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SUSPENSION OF eCOGRA SEALS

Lol, yes, I popped in to see player experiences with withdrawals and find the thread is all about ecogra still!

I find the games are disabled, deposits are disabled, and withdrawals are enabled.

Casino Action has meanwhile apparently entered liquidation. I have no idea what the original source of that is, but it's been announced at CAP and their CAP certification has been removed also.

It would look pretty bad for Microgaming not to pay players. It's their time to shine as the most responsible software company.

So far so good, they have kept track of the casino reserves and they acted when the reserves got too low. Not seen that from other software companies.

If Tusk has gone into liquidation , as they notified Microgaming was their intention (see the MGS press release) then it will likely involve delays in players being paid out.

The liquidator will have to conduct an audit to see what can be salvaged and lay that against the obligations in order to arrive at a payout ratio. I would guess that at that stage it would be a MGS decision as to whether it will establish a Player's Trust as it has in the past to make up the difference for the individual player.
 
If Tusk has gone into liquidation , as they notified Microgaming was their intention (see the MGS press release) then it will likely involve delays in players being paid out.

The liquidator will have to conduct an audit to see what can be salvaged and lay that against the obligations in order to arrive at a payout ratio. I would guess that at that stage it would be a MGS decision as to whether it will establish a Player's Trust as it has in the past to make up the difference for the individual player.

If the players DON'T get paid, it will be a hammer blow to the credibility of both Microgaming AND eCogra, so I don't think this a likely outcome. What is more likely is a spell of worry for those players with substantial funds tied up there, along with an unspecified delay.
For our non-US friends, this will be a taste of what some US players went through when they woke up that Monday or Tuesday and found their casino accounts locked because groups such as Intercasino told them all was OK on Sunday, and on Monday locked all US accounts, trapping deposits and uncleared bonuses. They got paid, but it was a month of worry. They then had a far worse experience when Neteler did the same, payment took the best part of a YEAR!

Still, not a peep out of Kahnawake yet - where's the investigation into WTF happened while they were "asleep at the wheel"?

UNTIL we know what went wrong, how can we be sure that other "top notch" casino groups sporting eCogra seals or a top reputation are properly funded for the long term. Is this just a "one off" monumental cock-up, or a sign of things to come. Casino Action did NOT pull out of the US market bar those 11 states, and US players were showing up on all three scoreboards, so were certainly depositing and playing to the bitter end.

I do hope someone picks these up, and brings back the "Casino Action" themed events, but runs it properly, with a little more innovation than the last lot. I did notice things just stopped happening when the new team took over. When I met the old team in Vegas they had ideas for the group (and indeed actively sought ideas from players), but when they left, that all ground to a halt.
 
Update just out by Microgaming

MICROGAMING ISSUES UPDATE ON TUSK TERMINATION

Liquidator's assessment now awaited

Microgaming has followed up on an earlier announcement that it has terminated its licensing agreement with the Tusk group following the latter's advice that it is seeking liquidation.

The Microgaming update advises as follows:

"Following the termination of the software licence with Tusk Investment Corporation Limited (Tusk), players are understandably experiencing frustration with the lack of information about their accounts with Tusk.

"Microgaming has unfortunately heard nothing further from Tusk itself, and has yet to be advised of the details of the appointment of a liquidator for Tusk. Until a liquidator advises on Tusks financial position and ability to pay players and to pay Tusks white labels and affiliates, Microgaming is unable to assess the situation.

"This position is quite separate from the Microgaming Poker Network as a whole, which continues to operate as before. Microgaming will of course continue to keep people informed as the situation unfolds."

The Tusk group's "Safe and Fair" seals from the standards and player protection body eCOGRA were pulled some two weeks ago following the discovery of non-compliance irregularities on a routine on-site review by an eCOGRA professional team. Subsequently, Tusk advised Microgaming that it was seeking liquidation, leading to the termination of its software license from Microgaming.
 
Their will be players who will now think eCogra had indeed sat back and "did nothing", and had this blow up in their faces. These will be the significant proportion that do NOT participate in fora, and simply see the seal, and maybe even go so far as to click through to view the certificate.
Good point VWM but even worse, there is one very active member of this forum who as recently as yesterday late afternoon had no clue why she could not play at Golden Reef....imo,you (industry insiders) can blame her or admit where the real problems are....I will continue practice reading between the lines, starting to get pretty good at it just like Dr.Frist! (like the biz as usual post, days ago-OK!!:rolleyes:)
 
Hi guys this is my first post on this forum. I find the online casino industry fascinating and this forum very informative giving players an informed choice.

Can anyone tell me where the eCOGRA and Microgaming press releases come from as I can not find them publicly available.

Thanks.
 
Hi guys this is my first post on this forum. I find the online casino industry fascinating and this forum very informative giving players an informed choice.

Can anyone tell me where the eCOGRA and Microgaming press releases come from as I can not find them publicly available.

Thanks.

Hi Zeth - if you go here: www.ecogra.org you will find a news/press section where all releases by that organisation are put up at the same time as they are distributed to the online media. You can also register to receive the releases and newsletters directly.

I'm not sure if Microgaming has the same facility on its website - check that out. I receive the infrequent MGS press releases because I am on their press distribution list.

