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To Long time Gamblers: Do you think you win more or lose more?

Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Location
Singapore
Hey there guys,

I would like to know if gambling really can make you earn more money in a long run..
If we can't earn more money, then what's the point isn't it?

As for me, out of my 7 - 8 years gambling, It seems I'm about $10,000+ ahead in profits BUT due to non-payment of my vegascasino21 winnings of more than $20,000 USD,
I'm down to $10,000 in loses. Still hoping that vegascasino21 can pay me hehe. :P

What is yours? :)
 
I don't know how much I've lost over the years, but it's probably in the low to mid 6 figures. I've been playing for 18 years now. I'm a slot player, and it's mathematically impossible to win on the long run unless you hit a very big jackpot and stop playing (which will more than likely never happen).

If we can't earn more money, then what's the point isn't it?

It's a much more complex issue than that. Players gamble for various reasons, most of them being psychological. For a lot of players, it's only "for fun" and "as a past time" on the surface.
 
For the 9-10 years I played online, I have to say I was up. I'm more cautious than greedy LOL But my deposits were small (usually around the $25 mark) so if I got to $100 I'd cashout. I did have some really big wins (for me that is, 3 wins over $1k shortly after the UIGEA and before US players lost privildges at MG casinos).

Landbased are different, have lost thousands in AC. Thank goodness I can't afford to go there as much anymore! On rare occassions, my daughter and I will go to the racino for the afternoon, play until our $20 is gone or we have made a little extra. It's only 30 minutes from my house so it's a relatively inexpensive form of entertainment. (And it's cheaper than going to the movies and buying the goodies...last movie I took my grandsons to see ended up costing me $60 just for the tickets and then another $25 in treats...and then they want you to give them back the damn 3D glasses...BS! I took all of ours home LOL)
 
Big Wins

I run an online casino, so some observations: When players have a win that's a large multiple of their normal play, about a third start playing for huge stakes and gamble it back quickly; another third withdraw, but tend to up their bets a bit and eventually redeposit and play back the win over a period of months; the final third withdraw the money and keep playing at their usual level. A number of players (entirely from the 3rd category) do end up long-term up, but obviously gambling isn't an investment strategy :)
 
Pre UIGEA I was in the black. Nowadays, all I see is red. (RTGs hate me :rolleyes:).

Thing to do is, when you get a get cashout that puts you ahead overall, stop.

The numbers (payout percentages) and math-heads will tell you that we're all on the losing end of the stick - made worse by fees to load cards, deposit, withdraw, etc. which further reduce player EV. But then again, I don't expect any refunds or money returned for any vacations to the beach or Disney World either. LOL It's all a matter of what you want to spend on 'entertainment'. (So we only take gambling vacations - and if we bring some $$ back home... wheeeeee!, if not, that's ok, too as we don't pay for rooms or food or booze while playing B&M.)
 
Personally for me, its for the excitement and fun and the possibility of WINNING. The "possibility" is what makes my heart race. I can blow $ on going to the ballet or the opera for entertainment or I can sit in my comfy PJs with my spiced tea all warm and cozy, with no make up on loving the excitement of the "possibility".

I think its why it annoys me so much when I deposit and go on a nonstop losing streak...leaving every slot game with less money ....no play time makes me feel beat up so I play less these days. I played 3 or 4 times at Sloto recently and my only win over $3 was $30 ONCE on my last deposit...even had many close to zero bonus rounds...after pouring in $80 into one game. When it started to feel a little shady, I went to High Noon and in my first few spins I won $45....was able to play for about 2 hours and had a blast. I had no cash out but I got to play and felt like there was a possibility of winning once I went to High Noon.

I have seen people who become addicted after they win BIG and end up losing a lot. If you go in with the mindset that you are going to win....it will be a disappointment for the most part. If you go in with mindset of "I wanna have fun and hopefully leave a winner" ...I think you will be happier. If you are on a constant downhill losing streak or it seems like none of the games are paying long enough for you to have fun...leave your money behind and move on to another casino....they seem to pay in waves and either everything is hitting or nothing is hitting....just my personal experience of course.

I think that there are rare occasions where you should not think positive...this is one of them.

