Playzee dispute over $150,000

[maxd]

"Yes" or "no" please, I don't want there to be any misunderstandings down the road.

- Max

 

[Minxxx]

Yes understood.

 

[Minxxx]

I have recieved this response back from the pOgg:

Hi kitty69,

If you believe that the operator in question has not appropriately complied with a Subject Access Request (a request for information about your account), then we would direct you to the appropriate data control governmental agency in your country of residence. They would be the party responsible for managing an issue of this nature.

Supposition that the operator in question may not have fully complied with a SAR request and that this potentially missing information may have bearing on your claim is not sound grounds for us to reopen this matter.

We've reviewed your claim and we are satisfied that the operator was within their rights to enforce the win limit as defined in their terms and conditions. If you obtain evidence to the contrary, please feel free to let us know, but for the present time we do not see sufficient grounds to pursue this matter further.

ThePOGG.

I thought I would report back before doing anything else rather than potentially jeporadise any further help from you guys like what I had done previously.

 

[maxd]

Yes understood.

Fair enough. I will proceed as previously described.

- Max

 

[Minxxx]

Fair enough. I will proceed as previously described.

- Max

Thank you.

 

[Minxxx]

Heya.
I understand this won't be on the top of your priorities list, but just thought I would check in to see if there' has been any change in the matter as far as the casino responding or if there is anything that needs attention from my side at all.

Thank you

 

[maxd]

Sorry, missed this. If you want someone to know you've posted you need to @___ them. For instance by adding @maxd to your message I would get notification and would then be able to respond in a more timely manner. I'll @Minxxx you now and you'll see how that works.

To answer your question, no the casino has not responded. I remind you of our previous agreement:

If they say "no", or give no reply at all, then that's "game over" in terms of us being able to help you. This would be the end of the road for us and our involvement with this particular complaint. This means "case closed": no re-do's, no "but I found this", no nothing. Fini.

Do you understand and accept all that?

To which you said "yes". And that, as agreed, is "case closed".

- Max

 

[kou187]

I hate reading stories like this. Seems like even when lightning does actually strike. Some how the casino will always find a way to tell you to piss off. However you probs could deposit £20'000 and no questions asked.

 

[Minxxx]

Pretty much. Especially when it has a 6figure win involved I misrepresented my case mistake 101 mind you I was gobsmacked I didn't play expecting to win $150k that's for sure. The only thing I've got left on my side now is my game play log which looks questionable on the casinos part so if it's ment to be I guess It will happen.

 

[maxd]

"my game play log which looks questionable on the casinos part"
Says who? I thought you said you couldn't make head nor tails of the play log data.

And AFAIK it's not a question of what's in the logs, it's a question of whether you fully completed the bonus requirements per the Terms.
Depositing while bonus Terms are still in effect -- which you did -- does not terminate, erase or nulify the bonus requirements and/or restrictions. It is because of this that your winnings were cut back per the Max Withdrawal rules in effect at the time.
It's my understanding that that is the crux of your case.

Just to be clear, the casino's designated ADR (ThePogg) has ruled on your case -- not once, but twice -- and they decided in the casino's favour both times. Having reviewed their ruling statement and the correspondence between you I see no reason to question their decision. You've also gone to the other designated ADR, eCOGRA, and they've said "pass" because ThePogg has already ruled on it.

I've told you, more than once now, that if you want to question the ADR's ruling you have to make your case to them. They've already said they'll look at any new and pertinent evidence you may have but you haven't any and that's why your case is dead in the water.

I've also explained to you that if you keep banging on about this here with no justification then doors will close that you won't be able to open again. We have Forum Rules and you are in violation of item 1.11, repeatedly. So now it comes: effective immediately you are in the Moderated group, meaning any future posts you may make will have to be approved _before_ they appear on the forums. Any future posts on this Playzee subject will almost certainly be deleted without further comment. If you truly have something relevant and significant related to your Playzee case I've already described to you what you need to prepare and how you may approach us with that. Otherwise, enough is enough and the "personal agenda" stuff stops here.

