Captain Cooks group in trouble?

[jetset]

Snakes and bushes

Misrepresents the situation? How? Be specific, please as this is an unpleasant accusation.

You seem intent on finding a snake in every bush here, Vesuvio so let me assure you there is nothing sinister or even conspiratorial involved in Casinomeister deciding to post one of our bulletins which he receives on a regular basis as part of our service to Casinomeister News. He's done it before where appropriate.

This week's news roundup included the piece, which is relevant to this thread. So Bryan posted it for the interest of his members in this highly topical discussion in which you have been so active.

I am trying to understand exactly what there is about the information and opinions in this story that has you on your high horse?

Do you contend that I am lying when I report the interpretation of several industry observers as similar to my own on this matter?

Do you dispute the fact that ICL are embarking on a policy of deciding with whom they wish to do business and that certain accounts will be closed?

Do you refute their rationale for the audit as part of that process to identify those to be excluded? If so on what grounds?

Do you have anything to back up your repeated allusions to possible financial trouble and imminent business problems at Integrity?

Do you disagree with the position that greater clarity is required on Integrity's intentions regarding bonuses?

Do you have sufficient internal information to back your allegation that the percentage of excluded players will be significant rather than small?

Surely you accept that any retroactive disqualifications of bonuses will be extremely difficult to justify?

 

[Timer]

Are you serious? You are in the USA and play in pounds (?) so it is obvoius
you are looking for the biggest bonus.

Whether I am or I am not, what is the problem with that? Nowhere on their website did I read that this was wrong or not allowed. I received no e-mails telling me this is inappropriate action. At no time was I led to believe that my behavior was unaceptable. My friend told me to deposit in GBP so I did.

That isn't the problem, but the unbelievable statement is that you wanted the deposit back from Casino Classic but not Captain Cooks. This must have been because you lost most of the bonus account money there!!

No. This is because THEY LOCKED MY ACCOUNT, WHICH SCARED THE HELL OUT OF ME. I had no intention of asking for anything back. I was ENJOYING playing. What don't you seem to get ? A new player gets his account frozen when he is LOSING! Then I get an e-mail saying I can get my deposit back, if I want to go that route, so yes, I want to go that route with this account, of course. I had finished clearing the bonus on the other account so why should I go that route there? What have I done wrong? I followed all rules. What am I supposed to think?

Of course, Integrity offered this to you (I assume your real money account still had the 200 deposit) so it seems to be their stupid mistake in offering such a deal but it seems to show their lack of understanding of their own offers! Anyone who lost their bonus funds seems to be able to receive their deposit back under this email offer. Am I wrong on this?

Yes, you are wrong. (100 deposit + 150 winnings in the Captain Cooks account) The way I read the T&C is that if you lose the money in your bonus account you still have to play x number of hands in the real money account to have a chance of getting any of that money out. This is the price you pay, the gamble you take, to try and win the bonus. I accepted those risks. You can't just play off the bonus money, lose it, and then say oh well, give me my deposit back. I'm also quite sure, but I have no data to prove it, that this is exactly what happened to many players. They lost their bonus money, and then they lost some, if not all, of the money in their real account playing off the required number of hands. Are they getting an offer to recoup their original deposit? I hardly think so. Isn't this what the casino really wants? They want people to lose don't they? Can they have it both ways? Can they collect the money from those that lose, but not have to pay those who win even though all parties used the very same promotion?

Microgaming have in the past paid players when licensees have gone bust so I don't think you need to worry about the casino being insolvent.

What is a newbie supposed to think anyway? First time in an online casino and the funds are frozen and you are subtly accused of something inappropriate. But I can rest easy now. Whew, I'm glad there is no problem. I can stop worrying. I was concerned over nothing. Thanks for putting my fears to rest.

 

[sirius]

Timer, I may have got the amount of the deposit wrong, but the email seemed to offer you the chance of getting your deposit back even though you lost most of the bonus. You had lost most of the bonus money in the bonus account but I suspect you hadn't touched your deposit yet in the real account. I don't think it's a bad deal but they probably didn't intend it that way. Are they still not replying to your emails about this? This is a quote from the email:

You may elect for an immediate refund of
deposit(s) made to claim signup bonuses up to the amount of your player
current account balance or withdrawal, however, in doing so you will
forfeit any amounts in your accounts/withdrawals above and beyond your
deposit(s). If you wish to elect for this option of deposit refund please
respond to this email with "BJ play return deposit" in the subject line
and we will attend to your query immediately.

Normally you'd have to wager your deposit again x times in the real account to withdraw!

 

[sirius]

I think this group are upset after losing money but what did they expect to happen with the ever changing terms? I mentioned years ago that if bonus terms are set too high, casinos would only have bonus hunters playing them.

A few days ago they increased the terms yet again and disallowed blackjack and this caused some confusion again and I've heard of players having their withdrawels reversed and CS telling them they'd have to play under the new terms even though they signed up under the old terms!

 

[Stanford]

This isn't good

QUOTE These actions are all designed to ensure that Integrity Casinos is known to operate brands where players who look for genuine gaming entertainment based around playing against the rules of the games fairly, are welcomed and treated with respect and courtesy.

Players who do not fall into this category detract from the ability of Integrity Casinos to reward the genuine and legitimate players for their continued patronage of our brands, and will not be tolerated. UNQUOTE

I would say that the interpretation here is that this established and successful group of casinos is taking a strong stand on whatever we want to call "advantage players, smart players, professional players, math players, bonus hunters, percentage players etc"

It sounds to me like they are ready to bolt on their terms if they have smart players. This is a rogue casino if they do that.

Part of the entertainment is deciding the best way to play a given promotion.

I will be watching for the smart player who has lost. When they refund the losses, I will consider them legitimate. Otherwise, we are cutting them to much slack and sending the wrong message.

I draw attention to Position 3 from Integrity's own statement:

QUOTE
Position
3) Wagering has a high probability of being suspect, and the Real Account has a balance greater than zero.
Result
These accounts will have any amounts transferred from their Bonus Account removed, and players advised they can continue wagering with their deposits and any remaining winnings, under the terms and conditions that existed at the time the deposit was made.

If any suspect account has cashins pending, these will be paid but transfers from the Bonus Account to Deposit Accounts will be deducted first.

I have won considerable money in the bonus account and then transferred it into the regular account. This casino group has no right to be removing either the bonus or the money won in the bonus account from these cashins. We have a word for this in Texas - we call it "cheating".

I hope all watchdogs will take a strong stand in this respect. And I hope players will stand together for as long as it takes to keep these threads at the top of every major forum until this is resolved. I am very disappointed that this group has resorted to such action - by their own admission.

