Germany Suffers..

[dunover]

The 3 stages of destruction of the European peoples and cultures:










RIP the Berlin Victims of this scum and best wishes the their families this Christmas.

May your revenge be brutal.

 

[Mouche12]

Yes, this will play into the hands of Merkelbach's right-wing critics who say these threats are the result of her open door policy for Syrian and other refugees.

The truck bore Polish licence plates and it is not yet known who exactly is behind this terrorist attack; it much resembles the horrific Nice attack by a Tunisian nutcase who had help from a couple of Albanians and more French-Tunisians with criminal records.

But why this link to the Syrian refugees? This right-wing fear mongering should stop here and now. It makes matters only worse by implying that [all] Syrian refugees are terrorists, that's plain ridiculous Make the distinction between desperate people who are forced to flee their country and criminals/terrorists who have this single-minded determination to destroy as much as they can and bring harm to society.

 

[mimi26]

Dont know why, I just thought this was a sort of 'anniversary' thread from the last time a truck was used as a deadly weapon, Its not been reported on sky news website at all!,

How awful, do we know if it is deliberate

 

[Dinahnana]

Yes, this will play into the hands of Merkelbach's right-wing critics who say these threats are the result of her open door policy for Syrian and other refugees.

The truck bore Polish licence plates and it is not yet known who exactly is behind this terrorist attack; it much resembles the horrific Nice attack by a Tunisian nutcase who had help from a couple of Albanians and more French-Tunisians with criminal records.

But why this link to the Syrian refugees? This right-wing fear mongering should stop here and now. It makes matters only worse by implying that [all] Syrian refugees are terrorists, that's plain ridiculous Make the distinction between desperate people who are forced to flee their country and criminals/terrorists who have this single-minded determination to destroy as much as they can and bring harm to society.

They are saying that Islamic State is taking the credit for it, also they took credit for the attack in Nice too. We also have no idea of the background of some of the Syrian refugees, they could be criminal who knows. When people travel without papers it's kinda hard to check. So the distinction can be hard to make and you cannot help Europeans becoming more suspicious and wary due to all the attacks that have taken place in the last few years in Europe.

 

[Dinahnana]

Dont know why, I just thought this was a sort of 'anniversary' thread from the last time a truck was used as a deadly weapon, Its not been reported on sky news website at all!,

How awful, do we know if it is deliberate

Yes it was deliberate. The owner of the truck think it was hijacked. One person was arrested and another person that was in the truck was killed. They also found another body near the scene so I am guessing that person must have been the original driver. I guess terrorists stick to what works and its very hard to stop these kinds of attacks since they are simple and easy to carry out. Scary stuff.

 

[lockinlove]

Its a good damn thing that Trump became president. He wont allow this garbage over here like Hilary was going to do.

I dont really know how the people of Germany feel overall, I mean ive read alot of comments where they are disgusted with her and the people are tired of being killed by these pieces of crap but if it was alot, whats germanys rule to get rid of her? I mean, to me it seems she letting these syrians do as they please to the germans by letting them just flood in

 

[Mouche12]

They are saying that Islamic State is taking the credit for it, also they took credit for the attack in Nice too. We also have no idea of the background of some of the Syrian refugees, they could be criminal who knows. When people travel without papers it's kinda hard to check. So the distinction can be hard to make and you cannot help Europeans becoming more suspicious and wary due to all the attacks that have taken place in the last few years in Europe.

There have been terrorist attacks before any influx of refugees, but there always have to be scapecoats, we simply cannot live without them, can we?

Consider this when you equate refugees with terrorists: It's exactly what the Islamic State wants.

The very same refugees entering Europe are often the very same civilians who face the indiscriminate violence and cruel injustice in lands controlled by the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria. Globally, studies have shown that Muslims tend to make up the largest proportion of terror victims, with countries such as Syria and Iraq registering the highest toll.

 

[Dinahnana]

There have been terrorist attacks before any influx of refugees, but there always have to be scapecoats, we simply cannot live without them, can we?

Consider this when you equate refugees with terrorists: It's exactly what the Islamic State wants.

The very same refugees entering Europe are often the very same civilians who face the indiscriminate violence and cruel injustice in lands controlled by the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria. Globally, studies have shown that Muslims tend to make up the largest proportion of terror victims, with countries such as Syria and Iraq registering the highest toll.

You have a right to your opinion Mouche and I have mine. I am far from stupid and do read the news and see whats going on in other countries. Fact is the vast majority of terror attacks in the last 16 years that have been committed by refuges or extremist Muslims. So not all of the refugees coming into Europe are victims some of them or terrorists and it is impossible to tell since many of them do not have papers. This is also want Islamic State wants and what they have planned. Plant terrorists among the refugees. I can't remember where I read this but it was in an intelligence report issued a couple of years ago.

 

[nachhaltig]

Its a good damn thing that Trump became president. He wont allow this garbage over here like Hilary was going to do.

I dont really know how the people of Germany feel overall, I mean ive read alot of comments where they are disgusted with her and the people are tired of being killed by these pieces of crap but if it was alot, whats germanys rule to get rid of her? I mean, to me it seems she letting these syrians do as they please to the germans by letting them just flood in

It's laughable to blame Merkel for this. If Terrorists want to hurt a Country, there is no way to hinder them. And thats a fact. There will never be a 100%-safe Scenario for anyone in any Country of the World. So please don't accuse Refugees for the Problems which arise from that bullshit system called capitalism.
With a policy, which is restrictive towards Refugees you don't win anything you're just masking the symptoms instead of fighting the cause.

Also consider that till now, no one knows for sure, if this was a political or religious assault.

As german citizen, I can assure you, that most of our educated citizens are pro refugees and contra those right-winged assholes who try to use those (terror)-attacks (no one still knows the background) for their purposes.

So not all of the refugees coming into Europe are victims some of them or terrorists and it is impossible to tell since many of them do not have papers. This is also want Islamic State wants and what they have planned. Plant terrorists among the refugees. I can't remember where I read this but it was in an intelligence report issued a couple of years ago.

So it is better to let million innocent people die, because there is the chance that from one million refugees, 100 might be terrorists? Sorry, no words for this.

 

[lockinlove]

It's laughable to blame Merkel for this. If Terrorists want to hurt a Country, there is no way to hinder them. And thats a fact. There will never be a 100%-safe Scenario for anyone in any Country of the World. So please don't accuse Refugees for the Problems which arise from that bullshit system called capitalism.
With a policy, which is restrictive towards Refugees you don't win anything you're just masking the symptoms instead of fighting the cause.

Also consider that till now, no one knows for sure, if this was a political or religious assault.

As german citizen, I can assure you, that most of our educated citizens are pro refugees and contra those right-winged assholes who try to use those (terror)-attacks (no one still knows the background) for their purposes.



So it is better to let million innocent people die, because of one million refugees, there is the chance that a very small percentage might be a islamistic terrorists ? Sorry, no words for this.

You seem quite dramatic. Relax.

I am pretty well informed on some of this, my other halfs relatives are German and their entire family is from there and half still live there and they disagree with everything you wrote. They despise Merkel. I asked them the questions I asked here and they said the area they live in Merkel is very hated but then you have the other side that loves them. Basically like here Liberal vs conservatives.

I also think the comment you made about if terrorists want to do something, they will. Wrong. Many countries do not allow refugees in, have a very tight border and vet people. They are enemies of many of these terrorist groups and they yet to be attacked. But when you open your borders and let them pour in, Im sorry thats not protecting your country. In my opinion she should be jailed.

To your last part. Its not a small percentage. One terrorists can kill tens of thousands. Many terrorists have already caused death and rape In germany.