- Max

 

[Minxxx]

I could interpret parts of the data not ALL of it and I had someone who's a bit more clued up then myself look over it for me The casino confiscated my balance....not my loyalty points so it looks as though they have put all my game play down as "LOYALTY" which Is a crock of

I did offer to send the log through but you implied there was no need so left it at that

Of course with a 6 figure win I well and truly wagered the silly bonus it was long gone behind me when I won that money fair and square. As I said I misrepresented my case in the first place my mistake. I'm only wanting what I rightfully won. Nothing more nothing less.

 

[maxd]

I see you've posted yet again on this subject. We'll take that as your closing remarks. Allow me to make a few closing remarks as well.

The unfortunate truth of your case is that you never "won that money fair and square" because you were still playing within the restrictions of a bonus that capped your winnings. The designated ADR -- ThePogg -- told you this, I read their work on the case and supported that conclusion. I see CasinoGuru has also done the same. The conclusion is clear: you were never entitled to that 150 grand because of the bonus restrictions -- specifically Max WD -- that were still in effect at the time.

The problem here is that none of that matters to you. Early on in this process you set yourself the goal of getting that money, full stop. Reason, rules, truthfullness and anything else that got in your way has been nothing more than an irritation to you. You had set your goal and that was that, anything that wasn't helpful to you was white noise and simply ignored. Anything that might help you, or at least keep the conversation going, was fair game regardless of truth, reality or facts to the contrary.

This is what's known as the Marcia Gay Harden Effect after her role as Mrs Carmody in The Mist: set your goal, grasp onto anything that might help, disregard anything that doesn't help, and never quit.

The problem with this is that it is fundamentally disrespectful to anyone who crosses your path. If they help you that's great and they're useful, for the moment. If they disagree and/or don't help you then they are dead to you, ignore what they say and forget them.

As evidence of this I point to the fact that you've ignored both ThePogg and CasinoGuru in their decisions on your case. At one point you came to us but repeatedly ignored and violated the PAB rules: you never told us that you'd gone to ThePogg, or eCOGRA after that. You claimed to be a rookie and not know how things worked but when it was explained to you you couldn't be bothered to listen. Through all of this you've failed to mention having gone to CasinoGuru and failing there too. When given advice or guidance on your case you just ignore it, or twist it into something you think you can use.

Those play records for example, what evidence do they have that supports your case? None, which is exactly what ThePogg told you. But that hasn't stopped you throwing them into the conversation for random reasons. First it was "the casino is hiding something!" because supposedly they wouldn't give you the records. And then they did, in pretty much exactly the time frame they said they would.

The bottom line is do those records show that you had fully completed the bonus requirements in their entirety? No, they do not. All this bumff about playing on "my money" or Loyalty Points or whatever is just rubbish. You're only saying that to keep the conversation going. Might as well say "records show I played on a Wednesday!" or "my birthday is in June!" So what? What relevance does that have? None, but that's not the point is it? It's something to say to keep people talking -- or so you imagine -- and that makes it fair game as far as you are concerned.

I've warned you that the end result of all this will be that doors will close on you: people eventually just stop listening, largely out of self-defence. I've taken the time -- one last time -- to explain why we're now doing the same.

 

[hubbadubbadingdong]

I see you've posted yet again on this subject. We'll take that as your closing remarks. Allow me to make a few closing remarks as well.

The unfortunate truth of your case is that you never "won that money fair and square" because you were still playing within the restrictions of a bonus that capped your winnings. The designated ADR -- ThePogg -- told you this, I read their work on the case and supported that conclusion. I see CasinoGuru has also done the same. The conclusion is clear: you were never entitled to that 150 grand because of the bonus restrictions -- specifically Max WD -- that were still in effect at the time.

The problem here is that none of that matters to you. Early on in this process you set yourself the goal of getting that money, full stop. Reason, rules, truthfullness and anything else that got in your way has been nothing more than an irritation to you. You had set your goal and that was that, anything that wasn't helpful to you was white noise and simply ignored. Anything that might help you, or at least keep the conversation going, was fair game regardless of truth, reality or facts to the contrary.

This is what's known as the Marcia Gay Harden Effect after her role as Mrs Carmody in The Mist: set your goal, grasp onto anything that might help, disregard anything that doesn't help, and never quit.

The problem with this is that it is fundamentally disrespectful to anyone who crosses your path. If they help you that's great and they're useful, for the moment. If they disagree and/or don't help you then they are dead to you, ignore what they say and forget them.

