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Discussion about Jewish role in world finances

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West, have we met..do I know you...I think we both graduated from the same conspiratorial school...which IMO is a good thing, welcome my brother...LOL...:thumbsup:

I started learning of a different view of the world back in the early 1990s. Since then I've learned about the Masons, Illuminati, Jesuits, the founding of the Catholic Church, the founding of the United States ("Rulers of Evil" by F. Tupper Saussy), and recently Zionism and Judaism (gentiles pretending to be Jews), among other things. But I'm not a believer in reptilian beings amongst us!:D
 
I started learning of a different view of the world back in the early 1990s. Since then I've learned about the Masons, Illuminati, Jesuits, the founding of the Catholic Church, the founding of the United States ("Rulers of Evil" by F. Tupper Saussy), and recently Zionism and Judaism (gentiles pretending to be Jews), among other things. But I'm not a believer in reptilian beings amongst us!:D
:confused: Are you referring to the MESSianic Jews/Jews For Jesus or all Jews?
 
Naerly all Jews today derived from the Khazarians who converted to Judaism around 700-800 AD. They are not from the Hebrews of Biblical times when nearly all of them were killed by the Romans in 70 AD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Westland Bowl
I started learning of a different view of the world back in the early 1990s. Since then I've learned about the Masons, Illuminati, Jesuits, the founding of the Catholic Church, the founding of the United States ("Rulers of Evil" by F. Tupper Saussy), and recently Zionism and Judaism (gentiles pretending to be Jews), among other things. But I'm not a believer in reptilian beings amongst us!
As for the accuracy (and possible intent) of your initial statement and subsequent answer to my question, I remain confused but I am not a religious scholar. I will seek clarification elsewhere. Thanks for your reply.
 
As for the accuracy (and possible intent) of your initial statement and subsequent answer to my question, I remain confused but I am not a religious scholar. I will seek clarification elsewhere. Thanks for your reply.

My initial statement was this: "Gentiles pretending to be Jews"

Your question was this: "Are you referring to the MESSianic Jews/Jews For Jesus or all Jews?"

My answer to your question: "Naerly [sic] all Jews today derived from the Khazarians who converted to Judaism around 700-800 AD. They are not from the Hebrews of Biblical times when nearly all of them were killed by the Romans in 70 AD."

So I'm saying that nearly all of the people called "Jews" today are actually gentiles, having derived from Khazarians who converted to Judaism. So basically they are milking the claim to being "God's Chosen People" for themselves and the Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose to support Israel in nearly everything Israel does, including the holocaust against the Palestinians. Anyway, the subject is one of those that require a lot more education about it than can be relayed through a forum. By the way, Wikipedia is owned by "Jews" so forget any objectivity there on the subject.
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My initial statement was this: "Gentiles pretending to be Jews"

Your question was this: "Are you referring to the MESSianic Jews/Jews For Jesus or all Jews?"

My answer to your question: "Naerly [sic] all Jews today derived from the Khazarians who converted to Judaism around 700-800 AD. They are not from the Hebrews of Biblical times when nearly all of them were killed by the Romans in 70 AD."

So I'm saying that nearly all of the people called "Jews" today are actually gentiles, having derived from Khazarians who converted to Judaism. So basically they are milking the claim to being "God's Chosen People" for themselves and the Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose to support Israel in nearly everything Israel does, including the holocaust against the Palestinians. Anyway, the subject is one of those that require a lot more education about it than can be relayed through a forum. By the way, Wikipedia is owned by "Jews" so forget any objectivity there on the subject.
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Mercy me.....WB, I like you, but that above statement (especially the bolded part), is offensive even to me, and I'm not Jewish. That's as much as I'm going to comment, as I really try to stay out of politics and religion.
 
Mercy me.....WB, I like you, but that above statement (especially the bolded part), is offensive even to me, and I'm not Jewish. That's as much as I'm going to comment, as I really try to stay out of politics and religion.

If you are going to say that this is offensive to you but not say why, then why tell me that this is offensive to you? Sometimes the truth hurts. What am I supposed to do with your statement? I knew some people may not like it but I hope they do their own research to see if this isn't so.
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It's offensive in more ways than one WB.

By using the phrase "milking the claims to be God's chosen people", you are showing your own personal disdain for people of the Jewish faith.

By using the phrase "Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose", you are implying that Jews are liars, and by nature deceitful.

I have read comments such as this before, and it doesn't matter whether it's against Jews, Muslims, whites or blacks, men or women...it all boils down to the same thing. Discrimination and pre-conceived notions of certain races, religions or gender. And I find it beyond distasteful. You may as well have come on here and told me that, in your opinion, the Holocaust is a hoax.

I have edited this to add that your comment that Wikipedia is owned by Jews, and therefore not to expect any objectivity...is also offensive. What you are saying is that someone who is Jewish cannot be objective regarding their own faith...or am I reading that wrong? You may as well say that because I am a woman, I can't judge another woman's actions objectively. Or is a lack of objectivity confined to people of the Jewish faith?

I just have to really wonder if you gave any thought at all to your post prior to posting it? Did you think at all that maybe we have some Jewish members here on the forum who might find it not only offensive, but discriminatory and inflammatory? I guess the biggest problem I have with the whole thing is that your own personal distaste for Jews is coming through loud and clear.

I refuse to get any further into this discussion...as I find ANY sort of discrimination turns my stomach. I teach my daughter to judge each person individually, regardless of skin colour, gender, religion, appearance, etc. That is the only true way to ever change this world...stop the hate for each other based on things that just don't matter.

I don't care what church someone prays in, what colour their skin is, or if they take a piss standing up or sitting down....it's all irrelevant. And discrimination of any sort drives me off the deep end. So I'm outta here.
 
