How attitudes have changed regarding P4F RTP

[JuicyFruit]

Way back when (2007 approx), I posted a query regarding the P4F software at Lassiters, but I was shot down in flames by some of the forum members who thought I was being stupid for even daring to question the P4F side of a casino, e.g.

Get real.
I have played at the site for 2+ years never an issue with REAL $$. That was FUN money and does not command the respect or attention of real play.
Casino is legit and one of the few that is regulated by the domestic goverment.

In fact, it did seem that the general consensus back then, among both players and support staff, was P4F didn't need to mimic the real version of the games.

So when did attitudes to P4F change, to the extent that we now expect PF4/Realtime to behave the same? In fact, I think I read that this is now part of the Accreditation checklist.

What has obviously prompted me to ask this are the current threads about Hi Lo and the difference between P4F and live.

 

[rockycatt]

Way back when (2007 approx), I posted a query regarding the P4F software at Lassiters, but I was shot down in flames by some of the forum members who thought I was being stupid for even daring to question the P4F side of a casino, e.g.



In fact, it did seem that the general consensus back then, among both players and support staff, was P4F didn't need to mimic the real version of the games.

So when did attitudes to P4F change, to the extent that we now expect PF4/Realtime to behave the same? In fact, I think I read that this is now part of the Accreditation checklist.

What has obviously prompted me to ask this are the current threads about Hi Lo and the difference between P4F and live.

can you post the link ?

 

[JuicyFruit]

can you post the link ?

Sure.... any particular reason though why you have asked for it?

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/lasseters-software-issues.10606/

 

[Simmo!]

Looking at the thread I don't think the subject got a fair hearing: it looks like a couple of posters just venting for the hell of it rather than at the issue of P4F vs P4R. I'd almost guess there was a bit of previous there. And when the the thread did finally get going on topic, thru Chuchu and Westland you didn't respond.

What was "OSG" software? Don't recollect.

 

[LaHutti]

Agree with Simmo!

Seems like you were unlucky, running into one or 2 posters looking for a girlfight, and also seems like you took the bait, and that kinda killed the thread.

 

[rockycatt]

Attach Removed (Old not found)

buck hasn't been around for ages or established himself so =not caring much wieght

 

[Richas]

Way back when (2007 approx), I posted a query regarding the P4F software at Lassiters, but I was shot down in flames by some of the forum members who thought I was being stupid for even daring to question the P4F side of a casino, e.g.

I think the difference is that the issue was presented as one abut a s/w glitch when exiting the play game which did not seem that important to real money players and may well be user specific.

Now I am more interested in this documentary evidence that winning at the play money version was so consistently easy/great....I wonder what the real money game returns were at the time and note that the record of how the play game actually played is binned with no record held to be available for review in an audit or for a site to prove that their play game does play the same as the real money game.

 

[JuicyFruit]

Looking at the thread I don't think the subject got a fair hearing: it looks like a couple of posters just venting for the hell of it rather than at the issue of P4F vs P4R. I'd almost guess there was a bit of previous there. And when the the thread did finally get going on topic, thru Chuchu and Westland you didn't respond.

What was "OSG" software? Don't recollect.

No idea what the software was.... I haven't seen games like those since they closed their doors, which is a shame, as I really like them.

However, I didn't mean this thread to be specific to Lassiters - I just used that as an example. Rather, I just wanted to see if people today do expect P4F and P4R to behave the same. As back then, it didn't seem to be the case. And it wasn't just the contents of that thread.....there were a few borderline nasty PMs as well.

So yes, Simmo and LaHutti .....being a natural born coward, indeed it was a case of Run, Rabbit, Run....

 

[Simmo!]

Rather, I just wanted to see if people today do expect P4F and P4R to behave the same.

Yes, absolutely.

 

[243 lines=daft]

This is quite interesting. I'm now of the opinion that all five of the Playtech multi spin slots are possibly delivering different results in P4R and P4F, in particular Goblin's cave which seems to be delivering about 25% more of the top symbol when five coins are played.

But in 2006 when these five machines were released, if the consensus then was that it didn't matter if real played the same as fun, then the programmers of these games might have seen the tweak as a legitimate enhancement for the business model.

In a strange way it reminds me of these interviews with Arnold Schwarzenegger where he answers an accusatory query about steroids by simply saying yes he did take them but that the general view back in the seventies was that steroids were an experimental but perfectly legitimate supplement.

 

[GrandMaster]

Sure.... any particular reason though why you have asked for it?

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/lasseters-software-issues.10606/

The complaint in that thread wasn't the difference between real and fun money game play, but that the fun money balance was not preserved between sessions.

 

[Simmo!]

Good points, 243lines. Attitudes change for a variety of reasons but one of those is knowledge. The industry has changed quite a bit since 2006/2007 and the regulatory and legislative attempts in certain jurisdictions, combined with the recognition of obvious financial benefits I'm sure, have tried to add a layer of legitimacy to the industry. With some success.

That's all well and good but if you want to be legitimate and regulate properly then you have to have procedures in place. The problem is, procedures are rarely 100% right first time - experience is what shapes them. A legitimate gambling industry is still in it's infancy, limited to a few jurisdictions and fairly basic regulatory attempts at that.

This is why, as the recent Finsoft/Playtech threads have demonstrated clearly, the procedures simply aren't good enough yet. Purposefully leaving aside the issue of who to blame as it will derail this and just go down roads being covered elsewhere, no rigged software, "incorrect versions" of games or "incorrect help files" should get through the net. Period.

Players are getting more knowledgable and better at recognising issues . The industry's job (casinos, regulators, software providers, distributors etc) is to get their ducks in a row before they lose the confidence of the players.

 

[JuicyFruit]

The complaint in that thread wasn't the difference between real and fun money game play, but that the fun money balance was not preserved between sessions.

My conversation with Lassiter's support regarding the difference between P4F and real was very illuminating, which is why I started the original thread, although it does only appear to be about the fun money balance not being preserved. I thought I had also put that in the thread, but I obviously got sidetracked before I had the chance.