Club World Raises Minimum Bet on Slots

[lauram]

I am also playing at club and luckyred. I can place bets 10 lines by 2 coins still.
Nothing has changed for me as of yet.

 

[Scooter7]

Smart business decision by ClubWorld.
This way they make more $ off the patron.

They may find out later that they have done more harm than good to their business.

Unless they can induce an extra (or bigger original) deposit, they're just making the same money faster. Of course next time they may not get the deposit at all since the player (rightly) will feel like they didn't get their money's worth.

Every casino operator that is not short-sighted and greedy will be happy that one of their competitors has made s stupid move like this.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I am also playing at club and luckyred. I can place bets 10 lines by 2 coins still.
Nothing has changed for me as of yet.

This is starting to look like RTG casinos CAN, after all, make these setting changes to SPECIFIC player accounts, rather than having to make a global change.

Even if this turns out to have been done in error, it STILL shows what CAN be done by RTG. We now have the possibilty that it is not ONLY the limits, but the RTP settings, that can be defined on a per player basis.

Even if this is not so, RTG have repeatedly been "economical with the truth", and in the discussions on RTP settings we were told that these changes could only be applied "across the board" for all players in a casino, yet here we have SOME players with raised minimum bets, yet others with no changes. Surely any update would be triggered for EVERY player at next login, so this really should NOT be happening due to delayed updates.

It seems the affected players were never told, and CS are treating it as something that CANNOT be changed back by just saying "it's how the software is", implying "tough" to players who want the old settings back.

 

[all4greed]

Just checked - no response from management and minimums have not been reduced.

I mostly play tournaments and have never had a cashout. The reason I know this is I still have the original request for fax back docs that I never fill out unless I have a withdrawal. No one needs to see my ID until I request a withdrawal.

So it's not just a me thing or a "software" issue. I haven't PM'd since it looks like someone already did that. When, and if, that person responds, I'll provide my account info privately.

 

[rainmaker]

Just checked - no response from management and minimums have not been reduced.

I mostly play tournaments and have never had a cashout. The reason I know this is I still have the original request for fax back docs that I never fill out unless I have a withdrawal. No one needs to see my ID until I request a withdrawal.

So it's not just a me thing or a "software" issue. I haven't PM'd since it looks like someone already did that. When, and if, that person responds, I'll provide my account info privately.

clubworld has been logged in and they have been reading this thread several times tonight, so a bit strange that they haven`t replied yet with some information.

 

[all4greed]

Email that was sent:

Minimum Slot Bet Requirement
Sent By:me@comcast.net
On: Feb 02/01/11 12:47 AM
To: support@clubworldcasinos.com

(Please forward this to a manager)

I noticed that the minimum bet on 20 line slots is $1.00 instead of .20 to play all lines. I like to pick what denomination amounts, usually a penny or two and don't like the new minimum set level. Can you change this?

Attached is my chat just a few minutes ago.

xxx
Account xxx

 

[takethemoney]

This is starting to look like RTG casinos CAN, after all, make these setting changes to SPECIFIC player accounts, rather than having to make a global change.

Even if this turns out to have been done in error, it STILL shows what CAN be done by RTG. We now have the possibilty that it is not ONLY the limits, but the RTP settings, that can be defined on a per player basis.

Even if this is not so, RTG have repeatedly been "economical with the truth", and in the discussions on RTP settings we were told that these changes could only be applied "across the board" for all players in a casino, yet here we have SOME players with raised minimum bets, yet others with no changes. Surely any update would be triggered for EVERY player at next login, so this really should NOT be happening due to delayed updates.

It seems the affected players were never told, and CS are treating it as something that CANNOT be changed back by just saying "it's how the software is", implying "tough" to players who want the old settings back.

