Brexit - whats the difference.....

[ChopleyIOM]

Port of Dover declares a critical incident, blames the French border control for not being adequately staffed, as post-Brexit there are border checks that simply didn't exist before.

Dover itself reported as being completely gridlocked, four hour queues to get to the port. Authorities now advising people not to even bother trying to get there, whatever travel plans they might have.

 

[interlog]

Port of Dover declares a critical incident, blames the French border control for not being adequately staffed, as post-Brexit there are border checks that simply didn't exist before.

Dover itself reported as being completely gridlocked, four hour queues to get to the port. Authorities now advising people not to even bother trying to get there, whatever travel plans they might have.

View attachment 170251

I guess that Brexit is to blame too that the French border control is not adequately staffed?

Why is the Eurotunnel not experiencing the same problems? Having checked their website, all is running there without delays

 

[interlog]

Port of Dover declares a critical incident, blames the French border control for not being adequately staffed, as post-Brexit there are border checks that simply didn't exist before.

Dover itself reported as being completely gridlocked, four hour queues to get to the port. Authorities now advising people not to even bother trying to get there, whatever travel plans they might have.

View attachment 170251

As to border checks..... even before Brexit when I travelled from Stansted to Eindhoven and back, there was passport control either side

 

[bamberfishcake]

Okay was thinking of a simpler way to put things. So let's ask Chopley for your honest opinion on this idea as i believe you are an intelligent man.

Let's forget about Covid , Brexit and all the other stuff going on .

Say you owned an airline. What in your honest opinion would cause your airline most damage.

1. Having more red tape, delays entering other countries and added expenses.

Or 2. Not being able to enter any countries at all. Having all your flights grounded for a year. Having to lay-off your staff as no income etc.

So would you say 1 or 2. I know just about everyone would say obviously number 2 would cause more damage. Do you agree or are you still saying number 1.

Its 2! I know its 2! Am I right?

 

[ChopleyIOM]

As to border checks..... even before Brexit when I travelled from Stansted to Eindhoven and back, there was passport control either side

Yes but it's a slower and more involved process now.

 

[interlog]

Yes but it's a slower and more involved process now.

I disagree.

Before Brexit, check in at Eindhoven airport, go through security, wait in airport, when flight called go through passport control and board flight. On arrival at Stansted disembark plane, go through passport control, pick up baggage.

Post Brexit, same process

Nothing has changed

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Okay was thinking of a simpler way to put things. So let's ask Chopley for your honest opinion on this idea as i believe you are an intelligent man.

Let's forget about Covid , Brexit and all the other stuff going on .

Say you owned an airline. What in your honest opinion would cause your airline most damage.

1. Having more red tape, delays entering other countries and added expenses.

Or 2. Not being able to enter any countries at all. Having all your flights grounded for a year. Having to lay-off your staff as no income etc.

So would you say 1 or 2. I know just about everyone would say obviously number 2 would cause more damage. Do you agree or are you still saying number 1.

Both are damaging, Covid had a hugely disruptive effect on the world's economy, no one's arguing against that (I'm certainly not).

However the UK travel industry itself is reporting that Brexit has been an additional disaster on top of Covid, it's not whether it's 'more bad' than Covid, they can both be really bad at the same time.

I've just gone back and re-read the posts and at no point do I say Brexit has been worse than Covid, the report itself says that the impact has gone 'way beyond' the Covid impact which I take to mean that as Covid recedes, the long term impacts of Brexit are becoming more visible.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

I disagree.

Before Brexit, check in at Eindhoven airport, go through security, wait in airport, when flight called go through passport control and board flight. On arrival at Stansted disembark plane, go through passport control, pick up baggage.

Post Brexit, same process

Nothing has changed

Well, apart from the Port of Dover declaring a major incident and telling people not to bother turning up for their holidays.

 

[interlog]

Well, apart from the Port of Dover declaring a major incident and telling people not to bother turning up for their holidays.

No such problems with the tunnel, but then again that costs a little more than a ferry crossing

 

[dunover]

Well, apart from the Port of Dover declaring a major incident and telling people not to bother turning up for their holidays.

The usual half-baked post omitting the 'inconvenient' facts. In this case, it's because the FRENCH have border police issues and are only manning 6 of their 12 channels. D'oh.

