What Will Bring Back The Trust Between Rival And Its Players ?

[LaurieJim]

There has just been so many anti Rival threads going up and for most i cant blame some of them. What will it take to gain the trust of so many of its players back? I made up a short list and maybe some can add on and just maybe the Rival casinos will take notice.

Its such a shame as Rival offers great games, what can we do as players to give them our input as im sure they dont like losing players and seeing the anti threads.

Here is my short list............

(1) Customer Service needs to be on the same page as the casino itself.

(2) Slow Pay within weeks, this has got to get better, no 72 hour holds and when we asked for it to be flushed, it should be paid within 72 working hours max imo.

(3) Why all the bonus bans, its almost become a joke, if you the casino place free chips in the account and a player wins, why the bonus ban? This to is not good.

(4) Bonuses that are just unreal, what ever happened to the decent ones with the average WR and cashout?

(5) No emails or replys but from a few Reps on the forum, atleast they show they are concerned imo.

I cant think of anything else at the moment, Rival casinos used to be pretty fair with its players in the past, so what has gone wrong now to have made so many players think otherwise?

................laurie

 

[dominique]

Nice, constructive post.

They are increasingly in trouble with affiliates also. Doesn't look good when both players and affiliates are unhappy....

 

[cpdnd31]

Im pretty much fed up with playing at all casinos. Im from the USA, everytime I play I have to pay fees. Fees here fees there and god help if I win then I gotta pay more fees to get my money. When it comes to rival what bothers me the most is their bonuses are constantly changing. WR of 40 30 cashout min. and max. At least with other casinos they are consistant. God forbid you miss read a term on their bonuses you could really screw yourself. What was the straw that broke the camels back. I had an incident that happened at a rival casino because of the incident 4 days later they contacted me and said hey your right we were wrong were sorry we are giving you a special bonus because of it. Ok I thought ty very much. When I looked the wr was and Im not joking 100x wr I thought screw you guys thats a big smack in the face. I allready have to jump thru hoops just to play online. Dont insult me too.

Maybe these casinos could just try to appreciate the American player. After all that we go thru just to play it would be nice if one casino would say hey we appreciate you playing.

Customer service at rivals is the worst Ive dealt with. Depending on the day and time you can get 3 different answers to 1 question. Hey heres a piece of advice know your product before you try to sell it.

Payment times also suck. Hey Rival if you paid me faster I would be able to play with you again. Do they not realize that most of us cash out to umw or qt. Why would I deposite and have to pay more fees when I can wait on my withdrawal.

Games are fun and I feel are some what fair however I was disappointed on the last couple they introduced.

Ive stopped playing rival it just wasnt worth it to me.

After all the problems with CC and now 3 dice not taking netspend Im starting to think hey the fees Im spending online I can put in my gas tank. Drive to local casino and play there at least there if I win I can cashout right away with money in hand oh and there are no fees to play there..

Its a sad day when you dont even want to play online, it use to be fun for me now I just get stressed out. Never knowing what way you can deposite and with who.

Anyway didnt mean to derail you topic

this is just my opinion not meant to offend anyone.

 

[gloria460]

I'm not sure Laurie..I don't have any rivals as of right now and I do like their games. I haven't had a problem cashing out and I rarely if ever take a bonus. I uninstalled them when I seen the way they were going with the bonuses.

huge bonuses with low max cashout is not good business..ie 600% bonus and 2xmax withdrawal...50% bonus with a 30xwr and max cashout or ridicoulous bonuses of 15-25% with 25xwr and the list goes on. If I do decide to take a bonus I want a fair shot of winning something.

My list would be to offer good bonuses to depositing customers.
Drop those silly wr of 50 to 100xwr. I even seen one of 160x on a 75% cashable bonus with a max withdrawal.

You've already addressed the other issues.

 

[cynthial]

I agree with all of the points in your post Laurie. They started out great with interesting new games, a fair bonus system, rapid comp points, player retention schemes, the works. Then step by step, bit by bit, it all changed.

Anyone with eyes has read about the changes or experienced it themselves. Maybe they grew the brand too fast. It seems a week did not go by without reading about another new Rival. Or maybe market conditions forced them to scale back on things they considered non-essential. I don't know. What I do know is that they are off the radar for me now. Even the few that are/were considered to be at the pinnacle have lost my custom. I have not a single Rival on my computers anymore and I don't want to smokem peace pipe. I now treat them the way they treat me. Total disregard. Hey Rival, NO SOUP FOR YOU!

 

[dominique]

I have heard from players who do not like to take bonuses that they are not allowed to deposit more than 15 to 50 Dollars at a time (accounts vary but are within these limits).

So it seems to me that Rival's profit expectations are based on huge WR and cashout limits. Ordinary play without bonuses may result in high payouts and that seems to not be encouraged.

So these guys quit playing there - who wants to run and deposit ten or twenty times during play?

 

[anniemac]

I have one Rival left and that's Slotocash. I tanked all the other ones the last time they quit paying with a reasonable (3 days max) timeframe. And I am bonus banned at all the rest of them for some reason anyway.

I have never had one problem with Slotocash but that could be because I have been with them since they came into being and have a good relationship with the rep and manager. My wagering requirements have been the same since the beginning, nothing out there.

But when I look at all the new ones that are coming down the pike, I just cringe. Do they think I will deposit and play a bonus with 100x deposit and bonus? Do they think I will wait 5 weeks to get paid? They would have to be sending a check by carrier pigeon for it to take that long.

I want a casino that (a) offers reasonable deposit bonuses; (b) flushes my withdrawals when I ask; and (c) pays me within 24 hrs. or less; (d) has a customer service in place that has a clue and gives a flip. In turn, I will jump thru hoops to deposit at their casino.

I don't think that is too much to ask.

