CasinoCruise refused to pay my £1700 winnings after making withdrawal.

[Harry_BKK]

it is indeed a disgrace.

some reputable casinos have returned the deposits and also paid the winnings before closing the account. that, for me, would be the only honorable thing to do.

 

[The Dude]

Before we start beating up the casino rep, let's keep in mind that the OP and casino rep have been in communication with one another about the whole thing.

Further, if you are self excluding, then you should not be playing at all. Self exclusion is not a tool to close an account - it's saying you have a gambling problem and need to quit. It is not something anyone should take lightly to include the player.

I also don't feel that anyone should be pointing fingers at the casino for "enticing" the player with an email. This is obviously an affiliate tactic and the OP probably was either spammed, or signed up to someone's spam list somehow.

I'll check to see if the casino rep wants to join in to this fracas. I'm not even sure he knows that this thread exists - it's up to the OP to contact the casino rep to let him know that there is a thread to be monitored. Please put the torches and pitchforks down until we hear from LLoyd.

 

[Barrasboy]

Hi,
With the greatest respect in the world I have followed every action I have been advised by CasinoCruise. They would not tell me the name of the Casino and date I allegedly self excluded from, they gave me an email address to submit an official complaint to EveryMatrix. EveryMatrix has ignored every polite email, they have furnished me with no information whatsoever. They have not even acknowledged my official complaint. They have ignored every communication.

It is very hard to accept the reason for not honouring a payout when they seem unable to furnish me with any information whatsoever and do not even have the courtesy to reply to polite emails or even an official complaint. They seem to have no complaint procedure whatsoever.

I wager online around once every three months and always set myself a limit, win or lose I walk away either if I hit my deposit limit or my winning target. To me online gaming is recreational and something a I look forward to every few months.

I have had accounts with Guts, Thrills etc which are all part of the EveryMatrix Group in the last nine months and deposited 4 figure sums and never made a withdrawal. No one from these casinos or EveryMatrix has contacted me saying I am self excluded from one casino in their group and offered to return my deposits. Surely this basis of not paying me my winnings must work both ways if you are applying this rule not honour a wager which was played in good faith.

Without even being furnished with any information whatsoever it is very hard to move forward.

Best wishes
Mark

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

Hi Mark,

Agreed - you, like any client, deserve prompt responsiveness and answers.

Today being Sunday it will be difficult for me to get all the answers but I reply ASAP.

Best wishes,
Lloyd

Hi,
With the greatest respect in the world I have followed every action I have been advised by CasinoCruise. They would not tell me the name of the Casino and date I allegedly self excluded from, they gave me an email address to submit an official complaint to EveryMatrix. EveryMatrix has ignored every polite email, they have furnished me with no information whatsoever. They have not even acknowledged my official complaint. They have ignored every communication.

It is very hard to accept the reason for not honouring a payout when they seem unable to furnish me with any information whatsoever and do not even have the courtesy to reply to polite emails or even an official complaint. They seem to have no complaint procedure whatsoever.

I wager online around once every three months and always set myself a limit, win or lose I walk away either if I hit my deposit limit or my winning target. To me online gaming is recreational and something a I look forward to every few months.

I have had accounts with Guts, Thrills etc which are all part of the EveryMatrix Group in the last nine months and deposited 4 figure sums and never made a withdrawal. No one from these casinos or EveryMatrix has contacted me saying I am self excluded from one casino in their group and offered to return my deposits. Surely this basis of not paying me my winnings must work both ways if you are applying this rule not honour a wager which was played in good faith.

Without even being furnished with any information whatsoever it is very hard to move forward.

Best wishes
Mark

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

Hi Mark,

You should receive your win.

I will take care of this personally.

Let's exchange contact details via PM and take it from there.

Best wishes,
Lloyd

 

[fun4all]

You should receive your win.

That is great - kudos to you LLoyd and this shows the power of having reps here for accredited casinos.

However wow, so they voided the win originally without good reason? That is bad. OP was very polite and persistant in trying to find the truth out as well and clearly just got stonewalled until posting in public on here.

