Roguish PKR revoking bonus for no reason.

[blizeH]

They didn't even humour me with a reply! Oh well.

[topoor]

BlizeH you have to report this to Alderney. You will be the fourth person to have this treatment. They cant be allowed to get away with it!

[topoor]

Moneybookers emailed me this morning. I have absolutely no clue what this is all about:

I have discussed the issue again with our Security Department so that they can review the issue once again and so that I am able to provide you with the most detailed and updated information. This is the information I can provide you with in view of coplying with all legal requirements and policies under which our company works.

You can accept this message as a final confirmation that your account at Moneybookers is now closed. Upon registration of your account with Moneybookers you agreed to our Terms and Conditions. Please visit section 7.5 and 11 of our Terms and Conditions for more information:

Moneybookers have the right to recover from you any costs or losses incurred as a direct or indirect result of this breach of our terms and conditions up to the value of 150 Euros.

12.1.....................Moneybookers may at its sole discretion assert reasonable handling expenses the Company incurs by a Customers' misuse of the Service and/or breach of these Terms of Use.

Any balance that remained in your account has been made immediately available for withdraw to you.

We are committed to resolving complaints whenever possible through our complaints procedures.
If a matter cannot be resolved satisfactorily or in case you are not satisfied with this information, you may be able to refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service. This would depend on the nature of the complaint and whether within the rules of the Service the person making the complaint is "eligible" to refer the matter to the Ombudsman.

The Ombudsman Service exists to provide independent adjudication and investigation will be undertaken prior to making a decision about outstanding disputes. A leaflet explaining the Financial Ombudsman Service is available on request, it has been also submitted to you in one of our previous messages. Alternatively the Ombudsman can be contacted direct at the following address:

Financial Ombudsman Service
PO Box 4
South Quay Plaza
183 Marsh Wall
London
E14 9SR
Telephone: 0845 080 1800
E-mail address:enquiries@financial-ombudsman.org.uk
For further information visit the Financial Ombudsman Service website at:
www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk

Thank you for your cooperation and please excuse us for any inconvenience caused.

We hope you find this infromation useful.

Best Regards,

Kamelia,

moneybookers.com Team


All I can summise from this is that they are saying I have breached their terms and conditions and they are making threats that they could recover damages. I would imagine that they would have to tell me what the breach was before they could even consider recovery action!

Still nothing further from Aldereny on either issue.

[Nifty29]

Here are the relevant sections FYI:

7. Receiving Payments

7.5. It is strictly forbidden to receive payments as consideration for the delivery of:


tobacco products,
prescription drugs,
drugs and drug paraphernalia,
firearms and ammunition,
weapons and knives,
satellite and cable TV descramblers,
porn and hardcore content or services,
government IDs and licences,
unlicenced lotteries,
stored value cards or pre-paid debit cards, if they are not associated with a single vendor and don’t have a dedicated use,
illegal multi-level marketing and pyramid selling services or ponzi schemes, matrix programs, other “get rich quick” schemes or High-Yield Investment Programs (HYIP) as well as
illegal downloads or any other goods and services infringing intellectual property rights of a third party.
Furthermore, it is strictly forbidden for citizens or residents of certain countries such as but not limited to the United States of America, Turkey, China, Malaysia or Israel to receive payments from websites offering gambling services such as sports betting, casino games and pokers games. Moneybookers reserves the right in its own discretion to amend the list of countries where it is prohibited to receive payments from gambling activities as described above.

Additionally Moneybookers cannot condone the trade of items or support of organisations that promote hate, violence, or racial intolerance. Therefore, Moneybookers will judiciously disallow organisations that promote or glorify hatred, violence, or racial intolerance from using Moneybookers to receive payments. Furthermore, such organisations may not be listed on any website of Moneybookers customers, nor may any of Moneybookers customers' websites advertise or support such organisations.

11. Termination
Customer may close down his/her account at any time by giving notice to Company’s customer service department. The Company at its sole discretion, reserves the right to close an account of any Customer at any time for any or no reason upon 1 week notice to the Customer and payment of any unrestricted funds held in custody. Moneybookers has the right to immediately close down a Customer account by giving notice if there are valid grounds. Valid grounds are assumed under, but not limited to the following circumstances:

a violation of any applicable law or regulation,
breach of any of these Terms of Use,
if there are reasons to believe that the account has been used in connection with unauthorised or unusual credit/debit card or bank account use, including without limitation, notice of same by Customer’s bank or credit/debit card issuer,
in case of abuse of the reversal or charge back process provided by Customer’s bank or credit/debit card company,
receipt of potentially fraudulent funds,
to comply with money laundering or other investigations conducted by government authorities, agencies or commissions,
return of a payment for insufficient funds in the bank account.