 

[cynthial]

I have heard from players who do not like to take bonuses that they are not allowed to deposit more than 15 to 50 Dollars at a time (accounts vary but are within these limits).

I have never heard of a limit being imposed on non-bonus deposits. Just when you figure they can't possibly skew things any further in their favor they handicap the player with low deposit limits? The guys who shoot craps out behind the liquor store have higher limits than that. Whatever will they think of next?

 

[cpdnd31]

Glad to know Im not the only one that feels this way.

 

[nisosbar]

I have one Rival left and that's Slotocash. I tanked all the other ones the last time they quit paying with a reasonable (3 days max) timeframe.

Laurie, I can basically live with all your complaints except timely withdrawals - that is simply unacceptable to me.

And Annie, I'm with you - Sloto is essentially the only Rival I play at now, but even there, not with a bonus - they have one good bonus per month/week - the VIP Gold one at 100%, 15xWR.

There is not another single Rival where withdrawals are paid in what I feel is a timely fashion - no more than 2 days, tops.

So that would be the most important thing for me - and it would have to be consistent and reliable; fast cashouts every single time.

Otherwise, I'm basically done with online gambling. I've got three or four casinos where I'll deposit just for fun, but being 100% honest here, when I look at the icons for all these other casinos, I just get this feeling in my stomach, thinking about, 'great you can win but how are you going to get your money? how many weeks will that take?' I just find it aggravating, and that's not why I like to gamble - I like to be entertained and have fun, so I'm just taking a pass right now.

 

[bb28]

Good thread Laurie.

I was cruising around the other day and happened to notice that Planet 23, (formerly topgame) which has a terrible rep IMO, is now Rival.

The jackpot fiasco was the first huge screw up, that alone made me lose my faith in them, all except Sloto.

It's scary that so many are popping up everywhere, especially now with the crackdown on Visa/MC, I don't see how they are going to survive coupled with the reputation that they are getting all around. I guess the big question will be, which one will be first? And when one goes down, then the rest of them are going go like domino's.

 

[LaurieJim]

Laurie, I can basically live with all your complaints except timely withdrawals - that is simply unacceptable to me.

And Annie, I'm with you - Sloto is essentially the only Rival I play at now, but even there, not with a bonus - they have one good bonus per month/week - the VIP Gold one at 100%, 15xWR.

There is not another single Rival where withdrawals are paid in what I feel is a timely fashion - no more than 2 days, tops.

So that would be the most important thing for me - and it would have to be consistent and reliable; fast cashouts every single time.

Otherwise, I'm basically done with online gambling. I've got three or four casinos where I'll deposit just for fun, but being 100% honest here, when I look at the icons for all these other casinos, I just get this feeling in my stomach, thinking about, 'great you can win but how are you going to get your money? how many weeks will that take?' I just find it aggravating, and that's not why I like to gamble - I like to be entertained and have fun, so I'm just taking a pass right now.

72 hours- 3 days is a whole lot better than 5 weeks as we have heard in some cases, i will be more than happy with 72 hours or less vs. weeks, most i have ever waited was 7 days including a weekend, to me 5 days isnt a good deal either.........

I would like to see each casino handle their own payments instead of Rival, when you have so many people involved, it seems like one hand doesnt know what the other is doing and cant stay on the same page imo.

So whats the deal with the affiliates, are they having trouble also getting paid in a timely manner or is it just the bad bonuses?

............laurie

 

[ksech]

The only Rival I have left is Sloto, but am rethinking keeping them. I was told by CS the other day, that the Bonus Manager reviews accounts every few days to determine which players get one of their lucky Sloto tickets. I would like to know:
a) what are the stipulations for receiving a sloto ticket? I used to get them after every few deposits, but that seems to have changed. So, how many deposits do you need to make to receive one? And why do I need to contact CS after every few deposits to find out I still am not eligible for a sloto ticket? AND...
b) I seldom play with a bonus,as even the Sloto bonus WR are getting higher and higher. Why would I want to play with a 25% noncashable bonus that has a WR of 20X? OR a 100% noncashable bonus with a WR of 30X?
I know I am not playing as often, but the slots are tight, and the bonuses, IMO are ridiculous. These just aren't enough incentive to keep me interested in playing there. I like to feel "appreciated" every once in awhile by a casino without having to jump through hoops to get a small token of "thanks for playing at our casino".

 

[mixx]

I no longer get the Sloto tickets as well. Still have no idea why. It seemed like when I started to deposit more, I stopped getting the tickets. Same thing with Tropica. I used to always get free bonuses every few days or so. I decided to deposit since they seemed so generous lol. Have not seen a free chip since then. I think I will stay away from Rival and stick with Microgaming. I already played out RTG & Vegas Tech casinos. If those were my only choices, I would probably stop playing online. Or go back to poker...

 

[nisosbar]

I no longer get the Sloto tickets as well. Still have no idea why. It seemed like when I started to deposit more, I stopped getting the tickets. Same thing with Tropica. I used to always get free bonuses every few days or so. I decided to deposit since they seemed so generous lol. Have not seen a free chip since then. I think I will stay away from Rival and stick with Microgaming. I already played out RTG & Vegas Tech casinos. If those were my only choices, I would probably stop playing online. Or go back to poker...

I could have written this post.

 

[jelsmith]

Im pretty much fed up with playing at all casinos. Im from the USA, everytime I play I have to pay fees. Fees here fees there and god help if I win then I gotta pay more fees to get my money. When it comes to rival what bothers me the most is their bonuses are constantly changing. WR of 40 30 cashout min. and max. At least with other casinos they are consistant. God forbid you miss read a term on their bonuses you could really screw yourself. What was the straw that broke the camels back. I had an incident that happened at a rival casino because of the incident 4 days later they contacted me and said hey your right we were wrong were sorry we are giving you a special bonus because of it. Ok I thought ty very much. When I looked the wr was and Im not joking 100x wr I thought screw you guys thats a big smack in the face. I allready have to jump thru hoops just to play online. Dont insult me too.

