Crooks at Casino Extreme

[tdubnik]

I made a mistake by playing here.


Even though I personally have never had a problem here previously, I didn't heed the warnings of another message board. I did well at the games and requested a cash out of $700 from my $100 deposit plus $100 bonus. This morning my account was locked. I sent an email to find out why and was told that I was ineligible to participate in promotions. This was news to me as I have never been told that in the past.

I got a personal call from the Manager who called me a bonus abuser and to not bother to attempt opening an account at Casino Heat because I was banned there too. I had played extensively at Extreme and even made deposits without bonuses in the past. The problem is that I obviously didn't lose my deposits and actually cashed out more than I deposited.

The bottom line is that they are refunding my deposit and stealing my $600 winnings and locking me out of Extreme and Casino Heat.

Another bunch of crooks that make up the rules as they go and in my case absolutely lied about previous notification of promotion inelgiblity.

 

[amandajm]

Was this thier Xmas 100% match bonus?

I got that offer too.Just the other day..

Man,even xmas aint sacred anymore...What a wonderful present i'm sure.Seeyah..

 

[The Dude]

Hi Tdubnik,

Could you please clarify which rule you did not follow in their terms and conditions? What excactly did they tell you? Did the manager explain what a "bonus abuser" is? Why were you disqualified?

~b

 

[tdubnik]

admin,

I followed all of the rules.

The promotion was for a bonus of $100 for a deposit of $100. I met all of the requirements for the promotion which included wagering and cashing out an amount greater than your deposit plus bonus after meeting the wagering requirments.
The requirement was that the deposit and bonus be wagered 8 times. I wagered in excess of 10 times. The bonus was $100 and since I cashed out $700 after meeting the wagering requirement, this certainly met the requirement that I cash out "a profit greater than the amount of the bonus."

I followed all of the "written rules", I messed up on the unwritten rule that "you have to lose or we will keep your winnings and lock your account."

The Manager called me a second time and informed me that he is NOT concerned that I am posting my experience on the boards. He said "this doesn't affect my business in the least."

We'll see.

 

[amandajm]

The manager cannot be serious?

Well i'll tell you for sure it does affect business!Unless my money does'nt count that is...

I've played at both and won.They will not get a chance to get it back...I've just got another email offering a $300 bonus for a thousand dollars.Pity really,because they were nice to me and paid me promptly.I never knew they were bad eggs until after i'd played there.

Dear Mr Manager man of Extreme and Heat.Do you like tennis?Remember Mcenroe?I'll say no more!

 

[amandajm]

Dear Tbudnik.

Did the manager not say what he thought you'd done wrong?

I think the Meister is asking for what the manager said,not your opinion.(i think)

 

[tdubnik]

The manager said that I had not deposited and played enough without bonuses. When I pointed out that I had in fact deposited and played without a bonus, he said "I see that and it doesn't impress me."

 

[amandajm]

No mention of what constitutes "enough"?

Is "enough" defined anywhere in thier rules?

 

[tdubnik]

In a word -- "no".

There is no mention of requiring deposits without bonuses at all. Not only that, but the offer I played was addressed to me directly from the Casino. I did not obtain it from a message board or portal.

 

[amandajm]

O.K man.

Hope ~b can help you out

 

[The Dude]

I'll see if the casino is willing to make a comment.

~b

 

[tdubnik]

Thanks admin

 

[hkplayer]

Hi Tdubnik,

The Casino Manager is correct. You know what, the casino refused to send you the mony becase you won too much

LOL

 

[The Dude]

Hi Tdubnik,

Casino Extreme's management is under the impression that they notified you in July that you were not to participate in any bonuses. They state:

"This individual was shut out of the casino on the 19/07/2001 he then told Richard that he would only play with no promos he then had his acct
reopened on the 24/07/2001 he then deposited $250-00 played it over once left it in his account untill 09/09/2001 he then withdrew $175-00.

He then arrives on the 22/12/2001 and tries to claim a bonus he was told numerous times that he could not participate in promos he makes one token
deposit of $250-00 which he leaves in his account for 2 months and thinks he can just come in here and claim promos."

This seems pretty cut and dry. Do you have copies of any emails that would negate this statement?