Any players suffering from this new policy of recanting and confiscation should certainly PAB. And you have my support; it could have easily been me.

imho,
Stanford

 

[Vesuvio]

Jetset, I wish you'd waited after my last post. I just got in and saw your post commenting on mine, but missed the whole long section that was all contained within a "quote". All I saw was the last two lines of unwarranted speculation on my motives. I wouldn't have replied as I did (as you already answered my question) if I'd seen it first, but then didn't have time to write any more.

I understand now how your wording found it's way into a statement which I took to be from Casinomeister. My point relating to that news story was mainly that Bryan seemed to be taking your interpretation as representative of the whole spectrum of views on here. As it is in fact your statement there's no issue! I don't entirely agree with your interpretation, and I'll try and say why, but I respect your opinion.

 

[Vesuvio]

I believe this is a case of a casino owner who has made the very innovative decision to exercise his/her right of admission and his/her right to choose with whom he/she will do business - as a conscious policy.

It's hard to know how best to put this, but I think my main disagreement with your press release is the positive spin it gives - suggesting that these casinos have decided to take a brave and bold step against bonus hunters. I don't see anything innovative here. Casinos are always deciding who they want to play with them and have always banned players they don't want at their casinos. This is very old hat and acceptable. It would have been logical, perhaps, for the casino to look at old accounts at their casinos and decide this before sending out e-mails to all their players advertising a sign-up bonus at Casino Classic.

What is unusual here is deciding to freeze funds and send out alarming e-mails, some of which may scare players (especially inexperienced ones) into forfeiting funds unnecessarily. I don't think I've been scaremongering to suggest that this audit is a drastic step which suggests something's not quite right with the casino group. I still think the most reasonable explanation would be that they were losing money (at whatever rate, and whether or not it placed their business at any risk) so decided they didn't have too much to lose from this action.

The difficulty now comes in over this question of retroactive application of bonus disqualifications, and I have to admit that concerns me and requires clarification. And there will obviously be some ill-feeling among those who are given the chop, that's understandable.

Yes, we're in agreement over this, though I do think you understate the reaction it's going to bring. I would expect ill-feeling industry-wide, rather than just from the players involved, but that's just the idealist in me.

You keep harping on this question of what percentage of the Integrity group's gambler base is likely to fall into the exclusion category, and as I have commented to you before neither you nor I can know how big....or how small, this number is.

I was only really bringing this up again because I thought it odd that Casinomeister used it as well - but as I've said I understand now this was your press release. My point was simply that the casino said this matter involved a large number of players. I agree, neither you nor I knows, so I was suprised your press release, rather than reporting what the casino said, decided it was a small percentage.

We don't have access to that information. But don't you think that a decision of this magnitude, taken by experienced operator people would have been carefully researched first? If these folks have miscalculated and their gambler base is weighted significantly toward the *undesireables* (for want of a better word) as you suggest do you think they would be embarking on this course? These are experienced online casino operators, man.

If their definition of *undesireables* is people who autoplayed bonuses on BJ, then it's undoubtedly a very large number of players, whatever it may be percentage-wise. If the casino was losing money to this group, and especially if it was losing money overall, then I can imagine it might embark on this course, despite the number involved.

As to your point about waiting to see what happens - I'd rather discussion on this thread helped to persuade the casino not to go ahead with actions which should see them automatically rogued i.e. removing funds from the accounts of players who met the terms and conditions of a bonus while not refunding players who took up the same bonuses and lost their deposits.

This is what stands out in their e-mails and their representative's comments, and perhaps deserved central billing in a press release on this issue rather than being relegated to a footnote. If they just pay out their players and then ban those they don't wish to play with them any more that's utterly standard practice and no-one will have any issue with them.

I apologise if my previous posts have come across as personal attacks (mainly through a misunderstanding). I accept you see this matter differently, and of course have every right to.

 

[Timer]

Timer, I may have got the amount of the deposit wrong, but the email seemed to offer you the chance of getting your deposit back even though you lost most of the bonus. You had lost most of the bonus money in the bonus account but I suspect you hadn't touched your deposit yet in the real account. I don't think it's a bad deal but they probably didn't intend it that way. Are they still not replying to your emails about this?

The amount of the deposit is not the point. The point is that AFTER they locked my account they OFFERED to return my deposit. What would you do? I accepted. They then asked me my preferred method to withdraw the money. Since I deposited with Neteller they suggested I withdraw using Neteller. I was unclear about their message, so I asked them if they had made the withdrawl for me. They said no, I had to go into my account to do that. The account was locked, of course and I couldn't make any withdrawl. I sent them another e-mail saying so and they said they would forward this e-mail to the accounts department, but unfortunately they were closed for the weekend. On Monday I e-mailed them again and they did not respond. I e-mailed them again today (you see I've been very patient) and they said:

"Accounts will let you know what's happening, first thing Monday (Sunday
night your time)."

So I am going to patiently wait until Sunday.

PS All of this correspondence has been with Casino Classic. I have had no correspondence with Captain Cooks save the first time my account was locked and they reset my password. Although since they are all one big corporation, I don't see what difference it makes. I have made no request one way or the other concerning my funds at Captain Cooks. In fact, I had an opportunity to withdraw those funds at one time, after they unlocked my account and I had finished clearing the bonus, but I chose not to because I wished to play some more. But since I am 150 winner on Captain Cooks I am waiting very patiently to see what happens.

 

[bonustreak]

I am amazed at how far all of this has gone to begin with, I work close with the casinos as an affiliate and I can assure you they are not running out of money or going broke. That is just absurd as Bryan has stated you do not open a new casino being broke!

As far as the players having accounts locked for a short time, if your a legit player and have not abused the system any anyway then you have no worries at all, sit back take a few days off of gambling and wait for the account to be
re-opened.

Why is Wily "sick"? All he did was state a fact, and the fact is there are people out there that do like to gamble and cannot leave their homes, what is the casino suppose to say...Gee you do not leave your home so we cannot have you as a player? Gambling is what they like to do, and as long as they are not putting themselves in danger of losing all they have then so what?
If the casino thought this was the case, they do have the resources to help anyone in need!

I personally would like to see a few bad apples gone then to have the casinos turn into a hateful group of casinos that do not care what so ever about the players, believe me there are plenty of them out there just waiting to take and take and take from players that are LEGIT!

Also since all this has happened I have cashed out with no problems and so have several of my friends, and they are BJ players.

 

[Stanford]

Integrity appears to be a misnomer

I am amazed at how far all of this has gone to begin with, I work close with the casinos as an affiliate and I can assure you they are not running out of money or going broke...

Also since all this has happened I have cashed out with no problems and so have several of my friends, and they are BJ players.

Players should be worried. We have no way to ascertain the financial condition and neither do you. I have received rumors of slow affiliate pay and that isn't a good sign. Maybe Willy can address that.