I have a friend who won the Texas lottery 33 million or something around that in 2003....I'm sure people told him that buying lottery tickets was a waste of money...but I doubt he bought his tickets believing he would WIN for sure...but just that possibility can drive us to do impractical things...so play within your means and keep it fun and who knows! Best of luck to you!
 
I often THINK I win more, but my records are there to show me the true long term picture. The regular small (and not so small) deposits that get lost eventually eat up all but the very biggest payouts. Even though I spend part of the big payouts on non gambling stuff, it is more a refund of the past x years deposits rather than a huge net win.
 
I kind of think of gambling as like a tax refund.... you spend all year have your taxes taken out (making deposits) and then finally you'll get a refund (a good withdrawal). I know taxes are a part of life, just as making deposits and losing and you never get back everything you spend (like taxes, you never get back what you put in) so when you do get that refund, it is "fun money" to do with what you need.

For me personally, I know I'm a loser as a gambler. I deposit too much and withdraw too little. I would hate to add it up but I assume over the years, I'm down (both online and in person) probably hundreds of thousands. But for me, it's my entertainment. And when I do get that withdrawal, I enjoy it. It just doesn't seem as much when you only deposit a little bit at a time, lol.
 
Thank you vinylweatherman, was waiting for your answer. Because I saw many of your wins are HUGE!
Even you yourself are saying break even or even down in profits. Hmmm.. I guess gambling can't really make you rich in a long run :(
 
Thank you vinylweatherman, was waiting for your answer. Because I saw many of your wins are HUGE!
Even you yourself are saying break even or even down in profits. Hmmm.. I guess gambling can't really make you rich in a long run :(

This can only happen by hitting something REALLY big, such as Mega Moolah. It would be pretty hard to play back £4 million without a significant increase in activity. It would also be very hard to move that kind of money through the eWallet and banking systems fast enough to lose it all back too quickly. The beauty of managing to just about break even is that you have the chance of hitting that kind of win without going heavily down trying. I do occasionally take a pop at the progressives, but have only won the £10 and £100 level jackpots from Mega Moolah. However, my biggest hits have been like hitting the "Major", which starts at 10K and can get close to 100K.

The only other way to get rich quick is to open a casino:D
 
I could tell you simply or I could just rap my experience.. Here it goes:

I've been up, been down, bet high and bet low but my withdraw
comes as slow as Betty White on a stripper pole.. I'd be up over all
much more If I didn't reverse my funds back down a freakin' rat hole.

I'll tell ya this - 3Dice is a bitch and JC used to pay big for me back in
03'. 2012 they're getting greedier and greedier - a withdraw now is less
easier they're teasing ya - If regulation doesn't hit I might split - you can
catch me at a B&M for my slot fix. Wooooord!
:cool:
 
I often make the mistake of reversing and loosing it ! I did it only today ! I am definitely down overall as I love to gamble and don't withdraw often enough.

Biggest win was 16k I did have a holiday with it but the rest dribbled its way back in to the casinos
 
I'm 53 now, and I've been gambling over 40 years now.

I was far less in control and gambling where paybacks were very much lower at one point in my life. It's been quite a few years since that. My track record at Bricks and Mortars is awful, I love it too much.

I've did pretty well online considering how often and how much I gamble. But when out with a friend on Sunday, she asked had I lost more than $10,000 gambling lifetime, and there was no hesitation to say of course. So she feels I deserve my recent hit!

At this point I'm ahead online. Last year I was up overall, and I think the year before that I was down $600, but quite a bit of that was counting in the fees associated with gambling. Down maybe 3 grand total in the two prior years. Helped a lot to lower my cashout goals, I used to be trying for $1000 cashout, now I'm very happy with $250, buys me quite a bit more gambling.

I'm like Wanda, I love the thrill. And it was wonderful to have a great time lowrolling the other night, a big hit and high rolling didn't ruin that for me, thank goodness.

I'll never make up those B&M losses, scratchcard, pull tab and bingo losses, and I've long stopped chasing.

I do however know people with nicer clothes, handbags and furniture, or who eat out a lot more.

