UltimateBet - Absolute Poker Scam

The Dude

The artist formally known as Casinomeister
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
"Oh what a tangled web we weave, When first we practice to deceive..."

Not a happy moment for Ultimatebet and Absolute Poker - a very thorough expose has been posted at the 2+2 poker forums:

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Another blackmark against the Kahnawake Gaming Commision - in fact, this could just make them look just as effective as the Costa Rican Gaming authorities :rolleyes:
 
Synopsis from Twoplustwo

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- reprinted with permission:

from 2+2 said:
Superusers and Silence: How UltimateBet let players get cheated for millions

May 20, 2008


AN OPENING THOUGHT

This following is a summary of this thread which originally appeared in the High Stakes No Limit forum on twoplustwo.com where the story of corruption at UltimateBet originally broke. UltimateBet, an online poker room founded in 2001 and one of the largest in the online poker industry, has been given ample opportunity to refute any of the statements in that thread, but have chosen not to do so as of this writing. Every claim made in the summary that follows in this thread is backed up by insurmountable evidence, which can be provided by request. Some of that evidence is included in this thread and there are links to many of the source in this thread. If UltimateBet or Absolute Poker feels inclined to refute anything that is said in this summary, they’re urged to do so.

I believe that it is important for online poker players to know about the unethical business practices of UltimateBet and Absolute Poker. It is also imperative to understand that these unscrupulous activities are not an indictment on the entire online poker industry. As you read this thread please keep in mind that UltimateBet and Absolute Poker are owned by the same company. They are also regulated by the same puppet regulatory commission. Most poker sites are run with the utmost integrity and security. UltimateBet and Absolute Poker are the exception and not the rule.

I urge the concerned reader to pass word of this summary on to other interested parties. The spread of this information will ultimately protect poker players from unknowingly exposing themselves to the corruption detailed below. If any reader is unfamiliar with any poker or technical terminology contained within, please let me know and an explanation will be provided.

I would also like to express my sincere gratitude to every one who investigated this scandal and who have worked tirelessly to uncover the truth and demand restitution for the affected parties. I did not participate in any part of the investigation myself, all I did was summarize the hard work of posters such as 'trambopoline,' 'dlpnyc21,' Nat Arem, and 'Josem.' Special thanks also to poker columnist Gary Wise who assisted in the editing this post.

Last, I want to make it clear that neither Two Plus Two Publishing nor any of its associative media is in any way responsible for these investigations, nor the accusations made based on their results. We thank Two Plus Two for providing an open forum in which those who have been investigating UltimateBet’s actions could gather and exchange information.

Steven Ware
Cornell Fiji

INTRODUCTION

It has been one hundred fifty days since allegations about suspicious activity in the high stakes no limit games on UltimateBet were first made public in this thread in the
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(referred to as ‘HSNL’ from this point) on twoplustwo.com.

Several million dollars were stolen and the evidence in the HSNL thread indicates very strongly that:
UltimateBet has known about the cheating for at least nine months.
UltimateBet knew about but did not make any attempt to acknowledge the cheating before it was exposed on 2+2.
People who worked for UltimateBet facilitated the cheating.
UltimateBet actively took steps to cover up these crimes and thwart the investigation of this scandal.
Additionally:
UltimateBet did not make any public statements or acknowledge that cheating had occurred until March 6th, 2008, three full months after the crimes became public.
UltimateBet has not reached out to any of the players who were stolen from (many of whom still don't know that they were cheated). When players read the HSNL thread, discover that they have been cheated and attempt to contact UltimateBet, they’re forced to wait several days for an email response, only to be told that UltimateBet is 'looking into the allegations.'
UltimateBet has not offered to reimburse any of the victims of the theft.
The first post in HSNL thread provided irrefutable evidence, including a graphic (below) proving that that the player NioNio's winning statistics were abnormal.

Please refer to the graphic posted here. There is also a review of the statistcs as well:
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Further:

from 2+2 said:
On March 6th, 2008 in a long-anticipated press release , UltimateBet concluded that after “extensive inquiry involving an independent third-party expert… NioNio account’s winning statistics were indeed abnormal” but did not reveal whether they’d found an unfair advantage existed. This press release is the only time that UltimateBet has publicly addressed this issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateBet
Montreal, Canada (March 6, 2008) – UltimateBet (UB), one of the ten largest online Poker cardrooms, today issued the following interim statement with respect to allegations of unfair play on its site.

“On January 12, 2008, UltimateBet was alerted to allegations that a player with the online handle “NioNio” exhibited abnormally high winning statistics and was accused of having an unfair advantage during play. These allegations were made both directly to UltimateBet by concerned players and the KGC, and indirectly through several web forums. The allegations also included reports of suspicious activity concerning the deletion of the NioNio account and other accounts that may have been related to this scheme.

“We immediately launched an extensive inquiry involving an independent third-party expert to review hundreds of thousands of hand histories, all of which were promptly locked down and made available to this expert. The initial findings of our third-party expert confirm that the NioNio account’s winning statistics were indeed abnormal, and we have expanded the investigation to look into whether an unfair advantage existed, how such a scheme might have been perpetrated, and whether additional accounts beyond those of NioNio were involved.

“UltimateBet is in regular communications and contact with its regulatory authority, The Kahnawake Gaming Commission (KGC), and will continue to cooperate fully with that body.

“UltimateBet is determined to complete a full and thorough investigation. We pride ourselves on providing a safe, secure playing environment for our customers. The investigation has proven to be extremely complex and, therefore, has been more extensive and taken much longer than initially expected. We continue to aggressively pursue the matter and will communicate the findings of our full investigation to our regulatory authority and to our customer base as soon as practicable.”

Please note - this was similar to the responses I received during the Absolute Poker scandal last fall.

Absolute Poker has been in the rogue pit since then :rolleyes:

from 2+2 said:
THE KEY PLAYERS

UltimateBet is owned by Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG, a privately owned company that also owns and operates Absolute Poker.

Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG is run by Joe Norton, the former Grand Chief of the Mohawk Territory of Kahnawake. UltimateBet and Absolute Poker are overseen and licensed by the “independent” Kahnawake Gaming Commission.

The Kahnawake Gaming Commission is a regulatory arm of the Mowhawk Indian tribe in Canada.

from 2+2 said:
SUSPICIOUS ACTIVITY AT ULTIMATE BET

By January of 2008, many high stakes no limit hold’em players on UltimateBet had become highly suspicious of the playing styles and win rates of some players on the site.

