Paula Deen Witch Hunt

[Jasminebed]

I come from farming families. Your livestock is a valuable resource. You feed them well to get best production. You treat them well, not only because there are laws, but because you have moral beliefs, and you get better results. You call the vet or treat them when they are ill, because they are costly to replace.

You breed them to produce superior offspring. You sell or trade these as you see fit.

You might bring the dogs in the house at night and feed them from your own table. You reward their loyalty with kindness.

There are animal cruelty charges laid every year, regardless. I'll be quick to agree these are a minority.

Slaves were not people, they were livestock.

 

[Janek12]

You want to be careful what you take from surveys and interviews. Surveys are only as good as the questions they ask and the people who take them and interviews can be hand picked.

There's a phenomenon called Stockholm Syndrome where kidnap victims bond with their captors. It's actually quite common and many long term kidnap victims learn to care for their captors. They empathize with them and even defend them when they're eventually set free.

You are right, thank you for pointing this out; I often try to find an angle of view different from the "official" or widely accepted one but in this instance I forgot to take this into account.

And I completely agree with your post - and actually that was part of what I was trying to say - that the attitude is the root of the evil. And I was trying to express my opinion that it is not a problem of racism or slavery per se, IMO, it is a wider problem of a group of people superior in some way and taking advantage of this at the expense of another group of people. It is the same story with Native Americans. And it is the same story all over the world today... The strong trying to subjugate or impose on the weaker...
Also, IMO one of the problems of racism stems from the fact that it is not widely recognised that races IMO are not the same! They are equal in human terms, yes, they are all human beings, but they are not the same - in terms of physical and mental talents, physical and mental predispositions... And the human society has developed to the point that it is widely recognised that the diversity represented by races is a great thing. But in practical terms, nobody knows what to do with this in societies consisting of members of different ethnic groups and races. In my country both Communist and post-Communist governments, have been trying to fit Gypsies into their local Central European templates... Of course, the result is disastrous...

 

[BMWSTACK]

I stand by my statement , the world is full of crazy people who do not care what they say and show little respect for their fellow human beings , it is sad but true, it is all around us and it is hard to tune it out while it plays in our music and everyday life events , that was what I was trying to state in my" General Statement".

I have always been proud to be from the south and yes we have had our share of racism but this is all over the world my friend , watch the world news , it is going on all around this globe not only in the south.

Laurie

I think the South has had WAY more than its "fair share" of racism, and from what I read and hear, much of it still exists simmering under the surface, which is not surprising given that these racist attitudes were/are passed down through the generations.

Just because it exists in other places too does not make it OK.

I have spent significant time in the deep south, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia. Racism is far more spread in these parts. Actually racism is still such a way of life that I am not sure that some people in these areas know exactly what racism is, they just understand that people are not created equal. Lots of people are still pissed that the south lost, and had their rights to slavery taken away.

The south really opened my eyes to the fact that racism is real. Of course being brought up I knew it was real, but of course the south was always the main demographic area when learning about racism. When I first got to spend time in the south the racism was so apparent that my first observation was "all the history books and lesson taught were real."

 

[skiny]

You are right, thank you for pointing this out; I often try to find an angle of view different from the "official" or widely accepted one but in this instance I forgot to take this into account.

And I completely agree with your post - and actually that was part of what I was trying to say - that the attitude is the root of the evil. And I was trying to express my opinion that it is not a problem of racism or slavery per se, IMO, it is a wider problem of a group of people superior in some way and taking advantage of this at the expense of another group of people. It is the same story with Native Americans. And it is the same story all over the world today... The strong trying to subjugate or impose on the weaker...
Also, IMO one of the problems of racism stems from the fact that it is not widely recognised that races IMO are not the same! They are equal in human terms, yes, they are all human beings, but they are not the same - in terms of physical and mental talents, physical and mental predispositions... And the human society has developed to the point that it is widely recognised that the diversity represented by races is a great thing. But in practical terms, nobody knows what to do with this in societies consisting of members of different ethnic groups and races. In my country both Communist and post-Communist governments, have been trying to fit Gypsies into their local Central European templates... Of course, the result is disastrous...

