Question Mr Green Account locked for investigation!!

[Mehmet]

Hi. I have a account on mrgreen and it is locked today when i was playing. I had make a withdrawal for 800 euro and i have money like 5K on my account. So my account is verieffied. And i get this mail.


Hello Mehmet,

Thank you for you for your email.

I can see we have now received all documents and thank you very much for sending them into us. Your winnings are on there way over to you.

I hope you enjoy your winnings.

Kindly reply to this email if you want to get in touch with us regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,


This mail have they send yesterday.. But then i was playing today and my account was locked. So i get this mail..




Hello Mehmet,

Thank you for your email.

Your account has been locked as we had received a notification from our payments processor that you had reversed transactions on this payment method.

can you please explain this for us to proceed?

Kindly reply to this email if you want to get in touch with us regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,



So i dont really understand what they are saying here?? So i just say sorry i dont understand the question, and they send a mail back






Hello Mehmet,

Thank your for your email.

Your account is now under investigation with our security team, we will email you back once we have a update.

Kindly reply to this email if you want to get in touch with us regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,




So i told them you cant close my account for nothing it is like you steal money from a person but on the internet, and they send me this.



Hello Mehmet,

Thank you for your email.

We can close your account here at Mr Green as we are running a investigation, i can not at this time give you a time frame but we will try to investigate this as soon as possible. We will get back to you once the investigation is complete.

Kindly reply to this email if you want to get in touch with us regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,




What the hell is happening now??

 

[IanO]

Your account has been locked as we had received a notification from our payments processor that you had reversed transactions on this payment method.

So i dont really understand what they are saying here??

Seems like they may have found some evidence relating to charge backs. Have you ever disputed any payments or charges on the credit card/depositing method you used to deposit at their site?

(for that matter... have you ever charged back deposits to any vendor for any reason that may be affecting you here?)

 

[incrediblestuff]

Seems English is not your strongest language, so to be sure i'll reply in Dutch

Wat ze zeggen, na in eerste instantie je uitbetaling te hebben toegezegd, is dat er bij de methode waar je naar uitbetaald hebt berichten komen dat je op een eerder tijdstip een "charge-back" hebt gedaan.

Dit betekent dat je een volgens jouw illegale transactie hebt aangevochten, wat kan betekenen dat je of fraude hebt gepleegd, of echt een poging tot "diefstal" van je account hebt teruggevorderd.

MrGreen wil voor dat ze betalen eerst weten welk van de twee gevallen aan de orde is
Als ze er namelijk achter komen dat je een fraudeur bent, zullen ze hooguit je deposit teruggeven, zeker geen winsten, als je een legitiem probleem had, dan gaan ze je winsten in principe wel betalen.

Je kreeg zelf de kans om het nader te belichten, maar jouw antwoord was dat je het niet begreep, dus hebben ze meteen alles geblokkeerd en zoeken het nu zelf uit met de Money-merchant.

Als je zelf contact met ze op neemt om uit te leggen wat het geval is dan versnel je wellicht de gang van zaken.

 

[Mehmet]

Seems like they may have found some evidence relating to charge backs. Have you ever disputed any payments or charges on the credit card/depositing method you used to deposit at their site?

(for that matter... have you ever charged back deposits to any vendor for any reason that may be affecting you here?)

No i have make depositt with Ideal you can never charge back with this payment methode.. I haven't do that i have deposit money and only play slots and i have make 3k wins now have 5k on account and 800 on withdrawal pending!! Its rediculous!!

 

[Mehmet]

Seems English is not your strongest language, so to be sure i'll reply in Dutch

Wat ze zeggen, na in eerste instantie je uitbetaling te hebben toegezegd, is dat er bij de methode waar je naar uitbetaald hebt berichten komen dat je op een eerder tijdstip een "charge-back" hebt gedaan.

Dit betekent dat je een volgens jouw illegale transactie hebt aangevochten, wat kan betekenen dat je of fraude hebt gepleegd, of echt een poging tot "diefstal" van je account hebt teruggevorderd.

MrGreen wil voor dat ze betalen eerst weten welk van de twee gevallen aan de orde is
Als ze er namelijk achter komen dat je een fraudeur bent, zullen ze hooguit je deposit teruggeven, zeker geen winsten, als je een legitiem probleem had, dan gaan ze je winsten in principe wel betalen.

Je kreeg zelf de kans om het nader te belichten, maar jouw antwoord was dat je het niet begreep, dus hebben ze meteen alles geblokkeerd en zoeken het nu zelf uit met de Money-merchant.

Als je zelf contact met ze op neemt om uit te leggen wat het geval is dan versnel je wellicht de gang van zaken.

Sooweyy!! Was gewoon een storting via ideal, ik zal nu contact opnemen met mrgreen, dankjewel voor je hulp!

 

[IanO]

If you are not getting the answers you need through the regular support avenues (remembering that sometimes all you need is a few days patience) you could always try PMing the rep here.

