Fortune Lounge Doubles Wagering Requirements

[GrandMaster]

To the best of my knowledge, no Microgaming operation has ever counted doubling up as part of the wager requirements - possibly because of the way in which the wager is recorded in Playcheck, or at least used to be (shows up as one bet and the net win/loss if I am not mistaken - haven't tried this in some time).

Barring that, however, I do not see why it shouldn't be counted - it is, after all, a wager of sorts.

Doubling up is a bet with 0 house edge, giving comp points for it is very generous of Playtech since then it becomes a bet with a small positive expectation for the player. Aggressive doubling up can reduce the house edge on Jacks or Better from 0.46% to about 0.1%, at the expense of vastly increased volatility. Even if you double up you are only risking your original bet as "real" money. An analogous situation is if you go to a brick and mortar casino, buy in for $100, turn it into $1000 and start betting black chips, you will still be rated on the basis of your $100 buy-in.

 

[kniepm]

I like playing FL casinos. Have found them to be fair and recently, relatively quick paying. But with their miniscule bonuses (I received e-mails today offering $14 for $140 deposit - yeah, I'll bite on that), and increased WR's, this is definitely a group where claiming a bonus is more of a liability than a benefit.

Even though I have been staying away from their deposit bonuses, I have been lured in by their drawings for DVD players, Hawaiian vacations and such.

PS is there a spell check feature for posted messages here?

 

[jpm]

And I usually only double up on 2 or 3 coin payout wins (10/15 coin really, since I'm betting full). I imagine that cuts into the house edge even more.

Doubling up is a bet with 0 house edge, giving comp points for it is very generous of Playtech since then it becomes a bet with a small positive expectation for the player. Aggressive doubling up can reduce the house edge on Jacks or Better from 0.46% to about 0.1%, at the expense of vastly increased volatility. Even if you double up you are only risking your original bet as "real" money. An analogous situation is if you go to a brick and mortar casino, buy in for $100, turn it into $1000 and start betting black chips, you will still be rated on the basis of your $100 buy-in.

 

[The Dude]

PS is there a spell check feature for posted messages here?

Nope, for a couple of reasons. In the past, there have been forum members who tried to use different email accounts to open more than one account here, acting as shills or what-not. There have been several instances when they blew their cover by misspelling the same words, etc. So the lack of a spell check was a tool for me

I also taught English comp. a few years back, and I was a firm believer in opening up a dictionary to check spelling, whatever. Auto spellers IMO are unnecessary crutches.

But if it bugs enough people, I'll install one.

 

[kniepm]

An analogous situation is if you go to a brick and mortar casino, buy in for $100, turn it into $1000 and start betting black chips, you will still be rated on the basis of your $100 buy-in.

Off topic, but: B&M casinos rate your play based on a formule that determines your expected losses based on the size of your wagers and the time you stay at the table. You won't be fooling the pit boss by buying for $5,000 and then playing only $5 bets. Whether you win and play with "their money" or lose and play with "your money," its all rated the same.

 

[fortunelounge]

Hi All,

As of today 08 March 2004 - Fortune Lounge will no longer be carrying over wagering requirements from one bonus to the next if a player reaches a 0 balance within the time frame of the two bonuses being added.

Regards,

Chad

 

[jpm]

This is great news Chad! Thanks for updating us. I think maybe you should announce that in a thread of its own here as well. People may miss it in this one.

I'm very glad they did away with this silly rule. I assume the wagering requirements remain at 10x?

Hi All,

As of today 08 March 2004 - Fortune Lounge will no longer be carrying over wagering requirements from one bonus to the next if a player reaches a 0 balance within the time frame of the two bonuses being added.

Regards,

Chad

 

[Stanford]

Hi All,

As of today 08 March 2004 - Fortune Lounge will no longer be carrying over wagering requirements from one bonus to the next if a player reaches a 0 balance within the time frame of the two bonuses being added.

Regards,

Chad

Hi Chad,

What happens with odd cents? I have shot craps on some of my no bonus play sessions and end up with odd cents. There isn't anyway to get rid of them. So what happens when you get below a quarter but not to zero?

Stanford

 

[jpm]

Good question Stanford. I had that problem at one point too, and I forget how I got rid of them. Every time I tried to do a withdrawl with those extra cents thrown in, they'd always put them back in my account and process the rest of the cashin! LOL. It was like trying to get rid of a bad penny, I just couldn't do it! Maybe you can build it up to a multiple of 5c and play thunderstruck till its gone.

