Moneybookers - WTF

[chuchu59]

I feel compelled to tell everyone of how badly MB treats its customers. More than 2 weeks ago, I was suddenly cut off from depositing with MB at a Rival and then a sportsbook. The funny thing is I was sure I had adequate funds in my MB account and I had just deposited elsewhere the night before. OK, I log in my MB account and lo and behold, there is a notice stating that with immediate effect, because of where I live, I was restricted from performing any gaming transactions as a policy change.

As I wasnt given any prior notice, I asked them why they didnt let me know earlier of the change in policy and they replied bluntly after 3 days that this was a change in policy and that I could still use MB to transfer funds to non-gaming merchants. Obviously not satisfied, I asked the same question again with a little more emphasis on why no notice was given only to be given the same reply again, this time 4 days later. Mind you, writing to them is a bit of a hassle because you cannot reply to their e-mail but can only go their site's Messaging centre and forward a complaint using the ticket number previously registered with them. So I asked a 3rd time and demanded that I should either be given a grace period to settle my other transactions ie withdrawals at various casinos or at the very least to have them send my MB balance via bank wire free of charge to me. After another 3 days they replied and said no to both requests while reiterating yet again that I was permitted to transfer funds to other merchants and I must pay a fee for the wire which I feel is ridiculous as I wasnt given any time to settle my accounts.

In a mad scramble to find an alternative to get my funds out of MB I was fortunate to be rendered assistance from someone from my zone and my funds were safely retrieved. I believe that those of you that have MB accounts to be wary of this as they will, without advance notice, cut off access to your gaming transactions. This was handled very badly by MB and I give them a fat 0.

 

[SlotMonster]

You damn right, chuchu!
MB are at the first place with their idiocity! I had been blocked for TWO weeks!!! only for sending a little money to my friend. Firstly they locked my and my friend's account without any notification, than they asked for scanned documents to be sent to them from both of us. After sending the documents they asked us to explain our relations to EVERY transactions we had made!
If you failed to enter you password more than three times, you will be blocked and you'll have to send 'em all the documents, even if you have already sent it a day before and they accepted it.
Every departure from the norm cause immediately block!!!
And they are VER-VERY slow with their decisions and problem solving!!!
I discontinued any business with MoneyBookers.

 

[hakapuku]

agree with chuchu. In my experience Moneybookers don't serve their customers (and customers' money) in a proper way. They love to lock the accounts with money in it.

 

[zebedy]

is there any official body you can complain to about how moneybookers treats its customers ?ill answer my own question
moneybookers are watched over by the FSA,
check the following link you might find something useful there,

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[halcyon1234]

I have a feeling that, especially if you aren't from the UK, complaining to them is just about as useful as complaining to the Kahnawake Gaming Commission.

I just shut down my Moneybookers account. They're rotten, filthy, incompetent idiots there. They've screwed up every withdrawal I've every tried to do from them except for the first one, which is the real kicker.

First withdrawal: Bank transfer, everything goes smoothly.
Second withdrawal: Bank transfer, they screw it up by sending it to the wrong account! Keep in mind that I didn't change ANYTHING in my account settings from #1 to #2
Third withdrawal: Check withdrawal, except that its missing $20 because their system said I didn't give them my full name. Except its printed right there on the check. Oh yeah, and there's more money missing because they converted from CAD to EUR to USD-- two unfavorable currency hits. (Plus another one when I convert from USD to CAD....)
Fourth withdrawal: With a new bank. I get every single SWIFT code and everything from them to be 100% sure. I enter it into their system-- well, as well as possible. Moneybookers only lets you enter the bank's code, then it says "CIBC at this address, right?". It doesn't let you confirm any other details, but everything it presents is correct. They screw up this one because there's missing banking information for international transfers, and they ignore me when I point out with screenshots how their system gives the right info and doesn't let you make any modifications. (Thus, the missing information is their fault)
Fifth and final withdrawal: By check, again missing $20 to currency conversion.

Total loss due to these assholes (I don't usually swear this much, but I'm really pissed just thinking about them) is over $100USD!

Good thing I got out when I did, because it looks like their giving up gaming transactions. Only a matter of time until their bad customer service and bad policies shut them down. And since they aren't a bank, they'll probably take everyone's deposits with them (or at least lock them up forever like Neteller). Get out while you can.

On a side note, now I have to find a gaming-friendly, Canadian accessible payment provider who isn't Click2Pay.

is there any official body you can complain to about how moneybookers treats its customers ?ill answer my own question
moneybookers are watched over by the FSA,
check the following link you might find something useful there,

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[heatherad]

On a side note, now I have to find a gaming-friendly, Canadian accessible payment provider who isn't Click2Pay.