Bryan

 

[tdubnik]

I have no information about ever being shut out of Extreme. I have a complete email history of my dealings but there is nothing about being banned from promotions or being locked out of my account. To my knowledge this account has never been locked. Please have Richard forward to you any email notification of this locking incident.

Regarding the deposit, he is correct that I deposited $250 on 7/24 but I played it more than once. On 7/24 I played two sessions wagering $267.50 and $272.50 respectively. On 7/25 I wagered $40. On 8/1 I wagered $237.50 and on 8/16 I wagered $177.50. I then withdrew $175 on 9/9.

I was not aware of any requirement that I play the money in my account until I lose it. As a player at online casinos, my goal is to win some money; the same as most other players. I try to get lucky and beat the house advantage and cash out ahead. Sometimes I play and lose some money. When this happens I will cash out when it feels like I won't recover and get ahead.

There is no question that I take advantage of bonuses when they are available. Any edge that I can get to overcome the built in advantage of the house is welcome. I do the same thing at land based casinos. As I write this, I am sitting in my hotel room at the Taj Mahal in Atlantic City. I am here because they sent me some cash coupons in the mail. I have done this on every occasion that I have played here. In other words, I have only played here when I have coupons or promotions that cut the house edge. I have been here over 20 times this year and cashed coupons every time but they have not felt it necessary to bar me from play. They have never balked at taking a coupon and have never told me that I must play without promotions. They have never sent me an offer and then AFTER THE FACT revoked it just because I happened to win.

If Richard doesn't want me to play at his casino then I should have been notified. This notification should not have occurred AFTER I participate in a promotion that was sent directly to me via email.
This was a personal invitation by name. If I was not allowed to participate, why was the offer sent to me?

I feel that I did nothing wrong. I feel that I took advantage of a legitimate offer and it was revoked because I happened to win. I met all of the terms and conditions of the promotion. Ask Richard what would have happened if I had lost my deposit and bonus. Would they have refunded my deposit?

 

[jetset]

Seems to me that TonyD has supplied enough fact for an independent check of Extreme's logs. Or Casino Extreme management could easily disprove his story by simply forwarding a copy of their email barring him from their promos...

TonyD can presumably also produce the email directly inviting him to participate in an Extreme promo after his alleged banning... If he was sent that email (even in error by Extreme staff) then that is their liability and they should pay up.

All-in-all ample material to prove the case of one side or the other.

I would say that it is now Show and Tell time?

 

[tdubnik]

I am pasting the email offer I am referring to below:

Subj: $100-00 Free for XMAS at Casino Extreme!!!
Date: 12/22/2001 2:09:25 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: tonyd*******@aol.com
Sent from the Internet (Details)



HO HO HO

Its Christmas Time again!!!

To celebrate the Festive Spirit of Christmas Casino Extyreme is Giving

Tony D***** a $100-00 Gift!!!

Thats right we will match your next deposit Dollar for Dollar!!!

Here is your code: *****

www.casinoextreme.com
www.casinoextreme.com

Simply enter the code and make a deposit you will be matched dollar for dollar up to $100-00


This Offer expires on the 25th December Midnight EST


We will also be adding a little extra Christmas Cheer and giving away 30 $500-00 accounts to the biggest bettors between now and XMAS!!


Once again the Casino Extreme Team would like to take this opportunity to wish you and your family all joy and happiness over the Festive Season!!


Regards

Casino Extreme Management and Staff!!


Terms and Conditions

1. We require that the deposit and bonus are wagered 8 times

2.In order to cash in , you need to cash in a total amount greater than the sum of the purchase and the bonus.
This means that you will only be able to cash in if you make a profit greater than the amount of the bonus.
If your profit is less than the amount of the bonus, this amount will be credited back to your casino account for you to play with.
If you lose more than the amount of the bonus no restrictions will be imposed on your cash-in, other than the wager requirements noted above.
For example, if you purchase US$100 and receive a bonus of US$100,
then a cash-in of US$190 will result in US$90 being returned to your casino account,
and you will only be able to cash-in again once your balance exceeds US$100 (being the amount of the bonus received).
Using this promotional offer to wager on Roulette, Craps and Baccarat does not fulfill your obligations with regard to the total amount wagered.
This offer is subject to ongoing review and the right to change the offer and its terms is reserved.