What you just posted has been at the root of my suspicions ever since I won over $40k in RJ's at Cherry Red. Since that time I have gone something like 116 deposits with nary a cashin, taking a bonus on 85% of those deposits and just cannot get anywhere. I'm not a big bettor. My bet range is normally 20c to $1, as it has always been. I've gone through over $20k in all those deposits. It's become almost too predictable, normally starting with immediate losses, few features and low payouts on those features when they do appear. Anyone who would have observed my results would have their head shaking, going WTF? Well, WTF that many times is just not acceptable anymore. And the casinos wonder why they don't get much from me anymore......

 

[vinylweatherman]

What you just posted has been at the root of my suspicions ever since I won over $40k in RJ's at Cherry Red. Since that time I have gone something like 116 deposits with nary a cashin, taking a bonus on 85% of those deposits and just cannot get anywhere. I'm not a big bettor. My bet range is normally 20c to $1, as it has always been. I've gone through over $20k in all those deposits. It's become almost too predictable, normally starting with immediate losses, few features and low payouts on those features when they do appear. Anyone who would have observed my results would have their head shaking, going WTF? Well, WTF that many times is just not acceptable anymore. And the casinos wonder why they don't get much from me anymore......

This illustrates the problem when things look "dodgy".

We have a case here that shows that a minimum bet of $1 can be set that applies only to SOME players, whilst the rest can still bet right down to 1c per line. We also know that there are RTP settings available, so one conclusion a player like yourself reaches is that this too is something that can be applied to only SOME players, leaving these players reduced to 91%, yet the rest still on 95%. This is all at "management discretion", just as is the decision whether to "bonus ban" or "boot out" a player. Your 20K win is a "motive" for management to "use their discretion" to alter the parameters on YOUR account in the hope of increasing their odds of getting that 20K back, rather than outright "bonus banning" or "booting" you from the casino.

Rival recently got embroiled in a similar matter, and they foolishly did this to Kasino King, who is a "credible witness" on the forum, so when he says he got booted, and found his bet limits changed when he logged back in, as far as I am concerned, it happened.

Given that this is Thursday, I am baffled by the unwillingness of the operator to comment on this, even if this is to say "sorry, seems to be a software error". Looks like they are figuring out the best way to tell us an unpalatable truth.

 

[LHofsdal]

What you just posted has been at the root of my suspicions ever since I won over $40k in RJ's at Cherry Red. Since that time I have gone something like 116 deposits with nary a cashin, taking a bonus on 85% of those deposits and just cannot get anywhere. I'm not a big bettor. My bet range is normally 20c to $1, as it has always been. I've gone through over $20k in all those deposits. It's become almost too predictable, normally starting with immediate losses, few features and low payouts on those features when they do appear. Anyone who would have observed my results would have their head shaking, going WTF? Well, WTF that many times is just not acceptable anymore. And the casinos wonder why they don't get much from me anymore......

This is so true!!! Ever since I won that RJ of 17K at LuckyRed, I can't hit a anything at anyone of those casinos in the group. I took VWM advice and played at the one where I have never won anything at Manhattan slots. Well guess what, I still haven't won anything there. I am sure of it now that you have posted your similar story that we are on some kind of "black list". I also remember the person who won 5 RJs at Inetbet, if I am not mistaken they have posted they can hit anything either.

Is it the casinos fault or is it RTG? That is one question I can find the answer to. If anyone knows or has thoughts on this, please fill me in.


On a side note, I did PM Tom, the CWC rep, because my settings were changed to just like All4greeds. He did rectify the situation for me.
All the best,
LH

 

[vinylweatherman]

This is so true!!! Ever since I won that RJ of 17K at LuckyRed, I can't hit a anything at anyone of those casinos in the group. I took VWM advice and played at the one where I have never won anything at Manhattan slots. Well guess what, I still haven't won anything there. I am sure of it now that you have posted your similar story that we are on some kind of "black list". I also remember the person who won 5 RJs at Inetbet, if I am not mistaken they have posted they can hit anything either.