Have you tried Instadebit?

 

[tombee]

Besides problems stated here, anyone has had problems with slow payments? Most of the times I get my money within a day or 2-3, but sometimes it takes much more.. I'm now still waiting for two withdrawals of 3 and 8 december. Why is that first withdrawal taking ages and ages???

 

[Jasminebed]

Hi. Just recently made my first MB withdrawal by bank wire. I am in Canada, my bank charged me $14 processing fee, in addition to the $2.85 fee MB charges.

But I've had an awful time funding my account. I use a prepaid MC for which I receive no paper statement. They made a small confirmation charge to my MC in GBP, shows up as as $CA. This amount cannot be entered, and there is no way to show them that the charge from Moneybookers in on my account...they will not accept my online info. I use TitaniumPlus from Moneymart, and Moneymart assures me that they have been in touch with Moneybookers multiple times for other people in this regard, with no sucess. Fortunately a casino I am a regular player paid to my Mneybookers' account without me first making a deposit, which allowed me to make a deposit at VegasSky to claim winnings from a ND bonus.

When I first opened my Moneybookers account, I was asked if I intended to use it for gambling transactions. I did answer yes.

Halcyon, Ecocard is available to Canadians, but they charge $30 to transfer funds, and I would expect the bank would charge the same $14 fee to receive the wire.

 

[halcyon1234]

Hi. Just recently made my first MB withdrawal by bank wire. I am in Canada, my bank charged me $14 processing fee, in addition to the $2.85 fee MB charges.

Yup, seems all banks will charge that. PC Financial said they wouldn't, but I don't believe them. =)

But I've had an awful time funding my account. I use a prepaid MC for which I receive no paper statement. They made a small confirmation charge to my MC in GBP, shows up as as $CA.

I hear you. I think I had to eventually call my bank and ask for the actual transfer amount, in its original currency. They should have a record of that. At first I tried to reverse-engineer the amount based on the transaction day's exchange rate, but I've since learned that MB uses a mystical, magical conversion rate that is different from what everyone else in the world uses.

Halcyon, Ecocard is available to Canadians, but they charge $30 to transfer funds, and I would expect the bank would charge the same $14 fee to receive the wire.

$30, ow. Sometimes I have to wonder if it's not just easier to deposit it all in a casino, then just pay whatever their slightly less exorborant cheque fee may be.

tombee: I believe my transactions took in the order of weeks, not days. Grab a sandwich. =)

heatherad: I'll check out Instadebit, thanks.

 

[Jasminebed]

It is possible that President's Choice is NOT lying to you. My daughter uses them, and is very happy.

Rival Casinos do not issue cheques, nor pay by bank wire. You have to use a Ewallet. I believe the regular, bank issued credit cards can have funds paid back to them, but I think only to the amount charged. I don't have one, so I am not certain.

I do not wish to use Instadebit...it's too easy to hit up the money in your bank account, and I prefer to have to go and put the money on my prepaid. But that is me, perhaps you have better impulse control. Some members use a separate account just for gambling.

 

[vinylweatherman]

UK regulators, including the FSA have been under fire for being incompetent.
Maybe the way would be to call their bluff, and get a solicitor, or a good letter writer, to send them a "solicitor's letter with a cut-off date to prevent court action". This often does the trick, no company wants this kind of black mark against it, as this affects their standing in the BUSINESS community.

Forget Click2Pay too, they are just as bad. Here in the UK, what they have just done would be ILLEGAL, as they have failed to give advance notice of a change of terms that are "detrimental to the client", and they can be fined, and taken to court for civil damages. Equally, refusing to return any outstanding funds is THEFT.

Forget their "complaints form", use "snail mail", and make it look official, as though they might be dealing with someone with legal experience.

This looks much like the stunt Neteller pulled with the US, claiming they were free to still use their accounts for "non gambling purposes", but the second any US customer tried this, they locked both their account, and that of the recipient.

Many of these eWallets might as well be unregulated, so the only way for any kind of justice is to ensure these actions get maximum publicity, so that other customers can be fully aware of what can happen.

It is utter bullshite that they made this policy change overnight, this was a deliberate and premeditated attempt to extract extra value by delaying the hit caused by losing the affected customer base, charging them extra fees, as well as benefiting from sitting on their funds while they sort things out.

