Bonus Complaint Grand Mondial (Casino Share) made bonus acommodations then renigged w/out telling me

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by kixxumass

Did I High-Jack this thread a couple of posts back?

hahaha!

I think I did! what started out as a beef with GM,
kinda veered off into Rich Reels, Bellerock, and
The Trident Group! ...My Bad.

Anyway, Back to the original subject,

Is Grand Mobdial and Casino Share part
of the PlayShare Partners Group?

If so, then I'm confused.
In the quest for finding a decent, reputable
casino that isn't cloaked in deceptive
bonus disguises, I came accross this
casino and have never heard of them
before, yet they claim to be a part of
the PlayShare Group of Casinos...

Crystal Ball Casino = www.cbcasino.com

On The "About Us" Page, It states:

ABOUT US:

Crystal Ball Casino

Welcome to cbcasino .
We are an exciting online casino and offer over 300 games to choose from, with some of the biggest Progressive Jackpots to be found on the net.


We offer a fantastic range of promotions, to find out more about the promotions click here
cbcasino are part of the PlayShare Partners Group of Casinos which are operated by Naden Inc and are powered by MicroGaming, the leading software provider in the world.

For a full list of the Casino’s Click Here:

http://list.playsharepartners.com

What I find strange is, if GM and Casino Share ARE part of the
PlayShare Partners Group, Then why are the not listed on
this playshare partners list?

There is no Grand Mondial on there at all,
and the only Casino Share Casino listed on there
is Casino Share Japanese and Casino Share Spanish.

All the other casinos on this list I have never even
heard of. Including this Crystal Ball Casino,
which I was looking for information on, as a
prespective player, but if they are affiliated with
Grand Mondial forget it...

I would just be jumping out of the frying pan
and into the fire!

You have found the skeleton in their cupboard. he is called Naden

There are a whole bunch of these white label casinos under the Naden umbrella, and not understanding this complex relationship is likely to lead to problems with locked accounts and non payments.

They are designed to look like a large number of seemingly unrelated MG casinos, many will seem completely new, and will have little written about them. In effect, they are all skins of Grand Mondial and Casino Share. The tricky problem comes when you come to open an account at one of these, the terms state that you can only have one bonus over the entire group of white labels, but it is a devil of a job for a player to stick to this rule, since the list is ever changing, and old names vanish and new ones appear. The ONLY way to tell is to run a search on "Naden" on the websites, but first you need to suspect it is a white label in the first place, otherwise you will be treating ALL MG casinos with equal suspicion.

When this issue first cropped up last year, the forum made it clear this was not a good direction to be taking with MG casinos, and I predicted this would only confuse players, and lead to many innocent breaches of group wide rules through the dificulties in identifying which group casinos belonged to.

There are just too many, and the names and promotions do not make any link clear. There has been enough trouble with Casino Rewards, who at their peak had 17 different casinos, Naden had well over 30 last year, and no doubt this has increased further.

[kixxumass]

Originally Posted by vinylweatherman

You have found the skeleton in their cupboard. he is called Naden

There are a whole bunch of these white label casinos under the Naden umbrella, and not understanding this complex relationship is likely to lead to problems with locked accounts and non payments.

They are designed to look like a large number of seemingly unrelated MG casinos, many will seem completely new, and will have little written about them. In effect, they are all skins of Grand Mondial and Casino Share. The tricky problem comes when you come to open an account at one of these, the terms state that you can only have one bonus over the entire group of white labels, but it is a devil of a job for a player to stick to this rule, since the list is ever changing, and old names vanish and new ones appear. The ONLY way to tell is to run a search on "Naden" on the websites, but first you need to suspect it is a white label in the first place, otherwise you will be treating ALL MG casinos with equal suspicion.

When this issue first cropped up last year, the forum made it clear this was not a good direction to be taking with MG casinos, and I predicted this would only confuse players, and lead to many innocent breaches of group wide rules through the dificulties in identifying which group casinos belonged to.