We respect your privacy to remove yourself from this and future mailings from Casino Extreme simply reply to this message with the word REMOVE
in the subject line

 

[jetset]

I'd say that puts the ball in Casino Extreme's court?

Looks like a customized email promo offer to me and why would they send it to someone they have barred from playing their promos?

If it's a casino screw-up they ought to eat it and pay up.

If they still say they didn't send the email let's see what they've got to prove it.

 

[don_gambler]

This is nothing but typical bullshit theft on the part of Extreme. Even if they want to deny him his bonus they are STILL obligated to pay him ALL winnings minus the bonus. I fully believe this person and not a word coming out of that arrogant ass Richard's mouth. This is nothing but a Bull shit excuse from these thieves to steal.

 

[The Dude]

I'll see if the casino has a comment about the email Tony D. received. I agree, if the casino slipped up, they should honor the promo.

~b

 

[The Dude]

Well, here's their comment:

Hi there Bryan

This case is closed this individual has a grossly abusive record and we are not interested in his case nor his business.

Regards

Warren

 

[amandajm]

What is this grossly abusive thing?

How does that work Warren?

Do tell!

 

[don_gambler]

Grossly abusive record?? What a bunch of crap. This is yet ANOTHER case of theft by the crooks at Extreme. This player won way more money then the bonus amount and should be at least paid for the winnings. They can revoke the bonus( THAT THEY THEMSELVES OFFERED AND THEN GAVE HIM) but stealing the winnings goes to show what thieves they really are.

It is also a MAJOR sign that they are about to go under and are hurting. They are looking for any excuse to steal any winnings. And don't be fooled by their BS.. posting on player's boards DO hurt their business, and hurt it bad.

 

[don_gambler]

Bryan with that unacceptable response from Extreme why haven't you added them to your Rogue section yet?

Spearmaster, why are you still accepting advertising from these crooks?

Extreme finally got kicked out of the OPA after embarrasing them for a long time. Just the information about Warren Cloud being associated with this place should be enough for any reputable portal, organization, etc to blacklist them and Casino Heat also.

 

[The Dude]

Man, I only have two hands that type!

Honestly, I'm going through some related stuff at the moment, and right now I'm not satisfied with this response. The casino (Warren) is very quick to respond, but the explanations are not thorough enough for my tastes.

~b

 

[brat]

Man, I only have two hands that type!

thank god you finally cleared up that rumor

 

[amandajm]

Grossly abusive record...

Thats bull.The guy won too much.

Pay the man then ban him,simple..

And if this firm then send him more emails offering a bonus,then they should honour it if he takes part,simple...

And it would be nice if the opa recommended/not recommended list was up to date.That way i could use it.At the moment i can't.Whats the point if i have to doublecheck elsewhere?

Some recommended sites on the OPA list advertise OPA blacklisted sites..

I only played at extreme because it was on the opa good list.That was the last time i used that list as a guide..

 

[amandajm]

Hey,strike that last post.

The list seems to have been updated..

The site seems to have changed also...

Whats going on?Someone must know!

Do tell..

 

[amandajm]

The OPA site i mean..Not extremes.

 

[The Dude]

Hi Amandajm!

The OPA has moved to the OPA (makes sense). I had hosted their forum here for one year and it was agreed that the OPA would now host their own forum.

As for Casinoextreme, I have been in contact with their manager and they are adamant (wasn't that an 80s band?) that Tony D. was abusive. As far as I can tell, Tony only played the bonuses (shame on you, Tony) and was not losing any money for the casino to make a profit. He was told on the telephone, twice I believe, that he was not to participate in any more bonuses. But I pointed out that he was identified by name in his email, thus he may have been mistaken that a bonus was intended for him, Warren stated that the email could have been faked.

Warren also stated that the player is banned for life, and also in any future lives, and banned from every possible casino that this guy is related to.

~b

 

[tdubnik]

Hi Bryan,

I thank you for your attempted help. I hope you are successful, but I have my doubts.

Have they provided any proof of thier claim of previously locking my account? or of banning me from promotions?

