Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[colinsunderland]

And even if they do work, they will still cause more deaths overall, and put or economy and financial future at risk of collapse.

well which is it, they do or don't?
and you have no evidence at all of any of those things happening, you can't even make comparisons at this time as you can't reliably predict how many extra would have died without lockdowns, nor how many would have in the future from the complications that are becoming apparent now.

 

[dealer wins]

If lockdowns work, why wasnt covid eliminated when we locked down from March 23rd to July, when virtually EVERYONE was complying, and everywhere was deserted.

They really dont work, and in the coming year or 2 we are going to see the full hell that they cause!!

 

[colinsunderland]

Look at Sweden, it says it all, they really REALLY dont work!!

Now you are just back to being a fucking troll, considering how many times thats been discussed previously and shown not to be true, and even if it was, the reasons why.

 

[colinsunderland]

If lockdowns work, why wasnt covid eliminated when we locked down from March 23rd to July, when virtually EVERYONE was complying, and everywhere was deserted.

They really dont work, and in the coming year or 2 we are going to see the full hell that they cause!!

Because a lockdown isn't meant to eliminate Covid?

 

[shadow123]

Think we need a separate "Do fucking lockdowns work ?" thread as its going to kill this one.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

If lockdowns work, why wasnt covid eliminated when we locked down from March 23rd to July, when virtually EVERYONE was complying, and everywhere was deserted.

They really dont work, and in the coming year or 2 we are going to see the full hell that they cause!!

Because essential workers were still out and so not all transmission chains were broken. For a virus to be eliminated, ALL transmission chains have to be cut. Millions of people were still at work.

Then on top of that you had spread through shared residential abodes such as care homes and hospitals.

 

[Playford7]

well dealer keeps telling us it's a fact that not just the ones who have caught it, but more of you would, if you were sat at home watching netflix, because lockdowns increase the transmission rate somewhow

Think we need a separate "Do fucking lockdowns work ?" thread as its going to kill this one.

If that doesn’t kill it my corona cooking certainly would...

 

[dealer wins]

Think we need a separate "Do fucking lockdowns work ?" thread as its going to kill this one.

Well they obviously dont, as most of the world have tried them over the last 10 months and we are still in a health crisis

 

[Borgie]

Look at Sweden, it says it all, they really REALLY dont work!!

The king of sweden saying how they messed up .. only last month

"King of Sweden blasts country's 'failed' coronavirus response | Sweden | The Guardian"

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[slotmaster]

Well they obviously dont, as most of the world have tried them over the last 10 months and we are still in a health crisis

That's because they were not done properly, If it was a true lockdown we would not be talking right now and pretty much back to normal lives like where it all started and a couple of other countries.

We are in a stay-at-home order and today for about a week now and we are at the lowest numbers since Jan 1, still way too high yes, and too early to say if this stay at home/lockdown is working though mind you.

 

[Steviedoo]

We are in a full lockdown, essential workers alway need to work, otherwise we wont have power, heat, food, health services or many other things that keep us alive.

Do you actually want that?

good god...it’s like you don’t get it.

 

[cncas2123]

Look at Sweden, it says it all, they really REALLY dont work!!

Look at New Zealand, they really really do work..

 

[colinsunderland]

good god...it’s like you don’t get it.

or that he's a sad little troll. It's been explained to him numerous times on the thread and he still comes back with the same rubbish.

 

[Tirilej]

Look at Sweden, it says it all, they really REALLY dont work!!

The fun thing in this is that many like you are screaming that lockdown is bad, while many people in Sweden are screaming that they want a lockdown with stricter rules.
What we did in the spring last year did work because people was scared and they were listening. But not even we can be that careful for ever, so we slipped when it came back.
We have stricter rules now. We even have the laws allowing us to have a full lockdown, which we didn't before. I hope they don't use it but if, then it's because it's needed.

Please stop using Sweden as an example.


Stay safe everyone

 

[mack341]

Can anyone give us an idea of the new swedish measures in place? i.e. are shops closed other than essential, bars, restaurants, schools/nurseries closed, mask mandates etc..?

Are the rates in north sweden aka kroffe land, comparable to finland and norway?

 

[Kroffe]

Can anyone give us an idea of the new swedish measures in place? i.e. are shops closed other than essential, bars, restaurants, schools/nurseries closed, mask mandates etc..?

Are the rates in north sweden aka kroffe land, comparable to finland and norway?

You can always see the most up to date information on this site.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I was too lazy to check how it compares with Finland&Norway tho.
But thats because im lazy.