There are just too many, and the names and promotions do not make any link clear. There has been enough trouble with Casino Rewards, who at their peak had 17 different casinos, Naden had well over 30 last year, and no doubt this has increased further.

eeew, that is so creepy... so they have like this "underground" operation of skeleton casinos that are masked or disguised to appear to run independently
from the Queen Bee ? but what their only true purpose is to have them set up at various places around the web in hopes that one of their players from one of their other casinos, like GM, or CS... so that they may then refuse to pay any winnings these players may attempt to cash out if and when they ever win any money... by simply accusing the player of taking a bonus or signing up at one of their other casinos which they say violates their
T&C's ??? did I understand that correctly... or something to that affect?

wow,... so they are deliberately sabotaging their own players? that runs right along the lines of the statement I made early on in this thread... don't $h*t where you eat... or better termed, "don't bite the hand that feeds you"
... man, whatta shame... i'm disgusted... this behavior by the casinos is soley motivated by greed.. and those who are greedy don't like to give up any part of their fortunes.. they want to make all this money, but dont want to have to put out any toward acheiving financial success... I guess the popular phrase "It takes money to make money is completely foriegn to them.

I am so disappointed right now... it seems to me that online gambling is going to hell in a hand basket... i'm afraid to play anywhere now... i think I just caught the trident group trying to do the same thing, but in a different approach... if you go to their site... http://www.kingneptunescasino.com

and click on the link at the bottom of the page that says "Virtual Casino Partners" or click here

here are just a few of many they have listed on that page:

Trident Entertainment Group
http://www.tridentegroup.com

Trident Lounge
http://www.tridentlounge.com

Vegas USA
http://www.vegasusa.com

Trident Poker
http://www.tridentpoker.com



But here's where it gets weird... when you click on one of those casino links or try to downlad one, particularly http://www.tridentlounge.com and http://www.vegasusa.com it really downloads the king neptunes casino and it keeps the url at kingneptunes.com but adds a "download=vegasusa", or a "download=tridentlounge" so there is no actual website or separate url
for either of these casinos... and when you try to download either
tridentlounge casino or vegasusa... it doesnt open any download for it,
it opens the kingneptunes casino software, and that is what you will be downloading. Here's a diagram pointing all of this out:




what do you make of this? why would they be tricking players into thinking they are downlaoding trident lounge or vegasusa casinos? ...is this trickery?

doesn't it appear as though they are trying to deceive , by getting the player to downlaod a completely differnt casino? or am I being unreasonable for
accusing them of doing this , ?

Can you or anybody tell me, just what exactly ARE they doing ?
what is the casinos intentions here?

what is the whole site misdirection and false casino download supposed to
accomplish?

I'm totally aggravated by this because I just deposited $100 here, and now
i feel like they are trying to mislead their players and misrepresent themselves

wow... this only gets deeper the further I dig....

[vinylweatherman]

Firstly - the intent behind the Playshare white labels was to get more players by flooding niche markets with the various white labels. This has not exactly worked though, as they simply look like a bunch of Microgaming casinos.
The rule that can land players in trouble is where they claim a bonus at one "Naden" white label, and then claim a bonus at another "Naden" white label. Because there are so many, and each one has a list of "Naden" outfits updated at a different time, it is easy for the unwary to make the mistake of not realising their shiny "new" casino is simply their second, third, etc Naden "skin". Unfortunately, they will be granted the bonus, but the breach will only surface when they withdraw after winning with the bonus. There seems to be no central "Naden list" that overrides the others that is fully up to date. It is up to players to check for "Naden" links with every "new" MG casino they spot, not something that is obvious to those who have no idea about this "white label" business.

It is OK, however, to claim the bonus at Grand Mondial OR Casino share (not both), AND claim another at any ONE of the Naden white labels. Beyond this, while you can still PLAY at all the Naden white labels, you CANNOT take any more NEW PLAYER offers.

ALL Naden casinos offer the same level of customer service (it is the SAME CS after all), if you are unhappy with one, the rest will make you just as unhappy.