Either that or FL can do what a number of other casinos do. If you are below $1, they consider that to be as good as 0.

 

[fortunelounge]

Hi All,

We do consider cents that are unable to be wagered on any game, as good as a zero balance. So , if you have 20c in your account and you are unable to wager this on any of the games, we will count that as a zero balance.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Chad

 

[Stanford]

Hi All,

We do consider cents that are unable to be wagered on any game, as good as a zero balance. So , if you have 20c in your account and you are unable to wager this on any of the games, we will count that as a zero balance.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Chad

Chad,

Thank you so much for your help. I think you process for other casinos as well and they use to piggy back your terms. Will this policy be the same at those casinos like Desert Dollar and Havana?

Thank you,
Stanford

 

[love2vegas]

WARNING- BE VERY CAREFUL WHEN PLAYING ANY FORTUNE LOUNGE CASINOS.
Recently, I recieved 2 seperate emails advising that VEGAS PALMS was running a special MARCH promotion- 300% bonus- to introduce their new VIPER SOFTWARE. You had to deposit $150 to be eligible. There was a link to their website, which stated the smae thing. NOWHERE (& I MEAN NOWHERE) did it state that this was a new player bonus. I clicked the terms & conditions & it listed a variety of promotion schedules. If you clicked the link which said "MARCH MADNESS PROMO" it only went to download. Still leary, I deposited the $150, hoping to receive the bonus. NOTHING. Hoping to be careful & because this group has used the trick of waiting several days to give you any bonus in the past, I sent an email- asking the WR terms and when I could expect the bonus... NO REPLY.

They have no live chat, & I don't like to call since customer service can say most anything & there will be no record. SO, I played some & sent yet another email. NOTHING.

In fact, I have now sent several emails & nothing- not even a form letter reply.
Brian signed up and clicked on a link which stated that the new player bonue had to be wagered 20X. He doesn't think I have any case, beacuse this link was somewhere on the site.

My belief is that all promotions should list the terms- new player, returning player, etc. This one, especially, since it was billed as introducing the new software. In additon- would an email hurt these people? I do like bonuses & had several offers for bonuses from 25% to 100% & higher. Certainly, I wouldn't have played this group for no bonus.

They have been put into my "never again" list. Hopefully, they will screw enough people with their tricky terms and increased wagering, delayed bonuses, etc. so that others will join me in this one.

 

[DealerBusts]

love2vegas, this does seem to happen quite frequently although most of the time you can tell that its a signup bonus for new players. Bonuses for existing players almost always have a link telling you the terms for the bonus. I usually email them if I'm not sure, although it has only happened a couple of times with RTG casinos. A little look on the site will usually give you a clue if the signup bonus advertised is the same as the email you received.

 

[GrandMaster]

WARNING- BE VERY CAREFUL WHEN PLAYING ANY FORTUNE LOUNGE CASINOS.

The FL group went downhill very quickly in the past month about the same time it changed the wagering requirements.

Here is my latest experience. I got two e-mails offering me a $10 bonus if I upgrade to the Viper version of Vegas Palms, someone even called me on the phone with this bonus offer. The e-mails said that the bonus would be credited within 3 hours of upgrading and making a purchase. I upgraded and made a purchase as required, then sent an e-mail. Next morning, no reply, no bonus. Another e-mail, no reply, no bonus. Third e-mail, no reply, no bonus. In the end I called the customer service on the phone and they credited my account instantly, but this is not the level of customer service I am used. This group used to provide excellent customer service, they would answer e-mails promptly.

 

[love2vegas]

love2vegas, this does seem to happen quite frequently although most of the time you can tell that its a signup bonus for new players. Bonuses for existing players almost always have a link telling you the terms for the bonus. I usually email them if I'm not sure, although it has only happened a couple of times with RTG casinos. A little look on the site will usually give you a clue if the signup bonus advertised is the same as the email you received.

Yeah, you're right. I did look on the site & I had a suspicion that it could be a new player bonus, but when it said that it was to introduce the new software & NOT A MENTION of it being for new players- guess I wanted the 300% offer too bad. PLUS, my point is that I emailed support to request clarification- but as GrandMaster has written- I guess they don't believe in bothering to reply to emails. I usually try to check the terrms, but I since this was a special "March madness" bonus (which has since been removed) I couldn't find anything which definitely said it this bonus was only for new players. BUYER BEWARE WITH THE FL GROUP!!!

