Musings on the current gaming climate


Ueber Meister Mouse
Sep 12, 2004
(Sorry guys, but this is what happens when I wake up at 4 a.m. on a Saturday and can't go back to sleep..... )

Online gamblers -- especially those of us in the USA -- are taking a huge gamble when we attempt to play online. The odds against us are mounting. NETeller shut USA players out, the US DoJ has confiscated funds, publicly listed casinos have dropped US players, and the casinos and web wallets that are left are all in a scramble.

What deposit method is working, and where? What works one day doesn't work the next, and there are reports of the nefarious 'lost in cyberspace' deposits where the money is removed from the players payment method but doesn't show up in the casino. Casinos and sports books are setting up their own proprietary deposit/payment systems, but even that is iffy as in the case of Intertops whose own PayTru card has pulled out and cannot be used by USA players. Some bank credit/debit cards are working at times, but may be refused the next time the player attempts to use them. Prepaid gift cards are working in at some casinos (particularly at RTGs), but that too is up in the air as they also can be refused. Click2Pay is still working at the casinos who accept it, but only those USA players who already had existing accounts in place before NETeller shut us out have that privilege, as they will accept no new USA customers. Players can set up accounts at other online wallets, like ECOcard, but that means giving out personal and financial information to yet another online entity and it will only work at certain casinos.

Let's assume the player manages to get a deposit into the casino, and let's say s/he is lucky, gets some good spins/hands and wants to withdraw from the casino. If the casinos are having problems accepting your money (and they are) getting money back to the player is something of a nightmare. What's working? If the player is fortunate enough to have Click2Pay, or other web wallet, he can withdraw to that method -- if that is what was used to deposit. Players are finding themselves in a tangle when they cannot withdraw from the casino to the method they used to deposit.

And if you withdraw to a web wallet, how do you get your money into your hands? Wire transfer from Click2Pay seems to be functioning, but they will only process withdrawals if they are over $1500 to your bank. Some players who use Click2Pay (and don't have $1500+ in their accounts) and other web wallets have deposited large amounts to casinos, played a bit, then attempted an ACH or wire transfer withdrawal which only sets off all sorts of money laundering alarm bells. Most casinos won't tolerate it even though the player is only attempting to get his hands on his own money. ACH is working from certain casinos -- at times. Some ACH and even paper checks are being declined, whether by the casino's payment processor, or by the player's bank -- leaving yet more funds in limbo while the casino and the player scramble to find yet another payout method. Some MG casinos have stated recently that they will accept USA deposits, but have no idea how they would pay the player should a withdrawal be requested.

Most knowledgeable players, who did their research, never had a problem getting their money from good casinos before the crack down and the UIGEA. But now that the US DoJ has stepped in.... The DoJ has gotten its paws on millions of dollars of USA players' monies. They have managed to bring about what they (the DoJ) have said they set out to prevent. Players are getting hoodwinked right and left. More shady casinos are trolling for US players everyday -- places that never liked to pay players even before the UIGEA crack down. The gullible, the innocent, the rookie player, are all fodder for these less reputable places. Reputable casinos are finding it difficult to impossible to pay players. Good casinos that once boasted of 24 - 48 hour withdrawal processing are finding themselves scrambling to pay players at all, and it might take weeks to get the money into the players hands even if a payment processor is in place.

Players who continue to play online in this unsettled climate must, absolutely must, stay abreast of what is happening in the online gaming community. Those who frequent the online gaming news portals and bulletin boards (like are the players who are more likely to play 'safely' and know what is working where and are less likely to deposit carelessly. The single most important piece of advice is that (once research has verified a casino as reputable) the player email or phone the casino immediately prior to depositing to get some idea of what deposit methods are working, and, more importantly, to determine if the casino has a processor in place that can pay USA players and what method will be used to pay out -- just in case he wins and wishes to withdraw.

A few fortunate, brave, diligent souls who have the time and fortitude to track down their deposits and withdrawals through persistent emails and follow up telephone calls, are making this new 'system' work. I, for one, have neither the time nor the patience and won't chance it.
Posted by Mousey:

Online gamblers -- especially those of us in the USA -- are taking a huge gamble when we attempt to play online. The odds against us are mounting. NETeller shut USA players out, the US DoJ has confiscated funds, publicly listed casinos have dropped US players, and the casinos and web wallets that are left are all in a scramble.

The best and most intelligent thing to do at this point is... NOT PLAY.

As you stated Mousey... it is a BIG HASSLE to deposit... even MORE of a hassle to withdraw (and actually get your money)

A "time out" for a few months... while things get sorted... seems to me to be the most prudent and wisest choice at this time... in my opinion.

I would like to read anyone elses thoughts on this issue.
You are so right Mousey .
I have deposited against my better judgement a little bit this weekend and last week but you know what ? It wasn't even fun because I couldn't relax not knowing that if I actually won anything if I would get my winnings . As of right now I am done until we know what is going to happen . I think reading your post gave me the kick in the ass I needed again :] :thumbsup:
Might be a boring missive, but I have turned my attention to Nevada. (geo local) At least I know I won't get threatened if I insist on winnings (unless I'm counting cards at an old downtown joint :eek2: But being, I guess addicted, to MG software I'm trying every imaginable variance on roulette and slots and practicing my blackjack strategy.

I've done a little gaming online since January, but not much.. pretty much lying low and putting my online budget into savings for B&M. At least now it isn't a gamble (win or lose online to finance the trips).

On one hand I know how and can still play online, but the gamble isn't just the money now, it could be drawing attention to my finances. No problem, but who wants to deal with it? Not me. There are years I have no receipts, oh well.

As someone mentioned in another post, 'they' have created a situation that will only give them ammo if and when this issue gets a full debate. I wouldn't count on anything until the admin changes, if then. FFS there's a war on and celebs are dying and being buried everyday. That won't change.

I'm gonna play, period. I'm honored when anyone here reads or replies to my posts. And for those that are aggressively seeking solutions my hat is off.
I tend to think we are fecked for the time being (bodog aside but that's another thread)
I'm just playing the horses online for now. Deposits and withdrawals are no problem.

I remember the thrill as a kid when my folks took us to the races, the stomping, clapping, screaming... then the ahhhhhhh ^%$#! I think that's where I caught the fever, come to think about it.

Does bodog or similar have a sportsbook for horses or dogs that is 'sanctioned'? I'd rather play online than sit in a parimutuel lounge - it's two or three hours to the track from here.
Horse racing

I to have taken a hiatus from the online casinos and went back to my first love, horse racing. There are two sites that stick out to play the ponies with no problems depositing or getting paid. and Good luck !!
I use Brisbet for horses. You can deposit directly from your checking acct (no hassles with ewallets, and no driving to Walgreens for a prepaid debit card). You get free live video and replays and free PPs for tracks you wager on. They also have a nice little $100 sign-up bonus.
Just found a good primer for race forms for newbies like me. From looking at the referred sites and a few other things it doesn't look like the ponies are anything I want to enter into lightly and expect to profit:eek2: But a couple of days of research and I think I'll be good to go:thumbsup:
Thanks again.

Users who are viewing this thread

Meister Ratings