 

[ternur]

You can always see the most up to date information on this site.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I was too lazy to check how it compares with Finland&Norway tho.
But thats because im lazy.

The feeling is mutual. We don't talk about Sweden here.

 

[Kroffe]

I noticed the lil store where i live have put a basket with balls outside the shop.
Its the kind you use when playing floorball.

Anyway, there was a note attached to the basket, but i didnt read it and just went in.
Saw some kids had balls from the basket and were kicking them around the store, so i figured it was something for the kids to play with while their parents shop.

Got to the register, "Hey Kroffe, did you not take a ball?"

Uh, no, should i have?

"Yeah, theres 20 balls in the basket, and thats the maximum amount of people allowed in at the same time. Didnt you read the note?"

My bad, i didnt read it.
You think there has ever been more than 20 people in this store at the same time?

"Guess you got a point about that...please take a ball next time tho."

Sure.

 

[mack341]

This is a report by Tommy Lennhamn, a swedish guy I believe, called 'Final Report on Swedish Mortality 2020, Anno Covidius'

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

[for anyone who fancies a short read ]


The conclusions...

"My personal take on Covid 2020 in Sweden is as follows:

Yes, Covid 2020 was real (and continues to be real at least until spring 2021, as all seasonal viruses). The number of deaths 2020 was higher than it should have been, which ever way we define “Excess”. Not exceptionally higher, and far from all the disaster scenarios painted by media, politicians and failed scientists.

Was Covid 2020 our generation’s “Spanish Flu” ? No. Far from it, as can be seen in the graph showing 1918 above, and by comparing mortality rates, where non-age-adjusted mortality 2020 is on par with that of 2012, and age adjusted mortality 2020 on par with 2013.

Was the Swedish Government’s response adequate ? To a large extent yes. Until they panicked and lost their mind in November 2020, and introduced “The Swedish Enabling Act“, a form of legislation that is a disgrace to any nation pretending to be democratic.

Where “The Strategy” failed was in protecting the frail and elderly, particularly in the care homes. The strategy also failed in overall crisis & contingency planning & management, where various governments since the early 90's have radically reduced investments and capacity in health care, care of elderly as well as many other vital parts of the societal safety net. So, the frequently repeated “Isolate, or our hospitals will be overwhelmed!” mantra was primarily caused by several decades of catastrophic political decisions and priorities regarding medical care and other critical societal function investments and resources, as much as by the virus itself.

[^sound familar to uk citizens?^]

What the future brings will be seen by those who survive. Myself, I’m afraid that more doom & gloom will follow for a long time in the tracks of the “2020 Covid Experience”, even if we should manage to eliminate the virus, e.g. by vaccine, during 2021. The psychological effect on populations having spent a year or more in Lockdown, thus missing most of what makes life and living worthwhile, will be interesting to observe, as will be whether social interaction patterns and behaviors eventually return to normal, or whether our future social interactions will be so deeply ingrained by Anno Covidis that we will, similar to Pavlov’s dogs, continue regarding fellow human beings as potentially deadly virus vectors."

 

[vorcirion]

This is a report by Tommy Lennhamn, a swedish guy I believe, called 'Final Report on Swedish Mortality 2020, Anno Covidius'

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

[for anyone who fancies a short read ]


The conclusions...

"My personal take on Covid 2020 in Sweden is as follows:

Yes, Covid 2020 was real (and continues to be real at least until spring 2021, as all seasonal viruses). The number of deaths 2020 was higher than it should have been, which ever way we define “Excess”. Not exceptionally higher, and far from all the disaster scenarios painted by media, politicians and failed scientists.

Was Covid 2020 our generation’s “Spanish Flu” ? No. Far from it, as can be seen in the graph showing 1918 above, and by comparing mortality rates, where non-age-adjusted mortality 2020 is on par with that of 2012, and age adjusted mortality 2020 on par with 2013.

Was the Swedish Government’s response adequate ? To a large extent yes. Until they panicked and lost their mind in November 2020, and introduced “The Swedish Enabling Act“, a form of legislation that is a disgrace to any nation pretending to be democratic.

Where “The Strategy” failed was in protecting the frail and elderly, particularly in the care homes. The strategy also failed in overall crisis & contingency planning & management, where various governments since the early 90's have radically reduced investments and capacity in health care, care of elderly as well as many other vital parts of the societal safety net. So, the frequently repeated “Isolate, or our hospitals will be overwhelmed!” mantra was primarily caused by several decades of catastrophic political decisions and priorities regarding medical care and other critical societal function investments and resources, as much as by the virus itself.