Secondly - King Neptunes is BelleRock, and has been for a while. They are SPECTACULARLY INCOMPETENT AND LAZY, and the oddities in the King Neptunes website are a reflection of this, rather than of any sinister intent. Rather than update the website properly, they have left behind the details for the "current promotion", which actually finished 2 YEARS ago Rather than write out the other two casinos, they have simply altered the links so that everything points to the King Neptunes download.
A further example of their laziness shows when you exit the King Neptunes site, as you STILL get that totally pointless (and annoying) exit pop-up inviting you to "try Trident Lounge casino", even though it has been CLOSED to new players for over a year

[kixxumass]

Originally Posted by vinylweatherman

Firstly - the intent behind the Playshare white labels was to get more players by flooding niche markets with the various white labels. This has not exactly worked though, as they simply look like a bunch of Microgaming casinos.
The rule that can land players in trouble is where they claim a bonus at one "Naden" white label, and then claim a bonus at another "Naden" white label. Because there are so many, and each one has a list of "Naden" outfits updated at a different time, it is easy for the unwary to make the mistake of not realising their shiny "new" casino is simply their second, third, etc Naden "skin". Unfortunately, they will be granted the bonus, but the breach will only surface when they withdraw after winning with the bonus. There seems to be no central "Naden list" that overrides the others that is fully up to date. It is up to players to check for "Naden" links with every "new" MG casino they spot, not something that is obvious to those who have no idea about this "white label" business.

It is OK, however, to claim the bonus at Grand Mondial OR Casino share (not both), AND claim another at any ONE of the Naden white labels. Beyond this, while you can still PLAY at all the Naden white labels, you CANNOT take any more NEW PLAYER offers.

ALL Naden casinos offer the same level of customer service (it is the SAME CS after all), if you are unhappy with one, the rest will make you just as unhappy.


Secondly - King Neptunes is BelleRock, and has been for a while. They are SPECTACULARLY INCOMPETENT AND LAZY, and the oddities in the King Neptunes website are a reflection of this, rather than of any sinister intent. Rather than update the website properly, they have left behind the details for the "current promotion", which actually finished 2 YEARS ago Rather than write out the other two casinos, they have simply altered the links so that everything points to the King Neptunes download.
A further example of their laziness shows when you exit the King Neptunes site, as you STILL get that totally pointless (and annoying) exit pop-up inviting you to "try Trident Lounge casino", even though it has been CLOSED to new players for over a year

SPECTACULARLY INCOMPETENT!!


I love it!

how descriptive a term that is!
and very funny, especially when you've experienced this type of incompetence to such a degree,
that you realize there couldn't be a better term to describe it other than that!! hahahaha!!

That's so unfair how these casinos conduct their business in this manner... I mean, really...
how the hell is someone supposed to know that the casino they are joining is related to a casino they already play at if these casinos operate in a stealth-like mode?

if they don't want their players claiming a bonus at more than one of their casinos then why don't they conspicuously display the casinos label name
and secondly, why don't they have security measures in place that would automatically detect any player claiming a bonus at "this" casino, who has already claimed a bonus at "that" casino, and not allow the bonus to be claimed in the first place?

They don't use these preventative measures because they deliberatly let the player sign up and claim the bonus just so that they can refuse any winnings if the player attempts to cash out in the future?

notice how they allow them to deposit again and again and don't say $h*t ... and continue allowing them to deposit for infinity, up until the day, if that were ever to come, that they attempt to cash out!

what a buncha little punk-@$$-b*tches!!
that is so wrong... I despise unethical business practices! and this has got to be at the top of my list, words cannot describe the utter disgust...


well... I'm off to the reservation... at least the land based casinos here
don't cheat the players on such an extreme level... it's just a drag to
drive there and back... I guess all gambling has it's drawbacks, other than the obvious self-destructive ones! hahaha!


Oh, btw.... trident support told me that "in the future" they were going to be merging with Bellerock ... but you say this already took place well over a year ago? either the support rep was bullsh*ing me... or that is a prime example of "SPECTACULARLY INCOMPETENT"


I tend to think the latter is true


Thanks for all your input, you're very informative!


Props to you, vinyl!!

[Mario]

Originally Posted by kixxumass

Hello fellow meisters,

I am posting this complaint because I feel that this casino handled this situation inappropriately. I am an easy-going person and hardly ever
complain about customer service, but I feel that a casino I play at on a regular basis should try to acommodate me if I make a reasonable request, and if they do, it only further strengthens my trust in them, my faith in their abilities as customers service proffessionals, and reinforces my opinion of their credibility. It also reflects my opinion on how a casino should build up a good reputation as an online business entity.

