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Lyceum Media mis-representation of facts - Slotland

Discussion in 'Casino Industry Discussion' started by KasinoKing, Oct 27, 2009.

    Oct 27, 2009
  1. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    I was more than a little bit gob-smacked to receive this press release from Lyceum this-morning:-
    (Some parts omitted)

    Several times they refer to the game as "Video Poker" - but these games are not video poker - they are slot machines with 5 reels where the wins just happen to be based on standard poker hands.

    From Slotland's own website:
    I'm a little surprised Lyceum let this report get out with that wording... :eek2:
    KK
     
    2 people like this.
  2. Oct 27, 2009
  3. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    I believe that it's Slotland that writes the press release - Lyceum distributes them. Believe me - many of their "press release" are just ads on steroids :D

    But that's besides the point since this is an PR announcement of someone winning a $175,812 jackpot. I don't think anyone at Lyceum is paying attention to game definitions.
     
  4. Oct 27, 2009
  5. Zoozie

    Zoozie Ueber Meister CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Software Developer
    Location:
    Denmark
    Thanks for bringing this up KK. It also makes my piss boil to see SlotLand calling their fake video-poker for video-poker. Especially since video-poker is my favorite casino game.

    It is not new though. There has been at least one similar thread before here on CM that went into more details with their fake video-slot and fake video-poker. It is an old thread, at least 2 years, but I could not find it. But I remember I was very disappointed with the thread getting nowhere and noone seemed to care.

    It is not video-poker and should not be called video-poker. They are falsely advertising it as video-poker. A better name would be bingo-poker,slot-poker or lottery-poker. There is no actual deck of card behind the scenes. Other casino software has been rogued here on CM in a long time ago for pulling similar stuff. Like dealing second cards in BJ when dealer would bust etc. At least in this software there was a deck of cards behind BJ actual game, which is not the case for SlotLand...

    I am sad that a leading portal like CM (and many affiliate sites - I will not mention names...) does not warn players against fake video-poker software (and video-slots). The only reason we know it is because of hard work done by some CM members, the avarage player has no way of knowing this.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Oct 27, 2009
  7. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Actually, the video poker issue was the reason they were dropped off of the Accredited list back then. And I think it was longer than two years ago - I need to check.

    Edited to add: the URL http://www.casinomeister.com/forums...71-slotland-fraudulent-video-poker-games.html - it was in 2004

    They were supposed to change the wording of this, but they never did. And most everybody forgot about the whole thing - including me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2009
    1 person likes this.
  8. Oct 27, 2009
  9. Zoozie

    Zoozie Ueber Meister CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Software Developer
    Location:
    Denmark
    Nice digging! The thread was older than I thought.
    Seems I was wrong, the thread did go somewhere :) But I think there has been more than this thread about it.

    I am happy SlotLand was removed them from accredited section because of this. But since they are still misleading players with their fake video-poker, maybe you could issue a permanent warning as well? That way new players will smell the fish before they deposit.
     
    2 people like this.
  10. Oct 30, 2009
  11. justred

    justred Full Member webmeister

    Occupation:
    Webmaster
    Location:
    AU
    Personally I think anyone who plays those games thinking they are playing video poker is pretty dumb.

    I am no great Slotland fan but surey at times the buck also has to stop with the player.

    It's pretty damn obvious its not video poker...

    You could actually dabate whether some of Slotlands slots are actually slots.. :)

    And those things sold by McDonalds are not hamburgers. :)
     
  12. Oct 31, 2009
  13. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I have played there for the two years I have been at GoneGambling. They are a long term sponsor, but more importantly, are one of only two casinos there where GoneGambling reward REPEAT deposits with some of their game vouchers, the points from which can be exchanged for a bonus at Royal Vegas. In a round about way, a deposit of $50 at $lotland, and 50 at Royal Vegas, gets me a 25 bonus at Royal Vegas.

    I believe the games are not just slots, but WEIGHTED slots. The progressive jackpot is described as being operated by a separate mechanism, so if, as usual, this decides you have NOT won, at least ONE necessary reel position has to be assigned a zero weight so that the progressive combination cannot be "dealt".

    I suspect that when those 4 to a RF were dealt, it had already been decided that the progressive was available, and the remaining card was thus drawn. Had the progressive NOT been determined to have been won, the necessary card would have been assigned a weight of zero.

    What is not clear is whether this weighting, or "blocking" ONLY operates to block the progressive combinations when they are not determined to have been won, or weights the game overall - even for lesser prizes.

    If you didn't know, you would take the video poker and blackjack games at face value, and assume a deck of cards lay behind it. Players with a deeper understanding might, however, spot that there is something "fishy" going on with the progressive pool not being won OFTEN ENOUGH for the games to be as shown. Similar MGS progressive VP games never get their pools anywhere near the values seen at $lotland, and they cover individual games too. The conclusion is that the RF, which triggers the progressive, simply CANNOT be "natural" dealt or drawn.

    They ONLY process payouts once a week too, on a Tuesday.
     
