Israel

[bamberfishcake]

Two innocent Swedish people probably football fans, shot dead in Brussels by muslim migrant tonight, sadly yet more European families suffering from the effects multiculturalism. The fact the scumbag has escaped so far and could quite easily be on the next cross-channel invasion wave from France makes me want to puke.

Heard the other day that Sweden has the highest rate of gun crime in Europe. Don't know how true that is or how it's measured - lies, damn lies, and statistics etc - but what has happened over there? Used to be one of the safest countries IIRC.

 

[dunover]

Heard the other day that Sweden has the highest rate of gun crime in Europe. Don't know how true that is or how it's measured - lies, damn lies, and statistics etc - but what has happened over there? Used to be one of the safest countries IIRC.

Apparently they shot the bastard in a cafe, so won't be coming over here.

 

[interlog]

Apparently they shot the bastard in a cafe, so won't be coming over here.

UK police need to learn how to deal with such vermin.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Are guns a big thing in Sweden? Its nothing like the US is it?

I suppose the weapons manufacturers would love it if the world adopted more guns.

 

[mack341]

Are guns a big thing in Sweden? Its nothing like the US is it?

I suppose the weapons manufacturers would love it if the world adopted more guns.

My understanding is lots of weapons found their way there after the balkan wars in the 90s, ak-47s and lots of grenades being two examples, don't know if this is correct. Or perhaps more recent smuggling from latvia and other gangster hotspots etc...

Probably tied to gangs selling drugs in the swedish cities, sex traffickers/ prostitution rings, resulting in turf wars would be my guess.

 

[justdoit]

Surely someone in authority must have given them permission to set up this stage there?

they need to get license from met police, when they get licence they get map, where and what they can do

 

[justdoit]

Heard the other day that Sweden has the highest rate of gun crime in Europe. Don't know how true that is or how it's measured - lies, damn lies, and statistics etc - but what has happened over there? Used to be one of the safest countries IIRC.

yes they do have high gun crime, ex Yugoslavia war left lot of guns open to public, now they getting sold

 

[Kroffe]

Are guns a big thing in Sweden? Its nothing like the US is it?

I suppose the weapons manufacturers would love it if the world adopted more guns.

Not really (apart from criminals of course).
A lot of people have a hunting license and own rifles/shotguns, but those are not really the type of weapons being used in shootings.

Like Mack said the vast majority of gun violence is between gangs, and related to drugs in one way or another.
So thankfully its mostly criminals shooting criminals, but its not like there is zero collateral damage.
And another disturbing and problematic thing is that its getting more common for the gangs to recruit kids for the shootings, and our laws are not really up to speed with that kind of behaviour.

Basically if someone under 15 commits a crime the punishment is a slap on the wrist compared to the punishment an adult would receive for committing the same crime.

99% of it is happening down south, but if nothing is done about it its only a matter of time before it spreads.

 

[dunover]

Not really (apart from criminals of course).
A lot of people have a hunting license and own rifles/shotguns, but those are not really the type of weapons being used in shootings.

Like Mack said the vast majority of gun violence is between gangs, and related to drugs in one way or another.
So thankfully its mostly criminals shooting criminals, but its not like there is zero collateral damage.
And another disturbing and problematic thing is that its getting more common for the gangs to recruit kids for the shootings, and our laws are not really up to speed with that kind of behaviour.

Basically if someone under 15 commits a crime the punishment is a slap on the wrist compared to the punishment an adult would receive for committing the same crime.

99% of it is happening down south, but if nothing is done about it its only a matter of time before it spreads.

You mean Malmo where they are enjoying the benefits of multiculturalism more than other Swedish towns and cities?

 

[interlog]

I think the rocket strike on that hospital has set the cat amongst the pigeons and I fear this will escalate soon.

Hamas stirring things up across the Arab world. Israel saying it wasn't them but a stray rocket from Hamas.

Interesting but also scary times ahead....

