Pending withdrawals - Everyone loses?

[ChopleyIOM]

I was just thinking about this before, and was wondering if the habit of casinos 'pending' a withdrawal for anything from 24 hours to 72 hours, and quite often more if a weekend or bank holidays gets in the way, actually hurts them as much as it inconveniences players?

Current case in point for me was I got a letter through the post from Red Flush offering me a 100% match up to £100 on a 30xB WR. I decided to have a go and managed to finish the WR with £175 (so a reasonable little £75 raise), so I made a withdrawal. (I'm hoping they don't invoke their insane 'we can void your winnings if you use autoplay' T&C.....)

I made that withdrawal last night, got the email confirming the request and stating their 24 hours pending period, which I guess means 24 hours starting on Monday, so I'll perhaps get my money into my Neteller account Tuesday or Wednesday next week.

Problem now is I'd quite like to do some slotting tonight, and there's nothing stopping me depositing at any other casino with my 'gaming card' (which I always keep fully paid off and don't use for anything else), but knowing that I've got £175 'in the system' as it were, but out of my reach, dissuades me from depositing elsewhere in the meantime.

Now this doesn't make any difference to Red Flush, they sit on my withdrawal for a few days in the hope I'll reverse it (which I won't), they pay out in the end, and everything carries on an usual - it's pretty much a no lose scenario for them, but for other casinos where I could be depositing and playing, the fact I feel disinclined to deposit elsewhere until I get my money back from Red Flush effectively takes that potential deposit out of 'the gaming system' as it were.

A couple of months ago I hit a point where I was waiting for something in the region of £800 or so of withdrawals to make their way back to me, and I simply stopped playing for real money until I got them all back, and went onto play money instead.

It just seems bizarre to me that I can make a withdrawal from 3Dice at 1am on Sunday morning, and by the time I get out of bed eight hours later, the money is sat in my Neteller account. A withdrawal from GNUF on Wednesday night doesn't arrive in my account until Monday or Tuesday the following week, thanks to the way their 48 hour pending goes past the end of the working week, so another 48 hours gets added on for the weekend and only then do they actually start to process it.

My point here is that I think this behaviour is bad for the casinos as much as it's annoying for players, because I can't be the only one who reaches the point where I think, 'Nuts to this, I'm not playing another penny of real money until my withdrawals get back to me.'

What do you think?

 

[immortality]

I simply choose to have a flutter in casinos that have no pending period, it's too tempting for me if money is sitting in the pending mode I have reversed and played away withdrawals in the past don't want to go through that again

 

[harrys99]

My point here is that I think this behaviour is bad for the casinos as much as it's annoying for players, because I can't be the only one who reaches the point where I think, 'Nuts to this, I'm not playing another penny of real money until my withdrawals get back to me.'What do you think?

LOL-I say "nuts" to depositing again for a while at the last casino that did not process a w/d request made on a Thursday night by Monday night, at which time I proceeded to reverse and play it back.

Clearly this is my own bad/compulsive behavior and not the fault of the casino, but until I get over myself I'm not depositing there. In that sense for the casino surely it is a losing situation not having that steady deposit stream.

 

[EdieD]

I have decided for now and in the future, I will only deposit to an online casino that pays within 24 hours including weekends. The only one that I know fits the bill is 3dice, but I don't play there as I don't like the software.

I'll wait until regulation where I feel this wil be standard or just play at top rated sportsbooks who practice this behavior.

 

[Tirilej]

Thanks for that post Chopley!
Why I like it is because you can play if you want but chose not to until you get your cash.

For me the reason why I don't play when I wait for a cashout is simply because I don't have the money to play somewhere else while I wait. I chose to play only at places where they pay fast for that simple reason. I hate myself when I reverse and lose, so I don't put myself in that position any longer.
A big thank you to those casinos that respect us enough to pay us as fast as they can:notworthy

 

[ChopleyIOM]

So am I in the minority then when I can say I've never reversed a withdrawal?

I have a really stubborn head on me, and once I decide to make a withdrawal from a casino, whether or not it represents a profit or a loss, I'm determined to just sit it out and wait until the money gets back to me.

Obviously each casino/casino group is going to operate on an 'every man for himself' basis, so if long pending periods in the hope of reversals appears to be helping their profits, I guess they'll keep on doing it.

Mind you, despite my original post protestations, I have just deposited at 3Dice for some slotting this evening, (well, morning as it will soon be ), but then again 3Dice are absolutely on my 'totally trusted' list, so I know that if and when I come to make a withdrawal they'll get it to me quickly and it won't get lost in 'the system' for several days.....

Battlefield 3 with the guys was fun this evening, but that's over for the night, the Chopley family is all in bed, so it's got to be some slotting, another glass of wine, and the Euro Dance radio channel to accompany some 3Dice gaming

 

[chayton]

I've reversed so many withdrawals it's ridiculous - nothing really big though, I think the biggest was maybe $400. But I shudder to think of adding up all of the $200-$250-$300 ones I've played back - especially right now when my bank account is looking so pathetic.

But I'm the same as Tirilej, I don't really have a lot of disposable income right now so when I have $200 whispering, "Come play me..." - well I usually fall for it. It gives me the chance to bet a little bigger, and it's not like I have lots of other fun things to do with my time. sigh.

