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zebedy

No!!!! Im Spartacus
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Jun 1, 2007
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I had this idea yeaterday about getting the links to as many alliliates sites that promote rogue casino's and putting them all here,

1/does anyone think it would do any good or will it be just pointless.
2/buy putting affiliates links on this site would it just be promoting them instead of trying to make them see the error of there ways

The idea i had was to get about 20 or so like minded people that hate to see rogue casino's promoted to help put the links on the site,
they would have the login details of the site so if they come across a website that is EVIL they could just post the links.


good idea? bad idea ?complete waste of time and energy?
 
link goes to a "website under review" page, but i think it's a great idea and very commendable. anything to help people who are just starting to play online is a great idea. since so many people know how to "google" now, every bit of information out there is of benefit to new players especially if it points them in the right direction (or away from the wrong direction).
 
Personally your idea is going to end up in the Rogue Pit. I would assume you just posted your thought without much thought.

Eventually if this idea were to take off, every person with an ax to grind could get a site listed to whatever it is that link you sent us too.
Surprised the USA didn't think of this. Allot cheaper way to put an end to online gambling.
 
Eventually if this idea were to take off, every person with an ax to grind could get a site listed to whatever it is that link you sent us too.
True dat.

IMHO, the only way for the site to work properly is with content monitoring. Someone finds a bad guy's site, sends a link to you, you check it out, you post it. You could have a comment function for people to give opinions on the place...and possibly the offending affiliate can defend his/herself.

Then there's the question of who decides what's rogue. What's the criteria for roguedom? Most of us would agree that anything "Virtual" or from the Gambling Wages stable are so rogue they squeak...yet some of the most, ahem, "respected" affiliates in the industry would promote them to their own mothers. You'd have to be prepared for some serious backlash.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you the best. The Sucks board has been listing bad webmasters for quite some time, so I'm sure my fellow "crew"members and I would be happy to give you a few names.;)
 
I think Swampwitch has hit on most of the problem points here, assuming that the genuine desire would be that such a section were to be objective and fair.

And it is definitely a possibility that there would be some "with an axe to grind" who would seek to manipulate the concept if it were not carefully and consistently supervised.

The starting point would have to be a clear definition of what constitutes a rogue affiliate; a rogue operation that such an affiliate may be promoting and whether he or she is aware that the operation/s they are promoting are rogue.

And whether the affiliate has been given an opportunity to state their case and address their shortcomings.

Otherwise it starts to look like the Spanish Inquisition.

Either way, it looks like a helluva lot of work for someone.
 
Personally your idea is going to end up in the Rogue Pit. I would assume you just posted your thought without much thought.
im glad someone noticed :D
you can probably tell by the website it was thought up pretty quickly and put out there in about 30 minutes, basically it was just to show people what could be done, as some cant visualise thing until they see it
i was going to add more but im only on chapter 2 of html and css for dummies :p
thats why i asked for opinions and didnt post any links to aff sites,
of course there would have to be some rules in place to stop anyone posting to there own agenda,
True dat.

Then there's the question of who decides what's rogue. What's the criteria for roguedom? Most of us would agree that anything "Virtual" or from the Gambling Wages stable are so rogue they squeak...yet some of the most, ahem, "respected" affiliates in the industry would promote them to their own mothers. You'd have to be prepared for some serious backlash.

like you said anything from the virtual group, if any affiliate is promoting virtual,cool cat,cirrus,ect, i doubt very much if they didnt know anything about them, the list would be very short,probably 10-20 or so casino;s i bet most of you probably could name them all, i just listed those sites because thats where i hear the most problems comming from, i mean someone like grand prive casino's couldnt be listed there even though they shafted all of there affiliates ive never heard of them shafting players, even though it seems most affiliates have stopped promoting them anyway.:cool:
as for the backlash , i expect most of the people doing the backlash were people promoting rogues, if i was scared of being insulted or intimidated by these people making any of these threats i probably wouldnt ever go on the internet or message boards again, water off a ducks back,



I think Swampwitch has hit on most of the problem points here, assuming that the genuine desire would be that such a section were to be objective and fair.
And it is definitely a possibility that there would be some "with an axe to grind" who would seek to manipulate the concept if it were not carefully and consistently supervised.
i would hope that there would be enought people out there that willing to post with enough honesty and integrity to keep it going in the spirit it was meant, i am pretty sure im not the only person who feels this way about affiliates getting away with promoting rogues,
if you get one bad apple in a bunch of 20 im sure the other posters wouldnt stand for it, so they wouldnt be around long enough to start there own agenda,