What we can ascertain is that this casino (by their own admission) is willing to remove the bonus and winnings after the fact and for cases other than fraud. If there ever was such a thing as bonus abuse, this is it - by the casino.

My conclusion is the casino is dishonest, short of funds or both.

Should they wish to abandon this policy or if they have misstated it, then that is a different matter.

There simply is no gray here. Players should avoid this casino.


imho,
Stanford

 

[bonustreak]

Even the best casino affiliates have paid late before and just because the payments are late does not mean they are broke, the aff program is run by a different support staff, and I as an affiliate am not concerned I know my money will come.

Wagershare was late by a week and a few days this month also with their payment, are they going broke? I can name several that paid late, when conventions and things of that nature are happening then payments get screwed up, we may bitch about it to one another but we do know we will be paid.

They are abusive because they are protecting themselves from shady players?

What we can ascertain is that this casino (by their own admission) is willing to remove the bonus and winnings after the fact and for cases other than fraud. If there ever was such a thing as bonus abuse, this is it - by the casino.

Go read other casinos T&C's they all have that in there, they can withdraw any winnings and bonuses or refuse to pay at anytime!

I also read that if your deemed a good quality player this will be returned to your account after they do the audits.

The casino is not being audited, players are.

 

[jetset]

Vesuvio, you are entitled to your personal opinion, too and I am more than prepared to debate your view of my bulletin although I think we should take that outside because this sort of sideshow detracts from the main thrust here and requires some restraint.

Let us therefore resort to PM or email exchanges where we can really go at it. I don't believe in hiding behind anonymity when I have something to say, so my identity is always upfront. Perhaps in private we can introduce ourselves and get to grips with your offensive and unwarranted use of terms such as *spin* and *PR* and an apparent suggestion that I am promoting the casino concerned instead of interpreting its motives as an independent but informed observer.

The way I see it, you seem to be unhappy chiefly because I haven't jumped on your anti-ICL bandwagon and voice my own opinions rather than following your own. And this is an innovative event - this is the first time I have seen a major brand cleaning house openly and on this level and publicising their future business approach in a formal press release.

By the way, you persist in referring to my op-ed editorial as a "press release"- it is no such thing. A technicality perhaps, but a necessary distinction.

Back on topic. I think you are now becoming irresponsible in the assumptions you are making and the as you put it persistent scare-mongering in which I think you are indulging. You are continuing to suggest without a shred of evidence that this casino group is in some sort of financial or business trouble. I have to believe that that is deliberately mischievous because myself and others have already drawn your attention to this.

I think that instead of this you/we should be pressing for clarity on this issue by posting specific questions we want answered (as I have done earlier in this thread) or by contacting the casinos involved directly and asking specific questions instead of indulging in what looks increasingly like malicious assumption and innuendo.

I have nailed my personal flag to the mast on the question of earned bonuses and retroactive confiscation as a matter of record earlier in this thread, and I have not changed my view, nor my interpretation of what the motivation of ICL is with this policy.

The emotional speculation on the possibilities regarding bonuses to one side for a brief moment, I think the management of this group has the right to choose with whom it wishes to do business and on what terms, as long as these are fairly and honestly communicated and applied. They seem to have decided what their priorities are, and where the emphasis in their business will lie in future.

That carries the risk attendant on every important management decision, and the responsibility to assess that before implementing the decision. Presumably that has been done conscientiously.

 

[Haviton]

OK

To cut the Inuendo and Speculation

I deposit 100, receive 100 in Bonus account

I play 3500 hands of Vegas Strip Black Jack on Auto Play (35xWR)

I transfer 100 to real account

I then play 7000 hands of Vegas Strip Blackjack on Autoplay (35X WR)

I then withdraw 200


Will I be paid the 200 that I have achieved completly by playing to The casino T&Cs of the time. If the answer is Yes then there is no problem. If the answer is no, Then, IMHO, the casino should be rogued

 

[Vesuvio]

Perhaps in private we can introduce ourselves and get to grips with your offensive and unwarranted use of terms such as *spin* and *PR* and an apparent suggestion that I am promoting the casino concerned instead of interpreting its motives as an independent but informed observer.

For the record - I don't think you're doing anything other than honestly describing the situation as you see it. I'm not suggesting you're promoting the casino. I do think your editorial happens to present the casino in a better light than the casino's own statements, but that's just due to their own incompetence.

The way I see it, you seem to be unhappy chiefly because I haven't jumped on your anti-ICL bandwagon and voice my own opinions rather than following your own.

I don't see where you get this from. As I said, of course I understand you have a different opinion. You told me to explain what I felt was flawed in your editiorial and I did. It's not my bandwagon. A very large number of people are understandably concerned by these actions.

And this is an innovative event - this is the first time I have seen a major brand cleaning house openly and on this level and publicising their future business approach in a formal press release.

As I see it the press release was an attempt to cope with the bad publicity their actions inevitably created. They still haven't deigned to explain "suspect wagering".

Back on topic. I think you are now becoming irresponsible in the assumptions you are making and the as you put it persistent scare-mongering in which I think you are indulging. You are continuing to suggest without a shred of evidence that this casino group is in some sort of financial or business trouble. I have to believe that that is deliberately mischievous because myself and others have already drawn your attention to this.

I've said I don't know (do you?) and everything may be fine. All I've said is that the most logical explanation for a casino taking these actions would be financial problems. I'd stand by that and others share my view. If I was scare-mongering I wouldn't have added, as I have, that I have no doubt they can pay all their customers if they choose to.

I think that instead of this you/we should be pressing for clarity on this issue by posting specific questions we want answered (as I have done earlier in this thread) or by contacting the casinos involved directly and asking specific questions instead of indulging in what looks increasingly like malicious assumption and innuendo.

I agree - I've asked a large number of specific questions in this thread. Most remain unanswered, but a number of interesting issues have been raised that are worth discussing whether or not the casino goes ahead and carries out its threats.

I think the management of this group has the right to choose with whom it wishes to do business and on what terms, as long as these are fairly and honestly communicated and applied.

Of course they do - no-one disputes that. All that's at issue here is whether they plan to remove bonuses and/or winnings from players who met their terms and conditions. If they do they should be rogued and it'll negatively impact on their future business. If they don't then we can forget this issue.

Presumably that has been done conscientiously.

You keep accusing me of making unfair presumptions, but they're no more or less out of line with the facts than your assuming the casino has thought out all their actions conscientiously. They may have, they may not have. We don't know and can only judge from appearances - & seem to come to opposite conclusions.

Anyway, I agree this back & forth between us has detracted from the overall impetus of the thread. I think we've both stated our views fairly clearly and I'd be happy to leave it at that (if you want one more post I'll agree not to reply to it).

