Eurolinx, BetOnBet, and Linx Casino gone into liquidation!!!

[spiderlegz]

Originally Posted by spiderlegz

It seems that the above assumption was right. Its over 2 months since they went belly up and no sign of any liquidators.

Does anyone know if theres been any progress with LGA (any former BetOnBet player)?

And I didnt keep my own word "Had" to reopen my 32Red account.

Had to quote myself. One affected player reported on 2+2 that he had contacted LGA multiple times and hasnt got a single reply.

I think I will contact "my" MEP next week and see if he can do anything about LGA (extremely unlikely but worth a try). They are even worse than Kahnawake. What a completely useless organization.

[jetset]

It looks as if little has changed in Malta and the LGA despite the assurances of the new management earlier this year.

Perhaps they are alarmed at the size of the Eurolinx debacle.

How about triggering some local media action - say the Times of Malta or The Independent in Malta - to put some pressure on the LGA?

Complainants with a specific case should at the very least get the courtesy of an acknowledgement of their complaint - ignoring them is neither professional or acceptable imo.

[Casinomeister]

Malta.....lip service, that's all you'll get - when they actually respond to you.

Major disappointment these people. They ought to lose their licensing abilities for being so non-player focused.

This is from last year's awards. Biggest Disappointment of 2008:
http://www.casinomeister.com/bestwor...php#disappoint

...So what does this indicate? Well hopefully not that the LGA is just another rubber stamp licensing agency primarily set up to shelter the casino operators from massive taxes. In order to have a driver's license, you have to know how to drive. And if you screw up bad enough the license is taken away. The reason why we have licenses is to protect the pedestrians and other drivers from getting smashed into or run over. This should be no different in the gaming industry - the license is to ensure player safety.

I have another issue with them from one of our members. The LGA reps at the EIG told me that they were aware of this player's problem and were dealing with it. The player hasn't heard diddly squat. What a crock of doo doo.

Looks like a repeat award this year

As for MGS getting massive percentages from operators, I don't think this is true with the poker rooms. I spoke to their CEO at the EIG about this, and he told me the percentage from Poker rooms is miniscule. In fact the operator owes them money - they're looking for him as well. He also said that they had done their due diligence with background checks on this guy Jo Remme.

But no-one is exempt from being fooled, right? Remember last year when this guy (Jo Remme) lied to me? This was a very public player issue - spread all over 2+2 and here. Eurolinx was yanked off the site because of this...yet people kept playing.

Caveat emptor - or a fool and his money are soon parted...

I'll check with MGS on what their position is on this. I'm not sure if they are dealing with this or what.

[deucebag]

Originally Posted by Casinomeister

In fact the operator owes them money - they're looking for him as well. He also said that they had done their due diligence with background checks on this guy Jo Remme.

Remme had a history of fraud and embezzlement from running La Isla Bonita Casino with a pyramid scheme on the side. If they were OK with that they need to raise their standards.

[jetset]

AFAIK there have been no further press releases from Microgaming to augment the ones already up on its website, which indicated that like the players MGS was awaiting the appointment of liquidators.

[JHV]

Originally Posted by spiderlegz

Chipdumping isnt that easy, if you dont wanna get caught. The player I mentioned did it over a period of two weeks, and he played pretty much his normal limits. Altough if you were caught it was definitely an EV+ situation to at least try.

And MG surely was watching the action at tables more carefully, they must have been aware that players were desperate.

The funds arent actually immediately withdrawable, at least not at Ladbrokes. Edit: Someone who knows better could comment.

Its interesting what you mentioned if in future there would be, lets say GENUINE processing problems. How would players act? Altough I dont see why anyone would still play at MG network.

One site was most likely quite close to bust recently (at least they were bleeding heavily), they recently changed ownership. But what I know they would have had the players money ringfenced.

People with more knowledge than I are covering the other issues pretty effectively so I'll just focus on VWM's point, which is extremely valid and one I genuinely hadn't considered until now - and very interested in understanding how MG or any network really deals with this issue.

Because...I'm a professional poker player and I can tell you that dumping huge amounts is incredibly easy for online pros. I could do it my sleep..in a manner that could have 20 experts watching the action aware I'm doing it and be helpless to do anything. For online pros, it's really just very basic and simple stuff.

And...I know players who dumped huge amounts from their Eurolinx accounts as the situation developed from Abnormal to Concerning to Potential Collapse to Liquidation. And I had no ethical problem with them doing so - but none of us had this issue in mind, which is a bit embarrassing I guess.

But surely there is some sort of reconciliation periodically and if there is a shortfall, MG must be forced to make it up - and I suspect they're doing this for these large abnormalities in reconciliation very quietly. Surely?

If not, you're going to see a domino-effect of collapses across the Prima network. And no way are some of the major skins foolish enough not to have considered this issue - so it has to be all guaranteed by MG somehow?

[spiderlegz]

Originally Posted by Casinomeister

Malta.....lip service, that's all you'll get - when they actually respond to you.

Major disappointment these people. They ought to lose their licensing abilities for being so non-player focused.

