Virgin games/hacking

[MaltesePlayer]

Coming from someone who works in the industry, two things should have already occurred. One, your Virgin account is closed completely and not reopened with just a new password, if they've managed to hack it once, twice actually, they're bound to be able to do it again, You need a completely new account with new email + password including security questions.

Secondly, I have to repeat, it is not your money, that is fraudulent dirty money and as mentioned by others, it's not Virgin's nor yours to keep. At this moment, I would ask Virgin to close down the account and change all personal details as this person has already managed to view them by logging in.

Lastly although I know I said I'd only say two things but this is from someone that's coming from the industry, you can forget about the Internal fraud department ever contacting the police, I've seen cases where they're either brushed aside or otherwise kept for a long time to try to get you to forget.

 

[Playford7]

Coming from someone who works in the industry, two things should have already occurred. One, your Virgin account is closed completely and not reopened with just a new password, if they've managed to hack it once, twice actually, they're bound to be able to do it again, You need a completely new account with new email + password including security questions.

Secondly, I have to repeat, it is not your money, that is fraudulent dirty money and as mentioned by others, it's not Virgin's nor yours to keep. At this moment, I would ask Virgin to close down the account and change all personal details as this person has already managed to view them by logging in.

Lastly although I know I said I'd only say two things but this is from someone that's coming from the industry, you can forget about the Internal fraud department ever contacting the police, I've seen cases where they're either brushed aside or otherwise kept for a long time to try to get you to forget.

I've contacted the police myself, I'll be speaking with them tomorrow between 1 and 8 tomorrow. I've emailed virgin and gave them my reference number from the investigation that's started with action fraud this afternoon I'll also be passing on my crime reference number when I get it from the police tomorrow.

 

[greylady]

I've contacted the police myself, I'll be speaking with them tomorrow between 1 and 8 tomorrow. I've emailed virgin and gave them my reference number from the investigation that's started with action fraud this afternoon I'll also be passing on my crime reference number when I get it from the police tomorrow.

You have done the right thing - who knows maybe it involves money laundering!

 

[Playford7]

You have done the right thing - who knows maybe it involves money laundering!

Well for today's deposit the fraudster made it was multiple deposits upto 300 within 40 minutes and then a withdrawal attempt of 300 exactly no casino games played.
So blatently money laundering. Tried to upload the screen shots but keeps failing

 

[Playford7]

What is particularly worrying is that even when the player changes their password, their account is hacked again, and quite easily. Coupled with the lack of information from the operator, how can players know what to do to keep their accounts safe.

Even if players can keep what they find left behind once they get their accounts back from the hacker, the problem remains that the account is forever tainted, and it's possible that one day the rightful owner of the funds put through the account will want them back. The bank will be obliged to refund victims of fraud, and the banks may then try to retrieve this money. This could lead to Virgin Games having to give back the money they have allowed the hacker to withdraw, and also the money they have allowed victim players to keep. This might tempt them to reverse their goodwill towards these victims in an effort to retrieve some of this money.

These operators should be doing more to prevent this. It shouldn't be possible to fund an account with someone else's card or Neteller account, yet checks are only made on funding ownership when significant withdrawals are made, they are not made when the money goes in, yet it should be a simple matter to verify that the funding source is registered to the same person as the casino account.

Rather than do their legwork for them, accept the information they have sent with good grace, and close the account making it absolutely clear that it is NOT "self exclusion". If the player is not out of pocket, they have no need to fund the investigation themselves simply so that they can repair the damage and continue losing their own money at Virgin games.

The casino have washed there hands totally of it and told me there's not a thing they can do. They are prepared to open my account t though :-/ They rang me this morning. They claim there own systems where not breached one bit, and the hacker obtained my details via a third party.
Action fraud whom I contacted are investigating the matter and could take upto 28 days.
I've just spoke to the police who told me they are powerless and to contact there branch of action fraud, who I've contacted already.
So there are people running around with bank cards in my name and accounts and the casino can't do anything and neither can the police. So my hopes are pinned on action fraud.
The behaviour of virgin has been terrible, havnt helped me one bit or provided any answers at all, in effect blamed me saying I must have identical passwords at other casino's and this is how it's happened.