 

[interlog]

Well, apart from the Port of Dover declaring a major incident and telling people not to bother turning up for their holidays.

That same chap Simon Calder was on TV this morning reporting on the travel chaos on the UK road network. No shit Sherlock, start of school holidays so what did people expect?!

Or is that down to Brexit too?

 

[ChopleyIOM]

The usual half-baked post omitting the 'inconvenient' facts. In this case, it's because the FRENCH have border police issues and are only manning 6 of their 12 channels. D'oh.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story eh dunover?

Look, I've even drawn a little man pointing to where I say that. He has an arrow for a hand, which is convenient.

 

[interlog]

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story eh dunover?

Look, I've even drawn a little man pointing to where I say that. He has an arrow for a hand, which is convenient.

View attachment 170253

So nothing to do with Brexit then because those border controls where in place before Brexit too.

 

[paul7388]

Its 2! I know its 2! Am I right?

View attachment 170252

Wow you still got it wrong.

 

[dunover]

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story eh dunover?

Look, I've even drawn a little man pointing to where I say that. He has an arrow for a hand, which is convenient.

View attachment 170253

Every time you try and be more condescending and clever you make a bigger fool of yourself.

The FRENCH controls in the UK were there decades before the Brexit vote. As a result of the Sangatte Protocol, starting from 1994, when travelling from the UK to France by Eurotunnel Shuttle (road vehicle trains), French immigration and customs checks both take place before departing from the Eurotunnel Folkestone Terminal, rather than on arrival in France.

So tell me how you've established this 28-year old set-up is a result of Brexit? We're all dying to hear it.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

So nothing to do with Brexit then because those border controls where in place before Brexit too.

'Nothing to do with Brexit' is the absolute best case scenario now isn't it? No one's even pretending anymore that it's delivered anything positive whatsoever (or indeed that it ever will), the best it can manage is THIS SHIT THING IS NOTHING TO DO WITH BREXIT, HONEST MATE.

The process to get through passports is, according to the news report, slower than it used to be pre-Brexit, so if the same number of people turn up to go on holiday as before, it will take them longer, and require more staff, to process them.

 

[interlog]

'Nothing to do with Brexit' is the absolute best case scenario now isn't it? No one's even pretending anymore that it's delivered anything positive whatsoever (or indeed that it ever will), the best it can manage is THIS SHIT THING IS NOTHING TO DO WITH BREXIT, HONEST MATE.

The process to get through passports is, according to the news report, slower than it used to be pre-Brexit, so if the same number of people turn up to go on holiday as before, it will take them longer, and require more staff, to process them.

View attachment 170254

Well from my own experience the process of going through passport control is the same before and after Brexit. Absolutely no difference whatsoever.

I don't care what Simon Calder says because I can imagine him thriving on bad travel news related stories because that earns him money. If there were no travel problems he wouldn't be wheeled out in front of the cameras and not earning his money.

 

[interlog]

The simple fact is that you have more people travelling abroad due to the Covid travel restrictions being lifted. This puts pressure on that industry that was slow to react recruiting staff for this.

Nothing to do with Brexit whatsoever, it is happening across all parts in the world.

 

[interlog]

In other BREAKING NEWS:

Due to Brexit, Orlando theme parks are struggling to recruit staff:

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[ChopleyIOM]

Every time you try and be more condescending and clever you make a bigger fool of yourself.

The FRENCH controls in the UK were there decades before the Brexit vote. As a result of the Sangatte Protocol, starting from 1994, when travelling from the UK to France by Eurotunnel Shuttle (road vehicle trains), French immigration and customs checks both take place before departing from the Eurotunnel Folkestone Terminal, rather than on arrival in France.

So tell me how you've established this 28-year old set-up is a result of Brexit? We're all dying to hear it.

Yes I know all that, and I also know that it's the French controls in the UK we're talking about.

I'd be interested to know if Dover has ever had to declare a critical incident before.

I guess the French have TAKEN BACK CONTROL of their borders too.

 

[interlog]

From that same article linked to above:

"But the company had difficulty filling hospitality and food and beverage jobs, a problem that has factored into Disney’s continuing efforts to limit crowds, he said. In May, CFO Christine McCarthy said Disney was dealing with “rising wages” and a “tighter labor market.”