This is from last year's awards. Biggest Disappointment of 2008:
http://www.casinomeister.com/bestwor...php#disappoint



I have another issue with them from one of our members. The LGA reps at the EIG told me that they were aware of this player's problem and were dealing with it. The player hasn't heard diddly squat. What a crock of doo doo.

Looks like a repeat award this year

As for MGS getting massive percentages from operators, I don't think this is true with the poker rooms. I spoke to their CEO at the EIG about this, and he told me the percentage from Poker rooms is miniscule. In fact the operator owes them money - they're looking for him as well. He also said that they had done their due diligence with background checks on this guy Jo Remme.

But no-one is exempt from being fooled, right? Remember last year when this guy (Jo Remme) lied to me? This was a very public player issue - spread all over 2+2 and here. Eurolinx was yanked off the site because of this...yet people kept playing.

Caveat emptor - or a fool and his money are soon parted...

I'll check with MGS on what their position is on this. I'm not sure if they are dealing with this or what.

MG takes 17% from the gross rake. So if the operator owns them money its peanuts to what they generated in rake from EL/BOB over the years. They were quite big skins. And their due diligence

Correct about warning signals last year. Sadly many newer poker players dont know about this site. Also according to Marc"myst"Karam it was a few months after that the problems started. But there were many players on BoB that didnt have a clue about it. Most Finnish players were BoB players as was durrr. And BoB was bought by Eurolinx early this year.

Their problems started a while after the TUSK scandal. And that already should have been enough of a warning signal to withdraw any funds from a non PLC MG room. Sadly there were many players that hadnt even heard of it (TUSK), of course it wasnt in the big RB affiliates interest to give it much space.

Edit: adding about chipdumping. Its can be easy if your roll is about 15-25 buyins. But to dump a +50 buyin roll isnt that easy. Not to talk about donkament players.

[Casinomeister]

Originally Posted by spiderlegz

...Correct about warning signals last year. Sadly many newer poker players dont know about this site. Also according to Marc"myst"Karam it was a few months after that the problems started. But there were many players on BoB that didnt have a clue about it...

I can buy the fact that not everyone knows about Casinomeister - but most everyone has heard of Google. Search "eurolinx problems" and the thread pops up detailing their removal at #2. This was the same result prior to their fuck-up.

I find it hard to sympathize with seasoned players who ignore the warnings that are a Google search away, and then are shocked when a company goes tits up. People need to exercise a little more discretion when it comes to choosing poker rooms etc.

But that's a little off topic - don't need to go there.

[spiderlegz]

Originally Posted by Casinomeister

I can buy the fact that not everyone knows about Casinomeister - but most everyone has heard of Google. Search "eurolinx problems" and the thread pops up detailing their removal at #2. This was the same result prior to their fuck-up. :rolleyes:

I find it hard to sympathize with seasoned players who ignore the warnings that are a Google search away, and then are shocked when a company goes tits up. People need to exercise a little more discretion when it comes to choosing poker rooms etc.

But that's a little off topic - don't need to go there.

But that was pretty much the only screw up that reached daylight. And the player in that case did quite much to stirr it up etc. He was banned at 2+2 for example.
Cashouts were processed fast and their support always was good, the best actually. And if everything runs smoothly its unlikely that you would google them for problems. I have never done it.
And in 2008 many highstake players succesfully cashed out their rolls after the big games on MG dried up. Several players with rolls of 500k+ (hearsay about the sizes of rolls).

[JHV]

Originally Posted by spiderlegz

And in 2008 many highstake players succesfully cashed out their rolls after the big games on MG dried up. Several players with rolls of 500k+ (hearsay about the sizes of rolls).

If you're getting your info from the main poker forums you have to realise there is literally SO much dribble about rolls there it's hard to believe a fraction of what they claim is true. I stopped posting on 2+2 and some of the other larger forums because I got tired of seeing players claim things I could easily disprove - and I didn't want to just be a "Truth Policeman" with all those retarded egos who would either sit out when I sat or who didn't even play the stakes they claimed.

But I will concur with you to Bryan that Eurolinx's reputation (right up until a month or so before disaster) was still viewed by most poker players in a positive light - I'm not sure when exactly it clicked for me that it was "game over" but I'd be lying if I claimed it was 2-3 months before the fact...even though problems starting showing up > 4 months (?) before they capitulated.

The poker community has a lot to answer for in this regard. I seriously don't know what's with players who don't make things like this public, but I had close friends in the final fortnight when it was 100% Titanic panic-Skype me saying they had 5 figure amounts pending for months?!!? And that Eurolinx wasn't reversing their w/d requests so they couldn't dump. After I ridiculed them, I helped a couple with some cheeky tricks which worked (if small remaining balance, dump it on high HA casino sidegames, then ask w/d reversed etc ). If I had a pending withdrawal > (such a short time for poker - a week max or less for processors), I would have pretty much covered forums with that news. I never understand why people stay quiet about these things.

(As for dumping, yes ofc 50+ buyins is trickier - still easy if you know what you're doing. And if you're a tourney player with a huge roll on there, unless they hit big scores towards the end, all I'd say is...Why? You don't need 50k to play tournaments on *any* site, regardless of volume.)