Is RTG fixed, rigged, whatever?

[RobWin]

So let me ask a silly question now....

Does everyone still believe that RTG Casino Software is Truly Random and the casino operators cannot tweak with it ??

How many more stories are out there like Laurie's that the folks are too embarrassed to admit...

If they have the balls to extort money from a big depositor like Laurie I really don't think that anyone could convince me that the operators cannot also tweak with the software too since there is obviously, absolutely no oversight whatsoever from RTG themselves !!

 

[aka23]

So let me ask a silly question now....

Does everyone still believe that RTG Casino Software is Truly Random and the casino operators cannot tweak with it ??

How many more stories are out there like Laurie's that the folks are too embarrassed to admit...[/B]

Operators can adjust the payouts of RTG games, often choosing from one of 3 pre-set levels. However, this has little to do with whether RTG is random or not. I also do not consider Palace of Chance extorting players evidence of non-random software. Instead it only shows that RTG is licensing their software to some rogue operations, likely anyone who pays the fees.

 

[Rusty]

Operators can adjust the payouts of RTG games, often choosing from one of 3 pre-set levels. However, this has little to do with whether RTG is random or not. I also do not consider Palace of Chance extorting players evidence of non-random software. Instead it only shows that RTG is licensing their software to some rogue operations, likely anyone who pays the fees.

I agree that RTG selling their software to operators who they know rip the players off does not in itself prove the slots are not random but it does prove they are quite happy to let the players be ripped off with their software.

As for this mythical Three set payouts, where does this information come from?

RTG is the answer, so we need to be willing to believe that a software provider that assumes no responsibility for its product and is in business with known crooks, a software provider that turns its back on scammed players, a software provider that incorporates into the software a means of altering payouts is in fact imposing restrictions on Casinos as to what levels of payout they can set and these can be no lower than 93%.

The question as to how random the slots are is moot if we believe the payouts can be altered by the Casinos.
Given all the evidence there is only one logical conclusion IMO.

Consider this thread that details a RTG Casino that cheats its customers out of their money.An RTG Casino that uses bribes and extortion as part of its business plan and what is the reaction of the software provider?
Where are the RTG representatives telling us how much they are shocked and dismayed by this?
Why are they not telling us they are no longer in business with POC and all other rogue RTG ?
Why is there no one here apologising profusely and explaining what they are going to do to ensure this never happens again?

So anyone who wants to believe RTG games are fair and post that belief here should have a good answer to all the above questions first.

Aka I am not saying you are promoting this idea I am just using your post, which I essentially agree with, as a lead in.

 

[winbig]

And who's to say that these RTG rogues don't have programmers working for them to reverse engineer the software to exploit it to their advantage?

 

[RobWin]

Operators can adjust the payouts of RTG games, often choosing from one of 3 pre-set levels. However, this has little to do with whether RTG is random or not. I also do not consider Palace of Chance extorting players evidence of non-random software. Instead it only shows that RTG is licensing their software to some rogue operations, likely anyone who pays the fees.

See Winbig's and Rustys posts above, my sentiments are the same...

 

[babs7262]

Maybe the ONLY true and honest way to find out how RTG's work is to buy one. Its a shame, I bet if we put all the money together that this whole group has gambled, we could of bought, find out the truth, made a profit and sell it by now

 

[Rusty]

Maybe the ONLY true and honest way to find out how RTG's work is to buy one. Its a shame, I bet if we put all the money together that this whole group has gambled, we could of bought, find out the truth, made a profit and sell it by now

Made a profit using RTG, perish the thought!
Where are your standards Babs

A great idea would be for a Casino owned by a players syndicate though.

I would happily design the slots, I already have some 5 reel completed.

We would need a good graphics artist a database and networking expert a good web designer etc but it is certainly achievable.
The hard part is finding enough people with the proper qualifications and will.

The logistics are difficult but could be overcome.
Spread the word and who knows

 

[aka23]

As for this mythical Three set payouts, where does this information come from?