[^sound familar to uk citizens?^]

What the future brings will be seen by those who survive. Myself, I’m afraid that more doom & gloom will follow for a long time in the tracks of the “2020 Covid Experience”, even if we should manage to eliminate the virus, e.g. by vaccine, during 2021. The psychological effect on populations having spent a year or more in Lockdown, thus missing most of what makes life and living worthwhile, will be interesting to observe, as will be whether social interaction patterns and behaviors eventually return to normal, or whether our future social interactions will be so deeply ingrained by Anno Covidis that we will, similar to Pavlov’s dogs, continue regarding fellow human beings as potentially deadly virus vectors."

First of all: Who is this guy?
Second: it wasn't just about the frail and elderly. It's impossible to protect all of them if you let the virus spread uncontrollably. Well that's basically it...letting the virus spread is a really bad strategy.

Shouldn't you concentrate on your own country? You failed worse than the US and half of the states didn't do anything. You should do some soul searching imo.

 

[cncas2123]

Look at New Zealand, they really really do work..

Thought I would just bump this up as the troll hasnt bothered responding to it, he'd rather go all Swedish and a failed herd immunity strategy as stated by the Swedish king and various Swedish politicians, though Mr Troll seems to think it worked out just dandy.....

 

[shadow123]

Really is a bit of a waste of time argueing out the pros and cons of lockdowns as there is bog all we can do about it,
maybe wrong but not seen Boris on here lately unless hes Guest49 or whatever,I dont think we have much influence
our goverments
As they said in Monty Pythòn , is this the 10 minute argument or the full half hour? ie arguing for the sake of it.
Personally i think Dealer is a very naughty boy

 

[dealer wins]

Thought I would just bump this up as the troll hasnt bothered responding to it, he'd rather go all Swedish and a failed herd immunity strategy as stated by the Swedish king and various Swedish politicians, though Mr Troll seems to think it worked out just dandy.....

Great, it worked in NZ, a country with much less population, and population density.

But the fact is, weve had 3 lockdowns, and they DONT WORK IN THE UK, otherwise we wouldnt have needed lockdown 2 let alone 3.

Maybe they work in sparsely populated places, but they obviously dont work in the UK.

And they are causing catastrophic damage too.

 

[cncas2123]

Great, it worked in NZ, a country with much less population, and population density.

But the fact is, weve had 3 lockdowns, and they DONT WORK IN THE UK, otherwise we wouldnt have needed lockdown 2 let alone 3.

Maybe they work in sparsely populated places, but they obviously dont work in the UK.

And they are causing catastrophic damage too.

And Australia? Did it work there? Maybe it didnt work in the UK because there were too many people who thought they new best, who thought it wasnt going to affect them, who listened to the BS that was put about by the conspiracy theorists.
Perhaps it would have worked if it was done properly, though I think I do remember towards the tail end of lockdown 1 the daily death figures were less than 50 per day, so maybe lockdown was lifted too early - 50 deaths per day down from 1500 pretty much proves that lockdown does work if it is done properly.

 

[slotmaster]

Thought I would just bump this up as the troll hasnt bothered responding to it, he'd rather go all Swedish and a failed herd immunity strategy as stated by the Swedish king and various Swedish politicians, though Mr Troll seems to think it worked out just dandy.....

I blame @Kroffe

 

[Playford7]

I blame @Kroffe

Agree, totally the evil bears doing.

 

[dealer wins]

And Australia? Did it work there? Maybe it didnt work in the UK because there were too many people who thought they new best, who thought it wasnt going to affect them, who listened to the BS that was put about by the conspiracy theorists.
Perhaps it would have worked if it was done properly, though I think I do remember towards the tail end of lockdown 1 the daily death figures were less than 50 per day, so maybe lockdown was lifted too early - 50 deaths per day down from 1500 pretty much proves that lockdown does work if it is done properly.

Still doesnt explain why Sweden didnt have the highest death toll in the world, if lockdowns work and they didnt lockdown. Funny that

 

[vorcirion]

Still doesnt explain why Sweden didnt have the highest death toll in the world, if lockdowns work and they didnt lockdown. Funny that View attachment 149305

More realistic picture:

 

[Playford7]

Just to add, call me a sell out or whatever i really don’t give a shit.

but my aunty whom is 88 is in hospital now, she fell weeks ago and hurt her hip and was in hospital for over 14 days (which I moaned about on here)

James cook, my local who I mention regular as my pals work there.

she’s a blockage in her esophagus, the hospital had a ambulance and her into intensive care within a hour.. she’s getting operated on as we speak.