 

[dunover]

The recent Virgin hacking issue centres around routers, people hacking into those and it goes from there. have you changed and reset your router password?

 

[nutnut]

Am I reading this right, the CASINO has told you to use STOLEN money from another persons bank/neteller account?

I'm not sure who I'm more disturbed at the casino or you for openly using it. You're spending someone elses money and happy to do so.

You're committing fraud and know you are. I can't believe the casino are actually advising you to use the money. Something is not right, on a legal and moral basis.

Absolute ridiculous, I hope the casino is sued.

 

[Playford7]

Am I reading this right, the CASINO has told you to use STOLEN money from another persons bank/neteller account?

I'm not sure who I'm more disturbed at the casino or you for openly using it. You're spending someone elses money and happy to do so.

You're committing fraud and know you are. I can't believe the casino are actually advising you to use the money. Something is not right, on a legal and moral basis.

Absolute ridiculous, I hope the casino is sued.

I was told by them it was dead money and could never be withdrawn. Just to play out the balance as it came from cards I don't own and could never be returned to them.
And it could of possibly been the hackers funds could it not?
How can it be determined where the funds came from on a bank card in my name?.
And me commit fraud? Haha I contacted the casino myself, action fraud myself and the police myself. So yes I'll commit fraud and do all that...really

 

[Playford7]

The recent Virgin hacking issue centres around routers, people hacking into those and it goes from there. have you changed and reset your router password?

My router isn't virgin, however I've reset it.
Virgin have told me as they havnt lost anything nor have I that in this case they can't do anything. A rep even called me this morning asking me what exactly is it they want me to do!..
They offered to reopen my account there and then.
Obviously I refused until this investigation is completed by action fraud.
If anyone on here doubts my claim I'll happily PM a respected member and provide my action fraud details so it can be looked at and proved what I'm saying is totally correct.

 

[Playford7]

Am I reading this right, the CASINO has told you to use STOLEN money from another persons bank/neteller account?

I'm not sure who I'm more disturbed at the casino or you for openly using it. You're spending someone elses money and happy to do so.

You're committing fraud and know you are. I can't believe the casino are actually advising you to use the money. Something is not right, on a legal and moral basis.

Absolute ridiculous, I hope the casino is sued.

Come on then. You wish to call me out on a public forum. you tell me what you want to know and I'll provide it. You think I just happily played away money that wasn't mine?. Well no, I done exactly what the casino told me to do.
I contacted the casino before they contacted me, I provided the evidence to them at virgin, I also contacted the police myself, I contacted action fraud myself. You want the crime numbers I have?.
Don't just Jump on here accusing someone of playing fraudulently and using another players funds you arsehole.
What exactly is it your disturbed at??...and what isn't Right?..
I've stated here I'll provide my full details of this case to a trusted member I've had contact with previously, I'd also happily speak to the boss himself and provide every shred of proof regarding this matter.
Before you accuse someone, have basis for it.
There is a person, persons out there who have bank accounts in my name, I've no idea what they have accessed or what credit has been taken out In my name, what accounts have been breached, I know certain things that have been affected but obviously on a public forum I won't state what. I'm trying my best to deal with this at the moment, as a single dad it's not easy.
Uninformed and frankly flaming accusations you posed I find wrong. I'm no fraud, I'm no liar, and as said the third time now I'll prove that.

 

[LHofsdal]

I think you are doing the right thing here. You notified all the correct people, closed the account until the investigation is completed. You really can't do anymore than that.

The casino is NOT acting very professional, no correspondence to let anyone know of the hack and yet wash their hands of it knowing that fraud has occurred. I would be very cautious playing there ever again after this all gets settled.