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I honestly don't see the issue with the
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:)
LOL....just stay single though:D....I was reading some of the You Tube comments and I will post a pic of my mother later after a few hours of ZZZZZZ!.....considering that her father/my grandfather was an Austrian Jew who escaped from a Nazi concentration camp (on skies for 8 days with a chocolate bar) and her mother/my grandmother was a German Jew (got to Ellis Island a few years before the Holocaust), I bet you will never have a clue of the so called sterotype look......and yes I know the anti-semite will say she is just a gentile pretending to be a Jew:rolleyes:
 
It's offensive in more ways than one WB.

By using the phrase "milking the claims to be God's chosen people", you are showing your own personal disdain for people of the Jewish faith.

I do NOT have a personal or otherwise disdain for true Jewish people. I believe in Jesus Christ who came as a Jew. However, most of today's Jewish people did not descend from the Hebrews of the biblical times but are of Turkish background. I have friends who are Jews. But I do have disdain just as Jesus did for today's Pharisees, the Talmudic Jews. If you knew what the Talmud says, you'd be appalled and believe it is the worse of religions.

"By using the phrase "Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose", you are implying that Jews are liars, and by nature deceitful.

It was not my intention to paint ALL of the people who are considered Jews today to be involved in active participation in deceiving Evangelical Christians as obviously they are not. But I do believe that powerful Jewish families such as the Rothschilds actively supported a belief system called Dispensationalism that gained ground in most Christian churches during the 1800s and 1900s. The Rothschilds, among a number of other powerful Jewish families, used Dispensationalism to further the cause of Zionism and the forcing out from Israel many Palestinians. They further influence US public policy of favoritism toward Israel. Dispensationalism claims that God has a special plan of salvation for the Jews and that the Jews are still "God's chosen people" therefore they believe anything that Israel does is in God's plan. I used to be a Dispensationalist.

I have read comments such as this before, and it doesn't matter whether it's against Jews, Muslims, whites or blacks, men or women...it all boils down to the same thing. Discrimination and pre-conceived notions of certain races, religions or gender. And I find it beyond distasteful.

The Talmud is a grossly racist document. The Talmud treats gentiles as dogs and worthy to just take property from. Jesus Christ has broken down the middle wall of partition between Jews and Gentiles. His purpose was that through His death and resurrection He might make the two into one new man so making peace. The Talmudic Jews wants to keep that wall up.

"You may as well have come on here and told me that, in your opinion, the Holocaust is a hoax."

Don't jump into a conclusion that I believe the Holocaust was a hoax! What I do not believe is the 6 million figure; world population statistics of the time doesn't support such a drastic reduction in the world Jewish population. Furthermore I do believe that the Rothschilds perpetuated anti-semitism to further force Jews into Israel and support Zionism.

I have edited this to add that your comment that Wikipedia is owned by Jews, and therefore not to expect any objectivity...is also offensive. What you are saying is that someone who is Jewish cannot be objective regarding their own faith...or am I reading that wrong? You may as well say that because I am a woman, I can't judge another woman's actions objectively. Or is a lack of objectivity confined to people of the Jewish faith?

Do you judge people by what they say or by what they do? The link I provided shows how Wikipedia treated one Jewish organization who were against Zionism and here is an
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.

I want to repeat that I am not against ALL Jews. Not all Jews or even most of them sit around winking and nodding at each other planning world takeover. Many Jews are certainly objective and do not like what their leaders and the rich and powerful Jewish families are doing. Some Jews even speak out against this such as Br. Nathaniel at www.realjewnews.com

I just have to really wonder if you gave any thought at all to your post prior to posting it? Did you think at all that maybe we have some Jewish members here on the forum who might find it not only offensive, but discriminatory and inflammatory? I guess the biggest problem I have with the whole thing is that your own personal distaste for Jews is coming through loud and clear.

Yes, I thought about all of this before posting. I thought I might eventually be killed or persecuted for it from Talmudic Jews or those beholden to them. But I again say that I do not have anything against the Jews. You are thinking that I'm carrying a broad brush but I'm only pointing out what SOME of them do, have done, and their belief system (Talmudic) that causes the rest of us to suffer the consequences. The Centralize Banking system was invented by a Jewish family, the Rothschilds, to gain the riches of the world through monetary manipulations. They and other powerful Jewish families have no remorse or any care of severe harm they do to other people because they are the "Chosen Ones" and justified by the Talmud.

I refuse to get any further into this discussion...as I find ANY sort of discrimination turns my stomach. I teach my daughter to judge each person individually, regardless of skin colour, gender, religion, appearance, etc. That is the only true way to ever change this world...stop the hate for each other based on things that just don't matter.

That is commendable. I do believe in judging on a case by case basis too. But I think you would change some of your post if you knew what I know.

I don't care what church someone prays in, what colour their skin is, or if they take a piss standing up or sitting down....it's all irrelevant. And discrimination of any sort drives me off the deep end. So I'm outta here.

Well, I'm only pointing out the extreme racism of Talmudic Jews and you shoot the messenger. Okay.
 
It's offensive in more ways than one WB.

By using the phrase "milking the claims to be God's chosen people", you are showing your own personal disdain for people of the Jewish faith.

By using the phrase "Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose", you are implying that Jews are liars, and by nature deceitful.

I have read comments such as this before, and it doesn't matter whether it's against Jews, Muslims, whites or blacks, men or women...it all boils down to the same thing. Discrimination and pre-conceived notions of certain races, religions or gender. And I find it beyond distasteful. You may as well have come on here and told me that, in your opinion, the Holocaust is a hoax.

I have edited this to add that your comment that Wikipedia is owned by Jews, and therefore not to expect any objectivity...is also offensive. What you are saying is that someone who is Jewish cannot be objective regarding their own faith...or am I reading that wrong? You may as well say that because I am a woman, I can't judge another woman's actions objectively. Or is a lack of objectivity confined to people of the Jewish faith?