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

That is great - kudos to you LLoyd and this shows the power of having reps here for accredited casinos.

However wow, so they voided the win originally without good reason? That is bad. OP was very polite and persistant in trying to find the truth out as well and clearly just got stonewalled until posting in public on here.

First, thanks a lot.

In discussion with our CEO today I was informed that according to UKGC the licensee in this case must pay out the player. There is just the beaurocracy of who and how which I will sort out, quickly. That's only fair. Also, I will take the opportunity to sort out this SE issue, once and for all.

 

[Mouche12]

Lloyd, I am impressed, it's the right thing to do!

And I am very happy for the OP, problem solved (for now).

 

[Barrasboy]

First, thanks a lot.

In discussion with our CEO today I was informed that according to UKGC the licensee in this case must pay out the player. There is just the beaurocracy of who and how which I will sort out, quickly. That's only fair. Also, I will take the opportunity to sort out this SE issue, once and for all.

Hi All,
EveryMatrix have just sent me an email saying they are not paying my winnings. It seems strange that the casino I opened the account with , deposited with and wagered in good faith have said they are now paying my winnings in accordance with the UKGC and this firm EveryMatrix have said they are not paying my winnings.

I am deeply disappointed in all these conflicting public admissions that I will be paid and private email refusals that I will not be paid. Lloyd the CasinoCruise rep has been a very polite and courteous rep but it is very bad form to keep raising my hopes of being paid for a genuine win and then having it dashed it again. Even the CasinoCruise Chief Executive Officer as noted above stated that I had a right to be paid. CasinoCruise took my deposits and wagers and have publicly stated that my withdrawal should be honoured. They should keep their word and pay me as their reputation and public image as a casino to trust may be getting adversely affected.

Warmest wishes
Mark

 

[Dinahnana]

Hi All,
EveryMatrix have just sent me an email saying they are not paying my winnings. It seems strange that the casino I opened the account with , deposited with and wagered in good faith have said they are now paying my winnings in accordance with the UKGC and this firm EveryMatrix have said they are not paying my winnings.

I am deeply disappointed in all these conflicting public admissions that I will be paid and private email refusals that I will not be paid. Lloyd the CasinoCruise rep has been a very polite and courteous rep but it is very bad form to keep raising my hopes of being paid for a genuine win and then having it dashed it again. Even the CasinoCruise Chief Executive Officer as noted above stated that I had a right to be paid. CasinoCruise took my deposits and wagers and have publicly stated that my withdrawal should be honoured. They should keep their word and pay me as their reputation and public image as a casino to trust may be getting adversely affected.

Warmest wishes
Mark

Did you PM Lloyd regarding the e-mail Everymatrix sent you? That e-mail doesn't necessarily mean that Casino Cruise will not pay you. You need to give Lloyd a chance to sort it out as he promised to do so in his post yesterday evening. It often happens when dealing with two separate but connected entitles that wires get crossed. So my advice is to wait and see what Lloyd says before making the assumption that Casino Cruise will not pay you.

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

Update:

I posted yesterday that I believe that Mark should get his winnings - please don't confuse that with a promise to pay him his winnings.

EM came back to me (and replied to Mark as well) that "The customer will be payed only with the cumulative deposit amount after SE and winnings generated ante SE, if any.
It basically means that every deposit after SE will be returned to him and any winnings prior to SE are not affected.
His deposit of 200 GBP has already been returned to him."

I am still checking with our CEO what other options there are, if any.

We share our UK GC license with the following casinos, so what a SE at any one of these casinos is considered a self exclusion at any other of the casinos:

BeanBagSports
CasinoLuck
NoxWin
PlayHippo
SlotoBank
SuperLenny
casinofloor
CasinoCruise
NextCasino
jetful

EM are speeding up the SE reporting systems so what we will be able to notify players quicker regarding SE and they are working on a system to fully automate the process so that in the future players will not be able to register at another casino sharing the same license if they are SE at one of the other casinos.

If I jumped the gun here or got over optimistic - my apologies.

As I mentioned, I am speaking with our CEO later today to discuss the situation and will report back.