I know this as my mother (the honey badger) is her support bubble thing.

so those whom say people are ignored due to Covid etc I call bullshit as sadly this is another example of personal experience, one that affects me that I can state as fact.

not a idiotic link, not a post from some website, my family... my life.

its insane how my opinion on all of this has changed, I’m in shock myself...
But I can’t as much as it goes against my political views deny this...

i get some of you may call me a sell out as said, but I’m one of the more honest and speak from the heart posters on here..

any issues PM me, I assure you all I’ve witnessed the past 4 days and still going I’d not wish on anyone.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Great, it worked in NZ, a country with much less population, and population density.

But the fact is, weve had 3 lockdowns, and they DONT WORK IN THE UK, otherwise we wouldnt have needed lockdown 2 let alone 3.

Maybe they work in sparsely populated places, but they obviously dont work in the UK.

And they are causing catastrophic damage too.

Following each lockdown case numbers have fallen...this fall has happened at the same point after the lockdown was imposed too. The evidence is there for you to see.

Besides this, we haven't even seen a proper lockdown in the UK. A proper lockdown would see all but health workers and the army etc consigned to their houses. No jollies to the supermarket with supplies delivered instead. In some countries a lockdown would carry the possibility of you being shot on sight if you did leave your house.

 

[sufferinsilence]

More realistic picture:
View attachment 149307

But Finland?

 

[sufferinsilence]

Just to add, call me a sell out or whatever i really don’t give a shit.

but my aunty whom is 88 is in hospital now, she fell weeks ago and hurt her hip and was in hospital for over 14 days (which I moaned about on here)

James cook, my local who I mention regular as my pals work there.

she’s a blockage in her esophagus, the hospital had a ambulance and her into intensive care within a hour.. she’s getting operated on as we speak.

I know this as my mother (the honey badger) is her support bubble thing.

so those whom say people are ignored due to Covid etc I call bullshit as sadly this is another example of personal experience, one that affects me that I can state as fact.

not a idiotic link, not a post from some website, my family... my life.

its insane how my opinion on all of this has changed, I’m in shock myself...
But I can’t as much as it goes against my political views deny this...

i get some of you may call me a sell out as said, but I’m one of the more honest and speak from the heart posters on here..

any issues PM me, I assure you all I’ve witnessed the past 4 days and still going I’d not wish on anyone.

Viruses and other illnesses don't care if you lean right or left.

 

[Playford7]

Viruses and other illnesses don't care if you lean right or left.

Can’t argue with that.

 

[dealer wins]

Following each lockdown case numbers have fallen...this fall has happened at the same point after the lockdown was imposed too. The evidence is there for you to see.

Besides this, we haven't even seen a proper lockdown in the UK. A proper lockdown would see all but health workers and the army etc consigned to their houses. No jollies to the supermarket with supplies delivered instead. In some countries a lockdown would carry the possibility of you being shot on sight if you did leave your house.

With each lockdown, cases started dropping before it was imposed

 

[Gaz237]

Following each lockdown case numbers have fallen...this fall has happened at the same point after the lockdown was imposed too. The evidence is there for you to see.

Besides this, we haven't even seen a proper lockdown in the UK. A proper lockdown would see all but health workers and the army etc consigned to their houses. No jollies to the supermarket with supplies delivered instead. In some countries a lockdown would carry the possibility of you being shot on sight if you did leave your house.

Could i be first in line, to shoot dealer wins on sight.

 

[Playford7]

But Finland?

Superb rally drivers

 

[Playford7]

Could i be first in line, to shoot dealer wins on sight.

He’s entitled to a opinion just like anyone else gaz.

I’ve openly stated why I was wrong, just hope he doesn’t have to do the same.

but he is entitled to say what ever he likes.

 

[colinsunderland]

He’s entitled to a opinion just like anyone else gaz.

I’ve openly stated why I was wrong, just hope he doesn’t have to do the same.

but he is entitled to say what ever he likes.

When he explains his 'opinions', then I'll give him respect. Like why he posted a video of a house party being broken up and said it was a BLM parade. How transmission rates go up not down when a lockdown is in place. How Sweden is the model to follow. To explain the numerous figures he keeps posting that are clearly lies.

 

[Playford7]

When he explains his 'opinions', then I'll give him respect. Like why he posted a video of a house party being broken up and said it was a BLM parade. How transmission rates go up not down when a lockdown is in place. How Sweden is the model to follow. To explain the numerous figures he keeps posting that are clearly lies.