 

[Vesuvio]

Go read other casinos T&C's they all have that in there, they can withdraw any winnings and bonuses or refuse to pay at anytime!

Yes, Vixen, but casinos that use the 'we can do anything we like' clauses in their terms and conditions end up rogued at message boards like this one.

 

[Freudian]

What I can't understand is why this groups behaviour is being described as innovative and a bold new step. This is the exact scheme of such old favourites as Virtual, Connecto and others. No difference whatsoever. Even the motivations sound exactly the same: "you are a sharp player". "you are not playing for entertainment purposes".

When a reputable group starts using scum tactics they are a scum casino. It's as simple as that.

 

[universexf6]

What I can't understand is why this groups behaviour is being described as innovative and a bold new step. This is the exact scheme of such old favourites as Virtual, Connecto and others. No difference whatsoever. Even the motivations sound exactly the same: "you are a sharp player". "you are not playing for entertainment purposes".

When a reputable group starts using scum tactics they are a scum casino. It's as simple as that.

　I completely agree. I often hear people here sometimes saying "Casinos can
do whatever they can do or change because there states their own rules and
there is no laws". But I will tell you, these casinos who try to cheat players
taking advantage of empty rules or just ruleless situation will pay in the long
run.

 

[profiler]

Have the 7 days elapsed yet?

 

[Linus]

Yes, Vixen, but casinos that use the 'we can do anything we like' clauses in their terms and conditions end up rogued at message boards like this one.

Doesn't that depend on the board?

Correct me if I'm wrong - but aren't many sites paid for by the casinos - to the extent that they're effectively partners, getting a direct cut of the casinos' wins and losses?

You wouldn't necessarily expect a fair hearing or an impartial resolution there.

Or to put it differently - because I'm far from an industry insider - I'd expect a lot of people to go to a lot of trouble to defend the casinos they make their living from.

That's the only way I can find to explain certain arguments - that the player has a duty to lose, that winning is cheating, or that your opponent has the right to retroactively change the rules when he decides (after the fact) he no longer likes them. Or, that a casino is taking a "brave stand" by cheating its players.

Or maybe it's because I come from the poker world, where those kinds of arguments would be laughed at out of hand.

I admit, if I was a casino operator, and I made my living taking money from the feeble-minded and the gambling-addicted, I wouldn't want me playing at my casino, either.

Even then, though, I wouldn't try to change the rules after the fact, or have the gall to try to paint myself out to be a victim of the people I'm stealing money from.

 

[Stanford]

Even the best casino affiliates have paid late before and just because the payments are late does not mean they are broke, the aff program is run by a different support staff, and I as an affiliate am not concerned I know my money will come. .

Thank you for confirming they have been late paying affiliates.

It doesn't mean they are broke. It is a warning sign and along with the "audit' tool is reason for concern. With the admittance to a policy of reneging on bonus and winnings, this casino group should be avoided by normal players and sophisticated players should proceed with great amount of caution.

With the onerous play through requirements, there is no need for less sophisticated players to play there in any event. Another reason they could be having problems.

"Go read other casinos T&C's they all have that in there, they can withdraw any winnings and bonuses or refuse to pay at anytime! "

Thank you for pointing that out. Those T&C's are void on their face. As others noted above, any attempt at enforcement of such terms gets one rogued at sites like this one. Not all affiliates are like this one.

I checked your profile and your affiliate site is not indicated. It would be nice if you would let players know which site is yours, so they don't make the misstake of playing through you.

The casino is not being audited, players are.

And that's the problem. If they were an eCOGRA casino we would not be having this discussion. The casino would either honor their terms or lose their seal.

imho,
Stanford

 

[DiePolizeiistda]

My five cents on this group: I made bad experiences with Captain Cook: Money transfer never credited and Casino Kingdom (received payout eight months after request which led even to an article from Jetset). It is correct that the customer service answers in five minutes, but the willingness and intellectual capacity to settle issues is lacking. I had a thread of almost one hundred emails on my problem without solution.
It is not surprising that the casino group is not member of ecogra. They would probably not pass their quality standards. It is no surprise for me either that this group uses a so-called bonus scheme of bonus accounts: a scheme that not only has outrageous bonus wagering requirements, but by its design is misleading players. I advise all fellow players to stay away from this group.

 

[Stanford]

It is not surprising that the casino group is not member of ecogra. They would probably not pass their quality standards...I advise all fellow players to stay away from this group.

It doesn't pass the quality standards of some of the better affiliates either.

I would like to salute faircasinos.com for dumping the Integrity Casino Group for not paying bonuses and winnings. Well-done Sirius.

Stanford.

 

[555YY]

I am amazed at how far all of this has gone to begin with, I work close with the casinos as an affiliate and I can assure you they are not running out of money or going broke. That is just absurd as Bryan has stated you do not open a new casino being broke!

As far as the players having accounts locked for a short time, if your a legit player and have not abused the system any anyway then you have no worries at all, sit back take a few days off of gambling and wait for the account to be
re-opened.

Why is Wily "sick"? All he did was state a fact, and the fact is there are people out there that do like to gamble and cannot leave their homes, what is the casino suppose to say...Gee you do not leave your home so we cannot have you as a player? Gambling is what they like to do, and as long as they are not putting themselves in danger of losing all they have then so what?
If the casino thought this was the case, they do have the resources to help anyone in need!

I personally would like to see a few bad apples gone then to have the casinos turn into a hateful group of casinos that do not care what so ever about the players, believe me there are plenty of them out there just waiting to take and take and take from players that are LEGIT!

Also since all this has happened I have cashed out with no problems and so have several of my friends, and they are BJ players.

and why "your" opinion or the opinion of "your friends" who cashed out with no problems have any more merit than rest of the board? If 100 people cashed out with no problem while 10 people who won big by autoplaying their bonuses have their cashout denied it is NO LESS of a problem. the policy set for the by IGC's own t&c MATTERS. if they go against their own words, be it vs. 1 player or a 1000, what's the difference? other than the fact that you still get your affiliate payments from the losers who "cash out with no problems" if they had anything to cashout?

ftr, i had autoplayed bj at IGC, i have manually played bj at IGC, I have taken frequent promotions at IGC, I usually had no problems cashing out from IGC, and I still think they're wrong and have already said i wont go back anywhere near their casinos... but then that might be b/c i don't get paid by the casinos to say good words for them

 

[pumacat]

Hangin in

I am very guilty of not understanding the whole bonus thing even though I do own a gambling website and I do try to make the bonuses offered by casinos as clear as possible when I post them. But i myself when i do play at a casino, simply call up ( live chat ) and simply ask what I can and cannot play just to cover my butt should I win.