Cheers

 

[Mouche12]

Update:

I posted yesterday that I believe that Mark should get his winnings - please don't confuse that with a promise to pay him his winnings.

EM came back to me (and replied to Mark as well) that "The customer will be payed only with the cumulative deposit amount after SE and winnings generated ante SE, if any.
It basically means that every deposit after SE will be returned to him and any winnings prior to SE are not affected.
His deposit of 200 GBP has already been returned to him."

I am still checking with our CEO what other options there are, if any.

We share our UK GC license with the following casinos, so what a SE at any one of these casinos is considered a self exclusion at any other of the casinos:

BeanBagSports
CasinoLuck
NoxWin
PlayHippo
SlotoBank
SuperLenny
casinofloor
CasinoCruise
NextCasino
jetful

EM are speeding up the SE reporting systems so what we will be able to notify players quicker regarding SE and they are working on a system to fully automate the process so that in the future players will not be able to register at another casino sharing the same license if they are SE at one of the other casinos.

If I jumped the gun here or got over optimistic - my apologies.

As I mentioned, I am speaking with our CEO later today to discuss the situation and will report back.

Cheers

This is a bit of a bummer - I did indeed interpret your first post that Casino Cruise would pay the OP his winnings. Returning (all) his deposits after SE is obvious, not doing so would be theft. I sympathise with the OP on these conflicting messages, and I also recall that another EM-based casinos DID pay the OP his winnings before closing his account. I hope that you and the CEO can work out a solution where the OP will get paid his winnings.

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

This is a bit of a bummer - I did indeed interpret your first post that Casino Cruise would pay the OP his winnings. Returning (all) his deposits after SE is obvious, not doing so would be theft. I sympathise with the OP on these conflicting messages, and I also recall that another EM-based casinos DID pay the OP his winnings before closing his account. I hope that you and the CEO can work out a solution where the OP will get paid his winnings.

Apologies for getting to excited about the options here, that's my mistake, sorry. The issue is that the player did SE on the same UK license that we are using and so according to UK GC regulations we need to refund the deposit. I just really hope this will be the last such case.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Apologies for getting to excited about the options here, that's my mistake, sorry. The issue is that the player did SE on the same UK license that we are using and so according to UK GC regulations we need to refund the deposit. I just really hope this will be the last such case.

What matters here is not the policy of Everymatrix vs your own policy, it's the UKGC rules. If UKGC rules say that you must pay the player, you don't have a choice in the matter, regardless of what the CEO of Everymatrix says.

You can't selectively obey just the UKGC rules that suit, they come as a package, and promotions emails must NOT be sent to players who have self excluded. Blaming affiliates just isn't really good enough, if your affiliates are using "black hat" marketing tactics like spamming and spoofing the "from" address in order to make the email appear to come from the casino itself, that is your responsibility, and the UKGC are likely to agree. Apart from this, and email marketing campaign is covered by the Advertising regulations, which are separate from those policed by the UKGC. These state that an advertisement must not mislead, and this mailer certainly did that.

As well as sorting out the responsible gambling systems so that they meet UKGC requirements, there are a few other things that need sorting out. Neglecting these could land casinos in trouble with the UK regulations, something that is still relatively new to an industry that for years has gotten used to being able to pick and choose jurisdictions that suit how they wish to treat their customers.

The "talk to the hand" attitude from Everymatrix in all of this is very poor indeed. What do they have to hide if they really are obeying all the regulations, and sincerely believe so. The impression I got is that they would have royally screwed this player over, buy not paying the win AND keeping the deposit, but later realised that he was a British player, and they would end up getting into trouble with the UKGC.

This also illustrates how little power even the CEO of an individual casino has over their operation. In effect, the CEO says "yes", but a subcontractor says "no" and actually WINS. This is a case of "the tail wagging the dog", but which is grossly misrepresented to the player as "the dog wagging the tail" when they visit individual Everymatrix casinos where it's the individuality of the casino that stands out, with the fact that it's using "Everymatrix software" being a mere footnote in the same vein as "accepts Neteller as payment method" would be seen. One would not deduce from this that it's actually the CEO of Neteller that calls the shots, yet it seems that the CEO of Everymatrix does in the case of these casinos.