And btw, there are many very educated right wing "assholes" in your country. And I bet they say the same about you left wing people too. Lets not pretend everyone who disagrees with you is an idiot.

 

[Mouche12]

Let's put some things into perspective: According to a review by the

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: of the approximately 2,400 terrorist attacks on U.S. soil it was determined that approximately 60 were carried out by Muslims.

In other words, approximately 2.5% of all terrorist attacks on U.S. soil between 1970 and 2012 were carried out by Muslims. This is a tiny proportion of all attacks.

 

[lockinlove]

Why go back to 1970? Run the numbers in the last couple of decades. Must be close to 100%.



25,000 americans have been murdered in the name of Islam since 2001

1/1990 USA Tuscon, AZ A Sunni cleric is assassinated in front of a Tuscon mosque after declaring that two verses of the Qur'an were invalid.
11/1990 USA New York City, NY An Israeli rabbi is shot to death by a Muslim attacker at a hotel.
1/1993 USA Langley, VA A Pakistani with Mujahideen ties guns down two CIA agents outside of the headquarters.
2/1993 USA New York, NY 1040 Islamic terrorists detonate a massive truck bomb under the World Trade Center
*1993 New York World Trade Center car bombed
3/1994 USA Brooklyn, NY A Muslim fires on a vanload of Jewish boys, killing one.
*1995 5 Americans kill in car bomb
*1996 Saudi Arabia Khobar Towers car bombed
3/1997 USA New York, NY A Palestinian leaves an anti-Jewish suicide note behind and travels to the top of the Empire State building where he shoot seven people in a Fedayeen attack.
4/1997 USA Lompoc, CA A prison guard is stabbed to death by a radical Muslim.
*1998 Kenya US Embassy car bombed
*1998 Tanzania US Embassy car bombed
10/1999 USA Near Nantucket An Egyptian airline pilot runs a planeload of 217 passengers into the water after uttering a Qur'anic prayer.
*2000 USS Cole boat bombed
*2001 New York World Trade Center hijacked airplanes steered into two towers
*2001 USA Shanksville, PA Islamic radicals hijack plane crashes in field
*2001 DC Sniper - USA Washington, DC 184 Islamic hijackers steer a plane full of people into the Pentagon.
3/2002 DC Sniper - USA Tuscon, AZ A 60-year-old man is gunned down by Muslim snipers on a golf course.
5/2002 DC Snipe - USA Denton, TX Muslim snipers kill a man as he works in his yard.
7/2002 DC Sniper - USA Los Angeles, CA Muslim man pulls out a gun at the counter of an Israeli airline and kills two people.
9/2002 DC Sniper - USA Clinton, MD A 55-year-old pizzaria owner is shot six times in the back by Muslims at close range.
9/2002 DC Sniper - USA Montgomery, AL Muslim snipers shoot two women, killing one.
9/2002 DC Sniper - USA Baton Rouge, LA A Korean mother is shot in the back by Muslim snipers.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Wheaton, MDMuslim snipers gun down a program analyst in a store parking lot.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Montgomery County, MD 5 0 Muslim snipers kill three men and two women in separate attacks over a 15-hour period.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Manassas, VA A man is killed by Muslim snipers while pumping gas two days after a 13-year-old is span>wounded by the same team.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Fredericksburg, VA Another man is killed by Muslim snipers while pumping gas.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Arlington, VA A woman is killed by Muslim snipers in a Home Depot parking lot.
10/2002 DC Sniper - USA Aspen Hill, MD A bus driver is killed by Muslim snipers.
*2002 Karachi, Pakistan: bomb explodes outside American consulate killing 12. Linked to al-Qaeda.
8/2003 USA Houston, TX After undergoing a religious revival, a Saudi college student slashes the throat of a Jewish student with a 4" butterfly knife, nearly decapitating the young man.
12/2003 USA Chicago, IL A Muslim doctor deliberately allows a Jewish patient to die from an easily treatable condition
*2003 Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: suicide bombers kill 34, housing compounds for Westerners. Al-Qaeda suspected.
4/2004 USA Raleigh, NC A Muslim man runs down five strangers with a car.
4/2004 USA Scottsville, NY In an honor killing, a Muslim father kills his wife and attacks his two daughters with a knife and hammer because he feared that they had been sexually molested.
*2004 May, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: terrorists attack Saudi oil company, take foreign hostage, killing 22 people.
*2004 June, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: terrorists kidnap and execute Paul Johnson Jr., 2 Americans and BBC cameraman killed.
*2004 Dec., Jeddah, Saudi Arabia: terrorists storm the U.S. consulate, killing 5.
*2005Amman, Jordan: suicide bombers hit 3 American hotels, Radisson, Grand Hyatt, and Days Inn
6/2006 USA Baltimore, MD A 62-year-old Jewish moviegoer is shot to death by a Muslim gunman in an unprovoked terror attack.
6/2006 USA Denver, CO Saying that it was 'Allah's choice', a Muslim shoots four of his co-workers and a police officer.
7/2006 USA Seattle, WA An 'angry' Muslim-American uses a young girl as hostage to enter a local Jewish center, where he shoots six women, one of whom dies.
10/2006 USA Louisville, KY In an 'honor' attack, a Muslim man rapes and beats his estranged wife, leaving her for dead, then savagely murders their four children.
*2006 Damascus, Syria: Terrorist an attack by four gunman on the American embassy is foiled.
2/2007 USA Salt Lake City, UT A Muslim immigrant goes on a shooting rampage at a mall, targeting people buying Valentine's Day cards at a gift shop and killing five.
4/2007 Virginia Tech shooting
*2007 Athens, Greece: the U.S. embassy is fired on by an anti-tank missile
1/2008 USA Irving, TX A Muslim immigrant shoots his two daughters to death on concerns about their 'Western' lifestyle.
2008 Nicky Reilly, who changed his name to Mohammad Rashid Said-Alimbe, set off his deadly cargo at Exeter’s city centre Giraffe restaurant in 2008 as part of a planned coordinated attack
7/2008 USA Jonesboro, GA A devout Muslim strangles his 25-year-old daughter in an honor killing.
*2008 May 26, Iraq: a suicide bomber on a motorcycle kills six U.S. soldiers and wounds 18 others in Tarmiya.
*2008 June 24, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills at least 20 people, including three U.S. Marines, in a town west of Baghdad.
*2008 June 12, Afghanistan: 4 American servicemen killed when IED explodes near a U.S. military vehicle.
*2008 July 13, Afghanistan: nine U.S.soldiers die when Taliban attack an American base,. It's the most deadly against U.S. troops in 3 years.
*2008 Aug. 18 and 19, Afghanistan: as many as 15 suicide bombers backed by about 30 militants attack a U.S. military base, Camp Salerno, in Bamiyan. Fighting between U.S. troops and members of the Taliban rages overnight. No U.S. troops are killed.
*2008 Sept. 16, Yemen: a car bomb and a rocket strike the U.S. embassy, killing 16 people. At least 25 suspected al-Qaeda militants are arrested for the attack.
*2008 Nov. 26, Mumbai, India: in a series of attacks on several landmarks and commercial hubs popular with Americans, including at least two five-star hotels, a hospital, a train station, and a cinema.
2009 Somali "Immigrant" Thug Racial Attacks