 

[Stanford]

The FL group went downhill very quickly in the past month about the same time it changed the wagering requirements.

I hope they return to form very quickly. They were and hope will continue to be a cream of the crop organazation. Certain well know gamlbiling sites only advertise for three - one of which is a FL casino.

FL, can you confirm that your new policy is effective for all the properties you manage - like Vegas Towers, Havana, and Desert Dollar.

Thank you,
Stanford

 

[fortunelounge]

Hi Stanford

This policy will be the same for all the brands we process for.

Regards,

Chad

 

[The Dude]

In fact, I have now sent several emails & nothing- not even a form letter reply.
Brian signed up and clicked on a link which stated that the new player bonue had to be wagered 20X. He doesn't think I have any case, beacuse this link was somewhere on the site.

love2vegas - you are almost getting out of line here. The link for the T&Cs of this promo was in their T&Cs under "First Time Sign-Up Bonus" Outdated URL (Invalid)

I was not yet a member of Vegas Palms and I signed up - and I received the bonus within 24 hours. If you failed to read their T&Cs - then there is no excuse for you to complain.

Stating that they have no support is false. Check your email spam filters just in case you are blocking their mails (it's happened to me before). Vegas Palms does not have a chat room ste up, but they have toll free numbers :
USA: 1-800-587-9036
United Kingdom: 0-800-056-9578

And being the seasoned gambler that you are, you would have known that Platinum Play is within the same casino group as Vegas Palms. You spoke with their customer service people via their chat about the same time you downloaded Vegas Palms software. Why didn't you ask them about not finding Vegas Palms T&Cs?

What it looks like to me is that you tried to take advantage of a bonus offer (which was a good one I'd have to admit) - hoping that it applied to you in your case. You didn't read the T&Cs and just because you couldn't find them didn't mean they weren't there.

Perhaps you celebrating your birthday a little early? (by the way, Happy Birthday).

So maybe Vegas Palms can make their T&Cs more obvious - popping up in your face so that future players will have no problem finding them. Maybe this is the solution. The solution is not complaining about not finding them, because they were there.

 

[fortunelounge]

Hi love2vegas,

You constantly make mention of e-mailing our support team to obtain clarity on the terms applicable to the 300% signup offer on Vegas Palms. You also make mention that the reason you kept on e-mailing was because Vegas Palms does not offer live chat. What you have neglected to comment on is the fact that you did indeed have contact with us and this was by means of 'Live chat'( you used the platinum play chat to enquire about the 300% VP offer). I sent the details of the chat session to Bryan last week after I received notification of this complaint, and in the chat session you make no mention of 'is this offer for new players only?'. The only question you asked us was ' what games are excluded from the wagering requirements?'. I have record of this chat session and can send it to you if you cannot remember the conversation.

With regards to us not displaying this offer as being an offer for new players only, the details pertaining to this offer were clearly visible on our website ( this offer is for first time real players on the Vegas Palms casino )

Regards,

Chad

 

[The Dude]

Sorry love2vegas - got you confused with love2win. This person's birthday was yesterday

 

[love2vegas]

Vegas Palms -fortune Lounge

CASINOMEISTER-

1.) My point about the offer was, and remains now, that NOWHERE ON THE EMAIL & NOWHERE ON THE LINKED PAGE OF THE WEBSITE did this state that it was a bonus for NEW PLAYERS ONLY. What it did state was that it was a MARCH MADNESS promotion & a limited time offer to introduce their new software.
Would it be unheard of that such an offer would be made to existing players as well as new players?????????????????? .

2.) You use the following link:
________________________________________________________________
Outdated URL (Invalid)
________________________________________________________________
Click onto this link & you'll find a page with BOTH NEW & EXISTING PLAYER BONUSES. As an existing player, you click onto this & there are three more possibilities: $50 promo (by invitation) - 50%/100%/200% bonuses- weekly purchase bonus. So, a special bonus, sent by email may possibly come under different catagories.