Maybe these casinos could just try to appreciate the American player. After all that we go thru just to play it would be nice if one casino would say hey we appreciate you playing.

Customer service at rivals is the worst Ive dealt with. Depending on the day and time you can get 3 different answers to 1 question. Hey heres a piece of advice know your product before you try to sell it.

Payment times also suck. Hey Rival if you paid me faster I would be able to play with you again. Do they not realize that most of us cash out to umw or qt. Why would I deposite and have to pay more fees when I can wait on my withdrawal.

Games are fun and I feel are some what fair however I was disappointed on the last couple they introduced.

Ive stopped playing rival it just wasnt worth it to me.

After all the problems with CC and now 3 dice not taking netspend Im starting to think hey the fees Im spending online I can put in my gas tank. Drive to local casino and play there at least there if I win I can cashout right away with money in hand oh and there are no fees to play there..

Its a sad day when you dont even want to play online, it use to be fun for me now I just get stressed out. Never knowing what way you can deposite and with who.

Anyway didnt mean to derail you topic

this is just my opinion not meant to offend anyone.

They are not taking NS anymore????? I used my card last week....and it worked....when did this happen? Sorry not trying to derail....but this is news to me

 

[chuchu59]

My view is that the Rivals dont care a damn about gaining the trust of the players at this very moment. They need injections of cash to survive based on their prolonged cashout times. They are meddling with security docs in addition to the 2-5 day business rule and their live chat staff are starting to make up all sorts of stories to stall payment unless all of the posters in the forum are lying.

Unless there is financial stabilty the Rivals will continue this mode of operation. Pathetic.

 

[De Beuker]

First and most important thing Rival has to do now is change that customer support system.
It totally sucks.
This central support system may have worked just fine 1.5 year ago, when there were only 12 Rivals, but now there are 40 of them, and you cannot expect these customer agents to know everything about all of them.
I really feel sorry for these ppl sometimes, as their hands are tied and all they can do is 'forward your question/complaint to the management'.
But a customer wants straight answers.

Second, they should stop opening new Rivals every other week.
There are more than enough of them already, all competing against each other with weird promotions.
By far most of them are owned by the same company, so why they do this, I don't know.
I have the strong feeling they are only killing each other.
But instead, they blame the player for seeking the best bonuses across the group, and call it bonusabuse.
Sorry Rival, but thats what players usually do, especially when the funds are limited. They go shopping for the best deal.
Result: Bonusban. Player gone.
Very bad marketing.

And the cashout times ofcourse.
5 businessdays is just too long, the only reason I quit playing Playtech a year ago is because of the cashout times.

I really like the software, and I hope things turn for the better, but for now I'm Rivalled-out.

 

[KasinoKing]

Here is my short list............

(1) Customer Service needs to be on the same page as the casino itself.

(2) Slow Pay within weeks, this has got to get better, no 72 hour holds and when we asked for it to be flushed, it should be paid within 72 working hours max imo.

(3) Why all the bonus bans, its almost become a joke, if you the casino place free chips in the account and a player wins, why the bonus ban? This to is not good.

(4) Bonuses that are just unreal, what ever happened to the decent ones with the average WR and cashout?

(5) No emails or replys but from a few Reps on the forum, at least they show they are concerned imo.

I cant think of anything else at the moment, Rival casinos used to be pretty fair with its players in the past, so what has gone wrong now to have made so many players think otherwise?

................laurie

It's great to hear that coming from a USA player - and that others are agreeing with it. Hopefully someone in power at Rival secretly reads the forum and realises all is not well in the state of Rival.

For me personally as a player I still have faith in Rival who remain one of my favourite softwares.
In respect to the points raised above:-
(1) & (5); I have very very rarely needed to contact support for anything at all, so have not suffered any frustration in that department. However, should need arise I would hope and expect to get a quick concise answer, and not the run-around some other CM members seem to have suffered.

(2) Payout times are not really a big deal to me, and I wouldn't be too bothered with anything up to a week, but most of my Rival withdrawals have been paid in only a few days max (via Neteller). However I totally understand how important fast pay-outs are to most players and I am completely bemused as to why casinos don't seem to realise that fast pay-outs benefit THEM most in the end.

(3) Totally agree. Bonus bans are MORONIC! How can the casino EVER win their losses back if they drive players away?

(4) Again, totally agree; far too many bonuses are totally crap and an insult to player's intelligence. Closing your account at a casino might seem like a good idea, but some who used to have rubbish bonuses a year ago now have some quite good ones. So with Rival casinos I suggest you keep your options open at as many places as possible and then "shop around" for the best offers. That's what I do!


For me personally as an affiliate;
Player numbers have dropped of significantly; 2009 saw about half as many in total as 2008, even though the number of Rival casinos actually doubled. This, if nothing else, tells me they are not doing everything right.
As far as payments go; SlotoCash have always paid VERY fast and still do. The others all use the Pantasia payment processor (same as for players); In 2009 they actually improved to around 15 days max. In 2008 some were taking up to 4 weeks to pay.

KK

 

[NASHVEGAS]

Has anyone mentioned the way Rival progressives have been handled by this same group of white labels?..........you know, lol , like the withholding of winning payments all the while inducing the player to play back (funny how that perfect storm also occurs) his numbers on a screen, so who has the cash?

Affiliates have begun complaining about low average player deposits and player retention among other complaints. Well, how can you expect ^rollers with weekly max. withdrawal limits that may be less than one's hourly total deposits. Affy's, this does not just apply to Rival and I promise it hurts your pocketbook/wallet.