 

[ChopleyIOM]

From that same article linked to above:

"But the company had difficulty filling hospitality and food and beverage jobs, a problem that has factored into Disney’s continuing efforts to limit crowds, he said. In May, CFO Christine McCarthy said Disney was dealing with “rising wages” and a “tighter labor market.”

'Look over there, a bee!'

 

[interlog]

Yes I know all that, and I also know that it's the French controls in the UK we're talking about.

I'd be interested to know if Dover has ever had to declare a critical incident before.

I guess the French have TAKEN BACK CONTROL of their borders too.

No they just continued with their border controls as they did before Brexit.

 

[interlog]

'Look over there, a bee!'

Then explain why across the world there are challenges facing the hospitality and travel industry, something that you are linking with Brexit hence you posting in this Brexit topic?

 

[interlog]

Hot from the press.

Due to Brexit, Poland is struggling with labour shortages having to resort to employing Ukrainian refugees

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[interlog]

Just in:

German airports struggling with staffing and looks to seek employment from the oversees market to resolve this.

A representative from Dusseldorf airport stated that Brexit is to blame for this and is glad to see the back of Boris Johnson

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[aceking123]

Airports sadly only have themselves to blame, when you kick your staff to the curb, what does one expect really, yer were come back running to help you out.

Far more going on.............

 

[dunover]

Just in:

German airports struggling with staffing and looks to seek employment from the oversees market to resolve this.

A representative from Dusseldorf airport stated that Brexit is to blame for this and is glad to see the back of Boris Johnson

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Chopley is an expert at decontextualising his posts by omission of unwelcome facts.

He lives outside the EU and has done for years in a tax haven yet feels he can lecture us about tax burdens and the necessity of remaining in the EU.

Now, as someone who goes over/under the channel at least once a year since 2015, I can speak with a least a little authority gained by personal experience as opposed to spouting from a distance or quoting favourable remoaner social media acolytes. So, let me tell you, it's exactly the same now as 2015/16 aside from the fact that the UK passport holders are separated from EU ones, as you'd expect. Same staff, same miserable po-faced French and British border/passports controls in the same booths. Oh sorry, I forgot - you can't bring unlimited tobacco and wine back into the UK any more. A real hardship.

 

[mack341]

From that twitter thread Chop posted:

Travel Expert
@SimonCalder
opens the session “Covid clearly camouflaged an awful lot of Brexit and I think it’s very important to separate what the effects were.

Now COVID obviously as we heard from Luke crushed the travel industry and made the restart very very difficult.

--------------

Seems to me Calder might have an anti brexit agenda rather than providing 100% unbiased factual insights on the travel industry, baggage handling comes up a lot in that thread, so how did the travel industry cope before the eastern european countries lower cost labour force entered the EU, I think they coped alright.

We can change bits of red tape our side, but the real source of any problems needs to be identified.

 

[interlog]

Chopley is an expert at decontextualising his posts by omission of unwelcome facts.

He lives outside the EU and has done for years in a tax haven yet feels he can lecture us about tax burdens and the necessity of remaining in the EU.

Now, as someone who goes over/under the channel at least once a year since 2015, I can speak with a least a little authority gained by personal experience as opposed to spouting from a distance or quoting favourable remoaner social media acolytes. So, let me tell you, it's exactly the same now as 2015/16 aside from the fact that the UK passport holders are separated from EU ones, as you'd expect. Same staff, same miserable po-faced French and British border/passports controls in the same booths. Oh sorry, I forgot - you can't bring unlimited tobacco and wine back into the UK any more. A real hardship.

True, but the cigarettes you can bring in now can be purchased tax free

 

[dunover]

From that twitter thread Chop posted:

Travel Expert
@SimonCalder
opens the session “Covid clearly camouflaged an awful lot of Brexit and I think it’s very important to separate what the effects were.

Now COVID obviously as we heard from Luke crushed the travel industry and made the restart very very difficult.

--------------

Seems to me Calder might have an anti brexit agenda rather than providing 100% unbiased factual insights on the travel industry, baggage handling comes up a lot in that thread, so how did the travel industry cope before the eastern european countries lower cost labour force entered the EU, I think they coped alright.

We can change bits of red tape our side, but the real source of any problems needs to be identified.

