Resolved BET-AT.EU - bonus issue - resolved

[Casinomeister]

To the OP:

Have you ever had an account in this forum before? Just wonderin'.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Now, this is funny. You do know your own screenshot shows a payout of £6,232? As in, the screenshot YOU posted, from YOUR account? I don't know why it came split up and I will inquire Neteller about it, but lets revisit the fact YOUR screenshot shows £6,232 coming in from us. How you can possibly still claim we paid you only 6K and shortened you is beyond me.

Not to mention the fact that if I had to pay you £6,232, I like to think of myself slightly more rational than to short you for £200 odd, and cause us havoc. In that case I'd just invalidate the bonus and be done with it saving our casino a £6.2K payout with same outcome.

Anyway, this has become a complete waste of time. It is your prerogative to say what you desire about our casino. It is our prerogative to ban unwanted players. I stand behind our decision 100% on how to handle this case. It was a good resolution that fell on short on deaf ears. Unfortunately, cant win them all.

Again, enjoy your winnings.

Best of luck

Your processor has a single transaction limit of 2000 with Neteller. This means that when they receive an instruction from you to pay 6232, they have to split it into lots of 2000 plus a remainder, else it won't go through. Different processors have different limits, and I have seen this splitting of a withdrawal many times. It is possible that the processor split the amount between 2 batches, so the 3 lots of 2000 went on one day, whilst the remaining 232 arrived from the next batch which went the next day.

Processors usually batch withdrawals together for many players, and run them all as a "batch job" either when they have enough, or on a set schedule.

Rather than asking Neteller, ask your processor. You will probably get a similar, if not identical, explanation.

The OP is annoyed because their wagering after their big win didn't count because in your system it is not supposed to if won from the bonus balance. The standard is that it WOULD count, so the OP would have been looking for the wager to have counted, rather than having to wager the win an additional 3x after making another deposit.

It was such a good deal for the player because your WR itself was lower than it would otherwise have been if bonus bets DID count. You have here a case of a player wanting their cake and to eat it.

"fairness" in comparison to the norm would be better evaluated by rerunning their bets on a standard system where all the wagers counted, AND where the WR was much higher to start with to take account of this. under this, whilst the OPs wagers would have counted, the WR would NOT have been completed, and it is possible that the remaining WR would have been greater than the mediated solution of having to deposit again and turn the win over 3x.


The OP could well have ended WORSE off if she had gotten her way.

The system is a problem because it is so unusual, not that it is any worse. The expectation is that all wagers count towards releasing a bonus, so players would not naturally think to deposit again once they were playing with only bonus funds.

The OP tried to play the "sympathy card" to win you over, but all it did was have the responsible gambling team permanently ban her.

She can't be THAT hard up though, if this claim is true:-

I had to deposit around 3000 GBP in order to complete the wagering.........

So, despite being hard up, the OP still had 3 grand knocking about to use to complete the WR. Whatever "urgent need" there was for the early payment of the 6K could have been catered for by using the 3K she had.

It is possible that the "urgent need" was another juicy bonus offering elsewhere that was about to expire

 

[Casinomeister]

To the OP:

Have you ever had an account in this forum before? Just wonderin'.

Yawn...

 

[vinylweatherman]

.... nice crop of Peer to peer transactions too in that screenshot

That's the kind of thing that looks suspicious, and the OP might have taken better care in editing that screenshot, rather than posting in haste to make a point.

 

[Nifty29]

Yawn...

C'Mon Bryan.

My popcorn is getting cold.

 

[heador112]

The guy who submittet the pab is well known in other forums and has also an account here (which is permanently bannend) .There is also a thread in a bonus forum about his pab .
It is a pretty stange guy who think he is the "king of onlinegambling". Actually its just a ordinary fraudster with international multiple accounts .

@BET-AT
It was mistake to pay this guy at all before making additional security checks .Some suggestions :

1. Request a photo of "her" holding "her" passport in hand . (This makes all fraudsters mad)

2. Contact the Neteller risk management and check the P2P transfers "she" made. I am sure you will find several connectet accounts which have played at your casino . (Even on his screenshot you can see he made several P2P transfers this is always a big red flag .