I would be contacting Neteller and advising them of this situation and letting them know that these cards are not yours maybe they can help you track them down. If they are using Neteller to deposit with these cards they have to have a way to block them. I would be losing sleep thinking someone has 4 cards in my name using it illegally.

Good luck to you! I hope you find out this is jerk is and prosecute to the fullest extent!

LH

 

[nutnut]

Come on then. You wish to call me out on a public forum. you tell me what you want to know and I'll provide it. You think I just happily played away money that wasn't mine?. Well no, I done exactly what the casino told me to do.
I contacted the casino before they contacted me, I provided the evidence to them at virgin, I also contacted the police myself, I contacted action fraud myself. You want the crime numbers I have?.
Don't just Jump on here accusing someone of playing fraudulently and using another players funds you arsehole.
What exactly is it your disturbed at??...and what isn't Right?..
I've stated here I'll provide my full details of this case to a trusted member I've had contact with previously, I'd also happily speak to the boss himself and provide every shred of proof regarding this matter.
Before you accuse someone, have basis for it.
There is a person, persons out there who have bank accounts in my name, I've no idea what they have accessed or what credit has been taken out In my name, what accounts have been breached, I know certain things that have been affected but obviously on a public forum I won't state what. I'm trying my best to deal with this at the moment, as a single dad it's not easy.
Uninformed and frankly flaming accusations you posed I find wrong. I'm no fraud, I'm no liar, and as said the third time now I'll prove that.

The money is NOT yours, how clear can one person be. It is NOT your money, it is someone elses and you morally choose to use it. The casino is wrong to tell you to use it, but even ifthey did tell you to use it, your own morals should have told you to tell them you want it removed as it does not belong to you.

You can call me a arsehole all you want, you are offended because you know deep down you have no right to use it.

Feel free to use the money, but don't post on a open forum about it and expect people to agree.

The money is stolen from somewhere. That is a fact, if you find a wallet in street but no one claims it, do you think you should keep the money inside? Same principle.

Sorry if my standards are higher than yours, but don'tget abusive.

 

[PaaskeDenmark]

The money is NOT yours, how clear can one person be. It is NOT your money, it is someone elses and you morally choose to use it. The casino is wrong to tell you to use it, but even ifthey did tell you to use it, your own morals should have told you to tell them you want it removed as it does not belong to you.

You can call me a arsehole all you want, you are offended because you know deep down you have no right to use it.

Feel free to use the money, but don't post on a open forum about it and expect people to agree.

The money is stolen from somewhere. That is a fact, if you find a wallet in street but no one claims it, do you think you should keep the money inside? Same principle.

Sorry if my standards are higher than yours, but don'tget abusive.

The only one getting abusive here is you. Playford has already explained everything and what is going on. You the one jumping the gun here try take a break from this thread is my suggestion or sort it out with playford in PM.

Your the one attacking playford and talking about fraud etc... and him committing illegal activity. YES the money might come from fraud etc. But end of day if Virgin has reported it and the money given away to authority means the money in playford account is virgin own free money for him.

The money is stolen from somewhere. That is a fact, if you find a wallet in street but no one claims it, do you think you should keep the money inside? Same principle.

You absolute out of line here. Have you even read the whole thread?? he already reported it to Virgin etc and has recorded phone calls so what in the word are you on about? This has nothing to do with money found in the street. You can not put those things together.

 

[nutnut]

I'm out of line?

Only one throwing abuse is him calling me a arse hole. He had already replied to my post then makes another hours later being defensive and abusive. Clearly he had been on the alcohol as very odd behaviour.

No one is accusing him of stealing the money or anything so don't twist my words. What I said was the money IS stolen and he has no right to use. I couldn't give a flying monkeys what virgins say.

Virginia are legally wrong for even allowing the money to be used so that says alot about that company.