Instead of a webpage maybe it could be in the form of a forum that is moderated ?,

i did post awhile back here at CM about having a section about evil affiliates, but i could now that see it probaly wouldnt be a good idea as the person doing it would be under attack left right and center from disgruntled affiliates, and i expect they could do alot of damage to someone trying to make a living from having this sort of forum, so they would probably have to have no ties to the online gaming world,


Either way, it looks like a helluva lot of work for someone.
personally i wouldnt have the time to do it all or give it the proper commitment it would need, thats where the idea of having around 10-20 people involved. 20 people giving 30 minutes a week = 10 hours, a task shared is a task halved,i think thats how the saying goes?

it was just an idea, something needs to be done but i doubt it will be, affiliates will still be promoting rogues and keeping them in business in 10 years time,
if anyone has the time and commitment to undertake it , the idea's out there,
 
True dat.

IMHO, the only way for the site to work properly is with content monitoring. Someone finds a bad guy's site, sends a link to you, you check it out, you post it. You could have a comment function for people to give opinions on the place...and possibly the offending affiliate can defend his/herself.

Then there's the question of who decides what's rogue. What's the criteria for roguedom? Most of us would agree that anything "Virtual" or from the Gambling Wages stable are so rogue they squeak...yet some of the most, ahem, "respected" affiliates in the industry would promote them to their own mothers. You'd have to be prepared for some serious backlash.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you the best. The Sucks board has been listing bad webmasters for quite some time, so I'm sure my fellow "crew"members and I would be happy to give you a few names.;)

A bit ironic as the Sucks promotes "stellar" casinos like Golden Casino and Gold VIP Club and some other dodgy casinos. Are they listed?
 
Either way, it looks like a helluva lot of work for someone.

A good idea in priniciple, but JetSet has hit the nail on the head. It is hard enough keeping up with all the casinos operating online, let alone the numerious portals promoting them.

That said I have in the past added portals to my blacklist pages. But these were as a direct result of them copying content from my own sites - I also did blacklist CAP - but I wouldn't consider that a portal.

In short, it is a lot of hard work for little or no return.

I think the best way to help try and police affiliates, is by outing them and their bad practices on sites such as CasinoMeister, GPWA and other popular gambling communities where you know there is a large webmaster presence.

Whilst there are countless number of portals, affiliates by and large are a smallish group and word of mouth gets around very quickly by using the current mediums available to you.

Regardless, if you do decide to go ahead and continue with the site, best of luck :)
 
AI think the best way to help try and police affiliates, is by outing them and their bad practices on sites such as CasinoMeister, GPWA and other popular gambling communities where you know there is a large webmaster presence.
As a slight aside, how do you feel about GPWA allowing EuroPartners to become a sponsor?
I know they're not one of your favorites! :rolleyes:
Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)

KK
 
A good idea in priniciple, but JetSet has hit the nail on the head. It is hard enough keeping up with all the casinos operating online, let alone the numerious portals promoting them.

That said I have in the past added portals to my blacklist pages. But these were as a direct result of them copying content from my own sites - I also did blacklist CAP - but I wouldn't consider that a portal.

In short, it is a lot of hard work for little or no return.

I think the best way to help try and police affiliates, is by outing them and their bad practices on sites such as CasinoMeister, GPWA and other popular gambling communities where you know there is a large webmaster presence.

Whilst there are countless number of portals, affiliates by and large are a smallish group and word of mouth gets around very quickly by using the current mediums available to you.

Regardless, if you do decide to go ahead and continue with the site, best of luck :)


i did try that once over at GPWA but i was blasted down by a mod and branded a trouble maker :( although several people agreed with what i said very few people actually spoke up, ever since then my opinion of that site went way down,

what gets me is these affiliates soon bitch and moan when some affiliate programmes changes there terms to rectroactive, and tries to take some money out of the affiliates pocket, but when you go to there website they have no quabbles about promoting and sending a player to a rogue casino,

dam im starting to think i must be related to mary whitehouse,:D
 
I just now became aware of this thread... and I feel I can offer some input on this topic... as I was the one that started the thread that Swampwitch referred to on Sucks... WEBMASTER "HALL OF SHAME"... two years ago.

I decided back in 2007 to "name & shame" webmasters that promoted "rogue" casinos... primarily the "Virtual Group" (and Gambling Wages) along with a few other "known rogues" including the casinos that are "rogued" here on Casinomeister.

A few webmasters replied... claiming to be unaware of the "rogue" label placed on some of the casinos they were promoting... and did indeed remove them from their websites. This was duly noted in follow up posts on that thread.

