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Bonus issue at ComeOn

textex

Banned User
Joined
Oct 14, 2011
Location
Norway
Just thought id say give a warning about comeon gambling site. Signed up there a few weeks ago and chose their 110% poker bonus, and thought everything was ok. After a however i learn that everything aint all right. They had forgot to write that the min deposit to get the bonus was on 25$. The ammount i had deposited in my local currency was like 24$. I dont feel that their miswriting should affect me so i contact support, which cant do anything else than forwarding it to what they claim to be their poker manager, which denies to give me anything back.

My impression of the site doesent get any better when the support refuse to let me get in touch with anyone higher up in the system. They dont even have a phone number on their site, just a live support, and a callback form. So my advice is to stay clear of this shady group of liars.
 
Just thought id say give a warning about comeon gambling site. Signed up there a few weeks ago and chose their 110% poker bonus, and thought everything was ok. After a however i learn that everything aint all right. They had forgot to write that the min deposit to get the bonus was on 25$. The ammount i had deposited in my local currency was like 24$. I dont feel that their miswriting should affect me so i contact support, which cant do anything else than forwarding it to what they claim to be their poker manager, which denies to give me anything back.

My impression of the site doesent get any better when the support refuse to let me get in touch with anyone higher up in the system. They dont even have a phone number on their site, just a live support, and a callback form. So my advice is to stay clear of this shady group of liars.

Well, that was to the point.
You are more than entitled to your opinion but may I suggest you tone down your criticism. Its generally frowned upon to use such wording in describing a casino. You just may well end up with some friendly advice from the members here. Take it on the chin!
 
You mean the 110% Poker bonus up to 600$.If you go to "Bonuses atm" it clearly says "Min dep 25$".

I find Comeon to be a very good casino.Never heard complaints about em before.Well thats just me.

Yeah one place at the site it states 25, another place 10$, and yet another place on the sites another ammount in my local currency.
 
Well, that was to the point.
You are more than entitled to your opinion but may I suggest you tone down your criticism. Its generally frowned upon to use such wording in describing a casino.

From wikipedia: "A lie (also called prevarication, falsehood) is a type of deception in the form of an untruthful statement, especially with the intention to deceive others.", which is just what they did. Tricking me into depositing offering a bonus, and then denying to give it afterwards.

And about the shady thing. Yeah they are. They refuse to let me talk to anyone else than some outsourced support who cant do anything.

To be honest i dont feel that that criticism was very harsh. I coulda called them a group of incompetent ***** aswell.

And to whoever changed the subject, this issnt a bonus issue, but a matter of principle that a proffesional part shouldnt be decieving customers like that.
 
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Max Deposit: $545,46 (396,35 €)
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That's what it says.Don't know where you reed the 10$ Min dep.It's unfortune that you deposited 1$ to little.
Is there a chance you have misreed or something,cause i couldn't find the 10 min dep anywhere?
You could send a email but i doubt it would help since the poker manager denied any bonuses.
 
Yeah one place at the site it states 25, another place 10$, and yet another place on the sites another ammount in my local currency.

I have never tried them, but I checked their Norwegian site and as CakeKing said, it clearly says that the min deposit for the poker bonus is $25. The general min dep on ComeOn is about $10.

To call them shady group of liars is highly inappropriate.
 
And to whoever changed the subject, this issnt a bonus issue, but a matter of principle that a proffesional part shouldnt be decieving customers like that.

I changed the title because "Don't play at comeon" wasn't descriptive of the issue. Plus you posted it in the Bonus Issues forum :D
 
I have never tried them, but I checked their Norwegian site and as CakeKing said, it clearly says that the min deposit for the poker bonus is $25. The general min dep on ComeOn is about $10.

To call them shady group of liars is highly inappropriate.

Since you think im bsing with ya, heres what the chat said.

Comeon: Ok, jag gick över nu på den norska sidan, och ser att det inte står samma information som på den svenska sidan
xxxxx: Usd min 15 Max 35
Comeon: Det ska ändras så att det står minsta insättning för att få pokerbonusen på startsidan.

They might have changed it after i made them aware of it though. But they shouldnt let the customers pay because of their own damn errors. Especially when its so many of them.

And no calling them a shady group of liars aint inapproriate. They refuse to let u talk to anyone higher up in the system, they refuse to give you any info about owners etc. If you dont call that shady, then nothing is. I know drug dealers thats more open about their buisness than that ffs.
 