 

[Dipity]

I think I'm in the same boat as most here, Chopley - I've reversed so many w/d it's ridiculous. That's why I enjoy 3 dice - prompt pay and I can get it from my mb into my account in less than 1 day turnaround.

I agree with the sentiment that everyone loses when they offer a reverse period!

On an unrelated note, BF3? I spend my time on Team Fortress 2 and Dota 2, do you play either of those?

 

[chuchu59]

While I agree with Chopley in a sense I think these extended pending withdrawal times were set after an extensive study on the stats and behavioral patterns by the casinos. Gamblers in general are perceived to be weak-willed and will reverse and play whenever they have the urge to do so. Most gamblers will not be as level-headed as Chopley and may choose casinos where they feel lucky at or those who offer them the best bonuses. IMHO pending w/d times will not be an important factor when choosing the casino they patronise most. Its true they will rant whenever they have a sizeable cashout still sitting in the cashier after 36 hours but in their rage most players will simply reverse and that's what the casinos want. I am pretty sure they conducted extensive research before coming to this decision ie 48-hour pending w/d times like JC despite a definite backlash from the community. If, as a result, their cashflow improves dramatically I doubt whether it will be much longer before we see the industry standard set at 72 hours.

 

[vinylweatherman]

The problem is they can only see their own data. If pending periods elsewhere deter players from depositing, they have no way of knowing unless they ask some regular players why they have deviated from their usual pattern. If their own pending period prevents the money going to a competitor, they can live with it, and this is data they can see for themselves.

The only thing that will make them change is if more and more players decided to sit tight for however long it takes, and gross turnover takes a tumble due to so much more "dead" money stuck in extended pending periods.

With 32Red, payment turns up the next day, even at the weekend. Whilst it often goes partly to a competitor, some ends up back at 32Red, and if I have a large amount stuck in various pending periods, I am more likely to put what I have available into 32Red, rather than have a win from it stuck in yet another pending period.

Casinos with long pending periods have to offer greater bonuses to compensate, else I will ignore them.

When a player busts out, the pending period is irrelevant, it is when they win that it matters. Players have a mixture of losing and winning sessions, and their hobby/habit/addiction is fed partly from new money, but also from money recycled from their winning sessions. Stalling the movement of the money from these winning sessions will reduce the gross turnover, but not necessarily cause a reduction in net profit.

Casinos trot out this "industry standard" bullshit to distance themselves from an unpopular change of policy, blaming instead some mythical industry body that sets such standards, and that expects operators to follow them. The truth, if told, would make them look bad, and lose them players. The truth is that no external body has told them to move from a shorter pending period to a longer one, it is purely an internal decision, and one they are free to not make, as well as to make.

32Red have chosen NOT to join in with this "bullshit club", and continue to operate with their player driven pending periods, which can be set right down to an hour on request so that payment effectively goes out in the next batch. Despite this, their profits have increased markedly, whilst at the same time other operators are suffering hard times, and even going bust.

 

[Nate]

I have reversed a few sizeable withdrawals - Heck I am a gambler - Sometimes disciplined, other times off the scale.

I think we generally have our ups and downs. One of the biggest downfalls is my impatience. I think RTG Casinos in general prey most on the 'Reversal Syndrome' than other places. Whilst MG and other places have pending periods, its only at RTG (in my experience) that you have that pending period and a Weekly Withdrawal limit..

I could withdraw 4k and have to wait another week for the balance to hit my account - I often end up just playing the funds.

I've ranted about Slotastic in the last week - But think of it this way... 48-96 Hours pending, then you are limited to 4k for the week and then another 48hours pending till they process your next WD... at the end it just becomes a nightmare and a frustrating experience withdrawing.

I just strike the 'pending' Casinos off my depositing list - I'm sure they don't care that my odd $1000 worth of deposits don't come their way - In the long run and with more people it may just hurt them.

I know Club World don't process on weekends but they process quickly in the week. I opt to stay away over the weekends as other places pay if I need a RTG fix.

In general - I HATE the restrictions because I feel there are none when it comes to depositing and losing.

This is why i have the utmost respect for Casinos who flush, process quickly AND do not impose limits.

Nate

 

[dunover]

Agreed with nate and vinyl - imagine going into ladbrokes, putting 100 on a horse and winning 500. Go to the counter, ask for your slip to be cashed and get told 'sorry, come back in 4 days'. You moan and then are told 'tell you what, we'll give you 500 in betting vouchers that you can only spend in here, and forget the slip' Would you go back?
The quick payers will gain more market share, especially from savvy online gamers who know the system, simply by doing nothing and paying fast. For proprietary you got 3dice, netent nordicbet, MGS 32red/Nedplay/dash, playtech bet365/betfred,Paddypower, IGT/MGS Virgin/MrGreen and most other IGT sites who all have no or minimal pending periods. Whatever software you prefer (unless a US player) you CAN find rapid payers of most softwares. Why you'd deposit elsewhere, unless bonus hunting, I don't know.
Time will tell, but all I know is that quick payment is in the spirit of good online gaming and sites who have a genuine customer-orientated ethos. The games I want to play have reels and cards etc. and I don't want cashouts to become another game....