Players (or for that matter anyone else who is interested in what's going on in the industry) can access relevant news on sites like this one (the weekly Casinomeister news round-up, or items posted from time to time by members who find specific items interesting) or by regularly visiting information portals with good online gambling news feeds, which are numerous.

Among those that are free and usually reasonably up to date (and there are many others) are online casino news.com, betsage.com, reviewed-casinos.com, online-casinos.com, pokerlistings.com and winneronline.com.
 
P.S.

Just as a postscript to the above, I should add that online gambling stories and features also appear periodically in the mainstream media.

However, these are usually either business-related articles such as the M&A or financial results of large gambling companies, or only the "big" stories that break.

When it comes to the latter there is a tendency to focus on the negative.

For example, "Gambler Stole from Employer to Pay Gambling Debts" type stories are almost guaranteed of coverage, whilst more mundane but positive items such as responsible gambling initiatives or charitable projects are generally not regarded as especially newsworthy.

What I'm trying to say is that to get as much of the online gambling-specific news as possible some of the information portals or dedicated subscription media like Interactive Gaming News are your best bets.
 
What is amazingly ludicrous is the almost complete lack of proactive communication to the innocent players involved.

I guess if Tusk is on the run with a suitcase full of money, that explains why they are mum.

But Red Nines (for example) has never sent me an e-mail. Their entire communication to me is a cryptic "Message of the day" when I try to log on.

Nor has Microgaming, who has arguably the most to lose at this point. Surely they have access to player e-mail addresses, how hard would it be to e-mail us some sort of explanation?

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad this forum is here! But it's ridiculous that we have to scrounge around places like this for information, much of which is of course speculation.

I guess I shouldn't be terribly shocked, it's certainly not the first time companies in this business have been completely boneheaded. How quickly they seem to forget who is paying their bills.
 
thanks jetset :thumbsup:
I did actually look at the MGS site the other day and the press release wasn't up then but it is now after it was posted on here. I just hope that the players are informed about what is going on and they get their money in a decent time frame. There is so much to this industry it can make your head spin!
 
Hi All

Please accept our apologies for the delay in our response regarding this matter.

We have been in discussions with eCogra and these purely administrative issues will be resolved shortly. We had delayed posting as we thought this would have been resolved in 24hrs, but as I am sure most of you know these kind of things tend to take longer than you would expect.

In no way has our honesty, integrity or customer service been questioned and our reputation speaks for itself!

We are expecting our eCogra seals will be reinstated very soon, but in the meantime it is business as usual.

Thank you for all the messages of support recently from a lot of well respected affiliates in the industry. (You know who you are!)

Jon
CPS

These statements have proven demonstrably false.

Players have low expectations with respect to integrity and online gaming providers. (Take note Jetset and Dominique)

However, at the time Casino Action made these widely publicized statements above eCogra knew, or ought to have known, them to be utterly false. And one can presume MG knew them to be false BUT as a online gaming provider their silence is hardly unexpected as far as players are concerned.

As an organization that purports to represent player interests eCogra are currently treading water. A full and truthful explanation and statement of fact is long overdue.

Being unable to compel groups such as Casino Action to remove the seals reduces the display of such seals pretty useless. Before issuing such a seal organizations such as eCogra ought to require the lodgment of a substantial bond liable to forfeiture should the offending seal holder fail to comply with appropriate directives. That such a simple procedure is not already in place beggars belief.

.
 
...I think ECOGRA need a spanking email. Irrespective of everything else going on, these images should have been yanked the minute the seals were suspended.
Let's not forget that eCOGRA has no access to the HTML of the sites. They instructed them to have the logos removed, the casino didn't do it. I contacted eCOGRA to give them a heads up on this, and they recontacted the casino to let them know that they hadn't removed the logos. If anyone has a suggestion on how to alleviate this sort of problem, please begin another thread with suggestions. Thanks!
 
But ecogra control their own site. Until a few days ago, the ecogra logo on the Casino Action sites still pointed to the certificates stating that the casinos were ecogra certified. It has been replaced by the press release. It think it would be possible to achieve by using the referrer that anyone clicking on an ecogra link on any of the Casino Action sites should be taken to that press release.
 
Players

Hi,

I am one of the players with money at Casino Action. I am a regular player and have deposited 20+ times. If I can speak for other players we have not been contacted at all! I did not have any idea there was any problem with Casino Action until I tried to play on Thursday and the games were with error. I had to find this thread (first another one like it) to know what was the problem.

If eCogra or Microgaming does not have a way to directly contact players when there is a problem, what purpose does it serve?

Even now there are probably a lot of other players who still have no idea at all why they cannot play any games and emails to support have no answer. I am owed over $1000 and another problem is I had over $100 more in loyalty points saving that I will not get no chance.

Still there is nothing I can do except wait someone contacts me about paying me the money to me I had in UKClub Casino. I hope it is soon.
 
Let's not forget that eCOGRA has no access to the HTML of the sites. They instructed them to have the logos removed, the casino didn't do it. I contacted eCOGRA to give them a heads up on this, and they recontacted the casino to let them know that they hadn't removed the logos. If anyone has a suggestion on how to alleviate this sort of problem, please begin another thread with suggestions. Thanks!

