[Resolved] Casino Club - robot or no bot?

[heffernan]

Hello,

I'm new here. I'm from germany. and probably the most interesting capital of the world. like I am on this site? just had a serious disagreement with a casino. and because someone gave me a tip.

 

[The Dude]

Hello,

I'm new here. I'm from germany. and probably the most interesting capital of the world. like I am on this site? just had a serious disagreement with a casino. and because someone gave me a tip.

Well, since you are banned now for being a fraudster, you can't read this if you try to log in.

For those of you using bots at Casino Club - you're getting caught out - and you are wasting Max's time with bogus PABs. I'd appreciate it if you'd all go take a hike and pull your crap with somebody else.

BS like this makes me tend to consider shutting down the PAB section for newbies. It's been done before - I'll do it again.

 

[AudiManinBoro]

Bots? lol How the hell do you use a bot with casinos? pmsl new one on me :S

 

[Shocked]

Well, since you are banned now for being a fraudster, you can't read this if you try to log in.

For those of you using bots at Casino Club - you're getting caught out - and you are wasting Max's time with bogus PABs. I'd appreciate it if you'd all go take a hike and pull your crap with somebody else.

BS like this makes me tend to consider shutting down the PAB section for newbies. It's been done before - I'll do it again.

Do I detect a whiff of hypocrisy from someone who uses bots himself?

Attach Removed (Old not found)

 

[SlotMonster]

Do I detect a whiff of hypocrisy from someone who uses bots himself?

Attach Removed (Old not found)

But Bryan doesn't use Vortran against Casinos

 

[hzock2]

Well, since you are banned now for being a fraudster, you can't read this if you try to log in.

For those of you using bots at Casino Club - you're getting caught out - and you are wasting Max's time with bogus PABs. I'd appreciate it if you'd all go take a hike and pull your crap with somebody else.

BS like this makes me tend to consider shutting down the PAB section for newbies. It's been done before - I'll do it again.

Well Bryan, you may be wrong with this one. I just saw this thread and thought, that the username seemed quite familiar to me and I checked back to see that I read about exactly the same problem posted under the same nick on a German Roulette-Strategy/hardcore gambling forum. Actually he there reported that he deposited 80 Euros and gambled it all the way up to 8000 Euro (seems like REAL gambling to me). He furthermore reported that he has been gambling at CC for a long time now and this was his first cash out ever (link:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

).
He was than told to submit a PAB on your site by another member.
So I dont really get the point why he should be using a bot.

I would be very curious to know what prove you were given by Casino Club, because all the info given on the German board seems quite authentic to me and I wonder about the outcome.

Furthermore looking on the Pitch a Bitch history Casino Club seems to scream 'bot fraudster' at any one cashing out a larger amount of money?! I personally experienced lack of support since the beginning of 2008 (long phone queue and no replys to emails) and this is why I wonder if Casino Club is drifting away from being a professional business.

In case he did in fact use a bot, I can of course understand Casino Clubs descision.

 

[hzock2]

Casino-Club has now posted the game logs on the German forum. Is this the same 'proof' you got and you made your descision upon? A statement would be appreciated...

 

[steinhaug]

Hah, that gameplay really is interesting! First off all, bot or not I don't care since it shouldn't make a difference. However, look at the gameplay.

Constant betting and you loose, change betsize all time to "shock" system and you keep winning. As soon as you keep going constant betsize you loose. Indeed interesting, or should I say - what I already had a feeling of. However nicely done to see theese stats, infact we have a great play right here!

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Look at the betting patterns, and it pays of aslong as you do NOT repeat the bet after a win! Start doing that and you loose!

 

[steinhaug]

OMG! I wonder who's the BOT here, the casino or the player? I Dare anyone to accually look at the gameplay here, there are a HUGE pattern on how to win here. Not ONE time does the player have 2 wins in a row in 2216 hands!

If this gameplay doesn't show that online BJ is a laugh I do not know!

Now please anyone who knows deviance or what you call it, please tell me what I do not get in the gameplay here? What is random and fair with this gameplay?

Obviously the betting pattern is forcing a pattern from the way the games are dealt here.

Edit:
Attached is the gameplay posted at the other site, 2216 hands of BJ. There are 3 files in the ZIP file.

bj.txt - the gameplay as posted on german site
bj +.txt, all win lines prefixed with + for easy spotting of wins
bj -.txt, all lose lines prefixed with - for easy spotting losses.

 

[Shocked]

If those are the logs that are supposed to reveal that this player was using a bot then Casino Club have just shot themselves in the foot..with a shotgun...several times..then in the head just for good measure. If anything that hzock2 has said is true, then this casino should be relegated to the rogue bin until they've paid this person out.

My 2p.

 

[WAYLANDER]

Am i missing something

Am i missing something ?
I am having a bit of trouble working those logs out.. but it does indeed look like the player never won 2 hands in a row in over 2000 hands !

Now if that is true, then that is simply Ludicrous ... the odds of that happening ... are .... well ... Impossible !

