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Swedish license - Should I stay or should I go?

Tirilej said:
Efter en dom har EG-domstolen förklarat att EG-rätten hindrar EU-länder att beskatta inkomster på vinster i andra EU-länder om samma vinst skulle ha varit skattefri i det egna landet. Därför ska vinster på pokerspel/kasino/vadhållning som anordnas inom EU/EES-området inte inkomstbeskattas i Sverige.

Men om spelarrangören finns utanför EU/EES ska vinsten beskattas. I din inkomstdeklaration tar du upp vinsten som inkomst av kapital. Det ska du göra även om du inte har fått någon kontrolluppgift.
Click to expand...

That's how things are in Finland. I have to read up on the new Swedish legislation. It's too close to home, Finnish politicians might get some ideas :D
 
sapit222 said:
I hadnt seen those rules either, so good to know. :thumbsup:

So as long as the casino is in Malta and either have a swedish licence or if they are targeting some other EU country (site in german and offering Euro), then its fine.
Click to expand...

I don't know really. If those that won't apply still will offer us to play then I guess it's up to us to find out.
As I said though I hope Swedish players play on licensed casinos, so be good boy now :thumbsup:
 
Hi guys,

On KarlCasino we moved to the Swedish Net Ent module. So i checked game availability and the following Net ENt games wont be available from the first:


All American Multi Hand
Baccarat Pro
Baccarat Pro - Low Limit
Baccarat Pro High Limit
Blackjack
Blackjack - High
Blackjack - low
Blackjack Double Exposure
Blackjack Double Exposure - High
Blackjack Double Exposure - Low
Blackjack Pro - High
Blackjack Pro - Low Limit
Blackjack Single Deck - High
Blackjack Single Deck - Low
Blackjack Touch
Boom Brothers
Caribbean Stud - High Limit
Caribbean Stud - Low
Caribbean Stud Poker
Casino Hold'em
Cosmic Fortune
Creature from the Black Lagoon
Crime Scene
Demolition Squad
Deuces Wild Multi Hand
Devils Delight
Diamond Dogs
Fisticuffs
Fruit Case
Funky 70s
Go Bananas
Golden Shamrock
Joker Wild Multi Hand
Kings of Chicago
Lost Island
Lucky 8 Line
Mega Joker
Oasis Poker Pro
Oasis Poker Pro - High Limit
Oasis Poker Pro - Low Limit
Pontoon Pro
Pontoon Pro - High Limit
Pontoon Pro - Low Limit
Punto Banco
Punto Banco Pro - High Limit
Punto Banco Pro - Low Limit
Red Dog
Retro Groovy 60s
Robin Hood
Roulette
Roulette - High Limit
Roulette - Low
Roulette Touch
Silent Run
Super 80s
Super Lucky Frog
Super Nudge 6000
Texas Hold'em
Texas Hold'em - High
Texas Holdem - Low
The French Roulette
The Wish Master
Thief
Viking's Treasure
Wild Rockets
Wild Turkey
Wonky Wabbits

Going to block the games now for Swedish players on Karl, if you still want to play Wonky Wabbits or so, go to Fun - now you still can :)

Kr.
 
L&L-Jan said:
Hi guys,

On KarlCasino we moved to the Swedish Net Ent module. So i checked game availability and the following Net ENt games wont be available from the first:


All American Multi Hand
Baccarat Pro
Baccarat Pro - Low Limit
Baccarat Pro High Limit
Blackjack
Blackjack - High
Blackjack - low
Blackjack Double Exposure
Blackjack Double Exposure - High
Blackjack Double Exposure - Low
Blackjack Pro - High
Blackjack Pro - Low Limit
Blackjack Single Deck - High
Blackjack Single Deck - Low
Blackjack Touch
Boom Brothers
Caribbean Stud - High Limit
Caribbean Stud - Low
Caribbean Stud Poker
Casino Hold'em
Cosmic Fortune
Creature from the Black Lagoon
Crime Scene
Demolition Squad
Deuces Wild Multi Hand
Devils Delight
Diamond Dogs
Fisticuffs
Fruit Case
Funky 70s
Go Bananas
Golden Shamrock
Joker Wild Multi Hand
Kings of Chicago
Lost Island
Lucky 8 Line
Mega Joker
Oasis Poker Pro
Oasis Poker Pro - High Limit
Oasis Poker Pro - Low Limit
Pontoon Pro
Pontoon Pro - High Limit
Pontoon Pro - Low Limit
Punto Banco
Punto Banco Pro - High Limit
Punto Banco Pro - Low Limit
Red Dog
Retro Groovy 60s
Robin Hood
Roulette
Roulette - High Limit
Roulette - Low
Roulette Touch
Silent Run
Super 80s
Super Lucky Frog
Super Nudge 6000
Texas Hold'em
Texas Hold'em - High
Texas Holdem - Low
The French Roulette
The Wish Master
Thief
Viking's Treasure
Wild Rockets
Wild Turkey
Wonky Wabbits

