actiononline are bouncing me around

[siegfriedB]

No news here I'm afraid. My last emails to actiononline didn't bounce either, but haven't been replied to, and when I phoned they said they hadn't received anything. I complained to playtech nearly two weeks ago and have heard nothing.

 

[pangloss]

Same here - nothing, zilch, zero, not a whisper. And still affiliates are recommending this casino to play. I think there is a liability here at the affiliate level. Since the affiliate i signed up thru is located within my jurisdiction I am confident I sue the Casino concerned at my local court and join (attach) the affiliate to the action. Even if the offending affiliate is not found to be 100% responsible the Law here would oblige the affiliate to compensate me for 100% of my loss leaving the affiliate to recover the remainder direct from the casino.

A prime example of this wold be the Fortune Lounge situation where no affiliate on planet Earth could claim ignorance.

In this way affiliates would think twice about linking rouge casinos. And no links to rogue casinos would make the world a better place.

I think a test case is on its way.


...

 

[vinylweatherman]

Same here - nothing, zilch, zero, not a whisper. And still affiliates are recommending this casino to play. I think there is a liability here at the affiliate level. Since the affiliate i signed up thru is located within my jurisdiction I am confident I sue the Casino concerned at my local court and join (attach) the affiliate to the action. Even if the offending affiliate is not found to be 100% responsible the Law here would oblige the affiliate to compensate me for 100% of my loss leaving the affiliate to recover the remainder direct from the casino.

A prime example of this wold be the Fortune Lounge situation where no affiliate on planet Earth could claim ignorance.

In this way affiliates would think twice about linking rouge casinos. And no links to rogue casinos would make the world a better place.

I think a test case is on its way.


...

Have you made a formal complaint to the affiliate?

This would strengthen your case, as it would show the court that the affiliate was made aware of the situation, but chose to ignore it and continue to promote the casino. The court's main interest is probably going to be related to the promotion of a casino by an Australian based affiliate to Australian residents whilst said casino is having serious and long standing problems. You should also get a certified screenshot of the website, showing that the regular promotional programme has not been updated since February, another indication that they may have effectively become insolvent.

Any company that trades whilst insolvent is breaking the law, at least here in the UK.
While it might be seen as unfair just to pick on one affiliate among those who still promote the rogues, any court case will make other affiliates think twice about keeping links to operations that are unable to pay out to winning players.

I rather suspect they are hoping enough deposits will come in until they have enough to pay the withdrawals - this is effectively what "trading while technically insolvent" is. If these new deposits result in net winnings, the casino are in an even deeper hole.
While they may come out of hiding and say it was all a silly mistake, I doubt anyone will believe that given the length of time this "fault" with their CS servers has gone on for.

 

[Casinomeister]

Have you made a formal complaint to the affiliate?...

Feel free to name and shame - no affiliate should be dealing with a casino that is either totally inept or crippled financially.

I'm working on these PABs at the moment.

 

[cristra]

I've informed the webmaster of the site from which I signed-up at Action Online, but I don't think he is to blame. There are a lot of casinos and I don’t think that it is possible to know exactly when one of them becomes rogue. The site contains warnings regarding the casinos listed in the casinomeister’s rogue or not recommended section and I’m sure that after this incident the link to Action Online will disappear.
That reminds me… has anyone been able to log in to the casino’s software recently?

Finally, after the last 4 failure notices from their site, I have received another reply from the KGC (the ones that I think are realy responsible for this mess):

Hello Cristian,

I have been looking into it for you. I'm waiting for the operator to
reply back to me. As soon as I hear something I will let you know. Sorry for
the long wait.

Sincerely,

Kitty Zachary
Administrative Support Clerk
Kahnawake Gaming Commission

It sounds exactly like the other 3 replies I got from them!
I hope that maybe Bryan will manage to get the money out of there…

 

[Casinomeister]

...I hope that maybe Bryan will manage to get the money out of there

Looks like a folded operation to me. They probably have cleaned out their desks and packed up. I wouldn't count on seeing any money.

Awaiting word from Playtech. By the way, my emails are not bouncing from the casino, so at least they are getting through to somewhere...

 

[cristra]

the e-mails to customerservice@actiononline.com are not bouncing anymore, but no replies are coming back either.

My last emails to actiononline didn't bounce either, but haven't been replied to, and when I phoned they said they hadn't received anything.

As you can see, our e-mails didn't bounce either probably somebody even read them, but Im afraid that he/she didnt have any good news to send back. Although I didnt try it, it looks from what siegfiredB said that their phone operators are still there... maybe this way something can be done.
Ive just noticed on their website, the progressive jackpots are still rising, but every time you refresh, they are updating from the same value! Crooks !