Jonas shows as not having been here for a while (a pm may solve that ) . Aliatam (their affiliate manager) has been on here more recently.

Jonas: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

Aliatam: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

It's possible Incrediblestuff just suggested all that of course. (can the curious get an english translation of your advice pls? )

 

[Mehmet]

If you are not getting the answers you need through the regular support avenues (remembering that sometimes all you need is a few days patience) you could always try PMing the rep here.

Jonas shows as not having been here for a while (a pm may solve that ) . Aliatam (their affiliate manager) has been on here more recently.

Jonas: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

Aliatam: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

It's possible Incrediblestuff just suggested all that of course. (can the curious get an english translation of your advice pls? )

I had deposit a week ago 200 euro's and i had lose all of my money, so i had go to the bank to get the money back, and i really get the money back.. I think that was the problem.. So now i dont know what to so..

 

[dunover]

I had deposit a week ago 200 euro's and i had lose all of my money, so i had go to the bank to get the money back, and i really get the money back.. I think that was the problem.. So now i dont know what to so..

OH dear! That alone seems to have resulted in either an unfulfilled transaction or chargeback. They can now effectively do what they like with your account. You've handed them that right. You will very unlikely be paid anything but they will refund your deposits - standard practice when casinos suspect fraud or danger of chargebacks at a later date.

 

[incrediblestuff]

Sooweyy!! Was gewoon een storting via ideal, ik zal nu contact opnemen met mrgreen, dankjewel voor je hulp!

@ Iano

yes, we basically said the same thing, although i did not point him at their rep, i did tell him to contact them as soon as possible to try and resolve the issue
Basically what i said translated by Google and pimped by me was :


What they are saying, after initially having accepted your withdrawal is that the method you used to withdraw has indications that a "charge-back" was done at an earlier time

This means that you have either commited a Casino-Fraud or really challenged an attempted "theft" or illegal transaction on your account there.

MrGreen first wants to know which of these two possibilities has occured.
If they find a case of fraudulent activity, they will return your deposit at best, but certainly no winnings and will block your account for good, if you had a legitimate problem, then they will surely pay your winnings.

You have got the chance to further illuminate your case the problem was that you did not understand their question initially (or so it seemed), so they immediately blocked everything and are investigating it themselves, with the Money-merchant.

If you take up contact with them to explain what the case is, then you may accelerate the course of events.

 

[incrediblestuff]

I had deposit a week ago 200 euro's and i had lose all of my money, so i had go to the bank to get the money back, and i really get the money back.. I think that was the problem.. So now i dont know what to so..

Well, that is too bad, like dunover said above this will most likely result in your account being permanently closed and your winnings confiscated.

If you are lucky they will refund your deposit, but if they feel you were attempting a malicious fraud, instead of what by your post, indicates a gambling problem, you will be S.O.L

I would make sure you clear this up, as it will happen in pretty much any casino you will sign up from now on.

Sounds like councelling is what you need, a break from gambling being the first step.

 

[Igor82]

Can i chime in here? It ticks me off, this new chageback my losses wave.

If you have a gambling problem and are playing out of your debts, Mr Green is one of the few casinos that set your "green gaming" parameters at the point of registration alone. not to mention the fact its easily accepible from practically everywhere on their site. This is exactly the kind of case i pointed out in another thread with relevance to bogus chargebacks.

A chargeback damages us - credit card companies (VISA) and even worse with mastercard give us a minuscule amount of space for chargeback transactions before they ban our business as fraudulent effectively blocking the business from being able to transact on the internet.

Inquiring a chargeback because you lost funds you deposited on your own free will, after being given an option to limit your habit every step of the way, is just completely unfair to the business that is offering you a service and all possible tools to control yourself.

You are effectively claiming your money was stolen because you did not manage to win from your risk - surely you must have known that this is not right. And since charge-backs take days to reach the operator, in your case it so happened that they received a request for deposit charge-back when you had winnings in your account. So you want your cake and to eat it too - quite literally.

And if you hadn't won - Mr Green would be stuck with a chargeback on their books, with a deduction of profits they deserved to have by being 100% honest and offering a service you very consciously requested. They would ahve also paid all the deposit, chargeback and revenue share costs to the game suppliers on your behalf.

This is exactly the reason why credit card purchase forms are the new wave of requirement and KYC process is getting more and more stringent by the minute.

Ease up on the unfair player practices in order to have a more lenient casino experience with accredited operators. If they do return your deposits it will be very big of them and my green hat's off to Mr Green in that case.

 

[aceking123]

igor, mr green is no angel i can vouch for that, there are many threads about them concerning id docs ) im not saying about chargebacks or anything like that but i will state on here mr green is isnt so green when it comes to id problems there lazy full stop !