You could send a email but i doubt it would help since the poker manager denied any bonuses.

Ive told them to drop dead and f*ck off. If i can't trust the site i play on, i might aswell go play monopoly. Ive tried talking gentely to them, but they lie me right in the face claiming that they can't do anything about it. One thing would be to say they wouldn't, but can't? That either means no1 is in control of the site, or that someone is talking crap.
 
Ive told them to drop dead and f*ck off. If i can't trust the site i play on, i might aswell go play monopoly. Ive tried talking gentely to them, but they lie me right in the face claiming that they can't do anything about it. One thing would be to say they wouldn't, but can't? That either means no1 is in control of the site, or that someone is talking crap.

Very grown-up of you to be so mature about it.

We're talking about $1 here and your claim that they lied about the min deposit amount.

Sheesh. The terms clearly state the minimum deposit required for the bonus. The fact that you may have confused that with general min deposit accepted at ComeOn is your fault not theirs.

Try directing your anger toward the cause of the problem - you.
 
This is becoming all to common now days in people and I find it a little worrying to be honest.

Why don't people take responsibility for there own actions. In this case it is Clear the T&C's were not followed. The min says $25 not $24 so the Casino is inder NO OBLIGATION to do anything in this case.

The above post sounds like you don't even accept that you were at fault. I'm sure the casino COULD change this and possibly give you the bonus based on your $24 deposit but honestly why would they want to??

I tell ya the times of " the customer is always right" has been well and truly lost.
 
Online casinos are a waste of time

In this case, fair enough.

What I have found 'common' is the amount of nonsense perpetrated by these online casinos. The level of customer support is abysmal. Worst of all, these online sites effectively 'steal'!

The only decent site seems to be Betfair. I'm not sure about their casino and other aspects, but their sport-betting page and trading concept is good.

Online casinos are a waste of time. If one must visit a casino, stick to brick and mortar ones.
 
I tell ya the times of " the customer is always right" has been well and truly lost.

Having worked in customer-facing operations in the dim and distant past I can tell you that whoever invented that mantra probably said "the customer thinks [he] is always right" but it's been twisted down the years - because a lot of the time they aren't right and many are arrogant, rude and treat those who are serving them like, well, servants.

You can probably see why I don't work in that area anymore ;)
 
Having worked in customer-facing operations in the dim and distant past I can tell you that whoever invented that mantra probably said "the customer thinks [he] is always right" but it's been twisted down the years - because a lot of the time they aren't right and many are arrogant, rude and treat those who are serving them like, well, servants.

You can probably see why I don't work in that area anymore ;)

A bit off topic...

The customer is 'always' right, irrespective of whether they're actually right or not. You see difficult customer at all levels - even CEOs have difficult customers. I work in the management consulting space and have had my fair share. Which is why I can't stand pathetic customer service.

You have 'customers' - you always do. You may not do front line work and have external customers, but you probably have 'internal' customers within your organisation. It's a matter of learning how to handle them.

Back on topic...
Online casinos don't see you as customers (they don't provide a service), but rather idiots whom they can bleed dry. Well, that's my first and last experience with an online casino.
 
A bit off topic...

The customer is 'always' right, irrespective of whether they're actually right or not. You see difficult customer at all levels - even CEOs have difficult customers. I work in the management consulting space and have had my fair share. Which is why I can't stand pathetic customer service.

You have 'customers' - you always do. You may not do front line work and have external customers, but you probably have 'internal' customers within your organisation. It's a matter of learning how to handle them.

Back on topic...
Online casinos don't see you as customers (they don't provide a service), but rather idiots whom they can bleed dry. Well, that's my first and last experience with an online casino.

hiya Macster,

I understand what you are saying but are you making an assumption based on ONE casino or ONE case only?

You can't really pass judgment on something based on one experience alone.
 
You know, initially, I really did think it was a one-off - a mistake by a particular casino, which was compounded by not-so-good customer service. Then, I did a Google search, found Casino Meister, realised that mine wasn't an isolated case (all sorts of issues at different sites). Hmmm... I see it as learning through my mistake and that of others. Thanks Casino Meister.
 
This is becoming all to common now days in people and I find it a little worrying to be honest.

