Resolved Da Vinci's Gold voided 1500 USD winnings for claiming multiple free chips in a row

[stokes]

I know, I should have known better, but the offer was too good.
Anyway, here is my story.

I have used their multi-stage promotion.
For those who are not familiar with their bonuses here is how it works. When it is claimed the account is credited with a certain amount (in my case it was 4000 USD if I am not mistaken). The aim is to win as much as possible with low wagering. The winnings (maximum 1000 USD) will be used as a bonus after the required deposit (25 USD) is made.
Then a high wagering (X 50) of the total balance has to be made to be able to cashout maximum 1500 USD.
The whole setup is very similar to Blackjack Ballroom Casino's sign up bonus (apart from the amounts involved).

So, I was quite lucky and made a cashout for 1500 USD after all wagering has been cleared.
To cut the long story short they voided my winnings quoting this:

As per DaVincisGold's Terms & Conditions which states
"After claiming a free chip, players are required to make at least one
real deposit before claiming another. Not doing so will void any
winnings."

I have claimed multiple free chips, that is true (they had a daily free chips in April and I claimed many of them).
I won't bother the part that they should be able to restrict claiming multiple free chips in row, I will not bother that they could limit the free chips offered (i.e. other Rival casino removed the Monday free chip option from me after some time).

The issue is that my winnings did NOT come from a free chip which this term should be valid for. I played with a deposit bonus.
If they mean to void any winnings after the multiple free chip redeeming then why should I have an account with them? I mean they can always claim that I breached the terms so they can void any of my winnings (even if it came from a deposit).

In summary:
I have used a deposit bonus (only the bonus amount was different according to the winnings in the first stage) and won, but they voided my winnings based on multiple free chip redeeming clause which should be relevant only for free chip winnings.

 

[Azzurri]

Are they accredited?

 

[coxwel]

You should be paid as their claim that you redeemed multiple freechips in a row doenst fit your situation, imo. You played with a deposit bonus, but it seems they consider this a freebonus as the first stage is indeed free, only on stage 2 you would have to make a deposit. Very lousy if they argument like this, but it seems thats the route they are on.

I would suggest you to contact KasinoKing (member here on board), if i remember correctly he promotes davincis and can maybe of some help for you.

Very sad to see that now also the good rivals (imo davincis was one of them) now also turn the you claimed multiple chips route, but offer them on daily basis, like they want you to breach their terms.

Hope that this can be soluted in your favour!

 

[coxwel]

Are they accredited?

nope, i think slotscapital and tropezia palace are the only ones accredited offering rival games

 

[stokes]

nope, i think slotscapital and tropezia palace are the only ones accredited offering rival games

Moreover, they are on the No Can DO list.

 

[coxwel]

Moreover, they are on the No Can DO list.

That´s why KK might be the best option for you as maybe he can use his contacts as an affiliate.

If they are on the No-can-Do a pab would not be possible.

 

[Tirilej]

I hope KK can help you, because these rules seems to be just a way to be able to deny you your winnings.

 

[dunover]

I know, I should have known better, but the offer was too good.
Anyway, here is my story.

I have used their multi-stage promotion.
For those who are not familiar with their bonuses here is how it works. When it is claimed the account is credited with a certain amount (in my case it was 4000 USD if I am not mistaken). The aim is to win as much as possible with low wagering. The winnings (maximum 1000 USD) will be used as a bonus after the required deposit (25 USD) is made.
Then a high wagering (X 50) of the total balance has to be made to be able to cashout maximum 1500 USD.
The whole setup is very similar to Blackjack Ballroom Casino's sign up bonus (apart from the amounts involved).

So, I was quite lucky and made a cashout for 1500 USD after all wagering has been cleared.
To cut the long story short they voided my winnings quoting this:

As per DaVincisGold's Terms & Conditions which states
"After claiming a free chip, players are required to make at least one
real deposit before claiming another. Not doing so will void any
winnings."

I have claimed multiple free chips, that is true (they had a daily free chips in April and I claimed many of them).
I won't bother the part that they should be able to restrict claiming multiple free chips in row, I will not bother that they could limit the free chips offered (i.e. other Rival casino removed the Monday free chip option from me after some time).