Given the lack of detail coming from Everymatrix, how can they know that this was actually a qualifying self exclusion, as opposed to a "cooling off period" or the setting of deposit limits.

 

[peterhanneman]

Has this problem be solved now then? If so, I'm very happy for the person having all the issues. This is a lot of money.

 

[Tirilej]

Has this problem be solved now then? If so, I'm very happy for the person having all the issues. This is a lot of money.

Couldn't you have bothered to read the thread instead of asking?
You posted this a minute after your last post. Are you in a contest or something?

 

[Barrasboy]

Has this problem be solved now then? If so, I'm very happy for the person having all the issues. This is a lot of money.

No, it looks sadly like I will not be paid my winnings. Had my hopes raised then sadly dashed again!!

Best wishes
Mark

 

[Jono777]

Couldn't you have bothered to read the thread instead of asking?
You posted this a minute after your last post. Are you in a contest or something?

I am so glad to read your post!

I was just about to make a similar post, something along the lines of 'Top Posters' are all going to move down a space or 'I thought I talked too much'

 

[Tirilej]

I am so glad to read your post!

I was just about to make a similar post, something along the lines of 'Top Posters' are all going to move down a space or 'I thought I talked too much'

I've reported him too now. Why bother post that much saying nothing? Does he want his name in google or what is it about?

 

[Jono777]

I've reported him too now. Why bother post that much saying nothing? Does he want his name in google or what is it about?

I could not even hazard at a guess!

Maybe trying to build reputation but going in the opposite direction whilst trying???

 

[Barrasboy]

Update:

I posted yesterday that I believe that Mark should get his winnings - please don't confuse that with a promise to pay him his winnings.

EM came back to me (and replied to Mark as well) that "The customer will be payed only with the cumulative deposit amount after SE and winnings generated ante SE, if any.
It basically means that every deposit after SE will be returned to him and any winnings prior to SE are not affected.
His deposit of 200 GBP has already been returned to him."

I am still checking with our CEO what other options there are, if any.

We share our UK GC license with the following casinos, so what a SE at any one of these casinos is considered a self exclusion at any other of the casinos:

BeanBagSports
CasinoLuck
NoxWin
PlayHippo
SlotoBank
SuperLenny
casinofloor
CasinoCruise
NextCasino
jetful

EM are speeding up the SE reporting systems so what we will be able to notify players quicker regarding SE and they are working on a system to fully automate the process so that in the future players will not be able to register at another casino sharing the same license if they are SE at one of the other casinos.

If I jumped the gun here or got over optimistic - my apologies.

As I mentioned, I am speaking with our CEO later today to discuss the situation and will report back.

Cheers

Hi Lloyd,
With all due respect that list you published will not help anyone in the future. EveryMatrix have stated that if you SE from just one casino brand you will be excluded from ALL EveryMatrix brands in the entire group. For example if you SE from GUTS or Thrills casinos etc and then open an account with CasinoCruise you will still not get paid even though they are not on your license or list.

It is clear that EveryMatrix is your boss. Even though I think I am right in saying that you are a co- owner of CasinoCruise and the Affiliate Director. I think you should start calling every casino in the EveryMatrix brand in a clear manner so people are not misled. For example EveryMatrix CasinoCruise , EveryMatrix SuperLenny, EveryMatrix Thrills etc. There are so many brands in this group it is impossible for the layman to know who owns or runs who or what as there is no mention of EveryMatrix when you open an account to any of your casinos. The only mention of EveryMatrix is when you actually deposit, but other casino brands in the same group use a different deposit payment name such as ODDSMATRIX. Even at the deposit stage you could easily be misled into thinking another group runs the casino as the Payees that show up on your bank statement are different.

You do have a responsibility when taking customers hard earned money and enticing deposits to say who is actually covering the wagers and who decides who gets paid and who does not. The only clear conclusion we have arrived at on this thread is that CasinoCruise is just there to bring the customers in but does not have the sole responsibility to pay said customers. You get told what to do by a third party. This is fundamentally flawed.