I just have to really wonder if you gave any thought at all to your post prior to posting it? Did you think at all that maybe we have some Jewish members here on the forum who might find it not only offensive, but discriminatory and inflammatory? I guess the biggest problem I have with the whole thing is that your own personal distaste for Jews is coming through loud and clear.

I refuse to get any further into this discussion...as I find ANY sort of discrimination turns my stomach. I teach my daughter to judge each person individually, regardless of skin colour, gender, religion, appearance, etc. That is the only true way to ever change this world...stop the hate for each other based on things that just don't matter.
I don't care what church someone prays in, what colour their skin is, or if they take a piss standing up or sitting down....it's all irrelevant. And discrimination of any sort drives me off the deep end. So I'm outta here.
if every parent taught their children this lesson, the world sure would be a much more peaceful place, great comment pina:thumbsup:............... laurie
 
I'm absolutely dumbfounded Westland Bowl, I really am. And I'm not going to say anything else, other than...I liked you. Past tense.
 
Westland Bowl said:
What I do not believe is the 6 million figure; world population statistics of the time doesn't support such a drastic reduction in the world Jewish population.
These are dangerous words. In fact, to make a statement like this is a "jail-time" offense in Germany/Austria.

Before I lock this thread on being too incendiary, I'd like to know where this is referenced. By the way, the extermination/work camps killed 11 million: six million Jews, and 5 million "others" (gypsies, homosexuals, POWs, political prisoners, etc.,)

And whether it was 6000 Jews or six million, it was still a catastrophic unacceptable inhumane way to treat our fellow man.
 
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Man....we've certainly seen some way-out concepts and theories put forward on Casinomeister these last few weeks, and this claim is up there with them, imo.

WW2 resulted in the deaths of scores of millions - by some assessments 20 million in the Soviet Union alone - and more after that during Stalin's reign of madness and suspicion. And that was just one part of the wholesale daily slaughter going on in almost every corner of the world at the time.

So I think that the claim that there were 6 million Jewish victims of the Holocaust has the ring of truth, given the long litany of brutality that characterised a cataclysmic period in world history.

And I totally endorse the comment: "And whether it was 6000 Jews or six million, it was still a catastrophic unacceptable inhumane way to treat our fellow man."
 
Well, I'm only pointing out the extreme racism of Talmudic Jews and you shoot the messenger. Okay.
HMMMM:rolleyes::rolleyes:............... AND YOUR ORIGINAL ANSWER WAS NEARLY "ALL" JEWS, NOT THE MESSIANIC JEWS OR JEWS FOR JESUS, (Per my question), WHO CLAIM TO BE JEWS BUT FOLLOW THE TEACHINGS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT CONTRARY TO JUDAISM WHICH FOLLOWS THE TEACHINGS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT WHETHER A REFORM JEW SUCH AS I, CONSERVATIVE JEW, OR AN ORTHODOX JEW.

I see the spin in your post that basically could be said of any group as there is good and bad among us all. That said, it may an/your opinion but it is one full of ANTI-SEMITIC PROPAGANDA including the links you provided......Is it offensive?, YES!!.....Is it dangerous?, YES!!.....Is it surprising?, NO, I have seen it my whole life even with my own eyes including the intended bombing and actual partial destruction of the The Temple I have been a lifelong member of in Nashville among other incidents.....In the last few weeks, ANTI-SEMITISM has reared itself particularily to extremes on the Net boards and I am not talking about the hate monger sites similar to the one's provided by the OP but more specifically, Yahoo finance, AOL et al.

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US financial crisis causes spike in online anti-Semitism:
Thu Oct 2, 5:01 PM ET


NEW YORK (AFP) - The US financial crisis has provoked an outpouring of anti-Semitism on the Internet, with Jews being blamed for the debacle on Wall Street, a monitoring group said on Thursday.

"The age-old canards about Jews and money are always just beneath the surface," said Abraham Foxman, the national director of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), which fights anti-semitism.

"As we witnessed after 9/11, whenever there is trouble or uncertainty in the economy or world events, Jews become the scapegoats and ugly anti-semitic canards are given new life."

The ADL said it had witnessed "a dramatic upsurge" in anti-Semitic statements on online discussion boards, and Internet service providers were struggling to delete them.

Blogs devoted to conspiracy theories as well as white supremacist and neo-Nazi websites have sought to exploit events on Wall Street and the subprime crisis to support their agendas, ADL said.

Referring to the demise of Wall Street bank Lehman Brothers, one poster on white supremacist website Stormfront wrote: "I would imagine the likelihood of the Fed etc bailing the company out depends largely to what degree it is Jewish owned," according to ADL.

Lehman Brothers went bust, while a number of other financial institutions from home loan providers Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae and insurer AIG were nationalized by the US government.


Am I in the minority? YES and I understand a very small one at that.

I also realize most are unfamiliar with the Holocaust and Judaism. Most have not been truly educated to the sad history of anti-Semitism and the Holocaust by those who actually survived those times. I will never forget though. It is not like most history where anything older than a few years is ancient and quickly forgotten. My conclusion in the past and even recently on this forum is that some are just ignorant to the offense of their insults. I do not label them anti-Semites although they may be just like the OP.

I said my piece and am at peace!! I have no further need to defend my religion and heritage on a forum message board nor the desire to give the hate mongers full of propaganda and conspiracy theories the attention they need and desire.

Shalom!
 
"It is not like most history where anything older than a few years is ancient and quickly forgotten."

The Holocaust definitely should never be allowed to be forgotten - it should stand as a reminder of how bestial supposedly civilised humanity can be under the right (wrong) circumstances and serve as a warning and deterrent against it ever being allowed to happen again.