 

[NASHVEGAS]

As far as payments go; SlotoCash have always paid VERY fast and still do. The others all use the Pantasia payment processor (same as for players)

BOX 24 is not a Bonne Chance white label or suck buddy per the Affiliate Wide CM rep.

I believe the rep. clarified (but want to check my memory) in the recent BD thread that BOX 24 processes it's own payments also as Deckmedia's Sloto does.--------->EDIT:Now confirmed that per the CM rep., BOX 24 does it's own payment processing.

 

[dominique]

Has anyone mentioned the way Rival progressives have been handled by this same group of white labels?..........you know, lol , like the withholding of winning payments all the while inducing the player to play back (funny how that perfect storm also occurs) his numbers on a screen, so who has the cash?

Affiliates have begun complaining about low average player deposits and player retention among other complaints. Well, how can you expect ^rollers with weekly max. withdrawal limits that may be less than one's hourly total deposits. Affy's, this does not just apply to Rival and I promise it hurts your pocketbook/wallet.

Not to mention that low retention means people don't like it. Whatever "it" is, and we hear all about that in this thread.

Rival also altered it's contracts with affiliates (and operators I understand!) without notice to deducting fees for progressives. While that is in breach of contract, it is aggravated by the fact that they don't calculate this as they go, but at the end of the month.

So the affiliate expects xxx dollars and figures to pay the rent, but when the check comes it may be considerably less than the statistics indicated all month.

But this isn't about affiliates, it's about why players don't like Rival and what can be done to fix that.

 

[NASHVEGAS]

Not to mention that low retention means people don't like it. Whatever "it" is, and we hear all about that in this thread.

Rival also altered it's contracts with affiliates (and operators I understand!) without notice to deducting fees for progressives. While that is in breach of contract, it is aggravated by the fact that they don't calculate this as they go, but at the end of the month.

So the affiliate expects xxx dollars and figures to pay the rent, but when the check comes it may be considerably less than the statistics indicated all month.

But this isn't about affiliates, it's about why players don't like Rival and what can be done to fix that.

And now time for one of my favorites, "Most affiliates are players also" so Affys carry on

 

[dominique]

And now time for one of my favorites, "Most affiliates are players also" so Affys carry on

Lol, yes, true.

But it's the bonuses and WRs that concern me. Inflated bonuses and WRs plus limits on how much you can win with a bonus and limits on how much you can deposit without a bonus - throw all that in a pot and give it a good stir and it means that very few people cash out.

What is nuts is that people get banned for using too many bonuses, and on the other hand people are kept from depositing much of anything if they don't take bonuses. You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't.

Won't they naturally push themselves out of business like that?

 

[KasinoKing]

So the affiliate expects xxx dollars and figures to pay the rent, but when the check comes it may be considerably less than the statistics indicated all month.

Sorry Dom, I'm an affiliate too, but I hate it when people say stuff like "figures to pay the rent, but can't" like that operation is solely hinged on getting payments from Rival operators - sorry again, but that's just total bollox!

As far as these progressive deductions go - I never even noticed it, so what I never knew I didn't have I can't miss!
Maybe other affiliates should do what I do - I don't check my figures until AFTER the end of the month - at least then I am never "bitterly disappointed" to not get something I was expecting...

[/derail - sorry again!]
KK

 

[Nifty29]

In answer to the OP - Rival can do NOTHING bar completely changing the way they 'classify' players and deal with inquiries, as well as their incentive structure and payment processing. I cant realistically see this happening, so this whole thread is probably not going to achieve much (no offence to LJ of course )

The whole situation and the direction Rival are taking reminds me a lot of Gambling Federation - remember when they were the bees knees?? Then they became greedy and white labelled themselves into oblivion and now hardly anyone bothers.

The best thing Rival could do is hire Pat and Co. from 32Red as consultants!

 

[felicie]

Seems like most complaints and suggestions are from usa. What's the story with the rest of the gambling world?

Good thread btw

 

[dominique]

Sorry Dom, I'm an affiliate too, but I hate it when people say stuff like "figures to pay the rent, but can't" like that operation is solely hinged on getting payments from Rival operators - sorry again, but that's just total bollox!

As far as these progressive deductions go - I never even noticed it, so what I never knew I didn't have I can't miss!
Maybe other affiliates should do what I do - I don't check my figures until AFTER the end of the month - at least then I am never "bitterly disappointed" to not get something I was expecting...

[/derail - sorry again!]
KK

This just happened, KK. If you do promote Rival heavily, you'll surely notice next month. It also only happens if you have players who play progressives.

I don't promote Rival heavily because of all the things mentioned in this thread, but many people do. For them it plays out like this:

Example of how this affects YOU

Assumption: 35% Revenue Sharing



Player 1: Deposits $5000. Takes no bonuses. Plays $0 in progressives. Loses all.
Affiliate Share: $1750

Player 2: Deposits $1000. Takes no bonuses. Plays progressives and wagers, in total: $75,000 (due to wins and losses). Loses all.
Affiliate Share: $350 2% ($75,000) = $350 - $1500 = $-1150

Player 3: Deposits $50. Takes no bonuses. Plays progressives and wagers, in total: $25,000. Loses all.
Affiliate Share: $17.5 2% ($25,000) = $17.5 - $500 = -$482.50



Affiliate End Revenue = $1750 - $1150 -$482.50 = $117.50

Affiliate Revenue Share Percentage = $117.50 / ($5000 + $1000 + $50) * 100 = $117.50 / $6050 * 100 = 1.9% Revshare

So if you want to work for 1.9% rev share, go for it.

BTW the above comes from here: Link Removed (invalid URL)

But I think this is a derail.

As affiliate as well as player, what matters more to me is that they make you deposit $15 at a time if you don't take a bonus. Even if you never cashed out. What's up with that? Nice games, too much trouble to play.

