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Gambling is bad, lucrative and wont dissappear...This industry just gets better every day...

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:notworthy :notworthy :notworthy
 
reply!!

QUOTE........ (As I write this, the headline on the Powerball home page reads, "North Carolina Man Claims $800,000 Power Play Prize!" You have to dig two clicks into the site to see the odds of winning. The grand prize? 146,107,962 to 1. That's the odds of you and me both picking the same second in the same four and a half years). (I was thinking of June 3, 2004, at 10:42:08 in the morning. You?)


Whats the odds of online, I have never seen any odds for a progressive ?





QUOTE....... Face it, folks. Lotteries are nothing more than a state-sponsored tax on the mathematically impaired


True.
At least they post the odds.
And in Canada anyway EH!
The money is directed back into the community. (so they say)
(at least its not some island masked man getting rich...LOL)








QUOTE.......... And let's look at the target audience. Lotteries appeal to lower-income people — exactly the kind of folks who shouldn't be wasting their money on the government's high-odds gambling. Yet the government gives it the big thumbs up. Horse racing (especially off-track betting) and brick and mortar casinos also target the people who can least afford to lose their money.



LOL....BS....OPEN for comments. I dont agree.








QUOTE............. Online gambling, on the other hand, at least requires a computer, Internet access, and a credit card. Certainly some of the people doing it can't afford to lose that money, but they're at least not the poorest of the poor.



OK so ......they have basic needs, now we can get hooked on slots ETC....FCKN window dressing....tell the truth, you dont want the FCKN people on the streets, you want the cards and bank accounts......:thumbsup:






QUOTE.............. Further, unlike lotteries, many online games are games of skill, not entirely chance — poker comes to mind. People can and do make money gambling in casinos, online or in person. There aren't people who make money playing the lottery.

More window dressing..... Poker yes...some skilll. The rest FCK the skill its chance. Gambling....again as stated before

YOU LOSE


Why is it any different then the state lottery.

odds....NO

THE MONEY IS LEAVING THE USA/ CANADA

.........


:lolup:
 
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You see, it's a two pronged attack on preventing people from gambling. First once this bill pass, people won't be able to go online and gamble and then they will continue to raise the oil prices and prevent people from driving to the nearest casino, cause it will not be worth it. See, the US government is so damn smart. Next bill pending, is prohibiting the manufacturing of bicycle axles. This way people can't ride their bicycles to the casinos.
 
one other thing


QUOTE....... So while there's at least a rational argument to be made that gambling is bad and should be banned or regulated, it crosses into the realm of hypocrisy when it focuses only on the online version...


BS..THE USA?CAN? what the FCK ever.... Where are we sending the $$$$ to were it shouldnt be, does it go to HEZBOLLA?????

FCK I dont know....

............just a thought...........
 
NoMouthToScream said:
You see, it's a two pronged attack on preventing people from gambling. First once this bill pass, people won't be able to go online and gamble and then they will continue to raise the oil prices and prevent people from driving to the nearest casino, cause it will not be worth it. See, the US government is so damn smart. Next bill pending, is prohibiting the manufacturing of bicycle axles. This way people can't ride their bicycles to the casinos.


WTF does this have to do with sending money.....Bags and Bags out of the country to support whatever.
 
cslate said:
More window dressing..... Poker yes...some skilll. The rest FCK the skill its chance. Gambling....again as stated before

YOU LOSE


Why is it any different then the state lottery.

odds....NO

THE MONEY IS LEAVING THE USA/ CANADA

Actually the author doesnt lose :)

In the end you agree that Money is leaving USA/Canada - so what should govt do to solve this issue? Regulate it and Tax it - Thats what the author said :)

-------------------
QUOTE - The second two arguments — that it's unregulated and untaxed — well, gee, I wonder what we could do about that. Perhaps, um, regulate and tax it? That's what the British do, generating millions in revenue from something people are going to do whether or not it's legal. Online gambling is a $12 billion industry, about half of which comes from the U.S. How many schoolbooks do you think the revenue on that could buy?
-------------------

Cheers!
 