The big question now is who the hell is next, this kind of thing is spreading well beyond the USA and Canada where it started, with Turkey and Israel adopting this policy, as well as attempts by some EU states.

 

[Rhyzz]

I think some people need to realise that these companies may have very good reason to pull out of certain countries and restrict transactions 'all of a sudden'.

As for the incompetence, that's just poor CS and they won't learn until people complain, so like VWM says, get it on a letter and address it to the directors, that way it may get through.

MB are regulated by the FSA so your money is safe, they're much better than any of the others. Click2Pay are awful and lost a load of details last year, mine being part of these. Please explain to me how someone managed to hack my C2P account when I didn't even know the details myself? Yes, C2P couldn't explain it either...very dodgy, avoid them like the plague.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I think some people need to realise that these companies may have very good reason to pull out of certain countries and restrict transactions 'all of a sudden'.As for the incompetence, that's just poor CS and they won't learn until people complain, so like VWM says, get it on a letter and address it to the directors, that way it may get through.

MB are regulated by the FSA so your money is safe, they're much better than any of the others. Click2Pay are awful and lost a load of details last year, mine being part of these. Please explain to me how someone managed to hack my C2P account when I didn't even know the details myself? Yes, C2P couldn't explain it either...very dodgy, avoid them like the plague.

Maybe, but it does NOT give them the right to hold to ransom the CUSTOMER'S monies, and they should offer IMMEDIATE return or give evidence of a LEGAL RULING, not just "change of policy".

These companies know full well that they are going to have to pull out of certain countries, but the only reason that it happens "all of a sudden" is because they are GREEDY, and want every HOUR of moneymaking available before they are forced out, even if this means risking money that IS NOT THEIRS TO RISK.

 

[chuchu59]

The very, very least that they could have done is to return the money to the account holder free of charge. Now they are simply saying that you can still make transfers to other merchants and sound as they have no obligation towards their customers.

 

[mobigarden]

Fuck Moneybooker

I feel compelled to tell everyone of how badly MB treats its customers. More than 2 weeks ago, I was suddenly cut off from depositing with MB at a Rival and then a sportsbook. The funny thing is I was sure I had adequate funds in my MB account and I had just deposited elsewhere the night before. OK, I log in my MB account and lo and behold, there is a notice stating that with immediate effect, because of where I live, I was restricted from performing any gaming transactions as a policy change.

As I wasnt given any prior notice, I asked them why they didnt let me know earlier of the change in policy and they replied bluntly after 3 days that this was a change in policy and that I could still use MB to transfer funds to non-gaming merchants. Obviously not satisfied, I asked the same question again with a little more emphasis on why no notice was given only to be given the same reply again, this time 4 days later. Mind you, writing to them is a bit of a hassle because you cannot reply to their e-mail but can only go their site's Messaging centre and forward a complaint using the ticket number previously registered with them. So I asked a 3rd time and demanded that I should either be given a grace period to settle my other transactions ie withdrawals at various casinos or at the very least to have them send my MB balance via bank wire free of charge to me. After another 3 days they replied and said no to both requests while reiterating yet again that I was permitted to transfer funds to other merchants and I must pay a fee for the wire which I feel is ridiculous as I wasnt given any time to settle my accounts.

In a mad scramble to find an alternative to get my funds out of MB I was fortunate to be rendered assistance from someone from my zone and my funds were safely retrieved. I believe that those of you that have MB accounts to be wary of this as they will, without advance notice, cut off access to your gaming transactions. This was handled very badly by MB and I give them a fat 0.

I have my business in China and I had my MB account, they closed my account one month ago suddenly without any reasons, and they ignored me for weeks, I kept sending them emails and documents, no answer at all, badly I have about 3000 USD in the accounts, I don't kwow when they will return the money to me, fuck moneybooker.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I have my business in China and I had my MB account, they closed my account one month ago suddenly without any reasons, and they ignored me for weeks, I kept sending them emails and documents, no answer at all, badly I have about 3000 USD in the accounts, I don't kwow when they will return the money to me, fuck moneybooker.

Try the threat of court action. You will have to convince them this will be in an English court, but for $3000 they might just believe you have engaged a firm of representatives to pursue the case here. For $3000, you could use the small claims court, for a fixed fee of well under 100. If you have friends or relatives here in the UK, they could help by getting local advise.

Moneybookers are looking very bad now, even Neteller have not stooped this low (except for Americans).

What players need is a better choice - currently, these crappy ewallets have little competition, so can get away with providing this poor level of service, especially to their customers OUTSIDE the EU, and thus OUTSIDE the immediate regulatory framework.