 

[Casinomeister]

If anyone hasn't PABd yet, they should do so now. I need to present these to Playtech so they can investigate the situation and hopefully get some people paid.

So far I have only Crista's

 

[Pinababy69]

I've informed the webmaster of the site from which I signed-up at Action Online, but I don't think he is to blame.

On this Cristra, I would have to disagree. It is absolutely a webmaster's responsibility (and duty) to keep track of which casinos he is promoting, and if they are reputable. Now unless this just happened out of the blue, then maybe I'd cut him some slack. But there are usually signs that a casino is slipping, and one of them is poor relations with their affiliates.

You say you have contacted him..I would hope he would remove any banners to this casino ASAP, and not send any more unsuspecting players there.

 

[vinylweatherman]

If they have been in dificulties, it has been for some while. The last time the promotions were updated was February, the only thing reported to still be working was making deposits.

It is inexcusable that both Playtech and Kawanake just let this slip due to the fact that they were unable to get a reply from the casino. Not replying to the regulating authority or the software provider should have rung alarm bells earlier, and action should have been swiftly taken to prevent further deposits from being made into accounts.
Both Kawanake and Playtech are quite capable of shutting down the server on at least a temporary basis pending clarification. If the casino was at any time taking further deposits whilst knowing they were insolvent (unable to pay players), they were committing a very serious criminal offence - well, they would be were they in a proper regulatory juristiction, but from past cases it seems Kawanake fall well short of their promise of regulation "modelled on that of the Australian government" (which is the regime that Lasseters operates under).
If the eventual outcome is indeed that players lost money due to the casino having gone bust in Feb/March, Playtech and Kawanake will have lost the trust of some players who were not already disillusioned about these so called "regulatory juristictions". Antigua should take note of this, as they have fought a WTO case against America, and if they get lumped in as just another place for casinos to operate from to avoid proper scrutiny and regulation, they may find their victory overturned on an argument that these small states are not able to provide a proper framework of player protection.

 

[Casinomeister]

If siegfriedB and pangloss could PAB - that would be great. I'll present these to Playtech and to the KGC - in person if I have to.

To let this linger like this in unnecessary and inexcusable.

 

[cristra]

First of all, thank you Bryan for doing somebody else's job in order to help the players in trouble!

This is the affiliates reply to my request for help (I would like to thank him also although he is a member of this forum, I will not disclose his name, as I dont think that he is to blame for this matter):

They haven't answered my email yet, but I did get them on the phone. My phone call was answered immediately. Unfortunately, they did not give any useful additional information. They recommended faxing the requested documentation to the number listed on the Action Online website, if email is not working. I assume you have already tried this?

I let them know about the thread on Casinomeister. They said they'd pass the information about the thread on to management.


I will send siegfriedB and pangloss private messages letting them know that they should PAB!

 

[siegfriedB]

I have just pitched my bitch. Thanks Bryan and everyone.

 

[Casinomeister]

Rogued

I have just pitched my bitch. Thanks Bryan and everyone.

And in the meantime - rogued:
https://www.casinomeister.com/casino-reviews/action-online/

 

[siegfriedB]

Thanks, nice to see them where they belong.

Is it acceptable for Playtech to just acknowledge complaints and then do absolutely nothing about it? KGC ditto? Do they not have any responsibility / compensation fund / system in place to look after the players when something like this happens?

Anyway thanks, I appreciate your help.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Thanks, nice to see them where they belong.

Is it acceptable for Playtech to just acknowledge complaints and then do absolutely nothing about it? KGC ditto? Do they not have any responsibility / compensation fund / system in place to look after the players when something like this happens?

Anyway thanks, I appreciate your help.

No, if they did they would take this seriously to prevent a huge compensation liability from building up.
KGC have repeatedly shown themselves to be a weak regulator. They behave more like a landlord collecting rent, and seem only to take action if THEY are likely to be affected, such as turfing out sportbooks that take US wagers to cover theoir own a$$es from UIGEA fallout. They hold the trump card with these errant casinos, the off switch to the electricity supply & internet feed, they could make these casinos jump to attention if they had a mind to.
When they do try to help, they act more like a weak mediator rather than determined regulator. If the casino fails to respond to the KGC letter within the prescribed 14 days, nothing seems to really happen, so this is not a threat to a rogue, but would prompt a reputable casino that values its reputation.
Hopefully, most gambling forums know about the Action Online problem, and few, if any, new deposits are flowing in from these players.