 

[Mouche12]

Yes, I first thought "Oh, another Mr Green issue", but it's plain stupid that the OP has recuperated his losses by asking for a charge-back

 

[incrediblestuff]

For the record i also agree chargebacks are a big no-no, only to be used as an extreme measure to prevent yourself from being de-frauded.

I feel this O.P. is a younger person, and already sunk into a Gambling problem due lack of responsibility and knowledge.

No excuse though, this will probably be a good lesson, hope he will learn from it.

 

[Igor82]

I'm not going to turn this into an argument about Mr Green, and i don't know they practices in-depth in terms of verification, but did you ever stop to think that these ID problems and seriously stringent process is in the least partly due to cases like above?

 

[dunover]

igor, mr green is no angel i can vouch for that, there are many threads about them concerning id docs ) im not saying about chargebacks or anything like that but i will state on here mr green is isnt so green when it comes to id problems there lazy full stop !

Sorry, that is not relevant to this thread. Your opinions of Mr. Green are pointless - they are doing what ANY casino would in the circumstances. The OP in my opinion is a fraudster and should be censured on here. He will get his deposits back because I believe they are obliged to if they neutralize an account. If they didn't, even given the bent way the OP worked here, they would be liable to get charged back legitimately as the OP would have a case to do so. It covers the casino's a$$.
Igor - you'd return the deposit in these circumstances in order to wash your hands of the matter?

 

[aceking123]

Sorry, that is not relevant to this thread. Your opinions of Mr. Green are pointless - they are doing what ANY casino would in the circumstances. The OP in my opinion is a fraudster and should be censured on here. He will get his deposits back because I believe they are obliged to if they neutralize an account. If they didn't, even given the bent way the OP worked here, they would be liable to get charged back legitimately as the OP would have a case to do so. It covers the casino's a$$.

no it hasnt got to do with the op ( if hes a fraud like you suggesting ( no proof ), ive said nothing about chargebacks or whever the op is or isnt wrong , but mr green is a nightmare with id docs & can & will give you the run around , me & chuzzle had the same issues within this group months apart aswell so it shows nothing has changed there , its fine for them to ask for docs & yes if he/she did make a charge back then its there own fault , but still theyre a nightmare with id docs.

 

[Igor82]

no it hasnt got to do with the op ( if hes a fraud like you suggesting ( no proof ), ive said nothing about chargebacks or whever the op is or isnt wrong , but mr green is a nightmare with id docs & can & will give you the run around , me & chuzzle had the same issues within this group months apart aswell so it shows nothing has changed there , its fine for them to ask for docs & yes if he/she did make a charge back then its there own fault , but still theyre a nightmare with id docs.

I really wish the player recognises his state of affairs, especially if he is young of age and manages himself before it gets to a point that may have very long lasting repercussions. That said, my post was about their green gaming which directly correlates to what seems to be player's addiction at this point and freely and openly helps a player mange their limitations when registering which isn't common - and not about their verification process and ensuing difficulties some players may have experienced.

 

[dunover]

I really wish the player recognises his state of affairs, especially if he is young of age and manages himself before it gets to a point that may have very long lasting repercussions. That said, my post was about their green gaming which directly correlates to what seems to be player's addiction at this point and freely and openly helps a player mange their limitations when registering which isn't common - and not about their verification process and ensuing difficulties some players may have experienced.

Yes, as I said it has bugger-all to do with ID verification, the last chap has gone off at a tangent. Taking lessons from VWM lol....

Did you see my last question to you in my post before this Igor?

 

[irmster]

I had deposit a week ago 200 euro's and i had lose all of my money, so i had go to the bank to get the money back, and i really get the money back.. I think that was the problem.. So now i dont know what to so..

Ooops. Why on earth did you do that? You lost the money fair and square, then asked to bank to give it back to you? Why?

 

[Igor82]

Yes, as I said it has bugger-all to do with ID verification, the last chap has gone off at a tangent. Taking lessons from VWM lol....

Did you see my last question to you in my post before this Igor?

Sorry mate, I didn't catch that. To be honest, i dont know. In a word, "yes";- but if my heart is to be asked - then no, we've been hit with quite a few fully bogus chargebacks by verified customers with multiple deposits (they come in, max out the bonuses that can be awarded and bugger off asking for a chargeback if they lose) and have actually had to concede to the claims which infuriates me. However, if my head is to be asked, then yeah - take it on the chin and move on.

My head generally rules (being in the maths business and all ) so yeah, i would; and we have even returned good % of losses to obvious addiction cases after they (or us on their behalf) permanently closed their accounts without having to. They simply get the last goodbye email that X amount was processed as a withdrawal and links to where they can find help.

It makes me sleep better at night if i am to be completely honest. This case is different, its conniving in my eyes to do what the OP did and as such i have no sympathies.

 

[incrediblestuff]

My head generally rules (being in the maths business and all ) so yeah, i would; and we have even returned good % of losses to obvious addiction cases after they (or us on their behalf) permanently closed their accounts without having to. They simply get the last goodbye email that X amount was processed as a withdrawal and links to where they can find help.