Going to block the games now for Swedish players on Karl, if you still want to play Wonky Wabbits or so, go to Fun - now you still can :)

Kr.
Click to expand...

I wondered how they would split us up from other players but that explains it though.
I guess I will miss Creature from the Black Lagoon, but I can't see any other game that I care much about.

Thanks for that! Now I wonder how the other providers will do it. I will certainly hate it :p
 
Tirilej said:
I wondered how they would split us up from other players but that explains it though.
I guess I will miss Creature from the Black Lagoon, but I can't see any other game that I care much about.

Thanks for that! Now I wonder how the other providers will do it. I will certainly hate it :p
Click to expand...


It is not that they split you on purpose from .com to .se.
It's related to the Lottery Inspektionen who set particular standards a provider needs to meet.
As a provider you need to amend/change most of your games.
So they basically calculate the costs to amend the game and the revenue expectations for the game. If that ROI shows to be negative, the game won't be a priority to become available at a later stage or the game won't become available at all.
We have seen the same in the beginning when the UK regulated. There were particular Flash games not available as they didnt meet the technical standards.

I was a bit surprised about the following titles though:
Creature
Wild Rockets
Wonky Wanker

Solid games and should have been available on mobile ages ago.

The other games speak pretty much for themselves.

Only one classic slot game left though, JP6K.

Thunderkick through SG is not ready, so no Thunderkick on the 1st. It will become available though.
 
L&L-Jan said:
It is not that they split you on purpose from .com to .se.
It's related to the Lottery Inspektionen who set particular standards a provider needs to meet.
As a provider you need to amend/change most of your games.
So they basically calculate the costs to amend the game and the revenue expectations for the game. If that ROI shows to be negative, the game won't be a priority to become available at a later stage or the game won't become available at all.
We have seen the same in the beginning when the UK regulated. There were particular Flash games not available as they didnt meet the technical standards.

I was a bit surprised about the following titles though:
Creature
Wild Rockets
Wonky Wanker

Solid games and should have been available on mobile ages ago.

The other games speak pretty much for themselves.

Only one classic slot game left though, JP6K.

Thunderkick through SG is not ready, so no Thunderkick on the 1st. It will become available though.
Click to expand...

I start to wonder though about all these casinos that will continue to have us as players without having a license. The difference is that we won't be allowed to play in sek and we won't get any kind of bonuses.
I guess we still will be able to play all the games as before since they don't have any reason to do those changes when not having a license.

If reputable casinos still allow us to play then maybe many Swedes also will search outside that area just to get bonuses. We'll see about that.
 
Just heard from another - Metal casino, applied and should be ready to go in Sweden in the new year.
It's actually good as it appears that unlike the UK, there is no White Label system in place for one license and several casinos - it seems that each brand or casino must have their own licence. Am I correct in this observation?
 
dunover said:
Just heard from another - Metal casino, applied and should be ready to go in Sweden in the new year.
It's actually good as it appears that unlike the UK, there is no White Label system in place for one license and several casinos - it seems that each brand or casino must have their own licence. Am I correct in this observation?
Click to expand...

No, I think you are very wrong. I just believe they choose to not take all casinos in since it's costs to it also.
 
dunover said:
Just heard from another - Metal casino, applied and should be ready to go in Sweden in the new year.
It's actually good as it appears that unlike the UK, there is no White Label system in place for one license and several casinos - it seems that each brand or casino must have their own licence. Am I correct in this observation?
Click to expand...
Hey mate!

Nope, it is allowed to have WL's (as we have at Direx). But like Tirilej said - it costs money, and more than this - not each brand want to apply.