 

[LaurieJim]

In answer to the OP - Rival can do NOTHING bar completely changing the way they 'classify' players and deal with inquiries, as well as their incentive structure and payment processing. I cant realistically see this happening, so this whole thread is probably not going to achieve much (no offence to LJ of course )

The whole situation and the direction Rival are taking reminds me a lot of Gambling Federation - remember when they were the bees knees?? Then they became greedy and white labelled themselves into oblivion and now hardly anyone bothers.

The best thing Rival could do is hire Pat and Co. from 32Red as consultants!

I dont know Pat from 32 Red from Adam, but what does he and his MG casino have that the others dont have? Im sure he is a nice guy given the great things said about him and the staf, i would just like to know, what do they do thats different from the rest, that makes them among the best according to alot of forum members that play there, US players cant play there so we can just go by whats been posted...............laurie

 

[1819]

i see not one rival rep has posted in this thread. that alone is enough to keep me away...

 

[LaurieJim]

i see not one rival rep has posted in this thread. that alone is enough to keep me away...

I was hoping Nicolas Johnson would post as he seems to have a good understanding on some of these issues and can maybe shed some light, i would just like to see any Rival Rep. post about our concerns in this thread.............laurie

 

[jod5413]

I was hoping Nicolas Johnson would post as he seems to have a good understanding on some of these issues and can maybe shed some light, i would just like to see any Rival Rep. post about our concerns in this thread.............laurie

Good thread, Laurie.

I do not hold my breath for any reps to come and comment. No matter what they say, they will be ripped by some of our more zealous members. I am not defending any particular rep, just have seen that the recent history with reps has been, no matter what they say, how they say it, or how much they try to explain anything, the end results seems to be rep 1, members unlimited.

This is my impression watching reps come and go, even the ones at what everyone considers good casinos, they get tired of being heckled or slammed. Maybe I am wrong, but think about it before you jump me, OK?

 

[LaurieJim]

Good thread, Laurie.

I do not hold my breath for any reps to come and comment. No matter what they say, they will be ripped by some of our more zealous members. I am not defending any particular rep, just have seen that the recent history with reps has been, no matter what they say, how they say it, or how much they try to explain anything, the end results seems to be rep 1, members unlimited.

This is my impression watching reps come and go, even the ones at what everyone considers good casinos, they get tired of being heckled or slammed. Maybe I am wrong, but think about it before you jump me, OK?

You are right Jod and that could be one of the reasons, we have had some good ones on here from other softwares in the past that were ripped to shreads and thats a damn shame imo...............laurie

 

[sparkz]

for rival are dead and burried... i would never play at a rival again (unless its a ND bonus)

support at rivals are becoming ever worse... theres some exclusive bonus i got at this casino the other day... support had no clue about it and denied a bonus like that existing even even though i know many people got the bonus fine... it was only after i spoke to the manager that the bonus was credited

the games.... pffft.... lets say tight as hell... over a few years iv deposited $10,000 into rivals, never made 1 withdrawl, always failed to meet WR and never made any profit while playing with just my own cash (well once i won literally a few $'s but thats next to nothing and after the losing streak began)

I remember betting $6+ a spin, hit the bonus spins and barely got $10 back... multiple times... strange eh?


i always deposited with my card and the other problems i only noticed recently... not only do they not pay withdrawls onto cards... but you have to of actually deposited with an E-Wallet to be able to withdraw to 1 (cheque is never avaliable at any rival casino for me) .... since im not a fan of E-Wallets and dont use them for depositing i would never of deposited via thoese methods. If id known sooner i wouldnt of made all them deposits

the only thing that can save rival now is if they took a leap out of 3dice's book with the super fast withdrawls

 

[slotjunkie]

The only Rival I have left is Sloto, but am rethinking keeping them. I was told by CS the other day, that the Bonus Manager reviews accounts every few days to determine which players get one of their lucky Sloto tickets. I would like to know:
a) what are the stipulations for receiving a sloto ticket? I used to get them after every few deposits, but that seems to have changed. So, how many deposits do you need to make to receive one? And why do I need to contact CS after every few deposits to find out I still am not eligible for a sloto ticket? AND...
b) I seldom play with a bonus,as even the Sloto bonus WR are getting higher and higher. Why would I want to play with a 25% noncashable bonus that has a WR of 20X? OR a 100% noncashable bonus with a WR of 30X?
I know I am not playing as often, but the slots are tight, and the bonuses, IMO are ridiculous. These just aren't enough incentive to keep me interested in playing there. I like to feel "appreciated" every once in awhile by a casino without having to jump through hoops to get a small token of "thanks for playing at our casino".

Very well said! I have deleted all RIVALS even Sloto. Like you said the games have gotten tight and the bonuses aren't worth it!

 

[NicolasJohnson]

Ok, first I would like to make a note about our overall status before trying to deal with the suggestions that have come about individually.

First, I would like to say that the title is misleading IMHO.

What Will Bring Back The Trust Between Rival And Its Players ?

While I will openly admit that we have a few issues that we can and will improve on, it is hardly like there is no trust. I think even the biggest detractor of Rival will admit that there are really no cases of 'non payment'.

Furthermore, I think not all Rivals are the same. The huge number of players we have here at Vegas Regal Casino know that we will pay them on time without stalling, answer their questions, offer good bonuses, new games, and all forum posts are attended to. Furthermore, I will make sure everyone is treated fairly, and I think I haven't failed yet. If you look up Vegas Regal Casino on google, the testimonials written on forums will speak for themselves.

I think saying that players don't trust Vegas Regal Casino is a long stretch. And we are a Rival Powered Casino.