Don't be fooled, gambling doesn't get worse online.
(LOL)

Once again, our esteemed legislators are acting as if something done online is somehow different than if it's done offline. A bill to ban libraries from offering access to MySpace is a perfect example. There are a lot of places in the world where kids can be in danger, but which one makes the news? The online one.


WHERE DO THEY MEET THEM?

TYPICALLY ON LINE.

OR GRAB THEM FROM A PLAYGROUND, WITH WITNESSES.


OR JUST MAYBE THEY SET UP A TIME/ APPOINTMENT THROUGH THE INTERNET TO MEET THEM IN A SECLUDED AREA...

COME ONWE HAVE HAD PLACES KIDS AND DANGER FOR YEARS..

ONLY RECENTLY THROUGH TECHNOLIGY HAVE WE BEEN ABLE TO BE PROACTIVE.








The latest attack on the online version of a common offline activity comes courtesy of the Internet Gambling Prohibition and Enforcement Act (IGPEA, which I pronounce "ig-pee-uh"). It's a bill that passed the House, and if the Senate approves it will essentially prohibit any online gambling that crosses state lines or goes out of the country.
It's a bill with at least some teeth it would prohibit banks and credit card companies from transferring money, so it doesn't need to rely on citizens' cooperation with the law.



WHAT ABOUT NETELLER /FIREPAY OR INSTADEBIT.JUST TO NAME A FEW IN THE JUMBLED WORLD TO GET YOUR MONEY FROM A-B.
UNREGULATED OR SECURED .PERHAPS.
DO YOU KNOW?








Unfortunately, the bill comes across as yet another "blame the Internet" law. Let's look at its problems
BLAME THE INTERNET?
FOR WHAT..
PROVIDING PEOPLE TO ACCESESS SITES TO FLOW AMERICAN /CANADIAN MONEY OVERSEAS.
UNREGULATED.

HMMM.I WOULDNT BLAM THE INTERNAT FOR THAT.
PERHAPS PROVINCIAL AND FEDERAL LAWS ALLOWING TRANSFER OF SUCH FUNDS.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?








Depending on who you ask, there are various reasons for wanting to ban interstate and international gambling, starting with the ethical issue. Some people just think gambling is bad, and if they think so, then darn it they're going to make sure no one can do it.


YES OF COURSE.IT IS BAD TO SOME
BUT
WHERE DOES THE MONEY GO?
DO YOU KNOW?


I DONT AND NEITHER DOES THE GOVERNMENT OF CAN/USA.
PERHAPS IF IT WAS REGULATED WE WOULD KNOW AND HAVE SUPPORT PROGRAMS FOR GAMBLERS ON A FEDERAL LEVEL NOT JUST PRIVINCIAL SPONSERSHIP.


WHAT DOES ONLINE GAMBLING SUPPORT.HMMMM.
CERTAIN POLITICAL PARTIES
TERRORISTS???
WHATEVER WHO KNOWS ?????
DO YOU KNOW.?
IF YOU KNOW PLEASE LET ME KNOW AND OUR FEDERAL GOVERNMENT OR FBI.







This kind of logic "if I think it's yucky, no one should be allowed to do it" pervades our lawmaking.
Offer all the arguments you want, but the only reason people want to ban gay marriage or politically incorrect speech is because they think it's yucky, ergo, no one should be allowed to do it. Gambling, to a lot of people, is yucky..




HALF THE THINGS WE DO IN NORT AMERICA ARE YUCKY.
BUT REGULATED.
FOR EXAMPLE I LIVE IN A PROVINCE (NS) WHERE GAMBLING IS REGULATED..
IS IT RIGHT?
NO!!!!!!!
WITH THE PROPER WINDOW DRESSING I.EPROFITS TO PAY FOR EDUCATION /HEALTH CARE
ITS SOLD AND WE BECOME DEPEDANT ON THE INCOME.
DO I WANT TO LIVE IN AN ADDICTION DRIVIEN SOCIETY?
NO!!!!!

BUT I KNOW WHERE THE MONEY IS GOING.










Others will point out that addictive gambling can destroy families. And this is absolutely true. But a lot of things can hurt or destroy families, and we can't go around banning every activity that has potential to do harm. Should we jail people for poor money management? For not spending enough time with their kids? For watching too much TV?