 

[Kroffe]

You mean Malmo where they are enjoying the benefits of multiculturalism more than other Swedish towns and cities?

That is definitely one of the cities that are having issues, but its not the only one.
From where i live (Umeå) its basically the further south you go the worse it gets.

Someone made a site mapping out the crimes, based on police reports. (not just shootings, but only 'big' crimes'
Its not non-existent where i live but there is a major difference, but these areas are also much more sparsely populated and im guessing that contributes to it aswell.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[goatwack]

Wow - that hospital attack

Had initially assumed full-on propaganda being in play, given the 'tactics' usually deployed by the besieged, smaller nations.

Yet in all honesty, I'm more likely to believe that Israel did cause it, given the fire & brimstone shelling they're likely to inflict. Such is the way of such things over there, I'd imagine the retribution to be like-for-like, as it's always been.....and of course the innocent always bear the brunt.

Pretty sure this isn't what ordinary Palestinians envisaged or asked for, yet seemingly that's what they're getting, given that Hamas and ordinary folk have somehow been conflated.

Of course Israel are grieving these atrocities, but causing the needless extermination of the Palestinian populace is not much better. Because this sort of collateral damage will only fuel anti-Israeli resentment, strengthen Hamas' resolve, and prolong this conflict for generations to come....

 

[mack341]

bbc:

Jordan's foreign minister has just said the country is pulling out of a planned summit with US President Joe Biden.

The summit was to be held in Amman and was to included Biden as well as Egyptian, Palestinian and Jordanian officials.

---------

Thinking aloud here, but maybe Israel didn't want this meeting to happen. Blowing up a hospital full of injured civilians [incl children] is guaranteed to cause problems for the west, who've to date backed the military action by Israel, so there must be some logic behind it.

 

[interlog]

bbc:

Jordan's foreign minister has just said the country is pulling out of a planned summit with US President Joe Biden.

The summit was to be held in Amman and was to included Biden as well as Egyptian, Palestinian and Jordanian officials.

---------

Thinking aloud here, but maybe Israel didn't want this meeting to happen. Blowing up a hospital full of injured civilians [incl children] is guaranteed to cause problems for the west, who've to date backed the military action by Israel, so there must be some logic behind it.

But that is illogical.

Want the support of the West is not gained by deliberately bombing a hospital.

It is something that more fits Hamas and putting the cats amongst the pigeons by blaming Israel.

There is apparently a video that shows a missile being fired towards Israel that fell short. Not sure of the authenticity of it though.

 

[goatwack]

Israel are allies of the West and U.S, they don't need the green light from them to conduct their affairs, nor would they particularly care.

It's highly likely to have been Israel that bombed that hospital, likely an indirect consequence from their not-so-hidden military assault. Even the Palestinians wouldn't let their loathing of Israel make them PR bomb their own hospitals, nor do I see Hamas having done that.

Would be great to have a neutral. completely unbiased source bringing us unfiltered news from that region, but ultimately, with most having the means to transmit these events live via their phones, that's the closest we'll get.....

 

[goatwack]

It's ok, Biden's here!

Yes indeed, he'll fulfil his mandatory visit and say his prepared-by-aides speech just after his alphabet spaghetti, but not before Sesame Street!

Even better, we'll have the U.S investigate the hospital bombing, so that should make for a completely accurate report.

 

[interlog]

Perhaps Iran should investigate it!

 

[dunover]

Jeeze how can Americans take that senile embarrassment Biden seriously. He makes a speech a couple of hours ago in Israel, fluff his lines (reading from a script) then calls Hamas 'the other side' when he forgets their name.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Jeeze how can Americans take that senile embarrassment Biden seriously. He makes a speech a couple of hours ago in Israel, fluff his lines (reading from a script) then calls Hamas 'the other side' when he forgets their name.

Or fall asleep with his prompt card in hand.

At least we know they are not hiding some miracle drug from us, because he would be pumped full of it on a daily basis to avoid the inevitable embarrassment.