Having said that, there are a few basic points brought up here that I will address. If I missed anything, please let me know and I will address that issue too:

Excessive Bonus Banning
We already stated we no longer use the Rival bonus banning system. This is true, we don't use it. You guys and gals suggested we don't use it and we listened. Only for charge back/fraud players we ban players who haven't already played with us. But this is standard. Every Casino in Vegas keeps a database of Scam/Fraud players.

No Emails or Replies from Forums Reps
I was lucky to find this thread, but I try to answer all the threads regarding Rival/Vegas Regal Casino that I can. If you want an answer/statement from me I'm always at the service of this community. I just ask to please PM me when you want an answer since I do not have time to read every thread on every forum. So if in the future I miss a Rival/Vegas Regal Casino thread, all you guys and gals have to do is send me 1 PM, and I'm on it!

Progressive Jackpots not Being Paid in one Lump Sum
You guys suggested we should change our system so we pay progressives in one lump sum. Here at Vegas Regal Casino we do now. You guys and gals spoke and we listened!

Unreasonable Bonuses
We offer plenty of bonuses. Some are high bonus/high restrictions. Some are low bonuses/low restrictions. Our Sign up bonus is 300% Cashable, no min or max cashout, 35x playthrough. Hardly unreasonable. We have tons of re-load bonuses. I just checked the ones currently on offer: They range from 50% all the way up to 600%. Some are cashable, some have no max cashout, some have playthrough as low as 25x. Again hardly unreasonable.

If the complaint is that we don't have positive EV bonuses, then that is something I will accept as we will never have positive EV bonuses. Our bonuses are meant to extend play time/entertainment value, not be source of income for advantage players.

Non Bonus Players Restricted to $15-50 Dollar Deposits
We don't apply these restrictions to 'non bonus' players. We do apply certain deposit restrictions to high risk transactions. But this is standard. Virtually all e-commerce sites have deposit restrictions based on high risk transactions. Exactly how we determine high risk transactions at Vegas Regal Casino is something that I can't say. But if we always apply those to the wrong people, you would hear about it in the forums. Which is something that doesn't happen.

We are 'Tight'
Every casino, every software provider, every gambling institutions of any kind has, is and will be called tight. It is a tendency of players that if a player wins, then the casino is considered 'lose', but if the player looses then the casino is 'tight'. We publish our payout % on each game help page. Transparent and honest and, if you look at the payout % and know what it means then you will see we are far from 'tight'.

Affiliate Jackpot Fiasco
We already made a statement on this at AGD. None of our affiliates will be affected by this issue. We at Vegas Regal Casino/Regal Affiliates take care of our players and affiliates. We know we wouldn't exist with out you! I would post a link to our statement on AGD, but I don't want to break the forum rules.

Customer Service Needs Improvement
This is something I agree with and that we are working on. Do bear in mind that all customer service inquiries are answered. And the great majority of the time players receive satisfactory answers. It is simply human nature to be more expressive when things go wrong than when they go right. When players get a good reply they rarely make a post about, only when they get an unsatisfactory one do most players post. And based on the number of queries and the number of complains of our customer service we aren't doing that bad. Again, we do need to improve, I'm not denying it, just putting it in perspective.

Cashout Time Frames
There are really two subsections to this, so I will deal with them independently:

5 Business Day Cashout Time Frame
This is something that we need to improve on, no doubt. But it is not something we hide or are underhanded about. We are open about the cash out time frame. We 99.99% of the time get payouts within the stated time frame, most of the time earlier. So it is not like we 'slow pay players' with ill-intent. This business is a million times harder to run then you might think and paying out in 24 hours like we would like to is much more complicated than simply stating it. Many casinos state short payout times they can't keep. We will not be one of them. We are preparing for paying out faster, and when we roll it out, there will be few to none exceptions.​

Delayed Payouts past the 5 Business Day Time Frame
This is something that very rarely happens. As I stated, players are paid before the 5 business day time frame more than 99.99% of the time. Every business has a margin of error, even the biggest fortune 500 companies. And this can be amplified by issues like the MC issues that Max was kind enough to inform you people about. Again, something we can improve on, but very few players are adversely affected by such an issue and the ones that are get taken care of so that they receive some type of satisfaction!​

I hope I dealt with all the points.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Regal Affiliates Manager
& Vegas Regal Casino Rep.

 

[Nifty29]

Thankyou Nicolas for the time you have taken to address these issues, although Im fairly sure your casino is the exception rather than the rule - and that should be a source of pride for you.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but I did want to comment on this:

:*5 Business Day Cashout Time Frame*
This is something that we need to improve on, no doubt. But it is not something we hide or are underhanded about. We are open about the cash out time frame. We 99.99% of the time get payouts within the stated time frame, most of the time earlier. So it is not like we 'slow pay players' with ill-intent. This business is a million times harder to run then you might think and paying out in 24 hours like we would like to is much more complicated than simply stating it. Many casinos state short payout times they can't keep

I know that Rival casinos have always had the 2-5 business day rule, but 12 months ago it meant 2 business days. Now, in the past few months, it is 5 business days.

So, it means that Rival casinos were able to pay in 48 hours - but now they just dont or wont. The only reasons I can think of for extending payout timeframes is poor funding/lack of funds, or just because the casino feels like it (and maybe hoping that some winnings will be played back). I really cant think of any other reasonable explanation.

Im sure anyone who hasnt operated an online casino cant understand the difficulties involved. Unfortunately, all we players see is that we have to wait up to a week for payment - and that is completely unacceptable IMO. I mean, why is it that SlotoCash can pay in hours?? Why is it that 3Dice can pay instantly?? Why is it that 32Red can pay in 12 hours?? Surely they face the same problems as any other operation??

I dont know of any casino that says they pay in 24-48 hours and doesnt honor it. It is my belief that if a casino is well-funded and stable enough they can pay within 24 hours or 48 hours at most.