What is their explanation of sending personal invitations to their promotion including the Christmas offer I pasted above?

Do they claim they would have refunded my bonus if I had lost during the Christmas promotion?

I am sure they can't provide any of the above because they don't exist.

 

[time]

Hi Bryan,

Is the OPA disbanding, or looking for a new home? Is there a place to lodge complaints anymore? It says on their web page to go see "gambling grumbles" or you if we have a problem. Remind me, please, why did OPA dues? Did something happen to Steve or Mary?

No I don't have a complaint it just been so quiet from them lately and then I went to the site and saw the new message board - and the front page says they are not monitoring complaints. I kind of feel like I missed the last chapter in the book. Which could be the story of my life, but that's another post.

Yes, I am asking for the gossip here. What happened to the OPA?
Thanks,
Time

 

[jetset]

TonyD, I hate to say this but having observed far too many complaints in this business in the past it looks to me as if Extreme have written you and your complaint off with what is becoming increasingly common arrogance.

At least you have had the satisfaction of warning other players about this operation.

Reading between the lines here I doubt that mediation is going to get any further with these guys or that they will provide you with anything in the way of proof of their actions. I hope I'm wrong for your sake but that's the way it looks as if it's going to me.

 

[don_gambler]

"But I pointed out that he was identified by name in his email, thus he may have been mistaken that
a bonus was intended for him, Warren stated that the email could have been faked."

This is pure bullshit. I have been locked out of this casino for several months and THEY SENT ME THE SAME DAMN E-MAIL WITH MY NAME ON IT. I deleted it as I do all their spam. God damn bunch of liars and thieves, lead by Warren Cloud and Richard.

There is STILL NO EXCUSE for stealing this players $500 of winnings above and beyond the bonus. NONE and Brian you should have them in the Rogue section by now. You know as well as anyone that they are nothing but liars. How can any casinos run by Warren Cloud not be in anyone's rogue section?

 

[tdubnik]

Bryan,

Isn't it convenient that my warnings were done via telephone instead of email? Obviously I have no official records of any telephone calls they say they initiated. I can tell you that it didn't happen. I never got a phone call to that effect. I keep a log on every casino I play. I log every call I make or receive with the caller's name and the subject of the conversation.

I can send you a copy of log pages for other casinos that show telephone calls and their subject.

I try to do all of my correspondence via email so I can keep a permanent record.

As far as the fake email for the offer, guess what. I still have the original AND the header information that shows the complete electronic path of the offer. It would show if it was forwarded by anyone else before it got to me.

The hole being dug by Richard and Warren keeps getting deeper and deeper. Every response is another lie and they dig their hole a little deeper. I think it's time we bury them.

Tony

 

[mrracetrack]

Bryan stated;

"I have been in contact with their manager and they are adamant (wasn't that an 80s band?)"

You are too sharp today, hahahaha
Your a funny guy!!

 

[don_gambler]

Look at what I just got.. and I have been locked out for months.. These lying, thieving scumbuckets here..

Subj: $100-00 For (MY NAME WAS HERE)!!
Date: 1/6/02 11:26:20 AM Central Standard Time
From: [email protected] (Casino Extreme)
To: (MY E-MAIL WAS HERE)

Happy New Year (MY NAME WAS HERE AGAIN)

To celebrate the New Year Casino Extreme is Giving

You a $100-00 Gift!!!

Thats right we will add 40% to your next deposit (Max Bonus $100-00)

IE Deposit $250-00 get a $100-00 Bonus!!!

Here is your code: F6JM9

www.casinoextreme.com
www.casinoextreme.com

Simply enter the code and make a deposit you will be matched 40% up to $100-00


This Offer expires on the 9th January 2002 Midnight EST


Regards

Angelica
Promotions Manager
Casino Extreme


Terms and Conditions

1. We require that the deposit and bonus are wagered 8 times.

2. This promotion cannot be used in conjunction with any other promotions at Casino Extreme

2.In order to cash in , you need to cash in a total amount greater than the sum of the purchase and the bonus.
This means that you will only be able to cash in if you make a profit greater than the amount of the bonus.
If your profit is less than the amount of the bonus, this amount will be credited back to your casino account for you to play with.
If you lose more than the amount of the bonus no restrictions will be imposed on your cash-in, other than the wager requirements noted above.
For example, if you purchase US$100 and receive a bonus of US$100,
then a cash-in of US$190 will result in US$90 being returned to your casino account,
and you will only be able to cash-in again once your balance exceeds US$100 (being the amount of the bonus received).
Using this promotional offer to wager on Roulette, Craps and Baccarat does not fulfill your obligations with regard to the total amount wagered.
This offer is subject to ongoing review and the right to change the offer and its terms is reserved.