Is it the casinos fault or is it RTG? That is one question I can find the answer to. If anyone knows or has thoughts on this, please fill me in.


On a side note, I did PM Tom, the CWC rep, because my settings were changed to just like All4greeds. He did rectify the situation for me.All the best,
LH

Shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. Too late, yet another unpalatable truth about RTG settings has emerged. They CAN be made on a "per player" basis, rather than only "across the board" at an individual casino. It also seems this was done WITHOUT the players asking for it, and indeed other players who would like the setting changed back are finding it's a "no can do" situation because "it's the software".

This could end up being as controversial as the "student" issue. CW said the REASON they had the student clause was because they wanted to ensure that their players "gambled responsibly". HOW is FORCING a mimimum bet of $1 on a player who is uncomfortable staking at this level "responsible gambling"? Why can OTHER players STILL stake a mere 20c or 25c, and are NOT forced into staking $1 per spin.

Is this simply one of those "get rid of the micro-rollers" moves, with the change actually having been TARGETED at players who frequently stake this low, and those that rarely stake less than $1 in any case having been left alone.
A consequence of this change is that affected players can no longer completely "zero out" if they can't access the 1c coin size.

 

[Mousey]

This illustrates the problem when things look "dodgy".

....
Rival recently got embroiled in a similar matter, and they foolishly did this to Kasino King, who is a "credible witness" on the forum, so when he says he got booted, and found his bet limits changed when he logged back in, as far as I am concerned, it happened.

Given that this is Thursday, I am baffled by the unwillingness of the operator to comment on this, even if this is to say "sorry, seems to be a software error". Looks like they are figuring out the best way to tell us an unpalatable truth.

I, too, experienced bet limit changes (lowered)... more than once... at Rival casinos. Usually, though not always, playing on a bonus. And always during a 'good' (for me) run on the particular slot. Very creepy experience.

Club World really need to address this... and pronto! We need to know who initiated the change. Did the casino do it themselves? Did they phone up RTG and have it changed for ONE player? Is it a software display glitch? Very strange situation.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I, too, experienced bet limit changes (lowered)... more than once... at Rival casinos. Usually, though not always, playing on a bonus. And always during a 'good' (for me) run on the particular slot. Very creepy experience.

Club World really need to address this... and pronto! We need to know who initiated the change. Did the casino do it themselves? Did they phone up RTG and have it changed for ONE player? Is it a software display glitch? Very strange situation.

I doubt it is just ONE player, but I remember years ago when phynqster was saying how RTG rogue operators could mess around, and make changes to individual player accounts, and this meant RTP changes. He gave as an example, booting a Blackjack player who was doing well, and setting the game to 255 decks to throw him off his stride.

RTG went to considerable lengths to assure us that there was no way this could be done to individual players, and that any changes had to be done over the casino as a whole. We have just begun to accept this, and now THIS happens to cast even further doubt on what we have been told previously.

It is clear that RIVAL booted a player to lower their betting limits, but they have completely trashed their reputation anyway, and don't seem to care.
RTG on the other hand, are trying to assure us that they do NOT do anything "dodgy", and that they will make changes to ensure that this does not happen.

It would be better had RTG "come clean" during these earlier discussions and told us about THIS option too, and that different limits could be applied to different players, not just the casino as a whole.

 

[anniemac]

I'll play devil's advocate here. It is possible that this is not something that CW did but is really a tech error. Why I say this is because of the ongoing problem I am having with the 'It's a Mystery' game at Lucky Club. It is a tech problem and it is player specific. All the rest of you can play the game and I can play it at other casinos, just not a Lucky Club.

Could be this is what is happening at CW. Or not. But I will give them the benefit of the doubt because if ever there was a low roller, it's me and my game play is fine.

 

[all4greed]

I sent a PM to the rep, no reply to my email.

It surely isn't an addicted gambling issue since my last deposit was around $40 months ago, the one before that $25 and that one lasted at least one month.

