32Red hmmm

aceking123

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Location
uk
They are two completely, massively different things.[/QUOTE]


how are they different then explain to me ? why they work in a different way because from where im sitting & spending i realy dont see any. other than i can spend alot in one machine to return to it at a later date & hay i get some of money back maybe even a little on top
)
 

trebord

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 18, 2011
Location
england
Just got a 100% match bonus offer at Betway. I Played 850 spins on king cole , 60p a spin , no feature. That would never happen at 32red!
 

LaHutti

Sr. ÜberUnter Ass. Man.
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If it was true...which it is not, that the chance of hitting a jackpot, on a completely random videoslot, would increase, like 777 says, the more money was lost to it, it would mean 2 things. 1. it would not be anywhere near random, and 2. every time a losing spin was hit, it would have to be removed, so that it couldn't be hit again, until the machine was left with no other choice, but to give you the JP combination, which, again, would make it non random.

What you're basicly saying 777, is that there is a number of combinations on a slotmachine, and if you keep grinding away, you'll eventually hit every single combination. This is true, in the sence that you would have to do millions and millions of spins for this to happen, excactly because each spin isn't removed when hit. You can hit the excact same combination over and over and over....including the jp combination. The chance of hitting any OTHER combination is a lot higher, because every other symbol on the machine, is represented more times on each reel, than the jp symbols. The more times a symbol is represented on the reels, the more times your combinations will have those symbols in them. It's really not rocket sience ;)

We often hear, that there is a lot more screenshots from a new slot, just released, and after 2 weeks, when the "new" effect slows down, and less people play the slot the number of screenshots drop. Yes....they do, simply because less spins are made on the slot, hence there won't be as many big wins. It's NOT because they "lower the RTP", or any other mumbo jumbo, that some people seem to think...it's simply because less spins are made, so less big wins will be won. It doesn't mean, that any individual player has a bigger chance of hitting a big win, but it DOES mean, that of all the many many many more combined spins, made by ALL the many many players, some big wins are more likely to occur, among any of those spins.


Comparing a compensated fruit machine to a random slotmachine is like comparing 2 things, that can't be compared ....you pick
 

Seventh777

RIP Roy
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Location
Planet Tharg, dark side, where nothing grows.
Okay, I will put this another way. how is the exact RTP of a slot worked out, and why does playing the same slot for longer, increase the chances of facing it`s RTP?, if it is not based over a certain amount of spins, would it not be impossible to calculate a precise % from an infinitive amount of spins?.

Imho a completely random system could not constantly produce a set percentage return, without having some form of control over it to ensure it happens, complete randomness and precise percentage payouts are two completely different aspects.
 

LaHutti

Sr. ÜberUnter Ass. Man.
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:thumbsup:


Okay, I will put this another way. how is the exact RTP of a slot worked out, and why does playing the same slot for longer, increase the chances of facing it`s RTP?, if it is not based over a certain amount of spins, would it not be impossible to calculate a precise % from an infinitive amount of spins?.

Imho a completely random system could not constantly produce a set percentage return, without having some form of control over it to ensure it happens, complete randomness and precise percentage payouts are two completely different aspects.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
Okay, I will put this another way. how is the exact RTP of a slot worked out, and why does playing the same slot for longer, increase the chances of facing it`s RTP?, if it is not based over a certain amount of spins, would it not be impossible to calculate a precise % from an infinitive amount of spins?.

Imho a completely random system could not constantly produce a set percentage return, without having some form of control over it to ensure it happens, complete randomness and precise percentage payouts are two completely different aspects.

I hear ya Roy, and I see what you're saying.

The important aspect here is that a slot is given a TRTP based on a full cycle of the reels I.e. based on every possible combination coming up once. The casino knows that it WILL have an edge of 5% on a 95% slot based on a full cycle.

Now, we know that many combinations are repeated over and over, and some seldom appear, so the slot doesn't throw out one of each combination in turn.....this is where the RNG comes in. So, the TRTP of the slot is THEORETICAL. In the short to medium term, it will fluctuate, sometimes wildly (this is the variance aspect), but the more spins that are made by all players, the closer the ACTUAL RTP gets to the THEORETICAL RTP....as a result of the LLN to which chopley referred.

It's a basic explanation and I'm sure there are other complications like free spins or picking features etc. I'll leave that to someone else.

In short, the casino DOESN'T precisely know or control the RTP. All they have to do is design their promotions and budgeting etc around the TRTP and let the maths do the rest.

You can see that unless the casino operator is smart, there is potential for them to go under if they don't do their sums, especially in the short term, and it is one of the major reasons that poorly funded operations are doomed to fail from the off.
 