Most (95%) of the "shamed webmasters" never bothered to reply or respond.

The thread remained quite active for about 4-5 months... and like many topics... started to have only sporadic posts added every few months or so.

Posted by spiderlegz:



A bit ironic as the Sucks promotes "stellar" casinos like Golden Casino and Gold VIP Club and some other dodgy casinos. Are they listed?

I am not the webmaster on Sucks... just the moderator. I'm sure you will find some "questionable" casinos on many websites. I will ask the webmaster of Sucks to post here and address your concerns about those casinos you listed. I do know the site hasn't been updated for awhile... as the webmaster has been very busy with non gambling related issues for the past 9 months.

I'll try to get him here to respond.

I also feel that Zebedy should be applauded for his attempt at "naming & shaming" websites and webmasters that promote rogue casinos. :thumbsup:

Not surprising that you were "blasted" on the GPWA forum... :rolleyes:
A large percentage of webmasters both on GPWA & CAP do indeed still promote Virtual & Gambling Wages casinos... and we all know why... $$$$$$$$$... :eek:

A BIG :thumbsup: to you, Zebedy for trying to exhibit some morals and ethics in an industry highly contaminated by greedy, money hungry, morally bankrupt people.
 
It's interesting (to me) that had I not run into all those wicked freebies, and slimey offers (I just thought all casinos were slimish), I probably would have never gotten into gambling online. And there is still a lot of people out there who just want to play free chips and don't seem to be looking for the most ethical place to play. What is wrong with listing them under Play at your own risk or untrustworthy. You know the old lead a horse to water........but;) Thank you
 
As a slight aside, how do you feel about GPWA allowing EuroPartners to become a sponsor?
I know they're not one of your favorites! :rolleyes:
Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)

KK

Ah yes Europartners. :rolleyes:

There are many programs which are listed on the GPWA site which I would not consider promoting at this moment in time. This also includes Europartners. However I have no problem with Europartners or other programs being listed on the GPWA - It allows webmasters to have easy access to the programs which are listed. Dialogue with the programs is important if and when problems arise - and they do.

I also would not want to tell Michael Corfman how he should run his business and nor am I in a position to do this. Michael since taking over the GPWA has been upfront from the offset in regards to the programs listed on there. The programs are sponsors, nothing more nothing less.

That said if I was running a site like the GPWA, there would be no more than ten programs listed. :D



LOL...I remember that thread, they won't leave Webzcas alone and stop calling him.

Webzcas, did they ever stop calling you by the way?
____
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I still get the odd spam emails from Europartners. I also have received cold calls from them since that thread. But thankfully I haven't received one for quite a few months now :)

i did try that once over at GPWA but i was blasted down by a mod and branded a trouble maker :( although several people agreed with what i said very few people actually spoke up, ever since then my opinion of that site went way down,

what gets me is these affiliates soon bitch and moan when some affiliate programmes changes there terms to rectroactive, and tries to take some money out of the affiliates pocket, but when you go to there website they have no quabbles about promoting and sending a player to a rogue casino,

dam im starting to think i must be related to mary whitehouse,:D

There are many affiliates who do care first and foremost about the player. Off the top of my head, I can name Robwin, Simmo!, Dominique, KK and Meister himself who post here. ( I know there are many more so please don't feel offended if I have left you out - Just providing a couple of examples :) )

I am of the view that to be a successful affiliate and to establish a long term working relationship in this industry, you have to have integrity. To gain integrity and for your sites to be trusted by players is quite simple. Only promote casinos and poker rooms, whereby you yourself are happy to play at.

Since the CAP implosion, it is clear there is a big void and as such affiliates are fragmented all over the place. Out of the CAP ashes have risen new communities to represent affiliates. The worry is, affiliates collectively no longer hold the same sway over the programs that they used to. Therefore we are currently seeing retroactive changes creeping in to some programs terms and conditions. This is a worry if you are a webmaster.

Whilst I am a private member at the GPWA and still have my forum account at CAP and other webmaster communities, Casinomeister and my own forum on OCR are the only two places where I hang out these days.

The great thing about the Casinomeister Forum is that pretty much everyone connected to the industry checks in regulary to see what is happening. I would seriously advise all affiliates who have problems which need raising to also use the webmaster forums here on CM which Bryan has kindly afforded us webmasters.
 
I just now became aware of this thread... and I feel I can offer some input on this topic... as I was the one that started the thread that Swampwitch referred to on Sucks... WEBMASTER "HALL OF SHAME"... two years ago.