Investigating the hands that these players played showed that they saw as many flops and turns as possible, they called bluffs with incredibly weak holdings, and they seemingly never lost. These players were employing what should be a losing strategy and they were playing in the highest stakes games on UltimateBet, yet they showed the highest win rates of anybody playing any poker game anywhere in the world (other than the Absolute Poker cheaters).

Their abnormal playing style of seeing many flops and turns along with their regularly calling river bets with extremely marginal holdings at an alarming rate of success, indicated a possibility that these players, like the players in the Absolute Poker scandal, had the ability to see their opponents hidden hole cards.

UltimateBet was informed about this problem within twenty-four hours of the creation of the HSNL thread on January 8th, 2008. The Kahnawake gaming Commission was notified soon thereafter.


Collecting the Evidence
After the Absolute Poker scandal it was clear that the poker sites were unwilling to regulate themselves and that the Kahnawake Gaming Commission was also uninterested with protecting the game. Frustrated by what seemed to be another major cheating scandal by a Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG poker site, posters on twoplustwo set out to find the truth.

While reviewing hands that they had played, twoplustwo posters 'trambopoline' and 'dlpnyc21' noticed that they had both lost significant sums of money to the player ”NioNio”. In only 3,000 hands against trambopoline and dlpnyc21 ”NioNio”, had profited an astonishing $300,000.

”NioNio” had an incredibly high VP$IP of approximately 60/40 (meaning that he put money into the pot preflop with 60% of the hands that he was dealt and that he raised preflop with 40% of his hands, abnormally high statistics for a winning player in these games). He cold called 3 bets and 4 bets at an abnormally high frequency and he made very thin value bets and repeatedly made what would otherwise be questionable calls against bluffs. Essentially, his play was consistent of that of a poor poker player, not one who was winning $300,000 in 3,000 hands.

NioNio's play was nearly identical to the play of POTRIPPER with one exception; where POTRIPPER would only raise or fold on the river, NioNio would on occasion call. It would eventually become obvious this served to make his omniscience less obvious.

Concerned about NioNio's play trambopoline turned to www.MyPokerIntel.com, a website which records all high stakes games that are played online, to gather more evidence.

MyPokerIntel.com provides a summary of anyone’s last 14 sessions. In those 14 sessions, NioNio had 13 winning sessions and was up approximately 135k. His one losing session consisted of a mere 2k loss. The stats on MyPokerIntel.com also showed that NioNio had beaten the games at a rate of 114 big blinds per 100 hands over the 8,000 hands that he had played. As a base of comparison, the absolute best players in the world strive to win 15 bb/100.

What was even more incriminating was the fact that the last date he played on that account was September 4th, the same week the AP scandal broke.

Below is a spreadsheet that lists NioNio's profits from each session that he played on UltimateBet:

Please refer to the 2+2 thread for the spreadsheet

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NioNio had won over 600k in a mere 64 hours of play, a hourly rate of $9,687.96/hr. One of the ‘wow’ figures from this investigation is that the average American works 2088 hours a year, not counting overtime. If NioNio worked for those same 2088 hours he would have an annual salary of $20,209,668.48.

Ulitmatebuddy.com is a website which provides a search feature for UltimateBet players. When trambopoline searched for NioNio on Ultimatebuddy, he found an odd message stating that NioNio's account no longer existed. This meant that his name was either changed or that it had been closed.

In order for an account on UltimateBet to have a user name changed or for an account to be closed the owner of the account must personally contact the company and the security department process the request. This is the first indication that UltimateBet knew about the cheater several months prior to the January 8th post on 2+2.

As many of you know, when you cash out of an online poker site, the cash out must first be cleared through the site's security department. Major withdrawals from new players are examined with additional scrutiny.

It defies reason to believe that a red flag was not raised when a new player began beating the highest stakes games on UltimateBet at a win rate that was ten standard deviations over his expectation. But even if UltimateBet's security department was so incompetent as to not investigate NioNio's account while the cheating was taking place it is virtually impossible that they did not investigate him when he requested to have name changed and cashed out in September 2007 .

It is simply unfathomable that red flag was not raised when NioNio, the most successful Poker player in the history of the world, a guy for whom logging onto UltimateBet was like going to an ATM machine... and stealing the whole thing, abruptly decided a couple days after the Absolute Poker scandal became public that he wanted to close his account. The only rational conclusion is that UltimateBet had full knowledge of the cheating as it was taking place and deliberately allowed it to continue just like at their sister site Absolute Poker where the founder of the company was cheating and orchestrating cover-up.

After 'trambopoline' and 'dlpnyc21' showed beyond any reasonable doubt in the HSNL thread that NioNio was cheating, many more 2+2’ers began compiling their hand histories and searching through www.myPokerintel.com for suspicious accounts.

If it was happening with one account why couldn’t it be happening on others? Within a matter of days, posters on 2+2 identified a number of accounts as having highly suspicious activity. They all played the same 60/40/aggressive style that was shared by NioNio and the superuser at Absolute Poker and all stopped playing around September 07, 2007 when the Absolute Poker scandal broke. They also all had had success at a profit rate of several degrees better than the win rates showed by the best players in the world.

These suspicious accounts were:
Flatbroke33, iLike2win, monizzzle, nionio, nopaddles, nymobser, nvtease, sleeplesss, stoned2nite, utakeit2, and whackme44.

Prior to January 8th, 2008, the day that the allegations were posted on twoplustwo, eight out of the ten accounts had been closed or had their screen name changed. Upon releasing these names in the HSNL thread, which was obvious was being closely watched by UltimateBet, the last 2 accounts were immediately closed or had their account name changed. This is known because within 24 hours they no longer appeared on ultimatebuddy.com when searched for. Just like with Absolute Poker, UltimateBet's management was covering their tracks.

Nat Arem (N82 50 24 on twoplustwo) was able to give trambopoline some further damning information. From the contacts he had from the AP scandal, he was able to confirm 3 things;
The NioNio account was changed to nymobser.
The Nopaddles account was changed to sleeplesss.
The changes were made on the same day.
The operator of these accounts would play high stakes no limit as NioNio. After they cheated someone out of enough money to inspire suspicion, the operator would then switch to the Nopaddles account. After they had exhausted the entire player pool by cheating everyone with both accounts, they again changed screen names and ran the same scam as nymobser and sleepless.