If you can take the time to check a customer out when he makes a withdrawal you can certainly check when he makes a first deposit or even at the opening of an account stage. A simple search on the net shows this has been going on for a long time not just this week with EveryMatrix brands, they have done nothing to rectify it whatsoever.

Mark

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

Hi Mark,

In reply to your very valid comments:

With all due respect that list you published will not help anyone in the future. EveryMatrix have stated that if you SE from just one casino brand you will be excluded from ALL EveryMatrix brands in the entire group. For example if you SE from GUTS or Thrills casinos etc and then open an account with CasinoCruise you will still not get paid even though they are not on your license or list.

According to the UKGC file we have from EM:
4.12. In the event of closure of Your Account because of gambling addiction or if your account has been closed due to fraud you acknowledge that you are prohibited from opening a new Account.
The Company will not be liable if you manage to open a new account, for such action nor for any direct or indirect consequential damages. The company shall have the right to close, at any time, a new account opened in breach of the requirement stated herein.

It is clear that EveryMatrix is your boss. Even though I think I am right in saying that you are a co- owner of CasinoCruise and the Affiliate Director. I think you should start calling every casino in the EveryMatrix brand in a clear manner so people are not misled. For example EveryMatrix CasinoCruise , EveryMatrix SuperLenny, EveryMatrix Thrills etc. There are so many brands in this group it is impossible for the layman to know who owns or runs who or what as there is no mention of EveryMatrix when you open an account to any of your casinos. The only mention of EveryMatrix is when you actually deposit, but other casino brands in the same group use a different deposit payment name such as ODDSMATRIX. Even at the deposit stage you could easily be misled into thinking another group runs the casino as the Payees that show up on your bank statement are different.

Please refer to the footer on our site it clear states our relationship with EM:

ABOUT CASINO CRUISE

The website is operated and managed by EveryMatrix Ltd, a company bearing registration number C44411, and having its registered address at Suite 10, Level 4, Portomaso Business Tower, Vjal Portomaso, St.Julians, STJ 4011, Malta. EveryMatrix Ltd. is licensed and regulated by the Malta Gaming Authority (www.mga.org.mt) in virtue of a Class 1 license numbered MGA/CL1/497/2010
The Casino games, Quickfire, are provided by EveryMatrix N.V. a limited liability company incorporated under the laws of Curacao, bearing company registration number 108354 and having its registered address at Dr. Hugenholtzweg Z/N, Curacao and is licensed and regulated in virtue of license number No. 8048/JAZ granted by the Government of Curacao.

LICENSING AND REGULATION

The website is operated and managed by EveryMatrix Ltd, a company bearing registration number C44411, and having its registered address at Suite 10, Level 4, Portomaso Business Tower, Vjal Portomaso, St.Julians, STJ 4011, Malta. EveryMatrix Ltd. is licensed and regulated by the Malta Gaming Authority (www.mga.org.mt) in virtue of a Class 1 license numbered MGA/CL1/497/2010
The Casino games, Quickfire, are provided by EveryMatrix N.V. a limited liability company incorporated under the laws of Curacao, bearing company registration number 108354 and having its registered address at Dr. Hugenholtzweg Z/N, Curacao and is licensed and regulated in virtue of license number No. 8048/JAZ granted by the Government of Curacao.

GAME PROVIDERS

CasinoCruise.com is a complete multi-vendor online casino gaming platform, offering over 1000 high-quality games from the world’s top suppliers and software developers. Our website conveniently brings together the very best casino games as provided by Microgaming, NetEnt, Play’n Go, Vivo and Nyx, all in one place. Everything you need to embark on a first class casino gaming experience can be found right here, aboard CasinoCruise.com.

You do have a responsibility when taking customers hard earned money and enticing deposits to say who is actually covering the wagers and who decides who gets paid and who does not. The only clear conclusion we have arrived at on this thread is that CasinoCruise is just there to bring the customers in but does not have the sole responsibility to pay said customers. You get told what to do by a third party. This is fundamentally flawed.