Meister, I believe that Roar just came up with a great solution regarding the Seal issue as I quote him here:

From Roar: Before issuing such a seal organizations such as eCogra ought to require the lodgment of a substantial bond liable to forfeiture should the offending seal holder fail to comply with appropriate directives. That such a simple procedure is not already in place beggars belief.

That is one of the best guarantee's of compliance that there is, out there in the business world today as this is required on the large construction projects that I work at, it guarantee's that if we fail, the project will get finished and this could work the same way in the event the casino goes under if eCOGRA would implement this policy across the board for all of their Seal Holder casinos...
 
But ecogra control their own site. Until a few days ago, the ecogra logo on the Casino Action sites still pointed to the certificates stating that the casinos were ecogra certified. It has been replaced by the press release. It think it would be possible to achieve by using the referrer that anyone clicking on an ecogra link on any of the Casino Action sites should be taken to that press release.
Too Logical.....That said this industry is really no different than most others to the consumer. The player choses to take the risk (for whatever reason) knowing there are no true fail safe protections....I really have no right to complain (as I often do) as I know the real solution, it is not rocket science....I admire those that uninstall and for whatever reason either quit online gambling and/or take their play elsewhere....Yet, I am also glad this forum gives the player (for the most part) a voice for change not that I see much positive change,JMO!
 
Meister, I believe that Roar just came up with a great solution regarding the Seal issue as I quote him here:



That is one of the best guarantee's of compliance that there is, out there in the business world today as this is required on the large construction projects that I work at, it guarantee's that if we fail, the project will get finished and this could work the same way in the event the casino goes under if eCOGRA would implement this policy across the board for all of their Seal Holder casinos...
Rob, I agree but that $25K surety or performance bond I or other developers often would put up with lets say the city to complete roads at the end of a project was a drop in the bucket compared to the future actual $500K cost to complete the roads. Then the developer goes belly up and the bonds are called by the city leaving the true cost to the taxpayer. Sure you could get a defiency judgement against that developer that went belly up and failed to perform but for what. Bonding is good in theory for online gaming but it better be structured much better than the construction industry!
 
Rob, I agree but that $25K surety or performance bond I or other developers often would put up with lets say the city to complete roads at the end of a project was a drop in the bucket compared to the future actual $500K cost to complete the roads. Then the developer goes belly up and the bonds are called leaving the true cost to the taxpayer. Sure you could get a defiency judgement against that developer that went belly up and failed to perform but for what. Bonding is good in theory for online gaming but it better be structured much better than the construction industry!

Oh yea, absolutely agree with you on that Nash...what eCOGRA would have to require is a "Type" of a 100% Surety Bond probably based on the "Player Base Size" essentially insuring each player in their data base for "X" amount of dollars...something along those lines...
 
Oh yea, absolutely agree with you on that Nash...what eCOGRA would have to require is a "Type" of a 100% Surety Bond probably based on the "Player Base Size" essentially insuring each player in their data base for "X" amount of dollars...something along those lines...
Thanks for confirming what I thought you were implying initially with your post pursuant to some type of bonding as a potential solution!:thumbsup:
 
...what eCOGRA would have to require is a "Type" of a 100% Surety Bond probably based on the "Player Base Size" essentially insuring each player in their data base for "X" amount of dollars...

I disagree that it should be eCOGRA doing this. They have zero control of any operation beyond the seal, and cannot protect the player against an operator making a run for it.

This should be under the License Issuers control. Have a look at Malta Gaming Licensee's. EVERY operator is required to declare at least one bank account specifically for the use of player balances. The Bank then has to declare to the Lotteries & Gaming Authority that they know the account is for player balances, and confirm that the account cannot be used for anything else. The Licensee, at the end of each month (before the 21st of the following month), then has to provide the LGA with a report of all player balances and liabilities (outstanding cashouts, bets placed for future events etc). The Cash in the bank account must be equal to or more than the player liabilities (and the operator needs to be on standby for a spot audit should the LGA wish to confirm the reports). On top of this, a single individual must be declared to the LGA as a key official (read : Lots and lots of due diligence done on this person), and this key official is PERSONALLY responsible for the full gaming operation.

There are a lot of costs in just setting up an online gambling operation. Choice of License has a lot to play in it :

Curacao : Cheque for $5000 pretty much guarantees it, no background checks.
Kahnawake : from $15000, plus some reasonable due diligence.
Malta : Incorporate company with issued and fully paid up share capital of at least EUR100,000, plus the license application fees, gaming tax etc. Full business plan, 3 year cash forecast, full background investigation on every shareholder & director, testing of RNG required, hardware checks, review of site content, commitment to annual operational audit (between 15 & 30k EUR per time), monthly, biannual and annual reporting, correlated with the tax & VAT departments, and more.

Then there are processing security deposits, set up fee's, dev costs.. and all this excludes having an office with staff sitting around ignoring your phone calls and emails.