It's clear to see how bonkers the world is right now when the head of the most powerful nation in the world is a geriatric old fart who barely knows what time it is. Inspiring times!

 

[goatwack]

Transcript in full, to those who missed it:

We will not submit to terrorism, freedom will prevail. We've looked at the evidence, and it was Israel....I mean, the other side, Hummus. You know.....the guy!

- Bib Biden

 

[dunover]

Transcript in full, to those who missed it:

We will not submit to terrorism, freedom will prevail. We've looked at the evidence, and it was Israel....I mean, the other side, Hummus. You know.....the guy!

- Bib Biden

View attachment 188271

Obviously hasn't gotten over Oireland losing to the Black & Tans yet in the rugby WC.

Never mind the White House, should be in Paradise Lodge.

Yes, no miracle drug I agree, but I think the Americans have found a way to preserve cadavers and insert some kind of electrical pulse box into them, which can move lips, eyelids and hands.

Next the embalmed Lenin will be making an appearance alongside Mad Vlad.

Surely there's one or two aides in the US aged less than 110 who can fly over there instead?

 

[mack341]

But that is illogical.

Want the support of the West is not gained by deliberately bombing a hospital.

It is something that more fits Hamas and putting the cats amongst the pigeons by blaming Israel.

There is apparently a video that shows a missile being fired towards Israel that fell short. Not sure of the authenticity of it though.

afaik those meetings were called off after the hospital incident, I can't imagine hamas rockets can cause that size of explosion. Israel issued warnings to evacuate hospitals, and one of their advisers tweeted that evening they'd hit a hospital and then a short while later deleted it.



The logic is Israel didn't want Biden to meet with the 'arab' leaders before he met netanyahu, or perhaps at all, biden is senile who knows how he might respond to their presentations/arguments. If he came out and said we need a ceasefire, than that would put israel in a very difficult position.

I'm just speculating on the chain of events, trying to understand why they would hit that hospital around the time biden arrives, why not wait till he's gone back. [If they believed it was a legitimate military target, not saying I agree with the blowing up of hospitals]

Or it was Hamas' rocket falling short.

If there is such a thing as a neutral expert or organisation that can analyse the damage, footage, debris etc...then that's what's required.

 

[interlog]

afaik those meetings were called off after the hospital incident, I can't imagine hamas rockets can cause that size of explosion. Israel issued warnings to evacuate hospitals, and one of their advisers tweeted that evening they'd hit a hospital and then a short while later deleted it.

View attachment 188286

The logic is Israel didn't want Biden to meet with the 'arab' leaders before he met netanyahu, or perhaps at all, biden is senile who knows how he might respond to their presentations/arguments. If he came out and said we need a ceasefire, than that would put israel in a very difficult position.

I'm just speculating on the chain of events, trying to understand why they would hit that hospital around the time biden arrives, why not wait till he's gone back. [If they believed it was a legitimate military target, not saying I agree with the blowing up of hospitals]

Or it was Hamas' rocket falling short.

If there is such a thing as a neutral expert or organisation that can analyse the damage, footage, debris etc...then that's what's required.

Didn't Israel say if it was them there would have been a crater, yet that appears not to be the case.

An analysis of the site by an independent body would be ideal, alas that is not going to happen in a war zone.

I wouldn't trust anything Hamas says or claims. They have nothing to lose, unlike Israel.

 

[dunover]

The pictures show very little blast damage from where the crater is, a small crater. Most are now saying it's rocket propellant, cars nearby are in the same position, merely burnt out. There's also a video showing rockets being launched in the direction of the hospital although it isn't clear if it was an accident or not and the videos don't show where the rocket dropped.

 

[Kroffe]

The amount of propaganda/misinformation from both sides is crazy.
Never before has knowledge&news from around the world been so easy to get ahold of, but finding out what is actually happening has never been harder than it is now, and it will only get harder going forward.

So what is the solution?
Well thats easy.