I was a barfly for a lot of years, and my time as a shut-in invalid, gambling online became my past time instead. And just being away from that, it lost a lot of appeal. I'm much more likely to play $50 than to go out to the bars now. It's more like $80 if you have dinner too, and forget movies.
 
how much does it cost to play golf, be a trophy fisherman, go power boating

That is a good point. I see casino gaming as a way of buying entertainment. The same as if you would buy a ticket for a concert (and those can be pretty expensive these days :eek:)

If I win...then great. A couple of more beers for me (or a new house, boat and a car if I win a jackpot hehe). If I lose, then at least I have been entertained for a couple of hours (or 5 minutes :o).

I do not see casino gaming as a way to "earn" money. Although you can be lucky and win.
 
I'm 53 now, and I've been gambling over 40 years now.

I was far less in control and gambling where paybacks were very much lower at one point in my life. It's been quite a few years since that. My track record at Bricks and Mortars is awful, I love it too much.

I've did pretty well online considering how often and how much I gamble. But when out with a friend on Sunday, she asked had I lost more than $10,000 gambling lifetime, and there was no hesitation to say of course. So she feels I deserve my recent hit!

At this point I'm ahead online. Last year I was up overall, and I think the year before that I was down $600, but quite a bit of that was counting in the fees associated with gambling. Down maybe 3 grand total in the two prior years. Helped a lot to lower my cashout goals, I used to be trying for $1000 cashout, now I'm very happy with $250, buys me quite a bit more gambling.

I'm like Wanda, I love the thrill. And it was wonderful to have a great time lowrolling the other night, a big hit and high rolling didn't ruin that for me, thank goodness.

I'll never make up those B&M losses, scratchcard, pull tab and bingo losses, and I've long stopped chasing.

I do however know people with nicer clothes, handbags and furniture, or who eat out a lot more.

I was a barfly for a lot of years, and my time as a shut-in invalid, gambling online became my past time instead. And just being away from that, it lost a lot of appeal. I'm much more likely to play $50 than to go out to the bars now. It's more like $80 if you have dinner too, and forget movies.


Really:D
 

Like Jasminebed. I also started to gamble very early. Not in casinos (as I live in Norway) but I bet on sports when I was like 15 years old or something. Rode my bike and delivered betting coupons. They did not care so much back then. Guess times have changed hehe.
 
Yes really vinyl. I think Dad taught me how to play craps before I was in school, and Rumoli and Poker were part of family game night. I was mathematically inclined, and knew about calculating odds and permutations and calculations before highschool. Won a lot of lunch money with Euchre, Spades, Hearts all through highschool.

My mom and I would settle up our gin rummy games once a month. We played micro stakes, neither one had to pay out more than a dollar or two in a month.

Did pretty well with poker most times when I could find a small stakes game. For a couple of years played quite often with a group of mostly cab drivers, it financed a lot of beers and bingo nights!

But I do like the thrill of slots, I just try to spend less on it now.

Online poker is too much like working, and too many people that are very disciplined.
 
For the 9-10 years I played online, I have to say I was up. I'm more cautious than greedy LOL But my deposits were small (usually around the $25 mark) so if I got to $100 I'd cashout. I did have some really big wins (for me that is, 3 wins over $1k shortly after the UIGEA and before US players lost privildges at MG casinos).

Landbased are different, have lost thousands in AC. Thank goodness I can't afford to go there as much anymore! On rare occassions, my daughter and I will go to the racino for the afternoon, play until our $20 is gone or we have made a little extra. It's only 30 minutes from my house so it's a relatively inexpensive form of entertainment. (And it's cheaper than going to the movies and buying the goodies...last movie I took my grandsons to see ended up costing me $60 just for the tickets and then another $25 in treats...and then they want you to give them back the damn 3D glasses...BS! I took all of ours home LOL)

I live 15 minutes from a casino and thank god Ive learned self control. Being that close to someone who loved gambling can be very dangerous. I rarely go but the last time I went which was around 1 year ago I got LUCKY to be ahead even a dime. I played like a degenerate gambler. I arrived late morning. I started with $100 and put it in a .25 slot machine betting 75 cents. Over the period of about 2 hours, I was up $600 on this machine. Most people would leave but I wanted to finally hit a big score, at least few thousand dollars. I moved to $1 betting $3 on the wheel of fortune. Not long I lost my entire $600. I was pissed I did that. Back to the debit machine I go and withdraw a few hundred.

