Hey

[trancemonkey]

Trance, i don't think at say £1 stake, a guarenteed bonus of £20 would affect the base game THAT much. what IS bad, about current slots.. for example Bonanza...
is that i've done 3000 spins, for a bonus on £0.60p stake, that paid as below....

This sort of 'Bonus' - isn't really a bonus at all.. just an insult.
View attachment 85972

And also, the slot has no idea you've had 3000 spins or 3 spins before you get the bonus...
Volatile bonuses require volatility... it's simple maths.

 

[goatwack]

I don't believe a guaranteed bonus is a good idea. Been playing 'Cool Buck' by MG recently, which triggered the bonus after 30 symbols had been collected (or if three scatters triggered it prior).

Problem with that is that it felt like a compromise had been made somewhere. The base game was pretty horrid, and subsequent bonuses never felt as though they had any potential, despite the abundance of stacked wilds

As for Bonanza, it is- despite everything leveled at it- the almost perfect slot template. Adding a bonus-guarantee would ruin it. It has a humdrum base game but can produce great hits. We need to abandon this bonus round player entitlement ASAP

 

[EnglishGuy]

You may think that, and i understand why... but what it leads to is either a) a reduction in the volatility of the bonus, b) less frequent bonuses or c) more RTP in the bonus, which reduces the RTP in the base game.

Not entirely true.. eg: you can design a slot with a variance of 1x - 6000x max payout. or you can design a slot with a bonus guarentee of 20x - 2000x... where the total payout of both versions = exactly the same.
both versions could have a bonus frequency of exactly the same. which is how Montezuma works i'm sure on a 10x guarentee. which is what you suggest as point 1 above i guess?

I'm saying > I < would prefer it.

 

[trancemonkey]

Not entirely true.. eg: you can design a slot with a variance of 1x - 6000x max payout. or you can design a slot with a bonus guarentee of 20x - 2000x... where the total payout of both versions = exactly the same.
both versions could have a bonus frequency of exactly the same. which is how Montezuma works i'm sure on a 10x guarentee. which is what you suggest as point 1 above i guess?

I'm saying > I < would prefer it.

Well, it is entirely true... as I didn't say it can't be done. Of course you can do what you are saying - but it will of course have an effect on something and in your case it would be volatility.

But if course wins over 250x are extremely rare anyway so having a max of 2000 or 6000 makes very little difference. The amount of RTP you would reasonable assign to wins of that kind of value is tiny...

And anyway there are much better ways of guaranteeing you don't get shit wins than having a bonus guarantee ..

If you play any of my land based games in casinos, most of them you will rarely get a win of <10x due to some clever (and fair and legal) maths in the free games

 

[trancemonkey]

Not entirely true.. eg: you can design a slot with a variance of 1x - 6000x max payout. or you can design a slot with a bonus guarentee of 20x - 2000x... where the total payout of both versions = exactly the same.
both versions could have a bonus frequency of exactly the same. which is how Montezuma works i'm sure on a 10x guarentee. which is what you suggest as point 1 above i guess?

I'm saying > I < would prefer it.

Anyway as a producer I would never consider a bonus guarantee of 20x unless the feature was pretty rare, the mechanic was such that low bonus wins were too frequent and there was no other way mathematically (and legally) of avoiding low wins from the free games. It just makes no sense.

I would even go so far as to say I think Rhino would be better without the Bonus Guarantee, but I might be in the minority there

 

[SlotGrinder]

I don't think basegame needs massive potential but I hate basegames like 300 shields where you know you cant win anything unless you hit the bonus
I think it would be good if a slot has a normal mode where rtp is fairly low but you can still get a good feature . But sometimes you randomly enter different enhanced modes where the basegame has more potential and if you hit the feature there then it also has more potential as well as being a different type of feature for variety's sake
So the "normal" basegame will pay out at low rtp and then the enhanced modes ( these can be different themes and graphics etc) will pay out much better and with much higher potential
I'm thinking a cross between seasons , battlestar galactica and trex mode on jurassic park but way better obv

 

[Supababe]

trancemonkey,did you ever play SkyVegas multiplayer games (pre UKGA License)? In particular the gold ticket one where you collected numbers until someone triggered the bonus wheel (containing multipliers)....Cant remember the name of it, that happens when you get old....
It was very successful and hugely popular but vanished along with the other multiplayer (multi cops and robbers etc)...
Just a different angle and starting point for ideas perhaps.

Also hopelessly addicted to 'tipping point slot' exclusively at skyvegas. Obviously, it would need a clever clone slot design.....

 

[trancemonkey]

Oh dear God...Tipping Point? What an utter abomination of a game! Haha... I use that in a "How not to design slots" talk I do. Each to their own I guess...

 

[Supababe]

Go on then . Share your notes from your talk as to why it is an abomination.... I’m curious lol.

Other than the fact that it is almost impossible to select more than one counter during the jackpot game, I can’t really think of any reason why you might think it so bad...


It has
- a bonus feature for free spins
- a ‘build up bonus’ for tipping point machine (which hooks players into playing longer/re-depositing/revisiting)
- lots of playability for your money (although some addicts might find it ‘slow’ if trying to play for profit)
- excitement/ edge of your seat moments
- player choices throughout both free spins and jackpot game
- fair payouts...I’ve had some terrible rounds and some excellent mystery win games.
- auto play function

 

[DreamRJ]

Well I am late to this thread.