WAYLANDER

 

[steinhaug]

I am having a bit of trouble working those logs out.. but it does indeed look like the player never won 2 hands in a row in over 2000 hands !

You read the log from bottom and up. The first line is the last hand. The format is like this:

Blackjack BJ_WIN1 1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:46 9050 / 10050

1. Game name (blackjack)
2. BJ_WIN1 = win, BJ BET1 = loss
3. balance change (1000 = bet 1000 and win, -500 would equal bet 500 and lose)
4. Date of bet
5. Time of bet
6. Balance before bet
7. Balance after bet

If you have problems reading the file I suggest the free TextPad (google it) to view with, one of the best text editors for the windows platform.

 

[Shocked]

Am i missing something ?
I am having a bit of trouble working those logs out.. but it does indeed look like the player never won 2 hands in a row in over 2000 hands !

Now if that is true, then that is simply Ludicrous ... the odds of that happening ... are .... well ... Impossible !

WAYLANDER

It looks like that because of the way that its formatted - Bets are separate to wins, so if there is a win then it looks like this

Win
Bet
Win
Bet

As opposed to this:

Win
Win

Which I presume is what you're thinking

Think there are more important issues here anyway, if these logs are true!

 

[KasinoKing]

Think there are more important issues here anyway, if these logs are true!

What issues are they then?
Did the player have his winnings confiscated for bot play?

I have absolutely zero experience of how bots work or what they play like, but if that was a bot playing it was a very clever one! The hand rate seems quite slow and the bet amounts are jumping all over the place. I always assumed bots just flat bet X hands as quickly as posible...

 

[Westland Bowl]

Over 2000 blackjack hands and not ONE back to back win?? Sheeeet! Yet the guy still wins $6000 at the end of Kmiss zip file. That guy went up over $8000, down into negative, back up to a high of $9175, back down into negative, several more ups and downs, then a steady coast to $6000 over. This is definitely NOT a random game! He only won 34.8% of his hands versus normal blackjack of around 43%. One thing I couldn't tell is whether there were any pushes in there.

 

[steinhaug]

Did the player have his winnings confiscated for bot play?

Yes indeed, and the meister agrees it seems. It doesn't look like bot play to me, unless it's a very adaptive one.

If you look at the gameplay it's pretty consistent, with a betting pattern like this:

1 unit lose
2 unit lose
4 unit lose
8 unit win

and start over again. Your bet unit would be from $10 - $100. 1967 hands he reaches his record high with $11.000 after a $1.000 win. From here he changes the tactic to a disastrous one! This to me looks like he is tired of wagering the bet style and just hopes for the best (read: no bot should do this). He starts flatbetting $500 and in the next 113 hands his down to $1.300.

After this he goes back to the already established working pattern, and builds up to $10.050 in 136. I might add some of the bets here are rather juicy, but looking at the previous 2000 hands it's pretty well established what the outcome would be - making the hands more than safe to get back. I would then think that after 6 hours of play he was tired and happy to reach the 10K mark and stopped.

To me this doesn't look like bot play more than a dedicated player. However it's very clear that the system responds by increasing the bet by serveing you a win (yes, increasing bet was smart of you!) - then you loose if you keep going (sucker!).

...Bets are separate to wins, so if there is a win then it looks like this

I belive you are reading the stats wrong. They look like this (excerpt from the data I posted)

Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:30 3050 / 2550
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:30 2050 / 3050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:30 2550 / 2050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:29 3050 / 2550
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:29 3550 / 3050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:29 4050 / 3550
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:29 4550 / 4050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:29 5050 / 4550

It is clear to me that each line represents a seperate bet, and 2 wins in order should require two lines in consecutive order. The above data would state, read from bottom up: 6 bets on $500, all lost. Then one bet of $1000 win, then one bet of $500 lose.

You even have the balance in the end clearly stating each line is one bet.

What issues are they then?

Obviously there are clear patterns here, and they stand out quite clear as I mentioned above. Looking at the betting read from bottom of the file I attached and go upwards, this system should not work unless there is a pattern match from the RNG that serves you cards given a scenario. (Say, when you increase your bet we let you win, thats a nice way to honor the player for increasing the bet, in change we make you loose thereafter when/if you continue).

Also, this betting pattern for some reason makes 2 wins in a row totally abscent... This is quite impressive really! If indeed theese are the right stats it only tells me that this:

The system is buildt to make big gamblers loose! To hook you that means you must be rewarded when increasing the bet. Usually you will stick on a higher wager if you win, and this is where you usually lose all again.

This player didn't do that, and therefore he kept building. That is - he did do that, and when he kept going on high wager he lost damn fast! When going back to a system which the computer most likely will detect as a player increasing the bet the win comes, however the system is messed up since the player doesnt keep going on that wager - hence never 2 wins in sequence since the payout is messed up.

Anywho, I would love to read some card experts observation on this gameresult and the result it produced compared to what one would normally expect from such play.