BR,

V.
 
Tirilej said:
No, I think you are very wrong. I just believe they choose to not take all casinos in since it's costs to it also.
Click to expand...
Yes, that's exactly what I said! :confused::confused: There needs to be a licence cost for each brand rather than just for the main licensee.
 
Nextgen's Casinomeister slot will remain available for the Swedish public, so thats really good new guys :)
 
dunover said:
Yes, that's exactly what I said! :confused::confused: There needs to be a licence cost for each brand rather than just for the main licensee.
Click to expand...

I guess meant was cost of operator as i don't think license holder pay tax 18% (?) tax from all WL:s and they need to do it themselves, that's quite big cost attached together with bonus rules so there probably will be some WL:s who don't take it even they would have license from their provider.
 
I don't remember if Guts have sent any information out yet. I don't think so even though their rep posted in this thread.
I just got an email informing me that from tomorrow my account would be closed, but I'm welcome to open a new account next year, in SEK if I wanted to play there.
Thank you! ..and thank you for all information that came with the email, which was none :)
 
Tirilej said:
This was interesting! I just got an email from CasinoEuro with two choices, either I leave them and sign up to a sistercasino or I continue to play with them even though they won't have a Swedish license.
I had no idea that some would accept us to continue playing if we wanted too.
If that's true I rather stay there since I know who runs it.
Click to expand...

Obviously CasinoEuro got a slap on their fingers for planning to keep Swedish players without having a license:rolleyes:
I just got a new email that they would miss me but that they will not allow us to play there on the English version from next year.

That was actually one reason for why I posted it here. I doubted that they would be allowed to do that. No matter the law then Betsson have a say in it too.
 
Tirilej said:
Obviously CasinoEuro got a slap on their fingers for planning to keep Swedish players without having a license:rolleyes:
I just got a new email that they would miss me but that they will not allow us to play there on the English version from next year.

That was actually one reason for why I posted it here. I doubted that they would be allowed to do that. No matter the law then Betsson have a say in it too.
Click to expand...

You can always report this to the Spelinspektionen on their home page from the 1st January. They have created a special page where you anonymously can inform them of violations.

Outdated URL (Invalid)
 
Nice to see you posting again. It took just 4 months.

Ok I can do that but what does the law really say? You should know so please tell me. Are they allowed to offer us to play in their casinos?
 
From the 1st they are not allowed but I believe little will be done to prevent them. Eventually, when they have been reported, you will get a pop-up that you're ISP will be forced to implement, telling you that you are about to visit a casino site that don't have a license. With the speed the Swedish authorities normally work I think you will start to see these pop-ups in the autumn of 2023.:rolleyes:


P.S. I posted two days ago as well :p
 
Matti said:
From the 1st they are not allowed but I believe little will be done to prevent them. Eventually, when they have been reported, you will get a pop-up that you're ISP will be forced to implement, telling you that you are about to visit a casino site that don't have a license. With the speed the Swedish authorities normally work I think you will start to see these pop-ups in the autumn of 2023.:rolleyes:


P.S. I posted two days ago as well :p
Click to expand...

I saw you did :sniper:

So if the casino is belonging to a group/platform that have a Swedish license, will they risk losing it then?

Who knows. Maybe they will have enough staff in the beginning to actually get some speed up :)
 
you can include and release all your casinos on one License but only one of them can offer a welcome bonus


dunover said:
Yes, that's exactly what I said! :confused::confused: There needs to be a licence cost for each brand rather than just for the main licensee.
Click to expand...
 
Those casinos who are on MT Secure Trade's platform will obviously have 2 different licenses.
14 different under Mt Secure Trade
...and 8 under Zecure Gaming Ltd, which are Guts, Rizk and those who we usually call the GiG group.
Still really odd that not all of them are sending out information.

It's 60 companies so far that have a license, but some of them have a lot of casinos and bingo sites listed so I would say it's between 4-500 now. Not all of them are good ones.
 
Sebastian - Rizk said:
Hi! Perhaps you have a different currency than SEK and that is why your account is closed right now? We will send out more information today a bit later on regarding this.Thank you for your patience. @Tirilej
Click to expand...

Of course I know that is the reason, but you must have more customers like me and the fact that you don't have the decency to inform us before you do such a thing is really bad.
We'll see if I can find a reason to come back, but I guess I don't have to inform you before if I do.
 