Don't mistake racial differences from cultural differences. Try telling Jet li, Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Usain Bolt, Albert Einstein, Mahatma Gandhi, Jaromir Jagr, Neils Bhor, Muhammad Ali, Neil deGrasse Tyson, Martin Luther King Jr (and trust me, I could go on and on) that their race makes them inferior mentally or physically. Any race is capable of producing brilliant minds and outstanding athletes. Any culture is not. There are religious, political social and economical problems that many cultures face (just to name a few) that keep people who are born into these cultures from reaching their full potential. And many cultures are quite happy with their economic status and level of technological advancements. Go visit an Amish village and ask if they're in any great hurry to send someone to the moon or if you can borrow their cell phone.

It's true that some nations are in dire need of assistance and welcome any they can get but we can't hold the world up to our standards because not everyone measures the quality of life with the same set of scales. It doesn't make them inferior, it just makes them different. Personally, I like different. The last thing we need is more people like me around.

 

[Nifty29]

Don't mistake racial differences from cultural differences. Try telling Jet li, Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Usain Bolt, Albert Einstein, Mahatma Gandhi, Jaromir Jagr, Neils Bhor, Muhammad Ali, Neil deGrasse Tyson, Martin Luther King Jr (and trust me, I could go on and on) that their race makes them inferior mentally or physically. Any race is capable of producing brilliant minds and outstanding athletes. Any culture is not. There are religious, political social and economical problems that many cultures face (just to name a few) that keep people who are born into these cultures from reaching their full potential. And many cultures are quite happy with their economic status and level of technological advancements. Go visit an Amish village and ask if they're in any great hurry to send someone to the moon or if you can borrow their cell phone.

It's true that some nations are in dire need of assistance and welcome any they can get but we can't hold the world up to our standards because not everyone measures the quality of life with the same set of scales. It doesn't make them inferior, it just makes them different. Personally, I like different. The last thing we need is more people like me around.

+1

Excellent post skiny.

 

[Balthazar]

A person who uses a racial slur in the privacy of their own home is still a racist.

Ok, but who gives a rat's ass? What are you going to do? Kill her? Send her to jail? It's none of your business if she's racist at home.

She sure doesn't act like a racist in public though, she's hiring tons of black people in her restaurant. Her bodyguard (the guy who follows her everywhere) is also black. I wouldn't want a black man around me at all time and put my life in his hands if I were racist, would you? Black people around her also appear to love her and claim that she respects them a lot.

People like you make racism witch hunting much worse than racism itself.

 

[Balthazar]

Don't mistake racial differences from cultural differences.

Now we're talking.

 

[skiny]

Ok, but who gives a rat's ass?

Not nearly enough people, apparently.

What are you going to do? Kill her? Send her to jail? It's none of your business if she's racist at home.

No, it's not but it is the business of her sponsors.

She sure doesn't act like a racist in public though,

Most pedophiles, serial killers and rapists don't either.

she's hiring tons of black people in her restaurant. Her bodyguard (the guy who follows her everywhere) is also black. I wouldn't want a black man around me at all time and put my life in his hands if I were racist, would you? Black people around her also appear to love her and claim that she respects them a lot.

You can believe a race is inferior and still have them provide services for you and respect is relative. Does she respect them as much as she respects people of her own race or do they feel more respected by her than by other racists? Or would they just like to keep their jobs so their not going to run around in public calling her a racist?

And if you think a people are not racist because they've hired some black people or have a few black friends you don't really understand racism.

People like you make racism witch hunting much worse than racism itself.