3.Ask for "her" notarized documents from a police station with a telephone number so you can check if the documents have been notarized there . And check if the police station exist . If you request notarized documents without these information this nasty guy will sent you again his photoshopped crap.

If you can , cancel the Neteller payout and make additional securty checks . I am 100 % sure he cant pass it .

 

[Igor82]

The guy who submittet the pab is well known in other forums and has also an account here (which is permanently bannend) .There is also a thread in a bonus forum about his pab here.
It is a pretty stange guy who think he is the "king of onlinegambling". Actually its just a ordinary fraudster with international multiple accounts .

@BET-AT
It was mistake to pay this guy at all before making additional security checks .Some suggestions :

1. Request a photo of "her" holding "her" passport in hand . (This makes all fraudsters mad)

2. Contact the Neteller risk management and check the P2P transfers . I am sure you will find several connectet accounts whcih have played at your casino . (Even on his screenshot you ca see he made several P2P transfers this is always a big red flag .

3.Ask for "her" notarized documents from a police station with a telephone number so you can check if the documents have been notarized there . And check if the police station exist . If you request notarized documents without these information this nasty guy will sent you again his photoshopped crap.

If you can , cancel the Neteller payout and make additional securty checks . I am 100 % sure he cant pass it .

All, I really appreciate the efforts - it's amazing to see the community also stand behind an operator.

Thankfully - in this case our 3rd party ID checker and Neteller both confirmed the identity as true.

I wish it wasn't - I would have loved to try and reverse the payout, but alas it is what it is

As I said before, good luck to her. The case wasn't fraudulent and she deserved her payout in full. I would have said I could have done without the bad PR a week ago, but in retrospect after these pages it wasn't even bad PR at all. People were honest and rational from the get-go which is amazing to see! Just a lot of hype over what should have been a satisfactory open & shut case.

Can't win them all...

Thanks once again!

 

[Igor82]

1. Request a photo of "her" holding "her" passport in hand . (This makes all fraudsters mad)

2. Contact the Neteller risk management and check the P2P transfers "she" made. I am sure you will find several connectet accounts whcih have played at your casino . (Even on his screenshot you can see he made several P2P transfers this is always a big red flag .

3.Ask for "her" notarized documents from a police station with a telephone number so you can check if the documents have been notarized there . And check if the police station exist . If you request notarized documents without these information this nasty guy will sent you again his photoshopped crap.

Love the suggestions BTW - first one isn't being implemented but will be from now. Thank you very much!

 

[Steve Russo]

All, I really appreciate the efforts - it's amazing to see the community also stand behind an operator.

Not really -- a good operator will usually get the support of the players. Each player who tries to cheat a casino makes it more difficult for the honest ones to collect when they win.

 

[heador112]

Thankfully - in this case our 3rd party ID checker and Neteller both confirmed the identity as true.

Maybe the person is real and he paid her to use her identity . I wouldnt be surprised if we talk about several 100 Neteller accounts here . Checking P2P transfers on Neteller is the best way to find out if you deal with a fraudster .

 

[Steve Russo]

1. Request a photo of "her" holding "her" passport in hand . (This makes all fraudsters mad)

I have a problem with casinos requiring passports at all. For a start, many people do not have them (this is especially true in the US and Australia). Beyond that, with identity theft being such a major problem, I would be hesitant to send anyone a copy of my passport. Indeed, if you do, you might find yourself a suspect in the killing of someone by an intelligence agency.

 

[heador112]

I have a problem with casinos requiring passports at all. For a start, many people do not have them (this is especially true in the US and Australia). Beyond that, with identity theft being such a major problem, I would be hesitant to send anyone a copy of my passport. Indeed, if you do, you might find yourself a suspect in the killing of someone by an intelligence agency.

In generell i agree with you . This shouldnt be a standard security check . It is only for "red flag" players.

 

[vinylweatherman]

All, I really appreciate the efforts - it's amazing to see the community also stand behind an operator.

Thankfully - in this case our 3rd party ID checker and Neteller both confirmed the identity as true.