This case only relates specifically to the case of self exclusion. When a player self excludes on a license they need to be treated by the licensee as having a self confessed gambling problem and their deposits returned to them and account closed. All withdrawals of moneys won that are in line with our terms and conditions are of course honoured.

If you can take the time to check a customer out when he makes a withdrawal you can certainly check when he makes a first deposit or even at the opening of an account stage. A simple search on the net shows this has been going on for a long time not just this week with EveryMatrix brands, they have done nothing to rectify it whatsoever.

We do receive from EM a report of SE clients under the group licensee but we need to improve the frequency of this reporting and the processes for closing new SE player accounts sooner. This is a correct and valid point.

Apologies for the frustration caused and as CM wrote himself in this thread - if you self exclude yourself from a casino you are admitting a gambling problem and should be taking a break from gambling.

Best wishes,
Lloyd

 

[FAZI1]

So if excluded from one of over 60 everymatrix casinos is gambling problem then how all rest everymatrix casinos can allowed same players to open acconts and collect deposits without problem ... Only in some day player win then got voided winings with reason - excluded in one of 60 everymatrix brands in past.


In one of your previous posts figured even Slotobank casino ( poor quality brands using often roqe practice) So if somone make excluded from roqe everymatrix brand Slotobank Then from this moment dont recived any money from his winnings in all rest everymatrix brands.

But can still play open new acconts and make deposits - just cant make withdrawal......

And one more things if somone make self excluded in roqe Slotobank - Self excluded always automatic is called gambling problem? - Or if somone just dont like casino / dont wonna recived no more spam to emails and after reading a lot complains in web decided close acconts so make self excluded.

Somone can say - You shoud go to live chat and ask to close acconts or send email with asking to close acconts - Mayby yes but in poor quality / roqe casinos like example slotobank - support team often just ignoring request like this and only way is make selfexcluded .

This is not only this person issue this is topic importand to all players who have in past any self exclude in one of all 60 everymatrix brands becose in this case all of them allowed to open acconts and colect deposits but not allowed to pay winnings

 

[Barrasboy]

First, thanks a lot.

In discussion with our CEO today I was informed that according to UKGC the licensee in this case must pay out the player. There is just the beaurocracy of who and how which I will sort out, quickly. That's only fair. Also, I will take the opportunity to sort out this SE issue, once and for all.

Lloyd as a Co - Owner of CasinoCruise you can't make statements like that above and not honour them.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I have been sent no evidence of any self exlusion from either you or EveryMatrix. As long as forum members see what type of casino this is my job is done. They can make their own minds up if they want to trust you with thier deposits. I have made a formal complaint to the UKGC in relation to you having no adequate complaint process or arbitration third party procedure or if you do I have not been offered it. I will also be sending a letter of notification to EveryMatrix London office this week. I would send one to you as well seeing as CasinoCruise took my deposits and I hold your casino responsible for sending me the email to my private email inviting me to open an account but seeing as you are in Israel that is not a practical option. I will never make an online deposit to any casino ever again after this fiasco. If a casino ever refuses to pay and honour a genuine wager it is time to leave.

Mark



Mark

 

[CasinoCruiseRep]

Lloyd as a Co - Owner of CasinoCruise you can't make statements like that above and not honour them.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I have been sent no evidence of any self exlusion from either you or EveryMatrix. As long as forum members see what type of casino this is my job is done. They can make their own minds up if they want to trust you with thier deposits. I have made a formal complaint to the UKGC in relation to you having no adequate complaint process or arbitration third party procedure or if you do I have not been offered it. I will also be sending a letter of notification to EveryMatrix London office this week. I would send one to you as well seeing as CasinoCruise took my deposits and I hold your casino responsible for sending me the email to my private email inviting me to open an account but seeing as you are in Israel that is not a practical option. I will never make an online deposit to any casino ever again after this fiasco. If a casino ever refuses to pay and honour a genuine wager it is time to leave.

Mark



Mark

That was a mistake of mine to write what I did to you without fully checking the situation. I was over motivated to try and help you but as things to turn out - the situation is as I posted above.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do but legally once you have SE the licensee must return your deposit and close your account, which was what happened.

All the best,
Lloyd