Believe what you like but I don't believe being offended by people who make racist statements worse than racism itself.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I remember reading somewhere about a survey carried out still in the 20th century among very old African American people who actually experienced the era of slavery in the south; there were roughly 1,000 respondents in that survey, IIRC. A surprisingly huge percentage of them (regrettably, I do not remember the exact figure) reminisced about the era of slavery as very good old times. They said their white masters took care of them, gave them work, housing, food, even some education, health care, etc. Also, black nannies were taking care of the white children, so the two races became interpersonally intertwined. The respondents went on to say that after slavery was abolished, they were on their own; I am paraphrasing but I recall the impression of something like being thrown out to the cold world without having the resources of the white masters behind them (of course it was the system's result that the black people mostly probably had no capital at all to start their own businesses, etc.).

So I think I understand what she was trying to say - that the southerners knew that black people were fine because they lived with them every day side by side. While others from the north might be paradoxically more prejudiced because they did not have any personal experience with them and might have been afraid of them as of unknown, different, strange, enigmatic people...

The impression I got from the survey was that it was a symbiotic relationship in the south, not always fraught with cruelty, inhuman treatment, etc. Also, I think it is fair to say that the white race at that time was undeniably more advanced technologically and intellectually.
But of course I agree with you, skiny, that slavery was and is unacceptable. And I think it was despicable that white people took advantage of their technological superiority and abused the black people the way they did.

All I am trying to say is that - no pun intended - it is not a completely black-and-white matter; it is more complex.
Look at Zimbabwe - the country fared much better with white people in charge; it prospered, etc. After they drove most white people away, some time after that the country was on the brink of famine IIRC... Once again, the problem I think was that white people, in general, abused their superiorty and were trampling on the natives so the natives were rightfully angered... These cases can be found all over the globe in other more subtle versions... We Czechs have to thank Germans for a lot from culture and technology and advancement in the last few centuries... But many Czechs refuse to recognise this because it came at a price - the Germans were oppressive in the border areas (I mean long before WWII) and, speaking in somewhat naive terms, were sometimes not behaving nicely... etc., etc.

The sample was biased.

These very old ex slaves were the ones that did NOT die young due to overwork and mistreatment, so of course their replies would paint a rosy picture of live as a slave.

What is far more telling is what they experienced when slavery ended. Despite being almost "part of the family", they were kicked out onto the streets. What was wrong with simply converting them to paid employees to carry out the same tasks as before. I would presume that after the ex slaves were "released", others were then employed to take their place and carry out the ex slaves' tasks as paid employees.

They were always "livestock" to even the good masters, and when the economics changed, and the current "livestock" suddenly became more expensive to keep, it was got rid of and replaced by a different "crop".

The TRULY good masters would have been those that simply told their slaves that they were now employees, and would be paid the going rate for what they did, and were free to leave to seek employment elsewhere if they didn't want to stay on. The ones that left should then have been given a starter package so that they could at least leave with dignity.

 

[dionysus]

Im prejudiced...I make conscious and subconscious choices and decisions based on preferences. What I am not, is racist. Im sorry but any person whether publically or privately, decides that a people on the whole are better or less than, are people i chose neither to form friendships with or know. You can say whatever the frick you'd like in your home..but if i hear such things or are aware of such things, i don't really want to know you

 

[Cleveland]

Some of the stuff said is this thread is pretty sad. I as an African American find it retarded that someone would mention any survey about x amount of former slaves saying how good of a time it was. The fact remains thousands were hung, thousands were lynched, thousands were raped. Yay for the few that didn't get harmed, and walked away with nice memories.

But the thread isn't about slavery how good or bad it was.

In terms of Paula, I wasn't there to hear how anything was said. I have no clue how the former employee heard about something she supposedly only said in her home 27 years ago, or how anyone would have heard about it if it was said between husband and wife 27 years ago. It's everyone's choice how they want to handle this. If I thought my bottom line would be damaged in anyway by this I would like to think my moral code would hold strong, but the sad truth is I'd probably drop her too. As a company it's their choice and right to protect their money, just like I'm sure there will be x amount of people not buying any of her products.