Why don't people take responsibility for there own actions. In this case it is Clear the T&C's were not followed. The min says $25 not $24 so the Casino is inder NO OBLIGATION to do anything in this case.

The above post sounds like you don't even accept that you were at fault. I'm sure the casino COULD change this and possibly give you the bonus based on your $24 deposit but honestly why would they want to??

I tell ya the times of " the customer is always right" has been well and truly lost.

As i wrote to my countryman in the last post, comeons support admin that they written different things their Norwegian site, and the others. My account wassnt even in USD, so how do you expect me to follow a USD requirement i cant even find?

This woulda been so mutch easier if the casino had one english site, and english support. But instead their busy making half working sites in all kind of languages where your sure to get some errors.

Yeah, its a pity that "the customer is always right" are gone in the online casino buisness(thankfully it still exists at normal retailer who actually provide you a fysical thing for what you pay). But when the casinos only task is to have a functional, and easy site/software, i still expect them to provide it and take any blame when they screw up for the money they make on it.

May i ask if you guys make sure to read all the language versions of a gambling site when you go to one with many languages?
 
In this case, fair enough.

What I have found 'common' is the amount of nonsense perpetrated by these online casinos. The level of customer support is abysmal. Worst of all, these online sites effectively 'steal'!

Couldn't agree more. The worse thing is that alot of people willingly bend over and accept it. Thats why they are popping up like weeds. On the poker sites its funny to spot what the FTP was doing, not to talk about Ultimatebet and Absolutepoker. I hope the US government raids some casinos aswell in the future, would be fun to see whats going on behind the scene there.

Another funny coincidence i learned was when i cashed in 3 free chips at 3 different casinos on the same network some time i ago. I also played the same slot machine all the times, and its funny how i won 1-200 euros on all the 3 casinos at the start of the playtrough, then to have very bad "luck" nearing the end of the playtrough requirments. Random, i think not!
 
As i wrote to my countryman in the last post, comeons support admin that they written different things their Norwegian site, and the others. My account wassnt even in USD, so how do you expect me to follow a USD requirement i cant even find?

This woulda been so mutch easier if the casino had one english site, and english support. But instead their busy making half working sites in all kind of languages where your sure to get some errors.

Yeah, its a pity that "the customer is always right" are gone in the online casino buisness(thankfully it still exists at normal retailer who actually provide you a fysical thing for what you pay). But when the casinos only task is to have a functional, and easy site/software, i still expect them to provide it and take any blame when they screw up for the money they make on it.

May i ask if you guys make sure to read all the language versions of a gambling site when you go to one with many languages?


They have only 1 English site and support just so you know.

Just like same_old said:This is becoming all to common now days in people and I find it a little worrying to be honest.

Why don't people take responsibility for there own actions. In this case it is Clear the T&C's were not followed. The min says $25 not $24 so the Casino is inder NO OBLIGATION to do anything in this case.


I don't read every language.Only Finnish/English or Swedish
 
Ive told them to drop dead and f*ck off. If i can't trust the site i play on, i might aswell go play monopoly. Ive tried talking gentely to them, but they lie me right in the face claiming that they can't do anything about it. One thing would be to say they wouldn't, but can't? That either means no1 is in control of the site, or that someone is talking crap.

Why would you wish someone dead over a few dollars?

Most members find this type of behavior unacceptable and childish. There is no reason to act like a dick to a customer service rep. I'd suggest chilling out a bit.
 
They have only 1 English site and support just so you know.

Just like same_old said:This is becoming all to common now days in people and I find it a little worrying to be honest.

Why don't people take responsibility for there own actions. In this case it is Clear the T&C's were not followed. The min says $25 not $24 so the Casino is inder NO OBLIGATION to do anything in this case.


I don't read every language.Only Finnish/English or Swedish

I was directed to the norwegian site when i entered. Geez, i followed the TOS that they wrote when i signed up and deposited. That they made errors when they made the different language sites aint my problem, and i dont feel like it should go out on me.
 
Why would you wish someone dead over a few dollars?

Most members find this type of behavior unacceptable and childish. There is no reason to act like a dick to a customer service rep. I'd suggest chilling out a bit.

Its not the bucks that matters, its the principle. Stealing money doesen get any better just cause you wrote it was okay in the TOC located at another part of the site. I have more respect for robbers than these kind of guys, robbers are atleast honest about robbing you. He also lies me right in the face saying they can't do anything about it. That provokes me even more.
 