It's based on RTG marketing documentation as well as posts from RTG operators on this site. I list specific numbers on my site. For slots, I believe it is a choice of 95%, 97.5% and a lower one (probably 92.5%). There are other games without set payout option and instead a choice of rule differences. For example, in blackjack RTG operators can choose any # of decks from 1 to 255 and can make those changes on the fly. However, a reputable casino probably wouldn't change the game rules without first informing the players.

Consider this thread that details a RTG Casino that cheats its customers out of their money.An RTG Casino that uses bribes and extortion as part of its business plan and what is the reaction of the software provider?
Where are the RTG representatives telling us how much they are shocked and dismayed by this?
Why are they not telling us they are no longer in business with POC and all other rogue RTG ?
Why is there no one here apologising profusely and explaining what they are going to do to ensure this never happens again?

So anyone who wants to believe RTG games are fair and post that belief here should have a good answer to all the above questions first.

RTG seems to have a hands off approach and let casino operators do whatever they want once they've bought the software. Most of us probably think this is a poor business decision, but making a poor business decision about software licensing doesn't mean their software is rigged. There are also reputable casinos that use RTG like Bodog, Club World, and iNetBet. Would these reputable groups choose to use the SW, if they knew it was rigged?

 

[Rusty]

It's based on RTG marketing documentation as well as posts from RTG operators on this site. I list specific numbers on my site. For slots, I believe it is a choice of 95%, 97.5% and a lower one (probably 92.5%). There are other games without set payout option and instead a choice of rule differences. For example, in blackjack RTG operators can choose any # of decks from 1 to 255 and can make those changes on the fly. However, a reputable casino probably wouldn't change the game rules without first informing the players.



RTG seems to have a hands off approach and let casino operators do whatever they want once they've bought the software. Most of us probably think this is a poor business decision, but making a poor business decision about software licensing doesn't mean their software is rigged. There are also reputable casinos that use RTG like Bodog, Club World, and iNetBet. Would these reputable groups choose to use the SW, if they knew it was rigged?

I don't think our opinions are that far apart.
The question for me is why did these Casinos choose RTG?

Also, as I have said the question of whether the software is "rigged" or manipulated is moot if the Casinos can alter the payouts.
You choose to trust a source with a very poor track records as far as players are concerned, I choose not to, that is where we differ.

 

[RobWin]

Thanks Bryan for setting up this thread separate from the POC thread, I should have done that originally instead of posting this first thread post in there...

 

[RobWin]

It's based on RTG marketing documentation as well as posts from RTG operators on this site. I list specific numbers on my site. For slots, I believe it is a choice of 95%, 97.5% and a lower one (probably 92.5%). There are other games without set payout option and instead a choice of rule differences. For example, in blackjack RTG operators can choose any # of decks from 1 to 255 and can make those changes on the fly. However, a reputable casino probably wouldn't change the game rules without first informing the players.



RTG seems to have a hands off approach and let casino operators do whatever they want once they've bought the software. Most of us probably think this is a poor business decision, but making a poor business decision about software licensing doesn't mean their software is rigged. There are also reputable casinos that use RTG like Bodog, Club World, and iNetBet. Would these reputable groups choose to use the SW, if they knew it was rigged?

Yea, that's my point exactly and the one that scares the hell out of me...but like an idiot I still play on the RTG platform...

 

[The Dude]

Operators can adjust the payouts of RTG games, often choosing from one of 3 pre-set levels. However, this has little to do with whether RTG is random or not. I also do not consider Palace of Chance extorting players evidence of non-random software. Instead it only shows that RTG is licensing their software to some rogue operations, likely anyone who pays the fees.

That's pretty much it. The software has been scrutinized for years by many third parties, and there hasn't been a case yet of a truly rigged experience.

It's the operators who fail - not the software.

 

[Rusty]

I don't know who these Third parties are or what their tests involve or by what criteria they judge whether software is rigged or not so I can not comment on that specific point but there is evidence of manipulation via weighting if you are prepared to look for it.

I have made this point over and over that just because something may have a random outcome it does not mean that it has the proper relative probability of outcome.