I decided back in 2007 to "name & shame" webmasters that promoted "rogue" casinos... primarily the "Virtual Group" (and Gambling Wages) along with a few other "known rogues" including the casinos that are "rogued" here on Casinomeister.

A few webmasters replied... claiming to be unaware of the "rogue" label placed on some of the casinos they were promoting... and did indeed remove them from their websites. This was duly noted in follow up posts on that thread.

Most (95%) of the "shamed webmasters" never bothered to reply or respond.

The thread remained quite active for about 4-5 months... and like many topics... started to have only sporadic posts added every few months or so.

Posted by spiderlegz:




I am not the webmaster on Sucks... just the moderator. I'm sure you will find some "questionable" casinos on many websites. I will ask the webmaster of Sucks to post here and address your concerns about those casinos you listed. I do know the site hasn't been updated for awhile... as the webmaster has been very busy with non gambling related issues for the past 9 months.

I'll try to get him here to respond.

I also feel that Zebedy should be applauded for his attempt at "naming & shaming" websites and webmasters that promote rogue casinos. :thumbsup:

Not surprising that you were "blasted" on the GPWA forum... :rolleyes:
A large percentage of webmasters both on GPWA & CAP do indeed still promote Virtual & Gambling Wages casinos... and we all know why... $$$$$$$$$... :eek:

A BIG :thumbsup: to you, Zebedy for trying to exhibit some morals and ethics in an industry highly contaminated by greedy, money hungry, morally bankrupt people.

I couldn't agree more. Take a look at Zebedy's posts. No sig link, even though their name is in green. I have no clue what Zebedy's website is. But I do know that they are a very active member here, and should definitely get some kudos for taking the initiative on a site like this.

While I agree that it may be impractical to attempt to determine which casinos are rogue, I think we can all agree that the Virtual Group meet all the criteria. So how about just listing/approving the websites that promote Virtual for starters? I don't know what your Google rankings are, but anything to counteract the search engine results that come up now for free bonus, no deposit bonus, etc., certainly couldn't hurt.

I wholeheartedly agree with MrR that you deserve a ton of kudos for even attemtping such a thing. This is EXACTLY the type of thing that I think JHV was trying to get at in the thread he started re: apathy, etc. Yes, you are only one person, but collectively....one and one and one adds up.

Ah yes Europartners. :rolleyes:



That said if I was running a site like the GPWA, there would be no more than ten programs listed. :D

I still get the odd spam emails from Europartners. I also have received cold calls from them since that thread. But thankfully I haven't received one for quite a few months now :)

There are many affiliates who do care first and foremost about the player. Off the top of my head, I can name Robwin, Simmo!, Dominique, KK and Meister himself who post here. ( I know there are many more so please don't feel offended if I have left you out - Just providing a couple of examples :) )

I am of the view that to be a successful affiliate and to establish a long term working relationship in this industry, you have to have integrity. To gain integrity and for your sites to be trusted by players is quite simple. Only promote casinos and poker rooms, whereby you yourself are happy to play at.

Since the CAP implosion, it is clear there is a big void and as such affiliates are fragmented all over the place. Out of the CAP ashes have risen new communities to represent affiliates. The worry is, affiliates collectively no longer hold the same sway over the programs that they used to. Therefore we are currently seeing retroactive changes creeping in to some programs terms and conditions. This is a worry if you are a webmaster.

Whilst I am a private member at the GPWA and still have my forum account at CAP and other webmaster communities, Casinomeister and my own forum on OCR are the only two places where I hang out these days.

The great thing about the Casinomeister Forum is that pretty much everyone connected to the industry checks in regulary to see what is happening. I would seriously advise all affiliates who have problems which need raising to also use the webmaster forums here on CM which Bryan has kindly afforded us webmasters.

Ditto here Webz, re: the # of programs you would promote. It is the whole reason I dropped doing the affy thing....just not enough confidence in many programs/casinos to make it worthwhile. I would struggle to come up with ten, but that's very close to my ideal list.

In re: your list of affies....matches mine exactly. But I would add Lots0. Mojo and Swampwitch to the list. Especially Swampy and Sorrell...I have known those women for forever...and they are as ethical as they come. You are also on my list of "good guys".
 
Zebedy I have just seen your post over on the Sucks board and I have to say I am truly amazed that one of the portals you have listed is featuring on it's home page, casinos such as Cool Cat Casino. :eek:

Indeed performing a search on 'Gambling Wages' ( The affiliate program behind these great virtual casinos :rolleyes: ) shows several prominent affiliate portals recommending them.