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6/2009 Little Rock recruiting office shooting
2/2009 USA Buffalo, NY The founder of a Muslim TV station beheads his wife in the hallway for seeking a divorce. 6/1/2009 USA Little Rock, AR 1 1 A Muslim with 'religious motives' shoots a local soldier to death inside a recruiting center.
11/2009 USA Glendale, AZ A woman dies from injuries suffered when her father runs her down with a car for being too 'Westernized.' (10-20-09)
11/2009 USA Ft. Hood, TX A Muslim psychiatrist guns down thirteen unarmed soldiers while yelling praises to Allah.
12/2009 USA Binghamton, NY A non-Muslim Islamic studies professor is stabbed to death by a Muslim grad student in revenge for 'persecuted' Muslims.
*2009 Feb. 9, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills four American soldiers and their Iraqi translator near a police checkpoint.
*2009 April 10, Iraq: a suicide attack kills five American soldiers and two Iraqi policemen.
*2009 Dec. 30, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills 8 Americans civilians, 7 of them CIA agents, at a base in Afghanistan. It's the deadliest attack on the agency since 9/11.
*2009 Shoe Bomber, Richard Colvin Reid
*2009 Arkansas Army recruiting office Mr. Muhammad shot and murder a Army Recruiter
*2009 Ft. Hood, TX Muslim psychiatrist murders 13 unarmed soldiers
4/2010 Marquette Park, IL, After quarrelling with his wife over Islamic dress, a Muslim convert shoots his family members to 'take them back to Allah' and out of the 'world of sinners'.
*2010 Underwear bomber/Christmas Day bomber, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab
*2010 New York City, NY Time Square Bomber, Faisal Shahzad
4/2011USAWarren, MI, A 20-year-old woman is shot in the head by her stepfather for not adhering to Islamic practices.
9/2011USAWaltham, MA, Three Jewish men have their throats slashed by Muslim terrorists.
*2011 Muslim terrorist attacks 12,533 in the world last year, according to a report by the National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC).
7/2012 2012, a mass shooting occurred inside of a Century movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
2/2013 Buena Vista, NJ, A Muslim targets and beheads two Christian Coptic immigrants.
3/2013 Ashtabula, OH, A Muslim convert walks into a church service with a Quran and guns down his Christian father while praising Allah.
4/2013Boston, MA, Foreign-born Muslims describing themselves as 'very religious' detonate two bombs packed with ball bearings at the Boston Marathon, killing three people and causing several more to lose limbs.
4/19/2013 Boston, MA, Jihadists gun down a university police officer sitting in his car.
8/2013Richmond, CA, A convert "on a mission from Allah" stabs a store clerk to death.
4/2013 Boston Marathon Bombing
9/2013 Washington Navy Yard shooting
2013 Oklahoma, Alton Nolen, a.k.a Jah’Keem Yisreal, stabbed and beheaded a female coworker
3/2014 Port Bolivar, TX, A Muslim man shoots his lesbian daughter and her lover to death and leaves a copy of the Quran open to a page condemning homosexuality.
4/2014 Skyway, WA, A 30-year-old man is murdered by a Muslim fanatic.
6/2014 Seattle, WA, Two homosexuals are murdered by an Islamic extremist.
6/2014 West Orange, NJ, A 19-year-old college student is shot to death 'in revenge' for Muslim deaths overseas.
9/2014 Moore, OK, A Sharia advocate beheads a woman after calling for Islamic terror and posting an Islamist beheading photo.
10/2014 Muslim Hits A NYC Cop In The Head With A Hatchet
12/2014 Ismaaiyl Abdullah Brinsley, 28, killed two New York City Police Department (NYPD) officers
2/2015 Oil Tanker Train, W. Virginia
4/2015 Oil Tanker Train,
5/2015 Oil Tanker Train, ND
05/2015 Garland, TX, 2 muslim terrorist attack Draw Mohammad Cartoon.
07/2015 Chattanooga shooting suspect muslim terrorist Muhammad Youssef Abdulazeez
10/2015 Oregon College Shooter Shiv Sharma Islamic Jihadist Muslim Terrorist.
2015 FBI report there have been over 25K muslim terrorist attacks since 911.
11/2015 Mass Stabber at Univ of CA Merced Identified as 'Faisal Mohammad'
2015 San Bernardino, CA Mass Murderers Islamic Jihadist Muslim Terrorist Syed Farook and Tashfeen Malik killed 16 wounded 21
2/2016 CALIFORNIA CAR JIHAD Muslim driver intentionally runs down jogger
2/2016 Somali man charged into a Columbus, Ohio, restaurant began attacking innocent patrons with a machete, according to reports.
2016 Propane Truck hit by Train at RR Crossing
2016 3 University Students Arrested for Building Bombs by Kevin Jackson | Mar 27, 2016

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2016 Disneyland, pipe bomb Happy Easter!
6/2016 CA UCLA shooter Mainak Sarkar a islamic jihadist muslim terrorist
6/2016 EERFIELD TOWNSHIP, Ohio Mohammed Abdou Laghaoui
6/2016 Tampa Florida Stipeclub shooting believed to be Islamic Jihadist Terrorism
6/2016 Orlando Florida Nightclub shooting by Omar Mateen Islamic jihadist muslim terrorism
6/2016 Mohammad Moghadden a Somalian Islamic Jihadist Terrorist took Hostages in Amarillo Texas Walmart: Police Say Suspect was Shot Dead
6/2016 Donte Brooks Island, aka Abdul Wahi Folcroft Police Officer Attacked – Shot Seven Times… Muslim Felon Abdul Wahi Arrested
7/2016 THE EXPLOSION HAPPENED NEXT TO THE FUNERAL OF HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR ELI WIESEL!
7/2016 Mahin Khan of Tucson, AZ was arrested for trying to blow up government buildings in 2 major cities
7/2016 11 DPD were shot and 5 murdered by Islamic Jihadist Muslim Terrorist.ISLAM! 5 Dallas Shooting Suspects Are American Muslims Who Attended South Dallas Mosque one is Micah X. Johnson
7/2016 AZ Street Shooter has killed 8 people
7/2016 Baton Rouge 3 officers murdered and 4 wounded
9/2016 NYC Naturalized US citizen from Afghanistan. 28 year old Ahmad Khan Rahami. The FBI arrest Admad's 5 brothers who lived in NJ.
9/2016 New Jersey Marine Run Bombing Ahmad Khan Rahami and his 5 brothers
9/2016 Minnesota Mall Stabbings St Cloud, Minnisota, Naturalized US Citizen 22 years old Somalian Daher Adnan ISIS fighter. His name was Dahir Adan, a Somalian immigrant, reportedly a “refugee” to the U.S.
9/2016 Cascade Mall Shooting: Five Killed at Macy's in Burlington, Washington. Arcan Cetin is an immigrant from Turkey non-citizen who is a Islamic Jihadist Muslim Terrorist who came to the US to kill American citizens.
9/2016 Houston strip mall gunman is a Muslim Lawyer Who Got Fired shoots 9 people and he is killed by police. www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyTHoe-qQss&feature=youtu.be Houston shooter is a Islamic Jihadist Muslim Terrorist wounds 9 people and he is kill by police.
10/2016 Man uses his car for jihad. Says he did it for Allah.
10/2016 Muslim Refugee Beats And RAPES Woman In North Dakota While Yelling ‘Allahu Akbar’ Abdulrahman Ali is a Somalian man who arrived in America four years ago
2016 Rashad Bugg-Bey slashed a woman with a knife about 8:15 p.m. just outside the entrance to the Metro station at Union Station.
11/2016 18 yr old Somali islamic jihadist muslim terrorist butcher knife at Ohio State University

 

[interlog]

Let's put some things into perspective: According to a review by the

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: of the approximately 2,400 terrorist attacks on U.S. soil it was determined that approximately 60 were carried out by Muslims.

In other words, approximately 2.5% of all terrorist attacks on U.S. soil between 1970 and 2012 were carried out by Muslims. This is a tiny proportion of all attacks.