That is to say you can have a random outcome of any Ten numbers from 1 to 10 but equally you can make any of those Ten numbers more likely to be the outcome or continually alter the likelihood of outcome while still maintaining random results.

This means the problem is that dynamic weighting is very difficult to prove and if the system is sophisticated enough I would say impossible but fortunately RTG software is not that sophisticated.

I have been luckier at RTG Casinos than I have any right to have been but only when I have first joined after that I have been unluckier than I have any right to be.

That means experiencing over expected returns on just about every slot for Tens of hours, many thousands of spins followed by well below expected returns on every slot for Tens of Hours.

It means experiencing features and retriggers frequently and multiple retriggers often, followed by infrequent features and no retriggers at all over long periods.

It means not seeing the first Wild symbol or scatter symbol appear anything like a normal amount, maybe 10% of average over long periods.

When I experience these things over and over at every RTG Casino I have to believe the evidence is that payouts can and are changed and this is done through weighting, I don't need a Third party I have my own eyes, statistics and experiences.

I will not use the term rigged because this implies the outcome is in no way random but the term manipulated certainly fits the bill.

It is the operators that fail but the software provider is responsible to who they provide the software to, in that respect it is also the software that fails whether you agree it can be manipulated or not.

If you give a thug a gun and they go off and use it to Rob someone and you then take no responsibility for your actions then I am going to have a pretty low opinion of you and question your integrity.

 

[RobWin]

I don't know who these Third parties are or what their tests involve or by what criteria they judge whether software is rigged or not so I can not comment on that specific point but there is evidence of manipulation via weighting if you are prepared to look for it.

I have made this point over and over that just because something may have a random outcome it does not mean that it has the proper relative probability of outcome.

That is to say you can have a random outcome of any Ten numbers from 1 to 10 but equally you can make any of those Ten numbers more likely to be the outcome or continually alter the likelihood of outcome while still maintaining random results.

This means the problem is that dynamic weighting is very difficult to prove and if the system is sophisticated enough I would say impossible but fortunately RTG software is not that sophisticated.

I have been luckier at RTG Casinos than I have any right to have been but only when I have first joined after that I have been unluckier than I have any right to be.

That means experiencing over expected returns on just about every slot for Tens of hours, many thousands of spins followed by well below expected returns on every slot for Tens of Hours.

It means experiencing features and retriggers frequently and multiple retriggers often, followed by infrequent features and no retriggers at all over long periods.

It means not seeing the first Wild symbol or scatter symbol appear anything like a normal amount, maybe 10% of average over long periods.

When I experience these things over and over at every RTG Casino I have to believe the evidence is that payouts can and are changed and this is done through weighting, I don't need a Third party I have my own eyes, statistics and experiences.

I will not use the term rigged because this implies the outcome is in no way random but the term manipulated certainly fits the bill.

Yep...

It is the operators that fail but the software provider is responsible to who they provide the software to, in that respect it is also the software that fails whether you agree it can be manipulated or not.

I agree, there is no other way to look at it...where is the oversight, has there EVER been a rep from RTG (and I don't mean one that worked or works for a casino) come on here and dispute any of our claims and thoughts, I can't ever remember one as long as I have been on here...

If you give a thug a gun and they go off and use it to Rob someone and you then take no responsibility for your actions then I am going to have a pretty low opinion of you and question your integrity.

Rusty, did you have to capitalize Rob...

 

[Rusty]

Rusty, did you have to capitalize Rob...



I did didn't I.
I would say freudian slip but I know you're a top man :notworthy

I just tried the free chip at One of the new Rivals and had a good run, I am pretty sure I could of cashed out after making the WR.
The trouble is that the software always behaves the same way and I could never play at Rival seriously because I know after every win streak you are going to go long periods of total nothing.
It is common to play a slot and go well over 100 spins without a win which is crazy and again it is obvious weighting exists here also but as far as I know all Rival Casinos are responsible and payout and as far as I know maintain payout percentage which makes it a lot more palatable.