Which hunt. No not really (imo), nobody is trying to put her in jail. It's in the media, as are a million other stories, some of which they beat us to death with. She's a public figure, naturally this type of incident wouldn't happen behind closed doors. I wonder if it would be better if the companies were dropping her but it wasn't in the news media? Would it then cease to be a witch hunt? As I said it's peoples / companies choice to support her or not. They aren't best friends, it's a business. Bad business, maybe, still business.

 

[jelsmith]

One of the reasons racism still exists is that people seem to believe there are such things as justified racism or situational racism. "If someone pulled a gun on me I would denigrate his entire race" as if every black person in existence is to blame for the offense. A person who uses a racial slur in the privacy of their own home is still a racist. The fact that they've learned they can't do this in public changes nothing. People don't stop being racists just because they've left the house and they don't start being racists once they get home and close the door.

It seems ludicrous to sit here trying to think of scenarios when it's acceptable to be a racist. Even if you live in the inner cities where the population of immigrants is dense and crimes perpetrated by black or ethnic groups is high, that's still not a race problem. If it was middle and upper class black or ethnic people would be perpetrating the same crimes and these crimes wouldn't be perpetrated by white people. It's an economic and social problem and adding racism to the mix only makes it worse.

Personally, I think the woman is a racist even if she was nice to some of her black staff.

She told a story in an interview about how rough it was for one of her ancestors after the civil war because he lost his 30 something slaves. "He didn't know how to deal with life with no one to help operate his plantation."

They weren't helping. They were slaves.

She continued by saying "I feel like the south is almost less prejudice because black folks played such an integral part in our lives. They were like our family."

They weren't your family. They were a race of people with no rights being bought and sold like cattle and being forced to work in chains.

Just because your ancestors had slaves doesn't make you a racist. But if you want me to believe you're not, stop acting like it was ok to own people regardless of where or when it happened.

The bolded quote by Skiny says it all. She did this to herself. She needs to STFU if she wants to save even a sliver of her reputation. She has complete diarrhea of the mouth. She has made herself out to be a racist by her own words.

 

[skiny]

Some of the stuff said is this thread is pretty sad. I as an African American find it retarded that someone would mention any survey about x amount of former slaves saying how good of a time it was. The fact remains thousands were hung, thousands were lynched, thousands were raped. Yay for the few that didn't get harmed, and walked away with nice memories.

But the thread isn't about slavery how good or bad it was.

In terms of Paula, I wasn't there to hear how anything was said. I have no clue how the former employee heard about something she supposedly only said in her home 27 years ago, or how anyone would have heard about it if it was said between husband and wife 27 years ago. It's everyone's choice how they want to handle this. If I thought my bottom line would be damaged in anyway by this I would like to think my moral code would hold strong, but the sad truth is I'd probably drop her too. As a company it's their choice and right to protect their money, just like I'm sure there will be x amount of people not buying any of her products.

Which hunt. No not really (imo), nobody is trying to put her in jail. It's in the media, as are a million other stories, some of which they beat us to death with. She's a public figure, naturally this type of incident wouldn't happen behind closed doors. I wonder if it would be better if the companies were dropping her but it wasn't in the news media? Would it then cease to be a witch hunt? As I said it's peoples / companies choice to support her or not. They aren't best friends, it's a business. Bad business, maybe, still business.

Being a racist isn't a crime. There's no way we can monitor and convict people for what they think or what they feel. Acting on these feelings is a different story entirely. Personally, I don't think it's a bad thing when we see people lose friends, lose their jobs, lose advertising sponsors and so on because they acted in a racist manner. People need to see that this behaviour will not be tolerated. As far as I know you can't be convicted of an offence for calling someone a racist name but if someone manages to prove she showed prejudice against any of her employees on the basis of race, that most certainly is illegal.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Being a racist isn't a crime. There's no way we can monitor and convict people for what they think or what they feel. Acting on these feelings is a different story entirely. Personally, I don't think it's a bad thing when we see people lose friends, lose their jobs, lose advertising sponsors and so on because they acted in a racist manner. People need to see that this behaviour will not be tolerated. As far as I know you can't be convicted of an offence for calling someone a racist name but if someone manages to prove she showed prejudice against any of her employees on the basis of race, that most certainly is illegal.

