Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[paul7388]

Just to add a little perspective.

Every year except last year Flu kills thousands including many who have had the Flu jag. It also causes other illnesses in the elderly. In a bad Flu season it causes about 20,000 deaths in the UK.

Without vaccine it would kill a hell of a lot more. Actually it could be said many more elderly would die annually from Flu than have died from Covid if it was not for the Flu jag.

So i can see why people would say if Covid Jag should be compulsory then why not the Flu jag.

 

[interlog]

I,m sure he will have his team of lawyers checking all the angles.

But i,m also sure in this current climate theres room for quite a few redundancies if things cannot be done down the legal route.

The blokes a multi multi millionaire who is used to getting his own way.

Hope it comes off and sets a precedent.

Yeah he did well about treating his staff as self employed didn't he. I bet his lawyers made a pretty penny from it too.

 

[Gaz237]

Yeah he did well about treating his staff as self employed didn't he. I bet his lawyers made a pretty penny from it too.

Was not agreeing with his moralities.

But as a business man.

 

[colinsunderland]

But surely a person that had the flu jab is more likely quicker to recover from flu than the person that hasn't. Isn't that the reason why he is discriminating against those that haven't had the Covid jab.

Both flu and Covid vaccinated people can still spread the virus. If it offered immunity, then I am with you, alas it doesn't.

The vaccination does seem to prevent transmission in a lot of people though, which I know isn't confirmed, but most studies show early results of around 30-50% lower chance of transmission.

People having flu doesn't cause widespread closures of businesses and having to deep cleans and suchlike at a large cost to the business. Covid-19 does. If I were a business employing staff I would want to reduce the risk of that happening as much as possible, and if that meant employing people who have been vaccinated as far as possible, then so be it.

 

[interlog]

Was not agreeing with his moralities.

But as a business man.

I was merely pointing out that he doesn't always get it his way.

 

[interlog]

The vaccination does seem to prevent transmission in a lot of people though, which I know isn't confirmed, but most studies show early results of around 30-50% lower chance of transmission.

People having flu doesn't cause widespread closures of businesses and having to deep cleans and suchlike at a large cost to the business. Covid-19 does. If I were a business employing staff I would want to reduce the risk of that happening as much as possible, and if that meant employing people who have been vaccinated as far as possible, then so be it.

People going off with flu symptoms does cost business money. Flu jabs reduces that absence. Make flu jabs compulsory too then.

 

[mack341]

I,m guessing your post is somewhat flippant.

But everyone in my area that works in care homes and as carers visiting people, all had to have the jab.

They got theirs at the same time as the eldest people. No Jab or they could not work.

Gaz was surprised you left that a like, I have to say!
but I was not being flippant just wondering if the govt/firms are going to be consistent.

Also the repeated message has been 'we need to save the NHS' and 'protect the vulnerable', to the point of spending billions/changing laws etc.. so I look forward to them carrying on this approach/mindset, providing all the cancer treatments people need and assistance etc.., updating care homes and reinstating meals on wheels, protecting the disabled rather than cutbacks, housing the homeless etc...also treating serious crime in the same way covid violations have been prioritised, bobbies walking the beat to make sure everything is in order.

Yes I am cynical, but that is formed from 30 years of following current affairs and politics, I'd be happy to be proved wrong and bojo and his mates have only ever had the most honourable of intentions in the way they're handling covid. Even quite a few respected and long standing conservative MPs have shown enough of their doubt, and voiced puzzlement over the govt's policies to make me know I'm not alone, or being alarmist at significant changes to society on the back of tackling covid.

 

[colinsunderland]

Yes, difference just is that contraceptive pills are only given if you go ask them yourself, with vaccination is bit different if there is will to have good coverage, majority have to take it and people might feel forced to have it if it's needed for travelling or other things.