Very generous and humanitairy
I do think this is just such a case however, but maybe due to the poor English it seems like fraud?
Like stated i think we are dealing with a younger, less responsible person, with little to no self restraint that acted
wrong in a panic situation, however, he should have stopped gambling right then and there, now that i think about it, but what would you expect from an irresponsible person with no self-restraint?

Probably a submit in the operator-shared "player-blacklist" is due..

 

[Mehmet]

I get it but i had the same message at triplegoldcasino they didn't believe that i had deposit the money, and the charge back at mr green doesnt work it was only 200 euro and it doesnt work. They only got a message that i wanted to do that.

So by triplegold casino they didnt believe that i deposit money, and becausr of that i had send my printscreen from my bankkaccount for proof that i had deposit my money 2 days later they open my account and sent my withdrawal. I think it is here the same problem..

 

[Igor82]

Very generous and humanitairy
I do think this is just such a case however, but maybe due to the poor English it seems like fraud?
Like stated i think we are dealing with a younger, less responsible person, with little to no self restraint that acted
wrong in a panic situation, however, he should have stopped gambling right then and there, now that i think about it, but what would you expect from an irresponsible person with no self-restraint?

Probably a submit in the operator-shared "player-blacklist" is due..

Lol i love your faith in humanity

I dont know, i tried doing a chargeback on a bad purchase transaction (nothing to do with gaming) and it was absolute hell. Pages of reasons i had to write how and why (since i didnt claim theft i had to explain why i want my money back and why the product is defunct), i had been warned twice of the charges i will incur if it is rejected and it was not an easy process.

By the end of it i regretted doing it because bank called me to come in personally twice and i simply have no time for that as it was only a few hundred quid. I had initially set out to do it on principle.

i dont know if its harder or easier to do it in Netherlands (?) but it's not a process of a tripping over and slipping into a chargeback. Its a concious, calculated and elaborate decision that was made before even approaching the casino and stating your case honestly. This is further cemented by OP WINNING the chargeback and then proceeding to deposit play again which obviously insinuates that he felt he was safe to repeat the process if he was to lose again.

The most credit i'll give the OP for is to be inexperienced enough not to know to move to the next casino to pull this stunt. I'm sorry for coming off as sharp as a switchblade, but 1) it hits home and 2) it doesn't sound as innocent as one might think when you really look into the process required.

Also note that if theft is claimed then his credit card would have to be invalidated and he would not be able to re-deposit using the same method (i'm assuming a lot here - i know)

 

[Mehmet]

I got this mail. Can anyone explain it to me?


Hello Mehmet,

Thank you for contacting Mr. Green!

We appreciate your patience through this time, a breach in our terms and conditions may have taken place, your file is still currently under review.

Our payments and fraud team are looking into your account for you and resolving this issue.

You will be contacting via email with a response when this is complete.

In the meantime please be patient and take note we are working on this for you at present.


I apologize for the inconvenience you may experience with Mr. Green.




Please reply to this email for further assistance regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,


Customer Service
Mr Green - A Casino Playground

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

ref:_00DD0qCjj._500D0R2L91:ref

 

[Igor82]

I get it but i had the same message at triplegoldcasino they didn't believe that i had deposit the money, and the charge back at mr green doesnt work it was only 200 euro and it doesnt work. They only got a message that i wanted to do that.

So by triplegold casino they didnt believe that i deposit money, and becausr of that i had send my printscreen from my bankkaccount for proof that i had deposit my money 2 days later they open my account and sent my withdrawal. I think it is here the same problem..

maybe it's the launguage barrier here but i'm pretty certain i read you say that you REALLY did get your money back after claiming it? I'm using your own capitalisation too...

 

[incrediblestuff]

I get it but i had the same message at triplegoldcasino they didn't believe that i had deposit the money, and the charge back at mr green doesnt work it was only 200 euro and it doesnt work. They only got a message that i wanted to do that.

So by triplegold casino they didnt believe that i deposit money, and becausr of that i had send my printscreen from my bankkaccount for proof that i had deposit my money 2 days later they open my account and sent my withdrawal. I think it is here the same problem..

You are wrong here: you must mean that TripleGold Casino did not trust you to have made the deposit yourself, that's why they wanted verification.

However if you charge back, even "only" 200,-, it's a very different story:

You have just learned that this is highly frowned upon in this business, from either the players or the Casinos side, and will most likely result in a "global" ban.
In other words, even if you are able to register at other casinos, once the verification process is started there, no matter for I.D. check or fraud control, you will pop up as a red flag and go through this same story..

I feel it might be the best thing for you to stop gambling immediately, since you obviously are living on the edge with your budget control: most gamblers spent more then they should, but always stay within the parameter.. or shit happens.
Best thing for you is to recoup your losses and find a new hobby.
No offense of course.