As evidence of this I point to the fact that you've ignored both ThePogg and CasinoGuru in their decisions on your case. At one point you came to us but repeatedly ignored and violated the PAB rules: you never told us that you'd gone to ThePogg, or eCOGRA after that. You claimed to be a rookie and not know how things worked but when it was explained to you you couldn't be bothered to listen. Through all of this you've failed to mention having gone to CasinoGuru and failing there too. When given advice or guidance on your case you just ignore it, or twist it into something you think you can use.

Those play records for example, what evidence do they have that supports your case? None, which is exactly what ThePogg told you. But that hasn't stopped you throwing them into the conversation for random reasons. First it was "the casino is hiding something!" because supposedly they wouldn't give you the records. And then they did, in pretty much exactly the time frame they said they would.

The bottom line is do those records show that you had fully completed the bonus requirements in their entirety? No, they do not. All this bumff about playing on "my money" or Loyalty Points or whatever is just rubbish. You're only saying that to keep the conversation going. Might as well say "records show I played on a Wednesday!" or "my birthday is in June!" So what? What relevance does that have? None, but that's not the point is it? It's something to say to keep people talking -- or so you imagine -- and that makes it fair game as far as you are concerned.

I've warned you that the end result of all this will be that doors will close on you: people eventually just stop listening, largely out of self-defence. I've taken the time -- one last time -- to explain why we're now doing the same.

Don’t mean to chime in here - but I remember being Given $50 bonus cash from Cashino ? I think - decided to play Razor shark $5 spins (was $5 max on bonus)

Of course 2nd spin hit 2500 coin and Boom $12,500 ran that up to $25,000 - it was three weeks before Xmas - I was set

FUCK YEAH , Then i was reminded max cash out for that type of bonus was $200 - … (bottom lip started to quiver) it’s like the games KNOW when you are on bonus cash

I didn’t bother with the $200 i just went balls deep buying the most insane real cash bonuses , went out with a bang !

 

[maxd]

Yeah, bonus Terms can be a real PITA. MANY of the cases I've dealt with over the years have been exactly because of that, bonus Terms that bite.

FWIW, most experienced players I know don't bother with bonuses anymore, too much hassle. But I do understand the lure of "free money" to play with. Problem is (of course) that it's never really "free" and players often end up paying for it dearly.

 

[hubbadubbadingdong]

Yeah, bonus Terms can be a real PITA. MANY of the cases I've dealt with over the years have been exactly because of that, bonus Terms that bite.

FWIW, most experienced players I know don't bother with bonuses anymore, too much hassle. But I do understand the lure of "free money" to play with. Problem is (of course) that it's never really "free" and players often end up paying for it dearly.

I never take a bonus unless my account at zero and it’s free $$, with no depositing required - as you get stiffed somewhere if you ever win

 

[Avernite]

I never take a bonus unless my account at zero and it’s free $$, with no depositing required - as you get stiffed somewhere if you ever win

I'm very careful with the bonuses I accept. I don't mind max bet as I'm a low roller for the most part, but will never take one with max cashout or a big list of restricted games. Easier to play raw at that point.

 

[shadow123]

Gave up UK bonuses years ago, impossible to benifit from them and more likely than not used as an excuse not to pay out
decent wins ,play at BC Game quite a lot now, the bonuses are small, mostly based on wagering turnover but quite a few different
ones that all add up.They are paid as real money with no restrictions and can be cashed out any time,
Managed to turn $17 into over 1000 recently ,cashed out and in the bank in minutes

 

[slot_zombie]

I actually got a 200% parachute bonus offered by an offshore casino last week. Nearly fell off my chair as those casinos usually offer smaller bonuses based on previous play and losses.

 

[Guntis]

I actually used welcome bonuses only around 3-5 times in my entire life. Once i deposited in William Hill £200 (half of my wages then) and on the live chat they told me that the welcome bonus 'will help me to win'... So, i accepted it and managed to get up to £400 and then i wanted to cash the money out, but i was not allowed to, which i then did not know about, and while being pissed off lost all £400 ... lol. That was a lesson after which i stopped accepting any bonuses except for wager-free cashback. Now i know very well everything about how it all works, but things like 'bonuses' or anything to the word 'free' related are not my thing ...