Murder on an industrial scale, atrocious medical experiments, a vast organisation designed only to kill human beings etc - it should continue to horrify and repel us and future generations, along with similar appalling events such as the Rwanda and Serbian attempted genocides.
 
I grew up in Philadelphia with the exception of 15 years in IL (age 10-25) and I know first hand how people can be as well with religion. My mother was jewish (which in jewish faith makes me jewish) I was baptized Roman Catholic because my dad was Roman Catholic and back then your kids are the fathers' religion. I was influenced by both. Philadelphia and Arlington Hts IL where two different animals. While living my younger years in Phila I was witness to many jewish people with tattoos on their arms. I saw it first hand, besides that fact that my Great Aunt was raped by nazis during the holocaust and my Aunt (she was like a 2nd mother) told me a horrible story about this great aunt's son who had to hide in an oven (turned on low) so they he wouldnt be found in the house. I was very young when she told me this so I didnt have the maturity to ask questions and by the time I was old enough, I just never did bring it up.

When we moved to IL I got teased alot, people making fun of me because I was jewish. THere is a huge jewish population in IL (suburbs closer to the city) but where I lived...no temple in site. I was an outcast for sure and it didnt feel to good. I moved back to Phila as soon as I could.

I personally feel that the Jewish people who had to endure what they did and put up with alot of obstacles (like other races and religions often due) have my admiration for still being able to overcome, get education beyond the norm. Yes, alot of jewish people run alot of companies, Is it their fault that they sought out the most education they could to get them that far?

Nash, your last paragraph was brilliant and you are so right! I think I will try my best to heed that advice.
 
HMMMM:rolleyes::rolleyes:............... AND YOUR ORIGINAL ANSWER WAS NEARLY "ALL" JEWS, NOT THE MESSIANIC JEWS OR JEWS FOR JESUS, (Per my question), WHO CLAIM TO BE JEWS BUT FOLLOW THE TEACHINGS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT CONTRARY TO JUDAISM WHICH FOLLOWS THE TEACHINGS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT WHETHER A REFORM JEW SUCH AS I, CONSERVATIVE JEW, OR AN ORTHODOX JEW.

NashVegas, you continually are confused by what I'm trying to say. I said this: Naerly all Jews today derived from the Khazarians who converted to Judaism around 700-800 AD. They are not from the Hebrews of Biblical times when nearly all of them were killed by the Romans in 70 AD.


That is ALL I originally said. Later I mentioned the implications for that fact upon the Christian Church belief that today's Jews were directly derived from biblical Hebrews. I wasn't going to go further than that then Pinababy said I had personal disdain for Jews. It is an illogical leap of logic to say that I have personal disdain just because I mentioned the that the origin of today's Jews is of Khazarian ancestry. In any case, since I was on the subject I did mention about Talmudic Jews who follow the Talmud seriously. As a gentile, I would be less than human in their eyes.

I see the spin in your post that basically could be said of any group as there is good and bad among us all.

Spin?? SPIN?? I am trying to be straight forward as possible! Just because I do not like a certain segment of people as the Talmudic Jews doesn't mean you are free to extrapolate that to the entire race!! Talk about who's spinning!!

That said, it may an/your opinion but it is one full of ANTI-SEMITIC PROPAGANDA including the links you provided......Is it offensive?, YES!!.....Is it dangerous?, YES!!.....Is it surprising?, NO...

Pointing out the fact of the Khazarian origins of modern-day Jews isn't anti-semitic! It's the truth! What the hell!:what:

I have seen it my whole life even with my own eyes including the intended bombing and actual partial destruction of the The Temple I have been a lifelong member of in Nashville among other incidents.....

Well, I do feel for you there as there are indeed many people of hate in this world. I personally have been in fights and teased because of my hearing aid and deafness. But I do not like the implications that seems to say that my belief in the Khazarish origins of today's Jews somehow translate into bombing and stuff.

In the last few weeks, ANTI-SEMITISM has reared itself particularily to extremes on the Net boards and I am not talking about the hate monger sites similar to the one's provided by the OP but more specifically, Yahoo finance, AOL et al.

Again, see my previous answer.

Am I in the minority? YES and I understand a very small one at that. I also realize most are unfamiliar with the Holocaust and Judaism. Most have not been truly educated to the sad history of anti-Semitism and the Holocaust by those who actually survived those times. I will never forget though. It is not like most history where anything older than a few years is ancient and quickly forgotten. My conclusion in the past and even recently on this forum is that some are just ignorant to the offense of their insults. I do not label them anti-Semites although they may be just like the OP.

My statements regarding Khazarian Jewish origins and Talmudic Jews does not have anything to do with Holocaust denial or even how many died in concentration camps.

I said my piece and am at peace!! I have no further need to defend my religion and heritage on a forum message board nor the desire to give the hate mongers full of propaganda and conspiracy theories the attention they need and desire.

Shalom!

I believe there is too much reactionary responses and profound jumping into conclusions to my postings on this subject. The impact of realizing that modern-day Jews derived from the Khazars who converted to Judaism around 799-800 AD would be huge upon today's Christian Church and it's over-reaching support for Israel and Zionism. I can't ignore that.
 
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Westland Bowl Quote (Followed By All Westland Bowl Quotes'):"NashVegas, you continually are confused by what I'm trying to say."

1."Since then I've learned about the.......and recently Zionism and Judaism (gentiles pretending to be Jews), among other things."

2."So I'm saying that nearly all of the people called "Jews" today are actually gentiles,"

3."So basically they are milking the claim to being "God's Chosen People" for themselves and the Evangelical Christians are being deceived on purpose to support Israel in nearly everything Israel does, including the holocaust against the Palestinians."

4."By the way, Wikipedia is owned by "Jews" so forget any objectivity there on the subject."