It should again be pointed out that it is standard procedure for an account asking to change its screen name to be scrutinized by a poker site’s security team. Looking at a single session that NioNio or Nopaddles played would be enough to show an almost imperceptibly small chance that the accounts were not cheating. It is simply beyond the realm of possibility that several insiders did not realize that these accounts were cheating when these accounts were investigated after requesting a name change in the middle of 2007. Instead of stopping the theft UltimateBet allowed them to change screen names and in doing so facilitated the cheating.

If you have a gmail account, you will be able to access this spreadsheet containing the playing statistics from all of the accounts in question. This is an incredibly damning piece of evidence;
Spreadsheet with the playing data from the cheaters at UltimateBet.

The detailed hand logs in that spreadsheet contain of all data from each session played by the cheating accounts. One can see the exact time each account played each session, how much was won and other pertinent info.

Looking at the times that the cheating accounts played one can observe instance after instance where one account would sign in, play a short session against a particular player, then sign onto a new screen name and play another session against the same player, making huge profits on each account. This was done in order to minimize the amount of hands that each account played against each high stakes player in hopes that the lack of data would keep the cheating under the radar. Once the two accounts had played all of the regular high stakes players they would be closed and two more accounts would be opened and the process repeated.

Here is a screen shot with some specific stats from these players:

Please refer to the 2+2 thread for the spreadsheet

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The date next to their name indicates the last date they played on UltimateBet;

Flatbroke33 = 8/11, 65.5 PTbb/100 over 3753 hands- deleted or name changed.
iLike2win = 6/22, 37.34 PTbb/100 over 5545 hands - deleted or name changed.
Nionio = 9/4, 57.3 PTbb/100 over 8100 hands - name changed to nymobser.
Nopaddles = 8/31, 89.6 PTbb/100 over 1508 hands - name changed to sleepless.
Nymobser = 9/26, 46.7 PTbb/100 over 899 hands - now deleted or name changed. This name was still active when it was first mentioned in the HSNL thread, but within 24 hours of it being identified in the thread the account was closed.
Monizzle = 11/20, 38.51PTbb/100 over 2265 hands - deleted or name changed.
Sleeplesss = 9/22, 98.87 PTbb/100 over 1561 hands - now deleted or name changed. This name was still active when it was first mentioned in the HSNL thread, but within 24 hours of it being identified in the thread the account was closed.
stoned2nite = 6/30, 129.2 PTbb/100 over 777 hands - deleted or name changed.
Utakeit2 = 8/29, 45.41 PTbb/100 over 8046 hands - deleted or name changed.
Whackme44 = 8/20, 47.73 PTbb/100 over 946 hands - deleted or name changed.

For the 7 accounts out of 10 that we received detailed records on, their total take was over $1.5 million. It is still unknown how much the other 3 accounts stole.

Other than their one press release stating that a three month extensive investigation revealed that NioNio had "abnormally high winning statistics" (something that was proven three lines into the first post in the HSNL thread) UltimateBet has not made any public comments about these findings. UltimateBet has also largely refused to discuss this scandal with its players other than to say that their investigation is ongoing. UltimateBet has not acknowledged their involvement in the cheating.

To this date the perpetrators of the Absolute Poker scandal have not been charged with any crimes. It is unknown if UltimateBet has filed charges against the people responsible for this multi million dollar theft or crimes related to the cover-up of these crimes.



CONCLUDING THOUGHTS

Out of the hundreds of online poker sites, the only two sites to ever be caught exploiting a superuser account to steal from its customers are both owned by Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG and licensed by the Kahnawake Gaming Commission.

The players on UltimateBet were victims of a serious crime: grand larceny facilitated by a company that operates virtually outside the law. I hope that the efforts spent investigating and publicizing this story will help the victims of these crimes find restitution. I hope that this story will also highlight the need for independent regulation in the online poker industry...

The athors go on stating that they hope that the thread can be used as a springboard of discussion on how this should never be allowed to happen again, and how can Ultimatebet respond to this and make restitution to the millions of dollars allegedly stolen.

Is this the beginning of the end for the self-regulated poker rooms?

Why is anyone still playing at these poker rooms anyway?? :what:
 
I started following this about a week ago. Truly horrifying for online poker. My concern now is that these thieves were caught because they were so greedy they won every single pot they could. Who is to say that someone could not still be doing the same thing, but toning it down to only look like a great NL player with a high, but realistic win rate? He could go years without being caught.
 
I started following this about a week ago. Truly horrifying for online poker. My concern now is that these thieves were caught because they were so greedy they won every single pot they could. Who is to say that someone could not still be doing the same thing, but toning it down to only look like a great NL player with a high, but realistic win rate? He could go years without being caught.

Exactly! If these crooks had used half a brain and played smart (keeping their wins within some sort of normal range) they'd still be raking in the dough.

Makes me wonder who hasn't been caught.

And for my short rant of the day -- I'm still pissed off that no formal charges of theft, fraud, whatever have been lodged against the crooks in the original AP mess.
 
Why is anyone still playing at these poker rooms anyway??
Because a big part of that money they stole they are using to buy credibility by advertising at EVERY major Poker event and hiring high profile professional poker players to advertise and promote for them.

The professional players like Phil Hellmuth and Anne Duke are really playing with fire here if they don't distance themselves from AP/UB.

Phil H. is well aware of the cheating that has been going on at AP and UB, he has even made some lame promises about what he would do if it were proven that they were cheating... Well after overwhelming proof has been shown, Phil H. has not said a word about it and has ignored all questions put to him about the cheating.

I understand there is a movement to hand out printed copies of the proof of cheating that has been posted in 2+2 forums at the WSOP that starts at the Rio(Vegas) in a few days. The folks doing the handing out, will most likley get escorted out of the casino... But it will make a very public stink...

What I don't get is the land based casinos (HARRAH’S) allowing these cheating M*****F*****s to advertise on their property and sponsor WSOP satellites. If I were in Harrah's public relations/legal department, I would be very concerned about being associated with known and proven cheaters like Absolute Poker and Ultimate Bet.
 
The worst sort of scumbags.

They make millions of the rake daily, they aren't happy with that?

I had my suspicious about Ultimate Bet even before I posted the Absolute Poker thread on here, and once again, I'd like to state that the evidence show is irrefutable that the site is rigged.

A win rate of 10 standard deviations over the mean is so improbable it is functionally impossible, and I'm sure Michael Shackleford would agree with that.
 
Let's get this story out there!

