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yes he probably could have done, not sure if it would have made a difference at that point, if that was why he should be impeached then the dems widened the goal posts:
US political crisis
- Thread starter The Dude
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yes he probably could have done, not sure if it would have made a difference at that point, if that was why he should be impeached then the dems widened the goal posts:
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The god emperor can’t be taken down
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A point I overlooked last night regarding impeachment and going by a simple majority, is if a party controlled both houses they could abuse the process to remove individuals they perceived as political threats, or bring pressure on individuals to vote certain ways.
A very interesting article here, regarding trump in fact requesting extra support prior to the day
A very interesting article here, regarding trump in fact requesting extra support prior to the day
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Yeah, imagine if someone were to abuse their powers in the senate.
Good thing the majority rule is in place stopping anything like that from happening.
What the backward rules does is allow the minority to sabotage what the majority of the senate&population wants.
Because the senate and house works as an extension of the people that vote.
I bet you would have called foul if brexit didnt happen because of the minority that voted stay.
But when it suits your own views, the minority getting to decide is just fine.
Good thing the majority rule is in place stopping anything like that from happening.
What the backward rules does is allow the minority to sabotage what the majority of the senate&population wants.
Because the senate and house works as an extension of the people that vote.
I bet you would have called foul if brexit didnt happen because of the minority that voted stay.
But when it suits your own views, the minority getting to decide is just fine.
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Yeah, imagine if someone were to abuse their powers in the senate.
Good thing the majority rule is in place stopping anything like that from happening.
View attachment 150594
What the backward rules does is allow the minority to sabotage what the majority of the senate&population wants.
Because the senate and house works as an extension of the people that vote.
I bet you would have called foul if brexit didnt happen because of the minority that voted stay.
But when it suits your own views, the minority getting to decide is just fine.
You're mixing first past the post voting, and referendums with an impeachment process aimed at removing people from office, three different things.
The founding fathers put in place safeguards for similar reasons:
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People often refer to the United States as a democracy, but technically speaking, that’s not true. It’s a republic.
Big deal, you say? If you care about your rights, it is. The Founding Fathers knew their history well, so they knew better than to establish the U.S. as a democracy.
In a democracy, of course, the majority rules. That’s all well and good for the majority, but what about the minority? Don’t they have rights that deserve respect?
Of course they do. Which is why a democracy won’t cut it. As the saying goes, a democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what’s for dinner.
The Founders were determined to forestall the inherent dangers of what James Madison called “the tyranny of the majority.” So they constructed something more lasting: a republic. Something with checks and balances. A system of government carefully balanced to safeguard the rights of both the majority and the minority.
That led, most notably, to the bicameral structure of our legislative branch. We have a House of Representatives, where the number of members is greater for more populous states (which obviously favors those states), and the Senate, where every state from Rhode Island and Alaska to California and New York have exactly two representatives (which keeps less-populated states from being steamrolled).
Being a republic, we also don’t pick our president through a direct, majority-take-all vote. We have an Electoral College. And a lot of liberals don’t like that.
Their attacks on the College are nothing new, but the defeat of Hillary Clinton in 2016 renewed their fury. After all, as they never tire of pointing out, Mrs. Clinton captured more of the popular vote than Donald Trump did. They see the Electoral College as an impediment to their political victories, therefore it’s got to go.
Were it not for the Electoral College, presidential candidates could act as if many Americans don’t even exist. They could simply campaign in a small handful of states with big populations. Who would care what the people in Iowa think? Or Wyoming? Or any number of other states with smaller populations?
The people in “flyover country” don’t get enough attention as it is, but without the Electoral College, they’d be completely at the mercy of the majority.
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interesting. Except. Why didn’t the president call up the national guard? Why would it be up to Nancy Pelosi. She has no authority to call up the national guard. And neither does the mayor have the power.
The governor can call the National Guard into action during local or statewide emergencies, such as storms, fires, earthquakes or civil disturbances. In addition, the President of the United States can activate the National Guard for participation in federal missions.
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wasn't there something about in a disputed election, nancy would take control, perhaps it would require her blessing, and maybe some thought/were wary trump wanted the 10,000 national guardsmen there in order to carry out a coup?