If they tried this on a UK customer, we could complain to the FSA after 14 days of no response, since we can assume no response as being the same as receiving a "letter of deadlock". The regulator will FORCE them to respond, and explain their actions. Poor service can be subjective, but holding onto money that belongs to a customer is absolute, and hard to deny.
I do not know what would happen if a non EU customer complained to our FSA, but it might be worth a try, since if there are many such complaints, Moneybookers might face an investigation "in the public interest", to see if they are still fit to hold their emoney license.

Posting these stories on the net will help, since the worst offenders will lose customers to the better operators, and newcomers will stand a chance of capturing many of these disaffected customers.

I have not heard more on Ivobank, a new entrant, and a "proper" bank with full FSA regulation and FULL membership of the FSA investor compensation scheme. Ivobank set up with the intent to take on GAMBLING transactions, and seem to be targeting the UK and EU, going head to head with Neteller and Moneybookers. The problem at the moment is a lack of casinos accepting them as a deposit & withdrawal method.

 

[Mouche12]

Yes, it is indeed time to say goodbye to MB, I have filed a complaint with financial-ombudsman.org.uk because 3 times over a period of 1.5 week, my bank account was debited using Ideal and NOT credited to the casino I wanted to deposit. Until now, MB has refused to respond to the regulator and I am awaiting its decision. Today, I tried to upload funds using Ideal and same thing happened AGAIN. My bank account was debited, but my account at MB was not credited. Also, MB's phone no. does not seem to work at this moment. I have sent 6 emails in the meantime (today). No reply yet.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yes, it is indeed time to say goodbye to MB, I have filed a complaint with financial-ombudsman.org.uk because 3 times over a period of 1.5 week, my bank account was debited using Ideal and NOT credited to the casino I wanted to deposit. Until now, MB has refused to respond to the regulator and I am awaiting its decision. Today, I tried to upload funds using Ideal and same thing happened AGAIN. My bank account was debited, but my account at MB was not credited. Also, MB's phone no. does not seem to work at this moment. I have sent 6 emails in the meantime (today). No reply yet.

If this is true, and you should find out from the regulator, then this makes Moneybookers look VERY bad indeed.

NO reputable bank, or other regulated processor of money, refuses to respond to the organisation tasked with regulating them.

Other complaints about Moneybookers have made their reputation look pretty shaky, but refusing to respond to a government regulator is in a different league.

Please let us know how this turns out.

 

[Mouche12]

1) the deposit was eventually manually done 4 business days after it happened
2) I still have not heard from the UK regulator... so I will keep you posted. Am not going to use MB anymore, that's for sure!

 

[AussieDave]

Hi all,

Just an update...

Well after my little rave to Moneybookers and pointing out that their policy sucks.

I received a response saying they would accepted a scanned Utility Bill.

Well I whipped out the scanner, sent and a few hours later I have now received confirmation that my identity and address has now been verified.

Ok so now my limit has been increased again and I can now use my MoneyBookers without being hassled for ID forms, number and what not.

Least it was somewhat smooth and void of too many headaches.

But if I didn't have a scanner I'd still be in the poo!


Cheers
T

 

[catcat941]

To viniweathy men and others -regarding bookers

Its a very good thing to send many signed letters with

true names for the body that gave MB the license . the uk regulator i mean .

i have an account with them about 2 years with zero money , since i still dont know what will happen if i upload money and try to send to a casino ,since i am from a place (still but hoping to leave) that MB states with red letters i should not use for gambling . i wonder if it can go one time without them noticing .

regards everyone

 

[vinylweatherman]

Its a very good thing to send many signed letters with

true names for the body that gave MB the license . the uk regulator i mean .

i have an account with them about 2 years with zero money , since i still dont know what will happen if i upload money and try to send to a casino ,since i am from a place (still but hoping to leave) that MB states with red letters i should not use for gambling . i wonder if it can go one time without them noticing .
regards everyone

Even if you did, they might notice the next time, then you would be screwed. If casinos accept deposits from Moneybookers, they will pay back that way. Moneybookers WILL notice, since they are almost exclusively a gambling processor.
The only way to fool them would be to submit false information about where you live (not Israel for example). They will quickly find this inconsistent with things like your IP address, and certainly when they ask for ID proofs, or bank verification.

IF you LEAVE Israel, and become resident elsewhere, you should be OK to use Moneybookers provided they accept Israeli citizens who reside abroad. This is not guaranteed though, since you will end up having to produce your Israeli passport for photo ID at some stage, unless you can get another photo ID from your new country without having to change citizenship (driving licence, for example). Beyond this, they may require permanent change of citizenship before they allow you to use Moneybookers for gambling.

