Bit of a story of a comedy of errors, especially when considering the whole picture. Yes, I am at fault for not checking the overall Licencee from the outset, but what transpires has confused/irritated/angered me.
18th April 2016 - a day of frustration from start to finish!
1am - create account at Full Tilt to play at their casino. Played a bit, had balance up to $350 and wished to withdraw, unable to do so due to 48 hour pending period.
11am - log back in and peruse their site a bit more - find out they are linked to Pokerstars (with whom I have an active self exclusion - reason for such is irrelevant)
11.20am - e-mail them to ask if my account at Full Tilt is ok baring in mind SE at Pokerstars
11.46am - reply saying 'If you have requested a Self-Exclusion in PokerStars you will be permitted to play in Full Tilt.'
1.24pm - e-mail them to confirm their reply as it didn't sound correct to me.
2.16pm - reply saying 'As advised by my colleague, the self exclusion of your PokerStars account will not affect your Full Tilt account. Therefore, your future deposit and cash out will be honoured as normal'
Later that day/evening I carry on playing there and in the reassurance that all is ok, make further deposits.
9.52pm - during game play, account becomes locked and I receive an e-mail from them saying 'Please be aware that your account has been excluded; in-line with the United Kingdom Gaming regulations. Our records show that you have previously requested a ‘cross-site’ exclusion through the PokerStars software and confirmed this action.'
11.01pm - e-mail them pointing out their previous 'ok to play' e-mails and asking what the situation exactly is.
11.42pm - reply saying my e-mail was forwarded to team responsible for handling this matter.
21st April 2016
00.10am - e-mail them asking for an update
22nd April 2016
1.01am - e-mail them again as no reply, now raising it as a dispute/complaint
24th April 2016
3.42am - received reply saying they are reviewing the situation
6.50am - received reply saying it is forwarded to a supervisor
7.39am - received reply from their Responsible Gaming Specialist. Contents of which are puzzling to say the least! They state (extracts from their e-mail in italics):
- It seems that there has been a misunderstanding and you have been given two different versions of our policies.
- Cross site exclusion 'will happen is if you request a Self-Exclusion for 180 days'
- It seems that there was some confusion with your case because our Security Staff restricted your account based on a 120 days exclusion (obviously self excluding for 120 days is a lot less severe than excluding for 180 as that means you exclude from all their sites!!!)
- Please let us clarify that your Full Tilt account was restricted in error. The truth is that you should not have been restricted from playing due to the exclusion requested at PokerStars. This is based on the current requirements of the UK Gaming Regulation. (errrr, there is only one licence for Amaya Group which includes Pokerstars, Full Tilt and BetStars, so how can they follow different UKGC rules for SE?)
- Now, we were going to reopen your account but we are concerned
- Your accounts have been closed until this situation is clarified.
Naturally I am puzzled on a few aspects and e-mailed them back on the evening of 24th April (turn of midnight, so 25/04/16) and no reply yet. Brief extract of said e-mail is:
Given the current situation and erroneous statements made by staff at Full Tilt, I have investigated further and with regards to your remark of 'we would like to know if you still have doubts about our policies', please could you, in your capacity as an authorised representative of Full Tilt on behalf of Amaya Group Ltd (the licencee), clarify the following:
1. For ease of reference, there is only one UKGC licence issued to cover the various sites/brands (namely Pokerstars, Full Tilt and BetStars) under Amaya Group Ltd and that each entity must adhere to the Code of Conduct and the Licence Conditions for such licence.
2. With regards to your e-mail, you state that if I had requested a 180 day self exclusion then all accounts under Amaya Group Ltd would be blocked, but it is satisfactory to have open and operational accounts given that I had requested a 120 day self exclusion period. Please clarify what the difference is with each self exclusion, apart from duration.
3. As we can agree that there is a self exclusion in place with the licencee, Amaya Group Ltd with licence number 39108, you have said ‘The truth is that you should not have been restricted from playing due to the exclusion requested at PokerStars. This is based on the current requirements of the UK Gaming Regulation.’ I have read the licence conditions and under section 3.5.3 of the code of practice, I cannot find reference to allowing a self excluded player to carry on gaming activities with the licencee. Please advise of the exception to this rule based on the current requirements.
4. Throughout your e-mail you have insisted there is an error in my account being closed/blocked, but you will keep the account closed until clarified. Please state who you are awaiting clarification from?
Well, that's my little bitch and moan out the way! I think they are confused about licence conditions and are naive to their responsibilities.
Rest assured, I am not unhappy if I had lost, more so that they allowed the account to be operational despite my concerns, then close it after I made further deposits and regardless to what the balance was!