Of all the casinos out there that have been way off with their promotions and playthrough and just plain ol scamming its players, I believe captain cooks is one of the few that i would still be willing to put my money into.

The casino ( captians ) may have had good reason to do what they did, and on the other hand, they may not have. I can not judge. But I do know that their are many people out there playing with these casinos and trying to take them for everything they got. Is this wrong? well....no..its not...If I thought I knew a way to drain a casino playing fairly, then id do it without thinking twice about it.

Its funny thought how most people have never had a problem with captain Cooks casino, and I also find it strange that they have picked out only a select few and asked them not to play at their casino.

Is there a good reson for their decision? They have never done this to me or 95% of their players. Perhaps, cause I am not part of any group who goes out of its way to create havik amongs the online casinos

In closing , I will say this, I think that any casino including captains, who agree on terms with a player during signing up, should have no right to change their terms in the middle of a person playing..that is simply not fair to the player involved.

Puma

 

[sirius]

this group is most certainly in trouble, recently they sent out an email, in which they admitted to having finacial troubles and would be unable to pay by neteller due to a cash flow problem, if you havn't done so yet,it maybe time to say goodbye to your money

Please copy and paste this email as I don't believe they would say they had a cashflow problem.

 

[sMeller]

Please copy and paste this email as I don't believe they would say they had a cashflow problem.

I think he is talking about this email:

Hi There,

Firstly I'd like to congratulate you on your recent win!

Currently we have limited funds in our NETeller account due to some big winners we have had in the last few weeks. Things have been so busy in here, with our recent influx of new players and with so many of them winning!

I'd like to offer to send you an Bank Wire for the full amount of your outstanding withdrawals.

We can have the wire sent off to you as soon as we receive your response to this email and it should arrive hopefully within 3-5 days of processing it.

Of course seeing as this would be a favour for us I'd like to offer to send the wire free of charge (usually the fee is around $10). This method of payment will be quicker than NETeller for receiving your withdrawal on this occasion, as it takes quite a while for us to fund our NETeller account. Of course your preferred payment method for future payments will remain as NETeller.

If you are happy for us to send an ACH please reply to this email and provide the following details of your Checking or Savings Account.

Bank Name
Bank Address (at least city, state, country)
Bank Account number
Bank Swift or Sort Code

Thanks, in advance for your understanding, I hope the lucky streak continues!

Kind regards,

Tracy
Accounts/Finance Department
Captain Cooks Casino

I have taken it from a post made in another forum July 2004.

 

[slotchik]

I am very guilty of not understanding the whole bonus thing even though I do own a gambling website and I do try to make the bonuses offered by casinos as clear as possible when I post them. But i myself when i do play at a casino, simply call up ( live chat ) and simply ask what I can and cannot play just to cover my butt should I win.

Of all the casinos out there that have been way off with their promotions and playthrough and just plain ol scamming its players, I believe captain cooks is one of the few that i would still be willing to put my money into.

The casino ( captians ) may have had good reason to do what they did, and on the other hand, they may not have. I can not judge. But I do know that their are many people out there playing with these casinos and trying to take them for everything they got. Is this wrong? well....no..its not...If I thought I knew a way to drain a casino playing fairly, then id do it without thinking twice about it.

Its funny thought how most people have never had a problem with captain Cooks casino, and I also find it strange that they have picked out only a select few and asked them not to play at their casino.

Is there a good reson for their decision? They have never done this to me or 95% of their players. Perhaps, cause I am not part of any group who goes out of its way to create havik amongs the online casinos

In closing , I will say this, I think that any casino including captains, who agree on terms with a player during signing up, should have no right to change their terms in the middle of a person playing..that is simply not fair to the player involved.

Puma

Puma which gambling website do you own??

 

[freezer]

Have the 7 days elapsed yet?

Yes, it has been close to 9 days now.

Our audit and reconciliation will be complete within 7 days of receiving
this email. We will advise you at the end of this audit of our findings
and decisions.

I emailed them 2 days ago asking for an update. I received a prompt reply that my email would be forwarded to accounts.

Glad to see my patience has been rewarded . . .

 

[The Dude]

As most of you know, I dont work weekends. I havent had a chance to pop in to this thread since Friday so Ill take this opportunity to make a few comments:

You seem intent on finding a snake in every bush here, Vesuvio so let me assure you there is nothing sinister or even conspiratorial involved in Casinomeister deciding to post one of our bulletins which he receives on a regular basis as part of our service to Casinomeister News. He's done it before where appropriate.

Casinomeister is a large site and the forum is only a part of it. Friday is news day when I update the news section with infopowa news, PRs, or other items of interest. Time is limited (isnt it always) and I chose to post the Integrity Casinos news item in the forum. Nothing scandalous about that last time I checked, this was still my website.

At no time was I led to believe that my behavior was unaceptable. My friend told me to deposit in GBP so I did.

And what the hell? Your friend told you to deposit in British Pounds? Are you a Brit or reside in the UK? Blimey!! What would possess you to do this? I dont know unless it was to take advantage of their bonuses. Pretty stupid in fact, since this is a major red flag for any casino operator when they start looking at their accounts.

What is a newbie supposed to think anyway? First time in an online casino and the funds are frozen and you are subtly accused of something inappropriate.

I dont believe any newbies are being affected. I havent seen or heard of any newbie posts, but then Im not through reading this thread.

Players should be worried. We have no way to ascertain the financial condition and neither do you. I have received rumors of slow affiliate pay and that isn't a good sign. Maybe Willy can address that.

No they should not be worried. Like I mentioned before and anyone who knows MG like I do would agree, you dont open a new MG casino without having appropriate funds to do so. MG wont let you; its a pretty tight organization. I have received rumors This is whats called rumor mongering.

They would probably not pass their quality standards.

I disagree. Joining eCOGRA requires a lot of commitment not just abiding by certain terms, but logistically as well. If youd notice, most of the MG casinos listed at eGOGRA are the larger casino groups that have more resources (manpower finances) to pull from. This has nothing to do with quality standards.

this group is most certainly in trouble, recently they sent out an email, in which they admitted to having finacial troubles.

This email has nothing to do with admitting to financial troubles. Captain Cooks deals with about 15 different methods of depositing and withdrawals its not just Neteller. There are times when they are shifting or transferring funds from one account to another; its pretty complex. Ive had this explained to me a couple of times in the past.

I am still waiting for the flood of complaints being lodged via the PAB. One was on Friday, and another came in yesterday both have been forwarded to the casino. (someone mentioned the PAB was intimidating?? ) Sorry about that.

Anyway, Im awaiting for more comments from the casino concerning this whole situation.