You can here in the UK.

If you mug someone and at the same time call them racist names you can be charged with a "racially aggravated" offence, and if convicted, would receive a stiffer sentence than if you had kept your mouth shut whilst robbing them.

If you hurl racist abuse at someone, the same applies, and any fine is greater than if you had just launched a tirade of bog standard non racist abuse.

 

[Andy Walker]

You can here in the UK.

If you mug someone and at the same time call them racist names you can be charged with a "racially aggravated" offence, and if convicted, would receive a stiffer sentence than if you had kept your mouth shut whilst robbing them.

If you hurl racist abuse at someone, the same applies, and any fine is greater than if you had just launched a tirade of bog standard non racist abuse.

Mind you the UK is a little strange in some respects, a person from England can call someone from Wales very horrible things about their choice of lifetime partners (did I hear the noise of a lamb in the distance then?) and it’s just a joke and conversely a person from Wales may fly their nations flag with complete impunity whilst their neighbours in England would be frowned upon for their flag fluttering in the wind as tantamount to national racism.

The same rules apply to the subjects in the South of England that consider people from the North as somewhat inferior and then we can move onto Scotland with the same issues.

I would suggest that people from the UK are not really qualified to comment and with the past influx of people from the eastern part of the Eurozone that have settled here for a few years complaining to the natively born about immigration it becomes a fallacy.

Where do you draw the line between overt and conjecture?

 

[Cleveland]

Being a racist isn't a crime. There's no way we can monitor and convict people for what they think or what they feel. Acting on these feelings is a different story entirely. Personally, I don't think it's a bad thing when we see people lose friends, lose their jobs, lose advertising sponsors and so on because they acted in a racist manner. People need to see that this behaviour will not be tolerated. As far as I know you can't be convicted of an offence for calling someone a racist name but if someone manages to prove she showed prejudice against any of her employees on the basis of race, that most certainly is illegal.

I was referencing the witch hunt statement. I also didn't say I wanted her jailed for this either, as she didn't commit a criminal offense. Not sure why you quoted me.

But for the record when commenting a crime against a person, if the crime was done because of victim's race then that charge can be upgraded to the next level and prosecuted as a hate crime. So yes we do prosecute racism.

 

[secret2]

Freedom Of Speech is one thing, but putting hatred of another race is another, if acted upon in violence then it is a crime.

Unfortunately, I was held up in Kingston, NY in traffic, as the KKK had a parade. No one could stop it, police were there but just to make sure there were no violent outbursts.

It sucks so bad when some hurl racist comments and all we can do is back away...unless it's in a work place...go figure.

 

[LaurieJim]

Mind you the UK is a little strange in some respects, a person from England can call someone from Wales very horrible things about their choice of lifetime partners (did I hear the noise of a lamb in the distance then?) and it’s just a joke and conversely a person from Wales may fly their nations flag with complete impunity whilst their neighbours in England would be frowned upon for their flag fluttering in the wind as tantamount to national racism.

The same rules apply to the subjects in the South of England that consider people from the North as somewhat inferior and then we can move onto Scotland with the same issues.

I would suggest that people from the UK are not really qualified to comment and with the past influx of people from the eastern part of the Eurozone that have settled here for a few years complaining to the natively born about immigration it becomes a fallacy.

Where do you draw the line between overt and conjecture?

I remember looking on FB and seeing some of the raciest things being said about the Muslims that butchered the young British soldier and other things involving immigrants that are rioting in parts of Europe now, so where is the line drawn ?

As I stated earlier it is all over the world and not just in the good ole USA , things are said in the heat of the moment or like mob mentality at its worst.