 

[aka23]

I agree, there is no other way to look at it...where is the oversight, has there EVER been a rep from RTG (and I don't mean one that worked or works for a casino) come on here and dispute any of our claims and thoughts, I can't ever remember one as long as I have been on here...

The reps that post on this forum are generally affiliated with casinos, as one would expect. However, there have been a couple RTG programmers who weren't connected to casinos. For example, in the thread at https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/inetbet-latest.18907/ a former RTG programmer disputes similar claims.

 

[babs7262]

LOL Rusty ,

I just love you sometimes!!I mean that in the nicest way. We are so predictable and funny sometimes. Your on this thread like most of us closing some accounts and talking about SW being rigged and in the same breath (so to speak) you have a lil side note...btw "I tried free chip at the new rival..."

Its just so funny. If we were talking about restaurants , I wonder how many times we would go back to a place that made us sick (including me!)

 

[Rusty]

LOL Rusty ,

I just love you sometimes!!I mean that in the nicest way. We are so predictable and funny sometimes. Your on this thread like most of us closing some accounts and talking about SW being rigged and in the same breath (so to speak) you have a lil side note...btw "I tried free chip at the new rival..."

Its just so funny. If we were talking about restaurants , I wonder how many times we would go back to a place that made us sick (including me!)

If it was free?
I am a skinflint so probably plenty.

By the way weighted does not mean the game is rigged or payouts are not as advertised.
Think of it like an automated throttle on a car, if you are speeding it will lift off the Gas and slow you down, if you are going too slow then it will put the pedal to the metal=feature bonanza
Just don't expect not to crash and burn after every speed rush
ps
I am not stating anything that is not obvious or observable by everyone.
For example I went 140 spins with one winning spin (X3bet)
Everyone else must experience these streaks.
That is not normal variance even for slots like Rivals which put a higher percentage return into the bonus rounds than other software and it is not an isolated incident, it is quite common.
I am not saying it is rigged, I won on a free chip for heavens sake!
Try to understand what I am saying.

 

[babs7262]

If it was free?
I am a skinflint so probably plenty.

By the way weighted does not mean the game is rigged or payouts are not as advertised.
Think of it like an automated throttle on a car, if you are speeding it will lift off the Gas and slow you down, if you are going too slow then it will put the pedal to the metal=feature bonanza
Just don't expect not to crash and burn after every speed rush
ps
I am not stating anything that is not obvious or observable by everyone.
For example I went 140 spins with one winning spin (X3bet)
Everyone else must experience these streaks.
That is not normal variance even for slots like Rivals which put a higher percentage return into the bonus rounds than other software and it is not an isolated incident, it is quite common.
I am not saying it is rigged, I won on a free chip for heavens sake!
Try to understand what I am saying.

I do because I do the same thing, a free chip is a free chip right? I hope you didnt take that as an insult, it was just cute i like you

 

[Rusty]

I do because I do the same thing, a free chip is a free chip right? I hope you didnt take that as an insult, it was just cute i like you

There is no accounting for taste but I like to be liked and love to be loved, so it is a wonder I can be so uncompromising.
I like you too

 

[tim5ny]

The nature of the game........the player being at a disadvantage from the start, but he forgets that. He thinks he's going into a fair game. It's 50/50!..right? Far from it.

Enjoy the high priced "Entertainment"!

 

[EasyRhino]

I don't see the point in complaining that a slot machine is high variance. That's what it's supposed to be.

The only shifty thing would be if a casino changed a slot payout (or table game rules) WHILE YOU WERE PLAYING IT. However, in the case of a slot, you generally don't know what the payout percentage is, so it probably wouldn't be noticeable. If RTG's percentages are between 92.5 and 97.5, those are all very reasonable compared to brick and mortar casinos.

 

[Rusty]

I don't see the point in complaining that a slot machine is high variance. That's what it's supposed to be.

