Casino Complaint Dendera Casino (Rival) Shady Bonus Rules/buisness practice

[casinokoenig]

HI all,

i ve signed up and deposited at Dendera Casino.
I deposited around 2.7k € in total claiming multiple bonuses that had Max. payout and SICK wagering requirements .

Well it was also when i claimed another 500 % bonus w. 5 x Bonus Max cashout and i believe 40 x D+B wagering requirements but blackjack and VP allowed alltough w. table limits.

Oh and also Blackjack + some otther games only counted 1/3 rd of the wager towards the wagering requirements! Imho quite a difficult thing to book a win on this.

So i managed to wager the ~26000 € for my 100 € deposit and my balance was ~ 1300 €.
As mentioned my deposits (loss) at this casino was allready around 2.7 k € till that time.

I requested a withdrawal for 4xx € and left 9xx to play with on my account , i received the 4xx € withdrawal but then received this email :

Hi,

Your withdrawal has been cancelled as you are in breach of promotional
terms:

1. You must play at least 20 different games when playing with a
bonus.
2. You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a
single game.

Regards,
Dendera Security


When i checked my account after that the balance was 0.00 !

In Rival Casinos you get to read the terms for a specific bonus when accepting it in the cashier - no word about that 20 % rule , i still did not find that rule written anywhere and also the 20 different games rule is ... well .. ridiculous ?

To my gameplay - i played at least 10 different games (i believe it was more) and played different table games and also made bigger bets all the time , i dont even know wich of the games i ve wagered more than 20 % on and therefore broke the rules (!) .



So in my opinion this behavior is ultrasneaky and i sure wont play/recommend at Dendera anymore !


I ve used my PABs unfortunatley and i dont know if Dendera is rouged or anything - i just wanted to share this with you fellow gamblers ...

 

[casinokoenig]

oh maybe a Mod could change the typo in the title - obv. i meant "business" not buisness ...

 

[KasinoKing]

Sounds a bit wrong to me.
If you could PM me your casino Log-In name, I will ask my contact at the casino to look into this for you.
(Might take a day or two - I'm on holiday at the moment).

KK

 

[labeled]

Crap for sure, but there on their terms & conditions page, so it'd be a wasted PAB anyway, I think.

Along with this, which I've never seen before & I prefer Rivals: NB: Should you withdraw winnings from a Free Chip and then reverse those winnings, the subsequent winnings will be capped at $ / € / £ 100. This includes taking up another promotion from the winnings of the free chip.

What's interesting is that I've been trying to figure out if Tropica was linked to Dendera (Dendera's site used to have Tropica's contact info on it, but that could've just been from a sloppy copy/paste job from the Dendera designer), and it looks pretty conclusive - that same snippet about reversed free chips is there too.

Really, REALLY sh*t terms, imo.

ETA: Tropica has a rep, maybe you can contact him and confirm a connection w/Dendera? Then maybe he can help you out?

 

[Nifty29]

If that term about 20 different games is true, then these guys need to be fully rogued immediately.

I'm surprised that you didn't stick to well respected and/or known safe casinos. You've been around long enough, and obviously had issues in the past, and Dendera IS in the rogue pit under "Not Recommended".

Maybe you need to reassess the way you select casinos, and whether the big bonuses are really worth it, especially if you're going to ignore the advice of CM and your fellow members. It's tough to have sympathy for people who take chances with where they play, especially when they don't bother to check the rogue pit first.

 

[casinokoenig]

Sounds a bit wrong to me.
If you could PM me your casino Log-In name, I will ask my contact at the casino to look into this for you.
(Might take a day or two - I'm on holiday at the moment).

KK

Pm Sent

 

[casinokoenig]

If that term about 20 different games is true, then these guys need to be fully rogued immediately.

I'm surprised that you didn't stick to well respected and/or known safe casinos. You've been around long enough, and obviously had issues in the past, and Dendera IS in the rogue pit under "Not Recommended".

Maybe you need to reassess the way you select casinos, and whether the big bonuses are really worth it, especially if you're going to ignore the advice of CM and your fellow members. It's tough to have sympathy for people who take chances with where they play, especially when they don't bother to check the rogue pit first.

Yes - i should have checked that - shame on me - i trusted in the "brand" Rival since my experience so far was OK with them...

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yes - i should have checked that - shame on me - i trusted in the "brand" Rival since my experience so far was OK with them...