According to stats, 28% of women in the UK take the pill (source

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) , thats a lot of women putting themselves at risk of blood clots.
You have to ask for the vaccine too. I had to go to the website, enter my details, book a timeslot, drive to the place, let them jab me in the arm. At no point was I coerced or forced into doing so.

Women taking the pill have a choice, take it, use another type of contraception, risk having a baby, don't have sex. 28% of them chose to take the 1 in 1000 chance of getting blood clots rather than do any of the other things.
The same women having the vaccine have the choice, either have it or don't. If they don't they might find they face restrictions like not being able to go on holiday abroad, some employers not wanting them, or getting seriously ill.

 

[colinsunderland]

People going off with flu symptoms does cost business money. Flu jabs reduces that absence. Make flu jabs compulsory too then.

Most people who catch flu tend to be retired don't they?
A business doesn't have to close if an employee catches it, to do a deep clean.
A flu outbreak won't cause most the country to have to close down for months.

 

[Gaz237]

People going off with flu symptoms does cost business money. Flu jabs reduces that absence. Make flu jabs compulsory too then.

As Colin said, the cost of employees being off sick with the Flu is probably 1% of the costs of a Covid outbreak, with a full shut down and deep clean, plus the length of time staff would be off.

 

[cncas2123]

As Colin said, the cost of employees being off sick with the Flu is probably 1% of the costs of a Covid outbreak, with a full shut down and deep clean, plus the length of time staff would be off.

I would also say that I am not aware of any Flu outbreak ever in the UK leading to thousands of people on ventilators.

 

[interlog]

Most people who catch flu tend to be retired don't they?
A business doesn't have to close if an employee catches it, to do a deep clean.
A flu outbreak won't cause most the country to have to close down for months.

No but it reduces the cost to the business. Before this Covid outbreak, where I work we had people go off with flu and it at times spread like wildfire. Yes not to the same extreme as Covid but nevertheless why not make flu jabs compulsory too then. It reduces strain on not only business, but also the NHS.

 

[interlog]

I would also say that I am not aware of any Flu outbreak ever in the UK leading to thousands of people on ventilators.

Then why bother with flu vaccinations. Might as well save the energy and money on them.

 

[Gaz237]

Gaz was surprised you left that a like, I have to say!
but I was not being flippant just wondering if the govt/firms are going to be consistent.

Also the repeated message has been 'we need to save the NHS' and 'protect the vulnerable', to the point of spending billions/changing laws etc.. so I look forward to them carrying on this approach/mindset, providing all the cancer treatments people need and assistance etc.., updating care homes and reinstating meals on wheels, protecting the disabled rather than cutbacks, housing the homeless etc...also treating serious crime in the same way covid violations have been prioritised, bobbies walking the beat to make sure everything is in order.

Yes I am cynical, but that is formed from 30 years of following current affairs and politics, I'd be happy to be proved wrong and bojo and his mates have only ever had the most honourable of intentions in the way they're handling covid. Even quite a few respected and long standing conservative MPs have shown enough of their doubt, and voiced puzzlement over the govt's policies to make me know I'm not alone, or being alarmist at significant changes to society on the back of tackling covid.

I left it a like, as i agreed with just about all of it.

Was just when i was replying i wondered if it was somewhat tongue in cheek.

Was having 3 convoys at the same time, so my answer was a bit short.

I agree that when we come out of the other side of all this, would be great if the NHS cops some extra funding along with associated services.

 

[colinsunderland]

Then why bother with flu vaccinations. Might as well save the energy and money on them.

well because they stop people being dead?

 

[Gaz237]

Then why bother with flu vaccinations. Might as well save the energy and money on them.

Because they save lives, generally in the elderly.

 

[cncas2123]

Then why bother with flu vaccinations. Might as well save the energy and money on them.

To make sure we dont get Flu epidemics every year?

 

[mack341]

According to stats, 28% of women in the UK take the pill (source

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) , thats a lot of women putting themselves at risk of blood clots.
You have to ask for the vaccine too. I had to go to the website, enter my details, book a timeslot, drive to the place, let them jab me in the arm. At no point was I coerced or forced into doing so.