3.) Then you say:
_______________________________________________________________
So maybe Vegas Palms can make their T&Cs more obvious - popping up in your face so that future players will have no problem finding them. Maybe this is the solution. The solution is not complaining about not finding them, because they were there.
_______________________________________________________________

I assume the "popping up in your face" was meant to be an absurd statement.
BUT, would it be difficult to put a little disclaimer- even in small print- or even the famous (*) and small print?? Most reputable casinos (& even some not so reputable) not only mention if it is a new player bonus, but even put the wagering requirements for special offers, so there is no mistake with their existing customers (or in my case- past existing customer)


CHAD- I would really appreciate a copy of the chat session.

YOU WROTE:

______________________________________________________________
You constantly make mention of e-mailing our support team to obtain clarity on the terms applicable to the 300% signup offer on Vegas Palms. You also make mention that the reason you kept on e-mailing was because Vegas Palms does not offer live chat.What you have neglected to comment on is the fact that you did indeed have contact with us and this was by means of 'Live chat'...
________________________________________________________________

AND what you NEGLECT to mention or address- is that NONE OF MY EMAILS WERE ANSWERED- NOT TO THIS DAY. I do have copies of these emails. (AND no, Bryan, I do not have them filtered out, as their special offers have always come through.)

CHAD- You also try to imply that the following was clearly posted on your website (as if it accompanied your offer) this offer is for first time real players on the Vegas Palms casino )

I challenge you to post the EXACT page as you previously had it displayed on the website. I checked it several times & this statement was not on the referring page. If it had been, would there have been confusion?????????????

Finally, Bryan, you write:

_________________________________________________________________
love2vegas - you are almost getting out of line here.
_________________________________________________________________

About what? Is it wrong to post complaints? Is it out of line to expect a casino group to be upfront with their offers? Or, if you would prefer not to have someone tell their experiences and warn others- let me know & I'm gone.

 

[The Dude]

CASINOMEISTER-

1.) My point about the offer was, and remains now, that NOWHERE ON THE EMAIL & NOWHERE ON THE LINKED PAGE OF THE WEBSITE did this state that it was a bonus for NEW PLAYERS ONLY. What it did state was that it was a MARCH MADNESS promotion & a limited time offer to introduce their new software.
Would it be unheard of that such an offer would be made to existing players as well as new players??????????????????

As I explained earlier, it was clearly there. I've attached a screenshot of the promo pop-up that I sent to you last week. I personally participated in the promo. I had no problem understanding that it was for first time players.

2.) You use the following link:
________________________________________________________________
Outdated URL (Invalid)
________________________________________________________________
Click onto this link & you'll find a page with BOTH NEW & EXISTING PLAYER BONUSES. As an existing player, you click onto this & there are three more possibilities: $50 promo (by invitation) - 50%/100%/200% bonuses- weekly purchase bonus. So, a special bonus, sent by email may possibly come under different catagories.

If you go to this URL, you will note that there is a link First Time Sign-Up Bonus. During the promotion, if you were to click on that link you would have seen a pop-up ad (the same one I have posted here)

3.) Then you say:
_______________________________________________________________
So maybe Vegas Palms can make their T&Cs more obvious - popping up in your face so that future players will have no problem finding them. Maybe this is the solution. The solution is not complaining about not finding them, because they were there.
_______________________________________________________________

I assume the "popping up in your face" was meant to be an absurd statement.
BUT, would it be difficult to put a little disclaimer- even in small print- or even the famous (*) and small print?? Most reputable casinos (& even some not so reputable) not only mention if it is a new player bonus, but even put the wagering requirements for special offers, so there is no mistake with their existing customers (or in my case- past existing customer)

Maybe you need glasses, but it was clearly there.

CHAD- I would really appreciate a copy of the chat session.

YOU WROTE:

______________________________________________________________
You constantly make mention of e-mailing our support team to obtain clarity on the terms applicable to the 300% signup offer on Vegas Palms. You also make mention that the reason you kept on e-mailing was because Vegas Palms does not offer live chat.What you have neglected to comment on is the fact that you did indeed have contact with us and this was by means of 'Live chat'...
________________________________________________________________

AND what you NEGLECT to mention or address- is that NONE OF MY EMAILS WERE ANSWERED- NOT TO THIS DAY. I do have copies of these emails. (AND no, Bryan, I do not have them filtered out, as their special offers have always come through.)

I'm sure Chad would be happy to post the chat session. But this is obviously a waste of bandwidth.