5."......the Talmudic Jews. If you knew what the Talmud says, you'd be appalled and believe it is the worse of religions."

6."But I do believe that powerful Jewish families such as the Rothschilds actively supported a belief system called Dispensationalism that gained ground in most Christian churches during the 1800s and 1900s. The Rothschilds, among a number of other powerful Jewish families, used Dispensationalism to further the cause of Zionism and the forcing out from Israel many Palestinians. They further influence US public policy of favoritism toward Israel. Dispensationalism claims that God has a special plan of salvation for the Jews and that the Jews are still "God's chosen people" therefore they believe anything that Israel does is in God's plan. I used to be a Dispensationalist."

7."The Talmud is a grossly racist document. The Talmud treats gentiles as dogs and worthy to just take property from."

8."What I do not believe is the 6 million figure; world population statistics of the time doesn't support such a drastic reduction in the world Jewish population."

9."Not all Jews or even most of them sit around winking and nodding at each other planning world takeover."

10."You are thinking that I'm carrying a broad brush but I'm only pointing out what SOME of them do, have done, and their belief system (Talmudic) that causes the rest of us to suffer the consequences."

11."They and other powerful Jewish families have no remorse or any care of severe harm they do to other people because they are the "Chosen Ones" and justified by the Talmud."

________________________!!
 
This has nothing to do with or why anyone quoted this statement , Its just an observation I want to share about "chosen ones", again im taking the longer road to show you the exposure I had.

This isnt the first time Ive heard this statement about jews being the chosen ones but what really confuses me is that my mom's side were practicing jews (I remember having fights with my aunt when i wanted a bagle during holiday) and she changed dishes and not only belonged to temple (Bnai Brith) but also worked full time as their nursery school teacher for 25 years and I even worked one year when I lived with her.

I have NEVER ever heard the words "chosen ones" being used while talking about this religion or overhearing conversations at gatherings or at the temple. My family explained lots of stuff but never used that term. Now, my old boss was a witness and he used that term but I never heard it growing up
 
Westland Bowl Quote (Followed By All Westland Bowl Quotes'):"NashVegas, you continually are confused by what I'm trying to say."

^^NashVegas, basically you are proving my point. You are thinking that because I have disdain for Talmudic Jews (as they first have toward gentiles) that I hate all Jews. Even hate is too strong a word. Some of those quotes of mine are applicable only toward Talmudic Jews and powerful Jewish families who operate on Talmudic principles to the world's detriment. But it appears to me that you are applying my quotes to all Jews. Are you a follower of the Talmud yourself?
 
.....This isnt the first time Ive heard this statement about jews being the chosen ones......I have NEVER ever heard the words "chosen ones" being used while talking about this religion or overhearing conversations at gatherings or at the temple. My family explained lots of stuff but never used that term. Now, my old boss was a witness and he used that term but I never heard it growing up

Babs, throughout the Evangelical Christian churches, they believe that the people called Jews today are directly descended from the Hebrews of our Bible. They believe that today's Jews still are "God's Chosen People" and that the land of Israel belongs to the Jews and no one else. If the Jews didn't occupy the land of Israel, then Bible prophecy will not happen. They also believe that "whoever blesses Israel, God will bless and whoever curses Israel, God will curse" hence these Christians currently influence US government policy toward Israel and turning a blind eye to the sufferings of Palestinians and other Arabs.

But the Hebrews of Israel for hundreds of years, leading up to the time of Christ, did not follow God. Hence, Jesus declared to Israel, "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, but you were not willing! See! Your house is left to you desolate; and assuredly, I say to you, you shall not see Me until the time comes when you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the LORD!'" Later, when Jesus was crucified, the veil in the Temple was ripped signifying the end of God's special relationship with the Jews. The old Jewish religious system ended right then. God later sent judgment against Israel in 70 AD. But now salvation comes through Jesus Christ rather than the old animal sacrificial system. The Jews were no longer "God's Chosen People" but it was through the Jews that begat salvation for the world through Jesus Christ.
 
this is way to deep for me, i have always been told in church, that we are all gods children, where ever and how ever and whom ever we want to call our almighty, one question for you westland, as i know you to be a christian from what i have read in other posts, are you saved? in this day and time it would do the world good to see us bring our children up to respect others religions instead of what happened eons ago, have your children read "the diary of anne frank" when they are old enough to understand right and wrong, it was required reading when i was in the 6th grade and it had a deep affect on me as a young christian..........."love thy neighbor as thy love thy self"...........................laurie...................sorry for the somewhat derail.................
 
this is way to deep for me, i have always been told in church, that we are all gods children, where ever and how ever and whom ever we want to call our almighty,.....

It is through salvation in Jesus Christ that we become God's children. Jesus said that no one can come to the Father, the Almighty, but only through Him, referring to himself. This applies to all races, Jews and Gentiles alike.

one question for you westland, as i know you to be a christian from what i have read in other posts, are you saved?

Yes, I am.

....in this day and time it would do the world good to see us bring our children up to respect others religions instead of what happened eons ago,....

Don't get me wrong....In real life, I'm socially respectful toward other people regardless of their religion. But if I was asked point blank if Judaism, Hinduism, Taoism, Buddism, or any other religion besides belief in Jesus Christ as Saviour is a way to God, then I would tell them no because Jesus Christ said He was the way to the truth and eternal life.

...have your children read "the diary of anne frank" when they are old enough to understand right and wrong, it was required reading when i was in the 6th grade and it had a deep affect on me as a young christian..........."love thy neighbor as thy love thy self"...........................laurie...................sorry for the somewhat derail.................