On the issue of the seals still being displayed after ecogra pulled them, that is a load of kimshi. While ecogra do not have access to the operators site, they have full control of their own. The seal should be more than just a simple image, (ever seen one of those "hacker Safe" images on an ecommerce website with a date in it). If a user clicks on the image, an ecogra controlled certificate should be displayed.

eCogra say they pulled all the links on the group sites, but if you go to casinoaction.com, click on the ecogra seal at the bottom of the page, you get an ecogra looking page that says :

Accreditation has been awarded to the
casinos listed at www.eCOGRA.org/casinos
on the basis of rigorous assessment by one of a panel of approved
external assessor consultancies of international repute.

Looks nice and legit, till you realise the page is being served by casinoaction and NOT ecogra. eCogra should be out there whacking people with sticks over this

This should be a huge wake up and smack in the face to eCOGRA, and it should result in a big change in the way they report pulled seals. eCOGRA won't suspend a seal for stupid/poxy reasons, but god help the players when a seal is suspended.

and before anyone asks, yes, I do like Malta.
 
I disagree that it should be eCOGRA doing this. They have zero control of any operation beyond the seal, and cannot protect the player against an operator making a run for it.

Sure they can...that's the purpose of the "Surety Bond", it works like an insurance policy in a way, and if eCOGRA would require their Seal Holders to post these if they want accreditation then each player would have their funds or cashouts insured, sorta like the FDIC works here in the US for bank customers...
 
Whether e-Cogra, licensing jurisdictions,etc.,the requirement of surety bonds or Letters of Credit in some viable structure put in place by the owners of onlines may add some sense of security for the player (rather than trust) as one would like to think not every Tom,Dick,and Harry can obtain a surety bond or Letter of Credit. Unfortunately some T,D,and H's can but still it is the financial stability of the issuing institution behind the surety bond and LOC's that actually provide the true financial insurance (for the player). In the grand scheme of an industry struggling for legitimacy, the cost is minimal at best!
 
Bonds

Sure they can...that's the purpose of the "Surety Bond", it works like an insurance policy in a way, and if eCOGRA would require their Seal Holders to post these if they want accreditation then each player would have their funds or cashouts insured, sorta like the FDIC works here in the US for bank customers...

So an operator in a good jurisdiction, which already has 100% of player balances covered, would be required to cover it again? How does that make it safer?

Yes, the operator needs to protect player balances. That is not in question at all. The only issue in question is who should hold the money. And since eCOGRA dont seem to be approving sports betting operations, I dont see why it should be them. It either needs to be done by the jurisdictions, as part of the ongoing due diligence into the operation (Malta, UK, Alderney all do this), or there needs to be an organisation that accepts non RNG based gaming sites like sports betting as well, which will create an infrastructure to manage the balances. Its no good covering just casino, poker and bingo. The entire industry needs to be covered.

And I dont think it should be a bond or a policy. If the melon hits the fan, it will take time for all the parties to agree to cash in the policy, and all the red tape gunk from the banks involved will delay players getting there money. Its easy : CASH. In a Bank account that earns interest. That can only be used to pay players in the event said melon hits said fan. Why make it more complicated than it really needs to be?
 
So an operator in a good jurisdiction, which already has 100% of player balances covered, would be required to cover it again? How does that make it safer?

Yes, the operator needs to protect player balances. That is not in question at all. The only issue in question is who should hold the money. And since eCOGRA dont seem to be approving sports betting operations, I dont see why it should be them. It either needs to be done by the jurisdictions, as part of the ongoing due diligence into the operation (Malta, UK, Alderney all do this), or there needs to be an organisation that accepts non RNG based gaming sites like sports betting as well, which will create an infrastructure to manage the balances. Its no good covering just casino, poker and bingo. The entire industry needs to be covered.

And I dont think it should be a bond or a policy. If the melon hits the fan, it will take time for all the parties to agree to cash in the policy, and all the red tape gunk from the banks involved will delay players getting there money. Its easy : CASH. In a Bank account that earns interest. That can only be used to pay players in the event said melon hits said fan. Why make it more complicated than it really needs to be?
I mentioned licensing jurisdictions above and really that was what I was really thinking also!!
 
So an operator in a good jurisdiction, which already has 100% of player balances covered, would be required to cover it again? How does that make it safer?

It makes it safer and faster for the player to get their funds because the "Surety Bond" or whatever you want to call it can be liquidated within a two week period whereas Gibraltar or whomever and MG and the Casino may negotiate this out for months before resolve is agreed upon...

Yes, the operator needs to protect player balances. That is not in question at all. The only issue in question is who should hold the money.

Lloyd's of London would be my first choice...

And since eCOGRA dont seem to be approving sports betting operations, I dont see why it should be them

90% or more of the MG casinos and others that eCOGRA issue Seal Certification for don't offer Sports Betting anyway...and neither did Casino Action Group...the basis of this thread...

It either needs to be done by the jurisdictions, as part of the ongoing due diligence into the operation (Malta, UK, Alderney all do this), or there needs to be an organisation that accepts non RNG based gaming sites like sports betting as well, which will create an infrastructure to manage the balances. Its no good covering just casino, poker and bingo. The entire industry needs to be covered.

One problem at a time you know, small steps first, back to the reason of the thread...Casino Action gets Seals Suspended...

And I dont think it should be a bond or a policy. If the melon hits the fan, it will take time for all the parties to agree to cash in the policy, and all the red tape gunk from the banks involved will delay players getting there money. Its easy : CASH. In a Bank account that earns interest. That can only be used to pay players in the event said melon hits said fan. Why make it more complicated than it really needs to be?