The only shifty thing would be if a casino changed a slot payout (or table game rules) WHILE YOU WERE PLAYING IT. However, in the case of a slot, you generally don't know what the payout percentage is, so it probably wouldn't be noticeable. If RTG's percentages are between 92.5 and 97.5, those are all very reasonable compared to brick and mortar casinos.

You don't mean "if" you mean if

 

[RobWin]

I don't see the point in complaining that a slot machine is high variance. That's what it's supposed to be.

The only shifty thing would be if a casino changed a slot payout (or table game rules) WHILE YOU WERE PLAYING IT. However, in the case of a slot, you generally don't know what the payout percentage is, so it probably wouldn't be noticeable. If RTG's percentages are between 92.5 and 97.5, those are all very reasonable compared to brick and mortar casinos.

Oh man, it has most definitely been noticeable at the majority of the RTG Casinos that I have played at this year without a flicker of a doubt !!

 

[tombee]

Wanted to post a new topic, but I think my question suits here well..?

Been playing BJ at Bodog (using RTG software) and EVERY time I play the bank gets an very high amount of Black Jacks. High compared to me as a player AND to other casino's. Anyone has got a same experience?

Also I had a fairly good game the first several hours I played, despite of the many BJ's from the dealer. But after those hours, the next hours (even more) were absolutely terrible . Losing way more hands then you would expect in a normal game. Off course this could be bad luck, but still very strange to see the sudden change in "luck" as a player.

 

[Alexishot69]

bodog

Wanted to post a new topic, but I think my question suits here well..?

Been playing BJ at Bodog (using RTG software) and EVERY time I play the bank gets an very high amount of Black Jacks. High compared to me as a player AND to other casino's. Anyone has got a same experience?

Also I had a fairly good game the first several hours I played, despite of the many BJ's from the dealer. But after those hours, the next hours (even more) were absolutely terrible . Losing way more hands then you would expect in a normal game. Off course this could be bad luck, but still very strange to see the sudden change in "luck" as a player.

Well i think if you take a closer look round the forum you will see RTG aint the most popular software and on top of that in the past weeks/months bodog have had a lot of processing problems so maybe they thought lets just stop any winnings and we will have no need for a processor

On a different note maybe you need to try another site theres loads of accredited sites here and ill pop up and say 32red as a starting point....alex

 

[tombee]

Thanks I have read some of the topics on RTG.. especially about the slots. Interesting... Maybe I'll try 32red, knew it existed but never took the time to play there.

Edit: Played at 32red but lost everything before I could say "black jack" (or anything else). So it's probably bad karma or something. Getting sooo tired of always losing

 

[Kenny Lingus]

RTG more crooked than Bill Clinton's..... politics (IMO)

I played for a good year and a half on RTG software before I wised up. Lost over $5k (a lot for a low roller like me), mostly at Bodog & Club World. Lost most of it at 40 cents a spin, although did a fair share at 20 cents and a $1.00.

One of the most significant details of my RTG exerience is that about 90% of my play was on one game, Achilles. Loved the game, great concept for a slot, but the payout over time was horrible.

How horrible? Well, out of all my deposits, I only managed to cash out once. That was from Inet, just a little before I swore off RTG; it was for $500, on a free chip, coincidentally, after I had lost $400-$500 to Inet over a couple week's span.

My conclusion: RTG sucks ass! I swore off RTG, and haven't went back!!! But this is not all to the story...

About two weeks ago, this is part of an e-mail that showed up in my hotmail account:

>Get $100 FREE!

>Dear Kenny Lingus

>This is Christopher DiAngelo with Prism Casino. I am contacting you today >because I noticed that you haven?t been in the casino for awhile. I would >love to have you back, and would like to offer you $100 FREE as a nice >incentive to come back in today!

>All you have to do is redeem coupon code 100WBB3HDB in the casino >cashier and you will automatically be credited with $100 FREE!

>Forgot your Prism Username?
>Your Account Name is: XXXXX

>Forgot your Password?
>Contact Us to get your casino password if you have forgotten it.