This story really needs to get out and be picked up by major news media. So many people were clueless about the AP scandal and still many that were in the know continue playing.
I tried to submit the article URL from the twoplustwo forum on Digg but it wouldn't allow me to because of previous spamming by I don't know who.
Anyway...... I just submitted the story link here at CM on Digg. Here is the link.
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For those who aren't familiar with Digg please check this link out.
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Digg is very popular, users are the submitters and to keep the story alive it must be dug by users. So please go cast your vote if you feel this is a important matter that needs to get out to the masses. If the article does not receive enough diggs it will be deleted within a few hours.
 
I just called Ultimate Bet at 1.866.605.0311 and informed them that I just heard about this today and am going to quit playing there and ask all my friends to until UB settles this matter. The customer service rep said he has not heard about this matter. I asked if anybody has called about this matter. He said not to his knowledge. I informed him that it seems the news just broke today or yesterday, and he would soon be receiving hundreds of calls about this matter.

So if everybody calls # this maybe it will get their attention. It costs UB $$$ to run a 1.866 #. Let's all call ( I was friendly ) and let them know what we think!
 
Tokwiro Enterprises owned UB when AP got caught, and strangely enough Tokwiro Enterprises still owns UB. If kahnawake were not paid for covering up the investigation, at least they would have exposed a multi million dollar fraud. It seems they tried to cover AP/UB's tracks, but the true investigation is against Tokwiro Enterprises, another whitewash.
 
Congratulations - it finally sunk in! However, this thread comes much too late!
In view of the incidents with Absolute and Ultimate Bet I suggest that the Casinomeister accreditation criteria are revised substantially. As long as this does not happen, Casinomeister is also a questionable organisation and for me nothing more than an eyewash. This is also the reason why I have moved back from this forum silently.
 
Congratulations - it finally sunk in! However, this thread comes much too late!
In view of the incidents with Absolute and Ultimate Bet I suggest that the Casinomeister accreditation criteria are revised substantially. As long as this does not happen, Casinomeister is also a questionable organisation and for me nothing more than an eyewash. This is also the reason why I have moved back from this forum silently.
What's your trip? UB and Absolute were never listed here as far as I know. :what:

Eyewash? Yeah, gets the red out :thumbsup:
 
Well said Corey. Thats about it- the net is a great place to spread the word.
After AP was done it was swept under the carpet pretty quick and the player was none the wiser.
I think we all need to keep this alive and tell EVERYONE you now, the word WILL get around and close these bloody assholes down. I suggest you take your money out of that aplce and any that is remotely conected to the 2 outfits.
 
Well said Corey. Thats about it- the net is a great place to spread the word.
After AP was done it was swept under the carpet pretty quick and the player was none the wiser.
I think we all need to keep this alive and tell EVERYONE you now, the word WILL get around and close these bloody assholes down. I suggest you take your money out of that aplce and any that is remotely conected to the 2 outfits.

I agree - the more mileage this story is given the less liklihood there will be of unwary players getting dragged into yet another dangerous situation with a Tokwiro operation.

Kudos to Casinomeister for doing his bit in achieving that.
 
Sadly, I have a few hundred dollars at UB & AP. Most of the money at AP came from my account at Vegas. I've already had hundreds of dollars taken from me my rogue sites and DGS. Maybe it's time to give up on-line gambling. It would seem the real gamble is if I'll get my deposit back.
 
I agree - the more mileage this story is given the less liklihood there will be of unwary players getting dragged into yet another dangerous situation with a Tokwiro operation.

Kudos to Casinomeister for doing his bit in achieving that.
The problem is that companies like this have massive marketing agencies that will bring in droves of unwary players. I have found that most players, casino and poker players alike, will never do any bit of investigation. It's like they've never heard of Google :rolleyes: - Sometimes it's their own damn fault.

The AP spectacle was unforgivable. The Kahnawake license should have been yanked with prejudice. I would have like to have seen how another jurisdiction would have dealt with this. (IOM, Gib, Malta). But I think there is a conflict of interest in the land of the Mohawks :p

Speaking of losing credibility, look at Gambling911's take on this last fall stating that AP will become the safest poker room on the net because of this debacle. C'mon - puhleese. As a "news" reporting entity, they were obligated to chastise this poker room and steer the sheep away.

Now look what happened :rolleyes:
 
I have found that most players, casino and poker players alike, will never do any bit of investigation. It's like they've never heard of Google :rolleyes:


Maybe the advertisement they seen contains some kind of subliminal message that makes them trust the site. :D

I just don't understand how people can view a random site and have instant trust with the company. :confused: I'm the exact opposite!
 
Maybe the advertisement they seen contains some kind of subliminal message that makes them trust the site. :D

I just don't understand how people can view a random site and have instant trust with the company. :confused: I'm the exact opposite!


You're right, it must be the subliminal messages... LOL

Amazing isn't it? A shopper will spend 15 minutes in the toothpaste aisle at the grocery trying to decide which brand to purchase -- should I buy the one on sale for $2 or buy the name brand for $2.50. That same person will come home, jump on the internet, and click any ol' link and give any POS casino $25 or $50 (along with CC number! and address!) and not give it another thought -- till the casino doesn't pay.

When I first became interested in online casinos, I spent months lurking here and other forums, googling casinos, softwares, etc. before 888 got my first $25. (They were cool back then.) Maybe I'm a bit anal, but day-yum... I see no reason to fork over hard earned money to a shady business just for the hell of it.

I think this goes hand in hand with a wide spread dangerous notion in many people's head: 'if I see it on the internet it must be true'. Some people are that way about TV, too.
 
The problem is that companies like this have massive marketing agencies that will bring in droves of unwary players. I have found that most players, casino and poker players alike, will never do any bit of investigation. It's like they've never heard of Google :rolleyes: - Sometimes it's their own damn fault.

The AP spectacle was unforgivable. The Kahnawake license should have been yanked with prejudice. I would have like to have seen how another jurisdiction would have dealt with this. (IOM, Gib, Malta). But I think there is a conflict of interest in the land of the Mohawks :p

Speaking of losing credibility, look at Gambling911's take on this last fall stating that AP will become the safest poker room on the net because of this debacle. C'mon - puhleese. As a "news" reporting entity, they were obligated to chastise this poker room and steer the sheep away.