The issue is that my winnings did NOT come from a free chip which this term should be valid for. I played with a deposit bonus.
If they mean to void any winnings after the multiple free chip redeeming then why should I have an account with them? I mean they can always claim that I breached the terms so they can void any of my winnings (even if it came from a deposit).

In summary:
I have used a deposit bonus (only the bonus amount was different according to the winnings in the first stage) and won, but they voided my winnings based on multiple free chip redeeming clause which should be relevant only for free chip winnings.

Yes, but the bonus you received when you deposited and then tried to cash out after meeting WR was originally derived from a NDB which by your own admission followed consecutive NDB's therefore as I read the terms, they are quite correct to void the balance.

 

[Refilliates Casinos]

Hi,

I hope you don't mind. This has been escalated to Rival and Da Vinci's for review.

Regards,
Dieter

 

[stokes]

Yes, but the bonus you received when you deposited and then tried to cash out after meeting WR was originally derived from a NDB which by your own admission followed consecutive NDB's therefore as I read the terms, they are quite correct to void the balance.

A NDB means (for me) No Deposit Bonus, so no deposit required. The bonus I have taken was not NDB as it required deposit, without deposit no way I could have withdrawn anything.

 

[Refilliates Casinos]

Hi guys,

Rival have liaised with DaVinci's and they have agreed to pay the player in full. I'm told that this was an error in the promotional set-up and the player could not be held accountable.

I hope you return to their casino in the future Stokes to spend some of your winnings - they are a good outfit

Thanks all,
Dieter

 

[maphesto]

I think these "multi-stage-promotions" are tricky to read if they are "ndb" or not. Some casinos call them free cash or free chips and they are infact deposit bonuses.

From winbig21:

Claim a no deposit bonus of $ 219 from cashier.

This is a multi stage promotion which is a deposit bonus.

 

[stokes]

Hi guys,

Rival have liaised with DaVinci's and they have agreed to pay the player in full. I'm told that this was an error in the promotional set-up and the player could not be held accountable.

I hope you return to their casino in the future Stokes to spend some of your winnings - they are a good outfit

Thanks all,
Dieter

Many thanks for your help.

I played there from time to time (few hundred spent on the last couple of years) and of course will after the happy end of this story unless they bonus ban me

 

[maphesto]

Many thanks for your help.

I played there from time to time (few hundred spent on the last couple of years) and of course will after the happy end of this story unless they bonus ban me

Ccan they ddo that???

 

[Dinahnana]

Stokes you have been a member long enough to know to avoid this casino. Problems such as this makes me dislike Rival casinos in general. This casino let you claim multiple free chips and then let you deposit knowing that they will not let you cashout. IMHO they should pay you.

Edit; just saw that Tropica intervened in order to get the player paid.

 

[maphesto]

@osulle:

Hi guys,

Rival have liaised with DaVinci's and they have agreed to pay the player in full. I'm told that this was an error in the promotional set-up and the player could not be held accountable.

I hope you return to their casino in the future Stokes to spend some of your winnings - they are a good outfit

Thanks all,
Dieter

 

[Dinahnana]

@osulle:

I am a tad slow today Multi-tasking is sometimes not a good idea.

 

[stokes]

Stokes you have been a member long enough to know to avoid this casino. Problems such as this makes me dislike Rival casinos in general. This casino let you claim multiple free chips and then let you deposit knowing that they will not let you cashout. IMHO they should pay you. Predatory tactics such as this should land this casino in the Rogue pit and not on the Reservation. That is my opinion.

Did they at least give you your deposit back stokes?

I guess after the happy ending this is not really relevant.

I have no problem with voiding winnings coming from free chips (the max cashout is very low anyhow) if they have such rule. I agree that it should not be possible to redeem (by the software) multiple free chips in a row if it is not allowed by the terms.

I have played in a few Rival casinos and have no problem with the cash out and I liked their DVG's slot challange (i.e. deposit 40 play with 8000 and try to reach 80.000 and then it is yours) for the extended playtime and I almost made it.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/da-vincis-gold-challenge-so-close.53122/

So, this was my first issue with Rival engined casino.