 

[PNEFOREVER2]

A while back I deposited £20 (I think) at Royal Vegas and took a bonus-made the w/d and withdrew around £200.

This was on a Friday,I asked if they could flush it,to which they replied no,hence over the next 2 days I stupidly reversed bit by bit until it was gone.

Never again-if I know I could get paid within around 6 hours of making a w/d at other casinos I'm certainly not risking playing somewhere that takes upwards of 24 hours to payout.

 

[rockycatt]

I have decided for now and in the future, I will only deposit to an online casino that pays within 24 hours including weekends. The only one that I know fits the bill is 3dice, but I don't play there as I don't like the software.

I'll wait until regulation where I feel this wil be standard or just play at top rated sportsbooks who practice this behavior.

they got the best selection of V P on the net I M O if you are interested

 

[SandraShells]

I personally do not like when that happens, makes me nervous :/ I think it is def a problem that should be solved, it really does no benefit to the casino and I am sure it bothers the majority of players! Hopefully some online casinos may be reading this forum thread

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Well after two and a half days sat at pending Red Flush emailed me to say they wanted my documents as it was my first withdrawal from them (I played and lost with them back in the day so never made a withdrawal, I'd say I've had an account with them for over four years).

I sent my documents off earlier this afternoon but haven't heard anything back from them yet.

So I still have £175 of my money trapped out in the 'ghostlands' of casino purgatory. (Yes this is just a £175 withdrawal from a £100 deposit, over two days sat at pending and now 'we want your documents'.)

As such, I'll play fruit machine emulators this evening - https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/50379/

And I'll play with real money at casinos another night......

 

[EdieD]

they got the best selection of V P on the net I M O if you are interested

Thanks for the tip rocky, but don't play much vp. For fun, I like to play the net entertainment slots or some at betfred. I can't deposit at these places, but enjoy the software better than a lot of land based games. Hope u.s. players eventually get onboard with software that professional and entertaining.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Just an update on my Red Flush situation. (Remember we're talking about a measly £175 withdrawal from a £100 deposit.)

1) Requested withdrawal Friday 8th June at 2345hrs.
2) Stayed at pending until Monday 11th June.
3) Monday 11th June at 1445hrs I get an email requesting my docs and an email address to send them to. ([email protected])
4) I return the requested docs within an hour. (Driving licence photo ID scan, credit card scans front and back, recent utility bill scan)
5) Still haven't heard anything by the next day so Tuesday 12th June at 0740hrs I email support and ask for an update.
6) Support email back (quickly in all fairness) and say they haven't got my docs, and provide an entirely different email address to send my docs to, or to just reply to the email.
7) Support email back (again, quickly) and say that my docs are fine (driving licence photo ID, credit card scans front and back, recent utility bill scan) but they now want to do telephone verification with me. (In 4 1/2 years of playing online I have NEVER been required to do telephone verification at ANY casino and I've withdrawn sums of cash a damn sight bigger than £175.)

Please note a once off verbal confirmation call needs to be conducted before the payment is finalized.

Could you kindly provide us with the convenient time to call and the telephone number to call you on, as to finalize your withdrawal.

8) I provide a phone number for them to contact me on and ask them to do so ASAP (what's the point of telephone verification if I can just provide them with any old number?), which is the same telephone number I provided when I originally opened my account with them about four years ago.
9) They call me within an hour, confirm some really basic details (D.O.B., postal address, email address - I'm really not sure what the phone call achieved), say that everything is in order and I should hear from their banking department within eight hours.
10) It's now 1845hrs on Tuesday 12th June, so nearly ten hours after the phone call, and coming up on 96 hours since I originally requested the withdrawal. Still not heard from their banking people and still no money in my Neteller account.
11) And to cap it all I finally got a bounce message from gmail from the email address that Red Flush originally provided me with to send my docs to, so I sent off a fair wedge of 'high quality' personal information to an email address that doesn't appear to exist and which bounced around in Cyberspace for over 24 hours, which I am very unhappy about.

On a scale of 1 to 10, how impressed do you think I've been with the process of my first withdrawal from the Red Flush casino?......

This also comes back to my original point in this thread which is this sort of behaviour keeps money out of the gaming system, which is lifeblood of all casinos. These kinds of shenanigans annoy players AND deprive the casinos of revenues, why can't they see this?

 

[rockycatt]

i think you will get paid but unlike dice were every one knows who you really are this is a cookie cutter response to any new with draw;r [P I T A] i know the heard mentality is that another player will revers and loose they don't want that option to go by

 

[dunover]

Just an update on my Red Flush situation. (Remember we're talking about a measly £175 withdrawal from a £100 deposit.)

1) Requested withdrawal Friday 8th June at 2345hrs.
2) Stayed at pending until Monday 11th June.
3) Monday 11th June at 1445hrs I get an email requesting my docs and an email address to send them to. ([email protected])
4) I return the requested docs within an hour. (Driving licence photo ID scan, credit card scans front and back, recent utility bill scan)
5) Still haven't heard anything by the next day so Tuesday 12th June at 0740hrs I email support and ask for an update.
6) Support email back (quickly in all fairness) and say they haven't got my docs, and provide an entirely different email address to send my docs to, or to just reply to the email.
7) Support email back (again, quickly) and say that my docs are fine (driving licence photo ID, credit card scans front and back, recent utility bill scan) but they now want to do telephone verification with me. (In 4 1/2 years of playing online I have NEVER been required to do telephone verification at ANY casino and I've withdrawn sums of cash a damn sight bigger than £175.)