 

[cristra]

If the casino fails to respond to the KGC letter within the prescribed 14 days, nothing seems to really happen...

... true, true !!

Behind Action Online there is a company, and behind that company there are people. Shouldn't KGC and PlayTech know who those people are and how to contact them (besides sending useless e-mails like any player)?
Is it that easy to pull such a scam? I mean... if I wanted to rip people off their money, I would set up an "online casino" powered by PlayTech and licensed by the KGC and it looks like I could get away with it...

To the people at KGC and PlayTech:
Ignorance means complicity !

 

[nektar4d]

simple and true

... true, true !!

Behind Action Online there is a company, and behind that company there are people. Shouldn't KGC and PlayTech know who those people are and how to contact them (besides sending useless e-mails like any player)?
Is it that easy to pull such a scam? I mean... if I wanted to rip people off their money, I would set up an "online casino" powered by PlayTech and licensed by the KGC and it looks like I could get away with it...

To the people at KGC and PlayTech:
Ignorance means complicity !

Well said.
I enjoyed the part "if I wanted to rip people off their money, I would set up an "online casino" powered by PlayTech and licensed by the KGC and it looks like I could get away with it..."
Something tells me that others have already copied this method and are using it...
Xmm, its a big story and probably should get a separate thread.

 

[cristra]

Any news on the Action Online issue? I have just sent what has become now my regular e-mail to PlayTech (still no response from them until now)… Bryan, have you managed to talk with someone from them about this situation? I have almost given up hope that somebody will consider my complaints…

 

[pangloss]

Any news on the Action Online issue? I have just sent what has become now my regular e-mail to PlayTech (still no response from them until now) Bryan, have you managed to talk with someone from them about this situation? I have almost given up hope that somebody will consider my complaints

My friend, Forum buddy and former moderator Spearmaster works for PT and I am pretty sure he is just bursting to help out here.


...

 

[siegfriedB]

It is still possible to download, join up and deposit at actiononline casino. I have just been into my account there, I can see my 990 sitting there and could blow it on the games if I wanted.

Just sorting through my postbox I see that I received the following from Playtech on May 6th:

Hi Siegfried,

Thank you for taking the time to let us know about your difficulties with Action on line casino.

Please rest assured that Ive addressed the issue with the casino and am waiting for an answer from my contacts over there.

As soon as I hear an answer Ill inform you.

Thanks in advance for your patience.

Best Regards,

Adam Ehrlich

Playtech Marketing

Looks like his contacts at the casino haven't got back to him for the last 40 days, so he's had no reason to get back to me. Hang in there Adam, I'm sure they'll be in touch soon, nice to know you're on the case.

 

[siegfriedB]

I have just written to Adam Ehrlich. May as well make it an open letter on this thread, as I'm sure plenty of people are interested in the response, or continued total lack of one.

Adam,

It's been 40 days since your last email. actiononline.com are now rogued at casinomeister.com, after being much discussed in the following thread:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/actiononline-are-bouncing-me-around.17688/?posted=1

Given the above, just how seriously do you expect me to take playtech and your commitment to resolving this issue? It is still, today, possible for new players to sign up and deposit at actiononlinecasino, and they will have absolutely no prospect of getting paid. What are you doing about it?

Siegfried

 

[vinylweatherman]

It seems Playtech are not entirely safe to play with, unlike Microgaming who have the capability to shut down the servers of errant casinos, which they did to Sunny Group years ago, forcing them to abandon players and move to another software provider with looser criteria as to what is acceptable.
This has dragged on for months, yet Action Online seem able to continue taking money from players who have not cottoned on to the fact they are effectively bust, and unable to make payments.

Perhaps Action Online are hoping to trade their way out of the problem, risking none of their own money, but only that of the players.
Perhaps Playtech will take notice when the licencing fee goes unpaid, but by then it will be too late for the players, and Playtech will not have lost any "real" money, just failed to make a profit on the software licencing at one of it's many customer casinos.

Microgaming also have a trust fund to pay players of failed operators, AND they are based in the Isle of Man. I expect this would get the attention of the software vendor if Action Online were Microgaming.

 

[Casinomeister]

I'm back on this now. I will get an answer.

 

[cristra]

I can see my 990 sitting there and could blow it on the games if I wanted.

...same here! My 360 EUR are still waiting for withdrawal. They sent me the usual automatic request for documents yesterday after 2 weeks from my cash-out attempt. Siegfried, at least you are lucky that somebody from PlayTech got back to you... they didn't bother to reply none of my 5 e-mails.