I believe I answered this in my first paragraph...
 
bonds v2

I still don't see why you want it issued as a bond or policy instead of cash on hand, secured to the benefit of the player.

What I want to see is all gaming operators put up security, in cash form, irrespective of their jurisdictions, gaming types, and memberships. eCogra caters to only a specific section of the market, so I personally do not believe they are the right people to do this for players.

Lets agree to disagree, makes life easier
 
I still don't see why you want it issued as a bond or policy instead of cash on hand, secured to the benefit of the player.

What I want to see is all gaming operators put up security, in cash form, irrespective of their jurisdictions, gaming types, and memberships. eCogra caters to only a specific section of the market, so I personally do not believe they are the right people to do this for players.

Lets agree to disagree, makes life easier

Essentially that is exactly what the bond stands for and an independent company holds it...like I used in my example..."Lloyd's Of London"...as they would have no interest in the actual issue at hand other than with regards to the bond itself and what it stands for...

Most of the online casinos could not afford to actually put up cold hard cash in amounts enough that would insure the players properly but lets say they go thru "Lloyd's" and then this is possible because "Lloyd's" would be hedging their bet that the casino operator would not fold thus insuring the player accounts for more than the casino property itself could afford to do on their own...

I think that's the best I can do at explaining how this "Bond" issue would work...
 
I still don't see why you want it issued as a bond or policy instead of cash on hand, secured to the benefit of the player.

What I want to see is all gaming operators put up security, in cash form, irrespective of their jurisdictions, gaming types, and memberships. eCogra caters to only a specific section of the market, so I personally do not believe they are the right people to do this for players.


I think you may well be right that eCogra are NOT the right people ensuring online gaming fairness for players per se. In fact their lack of independence from the member casinos is surely a fatal flaw.

BUT it was the very absence of a properly constituted regulated regime governing the commercial affairs of various online gaming outlets that gave birth to eCogra in the first place (plus no doubt some marketing leverage for members wanting to claim "fair play here").

Having said that eCogra ought to have anticipated the Tusk (Casino Action) scenario a long long time ago and implemented procedures such as the lodgment of bonds et al thus ensuring compliance from members (even under duress).

The fact that eCogra have been left floundering in the wake of the Tusk (Casino Action) demise IMHO is a telling indictment on this organization.

They had no pre-plan of action or protocol other than to release some meek advice that a seal had been suspended? Good grief! They are a lamentable organization who have demonstrably failed to deliver on the reasons they claim to exist in the first place.

Bye bye eCogra. Players won't be any worse off without you.

.
 
Well, eCogra or no eCogra, I'm still pissed off at Casino Action and whoever owns them (Tusk?) for not notifying players that they're going belly up. For no notification of steps to take to close accounts, what's going to happen to our personal and financial details, how to withdraw funds, how long such a thing may take, how it's going to happen, etc. :mad: There are still players out there who have absolutely no clue what has happened with this casino group.

And what if casino action survives this and they consolidate into maybe 1 casino, or merge w/another group. We're supposed to trust them with our money again after this fiasco?? Not me.
 
Well, eCogra or no eCogra, I'm still pissed off at Casino Action and whoever owns them (Tusk?) for not notifying players that they're going belly up...
It's a double edged sword. The problem with letting your players know that there is a money problem is that it would exasperate the crisis causing a "run on the bank". I'm extrapolating here, but they may have been in discussions concerning getting bailed out financially somehow. Apparently, they were so screwed that no one wanted to touch them.

...We're supposed to trust them with our money again after this fiasco?? Not me.

Well, you can revisit this statement:

Hi All

Please accept our apologies for the delay in our response regarding this matter.

We have been in discussions with eCogra and these purely administrative issues will be resolved shortly. We had delayed posting as we thought this would have been resolved in 24hrs, but as I am sure most of you know these kind of things tend to take longer than you would expect...We are expecting our eCogra seals will be reinstated very soon, but in the meantime it is business as usual...

So a) Jon could have been in the dark about what was going down, b) he could have been genuinely optimistic that a plan was in the making, or c) he was clearing out his desk when the posting was made. :p

My guess would be "b", but still - to state that it was "business as usual" was a bit irresponsible. This was definitely not true - there was a bit too much sugar coating that might backfire on them if they try to get back into this business.

Hopefully you used a unique email address with them to track any funkified movements of assets (databases). And all of us will probably have to exercise a hell of a lot of patience awaiting word when players and affiliates can expect to be paid.
 
One quick last comment - it's not just players and affiliates that are screwed here, there are a number of good people out of work. They're supposed to be providing for their families. Hopefully some of you can back up and look at the whole picture instead of being focused primarily with the player.
 
It's a double edged sword. The problem with letting your players know that there is a money problem is that it would exasperate the crisis causing a "run on the bank".

Exactly what happened to Northern Rock in the UK when people became aware there was a problem. It made a manageable problem unmanageable.