WOW !! YOU HAVE SAID SOMETHING MOST WILL AGREE WITH.

PEOPLE ARE JAILED FOR POOR MONEY MANAGEMENT, USUALLY STOLEN FROM A COMPANY TO PAY FOR GAMBLING DEBTS.
HMMM.INTERESTING ARTICLE RECENTLY IN THE UK IN REGARDS.








A lot of things can hurt or destroy families,

SO WHY PROMOTE ITVESTED INTREST.
PERHAPS..






So instead of being consistent, we ban the things we don't like, then we make excuses for the things that somehow are deemed "lesser" evils. That's why we have seat-belt laws but not red-meat quotas, and why we ban marijuana but not alcohol.

CONSISTANT..WTF IS YOUR COUNTRY DOING TO SAVE YOUR ASS SO YOU CAN PARTAKE IN THESE SO CALLED LESSER EVILS.
AT LEAST ALCOHOL, TOBACCO AND GAMBLING ARE TAXED AND USED TO BENEFIT YOU AND YOUR SAFETY.








Gambling falls between "bad things we like" and "bad things we don't like," so we regulate the heck out of it but don't ban it outright. That is, until you throw the Internet into the mix. The deep, dark Net pushes gambling onto the side of evil, and thus begins the effort to ban online gambling.
When it comes to things we don't like, the Internet is high on the list. Why? It's a scary place because people can share things and ideas that are different than our own. People can do things and say things that we don't like.

TRUESO WHY NOT REGULATE IT TO INTERPROVICIAL/ STATE.
AT LEAST WE KNOW THE ODDS AND WHERE THE MONEY WILL BE USED
NOT AGAINST US


Not sure if I'm right? Look at the arguments being given to ban online gambling: It's bad, it hurts families, it's not regulated, and its not taxed.

YES..YOU NAILED IT EH!!
BUT WHERE IS THE MONEY GOING???


The first two arguments apply to gambling itself, not just online gambling, yet they're only being used against the Internet-based variety.
The second two arguments that it's unregulated and untaxed well, gee, I wonder what we could do about that. Perhaps, um, regulate and tax it? That's what the British do, generating millions in revenue from something people are going to do whether or not it's legal. Online gambling is a $12 billion industry, about half of which comes from the U.S. How many schoolbooks do you think the revenue on that could buy?

YES. WHY WOULDNT WE TAX AND REGULATE IT.
AGAIN WHERE DOES THAT MONEY GO?
Hmmm.bombs/anthrax... do you know?
WHAT ARE WE FIGHTING AS NORTH AMERICANS?
IS THIS NOT A LINK TO OVERSEAS?
SEEMS TO ME LIKE IT IS!!!!!!!
I AM NOT SAYING STOP GAMBLING, BUT AT LEAST REGULATE IT TO YOUR HOME STATE OR PROVINCE.





If you aren't sure that the proposed anti-online-gambling law is more about the Internet than it is about gambling, think about this: The government is perfectly happy with offline gambling, whether it's horse racing, dog racing, Vegas casinos, or state lotteries.
The feds' excuse: Those things are state issues, and it's only banning interstate and international gambling. Of course, what's a state issue and what's a Federal issue is more about how far Congress thinks it can push something. That's why the feds regulate marijuana but states regulate alcohol.
But the hypocrisy becomes clear when you look at what's permitted.
Take state lotteries Lotto, Mega Millions, Powerball, and their ilk. Those are not only legal; they're encouraged by the state governments.


AGAIN PROFITS USED TO BENEFIT YOUR STATE/ PROVINCE THROUGH DEFENSE HEALTHCARE, ROADS ETC..WHY NOT



As I write this, the headline on the Powerball home page reads, "North Carolina Man Claims $800,000 Power Play Prize!" You have to dig two clicks into the site to see the odds of winning. The grand prize? 146,107,962 to 1. That's the odds of you and me both picking the same second in the same four and a half years. (I was thinking of June 3, 2004, at 10:42:08 in the morning. You?)