.... and then you finally made the ridiculous WR and withdrew a decent win.

The 20% max bet rule is pretty common, and not just with Rival. The "20 games or more" rule is an odd one. Many players don't get around to playing that many different games, even when they are "playing properly" in terms of those elusive spirits of play. Many have their favourite games that they tend to stick to. Some bonus terms prohibit so many games it can be hard to find 10 different ones without finding an excluded one by mistake.

My experience with Rival is reading about the misfortunes of others, and it is enough to ensure I don't go near any of their casinos that run under their "white label" system. This reading also tells me that no Rival white label will actually admit to it, they will all claim to be independently operated.

If you played from the outset to "abuse" this bonus (not that any sane advantage player would given these terms), you would have ensured that just prior to your withdrawal, you would have taken a couple of minimum bet spins on 21 different slots just so that they didn't have a leg to stand on if they tried to wheel out this term.

Oddly enough, even they couldn't find this term until AFTER they had paid your first withdrawal, so only managed to grab the amount left behind.

There is only ONE Rival operator worth playing as far as I am concerned, the SlotoCash group, which has both Rival and RTG powered casinos. Tropica has an active rep here, but if they are connected to Dendera and this BS set of terms, it will be a step back for their credibility. I would hope that the connection is the usual one produced by how the Rival centralised system works, rather than the two actually being sister casinos.

 

[goloa]

Hi

Dendera had me my account closed, after I wanted to payout €2000

Then got a email:

Hi xxxx,

Your withdrawal has been reversed and voided as you breached 2 of our
promotional terms.

1. You wagered 100% of wagering requirements on 1 game. You need to
wager only 20% on 1 game when playing with a bonus.
2. You did not play 20 games when playing with the bonus.

Please see Dendera Online Casino Terms and Conditions

As a result, your promotion has been ended and winnings/losses
forfeited.

Regards,
Dendera Customer Support


Whyyy? My highest wager was 4€ and this is not even 10%
dont understand it

 

[Tirilej]

I so hate when I see winnings void because of these kind of bonusrules.
Dendera probably have these rules listen in their T&C's, but not in the promotion itself.

Did you only play just one game?
If so, then that is the reason for them to void your winnings.

Please next time chose a Rival casino that is more trustworthy like Slots Capital.

I feel for you I do, but probably there is not much anyone can do about it.

 

[goloa]

i played 7 or 8 games

i think even if I would have played 20 Games, would not have paid me, nevertheless.

 

[Tirilej]

Maybe they would and maybe not. It's clear though that they have invented that rule just to not have to pay anyone that's using a bonus.
Most people never play 20 games in one session, and never expect that kind of rule.

This casino should be rogued immediately if I had anything to say about it.

 

[rena35]

i played 7 or 8 games

i think even if I would have played 20 Games, would not have paid me, nevertheless.

i agree,seems like u cant win for losing at this place

 

[vinylweatherman]

Maybe they would and maybe not. It's clear though that they have invented that rule just to not have to pay anyone that's using a bonus.
Most people never play 20 games in one session, and never expect that kind of rule.

This casino should be rogued immediately if I had anything to say about it.

This kind of bullshit rule is why Rival continue to remain "not recommended". The rules quoted even contradict each other. If you can play up to 20% of the WR on a single game, this means you can complete 100% on 5. I also thought Rival had a decent WR tracking system, so you could not even violate this rule by accident as the WR would not progress further once you had done 20% on a single game.

There is also another contradiction. The OP was told 100% of the WR had been made on a single game, yet the OP claims to have played "7 or 8 games".

Since ALL these "white label" Rivals are ultimately run by Bonne Chance/Silverstone, they are ALL capable of pulling such a stunt with little fear of retribution. There have been many "good Rivals" that have suddenly gone bad, and I believe Dendera was once considered to be one of the better ones. For that matter, Tradition was once considered one of the few "class act" Rivals, then they did one hell of a "class act" on players which triggered a rapid meltdown and eventual bankruptcy.


The only way we can trust any Rival is if there is a proper system of redress for players when one suddenly goes bad.

Rival casinos pull this BS on a regular basis because many of their offers are "insane". A recent Rival offering seemed to suggest that for $30 one could play with $7000, and win $70,000. No set WR either, just the need to have enough to submit a minimum withdrawal for $70,000. This is a mere 10x starting balance, and although not easy to achieve, is nowhere near "impossible" either. Too many winners and the BS confiscation reasons will start flowing, or the Rival in question will go under.