My experience with Rival customer service has been that they actually do not respond to every email and 99% of the time I have received a generic reply that only partially addresses my concerns. Im not sure what stats Rival provide you with in regards to customer service, but from the sound of it you arent getting the full picture.

Its nothing personal Nicolas...you are one of the good apples....but Rival has a history of just doing what they want without any regard to player feedback and they just seem to be going out of their way to alienate the people who should be their bread and butter.

 

[chuchu59]

Excellent post Nicolas. However, with due respect, the Laurie's title is spot on imo. At least for the majority of Rivals, that is. The centralised Rival support is becoming a joke, making up all sorts of stories and evading direct answers especially when it comes to withdrawals exceeding their supposed time-frame.

I sympathise with the plight of some Rivals who are unable to pay as quickly as they have wished but there is no reason to use delaying tactics like not advising players of the need for security docs until a week later. Rival casinos are not too well-funded so if there are problems that are beyond their control eg the MC/Visa issue, they should be honest about it. They overcame the light liquidity problem in 2008 and I have faith they can do so again but as I said be honest about it. Once bitten, twice shy and it seems we have been bitten twice so will a portion of the players ever retruen. That is debatable.

The Rival software is well-liked by many so players like Laurie and myself hope most Rival casinos will continue to operate and that is why we are concerned. Otherwise, there is no point in starting a thread like this one.

For abysmal service, look no futher than the Dendera thread. It's been nearly 3 months and the cowards are unwilling to even face the problem let alone give me a simple answer. many players are fed up with non-responses by many Rival casinos. They may write a few words here and there and then they simply vanish. The promises they make ie that they will look into the problem are empty and it seems they just want lessen the damage and hope the issue will go away. Having said that, you are a different breed because you always give a timely response and you do investigate.

Again, I thank you for taking the time to answer to this thread. At least you had the guts to do so in such a hostile thread.

 

[funeral979]

I don't know if it is a sign of less people playing or Rivals games REALLY are that tight, but you have to go back over a week and about 12 pages to find ONE Rival screenshot in the winners screenshot thread.

That has always been my main concern with them. Even with large bonuses, there is hardly any playtime.

Take these recent examples for instance.....I was playing on a free chip and moved to Scary Rich...yes I know its very high variance....but anyways I made 56 spins at 20 cents and 49 of those spins paid ZERO....only one spin paid my bet back. How much fun is that? These types of runs come about with alarming regularity.

Also, I was getting my butt kicked at blackjack (as usual), so I took a looksee at my history over the last several sessions at one particular Rival. I had to go back NINETY hands before I could find a an instance where I won more than two hands in a row.

And then there is their video poker (easily the worst and most boring of the major providers). I have played ALOT of Rival video poker....the best I have ever managed at their single hand is 4OK at jacks or better. We are talking thousands of hands here. I managed better at Lucky Creek and 3Dice and have only played 2 sessions at each of those casinos. For that matter, I cannot recall EVER seeing a royal flush (single hand) posted in the winners screenshots....perhaps I missed it....but doesn't that strike you as odd?

It took me a long time before I started playing Rival, and I can honestly say that I really don't feel comfortable with their software.

That being said, I have not experienced any of the other issues brought forth here. I have always been paid in 4 days or less where I managed (miraculously) to cashout.

 

[sparkz]

thanks for setting some things right nicolas

the thing i look at with rivals though as i mention is $10k on all rivals iv played at in a few years (and also many no deposit bonuses)... and not 1 cashout to date... never met the WR and playing with just my own cash barely got me a profit.... dont get me wrong casinos do make money... some days you win... others you lose... its part of the fun... but surely being 10k down without a withdrawl is beyond a joke


The next was again regarding the tightness... where else would 15 free spins with a x3 multiplier at $10 a spin bring back a measly $10 or less in wins??.... the answer is only at rivals, its happened most times iv had a bonus/free spins on a $10 spin... whereas if im playing at 3dice, rtg's, microgaming or whatever other casino brands the chances are a $10 spin will pay something a lot more realistic


and the problem with people who deposit with cards... it doesnt say in any terms people who deposit with cards cant cashout... but that is entirely true.... if you deposit with a card at any rival casino you cant cashout via card. None of them will even let you cashout via moneybookers or another ewallet because it says you must of made a deposit via the selected ewallet before you can cashout using it. Some people have said you can cashout via cheque however but i got a bonus play to $500 then went to see if cheque was there (hadnt met wr but i was checking to see if it showed up because if there was a minimum cheque withdrawl $500 would of exceeded it)....it wasnt


delays in payment are a thing too.. im not saying vegas regal has slow payments but there are others where people are waiting weeks to be paid... The bottom line however is if 3dice can pay members instantly or at worst in under 24 hours (usuaully 3 hours) then theres no reason why other casinos cant do it. If 1 can do it then all can do it.

 

[nisosbar]

I don't know if it is a sign of less people playing or Rivals games REALLY are that tight, but you have to go back over a week and about 12 pages to find ONE Rival screenshot in the winners screenshot thread.

I have noticed that, as well.

 

[LaurieJim]

Thank you Nicolas for coming thru, i have no problems with Vegas Regal as you lead by example as someone else posted, you have always lent an ear when we have needed it and gave great inside info. This was not a dis to you or your casino but just a letter to other Rival casinos of our recent concerns, again you and Vegas Regal have listened to your players and that sets you way above the others imho...................laurie

 

[NicolasJohnson]

Don't worry, I don't take it personally or offensively.

On the contrary. I thank you for starting the thread and I thank everyone for participating.

The advice here is a gold mine. We are very lucky to have this forum and the participants in it. I know Fortune 500 companies that pay big $$$ in consultancy fees to get the kind of advice we get here.