Seventh777

RIP Roy
Joined
Sep 28, 2010
Location
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I hear ya Roy, and I see what you're saying.

The important aspect here is that a slot is given a TRTP based on a full cycle of the reels I.e. based on every possible combination coming up once. The casino knows that it WILL have an edge of 5% on a 95% slot based on a full cycle.

Now, we know that many combinations are repeated over and over, and some seldom appear, so the slot doesn't throw out one of each combination in turn.....this is where the RNG comes in. So, the TRTP of the slot is THEORETICAL. In the short to medium term, it will fluctuate, sometimes wildly (this is the variance aspect), but the more spins that are made by all players, the closer the ACTUAL RTP gets to the THEORETICAL RTP....as a result of the LLN to which chopley referred.

It's a basic explanation and I'm sure there are other complications like free spins or picking features etc. I'll leave that to someone else.

In short, the casino DOESN'T precisely know or control the RTP. All they have to do is design their promotions and budgeting etc around the TRTP and let the maths do the rest.

You can see that unless the casino operator is smart, there is potential for them to go under if they don't do their sums, especially in the short term, and it is one of the major reasons that poorly funded operations are doomed to fail from the off.

Ah, cheers Tim :thumbsup:, somewhere along the line there had to be a base figure to work with for a percentage to be derived from ;).
 

bsilva028

Banned : multi-account fraudster
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Jul 16, 2010
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portugal
finally i got a good winning there

another proof that is only unlucky who dont wins there

after more than 3 years playing there and winnings 0,00
between friday and today i cashed out $1500

better than that, they ask me to send my docs, but they didnt block the payment, they ask for the docs after the payment has been made to neteller (it take about 12 hours only)
 

ChopleyIOM

Hearthstone Addict
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You can see that unless the casino operator is smart, there is potential for them to go under if they don't do their sums, especially in the short term, and it is one of the major reasons that poorly funded operations are doomed to fail from the off.

Indeed, which is why you end up with promotions like the 1777% bonus at Tropica that was very, very beatable - where the casino just didn't think about the implications of allowing a slot with a 99% T-RTP assuming perfect skill bonus round strategy, contributing 100% to the WR.

(To summarise, I nearly beat it 'by accident' on my first attempt, and on my second attempt was absolutely clear on how to beat it. Play a high variance slot to double my bankroll (that relied on good luck of course), then grind out the WR on The Back Nine (99% RTP with perfect bonus round strategy), job done, £1050 withdrawal from a £100 deposit.)

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/winner-screenshots.4193/ - (I'm not picking on Roy here, but you can see in that post he's basically saying 'you beat the bonus 'cause you got lucky' and I'm trying to get across, 'No dude, honestly, I worked the sums out, that's why I beat it')

The fact they changed the T&Cs on that bonus as soon as I beat it says it all really, and they reduced the T-RTP of The Back Nine by 4% according to the help file, AND they reduced its contribution to the WR by 90%, along with all their other slots that have a T-RTP of 97% or better. That bonus had been on Tropica's books for ages, which tells me no one had looked at the sums before and worked out it was basically free money.

T-RTP works both ways, it guarantees the casino a house edge in the long run, but with the right combination of bonuses and T-RTPs, even today, casinos are kicking EV+ promotions out of the door - it's just a question of keeping your eyes open and relying on maths to get the job done :)
 

werni

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 6, 2011
Location
germany
32 Red

Hey Sparkz,

I am more than 10K down this year (32red only)

Lost 600 today and even more a couple of days ago.

I've had my account closed but because of the fast payouts and great support i've decided to play there again.
Their support is great but what does it help me when i am going to lose most of the time ? Doesn't matter if i play smaller or hight bets it's always the same. Today i played several slots and it looked like they are all cold.

'Your payout for todays’ session is 78.32% and for Fighting Fish is 75.94%'

I don't even wanna know my payout ratio for isis or breakaway lol
Since January i deposited more than 44K and yet i am still waiting for the x1000 hit ;D

I know i shouldn't complain because i had my account closed and then started playing there again but hey they are a great casino and it really hurts to stop playing there :(

Anyway i started to play Riverbelle more often which is also a great Casino,Bossmedia,Dublinbet(Roulette) and recovered some of my losses :)
 

KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
webmeister
PABnonaccred
CAG
MM
Joined
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Location
Bexhill on sea, England
Since January i deposited more than 44K and yet i am still waiting for the x1000 hit ;D
I little bit of advice: STOP chasing that x1000 hit!

I've been playing slots online virtually every day since 2004 - and I've only hit ONE win over x1000 - and that was just last month at 3Dice!
I do play MG casinos quite a bit (more than any other software) and I do OK with them. The key is not chasing the big wins, just getting a little run going and knowing when to quit.