8) I provide a phone number for them to contact me on and ask them to do so ASAP (what's the point of telephone verification if I can just provide them with any old number?), which is the same telephone number I provided when I originally opened my account with them about four years ago.
9) They call me within an hour, confirm some really basic details (D.O.B., postal address, email address - I'm really not sure what the phone call achieved), say that everything is in order and I should hear from their banking department within eight hours.
10) It's now 1845hrs on Tuesday 12th June, so nearly ten hours after the phone call, and coming up on 96 hours since I originally requested the withdrawal. Still not heard from their banking people and still no money in my Neteller account.
11) And to cap it all I finally got a bounce message from gmail from the email address that Red Flush originally provided me with to send my docs to, so I sent off a fair wedge of 'high quality' personal information to an email address that doesn't appear to exist and which bounced around in Cyberspace for over 24 hours, which I am very unhappy about.

On a scale of 1 to 10, how impressed do you think I've been with the process of my first withdrawal from the Red Flush casino?......

This also comes back to my original point in this thread which is this sort of behaviour keeps money out of the gaming system, which is lifeblood of all casinos. These kinds of shenanigans annoy players AND deprive the casinos of revenues, why can't they see this?

This has me fuming just reading it. This casino cannot ever be recommended or accredited, and hopefully you'll get the lolly and don't ever depo there again. I say that, because if you redepo and perchance win a decent sum, you'll likely get more delays and obstructive behaviour, like notarized BS or needing to send a DNA swab in which takes 2-3 weeks for analysis.

 

[P.V.]

11) And to cap it all I finally got a bounce message from gmail from the email address that Red Flush originally provided me with to send my docs to, so I sent off a fair wedge of 'high quality' personal information to an email address that doesn't appear to exist and which bounced around in Cyberspace for over 24 hours, which I am very unhappy about.

This type of post is exactly what I've been pointing out for some time. What if your information was emailed to the wrong address by mistake too?
Good thing it wasn't and I'm glad there was a bounced message for clarification and relief on your part.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

This has me fuming just reading it. This casino cannot ever be recommended or accredited, and hopefully you'll get the lolly and don't ever depo there again. I say that, because if you redepo and perchance win a decent sum, you'll likely get more delays and obstructive behaviour, like notarized BS or needing to send a DNA swab in which takes 2-3 weeks for analysis.

I did get paid yesterday at around 4pm, so the best part of five days from withdrawal request to me getting my money. (Well outside the 'within 48-72 hours' period they get stated for themselves in the Accredited casino list.)

Oh yes and I also had the pleasure of having my driving licence scans along with a utility bill scan and my credit card scans bouncing around in Cyberspace for over 72 hours (I got the final 'we've given up trying' undeliverable from gmail today) because RED FLUSH PUT THE WRONG F**KING EMAIL ADDRESS ON THEIR OWN REQUEST FORM FOR DOCUMENTATION. That's actually the thing that's pissed me off the most to be honest, I'm wary enough about sending documentation like that via email as it is, without having to endure that kind of gross incompetence.

Needless to say they will not be top of my list for MG slotting in the future.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

There is a little bit of a kicker in this tale.

Remember these stages from the process that Red Flush put me through to get my measly £175 withdrawal out of them?

7) Support email back (again, quickly) and say that my docs are fine (driving licence photo ID, credit card scans front and back, recent utility bill scan) but they now want to do telephone verification with me. (In 4 1/2 years of playing online I have NEVER been required to do telephone verification at ANY casino and I've withdrawn sums of cash a damn sight bigger than £175.)
8) I provide a phone number for them to contact me on and ask them to do so ASAP (what's the point of telephone verification if I can just provide them with any old number?), which is the same telephone number I provided when I originally opened my account with them about four years ago.
9) They call me within an hour, confirm some really basic details (D.O.B., postal address, email address - I'm really not sure what the phone call achieved), say that everything is in order and I should hear from their banking department within eight hours.

I've bolded the bit above, because I did think at the time the phone call achieved nothing..... Well guess who called me up on the phone number that I provided them with, completely uninvited and unsolicited, and offering me a 'fabulous' 50% match up on my next deposit.

Yep, it was Red Flush, or rather, some Indian chap who appears to work for them.

Fortunately it was on a number that I have going to voicemail, so I didn't actually answer it, but I did get a message left for me.

So not only were Red Flush incompetent enough to give me an incorrect email address to send off personal verification documents to, they then effectively coerced a current phone number out of me (i.e. follow this process to get your withdrawal), and are now using that number to make unsolicited marketing calls to me via some sort of Indian call centre.

Amazing service from an accredited casino!

 

[Nifty29]

There is a little bit of a kicker in this tale.

Remember these stages from the process that Red Flush put me through to get my measly £175 withdrawal out of them?



I've bolded the bit above, because I did think at the time the phone call achieved nothing..... Well guess who called me up on the phone number that I provided them with, completely uninvited and unsolicited, and offering me a 'fabulous' 50% match up on my next deposit.