 

[KasinoKing]

For that matter, Tradition was once considered one of the few "class act" Rivals, then they did one hell of a "class act" on players which triggered a rapid meltdown and eventual bankruptcy.

For the record, I don't think Tradition were ever considered a "Class Act" by anyone, except maybe themselves!

They first opened in September 2009 and within a few short months they were found to be shafting their affiliates by retrospectively changing their affy T&Cs. Then it was only in March 2010 that the "Cheating Blackjack Scandal" occurred and they shut down shortly after that.

KK

 

[vinylweatherman]

For the record, I don't think Tradition were ever considered a "Class Act" by anyone, except maybe themselves!

They first opened in September 2009 and within a few short months they were found to be shafting their affiliates by retrospectively changing their affy T&Cs. Then it was only in March 2010 that the "Cheating Blackjack Scandal" occurred and they shut down shortly after that.

KK

Affiliates may have seen it coming, but for players we had an active rep who seemed pretty open and honest. This gave them an undeserved reputation that only unravelled when they messed with the Blackjack in a most obvious and amateurish manner. This is why I can't trust Rival casinos that have this connection to Bonne Chance stated on their website, no matter how vigorously their rep insists they are better than the rest.

This is a shame for the genuinely good Rival, who may find it hard to be accepted as a high class casino.

Many players don't know much about the affy side, and wouldn't see the warning signs when it is the affiliates who are getting screwed first, and complaining about it.

On the other hand, players feel something is going badly wrong at a highly regarded brand, yet affiliates say there is not a major problem, just minor issues that can be put right.

Now, we have another active rep for another Rival casino, who also insists they should not be judged on the behaviour of the rest. We were bitten by the Tradition rep, so if this latest rep really IS working for a good Rival operation, they have to overcome players' fears that they are going to get bitten twice if they believe that this Rival casino can be entrusted with our deposits.

Yet again, Bryan has kicked the whole bunch to the kerb, saying he will not have Max waste his time attempting to get cooperation from any Bonne Chance Rival on a PAB, which means those who would cooperate will not get the chance to show this, and potential players will see this blanket policy as meaning that ALL of the Rivals are equally bad.

I have never tried Rival software, but would have done were it not for all this negativity which Rival themselves seem to have little enthusiasm for addressing.

 

[Tirilej]

Many players don't know much about the affy side, and wouldn't see the warning signs when it is the affiliates who are getting screwed first, and complaining about it.

On the other hand, players feel something is going badly wrong at a highly regarded brand, yet affiliates say there is not a major problem, just minor issues that can be put right.

These two points is really interesting because many players feel that the affiliates just want to make money on them. They really need to step up for the players to show that they do care.

This thread is a typical one where i would like those affiliates to put some pressure on this casino for their way of creating rules where the player just can't win.
If Dendera has these rules in their T&C's then I don't want to see them listed at any affiliates site.

1. You must play at least 20 different games when playing with a
bonus.
2. You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a
single game.

But that's my opinion. I'm just so tired to over and over again hear about people not getting paid, and about all these Rivals, especially new or rebranded that are not paying at all or are stalling for months.
Rival themselves should be ashamed for letting that happen!

 

[chuchu59]

If anything, the Rival brand has deteriorated further over the past year due to serious underfunding. In the past, I can honestly say that with a couple of exceptions(ThisisVegas) and others with John at the helm Rival casinos eventually pay their players. Now this eventuality seems to fade away and no longer can I state with confidence that players are likely to get paid. The games are original and many players like them but if there are problems with receiving payment players are advised to ditch this software for good until they solve out their finances. I am more and more inclined to think that Slotocash has seen the decline of Rival coming and decided to branch out to other software.