I expect any casino that i am pumping my money into, to recognize the fact that I am doing just that- pumping my money into their casino, along with all of it's other players and therefore; should always do their best to acommodate their players, especially if they are designated by the casino as a VIP,and they should always have the players best interest (being satisfied) at heart, or at LEAST act like they do, if anything. If a casino doesn't appreciate my loyalty or displays to me that my patronage is not valued, it slightly offends me and leaves an unpleasant impression on me, and ultimately, will probably result in me not depositing there in the future, which turns out to be the case here, with Grand Mondial and Casino Share.

I don't know about anyone else, but if my livelyhood soley relied and depended upon revenue generated by the funds my customers have supplied my business with, I would take every measure possible to ensure that I retained these customers and that they are content; I would not want to do anything to jeopardize that source of revenue, because without it, would only result in a financial reduction that could potentially have an impact on my business in the future or affect me personally; most companies who rely on this type of generated revenue, I'm sure would certainly agree. However, online casinos seem to be the only ones who don't. (based on the complaints I have read from players about other casinos, and luckily I haven't had the unpleasant experience of being totally screwed by a casino, as some others have)

The only reason I have come directly here to post this complaint instead of trying to rectify it in private with the casino rep/affiliate here at the casinomeister forum is because I am told by the live chat agent not to bother, because apparently, according to him, the casino rep was present
and already sided with the casino.

And here is a post of that chat:



Welcome to Casino support live help, one moment please for world-class service

Jason: Hi, and thank you for using our Live Chat facility! Allow me to introduce myself as your chat representative...
Jason: will be assisting you, how could I be of service...

Vgmr00577xxx: Hi, this is an exerpt from the live chat i had with George yesterday, about changing my weekend 25% deposit bonus to weekdays instead, and he granted the 25% bonus match on my deposit yesterday, and told me to come to live chat when i deposit for any bonus's, and i made a deposit a few hours ago, but the bonus didnt show up and there was no way to claim it, then i remembered he said to check with live chat, here's the exerpt from that chat we had:



George: hi there gina, what seems to be the problem?


Vgmr00577xxx: hi george..i work at the hospital 3 days straight,
i sleep there during sleeping hours,
i go in on friday and dont come home til monday...
unless for some reason i happen to come home early,
or dont go into work for one reason or another,
i will never ever be able to deposit on a weekend,
so you are rewarding me for being a reg player,
but its like getting nothing at all,
since i can never claim the weekend bonus

Vgmr00577xxx: can you put in a request to make my bonus for
3 days during the week? i dont care which 3 days,
since i dont work weekdays

George: i will do that

George: i will add a $7.5 comp for this deposit.
i will be in touch with promotions department and request they change the days of your promotions to week days, we will change this days for you
and i am sure promotions won't have a problem to do this
but for future reference in order to avoid confusion have a quick
look into your email box to check if you are elegible for any match
bonuses or just contact us before you deposit

George: so i will add your 25% match bonus on the $25 deposit that you made

Vgmr00577xxx: ok, i appreciate that... thank you George thank you very much

George: not a problem
we want happy costumers here
we work for you all the time

Vgmr00577xxx: thank you so much
George: you'r welcome


Jason: Okay, I got the just of it.

Vgmr00577xxx: so can you please apply the 25% bonus to my last deposit please?
Vgmr00577xxx: hahaha
Vgmr00577xxx: ok

Jason: Unfortunately we cannot change your weekend match to the weekday as this messes with our systems.

Vgmr00577xxx: ok, did you look at the chat?, George said it would be
Vgmr00577xxx: he said to come to live chat when i deposit to claim

Jason: We gave you a bonus as a once off thing, and cannot keep doing it unfortunately
Jason: Yes, he said that he would query this with the Promotional manager, and the manager said no

Vgmr00577xxx: what? why wasnt i told this?
Vgmr00577xxx: and WHY did he say it wouldnt be a problem, ?
Vgmr00577xxx: had i known that, i wouldve deposited elsewhere, which is what i will do now.