Fair point mate

 

[Steviedoo]

Fair point mate

how are you feeling??

 

[slotplayer]

Alright, nothing here, back to Tucker. Mack watch Tucker's opening monologue if you can.

 

[mack341]

First of all: Who is this guy?
Second: it wasn't just about the frail and elderly. It's impossible to protect all of them if you let the virus spread uncontrollably. Well that's basically it...letting the virus spread is a really bad strategy.

Shouldn't you concentrate on your own country? You failed worse than the US and half of the states didn't do anything. You should do some soul searching imo.

Sweden is the only european country I know of that took a different approach to the standard lockdown, so if it were a medicine trial they would be the 'control' group.

'letting the virus spread is a really bad strategy' if you looked at the UK figures you'd think that was what we had done for the last 10 months.

--------------
[kings fund]
The total number of NHS hospital beds in England, including general and acute, mental illness, learning disability, maternity and day-only beds, has more than halved over the past 30 years, from around 299,000 in 1987/88 to 141,000 in 2018/9, while the number of patients treated has increased significantly.

Today there are signs of a growing shortage of beds. In 2018/19, overnight general and acute bed occupancy averaged 90.2 per cent, and regularly exceeded 95 per cent in winter, well above the level many consider safe.

The lack of available hospital beds has been closely associated with the deterioration in performance against key waiting time standards, such as how long patients should wait in accident and emergency (A&E) or for planned operations.

------------
The population has also increased by about 10 million [an entire finland] from 1988 to 2020, not sure of the demographics in terms of proportion of elderly, but it is clear we had better NHS capacity before and have cut that intentionally. So no, I don't ignore the uk and how we seem to fare badly time and again, when we're supposed to be leaders in science, innovation, higher education etc..

 

[vorcirion]

But Finland?

Easier to make Sweden look good if you compare it only to other failed countries like dealer wins did!

 

[vorcirion]

Sweden is the only country I know of that took a different approach to the standard lockdown, so if it were a medicine trial they would be the 'control' group.

'letting the virus spread is a really bad strategy' if you looked at the UK figures you'd think that was what we had done for the last 10 months.

--------------
[kings fund]
The total number of NHS hospital beds in England, including general and acute, mental illness, learning disability, maternity and day-only beds, has more than halved over the past 30 years, from around 299,000 in 1987/88 to 141,000 in 2018/9, while the number of patients treated has increased significantly.

Today there are signs of a growing shortage of beds. In 2018/19, overnight general and acute bed occupancy averaged 90.2 per cent, and regularly exceeded 95 per cent in winter, well above the level many consider safe.

The lack of available hospital beds has been closely associated with the deterioration in performance against key waiting time standards, such as how long patients should wait in accident and emergency (A&E) or for planned operations.

------------
The population has also increased by about 10 million [an entire finland] from 1988 to 2020, not sure of the demographics in terms of proportion of elderly, but it is clear we had better NHS capacity before and have cut that intentionally. So no, I don't ignore the uk and how we seem to fare badly time and again, when we're supposed to be leaders in science, innovation, higher education etc..

That's my point mack. UK's figures and Sweden's figures are almost the same. 50,9k/1milj. cases in the UK. 52,6k/1milj. cases in Sweden.

 

[mack341]

Alright, nothing here, back to Tucker. Mack watch Tucker's opening monologue if you can.

Just watching that now ... sad to say it doesn't surprise me what they [elite establishment and Dem radicals] want to do with their power, and how they view the 74 million who voted for trump.

 

[Slottery]

But Finland?

Was just checking weather forecast as have to renew my passport next week and should be easy to stay home and warm, been freaking cold there, have lost my herd immunity to freezing weather years ago, hopefully vodka still does same trick than before and keep you warm for time have to spend outside. Didn't plan to have any extra minutes outside

 

[The Dude]

Could i be first in line, to shoot dealer wins on sight.

Please don't joke about shooting people in the forum. There are still a number of Americans here who can take these things literally.

 

[electronictonic]

What an absolute cunt you are saying that, disagree with someone fine, but calling for them to be shot...

Could i be first in line, to shoot dealer wins on sight.

 

[ternur]

But Finland?

Old Attachment (Invalid)

hopefully vodka still does same trick

Old Attachment (Invalid)

 

[Borgie]

Old Attachment (Invalid)



Old Attachment (Invalid)

I like your pants @ternur groovy