Your taking your information from a website that has its own agenda. I wouldn't necessarily trust the information on that website to be totally independent and without skewed opinion.

 

[mimi26]

Why go back to 1970? Run the numbers in the last couple of decades. Must be close to 100%.



25,000 americans have been murdered in the name of Islam since 2001

(dont really know why you have copied a list of murder victims when we are talking about terrorist attacks, there is a difference)


It always surprises me when numbers are quoted at the amnesia many have to just how many civilians in the middle east were slaughtered because of an illegal invasion, no matter how much we want to block it out or deny it, it is us who have nurtured the growth of this 'terrorism' through our own supposedly moral actions.

Bush is one of the biggest war criminals in history aided and abetted by Blair.


As for letting people 'flood' into countries unchecked and its connections to terrorist attacks and think you will want to look a little deeper into that issue.


and who knows Trump may just build a wall around America save you all

 

[lockinlove]

(dont really know why you have copied a list of murder victims when we are talking about terrorist attacks, there is a difference)


It always surprises me when numbers are quoted at the amnesia many have to just how many civilians in the middle east were slaughtered because of an illegal invasion, no matter how much we want to block it out or deny it, it is us who have neutered the growth of this 'terrorism' through our own supposedly moral actions.

Bush is one of the biggest war criminals in history aided and abetted by Blair.


As for letting people 'flood' into countries unchecked and its connections to terrorist attacks and think you will want to look a little deeper into that issue.


and who knows Trump may just build a wall around America save you all

Most from that list are terrorist attacks and most others are hate murders in the name of Allah. Which is the same thing.

They commit so many attacks on westerners because they believe it is purifying the world. And because females are treated equally here which is against their beliefs. So much so they are determined to kill because of it

And yes thankfully Trump was elected to tighten up the borders and not have open borders like Germany. Problem is we have a laughable trudeau here who is all for buying votes from them IMO

 

[Harry_BKK]

Why go back to 1970? Run the numbers in the last couple of decades. Must be close to 100%.



25,000 americans have been murdered in the name of Islam since 2001

(dont really know why you have copied a list of murder victims when we are talking about terrorist attacks, there is a difference)


It always surprises me when numbers are quoted at the amnesia many have to just how many civilians in the middle east were slaughtered because of an illegal invasion, no matter how much we want to block it out or deny it, it is us who have neutered the growth of this 'terrorism' through our own supposedly moral actions.

Bush is one of the biggest war criminals in history aided and abetted by Blair.


As for letting people 'flood' into countries unchecked and its connections to terrorist attacks and think you will want to look a little deeper into that issue.


and who knows Trump may just build a wall around America save you all

Thank you very much for this post!

The constant blending out of the real reasons for terrorism is just staggering.

- UK - Israel/Palestine disaster
- UK - useless Falkland war
- US - Vietnam, Korea, Cambodia disasters
- US - feeding Taliban with weapons against Russia in the 80's, now fighting them
- US - 2 Middle east campaigns, this time Mr. Blair jumped on the bandwagon
- US/UK/France - Libya disaster
-....list by far not complete

Offficial Reason: All in the name of the "GREATER GOOD", fighting communism, terrorism and evil dictators

Real Reason: securing access to oil, territorial presence, enforce own interests

Real Victims: local civilians and victims of the war and "terrorist" attacks.

Question remaining: Who is really the bigger terrorist in this world??? I know the answer.

 

[lockinlove]

.

Bush is one of the biggest war criminals in history aided and abetted by Blair.

Also just want to add I dont really have a problem with what Bush did. Alot of conspiracy theorists yell oil etc. Bush refused to take the oil in the end. Saddam made an agreement from the first war the Americans were allowed to inspect for nukes etc. Saddam broke that agreement and kicked inspectors out. This just after 9/11 attacks. USA was never going to risk anything more. Hence why that administration made the assumption Saddam was building and hiding weapons.

The real idiot was Tony Blair. I dont even think that guy looked into it, he just followed along like a clueless sheep.

The USA tries to pry its nose into too many affairs. Especially the democrats Obama and Hilary. How the secretary of state doesnt answer over 300 calls/emails from the ambassador in benghazi is beyond me. And what happens? American soldiers and the ambassador dragged into the streets and killed.

Then this same crew with the Libya garbage..Again Hilary Clinton had a huge part in this.

Glad to see these people no longer in office in a few weeks.

The best thing I heard from Trump was "Why does the USA need to be the policeman of the world. We dont. We need to take care of our own country and affairs"

 

[mimi26]

Also just want to add I dont really have a problem with what Bush did. Alot of conspiracy theorists yell oil etc. Bush refused to take the oil in the end. Saddam made an agreement from the first war the Americans were allowed to inspect for nukes etc. Saddam broke that agreement and kicked inspectors out. This just after 9/11 attacks. USA was never going to risk anything more. Hence why that administration made the assumption Saddam was building and hiding weapons.

The real idiot was Tony Blair. I dont even think that guy looked into it, he just followed along like a clueless sheep.

The USA tries to pry its nose into too many affairs. Especially the democrats Obama and Hilary. How the secretary of state doesnt answer over 300 calls/emails from the ambassador in benghazi is beyond me. And what happens? American soldiers and the ambassador dragged into the streets and killed.

Then this same crew with the Libya garbage..Again Hilary Clinton had a huge part in this.

Glad to see these people no longer in office in a few weeks.

The best thing I heard from Trump was "Why does the USA need to be the policeman of the world. We dont. We need to take care of our own country and affairs"

really? near a quarter of a million innocent people slaughtered certainly makes me have sleepless nights

 

[lockinlove]

really? near a quarter of a million innocent people slaughtered certainly makes me have sleepless nights

IMO you should be blaming Saddam for that. Hes the one that allowed it to happen when all he had to do was follow the agreement that was made. What a time to try and take a tough stance on America. Right around 9/11. Not the sharpest tool in the shed.

Not only did he refuse, he insulted and enticed the Americans. Calling them weak and saying he would destroy them.

 

[mimi26]

IMO you should be blaming Saddam for that. Hes the one that allowed it to happen when all he had to do was follow the agreement that was made. What a time to try and take a tough stance on America. Right around 9/11. Not the sharpest tool in the shed.

Not only did he refuse, he insulted and enticed the Americans. Calling them weak and saying he would destroy them.

Honestly you just cant see the wood for the trees, blaming everyone else but the people who perpetrated these acts, maybe a good starting point would be researching just who was going to make money from the Iraq illegal invasion, always follow the money

 

[lockinlove]

Honestly you just cant see the wood for the trees, blaming everyone else but the people who perpetrated these acts, maybe a good starting point would be researching just who was going to make money from the Iraq illegal invasion, always follow the money

So breaking an agreement, threatening america with weapons of mass destruction, is me making excuses?

Saddam Husseins words on or after 9/11

"t is possible to turn to biological attack, where a small can, not bigger than the size of a hand, can be used to release viruses that affect everything..."
Babil, September 20, 2001 (State-controlled newspaper)



"If the attacks of September 11 cost the lives of 3,000 civilians, how much will the size of losses in 50 states within 100 cities if it were attacked in the same way in which New York and Washington were? What would happen if hundreds of planes attacked American cities?"
Al-Rafidayn, September 11, 2002 (State-controlled newspaper)

"The real perpetrators [of September 11] are within the collapsed buildings."
Alif-Ba, September 11, 2002 (State-controlled newspaper)

"The United States must get a taste of its own poison..."
Babil, October 8, 2001

Im sorry but you say these things to a country that was just attacked what do you expect. Then when the USA responds he says he has weapons of mass destruction and will kill all americans.