Make sense to anyone? if not, not to worry. No more bitch and moans from me as I will be playing at my select few favourites now without trying anyone else!
18th April 2016 - a day of frustration from start to finish!
1am - create account at Full Tilt to play at their casino. Played a bit, had balance up to $350 and wished to withdraw, unable to do so due to 48 hour pending period.
11am - log back in and peruse their site a bit more - find out they are linked to Pokerstars (with whom I have an active self exclusion - reason for such is irrelevant)
11.20am - e-mail them to ask if my account at Full Tilt is ok baring in mind SE at Pokerstars
11.46am - reply saying 'If you have requested a Self-Exclusion in PokerStars you will be permitted to play in Full Tilt.'
1.24pm - e-mail them to confirm their reply as it didn't sound correct to me.
2.16pm - reply saying 'As advised by my colleague, the self exclusion of your PokerStars account will not affect your Full Tilt account. Therefore, your future deposit and cash out will be honoured as normal'
Later that day/evening I carry on playing there and in the reassurance that all is ok, make further deposits.
9.52pm - during game play, account becomes locked and I receive an e-mail from them saying 'Please be aware that your account has been excluded; in-line with the United Kingdom Gaming regulations. Our records show that you have previously requested a ‘cross-site’ exclusion through the PokerStars software and confirmed this action.'
11.01pm - e-mail them pointing out their previous 'ok to play' e-mails and asking what the situation exactly is.
11.42pm - reply saying my e-mail was forwarded to team responsible for handling this matter.
21st April 2016
00.10am - e-mail them asking for an update
22nd April 2016
1.01am - e-mail them again as no reply, now raising it as a dispute/complaint
24th April 2016
3.42am - received reply saying they are reviewing the situation
6.50am - received reply saying it is forwarded to a supervisor
7.39am - received reply from their Responsible Gaming Specialist. Contents of which are puzzling to say the least! They state (extracts from their e-mail in italics):
- It seems that there has been a misunderstanding and you have been given two different versions of our policies.
- Cross site exclusion 'will happen is if you request a Self-Exclusion for 180 days'
- It seems that there was some confusion with your case because our Security Staff restricted your account based on a 120 days exclusion (obviously self excluding for 120 days is a lot less severe than excluding for 180 as that means you exclude from all their sites!!!)
- Please let us clarify that your Full Tilt account was restricted in error. The truth is that you should not have been restricted from playing due to the exclusion requested at PokerStars. This is based on the current requirements of the UK Gaming Regulation. (errrr, there is only one licence for Amaya Group which includes Pokerstars, Full Tilt and BetStars, so how can they follow different UKGC rules for SE?)
- Now, we were going to reopen your account but we are concerned
- Your accounts have been closed until this situation is clarified.
Naturally I am puzzled on a few aspects and e-mailed them back on the evening of 24th April (turn of midnight, so 25/04/16) and no reply yet. Brief extract of said e-mail is:
Given the current situation and erroneous statements made by staff at Full Tilt, I have investigated further and with regards to your remark of 'we would like to know if you still have doubts about our policies', please could you, in your capacity as an authorised representative of Full Tilt on behalf of Amaya Group Ltd (the licencee), clarify the following:
1. For ease of reference, there is only one UKGC licence issued to cover the various sites/brands (namely Pokerstars, Full Tilt and BetStars) under Amaya Group Ltd and that each entity must adhere to the Code of Conduct and the Licence Conditions for such licence.
2. With regards to your e-mail, you state that if I had requested a 180 day self exclusion then all accounts under Amaya Group Ltd would be blocked, but it is satisfactory to have open and operational accounts given that I had requested a 120 day self exclusion period. Please clarify what the difference is with each self exclusion, apart from duration.
3. As we can agree that there is a self exclusion in place with the licencee, Amaya Group Ltd with licence number 39108, you have said ‘The truth is that you should not have been restricted from playing due to the exclusion requested at PokerStars. This is based on the current requirements of the UK Gaming Regulation.’ I have read the licence conditions and under section 3.5.3 of the code of practice, I cannot find reference to allowing a self excluded player to carry on gaming activities with the licencee. Please advise of the exception to this rule based on the current requirements.
4. Throughout your e-mail you have insisted there is an error in my account being closed/blocked, but you will keep the account closed until clarified. Please state who you are awaiting clarification from?
Well, that's my little bitch and moan out the way! I think they are confused about licence conditions and are naive to their responsibilities.
Rest assured, I am not unhappy if I had lost, more so that they allowed the account to be operational despite my concerns, then close it after I made further deposits and regardless to what the balance was!
Make sense to anyone? if not, not to worry. No more bitch and moans from me as I will be playing at my select few favourites now without trying anyone else!