 

[steinhaug]

One thing I couldn't tell is whether there were any pushes in there.

This is true. We cannot see if the user willingly busts either. I would only assume that with theese stakes you are playing optimal play and have memorized perfect play.

I cannot find any pushes at all in the list while scanning with my eyes, neither BJs either. I could write a quick PHP script to analyze the data better, this way we could quickly spot any BJs or pushes if exists in data.

Then again, quite possible this play results in no pushes and no BJs at all. I know from normal gameplay that if you start getting those BJ (or dealer for that matter) they usually come in clusters. Maby this betting style is abscent from BJs? You never know, it's incredible data.

It's easy to validate the data really, just check with the user from the german forum if this infact is the casino support personel, since the data was copied from he/her post.

 

[hzock2]

As far as I can judge this data was posted by casino club personnel. The accused player wrote an EMail to Casino Club (and posted a copy in the thread) in which he allowed the support team to publish his game play history.

A user called "casinoclub" registered two days ago and posted:

[translated posting/ 1st posting on page 18]

For your acknowledgement:
Upon your written statement of agreement, we are going to publish an extract of the game play history of the Black Jack game session mentioned here. Casino Club thinks that is inhuman to play more than 6 hrs with only 3 breaks of 2 minutes each. The total game play has a length of more than 6 hrs. This case has also been investigated and concluded by Casino Meister.


However I wonder why they only posted about 90% of the game logs.

edit: btw I think that there actually have been blackjacks, but the log seems to present this quite strange.
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 37.5 11-12-2008 04:07 6965 / 7002.5
Blackjack BJ BET1 -37.5 11-12-2008 04:07 7002.5 / 6965
As far as I know, you can not bet 50 Cents, so I guess this is a 25$ bet with a BJ (37,5$ win)

And can someone with mod rights please change the topic of this thread to sth better fitting (i.e. Casino Club bot play accuse), so that you can basically see what it is all about.

 

[Rusty]

There are bets that win Twice or more consecutively
For example;

Blackjack BJ_WIN1 50 11-12-2008 01:37 4500 / 4550
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:37 4525 / 4500
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 25 11-12-2008 01:37 4500 / 4525
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:37 4525 / 4500
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 50 11-12-2008 01:36 4475 / 4525
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:36 4500 / 4475
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 50 11-12-2008 01:36 4450 / 4500
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:36 4475 / 4450
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 50 11-12-2008 01:35 4425 / 4475
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:35 4450 / 4425
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 250 11-12-2008 01:35 4200 / 4450
Blackjack BJ BET1 -100 11-12-2008 01:35 4300 / 4200
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 200 11-12-2008 01:34 4100 / 4300
Blackjack BJ BET1 -100 11-12-2008 01:34 4200 / 4100
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 200 11-12-2008 01:34 4000 / 4200
Blackjack BJ BET1 -100 11-12-2008 01:34 4100 / 4000

Shows 8 successive winning hands

However there are some serious questions that need to be answered.

1.What specific evidence in these logs relates to this being bot play?

(Does that mean any player could randomly bet a certain way and have their winnings confiscated?)

2. Does any evidence that proves bot play also prove algorithms are being used in the game to manipulate results?

Who is cheating here, the Casino, the player, or both?

 

[Rusty]

As far as I can judge this data was posted by casino club personnel. The accused player wrote an EMail to Casino Club (and posted a copy in the thread) in which he allowed the support team to publish his game play history.

A user called "casinoclub" registered two days ago and posted:

[translated posting/ 1st posting on page 18]

For your acknowledgement:
Upon your written statement of agreement, we are going to publish an extract of the game play history of the Black Jack game session mentioned here. Casino Club thinks that is inhuman to play more than 6 hrs with only 3 breaks of 2 minutes each. The total game play has a length of more than 6 hrs. This case has also been investigated and concluded by Casino Meister.


However I wonder why they only posted about 90% of the game logs.

May I ask your relationship with the original poster?

Casino Club thinks that is inhuman to play more than 6 hrs with only 3 breaks of 2 minutes each. The total game play has a length of more than 6 hrs

If this is true every gambler I know is a bot.
If that is the reason it is complete bullshit.

I will wait for Bryan to give some more info before making any conclusions.

 

[hzock2]

As I already told in this thread, I am a user of the same German forum.
I do not know the poster personally neither did I have any personal contact with that user. I am by coincidence reading both the Roulette-Forum and Casino-Meister.

 

[steinhaug]

Shows 8 successive winning hands

So what you are reading as a winning hand is looking at two and two hands, meaning one low lose then one high win - this is concidered a win. And there are 8 of them in a row. Then I see what you mean.

EDIT:
Thanks to Rusty and KK for pointing this out, I am reading the data wrong here! I will change my script and repost the data in a minute.

 

[Jufo]

For your acknowledgement:
Upon your written statement of agreement, we are going to publish an extract of the game play history of the Black Jack game session mentioned here. Casino Club thinks that is inhuman to play more than 6 hrs with only 3 breaks of 2 minutes each. The total game play has a length of more than 6 hrs. This case has also been investigated and concluded by Casino Meister.