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Do you seriously think the minority being able to decide on things as who becomes president makes more sense?
Just because billy-bob lives in Wyoming, his vote carries more weight than 3 people from California.
What rules are in place to stop the tyranny of the minority?
Makes even less sense when you look at education levels in rural vs urban areas.
Basically the uneducated minority have votes that carry more weight, which imo does not seem like the best idea.
And of course Gop is scared electoral college will be removed, since they wouldnt stand a chance in elections without it.
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It's all in that article, the alternative has far more potential to be worse.
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Big surprise, an article from a conservative promoting page argues that the electoral college, which is the only thing keeping gop in the game, is a good thing.
Maybe ive missed something, but the elections seem to be 100% focused on just a couple of swing states, the very scenario the electoral college is supposed to prevent, no?
Also, there is no balance. Small rural states wield way more influence than big urban ones do.
We will have to agree to disagree, i think its a shit system.
Its great if you are among the minority since your vote carries more weight, but its such a shitty deal for the majority of the population, which i dont think makes any sense.
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The framers anticipated partisan political witch hunts and made it a 2/3 super majority for that very reason instead of a simple majority. If it was a simple majority the Senate is currently 50/50 with Karmala Harris the tie breaker.
Hamilton warned of the “greatest danger” that the decision to move forward with impeachment will “be regulated more by the comparative strength of parties than the real demonstrations of innocence or guilt.” He worried that the tools of impeachment would be wielded by the “most cunning or most numerous factions” and lack the “requisite neutrality toward those whose conduct would be the subject of scrutiny.”
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The 1787 convention debate is interesting and a short read.
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This wasn’t a disputed election. This was disputed election in the mind of trump cuz he is who he is. Biden was declared the winner. Certified by all states. What was happening at the capital with the electoral votes was a dog and pony show. pageantry.
nancy Pelosi had no power to do so.
The only person who could have called the national guard that day was the president. Which he failed to do. And the governor. And there is talk that the governor was blocked from doing so
geordiecolin
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Now that Trump has been exonerated on impeachment charges twice I suspect he is free to start exert a lot of damage if he wishes too.
Whatever. It has been an awful week for the Dems both internally and worldwide.
Whatever. It has been an awful week for the Dems both internally and worldwide.
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And I hope the god emperor does exactly that after his appalling treatment during his tenure.
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How can it even be considered a disputed election, no cases were presented to any court that would have merited that description.
All this was was a wannabe dictator finding that more than half of the American voters didnt want to give him a second term.
Its really strange how not a single down ballot vote is being queried, particularly when these were for Republicans with the Presidential vote was for Biden. Was there nothing suspicious about these votes?
So blind are those who don't want to open their eyes.
geordiecolin
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I do question the basic sensibilities of those that do not see the partisan way that people are directed by one side of the political/ social debate over recent times.
I am happy to sit back and watch how things pan out for the most part. And I do not mean in just this extremely limited forum,but in my life regarding the issues that are seemingly most important in life with the posters in this forum.
Life is for living because we are long dead
geordiecolin
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Simply for the sake of democracy we need a excepting America of their democracy in our lives.But in all honesty I think that all aspects of American politics is controlled. That includes Trump and all that it entails. We can argue specifics until the cows come home.
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You can go fact check it as I don't have time but I believe Washington DC does not have a Governor as its not a State.
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Correct, it's a federal district.
It was the Governor of Maryland who tried to deploy the National Guard but was told he lacked the authority to do so. Then 2 hours later he got a request from the federal government to deploy them.
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Not a state yet,
But i doubt GOP will let the people there get the representation in the government they deserve, since it would almost certainly be a state that voted for the democrats.
I think its called "taxation without representation" and is a pretty crappy deal for the people living there.
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Sure it was trump leading the claims, pushing for audits etc...but it wasn't like everyone else felt the results were 100% legitimate, the application to the supreme court was backed by at least 17 states, then you had all the various witnesses testifying under oath.