 

[stokes]

Ccan they ddo that???

I think so. I mean in a few Rival casinos I don't have any promotion at the cashier (I guess because I have not played there with real money).

 

[dunover]

A NDB means (for me) No Deposit Bonus, so no deposit required. The bonus I have taken was not NDB as it required deposit, without deposit no way I could have withdrawn anything.

What I meant was yes, you deposited in order to receive the bonus in question, but this bonus amount (the way you described it) came accumulated from a previous NDB and by your own volition you had consecutive NDB's before that.

Luckily Rival have obviously deemed the terms a little contradictory and DVG will have to pay you out, so congrats! But you are playing with fire at these sites until their T&C's are more specific.

 

[Dinahnana]

I guess after the happy ending this is not really relevant.

I have no problem with voiding winnings coming from free chips (the max cashout is very low anyhow) if they have such rule. I agree that it should not be possible to redeem (by the software) multiple free chips in a row if it is not allowed by the terms.

I have played in a few Rival casinos and have no problem with the cash out and I liked their DVG's slot challange (i.e. deposit 40 play with 8000 and try to reach 80.000 and then it is yours) for the extended playtime and I almost made it.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/da-vincis-gold-challenge-so-close.53122/

So, this was my first issue with Rival engined casino.

Continuing to play at these questionable Rivals is your prerogative I am glad you got paid (this time)

 

[coxwel]

wow..this issue has been escalated very fast!

congrats to the op, and great to see that the tropica rep stepped in allthough the issue happened in another casino.

 

[KasinoKing]

Ccan they ddo that???

DaVinci's is one of the few Rival casinos who do not automatically ban people who are flagged on the central system - the dicision is made by the casino management.

Huge thanks to Deiter for stepping in and getting this issue sorted pronto. IMHO he is the best rep from a non-accreited casino on the forum!

KK

 

[maphesto]

DaVinci's is one of the few Rival casinos who do not automatically ban people who are flagged on the central system - the dicision is made by the casino management.

April 14th from DaVinci's to me:

Dear XXXXXXXX

I would like to inform you that your phone number has been updated.

Regrettably, a number of factors have led to our automated security
system flagging your account as bonus ineligible. You will continue to
be able to deposit and withdraw without using a bonus.

I call this an automatically ban from the Rival bonus system because DaVinci are using Rival's system.

Of course I can see that they want to blame the system in case they don't want to give me bonuses, which don't say that you are wrong. You are probably one who can use bonuses there even if the Rival chain of doom struck you in 2010.

 

[KasinoKing]

Sorry - double post after first one seemed to have not worked.

 

[maphesto]

DaVinci's is one of the few Rival casinos who do not automatically ban people who are flagged on the central system - the dicision is made by the casino management.

Huge thanks to Deiter for stepping in and getting this issue sorted pronto. IMHO he is the best rep from a non-accreited casino on the forum!

KK

 

[Tirilej]

KK have turned in to a boot. Just one sentence in each thread

 

[gagamel]

And now the big question:

Can I trust them or not?

 

[Dinahnana]

And now the big question:

Can I trust them or not?

Gagamel if you are determined to deposit at a non-accredited Rival I would say stick with Tropica as the rep is pretty active here and can help you with any issues.

On a side bar I do wonder if they are connected to Davinci's Gold.

 

[Tirilej]

Gagamel if you are determined to deposit at a non-accredited Rival I would say stick with Tropica as the rep is pretty active here and can help you with any issues.

On a side bar I do wonder if they are connected to Davinci's Gold.

I don't think they are, but I believe Tropica have really good connection with Rival themselves, so I would recommend them too, not DaVinci.

 

[Dinahnana]

I don't think they are, but I believe Tropica have really good connection with Rival themselves, so I would recommend them too, not DaVinci.

Thanks for the clarification Tirliej

 

[maphesto]

DaVinci's is one of the few Rival casinos who do not automatically ban people who are flagged on the central system - the dicision is made by the casino management.

April 14th from DaVinci's to me:

Dear XXXXXXXX

I would like to inform you that your phone number has been updated.