Jason: He said that he would ask and doesn't think that there would be a problem, but there is and you cannot have it.

Vgmr00577xxx: dont be rude about it, what the heck? im a player, dont treat me like a peice of dirt

Jason: I am not, I am just informing you of what was said about your situation, may I ask where I have been rude to you?

Vgmr00577xxx: so you'd rather lose the consistency and business of a regular depositing player, rather than accomodating me? ...thats crazy...i see where your priorities are...
Vgmr00577xxx: i have no idea why your listed with casinomeister

Jason: I do not make the rules, I just inform you as to what they are.

Vgmr00577xxx: but i'll contact mario over there and let him know how you guys do business

Jason: We cannot change the rules for one player, regardless of their situation.

Vgmr00577xxx: ya i know, i'm not blaming you Jason
Vgmr00577xxx: i just think you couldve stated it a little less harshly

Jason: Mario is here, and just told me to inform you of this as well.
Jason: Unfortunately it is out of his hands as well.
Jason: How, where was I harsh? Please do tell me, I am sorry if I came off like that, but I feel that I have been very polite

Vgmr00577xxx: ok, well then i wont play here anymore...sorry it came to this'
Vgmr00577xxx: have a good night anyway

Jason: So am I.
Jason: Good bye.
Chat session has been terminated by the site operator.



I don't know, maybe it was just me, and I realize that text can be misconstrued and not a viable way of interpeting one's attitude, but the way he seemed to present this information to me seemed a little unpersonable, not very friendly, he seemed short, abrupt and kinda cocky. I don't know, maybe it was my interpetation. But what i DO know... is that I am a loyal and frequent depositor at both Casino Share and Grand Mondial, and have made a simple request, in which George could have simply declined. But he chose to
give me the bonus, which was on a weekday, not the weekend, so by doing that, only indicated to me that it can be done, apparently they are just choosing not to. It's fine that the casino uses their descretion when determining these types of things, but i don't think that they should have given me the bonus at all, and waited to hear back from promotions on whether or not to change it, and if they determined that they would not be accommodating me, then i feel they should have at least emailed me with that decision. I received nothing from them at all regarding the denail of my request, and had to find out about it only AFTER making my deposit, and obviously they had made a decision, because from what Jason said, the promotions dept said no- at that point, whenever that decision was made, an email should have went out to me informing me so... don't wait for me to make a deposit, then tell me, ... because George left the impression that this would not be a problem, and based on the fact that he even gave me the bonus that day as well, and the fact that i had not received an email informing me otherwise, i had absolutely no reason to think this had been denied. Had i known this, i could have decided to play there anyway... or chosen another casino for that day if i wanted to play with a bonus, but that kinda upset me that i didnt know anything about this until after i deposited. and the way he threw Mario the casino rep into the mix like that, seemed a little odd, and to be honest, i really didn't feel like playing there after that.


Just to show you how i went to live chat before i deposited to make sure
i would get a bonus here is a copy of that chat: (as you can see, this agent doesn't really seem to have correct information, and as i expected, after depositing, i went to live chat to claim the bonus and it was denied)

info: Please wait for a site operator to respond.
info: Welcome to Casino support live help, one moment please for world-class service

Hansley: Hi, and thank you for using our Live Chat facility! Allow me to introduce myself as your chat representative...
Hansley: will be assisting you, how could I be of service...

me: hi can you please tell me what my grand mondial account number is?
me: i am playing from my laptop not my usual computer

Hansley: One moment please while we look into the matter for you?

me: sure

Hansley: Please may we ask you to first confirm the following personal details for security reasons.
Hansley: Full name
Hansley: Email address
Hansley: Date of birth
Hansley: ZIP / Postal Code
Hansley: Deposit method

me: also, i was told on my next deposits i get a 20% bonus is that correct?