AT LEAST THEY PAY THE WIN AND DISCLOSE THE ODDS.
ONLINE IF YOU ARE FORTUNAT TO WIN, GETTING PAID IS ALWAYS AN ISSUE; JUST DO SOME INVESTIGATING AND YOU MAY BE SURPRISED.





How about something more reasonable, say, the odds of winning $4 on a $1 bet? That's 127 to 1. Mega Millions isn't much different; the odds of winning a $2.00 prize is 75 to 1.
Compare the odds for roulette: 37 to 1 for the biggest payout.
Face it, folks. Lotteries are nothing more than a state-sponsored tax on the mathematically impaired.

WELL PERHAPS, ITS BUYER BEWARE WITH THE ODDS, AT LEAST YOU KNOW WHAT TOUR GETTING. (CAVEAT EMPTOR)
ONLINE IS ANOTHER ISSUEUSUALLY JUST GETTING PAID IS A CHALLENGE UNLESS YOU ARE WELL SCHOOLED IN THE SCAMS TO PREVENT YOU FROM CASHING OUT.
OH
OOPS
I ALMOST FORGOT ABOUT THE FEEL GOOD EMAILS THAT SAY PEOPLE IN CERTAIN CICUMSTANCES I.E DEPRESSED, RECENT BREAK UP WHAT EVER YOU GET THE PICTURE., JUST IMAGIN YOU WILL GET RICH FROM USING THEIR SITE JUST ONCE GAMBLING WITH JUST A MINIMAL 50$ DEPSOIT..I THINK WE KNOW WHICH CASINO GROUP THAT IS.
DISGUSTING.

WELL THATS JUST SPAM I GUESS WHO WOULD READ THAT, ONLY THE MATHMATICALLY IMPAIRED.





And let's look at the target audience. Lotteries appeal to lower-income people exactly the kind of folks who shouldn't be wasting their money on the government's high-odds gambling. Yet the government gives it the big thumbs up. Horse racing (especially off-track betting) and brick and mortar casinos also target the people who can least afford to lose their money.

WELL AT LEAST IN CANADA WHEN I PASS A FINACIALLY CHANGELLED PERSON BUYING A TICKET FOR THE LOTTERY AT LEASTIT IS GOING TOWARDS MY PROVINCE AND NOT SOME MASKED MAN OR SOME ISLAND WITH A BOMB.





Online gambling, on the other hand, at least requires a computer, Internet access, and a credit card. Certainly some of the people doing it can't afford to lose that money, but they're at least not the poorest of the poor.

FREE PUBLIC ACCESS COMPUTERSLIBRARIES ETC.
OR MAYBE A UNIVERSITY LOAN I WOULD SAY MOST COMPANIES TARGET UNIVERSITY KIDS STARTING OUT, NO RESPOSIBILITIES, NO IDEA HOW LONG IT TAKES TO PAY BACK ETC.
COME ON ..





Further, unlike lotteries, many online games are games of skill, not entirely chance poker comes to mind. People can and do make money gambling in casinos, online or in person. There aren't people who make money playing the lottery.

WOW THIS JUST KEEPS GETTING BETTER.
POKER
YES SOME SKILL.SOME LUCK

CASINO..GOOD LUCK..HOUSE HAS THE EDGE IN EVERY GAME.WHAT SKILL IS INVOLVED.
OH AND YA .ADD THAT WITH TRYING TO GET PAID
YOU LOSE.





So while there's at least a rational argument to be made that gambling is bad and should be banned or regulated, it crosses into the realm of hypocrisy when it focuses only on the online version.

NOT SAYING IT IS GOOD BUT REGULATION IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

AGAIN JUST MY THOUGHTS.


Posted 8/3/2006 4:50 PM ET
Updated 8/3/2006 6:08 PM ET E-mail | Save | Print | Subscribe to stories like this
 
CS Slate,

If you want to live in a highly regulated state/country - you should move to China :)

Just a thought ;)

Cheers!
 
cslate said:
BS..THE USA?CAN? what the FCK ever.... Where are we sending the $$$$ to were it shouldnt be, does it go to HEZBOLLA?????..