>A lot has changed since you were last in Prism Casino. We now have NEW >GAMES, NEW STAFF, and a BRAND NEW PAYOUT TEAM! So, no matter what >you might need, Prism Casino is prepared to make your gaming experience >BETTER THAN EVER BEFORE....

As it was, I played at Prism casino in late 2005, depositing about $150. Having not played RTG in almost 2 years, I thought WTH, downloaded and redeemed the coupon.

WELL YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BELEIVE THIS, BUT....

Old Attachment (Invalid)

I won, I won! Over $26K!!! Yes!!!!! All from $100!

And all of it was won on Achilles! Guess it does actually payout!
Hit the Random Jackpot 3 times, too! Woo-hoo!!!!!!!

Oh wait.....$100 max cashout on the free chip, it says? Can you believe my luck?!

What are the odds?

The odds are fraudulent, I say. Not just with Prism and the like, but with RTG in general. It is my opinion, take it for what it is worth, but RTG software can be manipulated far beyond what most of you think is possible.

Don't believe it? Well, as P. T. Barnum said, "There's a sucker born every minute".

RTG software and their affiliated casinos are counting on that.

 

[RobWin]

Wanted to post a new topic, but I think my question suits here well..?

Been playing BJ at Bodog (using RTG software) and EVERY time I play the bank gets an very high amount of Black Jacks. High compared to me as a player AND to other casino's. Anyone has got a same experience?

Also I had a fairly good game the first several hours I played, despite of the many BJ's from the dealer. But after those hours, the next hours (even more) were absolutely terrible . Losing way more hands then you would expect in a normal game. Off course this could be bad luck, but still very strange to see the sudden change in "luck" as a player.

Here is a thread you might be interested in reading tombee...

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/rtg-poll.26650/

 

[babs7262]

Thats when I closed my account out kenny. Inet gave me a manager bonus that I never asked for. It was for $10. I got it up to over $600 for the first time in my life at Inet. (never cashed out more than $200 ish). Wouldnt you know...10times cashout max. And on top of it, they took out the rest so I couldnt earn comp points.

I dont care how many screenshots Im shown, Ill never play RTG again. Im happy for the ones that do win, but Im not one of them so I find it pointless.
Someone has to lose in order for others to win so we all have our places. Its a shame because I must admit, I loved their games. I miss my Bee! ohwell

 

[RobWin]

Thats when I closed my account out kenny. Inet gave me a manager bonus that I never asked for. It was for $10. I got it up to over $600 for the first time in my life at Inet. (never cashed out more than $200 ish). Wouldnt you know...10times cashout max. And on top of it, they took out the rest so I couldnt earn comp points.

I dont care how many screenshots Im shown, Ill never play RTG again. Im happy for the ones that do win, but Im not one of them so I find it pointless.
Someone has to lose in order for others to win so we all have our places. Its a shame because I must admit, I loved their games. I miss my Bee! ohwell

Babs, you should have played that $600 back down to $110 and then done your cashin, that way you could have still earned the comps first...

 

[silcnlayc]

Someone has to lose in order for others to win so we all have our places

Babs7262? You didn't lose anything.....You were on a "free chip". Unless I am wrong, you invested nothing there...yes?

Inet gave me a manager bonus that I never asked for. It was for $10.

And as long as you have been playing, you should know most free chips have a limit for cashout (chiding you)...cause then in reality that round of play you would truly have been ahead since you invested no money...

 

[kakata]

My answer to the OP question is


YES



all of em no exeptions......sorry but this is the truth....ALL OF EM.
Its not cause I win or lose.....I know Ive to lose , still, they could do it with a little more elegance....not theyr style....actually not at all....no style on theyr part.
Its just I steal more today and Ill be a litlle just a little nicer tomorow....that's all.
well I cant use better english that I can but I know that you guys are accostumed to mine and I know you do undearsteand what I mean....at leats I hope so

 

[RobWin]

My answer to the OP question is


YES



all of em no exeptions......sorry but this is the truth....ALL OF EM.
Its not cause I win or lose.....I know Ive to lose , still, they could do it with a little more elegance....not theyr style....actually not at all....no style on theyr part.
Its just I steal more today and Ill be a litlle just a little nicer tomorow....that's all.
well I cant use better english that I can but I know that you guys are accostumed to mine and I know you do undearsteand what I mean....at leats I hope so

Does everyone still believe that RTG Casino Software is Truly Random and the casino operators cannot tweak with it ??