Thats not wood trees forest jungle whatever. Thats idiocy.

To blame Bush is ill informed imo. Which I dont blame people for. I studied politics in university and learned an awful lot. Was pretty boring alot of it lol.

Alot of what these articles im referencing were actual pieces used in our class. Alot of it no one knows about until you actually dig it up.

 

[mimi26]

So breaking an agreement, threatening america with weapons of mass destruction, is me making excuses?

Saddam Husseins words on or after 9/11

"t is possible to turn to biological attack, where a small can, not bigger than the size of a hand, can be used to release viruses that affect everything..."
Babil, September 20, 2001 (State-controlled newspaper)

"The United States must get a taste of its own poison..."
Babil, October 8, 2001

"If the attacks of September 11 cost the lives of 3,000 civilians, how much will the size of losses in 50 states within 100 cities if it were attacked in the same way in which New York and Washington were? What would happen if hundreds of planes attacked American cities?"
Al-Rafidayn, September 11, 2002 (State-controlled newspaper)

"The real perpetrators [of September 11] are within the collapsed buildings."
Alif-Ba, September 11, 2002 (State-controlled newspaper)

Im sorry but you say these things to a country that was just attacked what do you expect. Then when the USA responds he says he has weapons of mass destruction and will kill all americans.

Thats not wood trees forest jungle whatever. Thats idiocy.

To blame Bush is ill informed imo

you speak like one American life is worth more than one Iraqi life.


Bush was eager to invade Iraq during the year 2000 when Saddam changed its required currency for oil trade from USD to the Euro,

Sadaam threatening the world was not a 'new' tactic that took place post 911, why did Bush go after Sadaam when Bin Laden was blamed for 9/11, now that is the sticking point here, the USA just used the excuse of 9/11 to go back to Iraq and carry on what his father failed to finish. They knew there were no weapons of mass destruction it was a false flag and that has been proven, funny you Blame Blair for being a sheep, but being a sheep for what exactly? for following Bush into an illegal war

Isis was born out of the Iraqi war and for that Bush is responsible for.

You need to think outside the box to see it for exactly what it is.

 

[The Dude]

Moved to Political Rants. Be cool everybody.

 

[lockinlove]

you speak like one American life is worth more than one Iraqi life.


Bush was eager to invade Iraq during the year 2000 when Saddam changed its required currency for oil trade from USD to the Euro,

Sadaam threatening the world was not a 'new' tactic that took place post 911, why did Bush go after Sadaam when Bin Laden was blamed for 9/11, now that is the sticking point here, the USA just used the excuse of 9/11 to go back to Iraq and carry on what his father failed to finish. They knew there were no weapons of mass destruction it was a false flag and that has been proven, funny you Blame Blair for being a sheep, but being a sheep for what exactly? for following Bush into an illegal war

Isis was born out of the Iraqi war and for that Bush is responsible for.

You need to think outside the box to see it for exactly what it is.

lol I dont care either way. Its just facts im using. You are using an ill informed opinion.

Half of what you say are one liners that dont even make sense. I speak like one life is more than another what? Where did I say that?

Who said anything about Saddam threatening the world was new? I said he insulted, baited and threatened america with weapons after 9/11.

What do you mean why did Bush go after Saddam? Because he threatened america with chemical warfare etc after 9/11.

Blair is a sheep because he was the leader of a country and instead of doing what was best for his country, he followed america into war.

You accuse Bush of oil theft. The reason why Isis grew like it did was because Bush left the oil alone. So which is it here? Bush stole oil and Isis wasnt his fault or he didnt steal oil and Isis is still his fault? Just blame Bush for everything.

What his father failed to finish? LMAO. So you think a well known dangerous dictator should be allowed to threaten america with chemical warfare and terror attacks?

You need to think outside the box instead of listening to the news because all your one liners are exactly whats found on CNN clips or conspiracy clips. And its exactly what has poisoned alot of society.

 

[mimi26]

lol I dont care either way. Its just facts im using. You are using an ill informed opinion.

Half of what you say are one liners that dont even make sense. I speak like one life is more than another what? Where did I say that?

Who said anything about Saddam threatening the world was new? I said he insulted, baited and threatened america with weapons after 9/11.

What do you mean why did Bush go after Saddam? Because he threatened america with chemical warfare etc after 9/11.

Blair is a sheep because he was the leader of a country and instead of doing what was best for his country, he followed america into war.

You accuse Bush of oil theft. The reason why Isis grew like it did was because Bush left the oil alone. So which is it here? Bush stole oil and Isis wasnt his fault or he didnt steal oil and Isis is still his fault? Just blame Bush for everything.

What his father failed to finish? LMAO. So you think a well known dangerous dictator should be allowed to threaten america with chemical warfare and terror attacks?

You need to think outside the box instead of listening to the news because all your one liners are exactly whats found on CNN clips or conspiracy clips. And its exactly what has poisoned alot of society.

FYI, I NEVER listen or watch any news outlets I visit a website occasionally to see if there is any breaking news to follow, and I doubt you would get any news channel with my opinion on the IRAQ Broadcasting it.

Point once to were I have accused Bush of oil theft? and yes he is responsible for the direct rise of ISIL.

His father failed to finish yes, because he was still a a 'well known dangerous dictator' back in 1991 when they left him in power and that war was never formally ended.

Bush and his administration were itching to invade Iraq before 9/11, you speak like they only decided to go for it to protect its citizens because big bad Saadam with absolutely no means was going to somehow conquer one of the most powerful nations in the world. You argue and post quotes about the reasons for the invasion but they were not the reason at all some of these quotes were from late 2002 when the road to Iraq was very nearly reached, I suggest it may be you listening to propaganda that was thrown around to justify the invasion.

I am sorry if you can make no sense from my one liners (whatever they may be) but I dont feel the need to write an essay on the Invasion of Iraq, maybe a good start for you would be the Chilcot report heavy reading but well worth it.

 

[The Dude]

...the USA just used the excuse of 9/11 to go back to Iraq and carry on what his father failed to finish...

Just to chime in, the Gulf War was a coalition of quite a few nations - not just the US - and was sanctioned by the UN. We were only there to push the Iraqis out of Kuwait - which was done swiftly and effectively.

It was decided to leave Saddam in charge but contained. I'm sure some folks hoped that his own people would overthrow him, but we saw how that went.

 

[lotusch]

My wife was walking on that very same market last week..
Before she left I wasn't really comfortable seeing her go there with the high alerts that were already given but hey that is what they want on the end. You being scared staying home.
Glad she came back ok and I feel very sorry for last nights victims and their families.

The world is really going to smithereens.

I am not a fear mongerer but the world is about to explode i.m.h.o.
How long will it take before a new WW will erupt.

 

[mimi26]

Just to chime in, the Gulf War was a coalition of quite a few nations - not just the US - and was sanctioned by the UN. We were only there to push the Iraqis out of Kuwait - which was done swiftly and effectively.

It was decided to leave Saddam in charge but contained. I'm sure some folks hoped that his own people would overthrow him, but we saw how that went.

Sorry but it just may be the way I am coming across I know Desert storm was a joint effort and one I would say was very much needed, my point was that the Bush Junior was very much for regime change in Iraq and his father had failed to do it, it was a tongue in cheek comment.

Although I argue there was a need for this I cant get away from the horrors of the highway of death and just how pointless all war really is.

 

[goatwack]

Another political thread - goodie

I will say I am disgusted with what I'm seeing on the news, having been born in Berlin, and I can say with 100% certainty that this would not have occured had Germany not allowed hundreds of thousands of u n v e t t e d Syrians and other nationalities in from the Middle East.