Women taking the pill have a choice, take it, use another type of contraception, risk having a baby, don't have sex. 28% of them chose to take the 1 in 1000 chance of getting blood clots rather than do any of the other things.
The same women having the vaccine have the choice, either have it or don't. If they don't they might find they face restrictions like not being able to go on holiday abroad, some employers not wanting them, or getting seriously ill.

These aren't the same type of blood clots are they, that the oxford vaccine has caused in those rare cases, where the immune system starts destroying the blood platelets?

edit: I thought the pill related clots were more related to hormonal changes not the immune system but I could be wrong.

 

[interlog]

I was being flippant about stopping flu vaccinations but the point I am making is that similar to the Covid vaccination they are not compulsory yet those that don't have the flu jab don't get treated different, unlike the Covid vaccine.

It is dangerous creating a two tier system, a possibility of this happening.

 

[colinsunderland]

These aren't the same type of blood clots are they, that the oxford vaccine has caused in those rare cases, where the immune system starts destroying the blood platelets?

going to be honest and say I have no idea. Are the ones the vaccine seems to produce more dangerous?

 

[mack341]

going to be honest and say I have no idea. Are the ones the vaccine seems to produce more dangerous?

I haven't followed the last week and the details of the uk medical regulator's change of advice, but when I was reading before about the (rare) clots implicated with the oxford, they were fatal and all over the body, not like a clot you can get in your leg from a long plane flight.

 

[mack341]

Apparently a few years back we had around 25,000 influenza deaths, crowded wards in winter from it too with no spare capacity, bearing in mind the flu season is mainly nov to feb, that is a lot of people dying per month.

And no flu deaths counted with the 28 day rule as covid is, along with the mass pcr testing, with basically every person in hospital with other serious life threatening illnesses getting tested, and in a hospital setting where it is likely they are at a higher risk of catching covid.

 

[dealer wins]

I genuinely believe this man and all that he says here. Nothing else makes sense.

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[slotmaster]

Is it safe for us to go over to @Jono777 house yet? I was in Wolverhampton last night on Google Earth. Also, anyone knows where @ternur is? Have not seen him post for a while.

 

[ternur]

Is it safe for us to go over to @Jono777 house yet? I was in Wolverhampton last night on Google Earth. Also, anyone knows where @ternur is? Have not seen him post for a while.

I think he's been drinking more than moderately during the pandemic (and only during the pandemic) and his abilities to type a coherent sentence or two have been drastically reduced because of this.

 

[Kroffe]

Is it safe for us to go over to @Jono777 house yet? I was in Wolverhampton last night on Google Earth. Also, anyone knows where @ternur is? Have not seen him post for a while.

He usually claims to be from Finland, but that answer just leads to more questions.

Also, i saw a man yesterday that i think may have been Ternur.
He was sneaking around the shed where i keep my bike, but as soon as automatic flood lights turned on, he vanished without a trace.

 

[colinsunderland]

I genuinely believe this man and all that he says here. Nothing else makes sense.

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Thats because he's fucking nuts.
LifeSiteNews has been permanently banned on YouTube.
Thats enough to cast doubt on his claims. Heres what he said in an interview with the Daily Mail

In October, Yeadon wrote a column for the United Kingdom’s Daily Mail newspaper that also appeared on MailOnline, one of the world’s most-visited news websites. It declared that deaths caused by COVID-19, which then totaled about 45,000 in Britain, will soon “fizzle out” and Britons “should immediately be allowed to resume normal life.” Since then, the disease has killed about another 80,000 people in the UK.

Then theres this

When the coronavirus pandemic reached the UK in March 2020, Yeadon initially expressed support for developing a vaccine. He tweeted: “Covid 19 is not going away. Until we have a vaccine or herd immunity” – natural resistance resulting from prior exposure to the virus – “all that can be done is to slow its spread.” A week later he tweeted: “A vaccine might be along towards the end of 2021, if we’re really lucky.”