Its not the bucks that matters, its the principle. Stealing money doesen get any better just cause you wrote it was okay in the TOC located at another part of the site. I have more respect for robbers than these kind of guys, robbers are atleast honest about robbing you. He also lies me right in the face saying they can't do anything about it. That provokes me even more.

Obviously, you have never been a victim of a real crime. You are trivializing actual theft to a poorly written term on a gambling website. :rolleyes:
 
hi ive had a account with them for a while never had any problems whatsoever, good support aswell with good withdrawal times , you should have a read closely to deposits & bonuses , no good slagging them off , due to your oversight ,lesson learnt i would hope.
 
hi ive had a account with them for a while never had any problems whatsoever, good support aswell with good withdrawal times , you should have a read closely to deposits & bonuses , no good slagging them off , due to your oversight ,lesson learnt i would hope.

Didnt know they operated a site for blind people, as you obviously are. As i said 10 times now, the customer service admittet to having written different terms for the same promo on the different parts of the site.

Good support. If you think good support is denying to let you talk to anyone higher up in the system, not knowing what licence they got, denying to give any info at all on how to contact them apart from the live support, then i agree with you.
 
Obviously, you have never been a victim of a real crime. You are trivializing actual theft to a poorly written term on a gambling website. :rolleyes:

Tricking people into depositing on false terms just cause they can get away with it aint mutch better. And yeah i've been robbed with both a knife and a gun, but still it didnt feel as bad as getting ripped of by a casino like this.
 
Sry, i just dont like it when people pop into a debate not having a read a single post :)
This is not a debate; you come in here slagging off on a company that others have had experiences with. This is a forum and open to the entire membership. Anyone is free to come here and add to your claim, challenge it, or give you advice - as Mr. Jones was doing.

Me thinks this forum is not a good match for you.
 
Unless you have some proof this was a deliberate attempt to defraud you and not an honest mistake on a part of the site that the casino will correct, I suggest you are more careful about picking your words... especially when you start to disrerspect your fellow members here.

Pause and think about it for a second... do you honestly believe someone in casino management sat down one day and said: 'I have a great idea... lets not update this one translated page so that we can mess with customers who go there and then deposit between 10 and 25!. haha'. Is that really what you think happened here? All a casino is likely to gain in such a circumstance is 20 bucks and one annoyed customer. I know a lot of casino managers, but none who would consider that worthwhile.

Out of curiosity, as it's not clear from the thread... when you deposited and didn't get the bonus did you carry on playing anyway or try to withdraw the deposited funds?

I agree that the casino should have granted some leyway here and I would have expected them to make an exception especially considering you were only a dollar short, but the way you are approaching this is not winning many supporters to your cause.
 
This is not a debate; you come in here slagging off on a company that others have had experiences with. This is a forum and open to the entire membership. Anyone is free to come here and add to your claim, challenge it, or give you advice - as Mr. Jones was doing.

Me thinks this forum is not a good match for you.

This has grown into a debate. And debate ethics, or let me be clearer. All grown ups know they shouldnt enter a discussion having no clue what it is about. In the same way it would be stupid of me to challenge that cirrus is a rogue casino, cause i got some super bonuses there, not having tried to withdraw ofcourse.
 
A bit off topic...

The customer is 'always' right, irrespective of whether they're actually right or not.

Yes I was driving at the same point really...the art is to make the customer think they are always right. But that does depend on you as a business wanting that customer of course and I am sure that in any industry there are customers that are not wanted.

I looked at the OP here and the language and sentiment textex used in this thread and thought that maybe there is a chance that this casino was thinking that way.
 
Unless you have some proof this was a deliberate attempt to defraud you and not an honest mistake on a part of the site that the casino will correct, I suggest you are more careful about picking your words... especially when you start to disrerspect your fellow members here.

Pause and think about it for a second... do you honestly believe someone in casino management sat down one day and said: 'I have a great idea... lets not update this one translated page so that we can mess with customers who go there and then deposit between 10 and 25!. haha'. Is that really what you think happened here? All a casino is likely to gain in such a circumstance is 20 bucks and one annoyed customer. I know a lot of casino managers, but none who would consider that worthwhile.
Well it problably wasnt deliberate, but it was still one of the things that got me to deposit there in the first place.