I will still buy her products as she told the truth and if we all said I am sorry for any bad name we have ever called, thought or muttered under our breath , there would be a thundering of" I'm Sorry all around the world ", no one is perfect on this earth.

Laurie

 

[skiny]

You can here in the UK.

If you mug someone and at the same time call them racist names you can be charged with a "racially aggravated" offence, and if convicted, would receive a stiffer sentence than if you had kept your mouth shut whilst robbing them.

If you hurl racist abuse at someone, the same applies, and any fine is greater than if you had just launched a tirade of bog standard non racist abuse.

Yes, once you verbally express it the story changes. I really just meant being a racist isn't a crime in itself. You just can't act on it and in a lot of situations that includes being verbal.

I was referencing the witch hunt statement. I also didn't say I wanted her jailed for this either, as she didn't commit a criminal offense. Not sure why you quoted me.

But for the record when commenting a crime against a person, if the crime was done because of victim's race then that charge can be upgraded to the next level and prosecuted as a hate crime. So yes we do prosecute racism.

Sorry, I was too lazy to chop it up this time. I was just commenting on you wondering if it would have been better if the companies dropped her but it wasn't in the media. I think it's better that people see the result of this type of behaviour.

 

[Cleveland]

I remember looking on FB and seeing some of the raciest things being said about the Muslims that butchered the young British soldier and other things involving immigrants that are rioting in parts of Europe now, so where is the line drawn ?

As I stated earlier it is all over the world and not just in the good ole USA , things are said in the heat of the moment or like mob mentality at its worst.

I will still buy her products as she told the truth and if we all said I am sorry for any bad name we have ever called, thought or muttered under our breath , there would be a thundering of" I'm Sorry all around the world ", no one is perfect on this earth.

Laurie

I don't think anyone is saying anybody is perfect or hasn't thought or said bad things. The main point is being prepared to suffer the consequences should those things be made public. Just as it's ok for you to continue purchasing her products, it's ok for others to stop purchasing them, and companies to stop selling them. I think that's called freedom .

Truth be told if she would come to my house and cook me a meal, I would eat it in a flap jack minute. Still won't buy her products though.

I was referencing the witch hunt statement. I also didn't say I wanted her jailed for this either, as she didn't commit a criminal offense. Not sure why you quoted me.

But for the record when commenting a crime against a person, if the crime was done because of victim's race then that charge can be upgraded to the next level and prosecuted as a hate crime. So yes we do prosecute racism.

Ok my mistake, I understand now.

 

[robborg]

hindsight is 20/20 basically in a nutshell IMO

 

[Janek12]

The sample was biased.

These very old ex slaves were the ones that did NOT die young due to overwork and mistreatment, so of course their replies would paint a rosy picture of live as a slave.

.

Thank you, that is a very good point. I feel stupid for not realising this fact...

 

[skiny]

Thank you, that is a very good point. I feel stupid for not realising this fact...

I don't think you're stupid. I think the people who gave these interviews should have done more research and been more honest about the reality of this era. I've watched thousands of documentaries on a wide range of topics and the information in these things is only as good as the research put into them and the agenda the film makers start out with.

A little skepticism isn't a bad thing.

 

[Balthazar]

So two bullies walk down the street and they meet an unknown Asian and an unknown fat guy. The first bully, without warning, punches the fat guy in the face and calls him a "f'in fatass". The second bully punches the Asian guy in the face and calls him a "f'in chink". Both get arrested and the second guy gets a longer sentence for hate crime? How does that make any sense from the fat guy point of view?

 

[Stovetopp]

So two bullies walk down the street and they meet an unknown Asian and an unknown fat guy. The first bully, without warning, punches the fat guy in the face and calls him a "f'in fatass". The second bully punches the Asian guy in the face and calls him a "f'in chink". Both get arrested and the second guy gets a longer sentence for hate crime? How does that make any sense from the fat guy point of view?

SIMPLE
The Asian can't do anything about who he is Obviously, the fat guy can