Hansley: who said that?

me: name: sensored, sensored@netzero.net, 10-23-19XX. 85281 visa... uh, if you look up my very last chat session a few days ago you'll see

me: i cant remember his name
me: it was something regarding a 20% bonus up to $200 or something

Hansley: sorry wrong info

Hansley: Vgmr00577xxx

me: thanks

me: ok, is there any bonus at all on my next deposit? can you look up that chat and see what he did tell me


Hansley: when was the last chat?

me: just a few days ago....
me: you should have record
me: it was actually something the manager said

Hansley: you are eligible for 25% up to 200 in purchases

me: yeah, thats what i was told, so they were not incorrect?

me: so do i get that now if i deposit?

Hansley: ok

me: ok what?

Hansley: Is there anything further I can assist you with?

me: do i get the bonus or not?

Hansley: have you claimed?

me: i havent deposited yet, im doing that now, thats why i needed my acct number

Hansley: make sure you claim

me: ok when?

Hansley: you do get a bonus as soon as you have claimed and the system processes it

me: how come you said that the info was incorrect?
me: you said, "sorry wrong info"

Hansley: you had the wrong info about the bonus

me: no, it was right...i was off by what? 5%?

Hansley: my mistake then

me: so i DO get a deposit bonus right?

Hansley: yes as soon as you have deposited

me: do i claim after i deposit, or before ?

Hansley: you claim after you have deposited

me: and what are the wager requirements?

Hansley: http://www.grandmondial.com/BonusSystem.aspx for all info

me: ok thanks



I will no longer play here unless they rectify the situation, It hurts me to think
all this time I have been playing there, my frequenting their casino meant nothing to them, rather than acommodate a small amount of a bonus, they would rather let that player walk away and lose all future business from them,
and trust me, all further deposits i would have made as an ongoing player would have far exceeded the amount they would have dished out for this bonus. you'd think that would be incentive enough for them to just give me what i was practically promised and keep me happy, but apparently they really don't care.

Hi there kixxumas,
Hope you are well,
Sorry for the late reply as I only came across this matter today.
Before I comment I would like first to request that you contact me directly either via PM or via my email address for further investigation.
The manner in how this matter was dealt with is not how we do business and also not how we treat our players.
I must say that it is shocking in how you were treated and the matter will be taken further.
Kixxumas please do make contact with me so that I can personally take care of this matter for you.
Hope to hear from you soon.
Best regards
Mario

[kixxumass]

Thanks Mario,

Just a heads-up, when you posted your response here a while back and asked me to email you regarding this issue, I did, but you never got back to me....

[Mario]

Originally Posted by kixxumass

Thanks Mario,

Just a heads-up, when you posted your response here a while back and asked me to email you regarding this issue, I did, but you never got back to me....

Hi Sorry Kixxumass,

Never got your messages from either of your addresses and not to sure why not.

My apologies and will be looking at this matter for you ASAP.

In regards to the agent in question please note that the matter was take further and the nesasary disacplinary actions was taken and I'm glad to say that it had a very positive effect in general in the CSC.

None the less I will get in touch with you in regards to your concerns.

Best regards
Mario

[kixxumass]

Hi Mario,

That's good to know. Anytime a negative situation can create a positive outcome, and others can learn from it, that's a good thing. It was never
my intention to put the chat agents job in jeopardy or to get him in trouble
with his superiors, he put himself at risk for any job related discipline when
he chose to display unprofessional behavior towards me or any other player for that matter.

This is the first time, in the many years I have been playing online, that I have ever voiced a complaint about a casino employee; here, or otherwise-
I just felt that the tactics he used; telling me that you were present with him during the chat session and that you were agreeing with him on the bonus issue I was having, and the demeaning attitude he presented to me in the chat was just a blatant disregard for my right to polite and courteous customer service.

He was anything but professional. He was very disrespectful and he offended me to the point that I felt it was necessary to bring it to the casinos attention. Not to get him in trouble, just so that his attitude
could be addressed in a way that would be helpful, not hurtful~
because honestly...., if he took up this type of disposition with every player who came to live chat for assistance, I don't see how GM would retain any of their players; and eventually, he would be out of a job.

He needs to realize it is because of the players that he is even working at the casino in the first place and to take that into consideration before he decides to treat any of these players, the way he treated me.

Thank you for addressing this Mario, I will await your PM.