Spyware in your Software

[Ixian]

I am a webmaster who has two casino / poker related websites. Over the past year or so my virus protection program, I'm using NOD32, has been blocking an increasing number of different casino / poker software downloads.

The software I find that is currently being blocked is RTG, Playtech and Microgaming.

I got quite annoyed with this and sent an email to NOD32 support asking why their software was blocking legitimate casino and poker software. This is the reply that I received:

Even though the software may be legitimate, most of these still have integrated spyware and require the user to install active-x controls. ESET will not block any software that is harmless.

Have some of the major gaming software providers decided to spy on your gaming pattern? The market is very competitive so how low will some of these companies stoop to get a competitive edge?

I feel eCOGRA should investigate this matter as most of their approved list uses some of this "spyware".

[c_note]

Nod should head off back to sleep.

There are really 2 easy ways for online casinos to provide you with the entertainment you as a player want, Java Applets, and ActiveX. Most Microsoft based casinos will use ActiveX. More on active X at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ActiveX

MGS & Specifically Playtech dont care what you do on your pc unless it relates directly to their product. The controls they will have put in place allow them to :

1. Provide you with the game client, flash client, images, flash files, movies, real spins, and all the extra added value you can see.
2. Track you across their site, and provide you with account specific functions like depositing, requesting cashouts, playing games etc
3. Manage fraud to a degree (this is a minor thing within the activex controls they use)

Dodgy casino software can be used to spy on users, take over machines, and do a whole bunch of other nasty things, but you are not going to see the big software providers doing anything like this. If there was really spyware within the software, they would have been bust a long time ago by any one of the dozens or hundreds of paranoid IT freaks that play online.

[lots0]

It also depends on what their definition of "Spyware" is.

As far as I can tell ESET NOD32 defines "Spyware" in this case as the gathering of information and transmission of that data to an external destination.

This gathering and transmission of information is required for the casino games to play on your computer.

Also don't forget that if you are playing for 'Real' you have already given the casino most of your personal information anyway... The same personal information that these guys at NOD32 are saying the casinos are trying to steal with Spyware. (Why would anyone try to steal something that was given freely?)

Some companies have made the uninformed and incorrect decision that all online casinos are "evil" and therefor anything they do is suspect and intended to harm. This is just not the case.

Sure there are some Rogue Casinos, we have even discovered a few here at CM, that fill their download with Virus, Trojans and other badware. But that is the exception and not the rule.

[c_note]

Good response Lots0, thanks

And just like there are rogue casinos with spyware and other junk in their software, there are Anti Virus companies that write viruses to keep their sales up...

[winbig]

I use ESET NOD32 as well, and love it - except for the false-positives such as these. I can't even download RTG software without turning it off first. It deletes it as soon as it starts downloading.

[RobWin]

Who's to say really that the casinos don't use this data gathering software plant to capture the play patterns of the customer ??

Can it be proven that it is not used for this purpose or on the other hand can it be proven that it is ?

[winbig]

Who's to say really that the casinos don't use this data gathering software plant to capture the play patterns of the customer ??

Can it be proven that it is not used for this purpose or on the other hand can it be proven that it is ?

I can say without a shadow of a doubt that there's no "weird" traffic going in or out when I'm playing at a RTG casino.

[catrina m]

I run a free program called threatfire I downloaded from cnet along with my virus software and it alerts me to anything going in or out, it alerts me when I start the casino, but I allow it. I havent had virus in a while, but traffic in and out is important.

It does identify casinos as a high risk threat, but what isnt online these days.

cookies are still the way most places track you. We all probably have a meister cookie

[GrandMaster]

I am a webmaster who has two casino / poker related websites. Over the past year or so my virus protection program, I'm using NOD32, has been blocking an increasing number of different casino / poker software downloads.

The software I find that is currently being blocked is RTG, Playtech and Microgaming.

I got quite annoyed with this and sent an email to NOD32 support asking why their software was blocking legitimate casino and poker software. This is the reply that I received:



Have some of the major gaming software providers decided to spy on your gaming pattern? The market is very competitive so how low will some of these companies stoop to get a competitive edge?

I feel eCOGRA should investigate this matter as most of their approved list uses some of this "spyware".

There is also a concept of a false positive. See my previous posts on this topic: http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...tml#post213616, http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...html#post69358, http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...html#post52987

Who's to say really that the casinos don't use this data gathering software plant to capture the play patterns of the customer ??

Can it be proven that it is not used for this purpose or on the other hand can it be proven that it is ?

I know you love a good conspiracy theory, but what sort of play patterns are you thinking of that could not be obtained from the server side information?

[RobWin]

There is also a concept of a false positive. See my previous posts on this topic: http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...tml#post213616, http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...html#post69358, http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...html#post52987



I know you love a good conspiracy theory, but what sort of play patterns are you thinking of that could not be obtained from the server side information?

Frequencies in bet patterns and or global, area specific bet/play patterns, breaks in play...pauses