You discover an exploit- What do you do?

Is making use of a bug fraudulent tho? Let's say you inform a casino about this issue and they forward it to the provider in question, what are you going to get out of it? I bet they won't even say thank you, let alone give you a nice reward for something that could potentially cost them more than that.

I pointed out multiple bugs on the website of a casino, none of which had anything to do with exploiting them for money btw, and didn't even get a "thank you for letting us know". No, instead of that they insisted the issue was at my side. The day after I let them know they had a website maintenance and everything was fixed. Now, do you think I will ever point something like that out again to them? I don't think so.
 
Why should niceties or courtesies reap reward rather than simply for the sake of?
But to your point, the OP clearly refers to an exploit allowing players to win hand over fist.
Seeing as any member of calibre in here is hopefully playing at reputable casinos only, should not fairness flow both ways?
 
Why should niceties or courtesies reap reward rather than simply for the sake of?
But to your point, the OP clearly refers to an exploit allowing players to win hand over fist.
Seeing as any member of calibre in here is hopefully playing at reputable casinos only, should not fairness flow both ways?

It should, if you mean by fairness that casino's offer the highest RTP of games or don't offer bonuses where 99% of the games only have a 50% contribution. I guess it's those reputable casino's we're talking about?

Sometimes it's just about a simple thank you. It really does work both ways.
 
It should, if you mean by fairness that casino's offer the highest RTP of games or don't offer bonuses where 99% of the games only have a 50% contribution. I guess it's those reputable casino's we're talking about?

Sometimes it's just about a simple thank you. It really does work both ways.
Lowered RTP isn't about being fair, it's about business-decision-making, same as you pay a nickel more at different gas stations; one purveyor isnt more or less fair than the other.
Same as bonuses - they're added incentives..some casinos offer better than others.
Granted there's unfair terms and whatnot but that's another kettle of fish.

Casino X isnt unfair because it decides to offer a weekly 50% bonus while Casino Y offers 100 or none at all.
One isnt reputable because the goodies arent as good?

As to thank-yous, sure, it's common decency to extend a thank-you.
As you say, perhaps you won't be so quick to point out out any future errors. That's a far cry from exploiting them.
 
Lowered RTP isn't about being fair, it's about business-decision-making, same as you pay a nickel more at different gas stations; one purveyor isnt more or less fair than the other.
Same as bonuses - they're added incentives..some casinos offer better than others.
Granted there's unfair terms and whatnot but that's another kettle of fish.

Casino X isnt unfair because it decides to offer a weekly 50% bonus while Casino Y offers 100 or none at all.
One isnt reputable because the goodies arent as good?

As to thank-yous, sure, it's common decency to extend a thank-you.
As you say, perhaps you won't be so quick to point out out any future errors. That's a far cry from exploiting them.

What I tried to say is that some people might feel like they're at a disadvantage because of those business decisions and therefor will hesitate much less when they get a chance to "get one over" on a casino. I have a feeling the OP might be one of those people ;)
 
Let's break it down to a really simple point.

You walk into a friend's house.
There's a 20 right there, on the counter, easy for the taking.
Do you take it?
(I'd hope not)

Now, the next person, maybe you arent so fond of them. Possibly a real dick-head..maybe even a right bastard.
Suddenly, it's ok to pocket that 20?
 
What I tried to say is that some people might feel like they're at a disadvantage because of those business decisions and therefor will hesitate much less when they get a chance to "get one over" on a casino. I have a feeling the OP might be one of those people ;)

Not so much in the grey zone as that, but casinos with a history of outright scamming their players.
 
Let's break it down to a really simple point.

You walk into a friend's house.
There's a 20 right there, on the counter, easy for the taking.
Do you take it?
(I'd hope not)

Now, the next person, maybe you arent so fond of them. Possibly a real dick-head..maybe even a right bastard.
Suddenly, it's ok to pocket that 20?
Why not go for the ol loaf of bread for your starving family analogy?
To me, yes, there are varying degrees of moral culpability.
 
Let's break it down to a really simple point.

You walk into a friend's house.
There's a 20 right there, on the counter, easy for the taking.
Do you take it?
(I'd hope not)

Now, the next person, maybe you arent so fond of them. Possibly a real dick-head..maybe even a right bastard.
Suddenly, it's ok to pocket that 20?

I've never stolen anything and don't plan on starting doing that now :laugh:

OK OK, maybe I've stolen my avatar from the internets but don't tell anyone please.
 
Why not go for the ol loaf of bread for your starving family analogy?
To me, yes, there are varying degrees of moral culpability.
If you're exploiting a casino because you can't feed your family you shouldnt be in a casino to have discovered an exploit
 
This should be a subject for the moral maze on radio 4 with Michael buerk :laugh:

Funnily enough the casino rep for Midaur last week was hinting some games may have been designed on purpose with an exploit, so that associates in the know can enrich themselves at the casino's expense.

I don't know how that would be possible if the games results are decided by an rng, I did read something about 'seed' values, that if you know what they are you can time your spins :confused:

www.wired.com

By early 2011, casinos throughout central and eastern Europe were logging incidents in which slots made by the Austrian company Novomatic paid out improbably large sums. Novomatic’s engineers could find no evidence that the machines in question had been tampered with, leading them to theorize that the cheaters had figured out how to predict the slots’ behavior. “Through targeted and prolonged observation of the individual game sequences as well as possibly recording individual games, it might be possible to allegedly identify a kind of ‘pattern’ in the game results,” the company admitted in a February 2011 notice to its customers.