I like the "Bond" idea - but it should be the licencees who manage that, and can you see RTG ever doing that? Er...:cool:

Casino Action have still sent nothing out to players: but then, when the owners decided on liquidation, they probably locked the doors, waved goodbye and gave up caring....or they are acting on advice. Just leave eCOGRA, Microgaming and everyone else to try and clear up the mess :rolleyes:

No-one wins in these situations. But at least eCOGRA and Microgaming are there and players should (probably) get their money back. If this was anyone but MG or Wagerworks, it would probably be far more worrying for players. Everyone and his dog will criticise everyone else and their dogs irrespective of their roles in the affair because bad news makes a good playground and everyone has an opinion.

So on that basis, you can love or hate eCOGRA, love or hate Microgaming, agree or disagree with the actions thereof, but at the end of the day the situation arose because the new owners of Tusk either a) Didn't understand the business or b) set out to act fraudulently. Which would have been pretty stupid because if they did understand the business, they would have known this was inevitable. Or maybe they did...who knows.
 
Exactly what happened to Northern Rock in the UK when people became aware there was a problem. It made a manageable problem unmanageable.

I like the "Bond" idea - but it should be the licencees who manage that, and can you see RTG ever doing that? Er...:cool:

Thank you Simmo, and I also AGREE that it should be the licencees who manage it...but what I was saying in post #122 was that eCOGRA has to require it before they will issue a Seal Certification to the Casino..., if in fact the Casino wants to be eCOGRA Certified...
 
Update

Latest statement from MGS, advising that Tusk has appointed a liquidator:

QUOTE:

7 March 2008

COMPANY STATEMENT: UPDATE 07/3/08

ISLE OF MAN - Microgaming has now been advised that a liquidator has been appointed by Tusk Investments Corporation, although the appointment is subject to ratification by the regulatory authorities of Vanuatu the jurisdiction in which Tusk is incorporated.

As yet, Microgaming has not been informed how long this ratification process will take, but it will provide additional updates on the situation as and when information becomes available.

About Tusk
Tusk Investment Corporation Limited operates a number of casino sites and poker rooms:

Casinos: Challenge Casino, Golden Reef Casino, Music Hall Casino, Nostalgia Casino, UK Casino Club, Big Casino

Poker Rooms: Battlefield Poker, Royal Card Club, Red Nines, Arctic Poker, Raw Poker, Poker.ie, Daily Poker, Flush Draw Poker, Will Bet Poker, Bet Road Poker, Grand Central Poker, Off The Rail Poker, Privy Poker, Berserk Poker, Atomik Poker, Dave's Poker Room, Hetman Poker, Hot Pepper Poker, Poker Seas, TilttAA Poker, Loose Games Poker, CPT Gaming Poker, Ice Bear Poker, GoHard Poker, Caya Poker, Mr Urban Poker, Poker Sweden, Euro Poker Dream

UNQUOTE
 
Things developing quickly!

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Great, just what my in box needs is more weekly spam from CR as I have done everything possible including closing all accounts well over a year ago to get CR to cease (some of which was not so polite after all else failed)..oh well, that said I really do not sweat spam in the grand scheme of all so I will just continue to receive more I presume...thanks for the link JS and the heads up:p!!
 
Tusk casinos acquired by Casino Rewards

RESCUE MISSION. CASINO REWARDS STEPS IN ON TUSK DEBACLE

Fellow Aussies to take over casinos, but not poker operations of liquidated group

Online casino players with accounts at Tusk Investment's Casino Action group currently in the throes of liquidation can breath again - the Casino Rewards group has announced that it is to take over the online casino assets of the failed group. But the announcement warns that the acquisition does not include the widespread online poker assets of Casino Action.

All online casinos formerly operating under the Casino Action group such as Golden Reef, UK Casino Club, Nostalgia, iBig, Music Hall and Challenge, will soon fall under the Casino Rewards management, and ready for a grand re-opening on March 25, 2008.

Online casinos already in the well established and successful Casino Rewards group include: BlackjackBallroom.com GoldenTigerCasino.com, CaptainCooksCasino.com, Casino Kingdom, Casino Classic and LuckyEmperorCasino.com. The group is reviewed and monitored by eCOGRA.

All Casino Action player accounts in the acquired casinos will be safely transferred to the Casino Rewards network, with all account balances, withdrawals, and bonus credits available for immediate use.

"We are happy to welcome the new casinos into our network. We are working around the clock to integrate all of the casinos so the players have the best experience possible," said a spokesman for the Australian group. "Every cent of their account balances and bonus money will be accounted for and migrated over. They will be able to log in to the casinos just as they had previously and can play safe in the knowledge that the CasinoRewards logo will be on these casinos ensuring the security, reliability, and professionalism for which we are known."

The Casino Rewards team is working around the clock to finalise the migration. Unfortunately the online casinos will have to remain closed while the migration takes place but will be reopened on March 25, 2008. All players will receive a notification when they are able to play again.

Only the six casinos will migrate to Casino Rewards. Any poker rooms associated with Casino Action or any of its affiliates are not part of Casino Rewards and Casino Rewards has no knowledge whatsoever of the situation therein.

Whilst the fate of the poker rooms remains uncertain, the takeover of the online casinos in the failed Casino Action group will be welcomed by players and affiliates alike, as it assures their payouts. Casino Action's troubles started some weeks ago when a review team from the player protection and standards body eCOGRA discovered departures from its standards serious enough to warrant the immediate and public suspension of its 'Fair and Safe' seals.

