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Prestige Casino refuses to honor 10% of loss bonus

S

suzirose

Dormant account
Joined
Nov 8, 2001
Bryan,

Need a bit of help again (you helped be to collect my $16k from Club Dice about 2 months ago. I've since been playing a Prestige Casino (Boss Media) and was doing well.

I received the below listing email (full text below):

<, In a message dated 12/17/2001 12:06:09 PM Pacific Standard Time,
<, [email protected] writes:
<,
<,<,
<,<, Dear Suzanne,
<,<,
<,<, allow me to express my sincere thankfulness for playing at Prestige
<,<, Casino!
<,<, Christmas is in the air and everybody is happier.
<,<, Prestige Casino wants to be good and make you happy, too.
<,<, Yes, we have decided to offer only to you ( account with PINxxxx
<,<, our great Christmas gift: 10% Refund of all your money lost during your
<,<, past week!!!
<,<, Yes, we will credit back on your account 10% of all the money you loose
<,<, during these special weeks.
<,<, This fantastic promotion takes off Monday, December 17th, 2001 at 00:01
<,<, GMT (18:59 EST) and will end on Sunday, January 13th, 2002 at 23:59 GMT.
<,<, You have the privilege to play every week and therefore to be refunded
<,<, every week during this "4 week" promotion!
<,<, Every Monday, till 23:59 GMT you must mailto:[email protected]
<,<, an e-mail stating the amount of money lost and within 48 hours we will
<,<, refund you back 10% on your account.
<,<, One simple rule to follow: you must deposit $100 or more during
<,<, the week.
<,<, All amounts lost will be calculated.
<,<, Partecipating to this special promotion offers you an extra opportunity!
<,<, For every $100 you deposit you will earn also 1 credit which entitles you
<,<, to taking part to our Grandprize "2002" draw worth $25,000 scheduled
<,<, on January 14th, 2002.
<,<, Join the fun and start playing.
<,<,
<,<, A cheerful Merry Christmas from all the Staff.
<,<, Frank Redford

On 12/30/01, I ended up losing over $41,000 after which I deposited another $1000. According to the email, I should qualify for a 10% of my lost amount be refunded. Instead the casino gave me $100, saying that they only refund 10% of the deposit....

Can you read the above email, and I've I'm wrong let me know, otherwise can you help in getting the $4,000+ which I feel they owe me.

Thanks again,

Suzi
 
It may be unintentionally misleading (such an offer could prove very expensive for a casino if taken at face value) but the fact is that it does suggest that you get ten percent back on ALL of your losses - ie not only your deposits but monies you won and gambled again in the course of the week.

Are there more specific T&C's elsewhere on the site - not that that should excuse a badly worded offer?
 
Spearmaster...

I did not deposit $41k (I'm actually a net winner at the casino--deposited $9000, cashed out $14000), during the course of December I played and ran my account balance up to $41,000 (my playthrough was around $1,000,000).

When I received the email (12/17/01), my account balance was around $20,000.

On 12/30/01, I lost the entire account balance, plus another $1000 which I deposited on 12/30/01.

If I'm reading correctly I feel they owe me $4,200. What do you think?
 
Colly...

I didn't notice, but actually, what they call a "PIN" is really just an internal account number. Its neither the log in name nor password.

But I appreciate you mentioning it.
 
Ouch.

Under normal circumstances, I would have to say that this promo is intended to refund 10% of any deposits lost during the period of the promotion.

I do not think that, having had a positive balance at the time, that losses from that point onwards could be used to claim the 10% - but then again I am not the casino operator either.

But even so, if they WERE to take into account your starting account balance at the time the promo was mailed, you would only be entitled to $2,100.

Any time you are unsure of a promo you must always mail the casino to ensure that you have the correct response confirming what you thought. Had a casino rep validated this in writing, saying that losses on your positive balance would also be counted, they would be forced to abide by that.

I don't know how Bryan is going to read this, but I think you're going to have to accept the fact that any such promo can only be applied to deposits made during the appropriate period.

Now I see what Jetset was referring to. And undoubtedly there is room for confusion.

Let's see what Bryan comes up with - I'll stay out of this for the time being. Thanks for clarifying the point.
 