Regrettably, a number of factors have led to our automated security
system flagging your account as bonus ineligible. You will continue to
be able to deposit and withdraw without using a bonus.

I call this an automatically ban from the Rival bonus system because DaVinci are using Rival's system.

Of course I can see that they want to blame the system in case they don't want to give me bonuses, which don't say that you are wrong. You are probably one who can use bonuses there even if the Rival chain of doom struck you in 2010.

They must have localized my account after this thread and voilà, today I received an email with promotions again!

 

[The Viking]

Well in november 2009 Davinicis bonus banned me, and as usually they reseved the right not to tell me why, then in December they closed my account? when i mailed them about it they didnt even bother to answer, i still have all emails
and to be honest i had forgot about them until this post came along.

 

[stokes]

Update

Just as Dieter promised I got the followings from DVG.

Your withdrawal will of course be paid.
When accounting reviewed your account, they saw a number of free chips
being claimed and saw the FreePlay promotion as a free chip as well.

I am sorry for the inconvenience.

For security purposes, you are still required to send in your documents.


I will be reviewing your account to be sure everything is on track.

The $1475 that was removed from your account has been restored.

So feel free to request another withdrawal, I will be sure it is paid
the moment your documents are approved.

I have got my documents approved yesterday, so just waiting for the payout.


Kudos to Da Vinci's Gold (and for Dieter of course for his intervention) for reconsidering earlier position.
I like to play at those casinos who consider not only the rule but the logic behind. This can not be said for a few more reputable casinos (my case with Club Gold springs to mind, when they confiscated my winnings on Dollar Ball enhanced slots considering them to be progressive slot even though no chance to win jackpot without enabling Dollar Ball).

 

[stokes]

Payment received.

Thanks again for all involved.

 

[JenMark]

Know how you feel, I lost $800 with Prism for the same reason... just played it down and left.
Why offer the promos if you cant withdraw... even after a deposit?
They just wont negotiate at all; bottom line they keep your winnings.

I know, I should have known better, but the offer was too good.
Anyway, here is my story.

I have used their multi-stage promotion.
For those who are not familiar with their bonuses here is how it works. When it is claimed the account is credited with a certain amount (in my case it was 4000 USD if I am not mistaken). The aim is to win as much as possible with low wagering. The winnings (maximum 1000 USD) will be used as a bonus after the required deposit (25 USD) is made.
Then a high wagering (X 50) of the total balance has to be made to be able to cashout maximum 1500 USD.
The whole setup is very similar to Blackjack Ballroom Casino's sign up bonus (apart from the amounts involved).

So, I was quite lucky and made a cashout for 1500 USD after all wagering has been cleared.
To cut the long story short they voided my winnings quoting this:

As per DaVincisGold's Terms & Conditions which states
"After claiming a free chip, players are required to make at least one
real deposit before claiming another. Not doing so will void any
winnings."

I have claimed multiple free chips, that is true (they had a daily free chips in April and I claimed many of them).
I won't bother the part that they should be able to restrict claiming multiple free chips in row, I will not bother that they could limit the free chips offered (i.e. other Rival casino removed the Monday free chip option from me after some time).

The issue is that my winnings did NOT come from a free chip which this term should be valid for. I played with a deposit bonus.
If they mean to void any winnings after the multiple free chip redeeming then why should I have an account with them? I mean they can always claim that I breached the terms so they can void any of my winnings (even if it came from a deposit).

In summary:
I have used a deposit bonus (only the bonus amount was different according to the winnings in the first stage) and won, but they voided my winnings based on multiple free chip redeeming clause which should be relevant only for free chip winnings.

 

[KasinoKing]

Know how you feel, I lost $800 with Prism for the same reason... just played it down and left.
Why offer the promos if you cant withdraw... even after a deposit?
They just wont negotiate at all; bottom line they keep your winnings.

You should have read the WHOLE thread, specifically the last couple of posts before yours. Ultimately the casino admitted they made a mistake, apologised and paid up. (That is why the thread is marked "resolved")

Prism is a different kettle of fish - I wouldn't even deposit YOUR money there!

KK