I hope this is not the "evidence" their confiscation is based on. First of all, bots are not used when playing 500 EUR hands. Secondly, with that bet size I would be so anxious that I couldn't have a bathroom break either. When you are really in the flow of the game, playing even 18 hours without any breaks is possible.

Casinomeister should give more details why he thinks this PAB is fraudulent or does he automatically believe the Casino's version?

 

[steinhaug]

OK, I recomputed the data for you so it's human readable. And now it's correct.

All bet's are devided like this:
Format: bet amount: bust - push - win (amount bj)

$0005: 013 : 002 : 006 (001)
$0007: 001 : 000 : 000 (000)
$0010: 003 : 000 : 003 (000)
$0015: 006 : 001 : 004 (001)
$0025: 071 : 012 : 073 (011)
$0030: 001 : 000 : 001 (001)
$0035: 001 : 001 : 000 (000)
$0037: 001 : 002 : 001 (001)
$0050: 026 : 003 : 025 (002)
$0055: 001 : 000 : 000 (000)
$0060: 001 : 000 : 001 (000)
$0075: 006 : 004 : 015 (001)
$0100: 253 : 040 : 223 (020)
$0150: 014 : 007 : 005 (004)
$0200: 027 : 002 : 044 (001)
$0250: 002 : 000 : 004 (002)
$0300: 006 : 001 : 011 (002)
$0375: 001 : 000 : 000 (000)
$0400: 000 : 000 : 002 (001)
$0450: 001 : 000 : 000 (000)
$0500: 211 : 042 : 191 (024)
$0750: 008 : 003 : 005 (005)
$0800: 000 : 000 : 002 (000)
$0900: 000 : 000 : 001 (000)
$1000: 021 : 003 : 030 (000)
$1250: 000 : 000 : 001 (001)

As for the gameplay, in correct order it looks like this:
Format: Hand number: balance change, and explernation

Bold are wins, and +200 would mean a 200 bet who won.