I've had some good runs on the tournaments but wipe the balance down with VP.

 

[takethemoney]

I'm just going to throw this out there, be things as they may, as this may be taken as just another conspiracy theory by those who don't view things as those with extensive experience, but....here goes:

We have already found out that the RTP settings available to the operator are not as we had been previously told. They are different.

We have discovered that the minimum bet amount can be applied to different players.

Some of us have been suspicious that not all of us enjoy the same RTP at the same casinos, or even across the RTG network, no matter which casino we play.

So, this really leaves me suspicious that maybe the casino uses computer data to determine which players to apply certain protocol to. Maybe it's by IP range, name and address criteria, or perhaps, similar usernames.

At this point, will most of us really believe what the casinos want to tell us, especially when untruths have already been exposed? What can we expect casinos to tell us? My guess is denial for the purposes of damage control. It will be argued that the casinos have nothing to gain by doing this. I say they have much more to gain...like recouping $20k+ and I'm just one player.

 

[Nate]

3 Days and counting for Club World to grace us with their presence.

WTG!!!!

Nate

 

[all4greed]

I received a PM from Tom which I will post as this concerns other players and was not a software issue as support told me. Betting denominations have been restored.

I can see from the event log on your account that the algorithm we use has put you into a group that has slightly different table limits. From looking at this myself i can see that this group is not appropriate for you so i have manually adjusted this back for you.

I don't consider making the minimum bet $1/$1.25 a slight change as I'm mostly a low roller.

[bitch on]I don't appreciate:

Waiting 3 days for a response and only getting one once I send a PM

Being told to update Adobe

That software was the issue

That I can reduce lines played[/bitch off]

 

[rainmaker]

I received a PM from Tom which I will post as this concerns other players and was not a software issue as support told me. Betting denominations have been restored.

I can see from the event log on your account that the algorithm we use has put you into a group that has slightly different table limits. From looking at this myself i can see that this group is not appropriate for you so i have manually adjusted this back for you.

I don't consider making the minimum bet $1/$1.25 a slight change as I'm mostly a low roller.

[bitch on]I don't appreciate:

Waiting 3 days for a response and only getting one once I send a PM

Being told to update Adobe

That software was the issue

That I can reduce lines played[/bitch off]

I don`t like this at all. Club World should have given a better explanation.

Why did they use 3 days to give a reply?

The rep has "manually" adjusted your betting limit...wow. What more can they "manually change?

This "algorithm", had it originaly calculated that your wheren`t allowed to be a "low roller" anymore?

 

[jas2587]

mine is still set at $1 an $1.25 min
not happening here will not play there at all

Cindy

This sucks

 

[takethemoney]

mine is still set at $1 an $1.25 min
not happening here will not play there at all

Cindy

This sucks

My feelings on this are that one of the conditions of being accredited should be that things like this are not allowed to happen.

 

[slotjunkie]

Shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. Too late, yet another unpalatable truth about RTG settings has emerged. They CAN be made on a "per player" basis, rather than only "across the board" at an individual casino. It also seems this was done WITHOUT the players asking for it, and indeed other players who would like the setting changed back are finding it's a "no can do" situation because "it's the software".

This could end up being as controversial as the "student" issue. CW said the REASON they had the student clause was because they wanted to ensure that their players "gambled responsibly". HOW is FORCING a mimimum bet of $1 on a player who is uncomfortable staking at this level "responsible gambling"? Why can OTHER players STILL stake a mere 20c or 25c, and are NOT forced into staking $1 per spin.

Is this simply one of those "get rid of the micro-rollers" moves, with the change actually having been TARGETED at players who frequently stake this low, and those that rarely stake less than $1 in any case having been left alone.
A consequence of this change is that affected players can no longer completely "zero out" if they can't access the 1c coin size.