Yep, it was Red Flush, or rather, some Indian chap who appears to work for them.

Fortunately it was on a number that I have going to voicemail, so I didn't actually answer it, but I did get a message left for me.

So not only were Red Flush incompetent enough to give me an incorrect email address to send off personal verification documents to, they then effectively coerced a current phone number out of me (i.e. follow this process to get your withdrawal), and are now using that number to make unsolicited marketing calls to me via some sort of Indian call centre.

Amazing service from an accredited casino!

I think this is unacceptable from an accredited casino.

You should contact Bryan. Behaviour like this impacts on the integrity of the whole accredited list IMO.

 

[Seventh777]

What Nifty said, i`m still seething about updating my mobile number to only the casinos I was playing at this time last year, and the new ones i`ve joined since, I always un-tick the message by SMS box, but, the two most annoying aspects here are - Several casinos that I never gave my new number to have text`d me with offers, and even more annoyingly - Bastard loan companies and twats regarding PPI related crap are perma spamming me, so, somewhere along the line an accredited casino is selling peoples numbers .

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Thanks for the comments chaps, I'm not going to make any sort of official complaint to Bryan at the moment, as I really am hoping that his revamp of the accredited section will effectively take care of this problem.

The truth of the matter is that the casinos on the accredited list are NOT all equal - and that needs to be recognised, and as far as I can tell Bryan is on the case so I'll wait to see what transpires there.

Personally speaking it's 'lesson learned' for me, if I want to play Microgaming, I'll play at 32Red, end of story. Bollocks to the bonuses that other casinos offer as enticement, I'd rather play 'straight deposit' at 32Red, or with their smaller bonuses, than put myself through the hassle other MG casinos have subjected me to. (GNUF were a pain in the arse as well.)

Roll on the 'Accredited A list', or the 'Accredited Gold Medal/Silver Medal/Bronze Medal' or however Bryan chooses to implement it - but the best casinos on the accredited list really need to be recognised as such, and the 'under-performers' (to be polite about it) shouldn't be sharing the same stage.

 

[Dipity]

Speaking as a web developer, surely only a second 'opt in' via email address confirmation (an email sent to confirm your address is real) is enough in todays age?

EDIT: Oh, and trust me, if I could still play MG, I would ONLY be playing 32 Red. As it stands now, due to Spanish regulation, 3 Dice is getting all my deposits.

 

[chuchu59]

Thanks for the comments chaps, I'm not going to make any sort of official complaint to Bryan at the moment, as I really am hoping that his revamp of the accredited section will effectively take care of this problem.

The truth of the matter is that the casinos on the accredited list are NOT all equal - and that needs to be recognised, and as far as I can tell Bryan is on the case so I'll wait to see what transpires there.

Personally speaking it's 'lesson learned' for me, if I want to play Microgaming, I'll play at 32Red, end of story. Bollocks to the bonuses that other casinos offer as enticement, I'd rather play 'straight deposit' at 32Red, or with their smaller bonuses, than put myself through the hassle other MG casinos have subjected me to. (GNUF were a pain in the arse as well.)

Roll on the 'Accredited A list', or the 'Accredited Gold Medal/Silver Medal/Bronze Medal' or however Bryan chooses to implement it - but the best casinos on the accredited list really need to be recognised as such, and the 'under-performers' (to be polite about it) shouldn't be sharing the same stage.

Of course its up to you to decide whether to lodge an official complaint to Bryan but their behaviour is despicable and should they do it again dont have second thoughts about the complaint.

While I agree that not all accredited casinos are equal it could be quite a heavy task for Bryan to categorise them into different levels. If this categorisation is to be implemented perhaps Bryan could let us comment on the accredited casinos and categorise them based on feedback. Alternatively, comments can be shed on the criteria for accreditation and those who can attain a higher level of service can be awarded 'gold/silver/bronze status as appropriate. To facilitate future additions/upgradings/deletions the criteria must be objective so that the casinos can have an incentive for the status to be upgraded.

 

[vinylweatherman]

As this thread is about pending withdrawals and the increasing length of time between request and receipt of payment......

My personal "yawn of the month" award goes to Lucky Nugget, for the blistering performance of getting a withdrawal made late on 15th June, a Friday, into my Neteller account by Tuesday. The award is based on the fact that this was NOT the Tuesday I would have expected to see it, but the FOLLOWING Tuesday the 26th June - a staggering 11 days

A withdrawal earlier this year also took a similar "scenic route" around the system before turning up in my Neteller account.

Someone needs a Satnav for the Cyber highways


This is the kind of information that players need to be able to add as comment in a revamped accredited section, as it would show whether the official withdrawal timescales as listed are sufficiently accurate

Second place goes to GNUF for barely making payment on Friday from a Monday withdrawal, which is almost twice their published 48 hours. They also randomly paid it back to a card used earlier, even though all recent deposits, and certainly all deposits since the previous withdrawal, had come 100% via Neteller.

This is making Casino Rewards look like FAST payers!