Thought I would save everyone a trip to the MB site

[topoor]

Yes, I forgot to mention that in between trips to the Post Office for my pension I stop off at the local Al Queda stronghold and arrange to pay for nuclear weapons and armour piercing bullets with the £1100 I have in my moneybookers account. Thats not to mention the regular payments to the National Front for the hate filled propaganda material.

What on earth is going on?

[Fleur-De-Lis]

OMG! What a load of cr***p!
I know (sadly, from first-hand personal experience) that Moneybookers can be very difficult to communicate with... but that reference to TOS is so ridiculous that it is even offensive... I know I'd be like totally mad if I got such an email

[vinylweatherman]

Why did they mention 7.5

This is all about RECEIVING payments. This would be what a MERCHANT would do, you deposit, and the casino "receives" the payment.

Moneybookers can also be used for person to person transfer, and this term could also be about RECEIVING a payment via Moneybookers for a banned item (one that is would be illegal to either sell, or use, or which could assist in a crime if misused).

For this case, 7.5 seems totally irrelevant, so why on earth was it quoted?

Term 11 indicates that one or more other terms have been breached, which has resulted in the termination of the account. We know that PKR started this, thanks to one of the service reps.

Term 11 contains two provisions, one requires one week's notice, and the other is instant closure.

Which of these did Moneybookers do?

I got the impression of instant closure, and this is reserved for a serious breach of terms, and not simply them exercising their right to not do business with a customer.

This latest Email is the formal "final decision" that paves the way to complain to the Financial Ombudsman, and Moneybookers seem pretty confident they are in the right, yet the Alderney investigation has yet to produce a decision.


Moneybookers themselves are "in the pit", as they have been actively promoting "Ministering Angel" with a special promotion on the Moneybookers website, now removed of course.

It turns out that Moneybookers have been assisting with the marketing of a fake casino which was being used to extract personal and banking data for future illegal use. The logo for the casino itself was commissioned and paid for with stolen credit cards - Moneybookers can forget about impressing ME with their "high moral standards and compliance" which they use to get rid of a 62 year old recreational gambler just on the say-so of one of their merchants, yet they fell for the smooth patter of the Serbian network behind Ministering Angel, and clearly had no problem with them being "licenced" in Panama (the one thing they freely admitted), which somehow met the requirements of the UK gaming act 2007 with regard to promoting online gambling sites within the EU

[topoor]

Very interesting revelation. I have read some mutterings on line about this casino but wasnt aware of the Moneybookers involvement. I wrote back to Moneybookers and asked them if they are still refusing to provide me with the information I requested under the Data Protection Act. I also reminded them that I have the right to have any incorrect information held about me corrected.

I asked them to be very clear in their reply as I would be forwarding it to the ICO. The response I got informed me that they will be reinvestigating my issue at a managment level and to allow them 3 working days to do so!

Sounds positive.

The AGC still havent received the logs from PKR almost 3 weeks later. When asked why it was taking so long they informed that it wasnt a top priority for PKR.

Perhaps I am naive but if I received a request for logs from my regulatory body in connection with a player complaint I would think it important enough to respond in a timely manner.

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by topoor

Very interesting revelation. I have read some mutterings on line about this casino but wasnt aware of the Moneybookers involvement. I wrote back to Moneybookers and asked them if they are still refusing to provide me with the information I requested under the Data Protection Act. I also reminded them that I have the right to have any incorrect information held about me corrected.

I asked them to be very clear in their reply as I would be forwarding it to the ICO. The response I got informed me that they will be reinvestigating my issue at a managment level and to allow them 3 working days to do so!

Sounds positive.

The AGC still havent received the logs from PKR almost 3 weeks later. When asked why it was taking so long they informed that it wasnt a top priority for PKR.

Perhaps I am naive but if I received a request for logs from my regulatory body in connection with a player complaint I would think it important enough to respond in a timely manner.

Clearly, PKR do not even have proper respect for their regulatory authority. I hope Alderney are not going to sit back and take this BS, it will severely impact upon their credibility with players, and PKR's attitude shows that they may well have something to hide about this whole affair.

Producing playlogs should be both routine, and quick, the back end should be designed to ensure this.

They also claim to be licenced by the UK Gambling Commission, is this just for Poker, or does it include the casino. You could complain to them also, stating that they are failing to co-operate properly with Alderney's investigation, and stress the situation goes further than a dispute over winnings, they have caused Moneybookers to close your account without right to proper appeal and knowing why.

[mpt6cas]

i am get paid without a problem now.
I also hear from friends that their cash out was also succesfull.

But the conversation rate is so horrible O.o

thanks for help here

bye