 

[irmster]

whether the chargeback 'worked' or not, I'd really like to understand what made you try it.

 

[Igor82]

whether the chargeback 'worked' or not, I'd really like to understand what made you try it.

Panic or greed. Incredible and I seem to be at an impass over that

 

[Mehmet]

I know that is my foult i cant say anything else..

 

[Igor82]

I know that is my foult i cant say anything else..

Well, i feel proud for you for taking the responsibility. It's a powerful trait to have and will serve much in life.

My advice? Quit gambling kid, you're way too young for it. Find a new outdoor hobby and sit and spin for hours when your a$$ is too saggy and tired to climb those trees

 

[incrediblestuff]

I got this mail. Can anyone explain it to me?
Hello Mehmet,

Thank you for contacting Mr. Green!

We appreciate your patience through this time, a breach in our terms and conditions may have taken place, your file is still currently under review.

Our payments and fraud team are looking into your account for you and resolving this issue.

You will be contacting via email with a response when this is complete.

In the meantime please be patient and take note we are working on this for you at present.

I apologize for the inconvenience you may experience with Mr. Green.

Please reply to this email for further assistance regarding your enquiry.

Kind Regards,

Translate for the O.P.

Er staat dat het er naar uitziet dat er sprake is van een breuk in de contractvoorwaarden, wat precies daar gaan ze niet op in maar dat is hoogstwaarschijnlijk je stornering van die 200,-
Ze zijn het ann het onderzoeken en vragen je geduldig af te wachten, en dan zullen ze contact met je opnemen wanneer het onderzoek afgerond is.'

Excuses voor het ongemak, en als je nog meer vragen hebt dan graag op die email reageren.

Ik stel voor dat je vraagt om iemand van support die Nederlands, of een vriend erbij haalt met die goed Engels spreekt.
Zou zelfs mogelijk zijn dat er daar iemand Turks spreekt.

Succes

 

[Mehmet]

Translate for the O.P.

Er staat dat het er naar uitziet dat er sprake is van een breuk in de contractvoorwaarden, wat precies daar gaan ze niet op in maar dat is hoogstwaarschijnlijk je stornering van die 200,-
Ze zijn het ann het onderzoeken en vragen je geduldig af te wachten, en dan zullen ze contact met je opnemen wanneer het onderzoek afgerond is.'

Excuses voor het ongemak, en als je nog meer vragen hebt dan graag op die email reageren.

Ik stel voor dat je vraagt om iemand van support die Nederlands, of een vriend erbij haalt met die goed Engels spreekt.
Zou zelfs mogelijk zijn dat er daar iemand Turks spreekt.

Succes

Dankjewel voor je hulp!!

 

[vinylweatherman]

Sorry mate, I didn't catch that. To be honest, i dont know. In a word, "yes";- but if my heart is to be asked - then no, we've been hit with quite a few fully bogus chargebacks by verified customers with multiple deposits (they come in, max out the bonuses that can be awarded and bugger off asking for a chargeback if they lose) and have actually had to concede to the claims which infuriates me. However, if my head is to be asked, then yeah - take it on the chin and move on.

My head generally rules (being in the maths business and all ) so yeah, i would; and we have even returned good % of losses to obvious addiction cases after they (or us on their behalf) permanently closed their accounts without having to. They simply get the last goodbye email that X amount was processed as a withdrawal and links to where they can find help.

It makes me sleep better at night if i am to be completely honest. This case is different, its conniving in my eyes to do what the OP did and as such i have no sympathies.

This loophole is available because casinos tend to ask for documents on a withdrawal. If a player tries the above trick, the casino has no documents and no deposit verification form. Perhaps where cards are involved a deposit declaration form should be requested straight away, and returned before any further deposits are allowed.

It's hardly new, I was providing casinos with deposit declaration forms for credit cards back in 2005.

If the OP did charge back, he won't be around much longer as Bryan will ban him.

Although there is a language barrier, it looks like the OP has confessed to losing €200 at a casino, and then charging back to retrieve it, which appeared to work.

It seems strange that it is so easy to charge back casino deposits, yet trying to get the money back from a dodgy purchase was a nightmare.

 

[Igor82]

you missed boldening VERIFIED.

im not posting above becuase i got charged back - i'm lacking understand to the true need of the process when i got charged back by players who's KYC docs i've had (although not the declaration) - and i had them because they opted into our free 50 NDB for early KYC offer. When i challenged the fact with my processor that the chagebacks were accepted in spite of having KYC documentation on the user i got a shrug of the shoulder and a statement that its down to the banks and their policies and they don't look fondly on gambling. there was nothing we could do - literally. Our acquiring back had the removed the money from the reserve.

Anyway, this long winded ID back/forth and over complication of KYC... i think it has become more about "saying something" than having "something to say". Bottom line is cases above dont help the fact that you need to jump through hoops and your "minority" you defend needs to get with the times as the times demand it or quit playing.