 

[Vesuvio]

Casinomeister is a large site and the forum is only a part of it. Friday is news day when I update the news section with infopowa news, PRs, or other items of interest. Time is limited (isnt it always) and I chose to post the Integrity Casinos news item in the forum. Nothing scandalous about that last time I checked, this was still my website.

Yes, I realised how this news item came about in the end! I wish you'd explained it when you replied to my post about the story a few minutes later (on Friday) - it'd have saved an awful lot of typing for both me and Jetset

And what the hell? Your friend told you to deposit in British Pounds? Are you a Brit or reside in the UK? Blimey!! What would possess you to do this? I dont know unless it was to take advantage of their bonuses. Pretty stupid in fact, since this is a major red flag for any casino operator when they start looking at their accounts.

This strikes me as totally unwarranted. If the casino terms at the time said you had to deposit in your own currency then fair enough. If they didn't they why not deposit in whichever currency you choose. I'm a Brit but often deposit in dollars, depending on how lucky I'm feeling (not very when it comes to playing slots!). What's wrong with exploiting bonuses? Isn't that why everyone takes up a casino sign-up bonus? Why wouldn't you deposit in a currency that makes the bonus a larger amount of money? (assuming you're not going to be murdered by Neteller currency conversion fees)

I dont believe any newbies are being affected. I havent seen or heard of any newbie posts, but then Im not through reading this thread.

Have a read, Bryan

No they should not be worried. Like I mentioned before and anyone who knows MG like I do would agree, you dont open a new MG casino without having appropriate funds to do so. MG wont let you; its a pretty tight organization. I have received rumors This is whats called rumor mongering.

That doesn't mean they don't have fewer appropriate funds after opening the new casino. It's very odd behaviour from an on-line casino that still requires a coherent explanation. If this wasn't an MG casino the conclusion would be quite straightforward.

I am still waiting for the flood of complaints being lodged via the PAB.

Just keep encouraging Integrity to think what they're doing's reasonable & you've got a better chance of getting your flood of complaints! How does that Chinese curse about being careful what you wish for go?

 

[profiler]

And what the hell? Your friend told you to deposit in British Pounds? Are you a Brit or reside in the UK? Blimey!! What would possess you to do this? I dont know unless it was to take advantage of their bonuses. Pretty stupid in fact, since this is a major red flag for any casino operator when they start looking at their accounts.

I think that the discussion should be about the bigger principle involved, namely that a casino should abide by the WR and other rules set out in their own T&C. Whether it is ok or not, from a moral or any other perspective, to hunt bonusses and whether or not one should ''cover'' his play in the process is in my opinion not really the issue here.

I am still waiting for the flood of complaints being lodged via the PAB. One was on Friday, and another came in yesterday both have been forwarded to the casino. (someone mentioned the PAB was intimidating?? ) Sorry about that.

Except for the fact that the Captain Cook's Group have now been holding my GBP 530 (GBP 240 of which is bonus plus winnings transferred from the bonus account to the deposit account) for over ten days and the fact that the group have not been living up to the promise of finishing the audit within 7 days, i do not see what there is to complain.

I will just wait for the group to decide my case anytime in the near future, so that i can then make up my mind about the added value of a complaint. Also, it would be helpful to know the ''industry'' consensus opinion about the above named principle first. Or is this done the other way around?

 

[Black21Jack]

And what the hell? Your friend told you to deposit in British Pounds? Are you a Brit or reside in the UK? Blimey!! What would possess you to do this? I dont know unless it was to take advantage of their bonuses. Pretty stupid in fact, since this is a major red flag for any casino operator when they start looking at their accounts.

I don't know why anyone would not play in GBP due to the strength of the currency. I have my accounts in GBP at any casinos that offer that currency, all because it is approx. $2.30 CDN to the Pound. Maybe it is becuase I never claim any bonuses that I have no problems but all of the casinos I play at make it clear when I sign up that by playing in GBP I have given up eligibility on all bonus offers from the casino.

 

[Black21Jack]

Whether I am or I am not, what is the problem with that? Nowhere on their website did I read that this was wrong or not allowed. I received no e-mails telling me this is inappropriate action. At no time was I led to believe that my behavior was unaceptable. My friend told me to deposit in GBP so I did.

To add to my above post, 90% of casinos will email you to let you know that you can't play in GBP, or they will have it stated in their T&C's which all players should read before playing at any casino. There is no excuse for not reading the T&C's If you had read the conditions you would have seen this. Every casino in the CC group have the following stated in their conditions:

6.15 Residents of the USA and Canada, and their territories, may only wager and be paid in USD or CAD. Only residents of Great Britain, and its territories, may wager and be paid in GBP. Only residents of countries that have adopted the Euro may wager and be paid in Euros. Residents of other countries must wager and be paid in USD.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Bonuses 6.17

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Bonuses 6.15

Outdated URL (Invalid) Bonuses 6.15

No excuse, they do not have to honor your wagers if you claimed a bonus. If you didn't, you should be fine.

Edit: I just went back and read your intial post where you say that you did claim a bonus. They should return your deposits but they have no obligation to give you yor winnings. My advice as I have said many times in these forums is do not claim bonuses, you can't make any money off them and they are such a headache for such small amounts.

 

[profiler]

To add to my above post, 90% of casinos will email you to let you know that you can't play in GBP, or they will have it stated in their T&C's which all players should read before playing at any casino. There is no excuse for not reading the T&C's If you had read the conditions you would have seen this. Every casino in the CC group have the following stated in their conditions:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Bonuses 6.17

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Bonuses 6.15

Outdated URL (Invalid) Bonuses 6.15

No excuse, they do not have to honor your wagers if you claimed a bonus. If you didn't, you should be fine.

I believe that these conditions have been added to the T&C along with the other changes made in the latest T&C update (a.o. the WR increase from 35xB(+D) to 42xB(+D)). Can anyone confirm this?

Unfortunately i do not have a copy of the former T&C. (which either proofs that i am not a professional but a ''leisure'' player, naive and of too good faith, or just plain stupid, or my printer was broken).

 

[profiler]

Bye the way Black21Jack, what do you mean by:

(...) When I was really getting to know about online gambling my first attraction was the bonuses. Then as I read more on the internet and on various forums I decided to never use a bonus and that I could make a lot more money without them. (...)

Do you have some sort of a system? Can i buy it?

The only online gambling i know of that is beatable without a bonus are such games as poker and backgammon, in which skill is the deciding factor, but since we are talking (autoplay) casino blackjack / slots / etc. here...

 

[sMeller]

I believe that these conditions have been added to the T&C along with the other changes made in the latest T&C update (a.o. the WR increase from 35xB(+D) to 42xB(+D)). Can anyone confirm this?

Yes I can confirm this. These conditions have been added very recently and was not there when I signed up.

 

[ScurvyDog]

This thread continues to stray and devolve.