Get off your high horse.

 

[mac72]

I'm out of line?

Only one throwing abuse is him calling me a arse hole. He had already replied to my post then makes another hours later being defensive and abusive. Clearly he had been on the alcohol as very odd behaviour.

No one is accusing him of stealing the money or anything so don't twist my words. What I said was the money IS stolen and he has no right to use. I couldn't give a flying monkeys what virgins say.

Virginia are legally wrong for even allowing the money to be used so that says alot about that company.

Get off your high horse.

And he'll have no bother finding a high horse "Virginia" is full of them!!! Keep the money playford I'd say your more than morally entitled given the time and effort you've had to put into this.

 

[goatwack]

I remember when Virgin Games were quite a cool casino, and how they'd add little touches like sending playing cards and shiz.

Then they rebranded and culled half the games - on top of compromising players' personal details and not giving a flying monkey's.

Quite worrying how nonchalant they are about the whole thing. "Your money, my money, who cares"

 

[greylady]

Am I reading this right, the CASINO has told you to use STOLEN money from another persons bank/neteller account?

I'm not sure who I'm more disturbed at the casino or you for openly using it. You're spending someone elses money and happy to do so.

You're committing fraud and know you are. I can't believe the casino are actually advising you to use the money. Something is not right, on a legal and moral basis.

Absolute ridiculous, I hope the casino is sued.

Would it not be better to voice your advice without making accusations of thinking his actions were disturbing. I may be wrong but when I read some of your posts, they come across as condescending - Playford took advice and reported to the police, whilst I personally would not have played with the money in the account, the choice was his surely?

 

[nutnut]

Would it not be better to voice your advice without making accusations of thinking his actions were disturbing. I may be wrong but when I read some of your posts, they come across as condescending - Playford took advice and reported to the police, whilst I personally would not have played with the money in the account, the choice was his surely?

You're quite right it is his choice, and it was his choice to put it on here and my choice to voice my opinion that I don't find it morally right.

This is how forums work, you yourself state you would not have used it so you agree morally it's not right. My opinion matters not one bit, but as this is a public forum I will state it is wrong he used this money and it is even worse that Virgin actually told him to do so.

 

[Playford7]

The only one getting abusive here is you. Playford has already explained everything and what is going on. You the one jumping the gun here try take a break from this thread is my suggestion or sort it out with playford in PM.

Your the one attacking playford and talking about fraud etc... and him committing illegal activity. YES the money might come from fraud etc. But end of day if Virgin has reported it and the money given away to authority means the money in playford account is virgin own free money for him.

The money is stolen from somewhere. That is a fact, if you find a wallet in street but no one claims it, do you think you should keep the money inside? Same principle.

You absolute out of line here. Have you even read the whole thread?? he already reported it to Virgin etc and has recorded phone calls so what in the word are you on about? This has nothing to do with money found in the street. You can not put those things together.

Thank you.
I had fraud on my account. I had to personally contact the casino about this, which I did.
It first happened on my account weeks ago when they emailed me with very little info on the matter only telling me to change passwords. I done that.
Then I hear about the massive hack at virgin, over 800,000 thousand suspected users affected.
I log in and find multiple deposit attempts and withdrawal attempts. I straight away reversed a withdrawal and rang virgin. At no point had I touched any funds in that account.
The manger told me, the funds where mine to use on the account many times, I clarified this over the phone. Even after explaining I've not made a deposit from September last year. I was then told the funds can't be withdrawn anyway as they need to go to original deposit method, which was a fake netteller (I've never had a ewallet in my life)
So play away the funds as I'm at no financial loss nor is virgin. So I did that.
Balance sits at zero now with a dormant account.
I contacted the police, got a crime number and spoken to them.
I also contacted action fraud (police ran fraud team)
And I've sent all details to virgin who told me there's not a thing they can do, if I want my account re opening they will no problem, they will also co-operate with action fraud and Cleveland police.
I've had to cancel cards, have conversations with my mobile phone operator, my mortgage company and many many more financial places.
Some hacker has taken out bank cards in my name and effectively tried to launder money on virgin, yet virgin with me regarding this have washed there hands of it.
That's the truth. That's exactly what happened.
I'm awaiting my action fraud response that could take 28 days to see how I go about doing anything about this.