  14. Nov 1, 2009
  15. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    I just want to re-iterate what I said in my opening post - it's only the "Newsflash" which calls it Video Poker - they clearly state on their actual website that it's just a slot.
    I'm pretty sure this was changed shortly after CM booted them off the Accredited list.

    To repeat (with added bolding this time):-
    KK
     
  16. Nov 1, 2009
  17. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    Guys - I dunno about you - but I have to tell you - I LOVE Slotland - and totally love the "jacks or better"...

    And ok - yeah - I'm dumb and think it's just like Video Poker... sorry.

    It appears to PLAY like video poker.

    I'm not a numbers kinda gal - and don't count or add - just see a WIN or a Loss and think YAY or Bummer.

    So - I personally REALLY LIKE this slot/card game.

    All Youse guys who play poker and count cards and do all that - then youse might think this is not a real video poker game...

    But for dummies like me - who REALLY love Slotland's Excellent customer service and sometimes really fun winning games (ok - I generally lose, but still think they are tons of FUN!) --- it's all good.

    I dunno if it's that big of an issue - is it?

    (Don't take that the wrong way - I just don't know that it's that big of an issue - I mean - You either WIN or you Don't win when you play video poker - and you either win or you don't on Slotland's jacks or better game... Right?)

    I mean - could someone please explain to me why this is a big issue --- from my point of view (which is admittedly DAFT - LMAO!) I don't see it.:drink: I'm a glass is Half full kinda gal...

    But I still love them... just so you know. LOL!
     
  18. Nov 1, 2009
  19. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    It would be a VERY big issue if they tried to fool people into thinking they were playing Video Poker.
    I'm no expert on that game, but I do know the return for real JoB is probably something over 98%(?), you would decide which are the best cards to hold and you'd have a genuine completely random chance of getting the bigger wins.

    What they have is a slot with a return of... who knows?
    I can't see that they state this info anywhere on their website, so it could be anything from 95% downwards... maybe 80% for all we know!
    With a slot there is no skill involved - it just pays out when it feels like it.

    KK
     
  20. Nov 2, 2009
  21. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I think it's about 98%, but some of this comes from the progressive pool, which can be won from ANY of the games, including the Poker Slot, and the Blackjack Slot (Spacejacks). Each game displays the progressive win in it's own way, but the progressive itself is run using a mechanism separate from that of the game, a bit like the RTG Random Jackpot. The Slotland one goes regularly between around $70,000 and $150,000. I have not seen it outside this range.
     
  22. Nov 2, 2009
  23. RobWin

    RobWin closed account

    Occupation:
    Who knows?
    Location:
    A Vault!
    I've never managed to make a cashout at Slotland, how are they about paying out cashouts..fast, slow?
    ____
    ____
     
  24. Nov 3, 2009
  25. gambloggr

    gambloggr Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Account Manager
    Location:
    Canada
    I apologize for any misleading descriptions of Slotland games in their news releases.

    I apologize for any misleading descriptions of Slotland games in their news releases. Since I work for Lyceum Media and have written and distributed all of Slotlands news releases since 2005, this is my mistake so Im apologizing personally and on behalf of Lyceum Media and Slotland.

    Clearly, we have used the term video poker too loosely. I took the term to mean any video game where players receive 5 cards to build a poker hand. I understand now that a true video poker game deals cards from a deck and that randomly generated numbers may call for different playing strategies. Cards dealt by spinning slot machine reels arent considered true video poker by many and describing them as such may mislead players.

    As you have noted, Slotland very clearly describes their Jacks or Better game as a video poker slot machine game and poker slots game on the game description/pay table page.

    As has also been noted in this thread, Slotland is well-known for exemplary customer service and has many loyal players that have been with them many of their 11 years online. It is not Slotlands intention to mislead.

    Had either I or the current Marketing Director at Slotland been around in 2004 when this issue arose previously and was resolved we would both have been more sensitive to our regrettable and erroneous use of the term video poker.

    Please accept my personal apology for this misunderstanding and dont hold it against one of the most reputable and trustworthy operators in the online casino business.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2009
    2 people like this.
  26. Nov 6, 2009
  27. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I made one, and there were no problems. It was paid pretty fast back to my Neteller. You just have to remember that this ONLY happens on Tuesday, so the pending period can be anything up to 6 days (for a request on a Wednesday).

    The argument regarding Video Poker or Video Slot is down to the mechanism used to determine hands. In Slotland's case, the Royal Flush is "blocked" unless you have, on that game, won the progressive jackpot. This means that the RF will NOT occur "naturally" during play, around 1 in 40,000 hands played, but will occur LESS frequently due to it being tied to the central progressive. The "spacejacks" game is similar. Three hands are dealt to the player, and three Blackjacks wins the progressive. This again is not "natual dealt", because three Blackjacks would occur too frequently to allow a meaningful progressive pool to build up.
    If you are determined to have won the progressive at Slotland on any game, the game will probably just give it to you whatever you do. I have never won the progressive, so have not seen the exact behaviour of it's allocation. The wide variety of the games leads me to believe they use "weighted" reels on their slot games, so as to equalise the chances of winning the central progressive whatever game is played.
     

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