 

[sharon030161]

I just got the same run around with Dendera casino this evening about a free chip win. Same BS about the " you can't wager
more than 20% on 1 game" I have never heard of this rule to my knowledge.
I was told at first that since I won on a $5 free chip and made the playthrough requirements that they would put $25 in my account and count it as cash and that the max cashout would be $100. Their email stated: You can cashout at $100 using WIRE as a payment option. Kindly note
that wires under $250 incur a $50 handling fee. So I log in and instead of $25 there is $10 sitting there as a cash bonus not the $25. I went ahead and played it anyway because I figured they was up to something shady. I sent them a email stating:
Ok, so I went ahead and played the $10 that you put in my account so what is the max cashout on that?
I have my winnings up to $150 and some change. Their reply: You can cashout at $100 using WIRE as a payment option. Kindly note
that wires under $250 incur a $50 handling fee.
Then I got another email that said: Your balance has been voided as you breached the terms of the promotion
by wagering on 1 game only. When playing with free cash, you can't wager
more than 20% on 1 game. Are they on the rogue list here?
It has been a while since I have been here and seen this post and had to comment as I was going to start a thread about it.
Sorry for all your bad experience with these jerks. I now know that I am not alone.

 

[chuchu59]

I just got the same run around with Dendera casino this evening about a free chip win. Same BS about the " you can't wager
more than 20% on 1 game" I have never heard of this rule to my knowledge.
I was told at first that since I won on a $5 free chip and made the playthrough requirements that they would put $25 in my account and count it as cash and that the max cashout would be $100. Their email stated: You can cashout at $100 using WIRE as a payment option. Kindly note
that wires under $250 incur a $50 handling fee. So I log in and instead of $25 there is $10 sitting there as a cash bonus not the $25. I went ahead and played it anyway because I figured they was up to something shady. I sent them a email stating:
Ok, so I went ahead and played the $10 that you put in my account so what is the max cashout on that?
I have my winnings up to $150 and some change. Their reply: You can cashout at $100 using WIRE as a payment option. Kindly note
that wires under $250 incur a $50 handling fee.
Then I got another email that said: Your balance has been voided as you breached the terms of the promotion
by wagering on 1 game only. When playing with free cash, you can't wager
more than 20% on 1 game. Are they on the rogue list here?
It has been a while since I have been here and seen this post and had to comment as I was going to start a thread about it.
Sorry for all your bad experience with these jerks. I now know that I am not alone.

Well this is a Rival casino and even worse its Dendera which I would rate as a rogue. They try to shaft you over a hundred bucks so go figure what would happen if you won thousands. The 20% a game rule is ridiculous and even if you had played different slots they will then argue you played more than 20% on slots and void your win.

These types of casinos are a disgrace to the industry. I actually feel happy for the Canucks for not being able to have access to the casinos powered by this software.

 

[Balthazar]

"Legit Rival" huh? It's been proven that White Label = Bonne Chance and Bonne Chance = Rival themselves. Ever wondered why they would compete directly against their own "independent" customers? Or why they won't allow their "independent" customers to accept Canadian players?

What if MG, the software supplier, was caught red handed running a whole bunch of rogue MG casinos under a different name?

 

[Marie2473]

I think it is sad that they are tryi everyting to rip players off since i really enjoy the games and the software. These things makes me not wanna play though =(
20 games??? I never play 20 different slots since i have my favourites (maybe about 6-7 of them)
What if I just bet 1 cent on 15 slots - well guess that would be considered cheating =)

 

[Balthazar]

I think it is sad that they are tryi everyting to rip players off since i really enjoy the games and the software. These things makes me not wanna play though =(
20 games??? I never play 20 different slots since i have my favourites (maybe about 6-7 of them)
What if I just bet 1 cent on 15 slots - well guess that would be considered cheating =)

One have to conclude that their SOLE INTENTION to put such T&C is to eventually confiscate someone's winnings. Why would you force someone to play 20 different slots? Does it financially or mathematically make sense? Nope. Does it protect the casino in any way other than seizing a bunch of winnings? Nope.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Even funnier when it is a $10 chip. $10 barely contains 10 bets, so even playing one spin per slot could mean not meeting the 20 game requirement. It will also create a situation where players are more likely to play an excluded game just because they are searching around for 20 different games to play a couple of spins on. I am sure even ONE bet on an excluded game would cause winnings to be voided. Good job it was a free chip and $100, not a huge 4 or 5 figure win being confiscated.

 

[Tirilej]

Even funnier when it is a $10 chip. $10 barely contains 10 bets, so even playing one spin per slot could mean not meeting the 20 game requirement. It will also create a situation where players are more likely to play an excluded game just because they are searching around for 20 different games to play a couple of spins on. I am sure even ONE bet on an excluded game would cause winnings to be voided. Good job it was a free chip and $100, not a huge 4 or 5 figure win being confiscated.