I played roulette making wild bets trying to get lucky and thought just a few hundred bucks and Im outta here. it didnt happen and before I knew it, I was down $1100. Now $1100 isnt a tonne of money but being up $600 and now down $1100 is pretty gross feeling simply because I lost self control and acted like a dirty gambler lol.

I was really steamed and I went and withdrew $500 and thought I would play the $16 multi wheel slots. I thought "come on baby lets get my money back". After about 10 pulls and being down about $100, I hit one 5x multi, 2nd 5x multi third was a diamond or something. BANG. I won $1380. Yeeehaww Im outta here. I left the casino up about $95 after all that. Lost $1200 on casino games, $50 on dinner $30 on drinks $1280, final win was $1380. Most people in my position leave down that amount of money or even more, so I can see how sometimes you hear that story of how someone lost their life savings.

So now if I go, I bring a certain amount of money which wont make me feel guilty and leave all cards at home.
 
but before all this crap with the u.s players being shut out I'd say I pretty much broke even each year.. but for past 4 years Its been pure hell to get a big win.. I was used to getting 5 BIG wins each year with small deposits.. compared to now where I deposit every day and it isnt for months until I get a decent win.. so yeah I dont know..
 
Love love all the stories, thank you guys for sharing!
What I think is that Gambling is an entertainment.

I want to hear stories like:

I won $200 on January and save into the bank.
I won $1000 on February and save $800 into the bank
...
...
On december I already have $20,000 in my savings bank, all gambling money. Thanks to the online casino! :p

Can this scenario be possible??
 
Love love all the stories, thank you guys for sharing!
What I think is that Gambling is an entertainment.

I want to hear stories like:

I won $200 on January and save into the bank.
I won $1000 on February and save $800 into the bank
...
...
On december I already have $20,000 in my savings bank, all gambling money. Thanks to the online casino! :p

Can this scenario be possible??


Of course, with self control but hey we are all gamblers!!! If I withdrew every time I was $20 - $50 up I would be well ahead.

With my best run which was at Nodicbet and 32Red combined I must say I didn't save any of it but I did purchase some much needed things for the house hold.


If I remember correctly there was a member here at cm that had saved a good amount of money from gambling wins and had purchased a property and house in the Philippines?
 
Love love all the stories, thank you guys for sharing!
What I think is that Gambling is an entertainment.

I want to hear stories like:

I won $200 on January and save into the bank.
I won $1000 on February and save $800 into the bank
...
...
On december I already have $20,000 in my savings bank, all gambling money. Thanks to the online casino! :p

Can this scenario be possible??

LOL not for me. Whats an $800 score like online, no really someone please tell me :p
 
Love love all the stories, thank you guys for sharing!
What I think is that Gambling is an entertainment.

I want to hear stories like:

I won $200 on January and save into the bank.
I won $1000 on February and save $800 into the bank
...
...
On december I already have $20,000 in my savings bank, all gambling money. Thanks to the online casino! :p

Can this scenario be possible??

Yes, but not for too long. The industry would adapt and remove whatever edge was keeping you ahead.

Around 1989-1990, UK laws changed for fruit machines, and operators got the stake doubled to 20p, but the jackpot only went from £4 to £4.80 - the had to persuade players that 20p gave them twice the value, so many places jacked the RTP "sky high", from the usual 70% to 74%, places were offering 90%+. Many games were the old 10p ones tweaked, and the new 20p games brought in new features. Many of the game features were "true skill", but adapted to be hard or easy depending on how much the machine had paid recently. THEY GOT ABSOLUTELY HAMMERED by players like myself, who took "true skill" beyond the design limits and forced some machines to pay 100% or more. I once lived an entire year, everything, purely on the pound coins being extracted from our local centre, which as well as bowling and cinema, had over 70 of the "right kind of machine". They eventually adapted by banning all the best players, and soon after getting rid of most of the machines. Now they have 5 or 6 in the whole complex. I took to the roads, and eventually in around 1996 the industry ditched "true skill" in place of "pseudo skill", and rather than making the feature harder and easier, the software made it "true skill" until an arbitrary "block" was reached depending on past payounts, and at this point the feature would "cheat" and block even skilled players from completing it successfully.