Out of curiosity, as it's not clear from the thread... when you deposited and didn't get the bonus did you carry on playing anyway or try to withdraw the deposited funds?
Takes some time to get to know a new site, so i tried checking, didnt find anything, and contacted live support. She linked me here
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, and to another site who didnt give me any answers at all. And then told me the poker bonus would be released in increments when you play. I was fine with this, and didnt care to check anymore before i played a few thousand hands.

I agree that the casino should have granted some leyway here and I would have expected them to make an exception especially considering you were only a dollar short, but the way you are approaching this is not winning many supporters to your cause.

I tried being patient and friendly to the customer service not getting anything in return. CS had to forward everything to their poker manager who could only give answer trough the customer service back in return. And the answer was obviously a lie claiming that they couldn't like they didnt have control over their banking or something. And it was impossible to get in touch with anyone else than two customer service reps.

Anyways i've got out a warning about comeon based on my own experiences, and thats what i wanted with this thread. If anyone else feel like putting their money in the hands of a shady operation like that, they may also do that for what i care. Being based on Netent i do however belive there are 10s of better alternatives.
 
Anyways i've got out a warning about comeon based on my own experiences, and thats what i wanted with this thread. If anyone else feel like putting their money in the hands of a shady operation like that, they may also do that for what i care..

Now I may differ from others here but all this thread has really told me is that future posts of yours complaining about treatment should be taken with a grain of salt. It strikes me it's a small T&C anomaly that affected a $24 deposit in so much as you didn't get any 'free money'. Molehills and mountains in my opinion but it certainly doesn't make me think ComeOn did anything too bad.

I saw this post as "revenge" type of thing which as you may have guessed from responses, we don't encourage here ;)
 
Now I may differ from others here but all this thread has really told me is that future posts of yours complaining about treatment should be taken with a grain of salt. It strikes me it's a small T&C anomaly that affected a $24 deposit in so much as you didn't get any 'free money'. Molehills and mountains in my opinion but it certainly doesn't make me think ComeOn did anything too bad.

It issnt the just the tos thing, but its the whole package. I see that this site requires inhouse support and a rep on the forum to accreditate a casino, and i guess there's a reason for that? This site consisted of 3 outsourced cs people, and thats everyone they'll ever let you talk to. You wonder who owns the site, or whos the boss? Try figure that out and you win a cake.
 
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Ive told them to drop dead and f*ck off. If i can't trust the site i play on, i might aswell go play monopoly. Ive tried talking gentely to them, but they lie me right in the face claiming that they can't do anything about it. One thing would be to say they wouldn't, but can't? That either means no1 is in control of the site, or that someone is talking crap.

Why has this dude even be allowed to continue posting past this point? Posters have already said they read the terms and he was mistaken. His defensive in return is to say: The casino must have re-written the terms after I said something...... O really?

In that case I deposited a 100.00 at 3dice this week. Their site said I would get an extra 1,000 to play with at only 2xWR...I swear it...O no it's not there now? They must have re-written those terms to spite me...Those dame liars!!!!! :mad:

smiley-signs057.gif


edit: And in the end after his first few post who really cares if the casino made a minor mistake with the terms.
 
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Tricking people into depositing on false terms just cause they can get away with it aint mutch better. And yeah i've been robbed with both a knife and a gun, but still it didnt feel as bad as getting ripped of by a casino like this.

O really? Odd you must be that special case....seems I meet people each day at work that would disagree with you :rolleyes:
 
Textex,
You do not seem to realise you are making a total arse of yourself. I did try and warn you at the start of this thread.
Why dont you take some time out, reflect on this thread and perhaps you might even learn from this. Do you also realise that dealing with a problem in a rude and threatening manner will do you no favours at all. This is far from a debate as your just not listening. Take a look at yourself. All of us have/ had issues with casino,s but there are ways of dealing with it. This is not the way.
Chill out man.
 
Why has this dude even be allowed to continue posting past this point? Posters have already said they read the terms and he was mistaken. His defensive in return is to say: The casino must have re-written the terms after I said something...... O really?
You dont really get it, do you? Their live support has admitted to doing a mistake by writing from min deposit on their TOS. Ofcourse they change it when i made them aware of it. The problem is that i shouldnt suffer cause of their errors.

One thing woulda been if it stod a 1000% bonus with 1x rollover.