0001: +[B]200[/B]
0002: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0003: -100
0004: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0005: -100
0006: +[B]200[/B]
0007: -100
0008: +[B]100[/B]
0009: -100
0010: +[B]200[/B]
0011: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0012: -25
0013: -25
0014: -50
0015: +[B]50[/B]
0016: -50
0017: -50
0018: -100
0019: -100
0020: +[B]100[/B]
0021: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0022: -100
0023: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0024: +[B]100[/B]
0025: -100
0026: -100
0027: +[B]100[/B]
0028: +[B]100[/B]
0029: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0030: +[B]25[/B]
0031: +[B]25[/B]
0032: +[B]25[/B]
0033: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0034: +[B]25[/B]
0035: -25
0036: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0037: +[B]5[/B]
0038: +[B]15[/B]
0039: +[B]5[/B]
0040: -5
0041: -15
0042: -25
0043: -55
0044: +[B]100[/B]
0045: -5
0046: -30
0047: -50
0048: -100
0049: +[B]100[/B]
0050: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0051: -5
0052: +[B]15[/B]
0053: -5
0054: +[B]10[/B]
0055: -10
0056: +[B]25[/B]
0057: -5
0058: +[B]22.5[/B] (BJ, 15 bet)
0059: -5
0060: -15
0061: +[B]60[/B]
0062: +[B]7.5[/B] (BJ, 5 bet)
0063: -5
0064: -15
0065: -25
0066: +0 (push, 75 bet)
0067: +[B]75[/B]
0068: -7.5
0069: -10
0070: +[B]10[/B]
0071: -5
0072: -15
0073: -25
0074: +[B]75[/B]
0075: -5
0076: -15
0077: +[B]45[/B] (BJ, 30 bet)
0078: +0 (push, 5 bet)
0079: +0 (push, 15 bet)
0080: -15
0081: +0 (push, 35 bet)
0082: -35
0083: -75
0084: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0085: -100
0086: +[B]100[/B]
0087: +[B]100[/B]
0088: -100
0089: -100
0090: -100
0091: +[B]100[/B]
0092: +[B]100[/B]
0093: -200
0094: +[B]200[/B]
0095: -100
0096: +[B]200[/B]
0097: +[B]200[/B]
0098: +[B]100[/B]
0099: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0100: -25
0101: +[B]25[/B]
0102: -25
0103: -50
0104: -50
0105: -100
0106: -100
0107: -100
0108: -100
0109: +[B]100[/B]
0110: -100
0111: +[B]100[/B]
0112: +[B]-50[/B] (BJ, 150 bet)
0113: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0114: +[B]100[/B]
0115: +[B]100[/B]
0116: -100
0117: +[B]100[/B]
0118: +[B]100[/B]
0119: -100
0120: -100
0121: +[B]100[/B]
0122: +[B]100[/B]
0123: +[B]200[/B]
0124: +[B]100[/B]
0125: -100
0126: +[B]100[/B]
0127: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0128: -100
0129: +[B]100[/B]
0130: -100
0131: -100
0132: -100
0133: -200
0134: -100
0135: +[B]100[/B]
0136: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0137: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0138: +[B]100[/B]
0139: +[B]100[/B]
0140: -100
0141: -100
0142: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0143: -100
0144: +[B]100[/B]
0145: +[B]100[/B]
0146: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0147: -100
0148: -100
0149: -100
0150: +0 (push, 200 bet)
0151: -100
0152: +[B]100[/B]
0153: -100
0154: -100
0155: +[B]100[/B]
0156: -100
0157: +[B]100[/B]
0158: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0159: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0160: -100
0161: -100
0162: +0 (push, 200 bet)
0163: +[B]200[/B]
0164: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0165: -100
0166: +[B]100[/B]
0167: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0168: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0169: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0170: +[B]100[/B]
0171: -100
0172: +[B]100[/B]
0173: -100
0174: -100
0175: +[B]100[/B]
0176: +[B]100[/B]
0177: -100
0178: -100
0179: -100
0180: -100
0181: -100
0182: +[B]100[/B]
0183: -100
0184: -150
0185: +[B]100[/B]
0186: +[B]100[/B]
0187: +[B]100[/B]
0188: +[B]100[/B]
0189: +[B]100[/B]
0190: -100
0191: -100
0192: -100
0193: -150
0194: -100
0195: -100
0196: +[B]200[/B]
0197: -100
0198: -100
0199: +[B]100[/B]
0200: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0201: -100
0202: -100
0203: +[B]100[/B]
0204: -100
0205: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0206: -100
0207: +[B]100[/B]
0208: +[B]100[/B]
0209: +[B]100[/B]
0210: +[B]100[/B]
0211: +[B]100[/B]
0212: +[B]100[/B]
0213: -100
0214: +[B]100[/B]
0215: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 250 bet)
0216: +[B]100[/B]
0217: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0218: -100
0219: +[B]100[/B]
0220: +[B]100[/B]
0221: -100
0222: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0223: -100
0224: +[B]100[/B]
0225: +[B]200[/B]
0226: -100
0227: -100
0228: -100
0229: -100