This period of around 6 years is what I call "the golden age" of fruit machines, where you could make a profit purely by your skill at playing the bonus features, rather than having to have inside knowledge of bugs.

In 2004 I tried online, and looked for any elements of skill. There were none, but a new concept emerged, that of bonuses. Other than one Blackpool arcade giving out 60p in play tokens for every £5 changed into coins, I had not come across this before.

Whilst playing online, I hoped that one day they would introduce UK style fruit machines with the "true skill" based features. Whilst the UK style games have come, they have not really come with the element of skill that enabled the best players to win more.

When I win big online, it's a case of being on the right game at the right time, and doing it often enough to offset the deposits being made between wins. I have removed part of the bigger wins from gambling funds on a permanent basis by buying stuff. Investing may hold the money for a while, but it does again become available, and some of it could again find it's way into the casinos unless it gets spent on something else first.

One way to invest, but also remove the money permanently, is in a pension fund, but they have been discredited over recent years.
 
I run an online casino, so some observations: When players have a win that's a large multiple of their normal play, about a third start playing for huge stakes and gamble it back quickly; another third withdraw, but tend to up their bets a bit and eventually redeposit and play back the win over a period of months; the final third withdraw the money and keep playing at their usual level. A number of players (entirely from the 3rd category) do end up long-term up, but obviously gambling isn't an investment strategy :)

I am not in the 3rd category.
 
When I win big online, it's a case of being on the right game at the right time

Agree

One way to invest, but also remove the money permanently, is in a pension fund, but they have been discredited over recent years.

A pension is still the best longterm investment for a modest return. People have been duped into being greedy and chasing Bernie Madoff type returns which are not real.
 
I play for fun and the *hope* that you hit a big win. Slots of course - you will never win long term without the mega jackpot hit which is unlikely let's be honest.

If you gamble to win you may as well just do stocks & shares - same thing (but generally more socially acceptable of course) and a little more skill if you are prepared to invest money/time in gaining knowledge plus a lower house edge (the broker fee - that's it I guess).

I'm not materialistic so gambling is way more fun to me than buying a new car and watching 20% of it's value fall off as you drive it off the forecourt or paying extra for someone's logo LOL.
 
Love love all the stories, thank you guys for sharing!
What I think is that Gambling is an entertainment.

I want to hear stories like:

I won $200 on January and save into the bank.
I won $1000 on February and save $800 into the bank
...
...
On december I already have $20,000 in my savings bank, all gambling money. Thanks to the online casino! :p

Can this scenario be possible??

I'm far too much a gambler to have available cash to gamble with. For me, buying a big ticket item is my investment strategy. I love playing, and a $200 win almost always just means more play, hopefully over more than one session.

I won $1000 and spent $800 on something for the house is quite possible. But if what I want only costs $600, the other two hundred will creep back into the casinos after the $200 I meant to play goes belly up.


My recent big win will be used to pay down mortgage and a trip. I've been gambling a very long time, and often with way bigger bankrolls, and this is the biggest win I have ever had, and to be frank, the biggest I ever expect to have.

I almost ruined myself gambling years ago, it's no kind of investment strategy. If you really want to create a savings plan, start with something tax-sheltered with regular payday direct deposits, and either don't gamble, or reduce your gambling budget.
 
Nice thread, cus this question seems to pop up quite often. In fact, it is THE question ;)
As for me I can say i'm up several thousends of Euros. I play like i manage my stocks & shares as someone mentioned before. Usually I deposit 50 and withdraw 100 ( If I win ) This didn't work in the beginning, because like all newbies I had the "reverse withdraw" issue, but I now have a more strict policie on that one. I never reverse, no matter how small the win is. Thats it. It may sound small, but it works for me. I do have to mention that beside all that, my main reason for gambling is for the fun. The entertainment. And as a side note I just love the mathematic-professors always, sooner or later, jumping in on theese kinds of discussions with the "impossible to win in the long term" theory. All I can say is this: The unlikley is not the same as the impossible ;)
P.S No insults where intended with the use of the newbie word, sorry about that :)
 