When a fellow Twitter user said vaccines “harm many, many people,” Yeadon replied: “Ok, please refuse it, but do not impede its flow to neutrals or those keen to get it, thanks.”

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So you believe him? Which part of his posts? The ones when he says everyone should be vaccinated, or the ones where he says they shouldn't?

Reuters has a look at him.

Heres one of his tweets from last year

A Tweet posted by Michael Yeadon in May 2020. A second deadly wave of COVID-19 hit the UK a few months later.

And lets not forget his racist tweets he pretended he didn't write when called out on them, such as

But yeah, what a great guy he is.

 

[dealer wins]

Would trust him over SAGE any day. He may not get every single thing right, but SAGE have got NOTHING right so far.

 

[colinsunderland]

Would trust him over SAGE any day. He may not get every single thing right, but SAGE have got NOTHING right so far.

Well, except they have, and they show no evidence of being racist twats. The fact you trust such a person says volumes about you.

 

[geordiecolin]

A relatively up to date and personal account about how things stand on the Island today. The resistance is such against taking the vaccine that so many stated that they would rather die on the streets than take the vaccine that they have abandoned the must take the vaccine diktat.
Agriculture is going to be ruined as soon as the first rains come as it turns the ash-which is up to 4 feet in places-into cement and they believe that Geothermal drilling over months set off the volcano.

I ignored the religious references. To avoid his religious waffle at the start skip to 8 minutes in when he talks to a couple on the Island

 

[dealer wins]

Wow, I want to emigrate there. Real men and women with courage in their convictions! Amazing

 

[geordiecolin]

Wow, I want to emigrate there. Real men and women with courage in their convictions! Amazing

Something that I've noticed is that it seems to be those who are religious that are far more likely to question the validity of the covid vaccine. Yet these people are not getting help from their Church because their Church is in line with the government on their vaccine policy

 

[slotmaster]

He usually claims to be from Finland, but that answer just leads to more questions.

View attachment 153576


Also, i saw a man yesterday that i think may have been Ternur.
He was sneaking around the shed where i keep my bike, but as soon as automatic flood lights turned on, he vanished without a trace.
View attachment 153577

Sooooo Finland is an extension of Sweden?

 

[pinnit2014]

Yeah, it's the same as the USA and Canada

 

[geordiecolin]

Yeah, it's the same as the USA and Canada

Except for when it comes to pipelines

 

[pinnit2014]

Except for when it comes to pipelines

and healthcare

 

[Kroffe]

Sooooo Finland is an extension of Sweden?

Im not sure, your guess is as good as mine.
I think it may be possible to end up in Finland, same way as people end up in Narnia sometimes.
If you get drunk enough and start hitchhiking, you may get lucky and get picked up by someone from the Moomin clan, and they will then take you to Finland.
As for getting there sober, without the help of the Moomins? Nah, not possible.


You have to get really drunk before you start thinking getting in a car with this guy is a good idea tho.

 

[pinnit2014]

Im not sure, your guess is as good as mine.
I think it may be possible to end up in Finland, same way as people end up in Narnia sometimes.
I think if you get drunk enough and start hitchhiking, you may get lucky and get picked up by someone from the Moomin clan, and they will then take you to Finland.
As for getting there sober, without the help of the Moomins? Nah, not possible.


You have to get really drunk before you start thinking getting in a car with this guy is a good idea tho.
View attachment 153589

Spooky, was flicking through Netflix and put on the terrible 2007 film The Hitcher about 20 minutes ago

Though, what's scarier is that Sean Bean isn't speaking with a Sheffield accent

 

[ternur]

Sooooo Finland is an extension of Sweden?

I'd proceed with caution when it comes to believing a man pretending to be a bear.

Not always as jovial as one might think.

