- Joined
- Jan 20, 2004
- Location
- Pictland
A player came to us recently with a simple case: the casino claimed they used Live games while playing a Bonus in violation of the Terms.
The problem was the player’s play records did not show any Live games played. Suspecting there might be more trouble coming the player filed a PAB.
The response to us from the casino was promptly received:
Now there are two serious problem right there. The first is the “other games” bit because that can be interpreted by the casino to mean whatever they want it to mean at any given time. When we presented that argument to them they said “the player can always ask” but that isn’t the point and it isn’t a solution to the problem. For a player to actually know what games are restricted or not they’d have to ask about every single game before they went to play it, and to be safe they’d probably have to ask every day because who knows what might change from one day to the next. And of course they’d have to keep a record of the response given because maybe tomorrow the casino could change their minds and you’d need proof of what they said yesterday, assuming that would make any difference to them.
If the Terms are going to restrict games they need to be specific, not hand-wavey and hopelessly vague about “other games”. Terms like that are predatory in that they are written by the casino to punish players whenever the casino decides they are inclined to do so. As one of our resident experts put it: "It's a vile term, basically a cover-all for the casino to arbitrarily decide ex post facto what a high-variance game is, in order to refuse payouts. Utter filth."
The casino’s response to our concerns about the Terms and the entrapment written into them?:
Too bad those “specialists” couldn’t have taken the time to write their expert opinion into the Terms and clarify what games _exactly_ they were referring to.
I mentioned there were two problems with the casino’s response. Many of you will have spotted the funky URL,
If there was any doubt about the company’s intentions you need look no further than their licensing jurisdiction, Anjouan, the new and upcoming feeble do-nothing jurisdiction. There Win.Casino’s parent company is listed as "3-102-940395 Limitada”. That just oozes confidence and stability, doncha think? What a brand! You can imagine their banner flying over the local sports complex, "3-102-940395 are Proud Supporters of <your town’s name here> Little League Champions”. The music swells and the sun pierces through the clouds to blind you long enough for 3-102-940395 Limitada representatives to empty everyone’s pockets and prise granny’s gold teeth out of her head as they make their exit from the scene.
WARNING: Win.Casino is confiscating player’s winnings … whenever they feel like it, citing violations of Terms that were written purposely vague and ideally suited for exactly that purpose. Players need to either avoid Win.Casino at all costs, or simply give them all their money in one lump sum to get it over with quickly.
For the record, these are Win.Casino sister sites which should also be on your kaka list: win.city, bitwins.io, 21win.gg, orbita.bet.
The problem was the player’s play records did not show any Live games played. Suspecting there might be more trouble coming the player filed a PAB.
The response to us from the casino was promptly received:
"In our bonus terms, you can find the list of restricted games for bonus wagering:
https://win5709.win/static/bonus-termsAlso, it includes: 'Other games that are not mentioned above but have inside a bonus mechanic or can be high-volatility games can also be excluded from bonus wagering.’ "
Now there are two serious problem right there. The first is the “other games” bit because that can be interpreted by the casino to mean whatever they want it to mean at any given time. When we presented that argument to them they said “the player can always ask” but that isn’t the point and it isn’t a solution to the problem. For a player to actually know what games are restricted or not they’d have to ask about every single game before they went to play it, and to be safe they’d probably have to ask every day because who knows what might change from one day to the next. And of course they’d have to keep a record of the response given because maybe tomorrow the casino could change their minds and you’d need proof of what they said yesterday, assuming that would make any difference to them.
If the Terms are going to restrict games they need to be specific, not hand-wavey and hopelessly vague about “other games”. Terms like that are predatory in that they are written by the casino to punish players whenever the casino decides they are inclined to do so. As one of our resident experts put it: "It's a vile term, basically a cover-all for the casino to arbitrarily decide ex post facto what a high-variance game is, in order to refuse payouts. Utter filth."
The casino’s response to our concerns about the Terms and the entrapment written into them?:
"Our specialists, after carefully reviewing the case, decided to leave it unchanged. The rules of the site were violated."
Too bad those “specialists” couldn’t have taken the time to write their expert opinion into the Terms and clarify what games _exactly_ they were referring to.
I mentioned there were two problems with the casino’s response. Many of you will have spotted the funky URL,
https://win5709.win. The point here is that legitimate casinos don’t need to redirect to dodgy, generic URLs. Next week the URL could be win9945.win or win7234.win or whatever, it doesn't matter because they won’t be keeping it for very long and all they have to do is redirect win.casino to the next numbered URL, as they are obviously doing. Those are like numbered shell companies that bent operators buy by the sack load so they can easily shift from one to the next: they present a moving target in order to keep a few steps ahead of the blow-back they inevitably attract because of their wicked ways.If there was any doubt about the company’s intentions you need look no further than their licensing jurisdiction, Anjouan, the new and upcoming feeble do-nothing jurisdiction. There Win.Casino’s parent company is listed as "3-102-940395 Limitada”. That just oozes confidence and stability, doncha think? What a brand! You can imagine their banner flying over the local sports complex, "3-102-940395 are Proud Supporters of <your town’s name here> Little League Champions”. The music swells and the sun pierces through the clouds to blind you long enough for 3-102-940395 Limitada representatives to empty everyone’s pockets and prise granny’s gold teeth out of her head as they make their exit from the scene.
WARNING: Win.Casino is confiscating player’s winnings … whenever they feel like it, citing violations of Terms that were written purposely vague and ideally suited for exactly that purpose. Players need to either avoid Win.Casino at all costs, or simply give them all their money in one lump sum to get it over with quickly.
For the record, these are Win.Casino sister sites which should also be on your kaka list: win.city, bitwins.io, 21win.gg, orbita.bet.
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