Tirilej said:
Of course I know that is the reason, but you must have more customers like me and the fact that you don't have the decency to inform us before you do such a thing is really bad.
We'll see if I can find a reason to come back, but I guess I don't have to inform you before if I do.
Click to expand...

On the 26th we sent out an email together with an inbox message to Swedish players who do not have SEK as currency on their Rizk accounts. Yesterday these accounts were closed. In case you did not receive it or it ended up in your spam folder, I will PM you with the content.
 
Sebastian - Rizk said:
On the 26th we sent out an email together with an inbox message to Swedish players who do not have SEK as currency on their Rizk accounts. Yesterday these accounts were closed. In case you did not receive it or it ended up in your spam folder, I will PM you with the content.
Click to expand...

I receive all other emails from Rizk so it's strange it never came. It came from Guts though but everyone doesn't have an account at both casinos or know that they are from the same company.
No I don't need any copy.
 
Matti said:
Interesting to see that the Cherry Casino Group has applied and got 6 licenses, one for each brand.
I guess that means that they will be able to offer one bonus per brand..........
Click to expand...

Indeed, what seen quickly, most have got only one license, maybe you get more as long you pay from each one :) They had acquisition with Comeon under 2 years ago, they offer more than only casino games so it can be that (don't know how many acquisitions there have been on the road in years) that they have 6 licenses and applied them to all. Not gonna make Matlocking from my mobile but that was first guess :)
 
irish-ranger said:
You probably have a point there especially when it comes to genesis there's a shitload of complaints on AG..
Click to expand...

A casino doesn't have to be bad because they have complaints there. They can have bad luck with customers too :) It wasn't that many.

I'm still judging them for not being able to deal with self excluded customers in a correct way.
 
Matti said:
Interesting to see that the Cherry Casino Group has applied and got 6 licenses, one for each brand.
I guess that means that they will be able to offer one bonus per brand..........
Click to expand...

Isn't that a smart move, if it's almost the only way to get new customers? Also to get the old to stay since everyone will be treated as new players.
 
Tirilej said:
Isn't that a smart move, if it's almost the only way to get new customers? Also to get the old to stay since everyone will be treated as new players.
Click to expand...

In the short run I believe it will be a very good move. In the long run I'm not sure once the markets settles.
A crucial question for most casinos in the new Swedish market will be how to retain customers without bonus offerings and in that I can't see how one license per brand can help.
 
Matti said:
In the short run I believe it will be a very good move. In the long run I'm not sure once the markets settles.
A crucial question for most casinos in the new Swedish market will be how to retain customers without bonus offerings and in that I can't see how one license per brand can help.
Click to expand...

But it's just 400 000sek for a five years license isn't it? There isn't any more costs above?

Free spins and cashback I guess. Are they allowed to offer other contests with cash or a trip? Isn't it just the word bonus they can't use and no wagering?
 
Tirilej said:
I don't remember if Guts have sent any information out yet. I don't think so even though their rep posted in this thread.
I just got an email informing me that from tomorrow my account would be closed, but I'm welcome to open a new account next year, in SEK if I wanted to play there.
Thank you! ..and thank you for all the information that came with the email, which was none :)
Click to expand...

Hello Tirilej,

In regards to information from us, we did email players yesterday in regards to the currency if you have a different currency than SEK on the account, then you would receive an email from us.

The information in regards to players accounts with different currency other than SEK, I commented on the 21st of December (in this thread on Page 4). ;):laugh:

We're also on Monday sending out new general information to players via email which should be directed to everyone.

Guts said:
Our normal account at Guts, will remain there, with the same details everything.

If you have a different currency than SEK for instance, your account will be closed and automatically re-opened with an account in SEK due to the new regulation.
Click to expand...
 
Guts said:
Hello Tirilej,

In regards to information from us, we did email players yesterday in regards to the currency if you have a different currency than SEK on the account, then you would receive an email from us.

The information in regards to players accounts with different currency other than SEK, I commented on the 21st of December (in this thread on Page 4). ;):laugh:

We're also on Monday sending out new general information to players via email which should be directed to everyone.
Click to expand...