Confidentiality obligations prevented eCOGRA from revealing the nature of the non-compliances, however Tusk subsequently advised its software provider Microgaming that it intended to go into liquidation, causing the immediate suspension of its software license and closure.

Tusk Investments, the owners of the Casino Action group have been remarkably silent on the issue, and have not communicated directly with the player community or the public on the issue. It is understood that the appointment of liquidators has been finalised and awaits the approval of the Vanuatu jurisdiction.
 
Well this is good news - not excellent news, but good news nevertheless.

I would have rather seen Vegas Partners, Jackpot Factory, or another group that is active in the online gaming community take these casinos in. The Casino Rewards group has a standoffish attitude when it comes to dealing with player issues.
 
All online casinos formerly operating under the Casino Action group such as Golden Reef, UK Casino Club, Nostalgia, iBig, Music Hall and Challenge, will soon fall under the Casino Rewards management, and ready for a grand re-opening on March 25, 2008.

Online casinos already in the well established and successful Casino Rewards group include: BlackjackBallroom.com GoldenTigerCasino.com, CaptainCooksCasino.com, Casino Kingdom, Casino Classic and LuckyEmperorCasino.com.

Thanks for the list. I'll be sure to keep them off my computer. Ummm... no... I'm not a CR fan. :p
 
This might be interesting, for bonus whores at least:D

Casino Rewards will want to protect the transferred player base, as this is the chief asset of what they have bought.
Hopefully, transferred players will be offered another crack at each SUB to encourage continued loyalty, and many will probably be instantly booted to Casino Rewards VIP lounge level. This is pretty much what happened to me when they bought Aztec Riches and Phoenician from Casino Action before.

Sadly, their ongoing promotions are not so good as under Casino Action, and probably will NOT appeal to the inherited player base.

With the 25th also being my Birthday, I will remind Casino Rewards of this coincidence, as it may be of some value to me;)
 
RESCUE MISSION. CASINO REWARDS STEPS IN ON TUSK DEBACLE

Fellow Aussies to take over casinos, but not poker operations of liquidated group

Online casino players with accounts at Tusk Investment's Casino Action group currently in the throes of liquidation can breath again - the Casino Rewards group has announced that it is to take over the online casino assets of the failed group. But the announcement warns that the acquisition does not include the widespread online poker assets of Casino Action.

All online casinos formerly operating under the Casino Action group such as Golden Reef, UK Casino Club, Nostalgia, iBig, Music Hall and Challenge, will soon fall under the Casino Rewards management, and ready for a grand re-opening on March 25, 2008.

Online casinos already in the well established and successful Casino Rewards group include: BlackjackBallroom.com GoldenTigerCasino.com, CaptainCooksCasino.com, Casino Kingdom, Casino Classic and LuckyEmperorCasino.com. The group is reviewed and monitored by eCOGRA.

All Casino Action player accounts in the acquired casinos will be safely transferred to the Casino Rewards network, with all account balances, withdrawals, and bonus credits available for immediate use.

"We are happy to welcome the new casinos into our network. We are working around the clock to integrate all of the casinos so the players have the best experience possible," said a spokesman for the Australian group. "Every cent of their account balances and bonus money will be accounted for and migrated over. They will be able to log in to the casinos just as they had previously and can play safe in the knowledge that the CasinoRewards logo will be on these casinos ensuring the security, reliability, and professionalism for which we are known."

The Casino Rewards team is working around the clock to finalise the migration. Unfortunately the online casinos will have to remain closed while the migration takes place but will be reopened on March 25, 2008. All players will receive a notification when they are able to play again.

Only the six casinos will migrate to Casino Rewards. Any poker rooms associated with Casino Action or any of its affiliates are not part of Casino Rewards and Casino Rewards has no knowledge whatsoever of the situation therein.

Whilst the fate of the poker rooms remains uncertain, the takeover of the online casinos in the failed Casino Action group will be welcomed by players and affiliates alike, as it assures their payouts. Casino Action's troubles started some weeks ago when a review team from the player protection and standards body eCOGRA discovered departures from its standards serious enough to warrant the immediate and public suspension of its 'Fair and Safe' seals.

Confidentiality obligations prevented eCOGRA from revealing the nature of the non-compliances, however Tusk subsequently advised its software provider Microgaming that it intended to go into liquidation, causing the immediate suspension of its software license and closure.

Tusk Investments, the owners of the Casino Action group have been remarkably silent on the issue, and have not communicated directly with the player community or the public on the issue. It is understood that the appointment of liquidators has been finalised and awaits the approval of the Vanuatu jurisdiction.

Jet, I'm sure you remember our big discussion that you and I had in the Other Thread regarding this issue concerning eCOGRA, well now it looks like my worst fears and yours too have been confirmed, that eCOGRA does in fact have "Confidentiality Obligations" or as you said "ND clause" in place with their seal casinos...so this takes me back to one of my previous concerns as to how they can truly be a player advocate that is "Transparent" regarding looking out for the player community and keeping the player community forewarned regarding issues like the one that just happened with Casino Action when they have these "Confidentiality Obligations" and "NDA in place" ??