To suggest otherwise is naiive,oblivious and apologist for the actions of these individuals (mostly of fighting age, I hasten to add) and can await the day when their country is ruined thanks to the whims of a career politician.

Merkel should be tried for treason truth be told.

 

[maxd]

The 3 stages of destruction of the European peoples and cultures ...

Socrates has a dog.
A dog bit someone.
Therefore Socrates has blood on his hands.

Sloppy, dangerous thinking Dunover. And it's exactly that kind of crap that helped precipitate one of the worst genocides in human history.

Hopefully when the next right wing nutter murders someone in the street of some UK community you'll see that you have blood on your hands for propagating that kind of irresponsible drivel. You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[nachhaltig]

You seem quite dramatic. Relax.

I am pretty well informed on some of this, my other halfs relatives are German and their entire family is from there and half still live there and they disagree with everything you wrote. They despise Merkel. I asked them the questions I asked here and they said the area they live in Merkel is very hated but then you have the other side that loves them. Basically like here Liberal vs

My opinion vs. their opinion. But please tell me how a single politician can be blamed for the whole refugee-policy of the EU. The EU failed as a whole in this case.

I also think the comment you made about if terrorists want to do something, they will. Wrong. Many countries do not allow refugees in, have a very tight border and vet people. They are enemies of many of these terrorist groups and they yet to be attacked. But when you open your borders and let them pour in, Im sorry thats not protecting your country. In my opinion she should be jailed.

Terrorism isn't something which refugees invented. There was Terrorism before the Islamistic Scene. Sorry, but there is no 100% safety and there will never be a 100% safety.

To your last part. Its not a small percentage. One terrorists can kill tens of thousands. Many terrorists have already caused death and rape In germany.

And btw, there are many very educated right wing "assholes" in your country. And I bet they say the same about you left wing people too. Lets not pretend everyone who disagrees with you is an idiot.

But "caused death and rape" doesn't sounds dramatic ? There was this big case on last new-years-eve in Cologne, and beside that a few weeks ago a Girl was killed by a Refugee. You've got criminals in every country and every group.

I wouldn't consider myself "left-winged", I just had history and I know what happens when populism meets fear. Lesson learned, maybe you won't understand as you're not that sensitized like us germans.
I am sorry if I am sounding rude, I don't mean it that way, blame my english for it.


Last thing I want to add:
I admit, that the EU as whole handled the entire Refugee-Thing in a really bad way. They could have done it better (more control, take fingerprints and so on). But to blame Merkel and/or the Refugees for Terrrorism is nothing more then political propaganda.

I find it hard to discuss with you as my english is limited and I can't hold a proper discussing-language. Therefore I'm out

 

[sledge13]

Merkel is 100% to blame for this, encouraging millions of Muslims to enter Europe unchecked...Islam will never be with western values, the Koran teaches to kill the non believer etc.

The right wing view point has pointed out for the last twenty years that multiculturalsim does not work, now you are seeing the evidence of that.

 

[mimi26]

Merkel is 100% to blame for this, encouraging millions of Muslims to enter Europe unchecked...Islam will never be with western values, the Koran teaches to kill the non believer etc.

The right wing view point has pointed out for the last twenty years that multiculturalsim does not work, now you are seeing the evidence of that.

wow you speak like we dont live with many many Muslims just fine, you cant tar them all with the same brush.

Lets not go into what the Bible teaches us

 

[Mouche12]

I find it hard to discuss with you as my english is limited and I can't hold a proper discussing-language. Therefore I'm out

@nachhaltig, there is absolutely nothing wrong with your English and I agree with all of your points, well put!

 

[Naok777]

Merkel is 100% to blame for this

Don't forget decades of selling arms to the Middle East, Bush and Blair with their hard on for invading Iraq, the Turkish "history" with the Kurds and so on, point being that Merkel is just one of many who failed to find a solution.

 

[me_and_ed]

@nachhaltig, there is absolutely nothing wrong with your English and I agree with all of your points, well put!

I agree as well, I am having a very hard time biting my tongue based on some comments made here, I am a Canadian that spends more than half my time in the US with have many friends and business partners down there, I am extremely fearful for the future, I realize this started off with the heinous attack but am aghast by some of uneducated political views and Google professors.

 

[syntynyt]

if you guys and gals would have followed what the fate of ISIS is nowadays, that is almost finished in Irak and Syria thanks to Russian 'civil' bombing, and their sole message for several months was 'fight them in their homelands, don't come to Syria anymore', this is not a surprise, not an event, just another day in multicultural diversity West where one is naive and the other is radical. like i saw in UK, they have their own neighborhoods buying out any local residents, soon own cities, attending mosquees with known hate preachers, what are the expectations? as for moderate Islam, buy yourself a Koran and read it, i did that with .pdf files out of curiosity and personal research, you can't follow that bullshit unless you are inferior in mindset and from being a level above a monkey you make out of it the purpose and goal of your life. take the Bible morality points and revert them, then you have Koran. but if this is the will of the few that controls the reins of this Earth nobody can change it, just like always strive to survive, nowadays by avoiding gatherings. and lemme know when ISIS will not attack, just get 'permission' to mock the holy land or its ties. so far only other muslims and westerners have tasted their barbarity. how so?

 

[syntynyt]

Another political thread - goodie

I will say I am disgusted with what I'm seeing on the news, having been born in Berlin, and I can say with 100% certainty that this would not have occured had Germany not allowed hundreds of thousands of u n v e t t e d Syrians and other nationalities in from the Middle East.

To suggest otherwise is naiive,oblivious and apologist for the actions of these individuals (mostly of fighting age, I hasten to add) and can await the day when their country is ruined thanks to the whims of a career politician.

Merkel should be tried for treason truth be told.

spot on.
there is a reason Russia is kinda protected against such acts despite attacking them on all fronts. they didn't ;imported; the loads like did the west. and this type of liberalism evolved in mental illness

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isn;t present there. this continent wasn't so socially divided since WW2, and what once was regular activity between factions in the Middle East- the terrorism, is tending to become the standard here. shock and horror, extreme wheater, weekly? basis, yet another terrorist attack. 'give peace a chance' 'make love, not war' 'je suis', what about give change a chance.

 

[lotusch]

Socrates has a dog.
A dog bit someone.
Therefore Socrates has blood on his hands.

Sloppy, dangerous thinking Dunover. And it's exactly that kind of crap that helped precipitate one of the worst genocides in human history.

Hopefully when the next right wing nutter murders someone in the street of some UK community you'll see that you have blood on your hands for propagating that kind of irresponsible drivel. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I am very sorry maxd but I see exactly where Dunover is coming from and why people think and respond that way.
All my respect to you for all the work you do for this great community but I felt your words towards Dunover are quite harsh.
I don't know how you see things but I do see also a crumbling western society where our core values and cultures are being endangered.
If I just may take my home country The Netherlands as an example, the country has changed so much in the last 5-10 years, it is shocking!!
I can go write here all the examples that will show you exactly what I mean.
The Netherlands is losing it's culture and it's core values.
And yes, unfortunately that is due to multiculturalism.
I have never had anything against that because the majority of foreign people will adapt to the culture in their new home country.
In this day and age it is actually a minority of people that get things changed in The Netherlands by complaining about certain uses and cultures that they find racist towards them.

Now we can go into a very lengthy discussion about these things but I will leave them be for now.

The big problem I have is exactly what your response is towards Dunovers post.
Basicly you condemn him for speaking out his worries about the changes that are happening all over Western Europe with Germany as an example.

People who do this are now being put away as a racist and that is utter bull.
For me these are typical left wing orientated comments towards all people who are clearly worried about the current state of their country.
So everyone who is worried about that and vents their opinion is a racist and a right extremist these days if I may believe your wordings.