CHAD- You also try to imply that the following was clearly posted on your website (as if it accompanied your offer) this offer is for first time real players on the Vegas Palms casino )

I challenge you to post the EXACT page as you previously had it displayed on the website. I checked it several times & this statement was not on the referring page. If it had been, would there have been confusion?????????????

Dude, you were the only person who was confused. You probably got a bunch of bonus terms confused with each other. It happens to the best of us.

Finally, Bryan, you write:

_________________________________________________________________
love2vegas - you are almost getting out of line here.
_________________________________________________________________

About what? Is it wrong to post complaints? Is it out of line to expect a casino group to be upfront with their offers? Or, if you would prefer not to have someone tell their experiences and warn others- let me know & I'm gone.

I don't mind people complaining, but if you are willing to make this a public spectacle when you are clearly mistaken - you ARE getting out of line. You wasted my time with your "pitch a bitch", you're wasting my time answering your bogus claims in the forum. And it's all because you didn't get some fucking bonus you didn't deserve.

I have a lot of players who are relying on me to get LEGITIMATE claims resolved. I have people screwed out of four and five figure sums right now, waiting for me to help them out. Why?? Because they have no one else to turn to.

And I can't get to them all. Why? Because of stupid shit like this!

If you want to continue this mindless pursuit, take it somewhere else. I'm not wasting any more time with this. Sorry.

 

[love2vegas]

As I explained earlier, it was clearly there. I've attached a screenshot of the promo pop-up that I sent to you last week. I personally participated in the promo. I had no problem understanding that it was for first time players.

WELL, I think you hit on something, probably by mistake, which would explain a lot. You mention the promo pop-up. I have a pop swatter that kills all pop-ups. So, I will take the responsibility. Perhaps, just perhaps, the casino might take note that many people do have pop swatters now and put the disclaimer next to the promo- next time. Believe me, I don't care to have anything from this, except a valuable lesson.

I will also agree with you that I probably was confused. And I also previously admitted that I shouldn't have played until I knew the terms. (I am still waiting for an email reply to any of my emails though.)

_______________________________________________
CASINOMEISTERS WORDS:
I don't mind people complaining, but if you are willing to make this a public spectacle when you are clearly mistaken - you ARE getting out of line. You wasted my time with your "pitch a bitch", you're wasting my time answering your bogus claims in the forum. And it's all because you didn't get some fucking bonus you didn't deserve.

I have a lot of players who are relying on me to get LEGITIMATE claims resolved. I have people screwed out of four and five figure sums right now, waiting for me to help them out. Why?? Because they have no one else to turn to.

And I can't get to them all. Why? Because of stupid shit like this!

________________________________________________
1.) I apologize if I wasted your time. It truly was confusing to me and, as you have previously mentioned, I am an experienced player.
2.) I don't "fucking" deserve to be responded to in that way, either- "player advocate".
3.) Sometimes, the smaller claims that get by then result in the larger rip-offs as you mention. Perhaps, you should limit your valuable help to only those people who have 4 or 5 figure casino rip-offs and say to hell with the rest of the people.
4.) No more time will be wasted from here. This will be my final post. Have a good life.

 

[Dirk Diggler]

Hi All - I'd just like to add my recent experience into the changes that are going on at FL.

I am a VIP at FL and have gambled over $480,000 there in the past year. After reading their posts here about wagering requirements no longer carrying over I obviously allowed for this when playing there.

I recently made a cashin at two of their casino's after depositing several hundred dollars into them both (no bonus given), after previously wiping out on bonuses in the past. Low and behold this morning I received emails telling me I had had bonuses removed from my cashins for not meeting wagering requirements

Finally after me having to send them FOUR emails (they disputed that my balance had ever reached zero, so in the end I had to copy and paste Playcheck history before they believed me) they have finally forwarded a request through to their ecash department to find a reason.

I really can't believe this is how they would treat a VIP (Platinum Level for that matter) who has played there as much as me - it will certainly effect my future playing. It even infuriated me enough to open up a new email account just so I could join here (my main one is with yahoo which isn't accepted here) and post my experience

 

[Stanford]

Finally after me having to send them FOUR emails (they disputed that my balance had ever reached zero, so in the end I had to copy and paste Playcheck history before they believed me) they have finally forwarded a request through to their ecash department to find a reason.

It is odd. I am having trouble getting them to tell me which games takes odd cents so I can remove them. I know about the Thunder something multiline. Not sure of any others.

Stanford