These webmasters who run and own these portals are fully aware of the reputation the Virtual Casino Group has, yet it seems they are turning a blind eye. I wouldn't class the webmasters of the portals as weekend warriors either. As far as I know, they do this for a living. They really should know better.
 
Zebedy I have just seen your post over on the Sucks board and I have to say I amazed that one of the portals you have listed is featuring on it's home page sites such as Cool Cat Casino. :eek:

Indeed performing a search on 'Gambling Wages' ( The affiliate program behind these great virtual casinos :rolleyes: ) shows several prominent affiliate portals recommending them.

Without naming names, it's mind boggling isn't it? Cha ching, cha ching, cha ching!!
 
Without naming names, it's mind boggling isn't it? Cha ching, cha ching, cha ching!!

Greed followed by $ followed by Greed.

Bottom line is, you do not need to continue to promote places as notorious as the properties offered by Gambling Wages to make it as a Casino Affiliate.

Indeed some of the sites I have now seen promoting the likes of Cool Cat are run by what I would term big affiliates.

I have been self employed now for 4 years and I have not had to compromise my integrity to make a living. I guess though I have not seen the bigger picture..... :rolleyes:
 
I decided back in 2007 to "name & shame" webmasters that promoted "rogue" casinos... primarily the "Virtual Group" (and Gambling Wages) along with a few other "known rogues" including the casinos that are "rogued" here on Casinomeister.


And there was me thinking i had a unique idea, great minds think alike or is it fools seldom differ :p
seriously though i admire you for having the gonads to do it, i see many people talking about it but not many actually trying to do anything about it, :thumbsup:

Not surprising that you were "blasted" on the GPWA forum... :rolleyes:
A large percentage of webmasters both on GPWA & CAP do indeed still promote Virtual & Gambling Wages casinos... and we all know why... $$$$$$$$$... :eek:
i dont know much about the owners of GPWA but i would have thought that before giving out there seal of approval which get displayed over members sites they would be more strict over what casino's affiliates were allowed to promote, otherwise whats the point in having it, you may as well put a picture of a panda on your site, it just lessens the importance of it,

unlike here you know when CM gives out his awards and seals of aproval to casino's you know they mean something,



I couldn't agree more. Take a look at Zebedy's posts. No sig link, even though their name is in green. I have no clue what Zebedy's website is. But I do know that they are a very active member here, and should definitely get some kudos for taking the initiative on a site like this.
my website is still a works in progress , i never realised until i decided to learn about web building how mush work it involves :eek:and how much you have to learn, im starting to see <> div >/# im my dreams,
i only applied to the web masters section as you need to be a member to post, thats why it shows me being a webmaster,
While I agree that it may be impractical to attempt to determine which casinos are rogue, I think we can all agree that the Virtual Group meet all the criteria. So how about just listing/approving the websites that promote Virtual for starters?[/B] I don't know what your Google rankings are, but anything to counteract the search engine results that come up now for free bonus, no deposit bonus, etc., certainly couldn't hurt.

thats a good idea, it would probably be impossible to try and list all the rogues with all the affiliates that promote them,


Zebedy I have just seen your post over on the Sucks board and I have to say I am truly amazed that one of the portals you have listed is featuring on it's home page, casinos such as Cool Cat Casino. :eek:

Indeed performing a search on 'Gambling Wages' ( The affiliate program behind these great virtual casinos :rolleyes: ) shows several prominent affiliate portals recommending them.

These webmasters who run and own these portals are fully aware of the reputation the Virtual Casino Group has, yet it seems they are turning a blind eye. I wouldn't class the webmasters of the portals as weekend warriors either. As far as I know, they do this for a living. They really should know better.

i was as suprised as you, especially as they were the featured affiliate at gpwa a few weeks ago, there are probably alot more out there,
the only way to stop these people is to do something that hurts there google ranking as pina said or bring down there reputation a notch so it gets to the point when they think twice about what programmes they promote.
i bet if they start losing money because there sites were getting blacklisted for promoting rogues, then they would be removed in a shot,
 
I got rid of GW after reading casinomeister forums. Now it's become a must to read here and part of every day business. But not everyone reads here. I try to reference CM in my posts at other forums when a subject comes up and it fits. Affilaites need to know what players are saying or perhaps they shouldn't be in the biz.

Some do know and promote anyway.. :eek2:
 
If you are still considering this zebedy, I thought you might could use this. Google has a blogging feature and it's free and one thing that would be useful is you can give others access to edit or add.
Just throwing that out there. :D
 

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