 

[Playford7]

I'm out of line?

Only one throwing abuse is him calling me a arse hole. He had already replied to my post then makes another hours later being defensive and abusive. Clearly he had been on the alcohol as very odd behaviour.

No one is accusing him of stealing the money or anything so don't twist my words. What I said was the money IS stolen and he has no right to use. I couldn't give a flying monkeys what virgins say.

Virginia are legally wrong for even allowing the money to be used so that says alot about that company.

Get off your high horse.

Odd behaviour and stating you believe I had been drinking?
Well both accusations are wrong and totally unfounded without thought, fact or meaning.
I done as many posts show what the casino asked me to do.
I'm no VWM, no dunover or a Colin who has a wealth of online casino knowledge, I done what I believed was right by listening to the casino, contacting them first by phone personally, telling them no deposits or attempted withdrawal's are mine, asking what I should do with the funds there. Then I acted upon that.
I also personally contacted Cleveland police, and action fraud.
The casino don't want to know as they said 'us or you havnt been financially affected' I was told that by a agent yesterday who called me, he even also said 'what exactly do you expect, or want us to do'
I've had my identity stolen. People using bank accounts and debit cards in my name, that affects a lot.
So yes I called you a 'arsehole' and sorry for that, not decent conduct I agree, but I had the stress of that and a poorly little girl to deal with, sometimes a man can get stressed.
I've also offered any evidence anyone wants, I made this thread to alert others of what happened to me, I want nothing from it.
This is a forum, I posted to show what's happened honestly for others to see and help prevent it happening to anyone else.
Yet your main issue is I spent money that wasn't mine?...
I done as I was told to by the casino. I'm no expert in fraud or casino conduct, I done what I was told by those supposedly in the know, the casino that let someone attempt multiple deposits on 4 separate bank cards in a space less than 40 minutes on my account and didn't once flag something a miss.
All the best. Camel on its way.

 

[Playford7]

I remember when Virgin Games were quite a cool casino, and how they'd add little touches like sending playing cards and shiz.

Then they rebranded and culled half the games - on top of compromising players' personal details and not giving a flying monkey's.

Quite worrying how nonchalant they are about the whole thing. "Your money, my money, who cares"

I was called personally my a agent yesterday morning telling me why am I emailing them crime numbers, and what exactly do I expect them to do. It was apparently a 3rd party attack on my account and they are helpless.
Then asked if I wanted the acc re opening.

 

[Jasminebed]

This is an awful mess for you Playford. Identity theft is no laughing matter.

Personally, I would not re-open that account. Virgin has shown a real lack of interest in helping you resolve the security breach, and I believe they were wrong to tell you to play with the money. I wonder what would have happened had you won and attempted a withdrawal?

Did they provide you with info about the cards used, or the Neteller account, beyond "they were in your name"?

You will want to do a land registry search, to make sure they did not take out a loan or mortgage against your house. I read of a case where a couple lost their home, unaware a mortgage had been taken out and the bank claimed they had performed "due diligence" and the foreclosure was upheld in Canadian courts.

It may well be worth your while to engage the services of a professional company that deals with such matters. If anyone thinks casinos are heartless, they should try the banking sector.

 

[Playford7]

This is an awful mess for you Playford. Identity theft is no laughing matter.

Personally, I would not re-open that account. Virgin has shown a real lack of interest in helping you resolve the security breach, and I believe they were wrong to tell you to play with the money. I wonder what would have happened had you won and attempted a withdrawal?

Did they provide you with info about the cards used, or the Neteller account, beyond "they were in your name"?