Well, like I said in other posts, the Khazar origin of today's Jews and the Talmud issues that I brought up has nothing to do with the belief in the Holocaust. It happened and it was real. I just happen to doubt the 6 million figure and that it couldn't be more than 1.5 million. A 6 million figure would had wiped out the entire Jewish population in Europe twice. But like Bryan said, whether it is 6,000 or 6 million, it is a horror nonetheless. But the Holocaust shouldn't be held as Carte Blache to not say anything negative on Jewish concerns. Thanks for your comments.
 
SO where do you think everyone else goes when they die? Are you trying to say (write) that you "feel" this statement Im about to write is true ?

A Christian who has murdered people because of their faith (ie hitler) will go to heaven and see the light but a non christian who lives a healthy, loving and non judgemental life will not because they are not christian?

To tell you the truth, I believe all religions are man made because most human beings like the idea of a higher power existing so they have justification for the decisions they make. If people don't have a reason for something good then they might not be as nice in life. I also believe that people with no morals at all in life that commit crimes throughout their lives and are mean spirited know this to be true in their eyes because they fear noone. When you have someone or something to fear you usually live a pretty moral existance (not perfect, noone is) but more morally.

I hope that made sense, it did in my head.
 
SO where do you think everyone else goes when they die? Are you trying to say (write) that you "feel" this statement Im about to write is true ?

A Christian who has murdered people because of their faith (ie hitler) will go to heaven and see the light but a non christian who lives a healthy, loving and non judgemental life will not because they are not christian?

I've never heard of Hitler being a Christian and he certainly did not live in accordance with Christian faith.

If you believe in Jesus Christ and His words, people who do not believe in Him will not see the "light." Christians believe the Bible is God's Word to mankind and shows God's terms of reconciliation with Him. Acceptance of eternal life with God is open to all peoples who accept Jesus Christ. Those who do not are condemned into darkness and hell.

To tell you the truth, I believe all religions are man made because most human beings like the idea of a higher power existing so they have justification for the decisions they make. If people don't have a reason for something good then they might not be as nice in life. I also believe that people with no morals at all in life that commit crimes throughout their lives and are mean spirited know this to be true in their eyes because they fear noone. When you have someone or something to fear you usually live a pretty moral existance (not perfect, noone is) but more morally.

I hope that made sense, it did in my head.

Well, I do believe God exists and He has given His Word to mankind in the Bible. Everything else is certainly man-made. There are many ways to be deceived and distracted from the True Way and the way to God is narrow.
 
I've never heard of Hitler being a Christian and he certainly did not live in accordance with Christian faith.

If you believe in Jesus Christ and His words, people who do not believe in Him will not see the "light." Christians believe the Bible is God's Word to mankind and shows God's terms of reconciliation with Him. Acceptance of eternal life with God is open to all peoples who accept Jesus Christ. Those who do not are condemned into darkness and hell.


Well, I do believe God exists and He has given His Word to mankind in the Bible. Everything else is certainly man-made. There are many ways to be deceived and distracted from the True Way and the way to God is narrow.
the christian faith teaches us not to judge but to go out and testify on our savior, jesus christ's behalf, it is up to those who want to see the eternal light and have eternity with our father, our god is a loving god, a forgiving father, i know im saved and where my place will be in the after life, that is what i believe, not what everyone SHOULD believe, me personally, faith comes to you blindly and i mean this as no disrespect against another christian but you have some hate in your heart and you cant reach others and do god's work in this manner and path that you have taken, i disagree with the part i bolded in your post, strongly......... laurie
 
Just my two cents here...:)

The only unpardonable sin is to reject God's love by rejecting Jesus-Yeshua, the promised Messiah, who lovingly and willingly died for our sins...

The Bible Warns There Is No Other Way Into Heaven other than thru believing in Christ Jesus himself...no ifs, ands or buts about it !!

That is if you believe what Jesus said in the Bible...:)
 
Originally Posted by Westland Bowl:
I've never heard of Hitler being a Christian and he certainly did not live in accordance with Christian faith.

If you believe in Jesus Christ and His words, people who do not believe in Him will not see the "light." Christians believe the Bible is God's Word to mankind and shows God's terms of reconciliation with Him. Acceptance of eternal life with God is open to all peoples who accept Jesus Christ. Those who do not are condemned into darkness and hell.

.........i mean this as no disrespect against another christian but you have some hate in your heart and you cant reach others and do god's work in this manner and path that you have taken, i disagree with the part i bolded in your post, strongly......... laurie

Laurie, it is Jesus who said that about those who reject His salvation, not me. There are a number of references of hell in the Bible, such as "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burn with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." (Revelation 21:8) It is God who does the judging of the eternal fate of the unbeliever.
 
Do you know what really disturbs me the most? that you cannot just speak the way I am, from your heart. You seem to be quoting the heck out of me with scriptures and book page lines

Can you not make your point in your own words? I mean no disrespect either but it bothers me that you cannot have a debate unless you use someone else' words WB
 
Westlandbowl, this whole thread is really hurting me.I befriended you as I always had a soft spot for you re: the Cipher thread.(I have been lurking for years).

Please just drop the whole discussion. I know that everybody has a right to their own opinion, but sometimes their opinions are hatefull and hurtfull to others.

This is one of the times to just let it go:sob:
 
Do you know what really disturbs me the most? that you cannot just speak the way I am, from your heart. You seem to be quoting the heck out of me with scriptures and book page lines

Can you not make your point in your own words? I mean no disrespect either but it bothers me that you cannot have a debate unless you use someone else' words WB

As a Christian, who is the ultimate authority? God is. So I quote what God says in the Bible to convince you that these are God's ideas, not mine. I'm surprised you are not seeing that.

In any case, what do you mean by book page lines?
 
Do you know what really disturbs me the most? that you cannot just speak the way I am, from your heart. You seem to be quoting the heck out of me with scriptures and book page lines

Can you not make your point in your own words? I mean no disrespect either but it bothers me that you cannot have a debate unless you use someone else' words WB


Please correct me if I am wrong Westland Bowl....