 

[ValDes]

Personally speaking it's 'lesson learned' for me, if I want to play Microgaming, I'll play at 32Red, end of story. Bollocks to the bonuses that other casinos offer as enticement, I'd rather play 'straight deposit' at 32Red, or with their smaller bonuses, than put myself through the hassle other MG casinos have subjected me to. (GNUF were a pain in the arse as well.)

Speaking as a web developer, surely only a second 'opt in' via email address confirmation (an email sent to confirm your address is real) is enough in todays age?

EDIT: Oh, and trust me, if I could still play MG, I would ONLY be playing 32 Red. As it stands now, due to Spanish regulation, 3 Dice is getting all my deposits.

I'm afraid you just overestimate 32Red a little bit. Talking ONLY by myself of course, and my experience in their group! I got terrible issue with them and it was resolved successfully only because of CasinoMeister.com PAB, for what can say a big THANK YOU! Yes, I know they got solid reputation, but do have in mind that everyone can wrong, even the best and 32Red does not make an exception from that rule by no means!

 

[vinylweatherman]

I'm afraid you just overestimate 32Red a little bit. Talking ONLY by myself of course, and my experience in their group! I got terrible issue with them and it was resolved successfully only because of CasinoMeister.com PAB, for what can say a big THANK YOU! Yes, I know they got solid reputation, but do have in mind that everyone can wrong, even the best and 32Red does not make an exception from that rule by no means!

32Red DO get it wrong sometimes, but it is rare for a player to have to go to a third party to get 32Red to do the right thing. It is partly because 32Red have a better CS team than most, so issues that should be solved at this level get solved at this level, leading to fewer issues coming into the public domain.

Where a PAB is necessary, it will be because 32Red staff and management believed they were in the right, but given fresh input from an external mediator (Max), decide to err in the players' favour if there is any doubt about the fairness of their decision.

There have been a number of cases of player vs 32Red that made it to the forum, where there was insufficient evidence to decide for either side with certainty, but in most cases 32Red made a "without admission of liabilty" goodwill gesture to the player that would be no different to the player having won the dispute.

I remember one where a live game appeared to malfunction and a player expecting a £2000 payout didn't actually receive it. Although 32Red could not pin down what had happened, they eventually gave the player the £2000 and pulled the game as they could not be 100% certain the player had NOT been screwed over by the software.

Lesser operators would have required near 100% proof the player HAD been screwed before they would offer payment.

Oddly enough, 32Red are NOT showing any signs of going bust through this more generous approach to player issues, yet many groups who seem to put "penny pinching" above "doing the right thing" ARE either going bust, or struggling to survive.

 

[ValDes]

32Red DO get it wrong sometimes, but it is rare for a player to have to go to a third party to get 32Red to do the right thing. It is partly because 32Red have a better CS team than most, so issues that should be solved at this level get solved at this level, leading to fewer issues coming into the public domain.

Where a PAB is necessary, it will be because 32Red staff and management believed they were in the right, but given fresh input from an external mediator (Max), decide to err in the players' favour if there is any doubt about the fairness of their decision.

There have been a number of cases of player vs 32Red that made it to the forum, where there was insufficient evidence to decide for either side with certainty, but in most cases 32Red made a "without admission of liabilty" goodwill gesture to the player that would be no different to the player having won the dispute.

I remember one where a live game appeared to malfunction and a player expecting a £2000 payout didn't actually receive it. Although 32Red could not pin down what had happened, they eventually gave the player the £2000 and pulled the game as they could not be 100% certain the player had NOT been screwed over by the software.

Lesser operators would have required near 100% proof the player HAD been screwed before they would offer payment.

Oddly enough, 32Red are NOT showing any signs of going bust through this more generous approach to player issues, yet many groups who seem to put "penny pinching" above "doing the right thing" ARE either going bust, or struggling to survive.

I really do not know why you are telling me all this, since it has nothing in common with my words, but anyway, I am completely agree! My point was that 32Red is just a little bit ooooooooooooooverestimated - that is all! Just to wag the dog - Virgin is much better IMHO!

 

[vinylweatherman]

I really do not know why you are telling me all this, since it has nothing in common with my words, but anyway, I am completely agree! My point was that 32Red is just a little bit ooooooooooooooverestimated - that is all! Just to wag the dog - Virgin is much better IMHO!

censored

You wouldn't think this if you used them for the internet and TV.

Their CS is even worse than the lowest standards found with online casinos, which makes even a small problem a massive undertaking to get dealt with.

 

[ValDes]

censored

Their CS is even worse than the lowest standards found with online casinos, which makes even a small problem a massive undertaking to get dealt with.

CS was the exact reason for my issue with 32Red, so I stoped worshipping them, you know! Anyway, wish you luck, no matter what a casino you are using!

 

[chuchu59]

CS was the exact reason for my issue with 32Red, so I stoped worshipping them, you know! Anyway, wish you luck, no matter what a casino you are using!

As far as online casinos go 32RED has the best customer service. They may still be a tad behind the reputable big-name corporations in the real world that offer superior products and services but this is probably the only online gaming outfit that treasures its reputation more than anything else and is there for the long haul unlike many others who will screw you for several $k without caring about the harm done to their image.

 

[sparkz]

Yea I hate the pending time and also refuse to play anywhere that allows withdrawals to be reversed.