 

[Jono777]

Is it safe for us to go over to @Jono777 house yet? I was in Wolverhampton last night on Google Earth. Also, anyone knows where @ternur is? Have not seen him post for a while.

Be a bit of a squeeze since my 'forced' downsizing lol

Of course you are all always welcome but I'd recommend bring a tent

PS: The wife and I are both immunised so entry only permitted with a covid passport

 

[geordiecolin]

Be a bit of a squeeze since my 'forced' downsizing lol

Of course you are all always welcome but I'd recommend bring a tent

PS: The wife and I are both immunised so entry only permitted with a covid passport

Would this do as a temporary pass to your party Jono? I would be happy to share a good case of corona

 

[Kroffe]

I'd proceed with caution when it comes to believing a man pretending to be a bear.

Not always as jovial as one might think.

I take no responsibility for evil acts done by other bears. or evil acts done by me.
They look very similar, so i understand the confusion, and forgive you.

 

[mack341]

Well, except they have, and they show no evidence of being racist twats. The fact you trust such a person says volumes about you.

Many members here also had strong opinions about these crimes against youngsters, I remember the thread, are they also all racist twats for noticing the patterns and people involved?

He claimed his account had been hacked and that he didn't write them, he was potentially upsetting powerful people with a lot vested in the lockdown, vaccines etc...he was a high up at pfizer for several years and well qualified in scientific medicine research for respiratory illnesses by all accounts. [edit: why would reuters pay him any attention if he wasn't ruffling a few feathers]

The dates didn't make sense to me, the pakistani rape gang news stories were a few years back and yet he was posting about them in january 2020, and also why did it take until about oct 2020 for them to come to light, surely pro lockdown journos and others would have been sniffing around his account and past social media content very strange to me, but I can't say 100% he didn't post them.

 

[colinsunderland]

Many members here also had strong opinions about these crimes against youngsters, I remember the thread, are they also all racist twats for noticing the patterns and people involved?

He claimed his account had been hacked and that he didn't write them, he was potentially upsetting powerful people with a lot vested in the lockdown, vaccines etc...he was a high up at pfizer for several years and well qualified in scientific medicine research for respiratory illnesses by all accounts.

The dates didn't make sense to me, the pakistani rape gang news stories were a few years back and yet he was posting about them in january 2020, and also why did it take until about oct 2020 for them to come to light, surely pro lockdown journos and others would have been sniffing around his account and social media content very strange to me, but I can't say 100% he didn't post them.

If they wrote what he did in the tweet I posted then yeah they are. I'm aware of his other tweets at the time, which I didn't post as they weren't the same as the one I posted, which is clearly racist.
Of course his account was hacked. I mean, he will have posted a screenshot or something from Twitter when he recovered his account to prove that presumably? Like anyone would do if they were being accused of writing stuff like that when they hadn't.

I don't get your point about the dates? Are you saying someone hacked his account because of his views on a vaccine for a virus that hadn't taken hold at that point, and a couple of months later he was telling the world a vaccine would be good? Did they see into the future and do it to discredit him?

 

[mack341]

If they wrote what he did in the tweet I posted then yeah they are. I'm aware of his other tweets at the time, which I didn't post as they weren't the same as the one I posted, which is clearly racist.
Of course his account was hacked. I mean, he will have posted a screenshot or something from Twitter when he recovered his account to prove that presumably? Like anyone would do if they were being accused of writing stuff like that when they hadn't.

I don't get your point about the dates? Are you saying someone hacked his account because of his views on a vaccine for a virus that hadn't taken hold at that point, and a couple of months later he was telling the world a vaccine would be good? Did they see into the future and do it to discredit him?

no I'm presuming a bit like deep fakes anything on the internet could be faked, so posts could be added back into his twitter history, if you're telling me that is impossible then maybe you know more, it should also be noted twitter are actively banning all sorts who they don't agree with or question the lockdown/covid official narrative/science.