That was my original question Kakata...don't you of all people mean to say NO ??

 

[kakata]

Well the original question for me was....are all the RTG fixed ,...rigged????
Thats the question I answered....with a big YES.
Love you my friend.
kakata

 

[RobWin]

Well the original question for me was....are all the RTG fixed ,...rigged????
Thats the question I answered....with a big YES.
Love you my friend.
kakata

OK,, got you my friend...:notworthy

 

[footdr]

FOR THE MOST PART........

YES not really Random but I don't think any software is

 

[EasyRhino]

Does everyone still believe that RTG Casino Software is Truly Random and the casino operators cannot tweak with it ??

Me!

I mainly play the tables, so you've got fixed, known rules. Everything still seems to proceed according to (losing) expectations at RTGs I've played, even Virtual Group, over lots and lots of hands.

The only problem with slots is that you don't know what the payout is set to. But in a way it doesn't matter, because the variance of the slots is so high it wouldn't be noticeable over one or even several sessions.

 

[Luigi810]

RTG casinos need to be SHUT down, I don't understand how people still play at RTG casinos after reading all the threads on here, they don't pay when you win, when you chat with them they do everything in their power to get your deposit through, they'll give you a million free chips and bonuses when you ask for them because people think it's free money added on to theirs, they don't understand the playthroughs or the max. cashouts and the casinos know that..

And when you try to cash out, GOOD LUCK chatting with them, they rush you off, your documents are never good enough, but the bottom line is, you NEVER get your money, take it from a pro, DO NOT play at RTG casinos..

 

[babs7262]

Babs7262? You didn't lose anything.....You were on a "free chip". Unless I am wrong, you invested nothing there...yes?

I meant in general, not this time because it was a free chip

And as long as you have been playing, you should know most free chips have a limit for cashout (chiding you)...cause then in reality that round of play you would truly have been ahead since you invested no money...

Actually, no sil, I dont use free bonus chips, period. So when I got this chip I assumed a manager bonus meant "no strings attached" Im the biggest advocate of no free chips in here lol. The ONLY exception I make is one non rtg casino that has 5times WR , which to me is no big deal. I knew bonus chips had WR but honestly didnt know at the time that manager bonus was the same thing. Since then, I only use one RTG and got myself taken off any bonus/freechip list

 

[mercy]

DO NOT play at RTG casinos..

I second that

 

[wayram]

As i have posted before, they are all the bloody same , they all have the turn down switch..not just RTG

 

[lucky21]

I agree

I agree that all software providers have some manipulation avaliable above the RNG, I have seen so many wierd, at times shocking plays in blackjack from these games that if seen in a bricks and morter casino, would have the BJ tables empty, mt sessions at one casino constantly fall within the 1% of happening regarding losses.

Am I that unlucky? I dont think so.

The thing is if left to there own devices, greed will see us push all boundries that we can , no one is really keeping there eye on these casino's and they are set up in "casino friendly" countries.

I think the best we could do is not to use casino's for a while, let em sweat a bit, let them have to bid for your dollar as they did early in the industry and be reminded that we are the customer perhaps then the not so good ones will die off , excuse the oxy moron of good casino.

That or instead of Gambling we use our computers and send some denial of service attacks at the obviously crooked ones

 

[tim5ny]

Babs, you should have played that $600 back down to $110 and then done your cashin, that way you could have still earned the comps first...

Unless RTG is different, I don't think you earn comp points while playing on a no deposit gift.

 

[babs7262]

I should of but didnt know at the time. If I had known, I would of played out everything but the $100 but again, I didnt know they would immediatly take the rest of the money out. Atleast I dont have to worry about that anymore since Im on the non comp list now