Babs, my thoughts are Westland Bowl started studying about religion and reads A LOT about all religions, so that's why the words don't come from his "heart" he is typing what he remembers from what he has read, or looks up.


I do have a question/s for you Westland Bowl....Why is it that your beliefs are supposed to be the only belief that is right? You are not sure, no one is sure. Faith is supposed to be believing in what you believe in, BUT there are many many faiths, not only one is the right one.


The right belief or faith is the one that any individual picks for him or herself.
 
Westlandbowl, this whole thread is really hurting me.I befriended you as I always had a soft spot for you re: the Cipher thread.(I have been lurking for years).

Please just drop the whole discussion. I know that everybody has a right to their own opinion, but sometimes their opinions are hatefull and hurtfull to others.

This is one of the times to just let it go:sob:

I'm sorry this is hurting you, but I'm puzzled as to how it is hurting you personally. As long as people keep getting the wrong impression that I have hate in my heart and that God doesn't judge people, well, I keep on posting to correct them. The only people that would be offended by my postings or beliefs would be Jews who take seriously the Talmud. But the truth is what it is. Note that no one has challenged the claim here of Khazarian origins of today's Jews.
 
......I do have a question/s for you Westland Bowl....Why is it that your beliefs are supposed to be the only belief that is right? You are not sure, no one is sure. Faith is supposed to be believing in what you believe in, BUT there are many many faiths, not only one is the right one. The right belief or faith is the one that any individual picks for him or herself.

There is no way to "prove" that Christianity is the right and only way. Man's mind cannot comprehend the grandness and compassion that God has to give His Son to die on our behalf for our sins. In order to know that the right way to God is through Jesus Christ, God gives the gift of faith to whom He chooses in order for that person to understand God's salvation plan. There is a bit of pre-destination and free-will playing together there (and no, I don't want to get into that discussion right now! :) )
 
The right belief or faith is the one that any individual picks for him or herself.
Well said:thumbsup:

Next, excluding the couple obvious propagandists, non-tolerants, etc. and their agenda's, the following is simply to aid others that may be interested and possibly not be aware of the Basic Differences Between Judaism and Christianity (The Old Testament and The New Testament, Essentially). Then see Just Play's wise quote above again!!

"The Differences Between Judaism and Christianity
Introduction"

"There are many substantial and vital distinctions between Judaism and Christianity. Of course, there are many similarities as well, primarily because Christianity emerged from Judaism. However, the emergence was not a direct line. Christianity broke from Judaism, forming a new religion, so it is misleading, however comfortable the thought might be, to believe that the two religions are essentially the same, or to see Christianity as the natural continuation of Judaism.

The differences between the two religions will be explored below. As a preface, it is useful to repeat Judaism's central belief that the people of all religions are children of God, and therefore equal before God. All people have God's love, mercy, and help. In particular, Judaism does not require that a person convert to Judaism in order to achieve salvation. The only requirement for that, as understood by Jews, is to be ethical. While Judaism accepts the worth of all people regardless of religion, it also allows people who are not Jewish but who voluntarily wish to join the Jewish people to do so.

It is not really possible to summarize either Judaism or Christianity fairly in brevity, so further study is encouraged. Also, the formal positions of Judaism on various issues should be discussed with a rabbi. The beliefs described in this section are mainstream Christian and Jewish beliefs. Individual Christian and Jewish thinkers may differ, sometimes considerably, with the positions described here. It is nonetheless useful, even with all these limitations, to consider the differences. One book that is excellent on this subject is Judaism and Christianity: the Differences, by Trude Weiss-Rosmarin (Jonathan David, 1981).

God
Judaism insists on a notion of monotheism, the idea that there is One God. As Judaism understands this idea, God cannot be made up of parts, even if those parts are mysteriously united. The Christian notion of the Trinity is that God is made up of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Such a view, even if called monotheistic because the three parts are, by divine mystery, only one God, is incompatible with the Jewish view that such a division is possible. The Jewish idea is that God is one. This idea allows for God's unity and uniqueness as a creative force. Thus, for Jews, God is the creator of all that we like and all that we don't. There is no evil force with an ability to create equal to God's. Judaism sees Christianity's trinitarianism as a weakening of the idea of God's oneness. Jews don't have a set group of beliefs about the nature of God; therefore, there is considerable, and approved, debate within Judaism about God. However, all mainstream Jewish groups reject the idea of God having three parts. Indeed, many Jews see an attempt to divide God as a partial throwback, or compromise with, the pagan conception of many gods.

The Jewish View of Jesus
To Christians, the central tenet of their religion is the belief that Jesus is the Son of God, part of the trinity, the savior of souls who is the messiah. He is God's revelation through flesh. Jesus was, in Christian terms, God incarnate, God in the flesh who came to Earth to absorb the sins of humans and therefore free from sin those who accepted his divinity.

To Jews, whatever wonderful teacher and storyteller Jesus may have been, he was just a human, not the son of God (except in the metaphorical sense in which all humans are children of God). In the Jewish view, Jesus cannot save souls; only God can. Jesus did not, in the Jewish view, rise from the dead.

He also did not absorb the sins of people. For Jews, sins are removed not by Jesus' atonement but by seeking forgiveness. Jews seek forgiveness from God for sins against God and from other people (not just God) for sins against those people. Seeking forgiveness requires a sincere sense of repenting but also seeking directly to redress the wrong done to someone. Sins are partially removed through prayer, which replaced animal sacrifice as a way of relieving sins. They are also removed by correcting errors against others.

Jesus, for Christians, replaced Jewish law. For traditional Jews, the commandments (mitzvot) and Jewish law (Halacha) are still binding.