And, as a side note I am all for eCOGRA,, but also concerned as well about this issue and would like to hear your thoughts on this Jet as well as others here...
 
Last edited:
Press Release:

Casino Rewards Adds 6 Casinos to its Network

Award winning online casino group CasinoRewards.com extends its family, taking new online casinos under its wing to become the white knights of the online gaming world.

All online casinos operating under the Casino Action group: Golden Reef, UK Casino Club, Nostalgia, iBig, Music Hall and Challenge, will soon be under the Casino Rewards management, and ready for a grand reopening on 25 March 2008.

All player accounts in the aforementioned casinos will be safely transferred to the Casino Rewards network, with all account balances, withdrawals, and bonus credits available for immediate use.

“We are happy to welcome the new casinos into our network. We are working around the clock to integrate all of the casinos so the players have the best experience possible. Every cent of their account balances and bonus money will be accounted for and migrated over. They will be able to log in to the casinos just as they had previously and can play safe in the knowledge that the CasinoRewards logo will be on these casinos ensuring the security, reliability, and professionalism for which we are known.” (Spokesperson for Casino Rewards.)

The Casino Rewards team is working around the clock to finalize the migration. Unfortunately the online casinos will be closed while the migration takes place but will be reopened on 25 March. All players will receive a notification when they are able to play again.

The Casino Rewards group with its 12 exciting and luxurious online casinos, including GoldenTigercasino.com, CasinoClassic.com, CaptainCooksCasino.com, BlackJackBallroom.com and CasinoKingdom.com, continues to make online gambling more accessible to new players with its frequent promotions and signature bonus offers -
new players have the chance to use $500 of the casino's money to play any of the 260+ Las Vegas style online games absolutely free for one hour.

About Rewards Affiliates:

Established in 2000, RewardsAffiliates.com is the affiliates program of Casino Rewards, recently crowned "Best Affiliate Program" in the annual Casino Affiliate Program awards.
Rewards Affiliates has positioned itself as a respected industry leader, offering affiliates an excellent commission structure, unique affiliate marketing tools, fast, reliable monthly payouts and a dedicated 24/7 support team.

***Only the six aforementioned casinos will migrate to Casino Rewards. Any poker rooms associated with Casino Action or any of its affiliates are not part of Casino Rewards and Casino Rewards has no knowledge whatsoever of the situation therein.

This is great news, all people owed money shall be paid and business will be as usual.

I am very pleased with Rewards and with Microgaming. They handled this in the best possible way.
 
Microgaming's latest press release

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:

COMPANY STATEMENT: UPDATE 20/3/08

ISLE OF MAN - Microgaming can confirm that a Brisbane based liquidator has been appointed by Tusk Corporation and ratified by the regulatory authorities in Vanuatu. Microgaming has been in contact with the liquidator and been informed that they are currently in the process of gathering all the relevant financial information from Tusk Corporation. The liquidator made it clear that this process may take some time, however, Microgaming has been led to believe that affected players will receive information on how to lodge their claims with the liquidator by the end of next week. Microgaming appreciates that the slow process is causing continued frustration among the playing community, but unfortunately it is not in a position to influence the speed of the legal process. Microgaming will endeavour to keep players informed as more information is made available.


Remember, the poker skins still have to be dealt with.
 
Well this is good news - not excellent news, but good news nevertheless.

I would have rather seen Vegas Partners, Jackpot Factory, or another group that is active in the online gaming community take these casinos in. The Casino Rewards group has a standoffish attitude when it comes to dealing with player issues.

I guess it was whichever group gave the liquidators the best price, Bryan.

For the casino players at least this ensures that their account balances will be honoured by the new owners of the Tusk casinos, which should assuage the concerns of those owed money.

The poker situation remains unclear, and Tusk remains totally uncommunicative - it's almost as if the directors/owners have shut down along with their company!

In contrast, Microgaming are continuing to communicate with the player community as information becomes available to them, and that's a good sign imo.
 
Sadly, their ongoing promotions are not so good as under Casino Action, and probably will NOT appeal to the inherited player base.

While it's great that the casinos are soon to be back in business, I agree with this...I hope they will tread carefully here as Casino Action had one or two excellent features that players will be expecting. Most notably instant Neteller and the Casino Action program. Also they operated on a 12hr Reverse Period. CR operate a 48hr reverse and that might be a bit of a shock to some people if they utilise that here.

Although I suspect that having shelled out for the player base they will be keen to ensure they keep it, so fingers crossed.
 
I think the most important thing is that everyone will get paid, and that will be the case with the casinos. Rewards has experience with mapping player and affiliate accounts over, which some places really mess up. I expect this to work well.

After that, it's up to everyone to make their own decisions about whether they like the new system or not. That's par for the course.

The poker remains a problem. Not sure how many people are affected there, but I assume that eventually players will be paid (albeit it can take a long time) and affiliates will not.
 
While I am happy that all players will be paid, the overcrowded MG market is a bit of a concern. The CA group was brought down to its knees probably due to lack of business despite the casinos being seemingly well-managed and not having many player issues. Unless there is a huge influx of new players, I cannot see how the number of MG casinos can continue to thrive under such adverse conditions especially since the US and other economies are showing signs of slowing down.
 

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