I wish it wasn't - I would have loved to try and reverse the payout, but alas it is what it is

As I said before, good luck to her. The case wasn't fraudulent and she deserved her payout in full. I would have said I could have done without the bad PR a week ago, but in retrospect after these pages it wasn't even bad PR at all. People were honest and rational from the get-go which is amazing to see! Just a lot of hype over what should have been a satisfactory open & shut case.

Can't win them all...

Thanks once again!

Act in haste, repent at leisure

This is an unwise move, and will REALLY give you a dose of pad PR. In effect, it is a "chargeback of losses" by the casino, not much different from a player who has a bad session, and decides that the casino must have cheated, so disputes the charges.

Best get the checking done BEFORE making the payment.

This is probably not fraud in any case, but evidence that you are dealing with an experienced "advantage player", perhaps a "syndicate", rather than a hard up Glasgow lass that "needs the money urgently".

Checking the other emails to see whether they belong to other players at the casino is worthwhile, as it may reveal a bigger picture. Also, these email addresses could end up belonging to new players that register after the OP has been paid, and who may well be playing with money supplied via Peer to Peer from this payout. This would be a "syndicate".

Although there are only 10 transactions shown, the earliest was a "loan" of £400 which was immediately used for the deposit that completed WR and released the £6232. As soon as it was paid, around £3000 of it was forwarded to other Neteller accounts for purposes unknown. This is quite some money movement over 3 days for a "hard up Glasgow lass".

I am surprised that this screenshot even appeared, as payment had already been made, and it was after picking a fight over some minor issue related to how the processor split and batched the payout. Showing such a crop of suspicious transactions to the forum, including the rep for the casino she was battling, does not seem to have been well thought out.

I find it hard to believe this amateur display comes from an "international fraudster" with a reputation for multi-accounting on a large scale.

As for the photo of a player holding a passport, it does not have to be a passport, any of the documents supplied can have their credibilty enhanced by having the player go though this additional step. This type of photo is much harder to fake than a simple scan of a document.

Unfortunately, it does not just make the fraudsters mad, it makes innocent players mad because they know such requests are only made when they have been branded as bogus players by the security team.

 

[Casinomeister]

The guy who submittet the pab is well known in other forums and has also an account here (which is permanently bannend) .There is also a thread in a bonus forum about his pab .
It is a pretty stange guy who think he is the "king of onlinegambling". Actually its just a ordinary fraudster with international multiple accounts ...

I'm pretty sure I know who it is too - this member had multi accounts here and was banned for a number of things.

Gameon hasn't replied to this thread as well.

@Bet-at-eu - you may have been taken for a ride here.

 

[hakapuku]

Maybe the person is real and he paid her to use her identity . I wouldnt be surprised if we talk about several 100 Neteller accounts here . Checking P2P transfers on Neteller is the best way to find out if you deal with a fraudster .

How do you know all that ? Are you a fraudster yourself ? May be a former fraudster?

 

[Nifty29]

How do you know all that ? Are you a fraudster yourself ? May be a former fraudster?

ORENn't you going to ask who the fraudster is?

He might have been born in 1976.

The sad thing is that everyone at the bonus fraud/whore forum he belongs to know he is a crook and let him go about his business anyway. Says a lot about people who belong to bleatingbonuses.

The casino definitely got taken for a ride. Actually, all of us did, as we are the ones who pay the price.

 

[vinylweatherman]

ORENn't you going to ask who the fraudster is?

He might have been born in 1976.

The sad thing is that everyone at the bonus fraud/whore forum he belongs to know he is a crook and let him go about his business anyway. Says a lot about people who belong to bleatingbonuses.

The casino definitely got taken for a ride. Actually, all of us did, as we are the ones who pay the price.

Kudos for the casino though, they had no actual proof, so paid up anyway. They knew something didn't add up, but couldn't find it. The OP seems to have let their guard slip though, and has volunteered an additional piece of the puzzle. Had this come to light before payment, the casino could have followed up on the connected accounts via Peer to Peer transfers.

Maybe this was just the start, and evidence that the casino and this bonus have been targetted by one or more syndicates, perhaps even fraudsters. With this additional knowledge, they may save more than the £6232 they paid out, and without any particularly bad PR.

The OP started well, but kept slipping up when placed under scrutiny. Had she protested less and been more patient, she would probably have gotten cleanly away without any suspicions being cast.