I thought I had discovered an exploit on raging rhino but so far it's cost me thousands...:oops: there was rumour of a golden hour in which to play bonanza but not much long term evidence to back it up, I think amateur jokey observations along that line are okay.
 
I think amateur jokey observations along that line are okay.
as long as the joke's apparent; we all know there's more gullible than savvy :thumbsup:

besides, they moved the golden hr to Donuts...didnt you get the memo?
 
I'd say i'd benefit from your little secret, and dont tell the public. On top of that do it in a reasonable matter, that your behaviour does'nt stand out either. Dont be greedy.

I had a same thing going on, simply put granted me for 65k in 3 days of straight play. The casino paid without any questions asked. But the game defenitly got changed after that session. I was'nt able to (re)produce that anymore.

Others here will claim that it was a lucky situation, but i think a exploit into a slot is defenitly possible.
 
I'd say i'd benefit from your little secret, and dont tell the public. On top of that do it in a reasonable matter, that your behaviour does'nt stand out either. Dont be greedy.

I had a same thing going on, simply put granted me for 65k in 3 days of straight play. The casino paid without any questions asked. But the game defenitly got changed after that session. I was'nt able to (re)produce that anymore.

Others here will claim that it was a lucky situation, but i think a exploit into a slot is defenitly possible.

I'd be interested in hearing the story on this one, since it's patched it shouldn't matter?
 
It was Extra chilli. The buying future was maxed out to 500 a time. Ive learned quickly that buying and gambling for the amount of 5 to 7 ~ 8 times on avg it would 'land' and give more in return then i intially bought in for. So lets say it took 2500 up to 4000 on avg to set me back with interest. Ive repeated that pretty much 3 days straight (obviously with a break in between) and cashed out 3 times in a total of 65k. The best hit on this game btw was 17k.

I was kind of nervous that the casino would block my withdrawls, close my account or any of that, so i did'nt take it to the roof or so. But in the weekends the withdrawls landed onto my bank account(s). After that i took a holliday and pretty much break from playing online. After i got back there was no way i could reproduce that and i knew the game has bin 'changed'. It simply woud'nt play the way it did before.

Some here say it was'nt a exploit it was just luck, but hey the 65k on my account pretty much speaks for itself! So if i was you, and you had a exploit i would take the advise i gave you above. The casino aint going to grant you much to be honest. They've bin stealing in so many years from players over the last decade. At least their well crafted shit makes sure it happens.
 
people are pretty quick to point out any error not working in the player's favour; not so much the other way around

and we wonder why we've so many tthreads of people trying to circumvent the system

..... well, the system is circumventing you 100% of the time you play with its house edge sometimes being as low as 91% this days making the “random” hope of a big win an utopia ....
 
..... well, the system is circumventing you 100% of the time you play with its house edge sometimes being as low as 91% this days making the “random” hope of a big win an utopia ....
and players go in full well knowing a casino is a business and not a charitable endeavour, just as products that cost 2 dollars to produce sell for 14 and not 2

so you do your research and comparison shop for the best deals - it doesnt entitle you to steal the product because you dont fancy the price
 
..... well, the system is circumventing you 100% of the time you play with its house edge sometimes being as low as 91% this days making the “random” hope of a big win an utopia ....

Yeah that's an odd thing to complain about (I've seen plenty lower than 91% too)- it's the fundamental reason casinos exist.
 
Great question and a moral dilemma for some.

Its wrong to do. Cheating is wrong. No 2 ways about it.

Lawfully wrong but is this morally wrong?

Easy to sit there and take the moral high ground if you've never had to steal food for the table.

Thing for me is that life is set to beat you down and keep you on the poverty line unless born with a silver spoon or lucky. Nice guys finish last from what ive seen.

Raised to do the right thing but if im honest, my recent years have made me wonder how truly useful, to myself, my family and friends, playing by the book is.

A big part of me would judge and squeal but another part would be thinking cars and girls and far away beaches.

A bit like the lifestyle of the casino owners ;)

 
true...ish
the precursor is 100+ hour work weeks with a huge undertaking of risk

Plus a massive amount of money invested for licences, framework, marketing, staff etc.

Huge respect for a self made man but the opportunities for these kind of people are less and less and the best education and opportunity is reserved for the rich.

Edit: Dont forget the precursor to a chinese sweat shop is 100+ hour work weeks with a huge undertaking of risk.

Robin Hood springs to mind.
 
Well it depends years ago when the internet was fairly new around 2003 BlueSq used to set bet times on greyhounds automatically to the start time sometimes they would forget to close the betting and a few races you could bet after it had finished as the site was not monitored, for low bets there were a few times I could bet a normal amount and get a return because it was not a abnormal bet they never noticed.
 
Well it depends years ago when the internet was fairly new around 2003 BlueSq used to set bet times on greyhounds automatically to the start time sometimes they would forget to close the betting and a few races you could bet after it had finished as the site was not monitored, for low bets there were a few times I could bet a normal amount and get a return because it was not a abnormal bet they never noticed.

I can just see those poor bookies having to tell their kids there will be no Christmas this year.
 

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