Texas Holdem shootout

[Gaahl]

I was just wondering if this game is supposed to be random? I have played poker for about 3 years, and while playing at Virgingames casino I saw that they had this game called Texas Holdem shootout and I decided to give it a go. Now this is the question, I know nothing about this game, so, Is it supposed to be a random game? Because I have never in my entire life seen sicker things happen in that game. I have played 100s of thousands of ordinary pokerhands, but never has there happened sicker things than my 1.5 hour session on this casinogames. I would loose 4\5 hands (counted) to runner runner quads, runner runner flush, runner 2 pairs, gutshot str8 etc. It was realy a slaughterhouse, Im not complaining about loosing money, but I like to know if I play a fair game or not.

So I am asking you, is this game supposed to be a random dealt game or is it rigged to a certain payout were you can hit streaks etc?

[aka23]

Many players have reported that the game does not seem random. One player mentioned losing 48 hands in a row. If you search the forum, you can find a couple related threads.

[Gaahl]

Thanx for the headsup aka. I have now searched and read all the threads. But I still got some questions. Was there ever a answer to wether or not the flop, turn and river are randomly dealt? My experience says that it is impossible for it to be. And I must say I feel cheated. I played this game at Virgingames beliving I played a fair game (with an calculated HA, but randomly dealt cards). After loosing 4\5 hands to the sickest things you can imagine. I mean, what are the odds of loosing to runner runner quads, then a gutshot on the river, then a runner runner flush, and then a 2 outer in a row! I have played well over 200 000 "real" poker hands, and that has NEVER happened before.

It is 110£ I wil never see again, I can live with that, but it is a worse when you feel cheated out of them. And I belive I was cheated.

[vinylweatherman]

Despite this issue being raised before, I have seen nothing from the casino side. Unless it is made ABSOLUTELY CLEAR this is a non random AWP type game, it is cheating, and will erode confidence in the fairness of casino games in general.
To have an experienced poker player cast doubt based on nearly a quarter of a million "real" poker games played means there is definitely something here that needs explaining.
A big enough sample from actual gameplay should be enough to show there is a problem with the game, or not, as the case may be.

[KasinoKing]

I my view this game is completely random...
in exactly the same way as a lottery scratchcard is.
You pay your money, some cards turn over, you randomly win or lose.

This game is AWP, and as such it's a pretty funny one. Those ludicrous bad-beats have me splitting my sides!

Here's some from the last few days, for people not familiar:-
(Remember these are 'all-in' before the flop hands)

Tex1506.JPG

Tex1406a.JPG

Tex1406b.JPG

[Rusty]

Reminds me of a few sit n go prima sessions

[vinylweatherman]

The casinos had better come clean about this one. It is a card game, not a slot, and to have it running like one is highly misleading.
Casinos have enough trouble convincing us the other games are really random when we see too many bad beats, but if this is proven to be non-random, then there will be even less confidence in the other games.

The simplest test would be to look at the community cards, as to get this many bad beats, these have to be rigged, rigging the hole cards would not be enough.

[elscrabinda]

This is a poorly thought out game but i don't think its a slot or non-random. The problem is (and they do explain this in the rules) is you are playing against 2 bots who know what the final dealt cards will be. The one which will end up with the weaker hand drops out meaning that it is likely the bot that does play will have a strong hand, with the result being that the player sees an awful lot of bad beats when they think its just one-on-one.

It also means that you have to play against your instinct sometimes and it is a difficult game to master the strategy. At the very least read up here (scroll all the way down). It is published by them, but the advice is basically sound.

A far better game to play in my opinion is the Texas Holdem bonus poker as you are genuinely playing against one player and so get less angry!

[vinylweatherman]

This is a poorly thought out game but i don't think its a slot or non-random. The problem is (and they do explain this in the rules) is you are playing against 2 bots who know what the final dealt cards will be. The one which will end up with the weaker hand drops out meaning that it is likely the bot that does play will have a strong hand, with the result being that the player sees an awful lot of bad beats when they think its just one-on-one.

It also means that you have to play against your instinct sometimes and it is a difficult game to master the strategy. At the very least read up here (scroll all the way down). It is published by them, but the advice is basically sound.

A far better game to play in my opinion is the Texas Holdem bonus poker as you are genuinely playing against one player and so get less angry!

This 2 bot business was brought up before, but the main question was whether the 5 community cards were random. If they are, then it is just a game with an obscure strategy, but if the community cards are rigged to ensure the bots win a certain number of times then the game is unfair (as it is not marked as non-random).
Analysing the 5 community cards alone should give the answer, as it could be compared directly with the chance of a pat hand in 5 card video poker, probabilities for this are extensively calculated & posted on Wizard of odds. Perhaps he will analyse these "shoot out" variants in due course (might have happened already, not looked this month).

[kingkong098]

This is a poorly thought out game but i don't think its a slot or non-random. The problem is (and they do explain this in the rules) is you are playing against 2 bots who know what the final dealt cards will be. The one which will end up with the weaker hand drops out meaning that it is likely the bot that does play will have a strong hand, with the result being that the player sees an awful lot of bad beats when they think its just one-on-one.

It also means that you have to play against your instinct sometimes and it is a difficult game to master the strategy. At the very least read up here (scroll all the way down). It is published by them, but the advice is basically sound.

A far better game to play in my opinion is the Texas Holdem bonus poker as you are genuinely playing against one player and so get less angry!

This is an incorrect analysis. The rules state the stronger of the two hands preflop will continue playing. The bots supposedly have no knowledge of what the board cards will be.

Playing against the better of two bot hands means the player will win less than half the hands, but the ability to move "all in" preflop with strong hands should negate that advantage.

Wagerworks games state the expected return in the rules section and for this game it supposed to be 100% return based on strategy used. The statement is somewhat ambigous but I've always taken it to mean "Played properly the HA for this game is 0%." However from my experience and those of others I've read about this is not the case.