We do want to improve and who better to listen to than our customers? :notworthy We know we must constantly improve, and as I said in my last post, I agree with much that has been said. Plenty of work is going on behind the scenes, even if on the surface it seems slow, it really is moving along.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Regal Affiliates Manager
& Vegas Regal Casino Rep.

 

[KasinoKing]

I don't know if it is a sign of less people playing or Rivals games REALLY are that tight, but you have to go back over a week and about 12 pages to find ONE Rival screenshot in the winners screenshot thread.

One thing you have to remember with Rival though, is that on most of their slots you get the bonus feature / free-spins MUCH more frequently than on most other softwares, so naturally the wins tend to be a bit smaller.

For example, on most MG slots the features hit roughly every 120 - 130 spins on average. With RTG it's a similar figure, but with many Rival slots it's more like every 50-60 spins.

It depends what each player wants; if you want a big hit and are prepared to go many 100's of low pay-out spins to get it - play a high variance slot. If you want a good chance of lots of bonus features, but with smaller average pay-outs - play the lower variance Rival slots (or Grand Virtual slots if you're not in the USA).
You pays your money & you takes your choice!

KK

 

[Tengil]

One thing you have to remember with Rival though, is that on most of their slots you get the bonus feature / free-spins MUCH more frequently than on most other softwares, so naturally the wins tend to be a bit smaller.

For example, on most MG slots the features hit roughly every 120 - 130 spins on average. With RTG it's a similar figure, but with many Rival slots it's more like every 50-60 spins.

It depends what each player wants; if you want a big hit and are prepared to go many 100's of low pay-out spins to get it - play a high variance slot. If you want a good chance of lots of bonus features, but with smaller average pay-outs - play the lower variance Rival slots (or Grand Virtual slots if you're not in the USA).
You pays your money & you takes your choice!

KK

I disagree, the features dont seem to hit any more often than on other softwares regardless of which game you play. And on other softwares you can actually win more than 5xbet in the features. That is with my experience of +100k in wagering and an RTP of a bit over 80 with the "best" being ~87.

And the Rival slots generally are boring with last century graphics. Add to that lousy promos, support and cashout times and you have a loser. Almost forgot the ridiculously low cashout limits.

+ the stats I quoted above took endless of mails and "threats" to get.

 

[KasinoKing]

I disagree, the features dont seem to hit any more often than on other softwares regardless of which game you play.

Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one then!

All I know is I have dozens and dozens of Rival play-logs which show features hitting every 50-60 spins over 1000's of spins on games like; Cleo's Coins, Reel Party, 5-Reel Circus, Fantasy Fortune, Travel Bug, etc...
Of course there are "off days" when I've gone 100+ spins without features, but there have also been quite a lot of times which have been "Feature Fests" including getting 2, 3 or even 4 re-triggers in the free spins!

+ the stats I quoted above I record as I play - only takes a few minutes to dig them out & verify!

KK

 

[sparkz]

i have to agree with spider too

on average i would call games like cleos coins, atomic age etc.. low variance thats cause you get a win after almost every spin. However although bonuses do sometimes come frequently there is a lot of spells where your looking at 100+ spins without at thing (on atomic age a few times iv set the spins to 200 auto spins.. came back and there was no bonus)

the more high varience would be islots. The bonuses are meant to come round less often...which they do... and of coruse for spin after spin theres sod all wins. Although the bonuses should technically pay out more they are clearly "fixed"

for using the term "fixed" i can imagine a few people moaning at me. However its entirely true. For example lets take free spins on that boxing game and "phsychadelic sixties". A few times when i have had the free spins with a 20c/40c bet 3 wild symbols have come in which expand bringing me $100+ (be it i hadnt met WR so it wasnt my money). However when i was wagering considerably higher it was almost like it knew it couldnt afford to pay me the expected amount from a bet that high. Bonuses would come in even less and when they did it would only pay me a few measly bucks. Most of the free spins would be nothing then 1 or 2 would be a 3 symbol win of the lowest value symbol. That to me isnt using the RNG to correctly determine what win i get but instead telling itself "because the stake was that high and now on a multiplier, if a few wins from the free spins are given the payout will be too high for us to cope with".... so it gives me completely rubbish amounts back

 

[The Dude]

Admin note - accredited casino announcement

There has been an alarming amount of casino support issues deriving from Rival's Centralized support. From this point in time, any Rival powered casino that wishes to be listed in Casinomeister's accredited section must run its own in-house support.

Unfortunately Vanguard and Slotspower casinos do not meet this requirement and had to be removed. I hope they are making plans to form their own service and support. As soon as this is implemented, then they will be reconsidered to come back on board.

 

[sparkz]

There has been an alarming amount of casino support issues deriving from Rival's Centralized support. From this point in time, any Rival powered casino that wishes to be listed in Casinomeister's accredited section must run its own in-house support.

Unfortunately Vanguard and Slotspower casinos do not meet this requirement and had to be removed. I hope they are making plans to form their own service and support. As soon as this is implemented, then they will be reconsidered to come back on board.

a step in the right direction. I think what also annoys players is when you go to live support, and staff take ages to appear, then they ask what casino its for and more often than not dont have a clue what your talking about (when you mention certain bonuses etc)

 

[lancia]

All I know is I have dozens and dozens of Rival play-logs which show features hitting every 50-60 spins over 1000's of spins on games like; Cleo's Coins, Reel Party, 5-Reel Circus, Fantasy Fortune, Travel Bug, etc...KK

I think the problem here is that there are some Rival slots that have a much lower frequency of free-spins. While 5-Reel Circus indeed seems to have a higher frequency of free spins, approximately 1 out of 50 or so spins, others like Hole in Won have a much lower frequency of 1 out of 100 or so spins, based on 1,000's of spins. It's not only the i-Slots with this lower frequency because Dog Pound, which is not an i-Slot, also has a free-spin frequency of about 1 out of 100 or so spins.