If Integrity decides to declare null and void the bonuses + winnings of any player who deposited in a currency other than their own, then they also have the obligation to retroactively apply that logic as well to players who deposited in a currency other than their own and lost money, refunding their original deposit. If they retroactively apply that logic solely to winning players they deserve to be rogued, sued, and keelhauled.

The reason they chose to allow US players to deposit in pounds in the past (and the reason they manually awarded bonuses in pounds to those very same players) is because, on average, they make more money when that occurs. They're operating online casinos. They do what makes them the most money.

This whole debacle is solely about money. Integrity got hammered on the Casino Classic promotion because it got posted on assorted bonus-oriented forums. I'm sure they expected that, to some extent, but what they didn't expect is that it would make people aware that Cook's and Casino Kingdom offered decent bonuses as well. So everyone piled on in a short amount of time and they lost more money than they were comfortable with.

That's all this is about. It's not about making a stand or defining the relationship they want with players or anything like that. It's more than likely not about financial problems they're having.

More and more it's looking like a simple cash flow problem. Keep in mind that highly profitable, stable companies can experience cash flow problems all the time, depending on the nature of their business.

It appears (and yes, I say appears, as I'm not claiming to know) as if the audit is simply a delaying tactic designed to buy themselves a little time. They've had more than enough time to audit accounts and still no word or response of any sort to query emails about the state of the audit. They have to realize the backlash that would ensure if they do follow through on their veiled threats to reneg on their own published terms and conditions. More than likely this will end with a whimper, they'll pay out to nearly everyone except for the most obvious bonus abusers, and they'll be more careful about future promotions and terms they offer.

 

[Black21Jack]

That is terrible. I just did some further research using archive.org and could not find the terms I just posted above on older pages. It does not say that the terms have been updated recently so I just assumed the GBP rule had been in there for some time, I apologize. my mind is beginning to change on this group. It also states on their older terms that they offer 3 currencies; GBP, U.S. Dollar, and Euro. They go on to say that players may choose whatever currency they wish. They only stipulation was that if opening in Euro you are not eligible for progressives. I am starting to have second thoughts about depositing here, even though these changes in terms are for bonuses, and I do not claim them, I find it very sneaky and unfair.

 

[dominique]

Originally Posted by Black21Jack
(...) When I was really getting to know about online gambling my first attraction was the bonuses. Then as I read more on the internet and on various forums I decided to never use a bonus and that I could make a lot more money without them. (...)

I agree with black21jack completely.

Back in the days I was using bonuses too - the absence of wagering requirements made it easy pickings.

Today I find bonuses a good way to lose - the WR are just a trap in my opinion, and all enjoyment is taken out of playing. I have much better chances at winning without having to fill WR. I can withdraw any time I please and that has worked for me many times.

I have never thought about playing in GBP but it sounds like a good idea to me. Casinos need to clarify their positions on this.

The question here seems to be: Did they or did they not have this in their T&C at the time?

How about using the way back machine - it may show you.

 

[Stanford]

No they should not be worried. Like I mentioned before and anyone who knows MG like I do would agree, you dont open a new MG casino without having appropriate funds to do so. MG wont let you; its a pretty tight organization. I have received rumors This is whats called rumor mongering.

Thank you for your response. I acknowledge the logic in what you say.

Never the less, holding up cash-ins pending an audit is a stalling tactic and is not justified if the objective is to discover sharp players. As many players have pointed out, being a sharp player doesn't disqualify one from receiving their cash-in after meeting the terms.

Additionally, there are reports from multiple sources that they are late paying affiliates. I am not an affiliate so I will label this as a rumor in fairness. But given that I trust my sources, I consider this a real warning sign.

Despite my respect for your opinion, I will disagree in this case. Unsophisticated players should be worried and should look for another place to play. There are other good MGs where they don't have to worry about such things. If they have not played at 32Red for example, they are better off there.

I understand your opinion but I live in Texas. I heard much the same thing about Enron.

imho,
Stanford.

 

[profiler]

The new T&C have taken effect on or around wednesday the 16th of march 2005 if i am correct. Anyway, this GBP issue should not be hard to solve. If necessary i will query one of the message boards for someone will have a copy.

 

[The Dude]

This strikes me as totally unwarranted. If the casino terms at the time said you had to deposit in your own currency then fair enough. If they didn't they why not deposit in whichever currency you choose. I'm a Brit but often deposit in dollars, depending on how lucky I'm feeling (not very when it comes to playing slots!). What's wrong with exploiting bonuses? Isn't that why everyone takes up a casino sign-up bonus? Why wouldn't you deposit in a currency that makes the bonus a larger amount of money? (assuming you're not going to be murdered by Neteller currency conversion fees)

Many of us play in dollars because we are used to it. It was only until this mast year or so that some casinos began to accept Euros and the Pound. I play primarily with USD because Im used to it. I see no reason to switch to Euros unless I have to. I would just lose more money this way So no, I personally would not deposit in a currency that makes the bonus a larger amount. In fact, I rarely take up bonuses anyway to include signup bonuses.

I DO see it as taking advantage of the casino since this currency option is set up as a convenience for those people in other countries that wish to play in their own currencies. I dont believe that casino operators invest a shit load of time and effort to have this set up to get Joe Blow from Spoonville Alabama to deposit in GPDs. Obviously this is something that gets flagged on the casino side, and if this is something that you (third person plural) regularly do, youre probably going to have issues with the casino because they are going to have issues with you.

Just keep encouraging Integrity to think what they're doing's reasonable & you've got a better chance of getting your flood of complaints! How does that Chinese curse about being careful what you wish for go?

Who said anything about wishing? Believe me, I have much better things to do. I just want legitimate issues dealt with swiftly and fairly.

This thread continues to stray and devolve.

Sort of like Devo?

As for the T&Cs, this is a new addition; checking Googles cached page (10 March) some of these stipulations are not there.

Good post ScurvyDog. Im not sure how much is applicable, but you have made some excellent points.

 

[jpsartre]

The Grand Hotel group explicitly disallows that you play in unless you're in the UK-zone. Should be easy enough to do if the casino doesn't want players to take advantage of a bigger bonus.

 

[Black21Jack]

The Grand Hotel group explicitly disallows that you play in unless you're in the UK-zone. Should be easy enough to do if the casino doesn't want players to take advantage of a bigger bonus.

I play in GBP at all the casinos within this group. There is no problem with this unless you try and claim a bonus which I never do, and made it clear with support when I opened the accounts. In fact I had accounts in dollars and had to talk with support to have them close my dollar accounts so I could go in and open new GBP accounts. They were very helpful in getting this done.

 

[caruso]

Whoa, "Integrity Casinos Take Stand Against Bonus Scum"?