There is definately some of that gray area here. Depends on how you read it. Knowing Prestige, I am very certain it this is unintentional.

It does say all losses.

[Yes, we have decided to offer only to you ( account with PIN39750
<,<, our great Christmas gift: 10% Refund of all your money lost during your
<,<, past week!!!]

By the same token there are several references indicating on deposits. I just don't know. Impartially, I would say both sides have to take some responsibility. Either split the difference or maybe put the 4 grand in the account with a special agreed upon wager thru before it can be cashed out.

Certainly based on the sheer amount of the money involved.....100.00 is not an appropriate solution. Just my two cents.
 
The_Cpa....

The email may have "implied" deposits, but it was received when my account balance was $20,000...the implication I got was, "go ahead and play" and if you lose, we'll refund back 10% of loses. Generally with a $20,000 balance I can't imagine they wanted me to deposit more, just trying to entice me to play and lose (which worked).

Any comments?
 
Either way you met the deposit requirements right?

I completely agree, you played under a certain assumption and played hard I might add! You deserve the benefit of the doubt in a somewhat unclear bonus offering.

Personally, I read it as ALL LOSSES during the period of the promo, how much was in your account is irrelevent, it was your money and you lost it during the promo period. As long as you deposited the 100.00 as required, that is what it says to me. Let's just hope that Mr. Redford agrees.

I sincerely hope that they work this thru in an equitable fashion.
 
SuziRose: It is shocking to me how you, IN YOUR RIGHT MIND, could run up your balance to $41,000 and then give it all back. Bossmedia has a $5000 per month withdrawal policy, and the entire sum (less $1000) would have been YOURS in 8 months.
That's an enitre year's pay for most people.
You hit the jackpot of a lifetime, and then threw the money away. What were you trying for -- $200,000??? Are you that greedy? And even if you did make that kind of money, do you know how long it would take to withdraw $200,000 at 5K per month? Now that's what I call G - R - E - E -D !
That kind of money can change a person's life - FOREVER!

It amazes me how many people are completely addicted to casino gambling. They lose all self-discipline and self-control, and don't realize they are playing with real money.
Sheeesh.

SuziRose - Your still a net winner at the casino (+5000), so I will refrain from further comment.

Dave
 
Dave,
Certainly a thought provoking comment.

I do feel that "some" people are
completely oblivious when gambling
that this is "real" money, and it's
quite easy to just "keep playing".
Many of us (myself included) have
done this same thing.

Only after a period of time goes by,
do you start to comprehend the reality
of what occured.
Some learn from these experiences,
some never do.

As you also stated, at least "SuziRose"
is "still ahead" for the time being.
Hopefully, this is "cashed out",
and she gets to enjoy the "high"
of a winning session, which is
basically what it's all about for
most "gamblers".
 
Dave_r & mrracetrack....

I think we're getting a bit sidetracked here...my wins or loses are not at issue...if I was not "gambling" I would not have been up $41,500, and for the record, I cashed out over $200,000 in wins from various online casinos in 2001.

The issue which I raised to the forum is should Prestige Casino credit my account 10% of my loses--$4,250 or not, based on the email which they sent me.

The issue is not, "quit when ahead", because if I did that at ever place I've played, I would have won much LESS during the year and I did.

And Daver....as you noted, that although I did lose $42k, I am ahead at that casino (and Prestige has increased my monthly w/d limit much higher than 5000).

Did I cover all the points?
 
I kind of sensed that about you. Your comments are pretty controlled for loosing that much.

I, on the other hand..would have been screaming like a raped ape! I very much agree that how much a person wagers is a individual thing. 40k is weekend retreat for some and like Dave R. says, a years income for others.

Be it 100.00 or 100,000.00, the issue here is the same.

200k HUH? Wow! That's fantastic. Did they all pay up O.K?
 
The_CPA....

They didn't all pay, but most of them did...I try to research casinos before {potentially} giving them a big chunk of my money. I stay away if I don't think they will pay me if I win.

I try to read the various forums---casinomeister being by far my favorite.
 
Thanks Suzirose for the Kudos... :D

I've just returned from a looong weekend and I should be in gear early tomorrow morning. I'm suprised that one of the Prestige casino managers hasn't stepped in and made a comment since they are registered members of this board. But then a lot of people have taken a fair amount of time off during the holidays and are plenty behind (like me).