 

[Gameon]

Wow Bet-At must be very happy with the hype they got.

What are you talking about ? I had to beg for some money from my Ex and EXEXEXEX boyfriends. I almost had to sleep with one of them . I was able to return them the money so all is ok.

Bye bye from Glasgow

 

[vinylweatherman]

Wow Bet-At must be very happy with the hype they got.

What are you talking about ? I had to beg for some money from my Ex and EXEXEXEX boyfriends. I almost had to sleep with one of them . I was able to return them the money so all is ok.

Bye bye from Glasgow

All is bollocks.

You are a hard up Glasgow lass, yet you managed to persuade FOUR exes to loan you 3 grand, and they all had Neteller accounts too!


This is such a crock of ****.

Better tell your exes to stay clear of Bet-at-eu with that money

The ONLY reason they might lend you such sums is that they are fully aware of what you are up to, and know it is pretty much a "no-lose" situation. Since they all have Neteller accounts, they too must be into online gambling.

It is statistically improbable that by chance a Glasgow lass has had 4 consecutive relationships with lads who are keen on online gambling. More likely that all 5 of you have a common link based on an interest in online gambling, and that any relationships were forged from this common interest, and died just as quickly because other than this, you had little else in common.

Far more probable is that these were mere "business relationships" between members of the same player syndicate.

The initial account of your betting strategy shows you to be well versed in the various strategies employed by advantage players, and contradict your assertion that you are merely a hard up Glasgow lass for which this is a one off lifechanging win.

Your mistake was to try to gain sympathy by posting that Neteller screenshot, instead, you hanged yourself because it showed pretty clear signs that you move substantial sums of eMoney between yourself and fellow players, which is the hallmark of a syndicate, and could be evidence of fraud if other corrobarating evidence, such as using other players' identities yourself, is found.

 

[mattsgame]

Wow Bet-At must be very happy with the hype they got.

What are you talking about ? I had to beg for some money from my Ex and EXEXEXEX boyfriends. I almost had to sleep with one of them . I was able to return them the money so all is ok.

Bye bye from Glasgow

Thanks for my daily laugh.. so one of the EX's lent you $876.75, no wonder he is an ex then couldn't let the 75c slide

Some piece of work you are, it's a shame the casino didn't catch onto you earlier..

Hopefully this leads to most of your account and friends to be banned (at other casinos) , this is why genuine players suffer so much.

 

[Casinomeister]

Wow Bet-At must be very happy with the hype they got.

What are you talking about ? I had to beg for some money from my Ex and EXEXEXEX boyfriends. I almost had to sleep with one of them . I was able to return them the money so all is ok.

Bye bye from Glasgow

You're one hell of a weirdo.

Bye bye from CM.

 

[Seventh777]

Another aspect of her Neteller screenshot that has been slightly overlooked, it has her name right at the top for all to see, I think Bryan whom has many contacts out there should forward her name to every casino software provider out there, so they can pass on this information to the respective casino`s using their product .

 

[Casinomeister]

Another aspect of her Neteller screenshot that has been slightly overlooked, it has her name right at the top for all to see, I think Bryan whom has many contacts out there should forward her name to every casino software provider out there, so they can pass on this information to the respective casino`s using their product .

Actually, I have a newsletter for i-gaming industry folk with about 800 subscribers (to include Neteller admins). I'll just include this thread in the next edition

 

[vinylweatherman]

Actually, I have a newsletter for i-gaming industry folk with about 800 subscribers (to include Neteller admins). I'll just include this thread in the next edition

She must be kicking herself now for getting carried away and including that screenshot. It could bring down the entire syndicate

 

[Seventh777]

Actually, I have a newsletter for i-gaming industry folk with about 800 subscribers (to include Neteller admins). I'll just include this thread in the next edition

Awesome, I think Igor handled this with immense dignity and kept his integrity intact, even though he must be biting the bullet, mucho kudos to Igor.

Here we have a blatant example of a fraudulent syndicate that will be a beneficial read to members from both sides of the fence, especially newly formed casino reps, and those who question Nifty`s zero tolerance policy when he sniffs a rat .