The sad part is that they are marketing themselves well by giving out a lot of free chips. Most of them a lot bigger then $10.
If you want to continue getting those free chips you'll need to deposit, and when you finally win you won't be able to cash out, at least not if it's on a free chip.
I better go and take a look at all of their rules.
Did I mention I don't like this casino much?

 

[vinylweatherman]

"Legit Rival" huh? It's been proven that White Label = Bonne Chance and Bonne Chance = Rival themselves. Ever wondered why they would compete directly against their own "independent" customers? Or why they won't allow their "independent" customers to accept Canadian players?

What if MG, the software supplier, was caught red handed running a whole bunch of rogue MG casinos under a different name?

Apart from the "rogue" bit, they DID do this when they claimed to have licensed the games to a software house that didn't exist in order to have "clone" unbranded MGS casinos operate in the US market for a while. Operators told their US players they were having their accounts moved to a casino that was unbranded (no "powered by Microgaming" logos), that had a subset of the usual MGS games with "more to come". Of course "more" never came, as it relied on a software company that didn't exist to develop them MGS didn't actually run these cloned casinos though.

 

[Tirilej]

Is there someone that has an account at Dendera that can see if it says anything about having to play at least 20 games in their promotions?
That rules is not in their T&C's. I must say that there wasn't much in there at all.
The rule that is there is this: You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a single game.
That means that you need to jump around a lot never to go back to a winning game, in case your wagering amount isn't huge.

Also that stupid rule that even if you reverse a cashout from a free chip winning, your win will be captured at $100 max cashout.
That rule is even if you take a new bonus on the reversed amount, so you can never cash out more than $100.

.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Is there someone that has an account at Dendera that can see if it says anything about having to play at least 20 games in their promotions?
That rules is not in their T&C's. I must say that there wasn't much in there at all.
The rule that is there is this: You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a single game.
That means that you need to jump around a lot never to go back to a winning game, in case your wagering amount isn't huge.

Also that stupid rule that even if you reverse a cashout from a free chip winning, your win will be captured at $100 max cashout.
That rule is even if you take a new bonus on the reversed amount, so you can never cash out more than $100.

.

Perhaps they are making it up to confiscate winnings. Enforcing a term that does not even exist is a sure fire way to go fully into the rogue pit, where the very worst examples of Bonne Chance Rivals have found themselves.

 

[KasinoKing]

The rule that is there is this: You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a single game.
That means that you need to jump around a lot never to go back to a winning game, in case your wagering amount isn't huge.

Also that stupid rule that even if you reverse a cashout from a free chip winning, your win will be captured at $100 max cashout.
That rule is even if you take a new bonus on the reversed amount, so you can never cash out more than $100.

What you haven't said there, is that directly above those 2 rules it says:
Management reserves the right to apply the terms below should a customer be flagged as a bonus hunter, advantage player and/or fraudulent. Kindy note that this does not apply to loyal Dendera customers.

This is a little bit too vague for my liking as it seems they can apply these rules to the "flagged players" AFTER they have deposited & started playing.
I'm trying to get the exact intention of these strange rules from the casino (e-mail sent today).

KK

 

[Tirilej]

Also ask about that 20 game rule that no one seems to be able to find.

 

[vinylweatherman]

What you haven't said there, is that directly above those 2 rules it says:
Management reserves the right to apply the terms below should a customer be flagged as a bonus hunter, advantage player and/or fraudulent. Kindy note that this does not apply to loyal Dendera customers.

This is a little bit too vague for my liking as it seems they can apply these rules to the "flagged players" AFTER they have deposited & started playing.
I'm trying to get the exact intention of these strange rules from the casino (e-mail sent today).

KK

Far too vague, how can playing 8 games be "abusive". I am not sure even that playing only ONE game is abusive unless there is something in the manner of play that is out of the ordinary, such as making a full bankroll Blackjack or Roulette bet to start off, and then playing "normally".

They claim that betting around $4 per spin on a single game is "abusive", but if $4 per spin is bet on 20 different games, it is OK. If the slots are random, this is bollocks. If slots can "save up" losses for a later big win, then maybe they have a case as there is more chance of winning in the end sticking to a single game than playing a selection. The last time this excuse was used, it came from a Virtual casino.