I'll be checking into this tomorrow!

~b
 
Where I live in Germany, most everything is shut down from December 24th to about now. Everyone is taking time off. So the wife makes plans with friends out of town and we're gone a few days. Actually I would rather be glued in front of my computer screen sucking up wierd radiation rays instead of playing in the snow with my kids NOT.

The grind begins tomorrow :(

~b
 
Prestige Casino had a very poorly worded promo. I do not believe this was done intentionally.

Suzanne - despite my sarcastic comments in my above post, I still agree with you completely in this matter. A casino must have responsibility for the terms and conditions of its promotions, and this promo is as clear cut as it gets. The promo states 10% of all LOSSES during that timeframe. You had 20K in your account on 12/17 and deposited an additional 1K on 12/30. So based on this, you had 21K total losses from the time of the email, and Prestige Casino should be responsible for paying you $2,100 of it.

The email did make a requirement: If you lost money the week of 12/17 to 12/23 IT WAS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to email the casino on Monday 12/24 to get your rebate for that week. Otherwise any rebate for that week would be NULL and VOID. IF YOU NEVER EMAILED PRESTIGE THAT WEEK (and never deposited $100), THAN YOUR TOTAL LOSSES SHOULD BE COMPUTED FOR THE WEEK OF 12/24 TO 12/30 ONLY, AND PREVIOUS LOSSES (OR YOUR PREVIOUS BALANCE) CANNOT BE COMPUTED INTO THE EQUATION.

Suzanne - based on your comments above, I am assuming you did not lose $$$ the initial week of the promo. Therefore, Prestige needs to accept responsibility for its poorly worded email and PAY YOU YOUR MONEY.

I disagree with Spearmaster that there was any implication that a player needed to make a deposit. Spearmaster - show me WHERE!! WHERE in the email, does it state Prestige will only rebate 10% of a player's deposit. Once again, the email states 10% of ALL MONIES LOST THAT WEEK, without reference to a deposit. The word DEPOSIT was only mentioned twice in the whole email:

<,<, One simple rule to follow: you must deposit $100 or more during the week. >,>,

The other reference toward making a deposit was to gain entry into thier $25,000 sweepstakes, but this is neither here nor there, and has nothing to do with the promo.

Once again, Spearmaster, WHERE in the email does it make reference to a 10% rebate of the amount deposited, if a player loses all his money.

THERE IS NO SUCH REFERENCE. So, Spearmaster, how can you possibly come down on the side of Prestige? Perhaps the reason is your website, got2bet.com, is bought and paid for by the industry. I do not know if you've accepted advertising from Prestige in the past, but it sure seems that way. No impartial observer without an agenda would possibly come to your conclusion.

As for Mr. Racetrack and CPA I agree with most of what each of you said. If I lost $42,000 I would not be able to eat or sleep for 2 days. Suddenly I would be hit with the reality of the situation. THAT THIS WAS REAL MONEY. THAT THIS WAS MY MONEY.
I would then turn on the computer in the hopes that it was all a big dream. I would logon to the casino and check my balance. After seeing that it was only $0.75 cents, I would smack myself silly, and go into denial. The final outcome would be that I would never be able to live with myself.
I never would be able to forgive myself for giving away over $40,000.
 
Once again to quote the email:

<,<, Yes, we have decided to offer only to you ( account with
PINXXXXX
<,<, our great Christmas gift: 10% Refund of all your money lost
during your
<,<, past week!!!
<,<, Yes, we will credit back on your account 10% of all the
money you loose
<,<, during these special weeks.

Notice how the email says "ALL THE MONEY YOU LOOSE" and not just 10% of the DEPOSIT.

Case closed!
 
Dave_r...

That's how I read it, and in the back of my mind, I was thinking, well worse case if I run bad and lose everything at least I'll get something back....That was the only reason I deposited the $1000 (after losing $41000+), and I did email them immediately. I followed all conditions in the email to the letter.

If not for the email, maybe I wouldn't have played (who knows)....

But the email did have it's desired effect (i.e. me losing my bankroll).

Hopefully Prestige will cover the 10% of my lose. I would like to play there in the future, as they do payout promptly.
 