 

[vinylweatherman]

you missed boldening VERIFIED.

im not posting above becuase i got charged back - i'm lacking understand to the true need of the process when i got charged back by players who's KYC docs i've had (although not the declaration) - and i had them because they opted into our free 50 NDB for early KYC offer. When i challenged the fact with my processor that the chagebacks were accepted in spite of having KYC documentation on the user i got a shrug of the shoulder and a statement that its down to the banks and their policies and they don't look fondly on gambling. there was nothing we could do - literally. Our acquiring back had the removed the money from the reserve.

Anyway, this long winded ID back/forth and over complication of KYC... i think it has become more about "saying something" than having "something to say". Bottom line is cases above dont help the fact that you need to jump through hoops and your "minority" you defend needs to get with the times as the times demand it or quit playing.

"Getting with the times" means opting for ebilling too, yet the antiquated KYC procedures are holding this back. I dare not "get with the times" and save £22 per year on my landline bill by switching to an ebilling account because then no amount of photo ID will be of any use in passing KYC at the casinos.

Part of the blame is with the UK Government, and this is a harder nut to crack than any industry, hence pressure has to be brought to bear on the weakest target, even if this is not logically the best one. All the UK government needs to do is "get with the times" itself and realise that the current regime needs to change to support ecommerce companies in their quest to do proper KYC procedures.

You have also highlighted another problem, and it seems that banks are allowing chargebacks for gambling deposits based on an anti gambling prejudice, rather than a fair assessment of both sides of the argument. Maybe it's because you have a "middle man", the processor, and it is they who don't put a proper effort into defending the chargeback claim. Although you had all the KYC documents, you didn't have a deposit declaration form. Perhaps obtaining one for the first deposit as soon as it has been made and played would help tip the balance when it comes to challenging a bogus chargeback. If a particular bank has generated a particularly large number of chargebacks, you could even sue it in court arguing that gambling debts just like any other are enforceable in law. Winning this argument just once will help the industry as it could be used as a legal precedent with which to put pressure on banks that are too keen to put through bogus chargebacks. In theory, you could even sue the players who do it, but it's a question of whether it would really deter others.
A UK fraudster has already been taken to court by a large operator for "bonus fraud" (multi accounting), and was convicted. This should act as a deterrent, but it seems that most dedicated fraudsters have not been put off by just one case.

One way the UK government HAS "got with the times" is by changing the law on gambling debts, these are now enforceable in law, and as such, banks should NOT be allowing them to be charged back so easily.

Although UK citizens can eventually get passports, this is not a document we should be sending by EMAIL!!!! This is a gaping security hole in the KYC system, and one that exposes the most sensitive data to hackers. Government and banks state that they never discuss sensitive account information by email because it is not secure, and the Data Protection Act requires our data to be handled in a secure manner. In this respect, CASINOS need to "get with the times" and implement a properly secured means of sending documents for KYC. A small number have done so.

The passport is considered SO sensitive that the government don't even send them by ordinary post, and this is the ROYAL MAIL that isn't trusted, let alone email. Instead, they use a secure courier service.

With regard to the details of the KYC procedures, this is just as much a matter for the Information Commissioner's Office as it is for the gaming regulators.

If we put pressure on the UK government to "get with the times", it may actually turn out WORSE for the industry, even if it improves things for UK players.

For example, we may be officially told that we may send passport copies to companies for remote KYC, but then they may insist that the receiving companies change their own practices such as insisting that the entire transmission channel meets certain minimum security standards, whereas at present responsibility only starts when the company receives the document.

An example is our own banks, their response to this industry becoming mainstream has been to make it HARDER for UK players to deposit by card, and perversely EASIER for UK players to put through a bogus chargeback.

Perhaps accepting deposits by credit card too should be considered a thing of the past, and "getting with the times" would involve pushing players towards deposit methods that are properly geared towards the industry, such as Neteller and Skrill.

Players need a deposit method that is secure, and easy to operate. Casinos want one that makes it as hard as possible for players to issue bogus chargebacks just because they lose.

 

[naththo]

Wow, you have a had a terrible bad luck. Unfortunately like other said you did was a chargeback. Its a no no. So unfortunately casino will record against you for chargeback to put on your credit card system so that mean the other casino will be very cautious against you.

So probably for the best quit gambling for now and try recover some of your own financial and pay off debt. If you get better in future, then you know you are on safer hand but problem is once they have you on their system it will be very hard for casino to trust you.

Probably have a talk to your own local bank and get some help what to do, some good piece of advice and talk to your family if you believe you are still not sure/is in serious trouble, it best to stop, get some help and sort it out asap, the better you get out of trouble. I am sorry to see you have gone through a hell of time at least though.