I must of reversed a withdrawal and lost at least 30 times. With my withdrawal I would put some of it back to them anyway. So usually if I win and they take too long, I feel like playing again and so as you have to reverse the lot and not part of it I reverse it and lose.

The worst ever is Xbingo. That place is nothing but scum and they deserve to go down. I won over £2000, their pending policy at the time was 5 working days. More than 2 weeks later it was still pending, support took a week to reply to each email and they had no live support. My gambling budget was all deposited with them so I couldnt play anywhere else so before they paid I reversed and lost the lot. I remember I won that on the casino games but also tried their bingo which as nothing short of rogue. After 11pm there was just 1 bingo game open. The max cards you could buy was something like £4.80 worth. A lot of the games 40+ people would be playing, so if they all bought max cards that almost £200 in the pot.... but the top prize for a full house was little over £5. They were clearly making over £100 a game.

The funny thing was a year or so later (last week) I got emails off them saying I hadnt sent in my docs to them and I need to verify my account. haha.


I will only play now at places like 10bet (pays in under 6 hours) and 32red (they flush withdrawals)

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Here's my latest pending withdrawal grumble.

Last weekend I deposited 200GBP at an MG casino, accredited here at CM and have been for years. It was first time I've played with the group so I took the 100% match SUB to get me a £400 bankroll.

Did pretty well and got in a position to cash out with 500GBP. (Was down to my last £100 of bonus balance at one point but had a really good revival and ended up with a withdrawable cash balance of £500. I played only slots at low stakes (highest stake I spun at for the whole thing was 2GBP)).

First evening I tried to cash out was Monday 9th July, there were no payment options for me to select for the withdrawal in the cashier window. Opened a Live Chat window, the support person was pleasant enough but ultimately he couldn't fix it, he finally told me they were having technical difficulties and to try again the next day.

Tried the morning of Tuesday 10th July, still no withdrawal options for me. (I was definitely eligible to withdraw, by the way.)

By the time I got home from work on Tuesday 10th July they'd fixed it, and I was able to initiate the withdrawal at 8pm. I got an email a bit later from their support saying they'd fixed the issue and they noticed that I'd already withdrawn.

Then the 48 hour pending period kicked in, which I knew about, and they basically took it down to the wire. I checked at around 6pm on Thursday 12th July and it was still showing as reversible, by 10pm when I checked again, it wasn't - so they must have done pretty much bang on 48 hours.

On the morning of Friday 13th July at around 8am I got the 'please send us your docs' email, I was expecting this so I had them ready, and I got the docs back to them within 15 minutes.

I then got a return email saying that the docs would be passed over to their finance department and they'd let me know when they were approved. I replied and asked if they thought it would get done today, as I suspected their finance department didn't work weekends so if they didn't do it today it'd be next week before I got paid.

A couple of hours later (this is before 1pm GMT on Friday afternoon) I got a reply saying that the finance department didn't work weekends and my documents would be reviewed on Monday 16th July, fully SEVEN DAYS after I originally attempted to make a withdrawal. So my absolutely best case scenario here is a seven day wait from first trying to make a withdrawal, to getting paid.

I sent a reply asking why, if they knew they were going to request my docs before processing the withdrawal, did they not ask for them in the 48 hour pending period, rather than wait until the day after the 48 hour pending period expired to ask me. I have not received a reply.

And this is a casino group that has been accredited here at CM for years and has won CM awards in the past as well.

Poor display IMO.

 

[rockycatt]

i say they look at it from the broad view say your in the top ten percent of rigorous discipline another ten percent waffle / so eighty percent are likely to reverse

 

[chuchu59]

Here's my latest pending withdrawal grumble.

Last weekend I deposited 200GBP at an MG casino, accredited here at CM and have been for years. It was first time I've played with the group so I took the 100% match SUB to get me a £400 bankroll.

Did pretty well and got in a position to cash out with 500GBP. (Was down to my last £100 of bonus balance at one point but had a really good revival and ended up with a withdrawable cash balance of £500. I played only slots at low stakes (highest stake I spun at for the whole thing was 2GBP)).

First evening I tried to cash out was Monday 9th July, there were no payment options for me to select for the withdrawal in the cashier window. Opened a Live Chat window, the support person was pleasant enough but ultimately he couldn't fix it, he finally told me they were having technical difficulties and to try again the next day.

Tried the morning of Tuesday 10th July, still no withdrawal options for me. (I was definitely eligible to withdraw, by the way.)

By the time I got home from work on Tuesday 10th July they'd fixed it, and I was able to initiate the withdrawal at 8pm. I got an email a bit later from their support saying they'd fixed the issue and they noticed that I'd already withdrawn.

Then the 48 hour pending period kicked in, which I knew about, and they basically took it down to the wire. I checked at around 6pm on Thursday 12th July and it was still showing as reversible, by 10pm when I checked again, it wasn't - so they must have done pretty much bang on 48 hours.

On the morning of Friday 13th July at around 8am I got the 'please send us your docs' email, I was expecting this so I had them ready, and I got the docs back to them within 15 minutes.

I then got a return email saying that the docs would be passed over to their finance department and they'd let me know when they were approved. I replied and asked if they thought it would get done today, as I suspected their finance department didn't work weekends so if they didn't do it today it'd be next week before I got paid.