So that would put me in that same corner as Dunover.

I too am worried.

Am I a right wing extremist? No, and I never will be.

Am I a racist? No, I have many friends from different countries and religions and cultural backgrounds.
Actually I am pretty open minded about foreign cultures and even different religions.

Am I worried about the soft approach of the mostly left wing parties in Europe regarding refugees? Yes I am as they are not screened and thus potential extremists and salafists can mingle between them and enter our borders to create death and destruction. I will exclude the economic refugees here as they are a story on their own. I have no issues whatsoever with refugees from war torn zones!

So I ask myself, am I am racist by saying this? Am I Neo-Nazi for saying this? Am I a right extremist for saying this?

No I am not and I am sure the way we know Dunover, he isn't either.

People are drawing that racist card way too quick these days, one cannot vent their opinion anymore.
Even if you do that in normal wordings without being rude or disrespectful.
I hardly mingle into political discussions but sometimes it has to be done I suppose.

My final question would be, how many deaths have been caused by any right extremist group and how many have been caused by radical islamic groups and /or terrorists over the past let's say 10 years.
Both groups preach hate and see violence as a valid act toward fellow human beings.

I hope you can appreciate my response and I also hope you can understand my p.o.v on this matter even if we might disagree.

Thanks,

Mark.

 

[jetset]

I too (like one of the posters above) have been biting my tongue as these sensitive issues are discussed, with the attendant danger of someone losing their cool.

Let's hope that doesn't occur and we're all given space to voice an opinion, no matter how different it may be to our own.

This is off at something of a tangent, but one of my current perceptions, perhaps flowing from the deeply unpleasant hostility on both sides in the US election issue and its aftermath, is that many of those on the left appear to believe that others who do not subscribe to their viewpoint are (a) right wing, heartless racists and/or (b) ignorant (or "uneducated") and stupid.

I read and watch media reportage extensively every day, and that's the perception I have formed based on the expressed opinions of left-leaning writers, politicians and celebrities.

Nothing could be further from the truth, and such an attitude constitutes a sort of misguided intellectual snobbery in my view that does nothing to endear liberals to their fellow countrymen, quite apart from being arbitrary, unjust and inaccurate.

It's a big mistake to consider yourself intellectually elitist or educationally superior to the rest of the electorate, and to regard them as "deplorables" for not agreeing with you.

Concerning the argument here (seeing as I have said my tuppence worth on what I see as a pervading liberal attitude) I would have to agree that allowing largely uncontrolled entry of hundreds of thousands of undocumented folks from an alien culture and religion is treading a dangerous path that could lead to tragic consequences, and in that respect the EU has been less than diligent.

And it's a potential society-changer that many regard with alarm.

Hindsight is always 20/20, and I may be guilty of that in assuming that there must have been a better way of handling this crisis.

 

[dunover]

Socrates has a dog.
A dog bit someone.
Therefore Socrates has blood on his hands.

Sloppy, dangerous thinking Dunover. And it's exactly that kind of crap that helped precipitate one of the worst genocides in human history.

Hopefully when the next right wing nutter murders someone in the street of some UK community you'll see that you have blood on your hands for propagating that kind of irresponsible drivel. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Whooaaaah!!!

Socrates gets a dog. He doesn't check its temperament. He proceeds to leave it with his kids, whom it promptly attacks and kills. Socrates IS bloody well responsible. QED

Merkel IS a traitor to her people as Goaty said, because something as drastic as supplanting 1.5% of the German population with mainly Muslim migrants with no cultural ties in one single year should have been put to referendum. No single politician should have the power to wreak such damage on their country without the assent of the electorate. Then of course we know democracy often produces the 'wrong' result for the liberal ruling cliques, don't we?

You see that darned ballot box that lets me vote for somebody without being vilified or accused of racism is a bloody inconvenience to them.

To compare my post demonstrating the stupidity of one woman and those like her (and the consequences of that stupidity in letting the cat among the pigeons so-to-speak) with genocide is totally inappropriate, illogical and frankly offensive Max and you know it.

 

[lockinlove]

My opinion vs. their opinion. But please tell me how a single politician can be blamed for the whole refugee-policy of the EU. The EU failed as a whole in this case.



Terrorism isn't something which refugees invented. There was Terrorism before the Islamistic Scene. Sorry, but there is no 100% safety and there will never be a 100% safety.



But "caused death and rape" doesn't sounds dramatic ? There was this big case on last new-years-eve in Cologne, and beside that a few weeks ago a Girl was killed by a Refugee. You've got criminals in every country and every group.

I wouldn't consider myself "left-winged", I just had history and I know what happens when populism meets fear. Lesson learned, maybe you won't understand as you're not that sensitized like us germans.
I am sorry if I am sounding rude, I don't mean it that way, blame my english for it.


Last thing I want to add:
I admit, that the EU as whole handled the entire Refugee-Thing in a really bad way. They could have done it better (more control, take fingerprints and so on). But to blame Merkel and/or the Refugees for Terrrorism is nothing more then political propaganda.

I find it hard to discuss with you as my english is limited and I can't hold a proper discussing-language. Therefore I'm out

I dont understand how you cannot say Merkel is not to blame. She stood on podium and announced she will have open borders and all syrians are welcome.

BTW you claim not to be left wing, your entire opinion is left. I remember in class discussing this. One side was Democrat the other republican. Liberal views vs conservatives. Your view was that of theirs.

Have you ever read the Quran?

I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

And then the Quran is full of verses how woman are less worth and are to be treated how the men see fit.

Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). As to those women on whose part you see ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful), but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.

When you have a large group of people who believe in this and act on it and then invite them into your country with a completely different belief system, you are asking for serious problems.

You are trying to take the blame off of her and say it is an issue as a whole. She runs Germany. No one can persuade a strong leader to follow suit.

Merkel could do as other countries do and close the borders. She is to blame without question

No one said there is 100% safety. But you can take precautions and deter these attacks. See Canada's system. The refugees are vetted and for the most part have been no attacks.

 

[sledge13]

Superb post Lockin.

 

[nachhaltig]

Okay, since I have no money left to play with, I try to answer you

I dont understand how you cannot say Merkel is not to blame. She stood on podium and announced she will have open borders and all syrians are welcome.

It's interesting that everyone outside of Germany thinks, that Merkel made a kind of "Invitation". As I stated before, the whole EU failed in that case. Thats a huge and complicated topic, which isn't that easy to discuss. As I wrote in my previous post, I admit that mistakes were made. My Impression is, that in the early moments our politicians didn't realized how big the Number of potential Refugees is. As a Result all borders were overwhelmed with the amount of Refugees. I don't know if you kept Track of the efforts of Hungary to keep their borders closed. They also failed. Merkel didn't had any chance to make another decision (it was already to late) and believe me or not, I am the opposite of a Merkel-Fan.

I don't know exactly how the power is divided in the USA, Canada or UK, but in Germany the chancellor can't decide isolated. Most of the Parliament stood behind this decision. To go further, in the German party spectrum, the CDU (Merkels party) is far away from the left side, the CDU is by far the most popular conservative party here in Germany.

BTW you claim not to be left wing, your entire opinion is left. I remember in class discussing this. One side was Democrat the other republican. Liberal views vs conservatives. Your view was that of theirs.

I wouldn't call myself left. I am just against populism, Rascism and Fascism. Yeah okay, my view about economics is left, but thats not the point in this discussion.

Have you ever read the Quran?

I did not, did you read the Bible? It's all about the exegesis of this texts.