What I wish for in a new slot would be amazing graphics. And features that pay at least 100X bet. In other words no more features that pay less than 100X, So 100X is minimum you can win from a feature but then you could win far more obviously. And yeah I also concur with others the slot should be similar reel set to Bonanza and DHV with the 6 reels and mega ways too.

 

[goatwack]

It's simple really- it needs the graphical flair of Warlords, 243-ways gameplay of say Immortal Romance (with the audio to boot) that somehow factors in the 'Megaways' potential of Bonanza!

should be easy- peasy

 

[trancemonkey]

Well I am late to this thread.

What I wish for in a new slot would be amazing graphics. And features that pay at least 100X bet. In other words no more features that pay less than 100X, So 100X is minimum you can win from a feature but then you could win far more obviously. And yeah I also concur with others the slot should be similar reel set to Bonanza and DHV with the 6 reels and mega ways too.

If you’re bonus is paying at least 100x, then I assume you’re happy with it only happening every 800 Spins (at least)...

For example, if you had the bonus every 400 Games (assuming an average of 150x), that would account for 37.5% of the RTP leaving only 58.5% for the base game (I.e the other 399 Games). That would be an exceptionally dry base game...

 

[trancemonkey]

It's simple really- it needs the graphical flair of Warlords, 243-ways gameplay of say Immortal Romance (with the audio to boot) that somehow factors in the 'Megaways' potential of Bonanza!

should be easy- peasy

You like the way Warlords looks? Most people don’t like sci-fi style games so I would tend to avoid themes like that - especially for our first game

 

[goatwack]

You like the way Warlords looks? Most people don’t like sci-fi style games so I would tend to avoid themes like that - especially for our first game

A lot of people love that Pixel art/ Retro style that is reminiscent of older videogames...much like Flamebusters for example. That would be a cool look whilst retaining some charm as well

 

[interlog]

A lot of people love that Pixel art/ Retro style that is reminiscent of older videogames...much like Flamebusters for example. That would be a cool look whilst retaining some charm as well

 

[goatwack]

That's exactly what I was talking about!

 

[trancemonkey]

A lot of people love that Pixel art/ Retro style that is reminiscent of older videogames...much like Flamebusters for example. That would be a cool look whilst retaining some charm as well

That's true - but also, a lot of people hate it. Flamebusters hasn't done anywhere near as well as I would have expected it to, and my contacts in the online casinos all agree that the style of it was probably the reason for that... 8-bit graphics and sounds are very "Marmite"

 

[interlog]

That's true - but also, a lot of people hate it. Flamebusters hasn't done anywhere near as well as I would have expected it to, and my contacts in the online casinos all agree that the style of it was probably the reason for that... 8-bit graphics and sounds are very "Marmite"

Or maybe because the bonus round does you over more often than not!!!!

 

[trancemonkey]

Or maybe because the bonus round does you over more often than not!!!!

Yeah, i think the bonus round is TOO volatile... they ruined it for most people to give stupidly big wins, whereas actually they could have flattened that volatility a bit and still made it a great game...

I might have a go at doing that one day...

 

[slotmaster]

Quite a few beat me to it in regards to ideas, Stacked wilds, Something like Immortal Romance and a megaway's but with better maths and better chance of hitting a big big win but it won't scare away casino's, You know if I was applying for a job or something.

 

[slotmaster]

That's true - but also, a lot of people hate it. Flamebusters hasn't done anywhere near as well as I would have expected it to, and my contacts in the online casinos all agree that the style of it was probably the reason for that... 8-bit graphics and sounds are very "Marmite"

Ya I don't like Flamebusters.

 

[gerilege]

Maybe some twists on the left-to-right, right-to-left pays could be something new not on the market yet. I had this idea a while ago. It should not be a skill game, but there may be a random or player-originated input that decides whether an actual spin pays out right-to-left or left-to-right. Like stop the middle 1, 2 or 3 reels, and decide only after that whether it is r-t-l or l-t-r. If it is a player decision, then I felt the tricky part would be working out that it should not be skill-based. Maybe add wild reels, make it 6 reels, or free spins pay both directions, not sure, but maybe one or more of these could work.

Another idea is to combine the Wonka style slot with the Bonanza style. Like there would be more reels than what actually would play (i.e. 10 reels, but 5 will play for a given spin). First spin all the reels vertically, then move in the reel set that would actually play horizontally (either neighbouring reels or some other combination of reels).

 

[EnglishGuy]

I know one thing that a LOT of slot players hate... and thats the non-randomness of any picking.. Eg: scruffy duck.

I'm sure players would appreciate a genuine randomn pick.. and i can't see any reason why the RTP wouldn't be predictable.

 

[trancemonkey]

I know one thing that a LOT of slot players hate... and thats the non-randomness of any picking.. Eg: scruffy duck.

I'm sure players would appreciate a genuine randomn pick.. and i can't see any reason why the RTP wouldn't be predictable.

Non random picks are done when not all outcomes pay the same average...

If the pick is random then the average of all outcomes must be the same otherwise the Maths don’t work

TM

 

[goatwack]

Th

Non random picks are done when not all outcomes pay the same average...

If the pick is random then the average of all outcomes must be the same otherwise the Maths don’t work

TM

That would explain the never ending succession of duff bonus picks. I hate them with a passion, even more so knowing that it's completely averaged out. Takes me back to some doofus Hasselhoff slot I played years back, I'd always conspire to pick the lowest symbol. It made me livid