Try this one:

"Integrity casinos go the way of Golden Palace, Tropika and Goodfellas before them, "auditing" accounts on the basis of huge losses sustained from badly-conceived promotions they'd just LOVE to blame the players for taking up, with a view to confiscating winnings."

That would be my own press release.

In the first place, I have to agree that this group would appear to be in trouble, new casino notwithstanding. The one is not exclusive of the other. We have no knowledge of the license-arrangements between Microgaming and licensee, and short funds do not seem to preclude the possibility of a new operation, required for an influx of cash on the part of a desperate group. In fact, it seems perfectly sound business sense - Microgaming are not about to watch a long-time licensee, now in financial schtuck, to go down the pan without offering them a helping hand.

In the second place, audits are old news and they INVARIABLY spell disaster. Golden Palace pulled an "audit" before switching to Cytech and leaving at least $150,000 in unpaid debts; Tropika vanished into the sunset after a similar scenario - on which occasion Microgaming stepped up to the plate, as they did after Goodfella's "audit", after THAT casino folded. Then there was Gaming Club - same deal, heavy losses from an ill-conceived promo. They paid up after INSISTING they would not and were in the right! Now we have Cooks pulling an audit - and we're supposed to asume everything is fine? Why? History suggests they're in trouble - and history does not lie.

In the third place, why is this latest "audit" receiving such positive spin? This is nothing to do with "cleaning house" - Golden Palace et al all did the same, and I don't recall too many people saying that it was a particularly edifying move on the part of a forward-thinking operator back then. Rather, they were hung, drawn and quartered from all angles. The circumstances here are IDENTICAL, just on a much lower scale: players took bonuses; played; won; casino suffered heavy losses; casino "audited" and implied (thus far not carried out, I believe) that bonus funds would be confiscated (read "stolen"). THIS IS NOT NEW.

No, sorry folks, but this is just more of the same dirty tricks of years gone by.

"Cooks Threaten To Pull A Golden Palace."

Now THERE'S your headline.

Lastly, the facts here are simple: if a player plays by the rules, he is paid and THEN barred. It matters not one jot whethers he's " sharp" or a moron. He is NOT robbed. If this group fails to honour a single cashout of a rightfully-owed player, they belong in the rogue-pit. The nature of their behaviour thus far puts them well on the way - and I would advise NOONE to deposit a red cent here until this is resolved, by casino or PWC if they DO end up folding - but they can be inevitably redeemed if they, or someone acting on their behalf, pays up.

Otherwise, sayonara Integrity.

 

[dirk_dangerous]

This is a bit surprising, but I agree with most of Carusos above comments. I doubt anyone could be "abusing" Cooks current promotions; as I understand it, they just aren't that good. However, I haven't played at Cooks in long time and I haven't recently read the current terms of their promotions. I find it hard to believe anyone is taking vast sums out of their casinos.

The more likely scenario is what another poster mentioned above. The separate "bonus account" system is so complicated, cryptic and time-consuming most regular players are too overwhelmed to bother depositing at Cooks. Ive read advanced physics textbooks that were easier to understand. Moreover, even regular gamblers understand the difference between a real bonus and a fake bonus.

Frankly, any casino that overwhelms its customers with tedious details and pages of needless instructions is destined to lose customers and eventually go out of business. Lets face facts: the separate bonus account business model is ill-conceived and should be scraped by every casino that uses it.

Besides,there are better ways to structure promotions. If any casino needs advice on these methods, they can Email me. Ill be glad to help, but my consulting fees start at $2000 an hour + expenses ;-)


Cheers,
Dirk

 

[Wes Side]

I DO see it as taking advantage of the casino since this currency option is set up as a convenience for those people in other countries that wish to play in their own currencies. I don’t believe that casino operators invest a shit load of time and effort to have this set up to get Joe Blow from Spoonville Alabama to deposit in GPDs.

If they don't want Joe Blow depositing in GPD, casino operators should use some of that shit load of time and effort setting it up to make it perfectly clear in their T&C (which takes five minutes to do) or have the software not allow it to obvious addresses such as U.S. ones.

If a casino is too cheap or dumb not to hire someone to look at how much a certain action might cost them, then, just like any other business, it's generally their own fault if they take a loss higher than expected. Reminds me of the big "blackjack pays 2:1" promotions a few casinos did years ago and got their clocks cleaned. They could have very easily and cheaply found out beforehand that it was not a good idea. Casinos already have a license to print money. If they are dumb enough to screw that up, then it's on them.

I've played casinos in alternative forms of currency, partly for the increased bonus, but also it can be more fun. It's a minor thing, similar to going to Canada and buying things with "toonies" and "loonies" instead of dollars.

These casinos make people jump through hoops just to figure out how getting a bonus even works, and then with the often very high wagering requirements, the casino winds up keeping a good portion of the offered bonus money anyway. And with high wagering requirements, the risk of busting out is very real, and then no bonus is paid out at all.

If the Cook's group keeps a single cent of anyone's bonus money or winnings, I expect they will be pretty much through. They offered a bonus, people took them up on it, and now they cry foul. If someone has multiple accounts at one casino, that's different, and maybe that really is the reason for the audit, that they think all of the losses are from a small group using multiple fake names and addresses. I think it's simply that word got out about how to have a good chance at making money from their bonuses and they weren't expecting that many new players using their brains.

 

[Timer]

If the current Captain Cooks/Casino Classic situation isn't resolved to my satisfaction by Friday then I will officially "Pitch a Bitch."

I've waited long enough. They are stalling, plain and simple. It's been over ten days.

I reiterate: I thoroughly read the T&C before playing. I did nothing wrong.

As far as I'm concerned they haven't got a leg to stand on.

Pay up.

 

[wobble33]

guys
gee whizz, i used to love this casino..........but reading this thread........i wont be back. you cant just take peoples money off them because they have won via the bonus account playing ex number of hands to meet the wr? i remember when wagering was x20 for black jack and video poker, just about a few months back..........now x45, and still moaning because people win! pleased bryan didnt hit his 10k win off video poker at casino kingdom when wr was x45, but bryan probally didnt play with a bonus. but lets say you do hit a massive win in bonus account with x45 wr, u would have no chance of keeping it. then if you played black jack for days on end, to keep this bonus, u get classed as a sharp player??? something not right here i think, anyway just my 2p worth..

 

[paul1]

The more likely scenario is what another poster mentioned above. The separate "bonus account" system is so complicated, cryptic and time-consuming most regular players are too overwhelmed to bother depositing at Cooks. Ive read advanced physics textbooks that were easier to understand.

lol, you can say THAT again. omg, I was looking at them about six months ago and thought to myself, "who needs this crap?" I was TOTALLY confused.