From my brief reading of articles this evening, the capitol police could have requested additional support and the sergeants at arms from the congress, also the pentagon's chief had a big say.
according to wikipedia:
On January 3, 2021, all ten living former defense secretaries raised alarm in an open letter against a military coup to overturn the election results, warning officials who would participate and specifically naming Miller, that they would face grave consequences if they violated the constitution
That kind of links to my earlier post, was the deployment of the national guard blocked for fear of this potential?
edit: I put a question mark there but really I am past caring now, I am at ease at myself for not feeling the need to rage at trump, I won't be manipulated by the lamestream press into doing so either. I recognise he has faults, name a billionaire who doesn't. If biden is successful on the basic measurements of performance for a country he'll get a thumbs up from me.
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Well Monday is the federal holiday, Presidents Day, lol
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Yes. You are correct. in all other states the governor calls up the national guard. But Washington DC is special. No governor etc.
I think in the end it was mike pence who ordered the national guard.
Doesn’t matter. The capitol got stormed.
Trump is off the hook.
hopefully the Dems will move on. And we won’t have to hear about trump. But as you know trump is a big money maker for the media companies. So we will continue to hear about him.
But Everyone needs to move on. Country needs to get back to normal. With politics and covid.
Especially covid.
I miss my family and friends. I miss charleston.
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tiresome to have to repeat the same things on here. The election was won fair and square until proven otherwise. And we have yet to see any proof. These witnesses you claim....where are they, why weren’t they presented in all those court cases that were lost....
...activating the national guard had nothing to do with a military coup...I think you are confused ....
the national guard was needed to keep peace/order...
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I'll tell you what is tiresome, looking at my alerts and seeing a quoted reply from yourself when I've just stated I am past caring debating this bs.
Then when I read it, that wearisome reaction I had felt was warranted, another cheap shot and more strawman stuff.
However I will not abide an uncivil, cheap shot from you without responding further - and it's in a long line of little cheap shots fired by you in my direction, the casual reader won't be aware of that, so might think I'm overreacting here.
I stated many people, including the people in control of 17 states, do not believe the election was won fair and square. The witnesses appeared at the various state hearings to give evidence, also provided affidavits to the various court cases. [this was in reply to you saying " This was disputed election in the mind of trump cuz he is who he is"]
I was speculating why somebody blocked the deployment of the national guard...I didn't see it mentioned as part of the impeachment case, that trump or someone under his control had deliberately blocked it.
I quoted wikipedia that 10 former defense secretaries had written an open letter raising the alarm about a potential military coup by trump.
NPR:
The former chief of U.S. Capitol Police says security officials at the House and Senate rebuffed his early requests to call in the National Guard ahead of a demonstration in support of President Trump that turned into a deadly attack on Congress.
Former chief Steven Sund -- who
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last week after House Speaker Nancy Pelosi called for him to step down -- made the assertions in an interview with
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published Sunday.Sund says he requested assistance six times ahead of and during the attack on the Capitol. Each of those requests was denied or delayed, he says.
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Harley is not impressed.
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Uncivil? I think this might be a cultural thing. I apologize if I offended you with my reply.
there are no cheap shots directed at you at all. I respond to your posts and I do so with sincerity armed with my belief system. I have no qualms with you or your beliefs. I respect your posts as I have said sometime ago when for no reason at all you got banned. I came to your defence. I apologize if you think there is some hidden agenda to maybe take a shot at you. It is not my intention.
However I will clear up what I meant by tiresome. the part that makes me weary with ppl who believe the election was rigged is they believe that the election was rigged based on all these things they read in the right wing medias. Yet there is not one shred of evidence. Those so called witnesses? Why weren’t they called? Why did the courts throw out 69 out of 70 cases. Surely not everyone is corrupt in those courts where Giuliani and company presented their lawsuits. no one has any answers when confronted with this. Where is this undisputed proof. Think about it. An American election was rigged according to Trump and followers why haven’t they presented the evidence. The left wing media would ignore it but Surely the right wing media would tell the world about it. I mean if the evidence is there. Hard proof. Why hasn’t it been presented in the court of law or in the media?