Now look what happened :rolleyes:


Hi Meister,

Yep I hear you all to well. Google would be a good start as that is the first point of contact for the player searching for a poker room.
Automatic warning sign or a pop up indicating threads about none legitmate companies when clicking on a link or doing what they kind of do now and put the topics at the top of the search results, Maybe bigger warnning signs.

Something has to be done- the amount of money being ripped off can surely be incentive enough to start a policing company or something to that effect.
 
Congratulations - it finally sunk in! However, this thread comes much too late!
In view of the incidents with Absolute and Ultimate Bet I suggest that the Casinomeister accreditation criteria are revised substantially. As long as this does not happen, Casinomeister is also a questionable organisation and for me nothing more than an eyewash. This is also the reason why I have moved back from this forum silently.
You may feel that Casinomeister moved too slowly on this, but I think it's a bit of an over reaction to say that this is nothing more than eyewash.

If you want to be truly disappointed in poker affiliates, Link Removed ( Old/Invalid) at pokeraffliateprograms.

A leading poker affiliate went down to the UB/AP HQ in Costa Rica, asked them a few questions and is satisfied that they are all good people. A few of us attempted to call him out for being too lenient and were basically told by other posters (affiliates) to STFU. It makes me sick how much unabashed greed there is in this business.
 
Appropriate AP/UB Management Actions

As an offshoot from the AP/UB cheating scandals thread , what should AP/UB management do?

Their story is that the cheating happened before they took over the company, so they are not the ones to blame. Assuming that it is true, and I can't say for sure whether or not it is, what should they be doing about it?

Here is my recommendation, let me know if it should be modified:

-Fire Kahnawake Gaming Commission as their certification authority, and move their servers off Kahnawake territory.
-Turn over ALL evidence that will aid in the criminal prosecution of the thieves (I am not even sure which jurisdiction that would be in.)
-Fire EVERYONE who knew this was happening and did nothing
-Fire EVRYONE who should have known it was happening and is claiming ignorance.
-Make amends to the players who were robbed. I don't think a full payback is realistic or necessary, but some substantial gesture should be made for leading those players to believe they were playing poker when really they were just being victimized.

Anything else?
 
I read through that thread and found the justifications for continuing to promote UB/AP interesting. That said, I think it has to be conceded that "Beanie" the senior affiliate has apparently publicised the "cheat" stories and asked pointed questions of AP/UB's "new management" when he was visiting the Chipleader operations.

That was a good (but seemingly missed) opportunity for top management to lay their cards on the table and fully brief those invited on the visit on the whole festering UB issue, followed by a public statement.

Unfortunately, the fact remains that cheating has been shown to have taken place at two sites in the same (Tokwiro) ownership group, and that on both occasions it has been extraordinarily badly handled, with denials, poor communications and failure to publicly identify and prosecute those responsible. That has not inspired trust in either the management of the brands or in the licencing jurisdiction, to state the obvious.

This is not over, and the absence of progress reports from UB exacerbates the situation and indicates that the top brass have learned very little from the Absolute Poker debacle.

Although it was not very specific, I found the discussion of a UB/AP "merge" and new managers intriguing. Perhaps we will see a public announcement on that at some stage.

But brand merges and new management does not alter the fact that the principle decisions in this matter come from the same owners....and that's where a real change of policy and heart needs to take place.
 
...But brand merges and new management does not alter the fact that the principle decisions in this matter come from the same owners....and that's where a real change of policy and heart needs to take place.
Spot on. I wish I had a nickle for every time I heard the line "But now we have new managers - we've turned over a new leaf..." I'd be able to afford a rocket to the moon:rolleyes:

Business ethics are driven from the very top. It's the owners and corporate officers who lead the way, set standards and operating procedures, and if they fail to see the importance of leading by example and ensuring that all operations are above board at all times, then they should be selling shoes online, not running a poker room.

There are scores of poker rooms, and unless AP and UB offer something 100% exclusive that is found nowhere on this planet, then it is beyond me why anyone is still playing there or promoting them for that matter. Baffling :confused:

I can understand that some players feel I have a crystal ball in Casinomeisterland, and I can see what poker room is cheating and which ones are not. Sorry - I don't have one. All I can do is provide players with enough information so that they can make intelligent decisions on their own. Occurrences like these are frustrating since they are detected "after the fact". It's like trying to predict earthquakes; you have a good idea where the fault-lines are - but when is the ground going to shake? That's the question.

I stand corrected when I said I never had UB on board here. They were once, years ago - for only a few months, when they were publicly traded and using other software. But when they switched over to their new platform, they had a number of problems which brought on their removal from this site.
 
...That said, I think it has to be conceded that "Beanie" the senior affiliate has apparently publicised the "cheat" stories and asked pointed questions of AP/UB's "new management" when he was visiting the Chipleader operations.
I give Beanie a few points for at least asking some uncomfortable questions, but he loses them all and more for believing this is a sufficient amount of action, and for continuing to promote UB.

UB would have come clean on this issue long ago if affiliates would have stopped sending them new players until they did.
 
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They made a statement. Here is something that is very odd to me.

The existence of this vulnerability was unknown to Tokwiro until February 2008 and existed prior to UltimateBet's acquisition by Tokwiro in October 2006.

OK, so what a total coincidence insiders with AP were doing the same thing at the same time. Also if this wasn't done by insiders how was this player able to crush the highest games on the site for winrates 10x better then the best player in the world and security didn't catch him or audit his huge cashouts?

At least players are getting refunds.
 
TOKWIRO BREAKS SILENCE ON ULTIMATE BET

From infopowa:


TOKWIRO BREAKS SILENCE ON ULTIMATE BET

Cheating confirmed due to software vulnerability; disadvantaged players to be refunded

After months of silence and amid a growing uproar in the online poker player community over alleged cheating by player NioNio (see earlier InfoPowa reports), the owners of Ultimate Bet.com, Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG, issued a statement this week.

The statement presumably marks the end of what Tokwiro describes as a "lengthy investigation" in which it has been joined by independent auditors Gaming Associates and the licensing and regulatory jurisdiction Kahnawake Gaming Commission ("KGC"), in conducting a "...thorough investigation that included a comprehensive review of hand histories and game data, thorough analyses of software and network security, and audits of its security practices and procedures."

The investigation concluded that certain player accounts did in fact have an unfair advantage, and that these accounts targeted the highest limit games on the site, Tokwiro reports.

The statement does not identify the individuals responsible, but claims that these persons were found to have worked for the previous ownership of UltimateBet prior to the sale of the business to Tokwiro in October 2006.