I do care about them doing a "minor" error. Thats cause all they paid for is to provide a site and some software. In the same way i complain if a resturant do a "minor" thing like loosing hair in my food or so.
 
O really? Odd you must be that special case....seems I meet people each day at work that would disagree with you :rolleyes:

Ofcourse im glad i dont live in a place full of rednecks going amok with guns like Texas, but atleast they dont hide on a banana Island behind a TOS saying they cant do whatever they feel like, like the most casinos.
 
Textex,
Do you also realise that dealing with a problem in a rude and threatening manner will do you no favours at all. Take a look at yourself. All of us have/ had issues with casino,s but there are ways of dealing with it.
What is it do deal with? My point with this thread is to warn others to stay away. I told comeon to close my account for good days ago.

And im gettin sick of people jumping in with post not having read the whole story. I think atleast 4 guys here have went into comeon just to post the same sentence telling that theres at 25$ min. deposit to the bonus, when i wrote a thousand times that i never used the english version of the site, and that they changed it in any case.
 
Ofcourse im glad i dont live in a place full of rednecks going amok with guns like Texas, but atleast they dont hide on a banana Island behind a TOS saying they cant do whatever they feel like, like the most casinos.

give it a rest youve been here 5 mintues & already pi$$ed off many forum members with being rude even though most of us was trying to help you or guide you , anyway your be banned shortly after these kind of comments )
 
Ofcourse im glad i dont live in a place full of rednecks going amok with guns like Texas, but atleast they dont hide on a banana Island behind a TOS saying they cant do whatever they feel like, like the most casinos.

Yea, those silly rednecks and their guns. Hell I'm surprised they can even afford guns :lolup: What do those things cost out your way.....$ 24.00? :rolleyes:
 
Sorry, life is too short to argue with these guys. There was a mistake on their T&Cs - I get it.

I don't mind a few digs here and there between oldtimers - but for a newbie to come here and think they can run the place just pisses me off. Banned for being a PITA.
 
hi textex

Why would you wish someone dead over a few dollars?

Most members find this type of behavior unacceptable and childish. There is no reason to act like a dick to a customer service rep. I'd suggest chilling out a bit.
thats evil textex, just for couple of dollars you want them died, give you some advise close your account go else where
 
Yes I was driving at the same point really...the art is to make the customer think they are always right. But that does depend on you as a business wanting that customer of course and I am sure that in any industry there are customers that are not wanted.

I looked at the OP here and the language and sentiment textex used in this thread and thought that maybe there is a chance that this casino was thinking that way.

:) Indeed, there are some less-than-ideal customers. Also, the OP's language leaves a lot to be desired.

Saying that, the online casino industry is the only one (that I know of) that accepts all customers, but then make up excuses to not effect payouts without any worry about repercussions. So yes, online casinos do want your business, just not you as a customer. Which makes perfect sense as to why they allow anyone to sign up and make deposits, but then ask for ID and whatnot when having to pay out on withdrawals. Insisting on ID verification at the signup stage solves many issues (especially the much-used and much-maligned "fraud" excuse). It's also very easy to implement, does not cost much, improves customer service, etc. But then, they lose deposits ;)

In management consulting, we are exposed to all kinds of industries. Putting that hat on, I see the online casino industry as being something is dire need of an overhaul - in every sense of the word!
 
:) Indeed, there are some less-than-ideal customers. Also, the OP's language leaves a lot to be desired.

Saying that, the online casino industry is the only one (that I know of) that accepts all customers, but then make up excuses to not effect payouts without any worry about repercussions. ... the online casino industry as being something is dire need of an overhaul - in every sense of the word!

It needs effective regulation but as the economic crisis gets worse, the fear would be that regulatory measures becomes more geared towards maximising financial gain at the expense of the issues that matter. The "outside world" is no different to our industry in that regard.
 
Simmo,

Definitely agree with you there re. economic crisis. Had my day off, now time to get busy again.

I believe I've read enough on here and elsewhere to realise that though I enjoy Betfair sports-betting, online casinos are not for me. This industry really does need fundamental changes to the way it goes about its business.

So that's it for me. Will pop in from time to time to say hello. Oh, and I still have an outstanding issue with InterCasino. Will let you guys know what they say. But I believe them to be one of the better operators.

Take care!


-Macster
 

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