You will want to do a land registry search, to make sure they did not take out a loan or mortgage against your house. I read of a case where a couple lost their home, unaware a mortgage had been taken out and the bank claimed they had performed "due diligence" and the foreclosure was upheld in Canadian courts.

It may well be worth your while to engage the services of a professional company that deals with such matters. If anyone thinks casinos are heartless, they should try the banking sector.

Regards my the funds I could of never withdrew them as they would have to go back to original deposit method, which was 4 cards I've never Owned.
They didn't provide me one bit of help about those cards either, only the first few and last 4 digits, they wouldn't tell me what bank they where from or anything.
I was basically told contact the police we can't do anything and what do you expect us to do?..
I'll await the investigation from action fraud, I've contacted my banks and informed them this has occurred, checked credit reference agencies etc.
The worst bit was it was weeks ago my account was first breached, if I hadn't of checked that day I did last week this could still be going on now.
Virgin themselves said depositing off 4 different cards multiple times in a 40 minute time frame is perfectly normal for them, and to also allow a attempted ewallet withdrawal to a neteller I've never owed no sort of security checking is perfectly ok.
Tbh I don't even think there security or fraud nor financial departments are looking into this anymore.
It's just carry on as you where in the eyes of virgin.

 

[vinylweatherman]

The casinos were trying to cover this up by persuading you to play the money down to zero. No money means the problem goes away. Dead money sat in the account is evidence and part of the money trail. The casino should have removed the money from the account as soon as they realised it was stolen. They should then have informed the authorities that they had seized stolen money. The account is also part of the evidence trail, and is effectively a "crime scene", so it should remain closed. They should not be offering to reopen it, they should be saying it's permanently closed and that you will have to open a fresh account to replace it.

The best thing to do right away is to get hold of your credit file and check for any activity that isn't you. You should then register with CIFAS, a system that works with credit reference agencies to place extra safeguards on the records of people who have had their ID stolen. The idea behind CIFAS is that lenders can see this marker and will do additional security checks before lending money or opening bank accounts in your name.

House takeover and sale is a known scam, so also worth keeping an eye out for.

 

[Playford7]

The casinos were trying to cover this up by persuading you to play the money down to zero. No money means the problem goes away. Dead money sat in the account is evidence and part of the money trail. The casino should have removed the money from the account as soon as they realised it was stolen. They should then have informed the authorities that they had seized stolen money. The account is also part of the evidence trail, and is effectively a "crime scene", so it should remain closed. They should not be offering to reopen it, they should be saying it's permanently closed and that you will have to open a fresh account to replace it.

The best thing to do right away is to get hold of your credit file and check for any activity that isn't you. You should then register with CIFAS, a system that works with credit reference agencies to place extra safeguards on the records of people who have had their ID stolen. The idea behind CIFAS is that lenders can see this marker and will do additional security checks before lending money or opening bank accounts in your name.

House takeover and sale is a known scam, so also worth keeping an eye out for.

Appreciate the reply. Thanks.
I'll get onto CIFAS shortly.
The police basically said the investigation is in action frauds hands, as its police run I can accept that.
And my account will remain closed.
Everything I've said regarding virgin and the tactics they used is 100% correct, as I've said if I hadn't contacted them personally when I found the fraud how long would this of lasted for?.
They won't take one bit of ownership for the attack on my account, they insist it's because my password was weak.
They say it wasn't strange for multiple deposit attempts from different unregistered cards, even the 4 cards they accepted deposits from and even a neteller attempted withdrawal when I've never owned a ewallet in my life.
As for the funds being allowed to be just gambled away, I just played down to zero as I was instructed to do so, I was told they where not at a financial loss and neither was I at virgin, and they can't be withdrawn as they need to go back to original deposit method which was impossible because the deposits never came from a card or cards I've ever known.
I'll await the action fraud response.
Thanks again for your input.