0230: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0231: +[B]100[/B]
0232: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0233: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0234: +[B]25[/B]
0235: -25
0236: -100
0237: -100
0238: +[B]100[/B]
0239: -100
0240: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0241: +[B]100[/B]
0242: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0243: +[B]50[/B]
0244: -25
0245: -25
0246: -50
0247: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0248: +[B]100[/B]
0249: +[B]200[/B]
0250: +[B]25[/B]
0251: -25
0252: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0253: +[B]25[/B]
0254: +[B]25[/B]
0255: +[B]25[/B]
0256: +[B]25[/B]
0257: +[B]25[/B]
0258: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0259: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0260: +[B]50[/B]
0261: +[B]25[/B]
0262: -25
0263: -50
0264: +[B]25[/B]
0265: +[B]25[/B]
0266: -25
0267: +[B]50[/B]
0268: -25
0269: +[B]25[/B]
0270: -25
0271: +[B]50[/B]
0272: +[B]25[/B]
0273: -25
0274: -25
0275: -100
0276: +[B]100[/B]
0277: -25
0278: +[B]75[/B]
0279: -25
0280: +[B]75[/B]
0281: -25
0282: +[B]75[/B] (BJ, 50 bet)
0283: +[B]25[/B]
0284: +[B]25[/B]
0285: +[B]25[/B]
0286: +[B]25[/B]
0287: +[B]25[/B]
0288: +[B]25[/B]
0289: -25
0290: -50
0291: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0292: +[B]100[/B]
0293: +[B]25[/B]
0294: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0295: +[B]25[/B]
0296: +[B]25[/B]
0297: +[B]25[/B]
0298: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0299: +[B]25[/B]
0300: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0301: -25
0302: -25
0303: -25
0304: +[B]25[/B]
0305: -25
0306: +[B]75[/B]
0307: -25
0308: +[B]75[/B]
0309: +[B]25[/B]
0310: +[B]25[/B]
0311: +[B]25[/B]
0312: +[B]25[/B]
0313: +[B]25[/B]
0314: -25
0315: -5
0316: +0 (push, 5 bet)
0317: +[B]10[/B]
0318: +[B]5[/B]
0319: +[B]5[/B]
0320: +[B]5[/B]
0321: -5
0322: -25
0323: +0 (push, 75 bet)
0324: -75
0325: -100
0326: -100
0327: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0328: -200
0329: -200
0330: -200
0331: +[B]100[/B]
0332: -100
0333: -100
0334: -100
0335: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0336: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0337: -100
0338: -100
0339: -100
0340: -100
0341: +[B]200[/B]
0342: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0343: +[B]100[/B]
0344: +[B]100[/B]
0345: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0346: +[B]100[/B]
0347: +[B]100[/B]
0348: +[B]100[/B]
0349: +[B]100[/B]
0350: +[B]100[/B]
0351: +[B]100[/B]
0352: +[B]100[/B]
0353: +[B]200[/B]
0354: -100
0355: -100
0356: +[B]100[/B]
0357: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0358: -100
0359: +[B]200[/B]
0360: +[B]100[/B]
0361: +[B]100[/B]
0362: -100
0363: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0364: -100
0365: -150
0366: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0367: +[B]100[/B]
0368: -100
0369: -100
0370: -100
0371: +[B]100[/B]
0372: -100
0373: +[B]100[/B]
0374: -100
0375: -200
0376: -150
0377: -100
0378: -200
0379: +[B]100[/B]
0380: +[B]100[/B]
0381: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0382: -100
0383: +[B]100[/B]
0384: -100
0385: +[B]100[/B]
0386: -200
0387: -100
0388: -150
0389: +[B]100[/B]
0390: -100
0391: -100
0392: +[B]100[/B]
0393: +[B]100[/B]
0394: +[B]100[/B]
0395: +[B]100[/B]
0396: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0397: -100
0398: -100
0399: -100
0400: -100
0401: +[B]100[/B]
0402: -100
0403: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0404: +[B]100[/B]
0405: -100
0406: -100
0407: +[B]100[/B]
0408: -100
0409: -100
0410: -200
0411: -100
0412: -100
0413: +[B]100[/B]
0414: +[B]100[/B]
0415: +[B]100[/B]
0416: +[B]100[/B]
0417: +[B]200[/B]
0418: +[B]100[/B]
0419: -100
0420: -100
0421: -200
0422: -150
0423: +[B]100[/B]
0424: -100
0425: +[B]100[/B]
0426: -100
0427: +[B]200[/B]
0428: +[B]100[/B]
0429: +[B]200[/B]
0430: +[B]100[/B]
0431: +[B]100[/B]
0432: -100
0433: -100
0434: -100
0435: -200
0436: -200
0437: -100
0438: +[B]200[/B]
0439: +[B]100[/B]
0440: -100
0441: -100
0442: +[B]100[/B]
0443: -100
0444: +[B]100[/B]
0445: +[B]100[/B]
0446: -100
0447: +[B]100[/B]
0448: +[B]100[/B]
0449: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0450: -100
0451: -100
0452: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0453: -100
0454: +[B]100[/B]
0455: -100
0456: -100
0457: -100
0458: +[B]100[/B]
0459: +[B]100[/B]
0460: +[B]100[/B]
0461: -100
0462: +[B]100[/B]
0463: -100
0464: -100