If players are "bonus hunters", how come their promos still show? (this is RIVAL after all).

 

[casinokoenig]

Im glad i made my story public , thanks for our rersponses , they now offer me a 1000 % bonus up to 1000 €. Max. Bonus is 1000 € Maxcashout is 0.5 x Bonus - wagering requirements (50 x D+B) so basically you bet 100 to win 400 or lose your 100 - craptastic no ?

 

[Tirilej]

Im glad i made my story public , thanks for our rersponses , they now offer me a 1000 % bonus up to 1000 €. Max. Bonus is 1000 € Maxcashout is 0.5 x Bonus - wagering requirements (50 x D+B) so basically you bet 100 to win 400 or lose your 100 - craptastic no ?

If I were you I would immediately go back in to that casino. Push the help button, chose to close your account forever, and never look back.
You have other choices so show them that you don't accept how they are running their business

 

[vinylweatherman]

Im glad i made my story public , thanks for our rersponses , they now offer me a 1000 % bonus up to 1000 €. Max. Bonus is 1000 € Maxcashout is 0.5 x Bonus - wagering requirements (50 x D+B) so basically you bet 100 to win 400 or lose your 100 - craptastic no ?

Tell them you will consider it only when they pay you the outstanding €900, as until they do, you cannot be confident they will actually pay you from this latest offer should you win.

 

[Balthazar]

Apart from the "rogue" bit, they DID do this when they claimed to have licensed the games to a software house that didn't exist in order to have "clone" unbranded MGS casinos operate in the US market for a while. Operators told their US players they were having their accounts moved to a casino that was unbranded (no "powered by Microgaming" logos), that had a subset of the usual MGS games with "more to come". Of course "more" never came, as it relied on a software company that didn't exist to develop them MGS didn't actually run these cloned casinos though.

Well that's a heck of a difference. MG tried to push their games in the US market without putting themselves at risk. It doesn't exactly scream "honesty" but it's nowhere near what Rival does.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Well that's a heck of a difference. MG tried to push their games in the US market without putting themselves at risk. It doesn't exactly scream "honesty" but it's nowhere near what Rival does.

The problem is we don't know. The whole thing was more secretive even than Rival. Rival left the evidence lying around on the websites, each had "this casino is operated by Bonne Chance..........." even though the casino CS, owners, and reps claimed otherwise.

 

[Balthazar]

Rival left the evidence lying around on the websites, each had "this casino is operated by Bonne Chance..........." even though the casino CS, owners, and reps claimed otherwise.

I agree that we still wouldn't know that Bonne Chance = Rival if it wasn't of the court case. Still wouldn't be fair to suspect MG of doing the same IMO.

 

[Playforfun]

Dendera have it in their terms.

no more than 20% on one game when playing with a bonus.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[Balthazar]

These types of casinos are a disgrace to the industry. I actually feel happy for the Canucks for not being able to have access to the casinos powered by this software.

But but but...they are all independent so it wouldn't make sense...

 

[vinylweatherman]

So it does,

STANDARD BONUS/PROMOTIONAL TERMS APPLIED TO ALL CASINO PROMOTIONS
NB: Should you withdraw winnings from a Free Chip and then reverse those winnings, the subsequent winnings will be capped at $ / € / £ 100. This includes taking up another promotion from the winnings of the free chip.

Management reserves the right to apply the terms below should a customer be flagged as a bonus hunter, advantage player and/or fraudulent. Kindy note that this does not apply to loyal Dendera customers.

Should you cancel a withdrawal derived from winnings off a Bonus with a Max Cashout Restriction and play using your cash balance, then the casino reserves the right to apply the Max Cashout of the promotion where the winnings were generated. If you cancel winnings and claim a promotion without a Max Cashout, then the casino reserves the same right. This is to prevent additional losses using casino bonus money.

You may not wager more than 20% of your wagering requirements on a single game.

..but where does it say that you must play 20 games.


This one is 101% bullshit:-

Should you cancel a withdrawal derived from winnings off a Bonus with a Max Cashout Restriction and play using your cash balance, then the casino reserves the right to apply the Max Cashout of the promotion where the winnings were generated. If you cancel winnings and claim a promotion without a Max Cashout, then the casino reserves the same right. This is to prevent additional losses using casino bonus money.

What a load of bollocks!