A couple of hours later (this is before 1pm GMT on Friday afternoon) I got a reply saying that the finance department didn't work weekends and my documents would be reviewed on Monday 16th July, fully SEVEN DAYS after I originally attempted to make a withdrawal. So my absolutely best case scenario here is a seven day wait from first trying to make a withdrawal, to getting paid.

I sent a reply asking why, if they knew they were going to request my docs before processing the withdrawal, did they not ask for them in the 48 hour pending period, rather than wait until the day after the 48 hour pending period expired to ask me. I have not received a reply.

And this is a casino group that has been accredited here at CM for years and has won CM awards in the past as well.

Poor display IMO.

Name and shame Chopley.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Name and shame Chopley.

If you don't mind chuchu I'll wait until I actually get the money back into my Neteller account first

 

[Seventh777]

To show the basic ineptness of most MGS CS in general - I have had this problem with a few MGS casinos over the last year or so and always waited an hour or two until the withdrawal options became available again, last time it happened (which was 32Red this time) it dawned on me, a very easy remedy and one I kicked myself for, for not thinking of trying previously, log in to the flash site and ta da, problem cured.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

To show the basic ineptness of most MGS CS in general - I have had this problem with a few MGS casinos over the last year or so and always waited an hour or two until the withdrawal options became available again, last time it happened (which was 32Red this time) it dawned on me, a very easy remedy and one I kicked myself for, for not thinking of trying previously, log in to the flash site and ta da, problem cured.

LOL I didn't think of that at all, but then I've never, ever played one single spin of an MG slot using the flash casino, I've always used the client

Quite a clever little fix though Seventh, you'd think their CS would have thought of it though.....

The whole thing is really f**king annoying TBH, I've got £500 locked up in that casino because they're basically taking as long as they can about everything they can, how can attempting to make a withdrawal on a Monday evening with a 48 hour pending period end up falling foul of that old 'we don't do anything at weekends' chestnut?

 

[Seventh777]

LOL I didn't think of that at all, but then I've never, ever played one single spin of an MG slot using the flash casino, I've always used the client

Quite a clever little fix though Seventh, you'd think their CS would have thought of it though.....

My point entirely Chopley .

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Yay I got paid!

So seven days from when I first tried to make the withdrawal, and six days from when I was actually able to request it.

As ever it's the weekend that's the killer, casinos really don't do themselves any favours by not maintaining some sort of staff at weekends who are able to process payments.

Still, at least the money is back in my Neteller account now and I can deposit elsewhere!

 

[Nifty29]

Yay I got paid!

So seven days from when I first tried to make the withdrawal, and six days from when I was actually able to request it.

As ever it's the weekend that's the killer, casinos really don't do themselves any favours by not maintaining some sort of staff at weekends who are able to process payments.

Still, at least the money is back in my Neteller account now and I can deposit elsewhere!

And the casino is......??

You should name and shame. A week to neteller is nothing short of disgraceful and is not deserving of CM accreditation. In fact, it cheapens the accreditation standards by placing these operators in the same section as 32Red, 3Dice and Inetbet......when they clearly don't belong there.

 

[smcinoz]

i must admit im also not a fan of the 2 working day turn around, gives the player access to a reverse for far too long. I dont think it would be that hard to implement something in the system that after 48 hours regardless of weekday or weekend that the withdraw request immediately can no longer be accessed. But im sure they get more benefit out of it being setup this way so i dont expect it to change.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

And the casino is......??

You should name and shame. A week to neteller is nothing short of disgraceful and is not deserving of CM accreditation. In fact, it cheapens the accreditation standards by placing these operators in the same section as 32Red, 3Dice and Inetbet......when they clearly don't belong there.

It was All Slots.

Only played with them in the first place because they had a pretty tasty SUB (100% to £200) and were running Clearplay, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered at all. (I'm not going to make a complaint about them, but same as I did for GNUF and Red Flush, who also both dicked me around, I've kept emails, chat logs, screenshots, and in the case of Red Flush the voicemail that they left for me in an unsolicited marketing call after requiring 'telephone verification' for me to make a withdrawal, and then using the number I provided to spam me with a bonus offer - point being, I can back up everything I say out here on the CM forums with evidence and will be happy to provide that to Bryan/Max as required should I ever be asked to do so.)

The money from All Slots hit my Neteller account sometime around 3-4pm this afternoon.

And the craziest thing about this, from the casino's point of view, is that I WILL NOT PLAY THERE AGAIN unless they chuck some kind of solid bonus my way.

When I can play MG slots at 32Red and get paid in less than 12 hours if I make a withdrawal, why the hell would I play 'non-bonus' at a casino such as GNUF/Betway, All Slots or Red Flush, who all have 48 hour pending periods, who all add the weekend onto that 'just because they can', and who all apparently like to use every trick in the book (send us your docs, we need a phonecall, we've passed it to our finance department and they've not in until Monday etc etc), but are running exactly the same slots as 32Red?

They act as if they've got some kind of exclusive access to MG slots that gives them the right to mess their players around and make up the rules as they go along, but in reality of course I'm just like, 'Whatever, 32Red it is then.'

And some casinos wonder they only attract the custom of 'bonus hunters'