Tokwiro is taking full responsibility and will immediately begin refunding UltimateBet customers for any losses that were incurred as a result of unfair play.

According to the Tokwiro-UltimateBet statement, the fraudulent activity was enabled by "unauthorised software code" that allowed the unidentified perpetrators to obtain hole card information during live play. The statement claims that the existence of this vulnerability was unknown to Tokwiro until February 2008 and existed prior to UltimateBet's acquisition by Tokwiro in October 2006.

"Our investigation has confirmed that the code was part of a legacy auditing system that was manipulated by the perpetrators," the statement continues. "Gaming Associates, independent auditors hired by the KGC, have confirmed that the software code that provided the unfair advantage has been permanently removed."

This comment raises some interesting questions of coincidence, bearing in mind that UltimateBet's sister site, Absolute Poker in the same Tokwiro ownership group, was involved in similar cheating allegations last year that subsequently led to it being fined $500 000 by the KGC. In that case, too the initial discovery of wrongdoing can be largely attributed to expert poker detectives on the community website 2+2, and the perpetrators were neither named nor (apparently) prosecuted.

It also leaves unanswered the question of how NioNio was able to consistently beat the highest games on the UB site with win rates an order of magnitude greater than the best players on the planet, apparently without being flagged by security or the accounts section that handled his or her substantial winnings.

But back to the Tokwiro statement, which claims that throughout the investigation it's priorities have been:

* To permanently remove the ability to engage in unfair play;

* To complete its investigation and come to a full understanding of what occurred;

* To refund the affected customers; and

* To implement measures that prevent future incidents.

"We would like to thank our customers for their patience, loyalty and support, as well as for their understanding that we are doing everything we can to correct this situation," the statement asserts. "The staff and management of UltimateBet are fully committed to providing a safe and secure environment for our players, and we want to assure customers of our unwavering resolve to monitor site security with every resource at our disposal."

The statement goes on to provide the following chronological order of events pertaining to the incident:

January 2008: UltimateBet is alerted to suspicions of unfair play on the part of the account "NioNio" (prersumably by the 2+2 detectives who had already uncovered wrongdoing at Absolute Poker.) Within 24 hours, UltimateBet contacts the KGC to provide formal notice that UltimateBet has initiated an investigation of the incident. UltimateBet subsequently forwarded a copy of all related data to the KGC. The "NioNio" account and related accounts are suspended pending further investigation.


February 2008: Preliminary findings indicate abnormally high winning statistics for the suspect accounts. After discussions with the KGC, UltimateBet engages third-party gaming experts to assist with the analysis.


February 2008: Investigators confirm that the suspect accounts are associated with (unidentified) individuals who had worked for UltimateBet under the previous ownership.


February 2008: UltimateBet discovers the unauthorised code that allowed the perpetrators to obtain hole card information during live play. The code was part of a legacy auditing system that was manipulated by the (unidentified) perpetrators of the fraud. UltimateBet immediately removes the unauthorised code and works with the KGC and with third-party auditors to verify that the security hole has been eliminated.


March 2008: Six player accounts are confirmed to have participated in this scheme. No accounts were deleted at any point, although some account names were changed multiple times. The following account names are known to have been used in the fraudulent activity: NioNio, Sleepless, NoPaddles, nvtease, flatbroke33, ilike2win, UtakeIt2, FlipFlop2, erick456, WhackMe44, RockStarLA, stoned2nite, monizzle, FireNTexas, HeadKase01, LetsPatttty, NYMobser, and WhoWhereWhen.


May 2008: The investigation confirms that the fraudulent activity took place from March 7, 2006 to December 3, 2007.


May 2008: Gaming Associates certifies that the software code that enabled unfair play was removed from UltimateBet servers in February of 2008.


May 2008: Customers affected by this incident are identified, and plans for corrective action are reviewed with the KGC.

Corrective Actions Taken

The following actions have been taken or are currently underway as a direct result of this investigation.

* The security hole identified in UltimateBet's investigation has been permanently eliminated.

* UltimateBet is establishing a state-of-the-art software Security Center that consolidates and greatly enhances existing security capabilities. The first release of the new Security Center focuses solely on the immediate detection of abnormal winnings. Gaming mathematicians, poker professionals, and security software developers have all contributed to the specifications for the new Security Center.

* UltimateBet customers are no longer permitted to change account names unless they have suffered abuse in chat rooms. Requests for changes must be supported by proof of abuse and must be approved by the Chief Compliance Officer.

* In addition to its existing security department, UltimateBet has established a new specialised Poker Security team of professionals dedicated to fraud prevention.

* The refund process will begin immediately. The accounts associated with fraudulent activity did not use an unfair advantage in all play sessions. Regardless, UltimateBet is refunding all losses to these accounts.

* Accounts related to the fraudulent activity have been disabled, and the individuals associated with those accounts permanently banned from the site.

UltimateBet has worked closely and transparently with its governing body, the KGC and its designated expert auditors, to determine exactly what happened, how it happened, and who was involved, and has taken action to prevent any possibility of this situation recurring.

Tokwiro is pursuing its legal options in regard to this incident.

Hopefully the UltimateBet owners have learned from the Absolute Poker experience and will at some stage expose and prosecute the still unidentified perpetrators of this shocking cheating scandal, the worst yet in known online poker history and believed to involve millions of dollars.

Whether UltimateBet will suffer the imposition by the KGC of a hefty fine as was the case with its stablemate remains to be seen.

For the full report go to: Outdated URL (Invalid)
 
Just like to point out one inconstancy in Tokwiro's statement.

May 2008: The investigation confirms that the fraudulent activity took place from March 7, 2006 to December 3, 2007.

February 2008: UltimateBet discovers the unauthorised code that allowed the perpetrators to obtain hole card information during live play. The code was part of a legacy auditing system that was manipulated by the (unidentified) perpetrators of the fraud. UltimateBet immediately removes the unauthorised code and works with the KGC and with third-party auditors to verify that the security hole has been eliminated.

Am I the only person that wonders why Tokwiro says the cheating stopped on December 3rd, 2007, but according to Tokwiro they did not even discover and remove the "unauthorised code" until February 2008.

The phrase "lying scumbag thieves" comes to my mind when thinking about Tokwiro/Absolute Poker/UltimateBet.

I would also like to see a full accounting of all the money stolen by these nameless thieves and Tokwrio's attempts to repay the players the money that was stolen from them.