I can repeat a lie till I am blue in the face and convince everyone who believes me that this lie is true but it does NOT a make it true just cuz I keep repeating it. Repetition of lie does not make true.
the Dems were caught in the same cycle 4 years ago. we cannot go through this every four years. What is the point of an election if the losers will not believe they lost?
as for the national guard. It seems that there is confusion. So I will not argue the point.
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Apology accepted, and I may have been a bit tetchy first thing this morning, also it's the curse of the written word for misinterpretations to occur.
I did try to follow the election aftermath but there was too minutiae for me, in the end he was unable to convince anyone in authority that he unfairly lost, so the world moves on.
Let's see if Joe can do a better job, he has got a certain amount of 'the common touch' to engage with the average voter, far more than someone like beto o'rourke or hillary.
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@mack341
@Steviedoo
both superb people, one I agree with the other we don’t hardly ever ‘unless it’s about my superb cooking skills’
doesn’t mean her voice is less heard.
glad it’s been resolved this way rather than the other..
also my latest corona post leaves lots to be desired haha
@Steviedoo
both superb people, one I agree with the other we don’t hardly ever ‘unless it’s about my superb cooking skills’
doesn’t mean her voice is less heard.
glad it’s been resolved this way rather than the other..
also my latest corona post leaves lots to be desired haha
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Atleast it was a little bit better than what Tucker could come up with.
Lets hope he does not wear a tan suit our something, because im not sure Tucker could handle it.
Lets hope he does not wear a tan suit our something, because im not sure Tucker could handle it.
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Ready for my latest lame joke - how about this?
Its not a lie, its just not the full truth.
Its not a lie, its just not the full truth.
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Now i want to see the full movie with googly eyes on all actors.
=)
=)
geordiecolin
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Any Texan's in this forum care to comment on this? Circle back on me 
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I heard that Texas has its own power grid separate from the US power grid. The Trump EO has something to do with getting power transformers from China, these things are huge weighing 100-400 tons so the fear was they could implant some nefarious software in it.
I was going to post in the Covid thread a week or two ago as a rebuttal to the lockdown whining, something to the effect that dealing with a lockdown is nothing, imagine if we lost power for a month but preached to my friend about it instead.
I was going to post in the Covid thread a week or two ago as a rebuttal to the lockdown whining, something to the effect that dealing with a lockdown is nothing, imagine if we lost power for a month but preached to my friend about it instead.
geordiecolin
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Did you mistype? Did Trump not prevent it and the EO allowed access?
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What did Biden’s EO allow access to? And by whom.
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This thread needs a little something.
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Atleast it was a little bit better than what Tucker could come up with.
Lets hope he does not wear a tan suit our something, because im not sure Tucker could handle it.
Speaking of dogs.
"Damnit people, fox news is making us look bad, do we have nothing negative about Biden to air, like literally anything will do"
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yes, that is correct, Sorry, could have worded it better.
I had food here and wanted to get to it while it was still somewhat hot.
geordiecolin
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Presumably you did not listen to the reporters question? Note that Psaki could not answer the question.
Has she ever circled back to any question that she promised to circle back too?
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Groundbreaking discovery.
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Speaking of Texas.
They say that necessity is the mother of invention.
They say that necessity is the mother of invention.
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I didn't even know texas got snow until this week, must be global warming taking effect, sorry climate change
Edit: I experienced a 1 hr power cut last week, and that was bad enough.
Edit: I experienced a 1 hr power cut last week, and that was bad enough.
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Just seen president elect Kanye west and first lady kim are divorcing, who's going to come out of that the richer than they went in?
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Definitely Kanye.
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yes I did. You stated that trumps prevented it and the eo allowed acces to...
so I’m asking you what are you talking about.
as for the press secretary...circle back....same Crap different administration.
And....texas has its own power grid. So whatever is happening in Texas has nothing to with the National power grid and how safe or unsafe it is to hackers or any eo trump or Biden signed. Privatization of power and deregulation of water ...
Biden's executive order places a temporary suspension of trump‘s orders to allow the new energy secretary to review the policy and determine if a replacement order should be issued.
trump’s eo was not rescinded. It’s been suspended By Biden’s eo. The reporter states that. Trumps eo is suspended for 90 days.