0465: -100
0466: -100
0467: +[B]100[/B]
0468: +[B]100[/B]
0469: +[B]200[/B]
0470: -100
0471: +[B]100[/B]
0472: +[B]200[/B]
0473: -100
0474: +[B]100[/B]
0475: +[B]100[/B]
0476: -100
0477: -250
0478: -100
0479: -100
0480: -100
0481: -100
0482: -100
0483: -100
0484: -100
0485: -100
0486: -200
0487: -200
0488: -100
0489: -100
0490: -100
0491: +[B]100[/B]
0492: +[B]100[/B]
0493: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0494: +[B]200[/B]
0495: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0496: +[B]200[/B]
0497: +[B]100[/B]
0498: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0499: +[B]100[/B]
0500: +[B]100[/B]
0501: +[B]100[/B]
0502: +[B]100[/B]
0503: -100
0504: -100
0505: +[B]100[/B]
0506: +[B]100[/B]
0507: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0508: +[B]100[/B]
0509: -100
0510: +[B]100[/B]
0511: +[B]100[/B]
0512: +[B]100[/B]
0513: +[B]100[/B]
0514: +[B]100[/B]
0515: -100
0516: -100
0517: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0518: +[B]100[/B]
0519: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0520: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0521: +[B]100[/B]
0522: +[B]100[/B]
0523: +[B]100[/B]
0524: -100
0525: +[B]100[/B]
0526: +[B]100[/B]
0527: -100
0528: -100
0529: +[B]50[/B] (BJ, 150 bet)
0530: +[B]100[/B]
0531: +[B]100[/B]
0532: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0533: -100
0534: +[B]200[/B]
0535: -100
0536: -100
0537: +[B]100[/B]
0538: +[B]100[/B]
0539: -100
0540: -150
0541: +[B]100[/B]
0542: +[B]200[/B]
0543: +[B]100[/B]
0544: +[B]100[/B]
0545: -100
0546: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0547: -100
0548: +[B]100[/B]
0549: -100
0550: -100
0551: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0552: +[B]100[/B]
0553: -150
0554: -200
0555: -100
0556: -100
0557: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0558: +[B]100[/B]
0559: -100
0560: -100
0561: +[B]200[/B]
0562: -200
0563: -200
0564: +[B]100[/B]
0565: -100
0566: -25
0567: +[B]75[/B]
0568: -25
0569: -50
0570: +[B]100[/B]
0571: -100
0572: -100
0573: +[B]200[/B]
0574: -100
0575: +[B]200[/B]
0576: -100
0577: +[B]100[/B]
0578: +[B]200[/B]
0579: +[B]200[/B]
0580: +[B]200[/B]
0581: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0582: +[B]100[/B]
0583: +[B]100[/B]
0584: +[B]100[/B]
0585: +[B]100[/B]
0586: +[B]100[/B]
0587: -100
0588: -100
0589: -100
0590: -100
0591: -100
0592: -100
0593: +[B]100[/B]
0594: -100
0595: -100
0596: +[B]100[/B]
0597: +[B]200[/B]
0598: +[B]100[/B]
0599: +[B]100[/B]
0600: -100
0601: +[B]100[/B]
0602: +[B]100[/B]
0603: +[B]200[/B]
0604: +[B]100[/B]
0605: -100
0606: -100
0607: +[B]200[/B]
0608: -100
0609: -100
0610: -100
0611: +[B]100[/B]
0612: +[B]100[/B]
0613: +[B]100[/B]
0614: +[B]100[/B]
0615: -100
0616: +[B]100[/B]
0617: +[B]100[/B]
0618: -100
0619: -100
0620: -100
0621: +[B]200[/B]
0622: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0623: -100
0624: +[B]100[/B]
0625: -100
0626: -100
0627: +[B]100[/B]
0628: -150
0629: +[B]100[/B]
0630: -100
0631: -100
0632: -100
0633: -100
0634: +[B]100[/B]
0635: -100
0636: -100
0637: -100
0638: +[B]300[/B] (BJ, 200 bet)
0639: +[B]200[/B]
0640: -100
0641: -100
0642: -200
0643: +[B]500[/B]
0644: +[B]100[/B]
0645: +[B]100[/B]
0646: +[B]100[/B]
0647: -100
0648: -300
0649: -500
0650: +[B]500[/B]
0651: -500
0652: -500
0653: +[B]500[/B]
0654: -25
0655: +[B]75[/B]
0656: +[B]25[/B]
0657: -50
0658: +[B]100[/B]
0659: -25
0660: +[B]50[/B]
0661: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0662: +[B]50[/B]
0663: -25
0664: -25
0665: +[B]75[/B]
0666: +[B]25[/B]
0667: +0 (push, 37.5 bet)
0668: -50
0669: -100
0670: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0671: +[B]100[/B]
0672: +[B]100[/B]
0673: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0674: +[B]25[/B]
0675: -25
0676: +[B]50[/B]
0677: +[B]25[/B]
0678: +[B]25[/B]
0679: -25
0680: +[B]25[/B]
0681: +[B]25[/B]
0682: -25
0683: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0684: +[B]25[/B]
0685: -25
0686: -50
0687: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0688: +[B]100[/B]
0689: +[B]50[/B]
0690: -25
0691: -25
0692: +[B]100[/B]
0693: +[B]50[/B]
0694: -75
0695: +[B]150[/B]
0696: -25
0697: -150
0698: -150
0699: +[B]500[/B]
0700: +0 (push, 37.5 bet)
0701: -5
0702: +[B]25[/B]
0703: -10
0704: +[B]15[/B]
0705: -25
0706: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0707: -25
0708: +[B]50[/B]
0709: +[B]50[/B]
0710: +[B]25[/B]
0711: -25
0712: +[B]12.5[/B] (BJ, 37.5 bet)
0713: -25
0714: +[B]25[/B]
0715: -25
0716: +[B]25[/B]