Yes, the vast majority of online gaming funds go directly to Hezbollah and various other topical evil groups. I know you thought it was a bunch of pasty middle-aged white guys in the Caymans spending your losses on yachts, but turns out that's just a front. I know for a fact Abu Sayaff designed the Jungle Jim slot, and I heard the KKK had a hand in Moonshine.
 
At least the article has generated some thoughts

As I said before.. its an excellent view of the problem...

Gambling is bad, fun and won't dissappear... Applying those policies the US goverment is applying will only end in more unregulated business... Bookies will be back to the streets and more problems will be caused. Not mentioning how the american gambling community might feel regarding their so called "freedom". I am sure most of them are not feeling comfortable with some guys telling you where you can or can't spend your money or which sites you can or can't visit. Online gambling is becoming like the Internet's Cuba. A place and activity they don't want you to know about or do business with... To dangerous for "our citizens"... or is it our precious green dollars??
 
By the way online gambling is not regulated in the UK though there is a push to have it regulated 2007
It is currently illegal to run an online gambling company from the UK as with all online Casinos the servers are based off shore and in dark corners to avoid tax and regulation. (not that online gambling is still a shady practice ;)
One thing that still amazes most Brits about the American lobbiest who want Gambling banned is that they refuse to learn from history.Regulating it is the sensible way forward but as an asside once it is regulated and Taxed by the US goverment will you be any the wiser to which terrorist group/freedom fighters your tax dollars will fund?:eek2:
 
This whole notion of profits from online gaming funding terrorist organizations and the like is just complete and utter BS. Not only is it BS but it's BS that reinvents itself taking into consideration what's topical/politically useful. I seem to remember online gaming was funding Columbian druglords and sex-trafficking a few years back.

Linking money in international business with any organization you like is childishly easy, it's like playing the 6 degrees of seperation game with actors (only way easier). You could just as easily 'link' the Catholic church, Krispy Kremes or NASCAR with Hezbollah.

Prohibiting online gaming is solely about tax money. And that's FINE, maybe that's a good reason to ban it, there's certainly an argument to be made there. But why can't this society have some honest debate and just say that's what it is, instead of utilizing all these contrived, fictional and totally ridiculous arguments. It's just total BS all of it and it's what makes me despair of politics.
 
Couldn't said it better

I agree 100% with you...

Its the policy of fear. What they do is link everything they don't approve or like with topics like terrorism, drugs, child abuse, etc.

They only reason why they are fighting to ban online gambling is because they are not taking their cut of the cake. Simple as that.

Regarding compulsive gambling, lotteries and horse racing cause the same effect. How many people expend thousands of dollars a month on state lotteries?? But thats ok, since the goverment is proffiting from it.

The US just likes to be on control of everything, since they are not controlling the gambling business; the show it to the people as a major threat
 
guesswest said:
This whole notion of profits from online gaming funding terrorist organizations and the like is just complete and utter BS. Not only is it BS but it's BS that reinvents itself taking into consideration what's topical/politically useful. I seem to remember online gaming was funding Columbian druglords and sex-trafficking a few years back.

Linking money in international business with any organization you like is childishly easy, it's like playing the 6 degrees of seperation game with actors (only way easier). You could just as easily 'link' the Catholic church, Krispy Kremes or NASCAR with Hezbollah.

Prohibiting online gaming is solely about tax money. And that's FINE, maybe that's a good reason to ban it, there's certainly an argument to be made there. But why can't this society have some honest debate and just say that's what it is, instead of utilizing all these contrived, fictional and totally ridiculous arguments. It's just total BS all of it and it's what makes me despair of politics.

That's a thoughtful post with which I am generally in agreement, Guestwest, but I think the motivation behind these repeated US attempts to cripple or ban online gambling is more varied than the tax cake.

I think the legislators are strongly influenced by powerful interest groups and their desire to be perceived as politically correct (which probably applies to most politicians, everywhere LOL!)

It's a fine line they tread between religious zealots and very powerful political contributors like the horse racing, Indian casinos and sports lobbies and I believe that is evidenced by the constant wheeling and dealing and hypocritical carve-outs as we go through this snake dance every year. Up to now that has worked for the industry, because the various interests often pulled in opposite directions.