I since joined most of casino. I haven't had a single problem because since then I do not have credit card, my is a debit card of mastercard. Before I start play online casino I normally check bank to make sure sufficient fund is there before making deposit so I don't get end up with chargeback. And normally they won't let me deposit if my fund is run out during the period of fortnight so that will protect me against any chargeback by accident as well. But just in case to double check fund before doing it so.

Hope you have it all sort out asap and get back on your feet.

 

[Nifty29]

"Getting with the times" means opting for ebilling too, yet the antiquated KYC procedures are holding this back. I dare not "get with the times" and save £22 per year on my landline bill by switching to an ebilling account because then no amount of photo ID will be of any use in passing KYC at the casinos.

Part of the blame is with the UK Government, and this is a harder nut to crack than any industry, hence pressure has to be brought to bear on the weakest target, even if this is not logically the best one. All the UK government needs to do is "get with the times" itself and realise that the current regime needs to change to support ecommerce companies in their quest to do proper KYC procedures.

You have also highlighted another problem, and it seems that banks are allowing chargebacks for gambling deposits based on an anti gambling prejudice, rather than a fair assessment of both sides of the argument. Maybe it's because you have a "middle man", the processor, and it is they who don't put a proper effort into defending the chargeback claim. Although you had all the KYC documents, you didn't have a deposit declaration form. Perhaps obtaining one for the first deposit as soon as it has been made and played would help tip the balance when it comes to challenging a bogus chargeback. If a particular bank has generated a particularly large number of chargebacks, you could even sue it in court arguing that gambling debts just like any other are enforceable in law. Winning this argument just once will help the industry as it could be used as a legal precedent with which to put pressure on banks that are too keen to put through bogus chargebacks. In theory, you could even sue the players who do it, but it's a question of whether it would really deter others.
A UK fraudster has already been taken to court by a large operator for "bonus fraud" (multi accounting), and was convicted. This should act as a deterrent, but it seems that most dedicated fraudsters have not been put off by just one case.

One way the UK government HAS "got with the times" is by changing the law on gambling debts, these are now enforceable in law, and as such, banks should NOT be allowing them to be charged back so easily.

Although UK citizens can eventually get passports, this is not a document we should be sending by EMAIL!!!! This is a gaping security hole in the KYC system, and one that exposes the most sensitive data to hackers. Government and banks state that they never discuss sensitive account information by email because it is not secure, and the Data Protection Act requires our data to be handled in a secure manner. In this respect, CASINOS need to "get with the times" and implement a properly secured means of sending documents for KYC. A small number have done so.

The passport is considered SO sensitive that the government don't even send them by ordinary post, and this is the ROYAL MAIL that isn't trusted, let alone email. Instead, they use a secure courier service.

With regard to the details of the KYC procedures, this is just as much a matter for the Information Commissioner's Office as it is for the gaming regulators.

If we put pressure on the UK government to "get with the times", it may actually turn out WORSE for the industry, even if it improves things for UK players.

For example, we may be officially told that we may send passport copies to companies for remote KYC, but then they may insist that the receiving companies change their own practices such as insisting that the entire transmission channel meets certain minimum security standards, whereas at present responsibility only starts when the company receives the document.

An example is our own banks, their response to this industry becoming mainstream has been to make it HARDER for UK players to deposit by card, and perversely EASIER for UK players to put through a bogus chargeback.

Perhaps accepting deposits by credit card too should be considered a thing of the past, and "getting with the times" would involve pushing players towards deposit methods that are properly geared towards the industry, such as Neteller and Skrill.

Players need a deposit method that is secure, and easy to operate. Casinos want one that makes it as hard as possible for players to issue bogus chargebacks just because they lose.

Seriously dude.

You're like a labrador puppy with a squeaky toy.....you just won't let it go.

The UK government is not going to formulate new legislation because 28 online casino players across the country are having problems meeting KYC requirements. Its pure fantasy.

Almost everyone....including casino reps....have told you you're barking up the wrong tree. Maybe its time to listen to other people for a change...who knows, you might just learn something.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Seriously dude.

You're like a labrador puppy with a squeaky toy.....you just won't let it go.

The UK government is not going to formulate new legislation because 28 online casino players across the country are having problems meeting KYC requirements. Its pure fantasy.

Almost everyone....including casino reps....have told you you're barking up the wrong tree. Maybe its time to listen to other people for a change...who knows, you might just learn something.

It's not just 28 any more. Here in the UK it's fully mainstream. You can't avoid it. Adverts on the telly, in the papers, even through the door. On top of this we have the high street bookies advertising their offshore offshoots in their windows. If anything, marketing here has stepped up a gear.

This is not the case in many other countries, where such marketing is not permitted due to the status of offshore gambling. You won't see this level of marketing in Australia.

Certainly it was a niche hobby back in 2004 when I first started. There was ZERO mainstream marketing, and players had to actively seek information. I got into it because of early internet based marketing where I was offered a cashback almost equivalent to my first deposit for signing up at 888.com This had the effect of reducing the risk, so the £50 I risked and lost was partially recovered.
I also experienced none of this ID hassle, not for many years. UK players didn't have a problem back then, but now we do, and it is getting worse as the industry moves one way, and the UK government the other.