Well, that's just it. There were terrible problems before Brexit, usually caused by the anarchic French unions going on strike if the coffee was too cold or the office heater had broken etc. Or technical problems with Eurotunnel or trains. The difference is, nowadays as we see with @chopley there's a popular remoaner narrative in play to make these issues assume the context of Brexit, irrespective of facts.

 

[interlog]

Well, that's just it. There were terrible problems before Brexit, usually caused by the anarchic French unions going on strike if the coffee was too cold or the office heater had broken etc. Or technical problems with Eurotunnel or trains. The difference is, nowadays as we see with @chopley there's a popular remoaner narrative in play to make these issues assume the context of Brexit, irrespective of facts.

You mean things such as the French airtraffic controllers striking it resulting in flight cancellations?

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[ChopleyIOM]

Well this guy is saying that since Brexit all passports need to be checked and stamped, and this wasn't the case before Brexit, so it's a lot slower now.

I can't say one way or another, I've only ever been abroad once, frankly it was too hot and I didn't like it very much so I've never bothered again and I hope I never have to.

 

[interlog]

Well this guy is saying that since Brexit all passports need to be checked and stamped, and this wasn't the case before Brexit, so it's a lot slower now.

I can't say one way or another, I've only ever been abroad once, frankly it was too hot and I didn't like it very much so I've never bothered again and I hope I never have to.

For a travel expert he doesn't know what he is talking about.

Not once has my passport been stamped since Brexit when travelling to Europe.

Passport checked, yes, but that also happened prior to Brexit

 

[ChopleyIOM]

For a travel expert he doesn't know what he is talking about.

Not once has my passport been stamped since Brexit when travelling to Europe.

Passport checked, yes, but that also happened prior to Brexit

Well according to this you should be getting it stamped.

Maybe a lot of people at Dover are getting theirs stamped.

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[interlog]

Well according to this you should be getting it stamped.

Maybe a lot of people at Dover are getting theirs stamped.

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View attachment 170257

Well they shouldn't as it was abolished recently:

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[ChopleyIOM]

Well they shouldn't as it was abolished recently:

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Apparently not up and running yet, was scheduled for May, now put back to September.

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[interlog]

Apparently not up and running yet, was scheduled for May, now put back to September.

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Edit ignore misread it

Doesn't change the fact that my passport has neve been stamped.

Besides stamping a passport does not take extra time when it is already checked and is not the reason for the delays

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Why are some people so keen to blame everything on Brexit ?

These people make me more and more convinced that we were correct to leave the EU.

 

[mcgameboy]

News just in.........

Oil prices skyrocketing....Brexit is to blame

Food prices skyrocketing....Brexit is to blame

UK just had a heatwave....Brexit is to blame

I slept in for work this morning because I forgot to set my alarm....Brexit is to blame

I didn't like my morning coffee because I put too much milk in it....Brexit is to blame

I had to leave the room I was sitting in because I farted and it was a humdinger....Brexit is to blame

Water is wet....Brexit is to blame

Joe Biden is an incoherent, demented, bumbling old fool....Brexit is to blame

Justin Trudeau is a thoroughly annoying cockwomble....Brexit is to blame

Jacinda Ardern only got second place in a recent Mr. Ed lookalike contest....Brexit is to blame

IOM suffers from a massive surge in Covid cases because of the amount of visitors to the TT races....Brexit is to blame

Half the CM membership is rolling their eyes and/or pissing themselves with laughter every time Choppers posts in this thread....Brexit is to blame

Oh. I finally found something for which Brexit IS the actual culprit. Yay. Go me!

 

[mack341]

I haven't got a problem with someone [like calder] pointing out any new travel issue arisen since brexit, but the implication that it's unsolvable other than some form of reversing brexit is not logical. [jumping the gun at least]

The implementation of brexit by the uk govt is not necessarily the same as the brexit voted for by the public, no doubt there'll be teething problems that need ironing out.

 

[dunover]

Yes, it does get stamped, mine did 2 weeks ago, both ways on the UK and Dutch sides. It ALWAYS got checked anyway as a UK resident, as we weren't in Schengen, now the difference is that 2 seconds is taken to stamp it WHILE it's being checked, makes no fucking difference to the time of the process.

 

[interlog]

With regards the stamping of passports, just realised I don't have a UK passport hence the lack of stamps I guess. I checked my wife's passport and she does have stamps when travelling to Europe.