I'm with DaveR on this - it might have been the casino's mistake in badly wording their promo but it's pretty unequivocal and they should honor it.
 
THERE IS NO SUCH REFERENCE. So, Spearmaster, how can you possibly come down on the side of Prestige? Perhaps the reason is your website, got2bet.com, is bought and paid for by the industry. I do not know if you've accepted advertising from Prestige in the past, but it sure seems that way. No impartial observer without an agenda would possibly come to your conclusion.
Ha ha... you know that I am not bought and paid for by the industry. Yes we accepted advertising from Prestige a long time ago, but they haven't advertised in over a year. And yes, I am being impartial.

When any casino talks of losses, one should automatically imply lost deposits. But like I said, the wording of the promo leaves a lot to be desired, and it can easily be interpreted the other way.

Should this be the case, then Suzi would still only be entitled to $2,100 as her account had $20K when she received the promo - and then she deposited a further $1K after losing it all. The fact that she reached a high point of $41K has no bearing on the matter.

As I said, I am staying out of this, and letting Bryan handle this unless he gets no response. Then I recommend Julie at GG if you need a third opinion - she will probably have the best chance of reaching some sort of middle ground.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
I notified the casino yesterday, but there hasn't been a response yet (Christmas break?). I agree, it's a poorly worded promotion. If I were to have received this promo (offered only to me), I would have understood it as such:

If I play during those weeks (17th December - 13th January), I will be returned 10% of the money I lose (while meeting deposit requirements). If I had $20,000 in my account and was using this to play during the promotion, this should be included too.

One of the reasons that I read it this way is that this promo has been offered "only to me" since I am a BIG $$$$$ player. Why would the casino NOT want me to play that $20,000 that was in my account, and play only some token deposit. This would have only benefited the casino, which it did (sheesh Suzi, why didn't you visit my Christmas "wish list" at amazon.uk instead?? :D )

As a player, I would have assumed that this promo would have included my balance and and deposits made during this period.

Let's hear what the casino has to say.

~b
 
One of the reasons that I read it this way is that this promo has been offered "only to me" since I am a BIG $$$$$ player.
Click to expand...

Now THAT makes some sense. Does anyone know if this was offered to everyone? I suppose I can dig through my own emails... and I am *NOT* a big player LOL.

Hmm.

I can confirm that I did NOT receive this email. I did get one for a Thanksgiving promo, in which they CLEARLY stated that they will refund 50% of losses on deposits.

Starting today, Thursday November 22nd at 00:00 EST (05.00 GMT) and for the whole day long till 23:59 EST (04:59 GMT), if you deposit and wager a minimum of $100 up to a maximum of $1,000 we will refund you 50% of your money lost ($500 maximun for a deposit of $1,000).
Click to expand...

Now THAT looks strange. Why in the world would they NOT use the same type of wording when making the offer to Suzi?

Can anyone else confirm receiving the email that Suzi got?
 
Spear..

I receive tons of casino spam with bonus offers. They usually have some small print or refer to the website's T&Cs. The email I received, looks like it was hastily written (notice the misspelled "loose&#34 ;) without any references to the T&Cs. I agree that they should be held accountable and if they misworded they're email, that's their problem.

Bryan....I too am waiting for a response from Prestige. To add insult to injury, when I emailed them to credit my account the $4,250., they credited me $4.25. No questions asked :-)
 
I'm, Tony Brown, the Marketing Manager for Prestige Casino and I'll provide you, hopefully, an explanation on behalf on my Manager.

First of all I want to point out that Prestige Casino's policy and relationship with his players has been based always, I repeat, always on honesty, integrity and fairness and this statement can be witnessed and proved by thousands of players.
This case represents in our management history a unique and first one as we have always accomplished to solve our players' problems eventhough sometimes they didn't deserve it.

Our custom and policy is to respect the rules and
follow the correct guidelines with our players
in all promotions and mainly in this one, as well.
For this reason, we feel we can't have any exception to any player and we have provided refunding back all the players who have followed the rules.
As I said, all players have followed the rules in this promotion which I will repeat once again:
we give back 10% to the player who deposits and looses during our promotional event started on December 17th, 2001.
Our 10% refund is tied exclusively to the amount of money deposited - partially or entirely lost -
and not related to money won as a result of winnings.
In this singular case, SuziRose, as we have several times explained her, has deposited and lost $1,000 during our Promotion and therefore we have immediately refunded back 10% which is $100.
The money SuziRose claims and has lost is related exclusively to her winnings and not, I repeat, not to her deposits.
Therefore we have not satisfied SuziRose's request because it doesn't follow in a fair manner the rules that all players have honestly followed.