We respect your privacy to remove yourself from this and future mailings from Casino Extreme simply reply to this message with the word REMOVE
in the subject line


NOTICE THIS LAST SENTENCE. I HAVE ASKED THESE PIECES OF CRAP TO REMOVE MY NAME SEVERAL TIMES BUT THEY CONTINUE TO SPAM ME.

 

[The Dude]

Sheesh,

Are there anymore "banned" players receiving these emails??

Post them here or send them my way.

~b

 

[colly]

Well I received one- but as far as I know despite my winning I am not banned here. Still I won't take it up as I dont like to terms.

Sounds like everyone who may have made a sizeable deposit in the past may have got one. Think they should honour it if offered and they let you deposit.

regards
Colly

 

[tdubnik]

Bryan,

Why haven't you issued a Casinomeister Warning and placed Casino Extreme and Casino Heat on the Rouge list?

I think the evidence is abundantly clear that this operation belongs in the rogue section. You have documented evidence that the managers stole winnings from players and then flat out lied. They have not provided any evidence to support their claims yet I have.

You have corroboration from other players that I did not fake the email offer. They lied about me being banned form their casino previously and obviously could not provide any documentation. This group is about as low as a casino can get. When they ban players when their only offense is winning, when they then steal these winnings, and then RETROACTIVELY BAN PLAYERS; it is clear to me they are a rogue outfit.

Tony

 

[don_gambler]

And yet another personalized offer from the scum at Extreme to me.. they just keep coming..

"Greetings ***** ******(My name was here)

Casino Extreme would like to invite you to participate in Slot Mania!!

We have an awesome 30% slots bonus available for you!! (Max Bonus $150)

IE Deposit $500-00 get a $650-00 Bankroll!!!

Here is your code: TBP7P

And thats not all we will also add $500-00 to any Jackpot wins on machines denominated in 25c and up

3 Progressive Slots to choose from!!!

Jackpots from $50-00 to $50,000-00

www.casinoextreme.com
www.casinoextreme.com

Simply enter the code and make a deposit you will be matched 30% up to $150-00


This Offer expires on the 14th January 2002 Midnight EST


Regards

Candy
Promotions Manager
Casino Extreme

Support: 1-800-851-9247

Terms and Conditions

1. We require that the deposit and bonus are wagered 8 times on Slots only in order to cashin.

2. This promotion cannot be used in conjunction with any other promotions at Casino Extreme

2.In order to cash in , you need to cash in a total amount greater than the sum of the purchase and the bonus.
This means that you will only be able to cash in if you make a profit greater than the amount of the bonus.
If your profit is less than the amount of the bonus, this amount will be credited back to your casino account for you to play with.
If you lose more than the amount of the bonus no restrictions will be imposed on your cash-in, other than the wager requirements noted above.
For example, if you purchase US$100 and receive a bonus of US$100,
then a cash-in of US$190 will result in US$90 being returned to your casino account,
and you will only be able to cash-in again once your balance exceeds US$100 (being the amount of the bonus received).
Using this promotional offer to wager on Roulette, Craps and Baccarat does not fulfill your obligations with regard to the total amount wagered.
This offer is subject to ongoing review and the right to change the offer and its terms is reserved.

We respect your privacy to remove yourself from this and future mailings from Casino Extreme simply reply to this message with the word REMOVE
in the subject line

 

[The Dude]

Hi all,

Enough is enough. Casinoextreme has been placed in the coveted Not Recommended list here at Casinomeister. Not until they police up their bonus policies and procedures will they be removed.

~b

 

[jetset]

Casino Heat is the same outfit...

 

[The Dude]

Yeah, I know. They'll be up there too.

~b