When you withdraw, the bonus is removed, it takes no further part in play. Whether you reverse your resulting cashout of $xxx or let it run it's course and redeposit $xxx makes ZERO difference to the risk to the casino of playing on that $xxx. Even if a promotion is claimed on reversal, it STILL makes no difference whatsoever whether the claim was made from a reversed $xxx, or a redeposit of the same $xxx after payment.

If is does make a difference, it is slight, and in the casino's favour. They save on paying the transaction charges both ways on $xxx.

A decent advantage player would not trip up on this, they would know it makes no difference to the overall EV, so they would play the casino's game and do it by the book so that they have one less excuse to void the win.

The sneaky part is that Rival actively promote reversals to players, so a player might take up such an offer that shows up, and forget that they are walking into a potential pitfall because they are exposing themselves to this term.

Since "the terms below" ONLY apply to players flagged as frauds or "bonus abusers", players not flagged as such are excused all of this, and can freely play all WR on a single game, and reverse away to claim promotions as much as they like. Until a player has played a while, they cannot know whether a player has been flagged, so those new to Rival can hit them hard, something they couldn't do if the terms applied to all players, flagged or not.

The "must play 20 games" term isn't even there, so in this respect, they are acting like full blown rogues for giving this as a reason to void winnings.

It seems the OP "played on" after meeting WR, so maybe they can't back up a claim that at least 5 games were played for a minimum of 20% of WR each.

They also seem to be telling the player they were flagged after the fact, as they clearly were NOT flagged when they took this promo, as under the Rival system, flagged players don't see any promos in their lobby. Retrospective application of terms is another rogue practice, but this IS a Rival casino after all, so hardly a surprise

 

[Nifty29]

So it does,




..but where does it say that you must play 20 games.


This one is 101% bullshit:-



What a load of bollocks!

When you withdraw, the bonus is removed, it takes no further part in play. Whether you reverse your resulting cashout of $xxx or let it run it's course and redeposit $xxx makes ZERO difference to the risk to the casino of playing on that $xxx. Even if a promotion is claimed on reversal, it STILL makes no difference whatsoever whether the claim was made from a reversed $xxx, or a redeposit of the same $xxx after payment.

If is does make a difference, it is slight, and in the casino's favour. They save on paying the transaction charges both ways on $xxx.

A decent advantage player would not trip up on this, they would know it makes no difference to the overall EV, so they would play the casino's game and do it by the book so that they have one less excuse to void the win.

The sneaky part is that Rival actively promote reversals to players, so a player might take up such an offer that shows up, and forget that they are walking into a potential pitfall because they are exposing themselves to this term.

Since "the terms below" ONLY apply to players flagged as frauds or "bonus abusers", players not flagged as such are excused all of this, and can freely play all WR on a single game, and reverse away to claim promotions as much as they like. Until a player has played a while, they cannot know whether a player has been flagged, so those new to Rival can hit them hard, something they couldn't do if the terms applied to all players, flagged or not.

The "must play 20 games" term isn't even there, so in this respect, they are acting like full blown rogues for giving this as a reason to void winnings.

It seems the OP "played on" after meeting WR, so maybe they can't back up a claim that at least 5 games were played for a minimum of 20% of WR each.

They also seem to be telling the player they were flagged after the fact, as they clearly were NOT flagged when they took this promo, as under the Rival system, flagged players don't see any promos in their lobby. Retrospective application of terms is another rogue practice, but this IS a Rival casino after all, so hardly a surprise

It's interesting to note that Box24 also has this "can't reverse winnings after bonus removal" rule.....and they are "independent".

I agree. It's ridiculous.

 

[vinylweatherman]

It's interesting to note that Box24 also has this "can't reverse winnings after bonus removal" rule.....and they are "independent".

I agree. It's ridiculous.

It seems many casinos have this pointless rule, and argue that it "prevents bonus abuse" by ensuring that only a fresh $100 deposit can get a bonus, not a reversed $100. If anything, the casinos are abusing themselves as players with any sense will know that $100 is the same no matter how it got there. If anything, letting the withdrawal take place and then redepositing the $100 allows players to test that the casino is still happy to pay you without asking for further documents, DNA, etc.

Odd how an "independent" casino follow a daft rule just because the crappy white labels have it. Makes me think they are not as independent as they claim, something we have found out about other casinos who have claimed to be independent.