Complicating the issue is the position of the major land casino interests (although they seem to be moving more toward regulation these days as the industry goes through the $12 billion mark and still gathers steam) and the different attitudes of diverse US state governments that have themselves their own *special* interests like Indian gaming and lotteries, and jealously guard their state rights.

Online gambling, especially in the aftermath of the political embarrassment of lobbying scandals such as the Abramoff affair is a high profile target where the *moral* positions of politicians can safey be strutted imo.

Few of these politicians have thus far supported a bi-partisan Congressional investigation before deciding that the industry is bad for American morals/funds terrorism/drugs/is run by the mob etc etc. How sensible is that - trying to kill something without first taking an objective look at it?

Why are the numerous player polls that overwhelmingly call for regulation rather than prohibition in the States ignored?

I suspect it is because these guys know that such an investigation will show that the bulk of the industry has highly trackable systems that pretty much comply with international moneylaundering requirements demanded by the FATF. That the c/card chargeback ratio is lower than most other Internet businesses and that regulation could have a beneficial impact for the player....but possibly not for competing interests.

I think they know that the US players would be better served by large American or American domiciled groups operating under strict state regulation and that those groups would thrive.

The question is: do they really care?
 
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A lot of good points there. You're right I was being a bit simplistic/myopic with my OP. I was mostly just expressing my irritation at the whole terrorism and criminality thing that permeates this debate.

You're right that the religious right has some bearing on this issue, especially under the current administration and political climate. I don't think the religious right is really at odds with state interests like lotteries/horse racing etc tho. Both of these groups have a shared interest in suppressing online gaming, albeit for very different reasons. It's probably in fact that dichotomy which propels this debate in the realm of BS, because neither side can express their actual reasons without also attacking a group co-supporting legislation like HR 4777 on the other side of the fence.

Nevertheless, for all the myriad interests here, anti-gambling legislation would have no chance of getting thru the house (nevermind the senate) on idealogical objections alone. It's a financial issue at heart and that's where I feel it has teeth. And as I said in my last post, that's ok, maybe an inability to tax online gaming is a reasonable reason to prohibit it. I'm not arguing that position, but I'm sure there's an argument to be made. The US economy could certainly use a boost after 6 years of disastrous fiscal policy. I just wish we could have that debate instead of throwing around ridiculous red herrings like the notion that online gaming is funding terrorism.
 
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You're right - and the irony is that taxing the really significant portions of the industry (ie those prepared to domicile in the USA and be taxed in return for legality and regulation) would not be difficult once the infrastructure was in place, given the sophisticated nature of admin technology in the business.

Spokesmen for major companies like Sportingbet have already said they would prefer regulation and taxation in the USA rather than the status quo and there will undoubtedly be others who weigh this practicality against the very attractive American market.

If regulation were to happen, offshore operations unwilling to go after licensing in major markets offering it like the UK would soon feel the icy winds of departing business, because as I said earlier it is likely that gamblers in those countries will feel happier with well regulated and honest operations than those which present the player hassles we see on the Complaints section here all too often.

Leave the right to legislate in the States where it belongs - with the states. Nevada has already come very close to legalising, which threw the feds into something of a tizzy and I think the big land casino companies would relish the chance to access these tempting revenue streams - MGM's Lanni said so just recently.

Unfortunately logic does not seem to apply to these politicians with their diverse agendas, and we are likely to see a continuation of the hypocrisy that plagues this area.
 
We realized that :) Or I certainly did, think the others did also. I think cslate was joking too, tho it's a bit hard to tell with the confusing grammar.

But this linking of gaming money to criminal activity/terrorism/satan is a very real part of political theater in the US, that's all I was commenting on really.
 
Yes sorry as an "outsider" I am little removed from such theatre.
I guess the Goverments of the World will always need to blame somebody else for the ills of the World and the media is always a favourite target whether that media is TV, computer games, internet or any other type of media you care to think of.It is the age old trick of goverment by distraction.
Personaly I think that political scandals only come to light to cover up the "real truth." :D (pinch of salt)
 

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