Casinos tend to be more concerned about where you currently live, and mainly play from, rather than where you were born (and hold citizenship). This assumes that you are able to provide the relevant ID documents for your current country of residence.

Your eventual options will depend upon where you will end up residing if you were to leave Israel. There are special rules and regulations for a number of countries, and many defy ordinary logic.

 

[thebizb]

I am amazed to hear all of the problems people are having with moneybookers. I've been using them for 2-3 years now and have never had a problem. I get transfers from them to my bank account in 3-5 days always. Only once did it take longer and after i sent them a message they said it would be there the very next day and it was, just like that. I love mb and is the only ewallet that i use.

 

[justpistoff]

moneybookers

I am sorry to say this is my first post here and it is about a terrible problem a lot of us are facing. The problem is Moneybookers. I feel like such an idiot I did not know about this forum before and the true problems with Moneybookers. The name alone infuriates me! I have lived in another country for years and recently moved back to the US and that is when the problems started. I have had an acct. with them for almost two years with small amounts of money being transferred into my online casino accts. with no serious problems but short delays. Now I just wired them over $3,000 and that is when my new problems started or so it seems. Shortly after I wired them my money strange things started happening when I logged in. Many times it would take three attempts to log in even though I double checked everything twice before I entered. Then on Dec. 2nd I tried once again to log in and it would not let me log in and then came the notice I was locked out of my acct. They quickly sent me a message saying that a third party had tried to access my acct. which is a lie. Then another message stating I needed to send them documentation of who I am which I immediately sent them. They also told me to shut down my original email acct. that I used and open a new one, which I did. I have emailed them over 8 times with no response from them since then. They have basically stolen my money and will not respond to my emails. I have written back to them stating just wire back my money into my original bank acct. I sent it from to solve the problem but nothing. They don't even have the respect to send me an email stating they are working on it, nothing, what am I to do? I have reviewed the past posts in this thread and decided to contact the FSA which over sees them but they too have not responded to my emails. The sad thing is I need the money more than ever now because of a sick mother and the simple fact that a corp. can hijack my money is not acceptable to me. Keeping me from my money is theft! Can anyone here help me?

 

[vinylweatherman]

I am sorry to say this is my first post here and it is about a terrible problem a lot of us are facing. The problem is Moneybookers. I feel like such an idiot I did not know about this forum before and the true problems with Moneybookers. The name alone infuriates me! I have lived in another country for years and recently moved back to the US and that is when the problems started. I have had an acct. with them for almost two years with small amounts of money being transferred into my online casino accts. with no serious problems but short delays. Now I just wired them over $3,000 and that is when my new problems started or so it seems. Shortly after I wired them my money strange things started happening when I logged in. Many times it would take three attempts to log in even though I double checked everything twice before I entered. Then on Dec. 2nd I tried once again to log in and it would not let me log in and then came the notice I was locked out of my acct. They quickly sent me a message saying that a third party had tried to access my acct. which is a lie. Then another message stating I needed to send them documentation of who I am which I immediately sent them. They also told me to shut down my original email acct. that I used and open a new one, which I did. I have emailed them over 8 times with no response from them since then. They have basically stolen my money and will not respond to my emails. I have written back to them stating just wire back my money into my original bank acct. I sent it from to solve the problem but nothing. They don't even have the respect to send me an email stating they are working on it, nothing, what am I to do? I have reviewed the past posts in this thread and decided to contact the FSA which over sees them but they too have not responded to my emails. The sad thing is I need the money more than ever now because of a sick mother and the simple fact that a corp. can hijack my money is not acceptable to me. Keeping me from my money is theft! Can anyone here help me?

They seem to have responded to you before, but not since you opened a new email account - on their advice.

Even if you DID get this sorted out, you would not be able to use Moneybookers to fund and withdraw from casino accounts from the USA where you now live. They were quite happy for you as a US citizen to use Moneybookers to fund casinos whilst you were living abroad, so it has to be location, rather than citizenship, that determines their policy.

Maybe you can approach your bank to get help on this, as you would never have been able to use this money for gambling anyway due to Moneybooker's policy.

You could write to them, or try to track down a phone number. They also have an online contact form somewhere.

Did you tell them you were moving back to the USA? If not, this would be the initial cause of the security lockouts, since they would assume a third party was accessing your account from a different country from where you supposedly reside.