I posted something on this when I first started online which was mid '09! I was skeptical and for good reason!
I posted between then and early 2010 just don't remember where! I think I will spend a little time looking for that post and on my computer for any info I may have saved! There was a site I had found that stated just that; how operators had the ability to set settings for individual players, including changing lines or something to that effect!

 

[Perc]

I really don't understand why they would do that.

If someone normally bets higher, they would likely continue to bet high and not even notice, so there's no point forcing it on them. They could also get pissed off if they wanted to bet lower for whatever reason, like trying to zero their balance after losing on a bonus (could be impossible if there's no way to bet one cent).

If someone normally bets lower, they will likely just quit playing there, especially when CS tells them it must be a software issue.

The whole idea seems to be a good way to chase people away, not make more money.

 

[2btakn]

Club World

I talked with live chat today and this is what I got
Please wait for a site operator to respond.
info: You are now chatting with 'Cobie'
Cobie: Hello!
Cobie: How are you?
Freda: Im OK. Thanks for asking
Cobie: Good to hear.
Cobie: The system we have is different for all players.
Cobie: The system arranges for players what they think will be best for them, there is nothing i can do to change this,
Freda: so because i bet higher it put it at what I usually start at? Ok that kinda makes more sense.
Freda: But I don't understand why I don't have any offers besides the 35%. I have put at least $700 and haven't gotten anywhere..
Freda: how do you close an account?
Cobie: I understand this, everything here is set by the system.
Cobie: The only thing i can do is to email the promotions team for you and se if there is anything they can do.
Freda: Ok could you do that? I really did enjoy playing here and would always deposit here first before anywhere else
Cobie: I will email them for you, no problem.
Freda: Ok thank you very much Cobie
Cobie: Your welcome..

I normally do play .75 up to $2.50 but don't like the fact I now HAVE to bet $1.25 just to play. He also told me there is nothing he can do about it but I see that someone said a rep readjusted their account so what gives? I really did enjoy playing there but won't be anymore I like to chose what I want to bet not bet what they want me to. So disappointing. Now...can someone tell me where is a good place to deposit that has a short cash out time? I know the accredited list is there but.... Thanks

Freda

 

[rainmaker]

I talked with live chat today and this is what I got
Please wait for a site operator to respond.
info: You are now chatting with 'Cobie'
Cobie: Hello!
Cobie: How are you?
Freda: Im OK. Thanks for asking
Cobie: Good to hear.
Cobie: The system we have is different for all players.
Cobie: The system arranges for players what they think will be best for them, there is nothing i can do to change this,
Freda: so because i bet higher it put it at what I usually start at? Ok that kinda makes more sense.
Freda: But I don't understand why I don't have any offers besides the 35%. I have put at least $700 and haven't gotten anywhere..
Freda: how do you close an account?
Cobie: I understand this, everything here is set by the system.
Cobie: The only thing i can do is to email the promotions team for you and se if there is anything they can do.
Freda: Ok could you do that? I really did enjoy playing here and would always deposit here first before anywhere else
Cobie: I will email them for you, no problem.
Freda: Ok thank you very much Cobie
Cobie: Your welcome..

I normally do play .75 up to $2.50 but don't like the fact I now HAVE to bet $1.25 just to play. He also told me there is nothing he can do about it but I see that someone said a rep readjusted their account so what gives? I really did enjoy playing there but won't be anymore I like to chose what I want to bet not bet what they want me to. So disappointing. Now...can someone tell me where is a good place to deposit that has a short cash out time? I know the accredited list is there but.... Thanks

Freda

As I wrote, I don`t like this at all, and it is not accepteable. You are right. The rep here did "manually" change the limit for all4greed. The CS did tell you that they can NOT change the limit "manually". The CS is either lying, or don`t know better.

The whole case is roguish.

 

[jas2587]

I have never ever bet over $1.25 a spin its usually a $1 or less this just isn't right I am going to uninstall all their casino's

Cindy

to me IMO they used to be a good group before they pulled this crap