And then we have the fact that Tokwrio appears to be protecting the thieves! Why not release the names of the thieves? Why not turn the thieves over to Law Enforcement? Maybe because it would be hard to explain to outsiders why the only change in ownership at AP/UB is in fantasy land...

As far as the pokeraffiliateprogram postings, it is more than obvious to anyone that takes the time to look, that a large group of poker affiliates are nothing but whores that will do anything for money.
 
There are scores of poker rooms, and unless AP and UB offer something 100% exclusive that is found nowhere on this planet, then it is beyond me why anyone is still playing there or promoting them for that matter. Baffling :confused:
This is the biggest mystery, or perhaps not? Stars only runs CPA at $75 a head, so there's no lifetime earn for a player, and if you're a US afiliate you then have Tilt, before you get to the next biggest two US supporting rooms - these two rogues.

Then you get Cake, some MG rooms and Bodog, all the rest are minute.

So if the majority of your traffic is US based, then there is likely to be a fair hit to your earnings as an affiliate. I say likely, but surely take those two sites down and your players will move to Cake or Bodog or the like, after all if they havn;t heard of UB or AP by now, they sure as hell won't have heard of Cake!

Too many affiliates are purely in it for the bottom line, even those who dress up their site as some sort of player advisory or community flag bearer.

More sites need to follow 2+2, BW and the Meister IMO in outing and blacklisting places like these.
 
Some heavy damage control going on at present here:

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Annie Duke says she was ready to distance herself from Ultimate Bet until "new management" took over and fully disclosed. Blames previous management.

She now has "a lot of say in the business" and claims that all the "bad apples" have been removed and consequently is confident that everything is hunky dory.

But there's some confusion there regarding "change of management" and "sale of the company" - both of which are referred to but without clarity or sufficient detail to be convincing afaic.

The failure to identify the culprit publicly is explained as mainly due to legal difficulties surrounding identification of the perpetrator and under which jurisdiction to proceed, but UB is apparently investigating.

Seven figures were repaid to disadvantaged players, but again no specifics.

UB revenues were "not affected" by the scandal, AD claims.

Points to big name pros agreeing to be associated with UB (looks like one of the UB strategies) as an endorsement.

Annie Duke is a very respected name on the poker side of the business, but personally, I was not left with a comfortable feeling after viewing this video interview.

There's a clearly apparent apprehension that the upcoming "60 Minutes" program is going to make the industry look bad (UltimateBet more so, i.m.v.) The producer has recently been in contact with Annie D at WSOP, but it isn't clear what the result of that was.

Personal assessment: damage control move, and this scandal is hurting more than they wish to admit. A closing comment was to the effect that continued bashing of UB is not good for the industry. Personally, I think there has to be a lot more of the much-used word "transparency" here, especially regarding this "new ownership" question....or is that "new management?" ;)
 
The failure to identify the culprit publicly is explained as mainly due to legal difficulties surrounding identification of the perpetrator and under which jurisdiction to proceed, but UB is apparently investigating.

This makes me really angry. The funds from this criminal activity had to be taken out of the system at some point.

With so much money involved it was most likely bank transfers which would make identifying the end recipient fairly easy. Even tracing back via a web wallet shouldnt prove too difficult.

If the funds are out there in limbo somewhere, waiting to be laundered, the card rooms should do the honourable thing and start repaying ALL players that were stolen from. IMO they should be doing this anyway, in full, in order to beging the difficult task of rebuilding their image.

Regards, e.
 
This makes me really angry. The funds from this criminal activity had to be taken out of the system at some point.

With so much money involved it was most likely bank transfers which would make identifying the end recipient fairly easy. Even tracing back via a web wallet shouldnt prove too difficult.

If the funds are out there in limbo somewhere, waiting to be laundered, the card rooms should do the honourable thing and start repaying ALL players that were stolen from. IMO they should be doing this anyway, in full, in order to beging the difficult task of rebuilding their image.

Regards, e.
Dude... The management at AP/UB know who did it... They just don't want the public to know... Because if the public did know who was stealing all that money... they would be outraged.
 
Dude... The management at AP/UB know who did it... They just don't want the public to know... Because if the public did know who was stealing all that money... they would be outraged.

Definitely, they must be paying some serious 'hush hush' money to keep this quiet... but the truth has a way of eventually making itself known...

What gets me angry aswell, aside from the honest players losing out, is the damage it does to the industry as a whole. With the Frank amendment not getting through and these kind of issues going on it only adds weight to arguments by those against online gambling in general.
 
Definitely, they must be paying some serious 'hush hush' money to keep this quiet... but the truth has a way of eventually making itself known...

It's all those $168,000 apiece TV commercials and Million dollar+ $ponsorships by one or two big names... If AP/UB have a bunch of nice TV commercials, a hot spokesmodel and a weird guy that won a lot of WSOP bracelets who wears their name plastered all over his body... well they can't be all bad now can they? :rolleyes:
It just goes to show ya that money can buy respectability, no matter how much you've stolen...

What gets me angry aswell, aside from the honest players losing out, is the damage it does to the industry as a whole. With the Frank amendment not getting through and these kind of issues going on it only adds weight to arguments by those against online gambling in general.
I couldn't agree more. These A-Holes seem to be doing everything they can to screw it up for the rest of us.
 
Interesting that KGC have issued a statement a day after the PPA had a go at them with a public condemnation of the cheating incidents earlier this week.

KGC admits it could have communicated better, and says the UltimateBet investigation will bring forth a new statement within the next few days.

The Kahnawake statement acknowledges that the guys at 2+2 have done a very praiseworthy and impressive job of investigating this whole scandal, deploying some sophisticated analytical capability.

I think they are (belatedly) starting to realise that this is not going to just go away.

I found the "retraction" very interesting, too - it was probably not something that the chief's lawyers anticipated or enjoyed LOL!
 
Also AP/UB have announced they are officially merging.

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This was pointed out today.

New poker platform will integrate customers and features from two leading poker rooms to create third largest online poker network.

If you take their trailing 7 day average it is about the same as #6 Everest and less than half the size of #3 iPoker.

Anyway I wonder if a rebranding of the skins is coming. It probably wouldn't be a bad idea at this point. UB also has many skins. I have to assume they will be coming along as well. AP bought up their skins in the last couple of years.
 
Pretty much the realisation of rumours and speculation that have been doing the rounds for a while, with the next development (allegedly) to be rolling the brands into one entity.