When you have a large group of people who believe in this and act on it and then invite them into your country with a completely different belief system, you are asking for serious problems.

I can only speak for myself. I have had contact on several occasions with Refugees and didn't had any problems. Most of them are really glad that they have the possibility to be here and to be alive. In every bigger Group are people who behave like scum. It's unfair to judge a whole Group by the misbehaviour of some individuals.

Merkel could do as other countries do and close the borders. She is to blame without question

No one said there is 100% safety. But you can take precautions and deter these attacks. See Canada's system. The refugees are vetted and for the most part have been no attacks.

Before a refugee is able to come to germany they have to cross Greece/Turkey - Bulgaria/Serbia - Hungary and Austria. So you are blaming the country at the very end of the chain? If the other countrys would have kept their borders closed, then how were the refugees supposed to come to germany?

If I had to leave my country because people want to kill me there, i would be really glad if there would be a country like germany which would give me opportunity to begin a new life.


And to speak about those terrorists. We already have enough of them in our Country. And most of them were born in Germany. There is a reason why people believe the shit, a preacher of hate is telling them. They don't see any future and are hoping for a better live in paradise as a martyr. You could tell me that in paradise would 300 virgins wait for me, I wouldnt care. And why? Because I have everything I could ask for (okay except monster hits like you had ).

 

[Dinahnana]

So it is better to let million innocent people die, because there is the chance that from one million refugees, 100 might be terrorists? Sorry, no words for this.

OMG that is not what I said or implied at all. What I think is that the political situation ought to be sorted out in Syria, Libya et al so we don't have the need to have refugees as they would be safe in their home countries.

Besides why does the EU have to take the vast majority when many member states are in the middle of a housing crisis and can barely handle the population in their own countries. Now we have to take dis-placed and traumatized people when we do not have the resources to take care of them. Those actions breed resentment among the native population which then breeds resentment with the incoming people and the end result is you have people carrying out terrorists attacks.
Why can't the politically stable Muslim countries take some of these refugees? Why does it have to be Europe? It's because of Angela Merckel.


Edit: I have come to believe that this whole mess with inviting millions of refugees into the EU with the intention of forcing member states in taking them (led by Germany because everybody knows Germany is mostly in charge of the EU) caused the UK to vote to leave the EU.

I didn't understand it then because refugees hadn't been re-settled yet but I understand now since my country is being forced to settle more and more refugees. If there was a vote to leave tomorrow I would vote to leave. I am not a racist in any way shape or form but I think forcing a country to take people when you can't take care of your own population is wrong. I also think the crime rate will increase in the next few years. I hope that I am wrong but I don't think that I am.

 

[lockinlove]

Okay, since I have no money left to play with, I try to answer you



It's interesting that everyone outside of Germany thinks, that Merkel made a kind of "Invitation". As I stated before, the whole EU failed in that case. Thats a huge and complicated topic, which isn't that easy to discuss. As I wrote in my previous post, I admit that mistakes were made. My Impression is, that in the early moments our politicians didn't realized how big the Number of potential Refugees is. As a Result all borders were overwhelmed with the amount of Refugees. I don't know if you kept Track of the efforts of Hungary to keep their borders closed. They also failed. Merkel didn't had any chance to make another decision (it was already to late) and believe me or not, I am the opposite of a Merkel-Fan.

I don't know exactly how the power is divided in the USA, Canada or UK, but in Germany the chancellor can't decide isolated. Most of the Parliament stood behind this decision. To go further, in the German party spectrum, the CDU (Merkels party) is far away from the left side, the CDU is by far the most popular conservative party here in Germany.




I wouldn't call myself left. I am just against populism, Rascism and Fascism. Yeah okay, my view about economics is left, but thats not the point in this discussion.


I did not, did you read the Bible? It's all about the exegesis of this texts.



I can only speak for myself. I have had contact on several occasions with Refugees and didn't had any problems. Most of them are really glad that they have the possibility to be here and to be alive. In every bigger Group are people who behave like scum. It's unfair to judge a whole Group by the misbehaviour of some individuals.



Before a refugee is able to come to germany they have to cross Greece/Turkey - Bulgaria/Serbia - Hungary and Austria. So you are blaming the country at the very end of the chain? If the other countrys would have kept their borders closed, then how were the refugees supposed to come to germany?

If I had to leave my country because people want to kill me there, i would be really glad if there would be a country like germany which would give me opportunity to begin a new life.


And to speak about those terrorists. We already have enough of them in our Country. And most of them were born in Germany. There is a reason why people believe the shit, a preacher of hate is telling them. They don't see any future and are hoping for a better live in paradise as a martyr. You could tell me that in paradise would 300 virgins wait for me, I wouldnt care. And why? Because I have everything I could ask for (okay except monster hits like you had ).

Its because we saw her on TV

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You dont need to listen to the guy just listen to the concerned Germans and her idiotic response. Fast forward to 1:11 Its Germanys responsibility? What? To open your borders to them? Uh no. This is her fault and her line of thinking proves it

More delusion

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more delusion

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Another public announcement inviting them in

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Id be happy too if a country invited me in if my country was in war. However, I would expect that country to vet me.

And yes I did read the Bible. And no its not about the exegesis.


Allowing 10,000 young men from Syria into your country in ONE day is not only irresponsible, a strain on your economy, its blind idiocy and extremely dangerous.

 

[hedgehok]

Don't even try nachhaltig. And keep in mind that the North American interpretation of leftism is not comparable with Europe. A Bernie Sanders is called a leftist there where in Germany he would be a centrist.

Anyway blaming Merkel for the Bus attack is quite far fetched. However there is a point in saying letting 100,000 Syrians in without vetting has caused some issues. However living in Cologne atm I can assure everybody that a life without feeling threatened is still possible . But the perception of "threat" differs and some feel a little uncomfortable with all these guys around - especially young women. You can't blame them and can't ignore them.

It was a political mistake by Merkel not more - not less. She is not responsible for European genocide or anything around these lines.

 

[dunover]

OK, I'll be careful here as I've been called out by Admin earlier for my OP as you all saw. All I can say is 100% in agreement with Lockinlove and I am heartened so many share similar sentiments to myself. The 'Paradox of Liberals' is what I term it, their total inability to see that their blind misjudged thinking is the very thing that one day will end their beliefs and freedoms forever. I should laugh at them really but can't because the reality is too dreadful.

Merkel isn't responsible for genocide, nobody here has said that as far as I can see. Rapes, sexual assaults, crime, intimidation and imported terrorism yes, but not genocide - as far as that goes she's just sown the seeds for it.

As for feeling ashamed of my viewpoint, just the opposite. I can see what's coming as many of you can, I suspect even the lib-left lot know this can only end badly.

Oh, and one more thing - in the 18 months since Madmerkel introduced Germany to the benefits of 1 million African/Middle Eastern migrants, the population of the countries they left has increased by 2.5 millions. Makes sense, doesn't it? It's really made a difference, right?

 

[syntynyt]

looking forward for 2017 compilation of horrific events caused by mostly thanks to people ignorance and then politics.

 

[Mouche12]

My final question would be, how many deaths have been caused by any right extremist group and how many have been caused by radical islamic groups and /or terrorists over the past let's say 10 years.
Both groups preach hate and see violence as a valid act toward fellow human beings.

I already gave an answer as to the percentage of terrorist attacks by radical islamic groups: in the US it is around 6% since 1980 - and this is according to the FBI. For an overview of all deaths caused see

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. What sticks out is the number of 32,658 deaths caused by terrorist attacks in 2014 (an 80% increase on the previous year) with Iraq, Afghanistan and Nigeria bearing the brunt of deaths.

As I had mentioned before: most deaths were among Muslims...