KK
 

ChopleyIOM

Hearthstone Addict
webby
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Location
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I've been playing slots online virtually every day since 2004 - and I've only hit ONE win over x1000 - and that was just last month at 3Dice!

Blimey KK that's a surprising stat, I've only been playing for around five years and I don't play half as much as you do, and I've had several 1000x stake or better wins.

If you don't tend to play high variance slots that would explain it, I guess?

I mean, if you don't play slots that have 1000x stake or better wins on the paytable, then you'll never hit one!
 

Balthazar

The Governor
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Location
Woodbury
Blimey KK that's a surprising stat, I've only been playing for around five years and I don't play half as much as you do, and I've had several 1000x stake or better wins.

If you don't tend to play high variance slots that would explain it, I guess?

I mean, if you don't play slots that have 1000x stake or better wins on the paytable, then you'll never hit one!

I probably don't play as much as you and KK but I also only hit 1000x stake once (with a few 800x-900x). Even with high variance slots (which I play) it's hard to get. :)

My only 1000x online was on BDBA (line of gold ingots with wild symbol in free spins). I've got about a dozen of 1000x in land based casinos, though.
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
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MM
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Apr 18, 2009
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Sweden
That surprised me KK, and Balthazar. I wonder if it's because you are playing higher bets than I, and maybe are running out of money faster.
I havn't even posted all of my screenshots, but I counted 15 posted wins of 1000x or higher, and 3 of 900x, in the last 6 months.
Am I just a lucky gambler maybe;)
 

dionysus

Good(w)ill Ambassador
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the land of snow and maple syrup
That surprised me KK, and Balthazar. I wonder if it's because you are playing higher bets than I, and maybe are running out of money faster.
I havn't even posted all of my screenshots, but I counted 15 posted wins of 1000x or higher, and 3 of 900x, in the last 6 months.
Am I just a lucky gambler maybe;)

Possibly. Could mean you're also spinning more/spending more in general
 

Balthazar

The Governor
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Location
Woodbury
That surprised me KK, and Balthazar. I wonder if it's because you are playing higher bets than I, and maybe are running out of money faster.
I havn't even posted all of my screenshots, but I counted 15 posted wins of 1000x or higher, and 3 of 900x, in the last 6 months.
Am I just a lucky gambler maybe;)

I usually play bets that are higher than they should be for my bankroll (although I've found myself playing a lot of $0.60 spins recently, which never happened before). When I play online it's usually a $100 deposit and $0.90 bets on high variance slots (almost exclusively on TDK, IR, TD2, SWR or BDBA). I'm going to be honest here and admit that hitting a 1000x on a $0.30 bet would more than likely p*ss me off, that's why I don't like to lowroll much.
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
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I usually play bets that are higher than they should be for my bankroll (although I've found myself playing a lot of $0.60 spins recently, which never happened before). When I play online it's usually a $100 deposit and $0.90 bets on high variance slots (almost exclusively on TDK, IR, TD2, SWR or BDBA). I'm going to be honest here and admit that hitting a 1000x on a $0.30 bet would more than likely p*ss me off, that's why I don't like to lowroll much.

It has to be the boy/girl thing I've said before. Or how we are valuing money.
My thought when playing is mostly that it doesn't matter if I'm playing low stakes or not, because in the end I will play it back anyway.
I would not see me as a better or smarter player if I win huge, and I have no need to show how much I win (not entirely true since I told you about all my 1000x winnings):oops:
I'm up this year but I'm only consider myself as lucky, because I was down last year:)
 

KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
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I usually play bets that are higher than they should be for my bankroll (although I've found myself playing a lot of $0.60 spins recently, which never happened before). When I play online it's usually a $100 deposit and $0.90 bets on high variance slots (almost exclusively on TDK, IR, TD2, SWR or BDBA). I'm going to be honest here and admit that hitting a 1000x on a $0.30 bet would more than likely p*ss me off, that's why I don't like to lowroll much.
That's EXACTLY my thoughts (except the high-variance bit!) :thumbsup:

Time is also an issue for me at the moment: I know I shouldn't let it change my playing style (pretty successful in the past), but because I have such limited playing time online these days, I do tend to bet higher than I used to, hoping for a quick biggie or two so that I can at least quit ahead for each day.

KK
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
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geeeeez 32Red..here's our new promo..BUT....you only have 7 hours to claim it ugh

the new scratch card came out today...100%.
And there it went lol
Email at 1pm, but expires at 7pm so if you happened to just get it? Too late lol

But if you take a little trip and ask support they will give it to you anyway. I don't doubt that for a second.
 

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