I saw some of the tweets too, for me they didn't read similar in style to later posts, regardless of the content. with his name on the account and being publicly known, still involved in the pharma business with set-up firms and advisory roles, I find it hard to believe he would have posted them, but he may have been so angry about the issue that he did.

It shouldn't mean everything he says regarding respiratory illness, his career speciality, should be disregarded simply because of it.

edit: also he is not anti vax, he is in favour of those with a pro risk/benefit ratio having the jab, similar to the way flu is handled. late 2021 might have well been the date for the vaccine if longer safety testing had been implemented, many docs and scientists were saying similar things regarding the realistic date.

 

[geordiecolin]

If they wrote what he did in the tweet I posted then yeah they are. I'm aware of his other tweets at the time, which I didn't post as they weren't the same as the one I posted, which is clearly racist.
Of course his account was hacked. I mean, he will have posted a screenshot or something from Twitter when he recovered his account to prove that presumably? Like anyone would do if they were being accused of writing stuff like that when they hadn't.

I don't get your point about the dates? Are you saying someone hacked his account because of his views on a vaccine for a virus that hadn't taken hold at that point, and a couple of months later he was telling the world a vaccine would be good? Did they see into the future and do it to discredit him?

Is there any reason why you are so aggressive after all of this time debating in this thread on issues surrounding this subject for over a year with so few people taking part in it?
Just remember that without different views debating threads would only exist as a echo chamber and would surely die
And suggesting that Mat is racist is out of order entirely.

 

[colinsunderland]

no I'm presuming a bit like deep fakes anything on the internet could be faked, so posts could be added back into his twitter history, if you're telling me that is impossible then maybe you know more, it should also be noted twitter are actively banning all sorts who they don't agree with or question the lockdown/covid official narrative/science.

I saw some of the tweets too, for me they didn't read similar in style to later posts, regardless of the content. with his name on the account and being publicly known, still involved in the pharma business with set-up firms and advisory roles, I find it hard to believe he would have posted them, but he may have been so angry about the issue that he did.

It shouldn't mean everything he says regarding respiratory illness, his career speciality, should be disregarded simply because of it.

edit: also he is not anti vax, he is in favour of those with a pro risk/benefit ratio having the jab, similar to the way flu is handled. late 2021 might have well been the date for the vaccine if longer safety testing had been implemented, many docs and scientists were saying similar things regarding the realistic date.

So posts could be added back into his twitter feed, but he doesn't mention this? I fail to see how that could possibly be done, unless the 'hackers' hacked twitter, unless you are suggesting twitter did it?

He has been wrong about pretty much every major statement he has made, so as regards him being some kind of expert, then he's not a very good one.

Is there any reason why you are so aggressive after all of this time debating in this thread on issues surrounding this subject for over a year with so few people taking part in it?
Just remember that without different views debating threads would only exist as a echo chamber and would surely die
And suggesting that Mat is racist is out of order entirely.

Who is Mat? I've got no idea what you are talking about.

 

[geordiecolin]

So posts could be added back into his twitter feed, but he doesn't mention this? I fail to see how that could possibly be done, unless the 'hackers' hacked twitter, unless you are suggesting twitter did it?

He has been wrong about pretty much every major statement he has made, so as regards him being some kind of expert, then he's not a very good one.



Who is Mat? I've got no idea what you are talking about.

 

[geordiecolin]

I meant Mack. Sorry for my poor accuracy multi tasking skills while online and other stuff. But your pretending that you do not know who I was referring too .

 

[colinsunderland]

I meant Mack. Sorry for my poor accuracy multi tasking skills while online and other stuff. But your pretending that you do not know who I was referring too .

that will be because I didn't do anything of the sort.
What was it you accused me of earlier? Trying to discredit you after you posted fake news, yet you're here saying I suggested Mack is a racist, when I didn't do anything of the sort. Feel free to show me where I said that?