Strangely enough, she stood at the same passport control I stood at for the same period of time so the stamping of passports resulting in the travel delays is a load of old bollocks.

When we recently arrived in Crete a Dutch flight arrived too. They too had to queue at immigration, they couldn't just walk from the plane straight to their hotel. They may not need a passport but they would need some form of ID.

Same for the way out. Everybody had to go through the passport control on exiting the island. Europeans also had to do this.

 

[dunover]

With regards the stamping of passports, just realised I don't have a UK passport hence the lack of stamps I guess. I checked my wife's passport and she does have stamps when travelling to Europe.

Strangely enough, she stood at the same passport control I stood at for the same period of time so the stamping of passports resulting in the travel delays is a load of old bollocks.

When we recently arrived in Crete a Dutch flight arrived too. They too had to queue at immigration, they couldn't just walk from the plane straight to their hotel. They may not need a passport but they would need some form of ID.

Same for the way out. Everybody had to go through the passport control on exiting the island. Europeans also had to do this.

Yes, but you've got to remember @ChopleyIOM 's world experience is derived from social media commentaries and doesn't necessarily reflect reality. As experienced by us lot who do actually travel.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Yes, but you've got to remember @ChopleyIOM 's world experience is derived from social media commentaries and doesn't necessarily reflect reality. As experienced by us lot who do actually travel.

This is why social media is so dangerous in so many ways. It actually shapes how people think. Any low IQ pleb can have an opinion on there and make it look like fact. Then you get echo chambers forming and the whole thing snowballs.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Yes, but you've got to remember @ChopleyIOM 's world experience is derived from social media commentaries and doesn't necessarily reflect reality. As experienced by us lot who do actually travel.

I travel regularly, from Ramsey to Douglas and then back again. Sometimes I go to Peel as well.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

OK, so the French have now responded to this. It is true that only six of the twelve border posts were manned first thing this morning, their intention was to have all twelve of them operational, as they knew there'd be loads of Brits going off on their holidays, but a glitch elsewhere in the system kept six of them unmanned for a couple of hours.

By the time they had all twelve of the posts operational, the queue had already built up to epic proportions, and given Dover's constrained capacity and general unsuitability for this kind of throughput when even the tiniest thing goes wrong, things stayed pretty fucked up all day.

Dover kind of 'worked', just about, when the UK was in the EU, now we're outside of the EU, even slowing things down a little bit, creates chaos.

French officers used to glance at UK passports. Now they have to stamp each one to make sure that only the Brits with a right to do so are spending long periods in France. It’s called “taking back control of borders”.

The French put out a press release earlier today to explain it, this is basically a translation of what it said:

 

[interlog]

OK, so the French have now responded to this. It is true that only six of the twelve border posts were manned first thing this morning, their intention was to have all twelve of them operational, as they knew there'd be loads of Brits going off on their holidays, but a glitch elsewhere in the system kept six of them unmanned for a couple of hours.

By the time they had all twelve of the posts operational, the queue had already built up to epic proportions, and given Dover's constrained capacity and general unsuitability for this kind of throughput when even the tiniest thing goes wrong, things stayed pretty fucked up all day.

Dover kind of 'worked', just about, when the UK was in the EU, now we're outside of the EU, even slowing things down a little bit, creates chaos.

French officers used to glance at UK passports. Now they have to stamp each one to make sure that only the Brits with a right to do so are spending long periods in France. It’s called “taking back control of borders”.

The French put out a press release earlier today to explain it, this is basically a translation of what it said:

French Embassy uses different confrontational language with regards the situation:

 

[ChopleyIOM]

French Embassy uses different confrontational language with regards the situation:

I don't see anything confrontational about that, they knew it would be really busy, they wanted to have all twelve border posts manned, something went wrong and they couldn't for a couple of hours, and there were massive queues as a result.

It's a factual statement dealing with the realities of what happened.

 

[interlog]

I don't see anything confrontational about that, they knew it would be really busy, they wanted to have all twelve border posts manned, something went wrong and they couldn't for a couple of hours, and there were massive queues as a result.

It's a factual statement dealing with the realities of what happened.

Correct, I was meant to write "less confrontational language" unlike the translation tweet you posted which I am wondering which French person in authority would write