If that happens it will presumably be at least in part designed to cast off the bad reps for both of these operations that have been generated by cheating scandals and the lack of transparency surrounding same.

I guess the question is will these leopards change their spots by forming a bigger pool of players? Annie Duke speaks very highly of this new CEO Leggett, saying that his professional approach to business is what dissuaded her from abandoning her endorsement.

Yet I still don't see too much in the way of a changed attitude when it comes to putting all the cards on the table regarding this monumental scandal.

And Tokwiro Enterprises remains officially the owner....it hasn't exactly covered itself in glory in these matters imo.
 
If that happens it will presumably be at least in part designed to cast off the bad reps for both of these operations that have been generated by cheating scandals and the lack of transparency surrounding same.

I guess the question is will these leopards change their spots by forming a bigger pool of players? Annie Duke speaks very highly of this new CEO Leggett, saying that his professional approach to business is what dissuaded her from abandoning her endorsement.

If Tokwiro Enterprises is going to change Absolute Poker/Ultimate Bet's names and roll them into one poker room...

Brings to mind what my Grandpa used to say... "You can put lipstick, purfume and a dress on a Pig... But it's still a pig."

The fact that Anne Duke continued to promote these theives AFTER she KNEW they were stealing from players... Means nothing more than she is a better poker player than she is a person.

Her opinion about the 'new' management at Tokwiro Enterprises means nothing... Did she talk about how much money Tokwiro Enterprises was paying her to say nice things about them? Of course not.

No serious player is going to believe anything she or Helmuth has to say about the online poker "business".

If Duke and Helmuth were so knowledgable about the Poker 'Biz' what were they doing promoting these theives in the first place?

If you advertise and promote theives, when you know they are theives... what does that make you?
 
New statement out from Tokwiro, I haven't really had time to digest this yet, but it still seems to fall short regarding the responsible individuals in this debacle.


QUOTE:

Tokwiro Enterprises ENRG ("Tokwiro"), proprietors of UltimateBet.com ("UB"), one of the ten largest on-line poker cardrooms, today announced that it has concluded the investigation into allegations of unfair play on UB's web site.

Tokwiro has compiled complete forensic evidence including the IP addresses, devices, transfer and withdrawal histories, and names associated with the player accounts that benefited from illicitly viewing hole card information. The results of Tokwiro's internal investigation have been turned over to the Kahnawake Gaming Commission (KGC) and its auditors, as that regulatory body continues its independent investigation. These results are in addition to the data which Tokwiro has already shared with the KGC.

Tokwiro has identified a total of 19 accounts and 88 associated usernames that were involved in the cheating, including the accounts that were named in Tokwiro's publicly posted investigation updates of May 29, 2008 and July 8, 2008. The same perpetrators that were previously identified controlled all of these usernames. There are no new perpetrators involved, only new usernames. Usernames were changed many times over the course of the cheating scam in an apparent scheme to avoid detection. Our complete list of usernames involved in the cheating scheme has now been turned over to the KGC, and the Company does not expect to uncover any additional usernames.

Paul Leggett, Tokwiro's Chief Operating Officer, said, "Make no mistake: our management team is outraged that this cheating occurred on our site through illicit software placed on the UB servers prior to our purchasing UltimateBet. Tokwiro is aggressively pursuing legal avenues of redress in order to protect and compensate our players and the business. Rest assured that we will release more information to the poker community and to the public at large as we enforce our and our players' rights."

"With respect to refunds to the affected players, we are continuing our analysis in order to determine the refund amounts. We will move forward with another round of refunds in the weeks ahead. We thank the poker community for its invaluable contributions to this investigation and assure it that we remain committed to fully investigating any claims of fraud on our site," Mr. Leggett said.

The investigation revealed that the perpetrators logged into the client software, using an account that had the ability to view hole cards. The ability of a specific account to view hole cards was enabled by illicit software that was placed on the UltimateBet servers prior to October 2006, which was before Tokwiro acquired the business.

The account that was used to view hole cards never actually played in a game. Instead, the perpetrators used hole card information gained from logging in with this account while playing on other accounts, which thereby benefited from the cheating. The money won by the accounts that received hole card information was then moved around and off the site in a complex web of player-to-player transfers and withdrawals. This contributed to the complexity of Tokwiro's efforts to uncover the truth.

Mr. Leggett concluded: "We cannot over-emphasize the fact that Tokwiro and its entire management team had no knowledge of the illicit software until it was revealed by our investigation; and no one associated with Tokwiro was involved in the cheating scheme at any point." UNQUOTE
 
Awesome post Lotso and I couldn't agree more!




If Tokwiro Enterprises is going to change Absolute Poker/Ultimate Bet's names and roll them into one poker room...

Brings to mind what my Grandpa used to say... "You can put lipstick, purfume and a dress on a Pig... But it's still a pig."

The fact that Anne Duke continued to promote these theives AFTER she KNEW they were stealing from players... Means nothing more than she is a better poker player than she is a person.

Her opinion about the 'new' management at Tokwiro Enterprises means nothing... Did she talk about how much money Tokwiro Enterprises was paying her to say nice things about them? Of course not.

No serious player is going to believe anything she or Helmuth has to say about the online poker "business".

If Duke and Helmuth were so knowledgable about the Poker 'Biz' what were they doing promoting these theives in the first place?

If you advertise and promote theives, when you know they are theives... what does that make you?
 
If Duke and Helmuth were so knowledgable about the Poker 'Biz' what were they doing promoting these theives in the first place?

If you advertise and promote theives, when you know they are theives... what does that make you?
Sad to say lots of money!
 
IMO there remains too many unanswered questions in the latest Tokwiro statement, and unfortunately I don't expect the next Kahnawake effort will be much better.

They say they now know who these 'perpetrators' are, yet there is no indication of who they are, what their relationship to the company past or present is and exactly what concrete criminal action is being taken against them in this multi-million dollar fraud of what must be a considerable number of players (we don't know how many because they haven't revealed this either).

The current Tokwiro strategy appears to be that the criminally defective software was positioned before the sale of the Absolute Poker and UltimateBet sites to Tokwiro's ex-chief Joe Norton, but the company statements don't reveal who was behind the company that sold AP and UB to Tokwiro, how much was paid for these companies and whether any of the sellers are still shareholders or have other links to Tokwiro.

This lack of upfront transparency will continue to generate questions about the integrity of Tokwiro and by association about the KGC.
 

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