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Nice thread, cus this question seems to pop up quite often. In fact, it is THE question ;)
As for me I can say i'm up several thousends of Euros. I play like i manage my stocks & shares as someone mentioned before. Usually I deposit 50 and withdraw 100 ( If I win ) This didn't work in the beginning, because like all newbies I had the "reverse withdraw" issue, but I now have a more strict policie on that one. I never reverse, no matter how small the win is. Thats it. It may sound small, but it works for me. I do have to mention that beside all that, my main reason for gambling is for the fun. The entertainment. And as a side note I just love the mathematic-professors always, sooner or later, jumping in on theese kinds of discussions with the "impossible to win in the long term" theory. All I can say is this: The unlikley is not the same as the impossible ;)
P.S No insults where intended with the use of the newbie word, sorry about that :)

So you mean, we can win / profit in the long run? :)
 
So you mean, we can win / profit in the long run? :)

Kasino King has been trying to achieve this in the long term by picking the best casino promotions he can find, and playing them to win. He has also made his records available for review on his own website. With disciplined play, he DOES manage to edge ahead over the long term.

His method however is not about beating games that have a house edge, but about outsmarting the casinos who come up with promotions that temporarily give the player an edge. Operators tend to call this "bonus abuse", and if they see any player doing too well at this, they will ban them from the promotions.
 
So you mean, we can win / profit in the long run? :)

I reallise my post maybe was somewhat provocing, of course one can profit, but most gamblers wont. The keyword here is luck, and maybe disipline, Im just saying how my bankroll looks at the moment. Seems that no one ever belives me when im saying im doing well. But think about it, if i win more than i loose, I will make good money. Thats a fact. Its also a fact that if I run out of luck, my bankroll will look a lot different a few years from now. Theres just no guaranties, thats why it's called gambling. But if I stop gamble right now, at this very moment, yes I made a few bucks ;)
EDIT: In all honesty I hope most people play for the entertainment, not to make money, cause thats just dangerous and spoils all the fun.
 
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Down thousands.

Thankfully my casino habits have now changed and I have limits imposed where I play and make sure I always put away in my savings at least 10 times what I gamble.

I used to gamble to win, now I gamble for entertainment and if I win great.

I never mind losing as long as I feel as though I have had a good run for my money.

My biggest issue is not being able to cash out when I'm up as I get greedy, although I do occasionally manage it.

Overall I'd love to stop gambling but despite several attempts I find it impossible, so now I strictly control the amount I gamble and have done for about 4 years.
 
This is the first year I think I am actually up! About £30k so far so not a bad year!

Maybe I should quit whilst the going's good...
 
This is the first year I think I am actually up! About £30k so far so not a bad year!

Maybe I should quit whilst the going's good...

Maybe spend or invest much of the profit so that it can never go back to the casinos.

Early this year, I had a decent 5 figure win, so got top of the range solar PV installed under the government generation incentives. This turns it into a 20/25 year investment with a return of between 8% and 11% (including return of capital invested after about 6-8 years). Not much change from 11K, and too early yet to predict the actual returns I will get. It is, of course, 11K that isn't going straight back to the casino.

If you spend much of a big win, even if you don't quit, you can't play it all back. This helps you stay ahead for longer.
 
Definitely lose. I've only been a player at online casinos for about 3 months and I'm down about $4000, only a couple of withdrawals and a massive deposit history which I'm afraid to look at. I'm hoping my luck will turn around in the future. I already content at small wins, a big one would drive me ecstatic.
 
I've been gambling for 12 years, but been playing online from 2010, I really don't know how much I've won or lost as I don't keep track of my habit. I can say that I've won a lot and I've lost a lot, but I'm no better off.
 
I definitely have won more since I started playing no zero roulette online. I guess I lost back in the days, but I did not keep track of the moneyflow then. The last couple of years I have kept track of all my wins/losses for ech session everyday. So not only is it incredibly fun to play, it is even more so when you are on a the plus side for some time :)
 
I gamble since a long time, in B&M casinos I mostly played Roulette and lost a lot of money over the years, although I never highroll, but it adds up. Since several years I only gamble online with low stakes and dont keep track. Two years ago I was up several K, but lots of small deposits ate that up in the meantime. My strategy is looking for a good bonus or playing for cash and cashing out if I double or triple my deposit but sometimes I reverse and lose. Wanda made a good point, its the POSSIBILITY that makes me give it one more try. My money pit is RTG :)

Balky
 

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