This promotion has not been posted on our Web site because it was designed expressly for our loyal players.

In regards to the $4.25 credited to SuziRose we apologize for this inconvenience as there has been a mistake made from our Support Staff.
As I said, we have provided refunding back $100.00.

We will continue to respect and follow the rules and we request our players do the same thing.

Tony Brown
Marketing Manager
Prestige Casino
 
Tony...

Thank you for responding to the forum, but what you neglected to address was the wording of the email which was sent to me, said "10% of loses (looses)" there was NOTHING in the email or the T&Cs which said "10% of deposits". Different casinos have different enticements and my understanding, as well as the understanding of most readers of this forum, that the email I received (and posted here in it's entirety) was in a way of "insuring" a portion of my money, so that if I was to gamble, the most I could lose is 90% of my bankroll. This is what I read from the email.

As for following the rules, I followed the rules in the email TO THE LETTER. I deposited over $100 during the promo period, and I immediately sent an email requesting my 10%.

I know that Presitage is an honorable and fair casino, and will make the correct decision regarding this issue.

Care to comment on this further?
 
Tony....

As an aftertought to my last post: you may say that your email "implied" deposits, not loses, but that would be like offering a 50% bonus, and then saying, we "meant" 5%, not 50%.

Players can only go on what they read; it's hard enough going thru the fine print and searching out T&Cs on the website, only later to find that something was missed. In this case, the email was clear cut.

I did not ask for a 10% refund of my "loses". PRESTIGE offered it to me unsolicited!!
 
Tony Brown (Pretige Casino marketing manager said):

Our 10% refund is tied exclusively to the amount of money deposited - partially or entirely lost -
and not related to money won as a result of winnings. [End Quote]

THE PROMOTION NEVER STATED THIS.
AMAZING! AN UNWRITTEN RULE!

There are several views on this:

Spearmaster believes a deposit should be implied.

CPA believes it is a gray area, and both the casino and the player need to bear some responsibility. Therefore s/he believes a compromise should be made.

Myself/Jetset/Bryan believe that there is no gray area and that the casino bears total responsibility since the rules are clearly stated.

AND . . . Almost everyone agree's the promo was poorly written.

I've played at Prestige many time in the past, and have always found them to be a highly reputable operation. I do not think Prestige was out to rip anyone off. Nonetheless Prestige must be held accountable for ITS OWN RULES.

I have removed Prestige Casino hard drive. I doubt I will play there again unless they pay Suzanne her rightful rebate.

There are many casinos out there that know the meaning of good customer service. Its apparent Prestige is not one of them.
 
This should all be very simple. What was the balance in your account when the promo started? If this is the money that was lost, you should get paid. If you won it after the promo started and then lost it, that doesn't count. This is money you could have withdrawn and then redeposited if a deposit was called for. Some casinos are never happy, here you lose a large sum of money and they are refusing to pay according to their own rules. Tony, by you taking this action, you are alienating what appears to be a good customer.
 
Yet another irritating case of a casino management apparently screwing up on a promo wording and then refusing to accept the financial consequences, is my opinion.

It is doubly disappointing because Prestige has (had?) a good name and they should not be pulling this kind of BS - why not negotiate with the client and come to a mutually fair arrangement instead of this outright rejection and talk of "implied" terms and conditions.

And for God's sake get a senior and experienced manager to scrutinize and approve all promo offers in future. BEFORE they go out.
 
I agree that the email does look like a personal offer to a player with a big balance. I'd consider a $2k bonus fair, as being either 10% of her balance when recieving the offer or a 50/50 compromise on 10% of her losses (to which I think she is really entitled but I'm being realistic here)

The casino's excuse about "we meant deposits" etc. is bogus. It wouldn't stand up in court. The email said "losses".
 
Tony Tony Tony,

Let me help you out here

1. you come accross as an arrogant stuck up your own ass type of man.

