Playtech inquiry

[KasinoKing]

You write:

"Regardless of whether you 'touch' the bonus money or not, you are still committed to completing the WR."

That is what Europacasino would like to make believe. I don't think that this general rule applies to all casinos.

I have been playing online casinos virtually daily since January 2001 (That's 8 years).
I have joined and played at well over 140 different casinos.
I can assure you that the vast majority run their bonuses the way I described in my previous post.

Now you can believe that or not. You can like it or not.
But it is a FACT.

How long have you been playing online? How Many casinos?

Sorry, but you're never going to get anywhere with your argument.
Accept it & move on.... please!

KK

[UKDafoe]

I think merino has a point really. I agree with you KK regarding the way casinos treat bonus/cash balances, but we can't expect every new online casino player to know this.

Imagine that this is the first casino merino has ever played, so he read's the terms and conditions carefully to understand how the bonus works. I definitely think his interpretation is correct. It is certainly a careful reading, but he is taking a literal interpretation.

Merino, have you tried filing a dispute with Playtech regarding the seizure of your money rather than just getting your play history. Surely you can explain to them your literal interpretation and stress how you never dipped into your bonus balance so you thus didn't wager your bonus on disallowed games.

http://www.playtech.com/html/index.p...player-inquiry

[KasinoKing]

I think merino has a point really. I agree with you KK regarding the way casinos treat bonus/cash balances, but we can't expect every new online casino player to know this.

Imagine that this is the first casino merino has ever played, so he read's the terms and conditions carefully to understand how the bonus works. I definitely think his interpretation is correct. It is certainly a careful reading, but he is taking a literal interpretation.

Yes - I totally understand that - and I understand why he got confused.
But he has made about 6 posts on this subject, and I have explained it as clearly as possible each time. I even spent quite a while writing & sending him a PM fully explaining it.
And yet he keeps on & on & on about it, and refuses to accept this is how bonuses work.
That's why I am getting a little short with him.

KK

[thelawnet]

I have been playing online casinos virtually daily since January 2001 (That's 8 years).
I have joined and played at well over 140 different casinos.
I can assure you that the vast majority run their bonuses the way I described in my previous post.

Now you can believe that or not. You can like it or not.
But it is a FACT.

How long have you been playing online? How Many casinos?

Sorry, but you're never going to get anywhere with your argument.
Accept it & move on.... please!

Actually your experience is not relevant. The player should be able to read the terms and make decisions from them without having to have 8 years experience. And in any case, any casino can operate its bonuses how it chooses, they are not all the same, the "vast majority" is not ALL, as I'm sure you're well aware.

As the player says:

"The first credits wagered will be deducted from your deposit(s) rather than from the PLAY BONUS”.

“We reserve the right to withhold any amount in excess of the player’s original deposit from a player's withdrawal if the play bonus is wagered on the above mentioned games.”

And as it seems the player got a 25% bonus, 80% of his balance was DEPOSIT, and 20% was PLAY BONUS.

So was the "play bonus" "wagered on the above mentioned games"?

Most likely not given the 80/20 ratio of cash to bonus. If his balance ever fell below 20% of the starting balance, then the answer is yes, otherwise no.

And as he says, the only way to show this would be if they provide the logs, which they certainly should do.

You could argue that this is not what they intended, but in a business to consumer relationship it is not normal to imply terms to the benefit of the business. They happily took his money (these are reload bonuses), and would have continued to do so, despite the fact that he could never be paid. What player will play if he knows he won't be able to cash out? It makes no sense.

BTW, I had a similar issue with Vegas Red Casino to this one, and they eventually paid me up, for similar reasons (the terms and conditions were not clear).

[marino]

Actually your experience is not relevant. The player should be able to read the terms and make decisions from them without having to have 8 years experience. And in any case, any casino can operate its bonuses how it chooses, they are not all the same, the "vast majority" is not ALL, as I'm sure you're well aware.

As the player says:

"The first credits wagered will be deducted from your deposit(s) rather than from the PLAY BONUS”.

“We reserve the right to withhold any amount in excess of the player’s original deposit from a player's withdrawal if the play bonus is wagered on the above mentioned games.”

And as it seems the player got a 25% bonus, 80% of his balance was DEPOSIT, and 20% was PLAY BONUS.

So was the "play bonus" "wagered on the above mentioned games"?

Most likely not given the 80/20 ratio of cash to bonus. If his balance ever fell below 20% of the starting balance, then the answer is yes, otherwise no.

And as he says, the only way to show this would be if they provide the logs, which they certainly should do.

You could argue that this is not what they intended, but in a business to consumer relationship it is not normal to imply terms to the benefit of the business. They happily took his money (these are reload bonuses), and would have continued to do so, despite the fact that he could never be paid. What player will play if he knows he won't be able to cash out? It makes no sense.

BTW, I had a similar issue with Vegas Red Casino to this one, and they eventually paid me up, for similar reasons (the terms and conditions were not clear).

Thank you Thelawnet. I began to doubt about it.
Now, the questions are:
How to force the casino - or Playtech - to provide the records requested?
More difficult still, how to force the casino to meet its T & C and to pay?

[UKDafoe]

Like I said before, you need to file a dispute with Playtech:

http://www.playtech.com/html/index.p...player-inquiry

If Playtech does not help, you have one last option which is the Gibraltar Regulatory Authority. You can find information about that here:

http://www.gra.gi/index.php?site=gambling&section=help


Let us know your results after you've contacted them.

[vinylweatherman]

Like I said before, you need to file a dispute with Playtech:

http://www.playtech.com/html/index.p...player-inquiry

If Playtech does not help, you have one last option which is the Gibraltar Regulatory Authority. You can find information about that here:

http://www.gra.gi/index.php?site=gambling&section=help


Let us know your results after you've contacted them.

I thought that Gibraltar REQUIRED licensees to provide play history to players on request. Check this, and if so, you have them. If Gibraltar rule they acted wrongly in refusing to supply play history, hit them with a follow up complaint based on these terms, and your assertion you kept fully within them. The initial refusal to provide play history will prejudice the casino's case.

[thelawnet]

Like I said before, you need to file a dispute with Playtech:

http://www.playtech.com/html/index.p...player-inquiry

If Playtech does not help, you have one last option which is the Gibraltar Regulatory Authority. You can find information about that here:

http://www.gra.gi/index.php?site=gambling&section=help


Let us know your results after you've contacted them.

Europa are licensed in Antigua. A far cry in terms of reputability (?) from Gibraltar unfortunately for this player.

[UKDafoe]

Europa are licensed in Antigua. A far cry in terms of reputability (?) from Gibraltar unfortunately for this player.

My mistake. Got confused and was thinking the issue was with CasinoLasVegas.

Still worth a shot merino:

http://www.antiguagaming.gov.ag/complaints.asp

[marino]

My mistake. Got confused and was thinking the issue was with CasinoLasVegas.

Still worth a shot merino:

http://www.antiguagaming.gov.ag/complaints.asp

Thank you.
Does not look very efficient.
When I tried to submit a complaint I got a message error.
When I sent an email to the webmaster I got a "mailer Daemon"
I'll send them a registered mail. I hope they have got a letter box