Which is exactly what I had posted except that I wanted more information, but if that will come on Monday then that is fine :)

I maybe should add that I hope you inform about the change in game performance, only one bonus in the group, and maybe what we will be offered so we know if we'll get anything for playing there.
I will probably stay ;)
 
Tirilej said:
But it's just 400 000sek for a five years license isn't it? There isn't any more costs above?

Free spins and cashback I guess. Are they allowed to offer other contests with cash or a trip? Isn't it just the word bonus they can't use and no wagering?
Click to expand...

There is an annual fee as well that varies depending on size. A bigger cost though is keeping separate companies. Of course they know the cost but feels that the will have more benefits by doing it this way.

I believe casinos will be creative when it comes to award their players. We'll just have to wait and see what the Spelinspektion will say.
There will most probably be casinos saying that you get one lifetime bonus when you sign up and then you get those in increments as long as you are a customer. It is just one bonus as the law states but I don't think that is what the lawmakers had in mind.

My personal opinion is that free spins is ok. Cashback based on deposits is not. But it is still somewhat unclear to me.
 
Matti said:
There is an annual fee as well that varies depending on size. A bigger cost though is keeping separate companies. Of course they know the cost but feels that the will have more benefits by doing it this way.

I believe casinos will be creative when it comes to award their players. We'll just have to wait and see what the Spelinspektion will say.
There will most probably be casinos saying that you get one lifetime bonus when you sign up and then you get those in increments as long as you are a customer. It is just one bonus as the law states but I don't think that is what the lawmakers had in mind.

My personal opinion is that free spins is ok. Cashback based on deposits is not. But it is still somewhat unclear to me.
Click to expand...

But cashback on wagering should be then? I'm thinking VS and their cashback system now, and Thrills, and Rizk even though they give wagerfree spins instead. Isn't it cashback as cashback as long as it's real money?
Whatever it is called we still have to deposit and wager. We are just not tied in and can't break any rules and that must be the point of it all.
 
Last edited:
No one can be 100% sure at this point what is ok. It is open to interpretation.
The statement from the authorities are:

Lotteriinspektionen har inte tagit fram någon vägledning eller allmänna råd angående tolkningen av bestämmelserna om bonus och ger inte några förhandsbesked. Frågorna kommer att hanteras inom ramen för myndighetens tillsyn. Detta innebär att det är upp till licenshavaren att tolka och följa bestämmelserna utifrån vad som följer av lag, förordning och förarbeten.

Google Translate:
The Lottery Inspectorate has not produced any guidance or general advice regarding the interpretation of the rules on bonuses and does not give any advance notice. The questions will be dealt with within the framework of the Authority's supervision. This means that it is up to the license holder to interpret and follow the regulations based on what follows from law, regulation and preliminary work.
 
Tirilej said:
But it's just 400 000sek for a five years license isn't it? There isn't any more costs above?

Free spins and cashback I guess. Are they allowed to offer other contests with cash or a trip? Isn't it just the word bonus they can't use and no wagering?
Click to expand...


You left out the most significant cost to casinos which is going to be the new 18% tax they have to pay

The regulation states in general that casinos are not allowed to reward players in return for extending their game play.
For example, they cannot give bonuses, FS or anything else based on doing more wagering or completing a task involving depositing more to earn a prize
 
Krystal_EGO said:
You left out the most significant cost to casinos which is going to be the new 18% tax they have to pay

The regulation states in general that casinos are not allowed to reward players in return for extending their game play.
For example, they cannot give bonuses, FS or anything else based on doing more wagering or completing a task involving depositing more to earn a prize
Click to expand...

That gonna be tricky one, can you just give FS for some customers or does it then need to be available for all (as casino "accidentally" could send them for different segments depending on their value as pretty much is done now)? So can you email just some punch of players that you have free spins on your account? Questions we have answers in next few months.
 
Krystal_EGO said:
You left out the most significant cost to casinos which is going to be the new 18% tax they have to pay

The regulation states in general that casinos are not allowed to reward players in return for extending their game play.
For example, they cannot give bonuses, FS or anything else based on doing more wagering or completing a task involving depositing more to earn a prize
Click to expand...

If I feel confused then I can imagine how it feels for you :eek2: I better wait a few weeks and see what is happening.

True I didn't think of the cost for taxes, since you must have players depositing before you need to pay anything.
 

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