Jesus is not seen as the messiah. In the Jewish view, the messiah is a human being who will usher in an era of peace. We can tell the messiah by looking at the world and seeing if it is at peace. From the Jewish view, this clearly did not happen when Jesus was on Earth or anytime after his death.

Jews vary about what they think of Jesus as a man. Some respect him as an ethical teacher who accepted Jewish law, as someone who didn't even see himself as the messiah, who didn't want to start a new religion at all. Rather, Jesus is seen by these Jews as someone who challenged the religious authorities of his day for their practices. In this view, he meant to improve Judaism according to his own understanding--- not to break with it. Whatever the Jewish response is, one point is crucial. No one who is Jewish, no born Jew and no one who converts to Judaism, can believe in Jesus as the literal son of God or as the messiah. For the Jewish people, there is no God but God.

Free Will and Original Sin
Judaism does not accept the notion of original sin, the idea that people are bad from birth and cannot remove sin by themselves but need an act of grace provided by the sacrificial death of Jesus as atonement for all of humanity's sins. For Christians, there are no other forms of salvation other than through Jesus.

In contrast, the Jewish view is that humans are not born naturally good or naturally bad. They have both a good and a bad inclination in them, but they have the free moral will to choose the good and this free moral will can be more powerful than the evil inclination. Indeed, Jewish ethics requires the idea that humans decide for themselves how to act. This is so because temptation, and with it the possibility of sin, allows people to choose good and thus have moral merit. The Jewish view is not that humans are helpless in the face of moral error.

Death, Heaven, and Hell
In general, Jewish thinkers have focused on the ways to lead a good life on Earth and improve this world, leaving concerns about death and beyond until the appropriate time. Judaism has stressed the natural fact of death and its role in giving life meaning. Of course, issues of death are inevitably important. The fear of death, concern about the fate of our own soul and those of our loved ones, ethical concerns that some people die unfairly, all these and many other issues are discussed in Jewish literature. Since God is seen as ultimately just, the seeming injustice on Earth has propelled many traditional Jewish thinkers into seeing the afterlife as a way to reflect the ultimate justice of human existence.

Traditional thinkers considered how individuals would be rewarded or punished after their deaths. There are a few rare descriptions of life after death. Traditionalists gave the name Gehenna to the place where souls were punished. Many Jewish thinkers noted that since, essentially, God is filled with mercy and love, punishment is not to be considered to be eternal. There are, similarly, many varying conceptions of paradise, such as that paradise is the place where we finally understand the true concept of God. It is also possible that there is no separate Heaven and Hell, only lesser or greater distance from God after death. In addition, punishment might be self-determined on the basis of suffering in kind the suffering the person brought about. That is, Judaism doesn't have a clear sense of Heaven and Hell, with different places in Hell for different punishments. Rather, the idea is that God uses the afterlife to provide ultimate justice and for the wicked to seek some sort of final redemption.

Judaism does not believe people who are Gentiles will automatically go to Hell or that Jews will automatically go to Heaven on their basis of their belonging to the faith. Rather, individual ethical behavior is what is most important. Many traditional Jews believe that Judaism provides the best guide to leading such an ethical life."

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That was beautiful Garry. After reading everything you wrote I take after my mothers' religion more than I thought. I knew about believing that Jesus was just a human and just the son of God in the "all people are the children of God" sense and I too believe that as well. The rest was very well put and interesting. I loved how you gave us "A" view to look at instead "trying to convince people to see the right way"

Westland, When I said "from lines in a book page" I meant word for word instead of using your own. I just said it that way because sometimes I lose my words when Im writing.

Anayway, Ive had enough, I don't feel the need to be distracted by something I dont believe in. I know who I am and know what I am and I am confident that the life I am leading is a good one and in the end, well, lets just say Ill find out when I get there. No need to worry about something until it happens as long as your happy with the choices you make in life
 
Just my two cents here...:)

The only unpardonable sin is to reject God's love by rejecting Jesus-Yeshua, the promised Messiah, who lovingly and willingly died for our sins...

The Bible Warns There Is No Other Way Into Heaven other than thru believing in Christ Jesus himself...no ifs, ands or buts about it !!

That is if you believe what Jesus said in the Bible...:)

Well said:thumbsup:

Next, excluding the couple obvious propagandists, non-tolerants, etc. and their agenda's,

Nash/Garry WTF ?? Why be so gawd damn cryptic man...you got something to say then spit it out...and for the record you can clearly see in my above post that I have highlighted in large red letters that I said "That is if you believe what Jesus said in the Bible"

It is purdy damn clear that you don't believe anything at all that Jesus said in the New Testament after reading your post twice and that is absolutely cool too...you know, to each his own...free will and all that bullshit you know...it ain't no sweat off my ass what you want to believe, you know what I mean...but to call me a gawd damn propagandist with some kind of agenda...that's just going too gawd damn far man...WTF ??

There is not anyone else that has posted anything here that you could possibly be insinuating as a propagandist other than myself or Westlandbowl...I've never stooped to that low level regarding any of your posts, no matter whether I disagreed with them or not !!

Seems as though we are all adults here you could also be capable of carrying on a decent conversation/debate without having to stoop to this level man...
 
I was raised a Roman Catholic and for what it's worth, everything i see here in this post is not only belittling people it's judgemental, we all believe in a God and i'm proud that i was rasied catholic, when i was young it was put so simple to us coz being a kid you have to know right from wrong....we'd go to HELL if we committed a crime.....HEAVEN if you were good with helping people and if you committed a SIN you went to church to confession looking for forgiveness.

What people are doing in the world today .....they don't know what religon is cause if they did then crimes would not happen and as for judging others by they're religon is on-called for....without our beliefs "who are we" and what would we have become????.

Everyone has opinions and that's a good thing.....but NO ONE has the right to judge us as HUMAN beings.


I rest my case

Cat
 

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