I see a great deal of "bleating" from parts of the industry over the UK government's efforts to "get with the times" by taxing it like any other regular entertainment business, and ensuring that players' can use UK laws to protect themselves.

The industry could have done more to improve it's image, and thus it's case for the status quo, but we found that some software suppliers and regulators looked the other way when customers were getting ripped off.

The ID issue is about selectively obeying the law when it suits them, but looking for wriggle room when it doesn't, or simply disobeying it altogether and then doing a runner.

Although companies dealing with money have to do their best to prevent money laundering, the regulations also place a duty on them to minimise financial exclusion. Casinos are very keen on the former, but not so the latter, and it is this that is likely to change under the UK regime.

 

[Nifty29]

It's not just 28 any more. Here in the UK it's fully mainstream. You can't avoid it. Adverts on the telly, in the papers, even through the door. On top of this we have the high street bookies advertising their offshore offshoots in their windows. If anything, marketing here has stepped up a gear.

This is not the case in many other countries, where such marketing is not permitted due to the status of offshore gambling. You won't see this level of marketing in Australia.

Certainly it was a niche hobby back in 2004 when I first started. There was ZERO mainstream marketing, and players had to actively seek information. I got into it because of early internet based marketing where I was offered a cashback almost equivalent to my first deposit for signing up at 888.com This had the effect of reducing the risk, so the £50 I risked and lost was partially recovered.
I also experienced none of this ID hassle, not for many years. UK players didn't have a problem back then, but now we do, and it is getting worse as the industry moves one way, and the UK government the other.

I see a great deal of "bleating" from parts of the industry over the UK government's efforts to "get with the times" by taxing it like any other regular entertainment business, and ensuring that players' can use UK laws to protect themselves.

The industry could have done more to improve it's image, and thus it's case for the status quo, but we found that some software suppliers and regulators looked the other way when customers were getting ripped off.

The ID issue is about selectively obeying the law when it suits them, but looking for wriggle room when it doesn't, or simply disobeying it altogether and then doing a runner.

Although companies dealing with money have to do their best to prevent money laundering, the regulations also place a duty on them to minimise financial exclusion. Casinos are very keen on the former, but not so the latter, and it is this that is likely to change under the UK regime.

>>> In one ear >>> Out the other

Nothing changes does it. *Sigh*

 

[dunover]

Seriously dude.

You're like a labrador puppy with a squeaky toy.....you just won't let it go.

The UK government is not going to formulate new legislation because 28 online casino players across the country are having problems meeting KYC requirements. Its pure fantasy.

Almost everyone....including casino reps....have told you you're barking up the wrong tree. Maybe its time to listen to other people for a change...who knows, you might just learn something.

 

[Nifty29]

View attachment 41071

 

[Igor82]

Just wanted to say with all his long-winded KYC ranting about, VWM does drop a hidden valid gem here and there - such as secure upload facility for documents which you wouldn't want to send via unsecured connection.

I've briefed my team to put those in place. Thanks VWM

 

[dunover]

Just wanted to say with all his long-winded KYC ranting about, VWM does drop a hidden valid gem here and there - such as secure upload facility for documents which you wouldn't want to send via unsecured connection.

I've briefed my team to put those in place. Thanks VWM

Well if you keep firing the scattergun one pellet will eventually hit the target.......

 

[Igor82]

 

[Tirilej]

Please young men, try to be nice

 

[Nifty29]

Just wanted to say with all his long-winded KYC ranting about, VWM does drop a hidden valid gem here and there - such as secure upload facility for documents which you wouldn't want to send via unsecured connection.

I've briefed my team to put those in place. Thanks VWM

It's hardly a new idea though Igor.

I play at other casinos that have this facility and have done for some time.

It is certainly not original.

 

[DepositSpinLose]

so funny u 2

lol I think we should all figure it out by now........nifty likes vwm......always tugging on his hair.

come nifty just kiss him by now!


(sorry, no HAHAHAHAAHAHAHA icon)

 

[Igor82]

It's hardly a new idea though Igor.

I play at other casinos that have this facility and have done for some time.

It is certainly not original.

i didn't have it before - and while it was written in the original brief, it slipped over time and fell into the forgotten pile. It may not be original, but he said it, i heard it and my business within a few days will be marginally better for it. So thanks are deserved and as such given

 

[dunover]

i didn't have it before - and while it was written in the original brief, it slipped over time and fell into the forgotten pile. It may not be original, but he said it, i heard it and my business within a few days will be marginally better for it. So thanks are deserved and as such given

Take a look at Nordicbet and their account page if you are a member there - that's the best secure upload I've seen, and when they've checked the docs the account shows in green type 'verified'. Quite nifty, no pun intended.