2 your email was incorrectly worded (no one would give away 10% of losses but alas it appears noone in your outfit has previous knowledge of gambling or this would have stuck out like a sore thumb.

3 stick your head in the sand and hope this will go away. (cos you cant afford to make good the limits)

4 best go back to your old job (i will show my ass in woolworths if it was gambling related)

5 who loves ya baby (said in kojak mode)

6 with reference to comment 1 above think about it and dont talk down to people as its rude and makes u seem evil, your probably a very nice man, maybe bald maybe fat maybe a cross dressing lesbian dwarf, this we can live with but saying things like "not and i mean not" etc etc is ass wipe bollocks

7 xxxxxx give us a kiss
 
Well,

I was just in the process of emailing Tony to see if he would again respond to some of the legit comments. Foofoo probably just scared the poor man away.

Shame on you foofoo.

~b
 
Well,

Tony Brown (Prestige Marketing Director) sure must be a busy guy, cause after his one post, he's had numerous requests for a follow-up with a rebuttal post, but he is nowhere to be heard from.
 
Perhaps a confirmation of Foofoo's opinion that he is an "arrogant stuck up your own ass type of man."

Foo you left out the oversized brown underwear bit!!!!
 
jet & foofoo....

There is no need to insult Mr. Brown. He is just making a "business" decision, which though it seems that most people in this forum disagree with, it doesn't make Tony an "ass", just an unwise business man, in my humble opinion.

I've put a lot of action at a lot of casinos in the last few years. I'm the type of player the casinos wish to grab with the tons of spam they send out, yet Tony, is willing to lose my action when it's blatantly obvious that Prestige is in the wrong, and the amount we're talking about is only two hands of blackjack for me.

That's goooooood business sense (sacrastic).
 
Suzi I guarantee Tony Brown (who went to town riding on a donkey) isnt ignoring this thread he and his merry band from Prestige will be checking this thread almost daily in the hope it will vanish in the under growth.

That said a 10% payback on your losses is not sustainable by any casino that is so obvious to anyone who can count to five.

Now I presume Prestige intentions where very honorable by offering the promotion but alas the wording let them down, I think suzi babes however hard it is to swallow you will haved to make do with whatever bonus he gave you as never in a month of sundays is he going to flip you 10% and his reply says as much.

Now Tony come out from the shadows and try and make it up to suzi or I publish the pictures of you in the chinese brothel being pampered by ladyboys. oh scandel and gossip ok the last bit is made up but come on tony show you are human and I will forgive you, suzi wont or maybe she will who knows but just admit you fooked up, theres a good man
 
As it's looking more and more like Prestige will not be honoring their 10% promo, does anyone know if Prestige owns any other casino sites.

I want to make sure that I don't accidently play at any of their casinos ever again.
 
Well, it looks as though this casino does not plan to budge. What a shame since this is obviously a poorly worded/planned promo, and Suzirose was one of their big players.

I hope Prestige feels this is worth it.

~b
 
Jerry Garner at WOL makes a good point...

"The one piece of the pie that I don't see represented are the Terms and Conditions for that promotion. Does anyone have a copy saved the way they were at the time the email was sent out? If so, do the T&C specifically reference a 10% refund on Deposits, or does it also say on Losses?"

Generally when Prestige emails me, on the very bottom on the email, there is a summary of the T&C for the promo. However, this email was different. IT DOES NOT SHOW THIS. I am extremely curious as to whether Suzanne posted THE ENTIRE email, or just the main portion of it.

If she posted this email in its ENTIRETY here at Casinomeister:

She should be paid $2000 in addition to the $100 she received. Prestige has made a terrible business decision by not being more felxible and at coming to a settlement with Suzanne. It does not make sense to upset a good customer, and create such negative publicity. I will never again recommend Prestige to anyone again unless she gets paid. At the same time, it is fair to point out that in all the time Prestige has been online, I have never read anything negative.

Suzanne - You maybe able to get satisfaction by complaining to IRAPIG at thepigpost.homstead.com.
His portal sends a huge amount of business to Prestige through many promos his site has come up with. However, IRAPIG is extremely receptive to player complaints, and may be willing to terminate Prestige's advertising contract.
 

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