Why disallow games through T&C and not through software?

**bridgehajen** · 13th April 2007, 10:27 PM

Hi,

I had a thought a few days back. It immediately struck me as obvious and something that greater minds must have thought before me. I'm posting it here for comments, especially from the casino representatives that hang around the forum.

Allow me to explain ...

When a player takes up a bonus, the T&Cs typically disallow a range of games for various reasons. With T&Cs generally being hairy and complicated beasts, some players will overlook the restrictions and play games which are not allowed. Perhaps they hit a jackpot but the casino, citing the T&Cs, refuses to pay. A public dispute results, which benefits none of the involved parties (the player becomes frustrated and the casino gets bad publicity, whether deserved or undeserved).

This is not a hypothetical example. It occurs in this forum from time to time.

So, here is the obvious idea .. why not simply disable the games that are not allowed? Grey out the buttons. You can configure all kinds of stuff, such as table limts and the like, so why not make it possible to configure this? Of course, the software would have to keep track of whether the player has an uncleared bonus and what are its conditions. But you probably already do that somehow. (And don't worry about the actual terms and the T&Cs on the web site getting out of sync, just let your web server generate part of the text based upon the terms in the database or config file.)

That was the idea. Free, unpatented, and up for comments.

And of course you may argue that it is up to the software providers to build this kind of functionality. But don't forget that they are paid to do what you want them to do. If a large number of customers request something they will get the idea.

And finally; I am aware that Microgaming devised an elegant solution to the problem by introducing the EZ Bonus system, which is one of the things that gives your software a good reputation. But what about the other software providers. I don't have any statistics but it appears to me that RTG casinos get into a lot of troubles on this account ....

**mikepipe** · 13th April 2007, 10:41 PM

a good idea, which is not new, we had discussions about often here in the forum.
I think, you are right, especially for RTG and the other providers. MG-problems hardly happen.

**RobRival** · 13th April 2007, 10:47 PM

Hello,

Rival Powered casinos with the Rival bonus system (most of the licensees use it, however Superior and Bet Empire do not) have this feature. Instead of banning games out right, however, the bet limits are modified. Wagers on games that do not count are simply not added to the wagering for the bonus.

So far, none of the operators have used the feature that specifically prohibits a game from being played (that is, the bet limits are 0 when a promotion calls for that).

Rival designed this system to be easy for players to use, and to avoid the headaches of terms and conditions, tracking wagers, and retroactive changes.

I hope this answers your question,

Rob

Rival Technical Support

**happygobrokey** · 13th April 2007, 11:08 PM

also try to work in:

a dialog message "wagers on this game do not contribute to the bonus wagering" or "wagers on this game count only 25% or a fourth towards the bonus wagering"

where some game must not be played while on bonus: "wagering on this game will forfeit your bonus eligibility and playing now will *nullify any subsequent winnings.* contact support to have your bonus removed if you wish to play this game"

and in cases where the wr is permanently increased if one decides to play certain games "warning: wagering on this game will increase your wagering criteria from *15 times* to *75 times* bonus and deposit" or similar

clearly with today's technology this can be achieved. if any casino would take the leap of faith and implement these sorts of conditions to make bonus play crystal clear and fool-proof, invariably players would flock to this place. big juicy offers and clearplay structure don't hurt either

**EasyRhino** · 14th April 2007, 03:44 AM

I think partly it's due to the technical complicatedness of doing such a thing. Especially at an RTG, where the game restrictions sometimes vary wildly per coupon.

And, to be frank, for some operators, I think it's a convenient way to jack over less careful players who into losing more money that usual with the bonus.

**Mousey** · 14th April 2007, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by EasyRhino

I think partly it's due to the technical complicatedness of doing such a thing. Especially at an RTG, where the game restrictions sometimes vary wildly per coupon.

And, to be frank, for some operators, I think it's a convenient way to jack over less careful players who into losing more money that usual with the bonus.

Bingo!

**tim5ny** · 14th April 2007, 07:38 PM

Why don't they do it through the software? Are you kidding? Do you know how many people they scam out of their winnings because of the fine print! Only a small fraction of gamblers even know that there is help out there from guys like Casinomeister. The rest are at the mercy of the casinos.

**bridgehajen** · 14th April 2007, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by tim5ny

Why don't they do it through the software? Are you kidding? Do you know how many people they scam out of their winnings because of the fine print! Only a small fraction of gamblers even know that there is help out there from guys like Casinomeister. The rest are at the mercy of the casinos.

Well, I agree with the point of view that some operators use it as a way to cheat customers. But I also believe that for any serious operator it's far more profitable in the long run if the player has a good inital experience with the casino. This will assure that a certain percentage of the players eventually comes back to lose their own money. Welcome bonuses fit into this perfectly by increasing the chance that the players wins, which most players attribute mainly to luck, "hot slots", "nice dealers" or whatever. Heck, if it weren't for them nasty bonus hunters, there would hardly be a need for T&Cs

Speaking of bonus hunters, I guess I should comment on CocoaRob's post. I downloaded a Rival casino (my first one) yesterday and I must say that the software is quite slick. Only problem was that it sometimes froze when it couldn't contact the server but I guess I should say that my ISP is amazingly unstable. It also seems like you have found a good way to manage the bonus terms, not far from the idea that I posted above. And the idea with changing the betting limits while in "bonus mode" is also a clever move. All in all, it's quite difficult to get a +EV from your bonus, so I guess that you did your homework properly ..

**nielsenj** · 14th April 2007, 09:45 PM

The idea of letting the casino software block games that are excluded from reaching wagering requirements is new to me and I like it. Some difficulties with blocking games are mentioned earlier in this thread, but if there is a will from the software developing companies and online casinos to implement a game blocker, surely they can find a way. It would be a good additional feature for the future at legitimate online casinos who are concerned about transparancy and honesty.