0717: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0718: -50
0719: +[B]50[/B] (BJ, 150 bet)
0720: -50
0721: +[B]100[/B]
0722: +[B]25[/B]
0723: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0724: -25
0725: +[B]50[/B]
0726: -25
0727: -25
0728: -100
0729: -375
0730: +[B]900[/B]
0731: +[B]25[/B]
0732: -25
0733: +0 (push, 75 bet)
0734: +[B]75[/B]
0735: -25
0736: +[B]100[/B]
0737: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0738: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0739: -25
0740: +[B]75[/B]
0741: +[B]50[/B]
0742: -25
0743: +[B]50[/B]
0744: -25
0745: +[B]50[/B]
0746: -50
0747: +[B]100[/B]
0748: +[B]25[/B]
0749: +[B]25[/B]
0750: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0751: +[B]25[/B]
0752: -25
0753: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0754: +[B]25[/B]
0755: -25
0756: -25
0757: -100
0758: +[B]200[/B]
0759: +[B]75[/B] (BJ, 50 bet)
0760: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0761: +[B]37.5[/B] (BJ, 25 bet)
0762: +[B]25[/B]
0763: -25
0764: -50
0765: -100
0766: -200
0767: +[B]500[/B]
0768: +[B]25[/B]
0769: -25
0770: +[B]50[/B]
0771: +0 (push, 50 bet)
0772: +[B]50[/B]
0773: -50
0774: +0 (push, 50 bet)
0775: -50
0776: -100
0777: +[B]450[/B] (BJ, 300 bet)
0778: +[B]25[/B]
0779: +[B]25[/B]
0780: -25
0781: -75
0782: +[B]375[/B] (BJ, 250 bet)
0783: -37.5
0784: -100
0785: -300
0786: -500
0787: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
0788: +[B]250[/B] (BJ, 750 bet)
0789: -25
0790: -75
0791: +0 (push, 500 bet)
0792: +[B]250[/B]
0793: -50
0794: +0 (push, 150 bet)
0795: -150
0796: -450
0797: +[B]500[/B]
0798: +[B]250[/B] (BJ, 750 bet)
0799: +[B]500[/B]
0800: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0801: -25
0802: -60
0803: -200
0804: -500
0805: -1000
0806: -500
0807: +[B]500[/B]
0808: +[B]500[/B]
0809: -500
0810: -500
0811: +[B]1000[/B]
0812: -500
0813: +[B]500[/B]
0814: +[B]500[/B]
0815: +[B]500[/B]
0816: +[B]500[/B]
0817: -100
0818: -200
0819: +0 (push, 1000 bet)
0820: -500
0821: -500
0822: -500
0823: +0 (push, 500 bet)
0824: +[B]500[/B]
0825: -500
0826: +[B]500[/B]
0827: -500
0828: -500
0829: +0 (push, 1000 bet)
0830: +[B]500[/B]
0831: -500
0832: -500
0833: -500
0834: +[B]1000[/B]
0835: -500
0836: -1000
0837: -500
0838: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
0839: +[B]500[/B]
0840: -500
0841: +[B]500[/B]
0842: +[B]500[/B]
0843: -500
0844: +[B]500[/B]
0845: +[B]500[/B]
0846: +[B]500[/B]
0847: +0 (push, 500 bet)
0848: -500
0849: +[B]250[/B] (BJ, 750 bet)
0850: -500
0851: -1000
0852: -500
0853: +[B]500[/B]
0854: +[B]1000[/B]
0855: -500
0856: -500
0857: -500
0858: +[B]500[/B]
0859: +[B]500[/B]
0860: -1000
0861: -500
0862: -500
0863: -1000
0864: -500
0865: +[B]500[/B]
0866: -500
0867: +[B]500[/B]
0868: -1000
0869: -500
0870: +[B]100[/B]
0871: -100
0872: +[B]500[/B]
0873: -100
0874: +[B]800[/B]
0875: -100
0876: -200
0877: +[B]800[/B]
0878: +[B]100[/B]
0879: -100
0880: -200
0881: +[B]500[/B]
0882: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0883: -100
0884: -300
0885: -500
0886: +[B]500[/B]
0887: +[B]500[/B]
0888: -500
0889: -500
0890: -500
0891: -500
0892: +[B]500[/B]
0893: -500
0894: +[B]500[/B]
0895: +[B]500[/B]
0896: +[B]100[/B]
0897: -100
0898: +[B]300[/B]
0899: +[B]100[/B]
0900: +[B]200[/B]
0901: -100
0902: -100
0903: +[B]300[/B]
0904: +[B]300[/B]
0905: -100
0906: -100
0907: +[B]300[/B]
0908: -100
0909: +[B]100[/B]
0910: -100
0911: -100
0912: +[B]300[/B]
0913: -100
0914: -300
0915: -500
0916: +0 (push, 500 bet)
0917: +[B]500[/B]
0918: -100
0919: +[B]300[/B]
0920: +[B]300[/B]
0921: -100
0922: -100
0923: -200
0924: +[B]500[/B]
0925: +[B]500[/B]
0926: -100
0927: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
0928: +[B]100[/B]
0929: -100
0930: +[B]100[/B]
0931: +[B]100[/B]
0932: +[B]100[/B]
0933: -100
0934: -200
0935: -500
0936: +[B]1000[/B]
0937: +0 (push, 100 bet)
0938: -100
0939: +[B]200[/B]
0940: -100
0941: -100
0942: -100
0943: -500
0944: +[B]500[/B]
0945: +[B]1000[/B]
0946: +[B]100[/B]
0947: +[B]100[/B]
0948: -100
0949: -100
0950: -200
0951: -500
0952: +[B]-250[/B] (BJ, 750 bet)
0953: +[B]500[/B]
0954: -500
0955: +[B]500[/B]
0956: +[B]1000[/B]
0957: +[B]500[/B]
0958: +[B]500[/B]
0959: -500
0960: -500
0961: +[B]1000[/B]
0962: +[B]1000[/B]
0963: +0 (push, 500 bet)
0964: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
0965: -100
0966: +[B]300[/B]
0967: +[B]25[/B]
0968: +[B]25[/B]
0969: +[B]50[/B]
0970: +0 (push, 25 bet)
0971: +[B]25[/B]
0972: -25
0973: +[B]75[/B]
0974: -25
0975: -100
0976: -500
0977: -500
0978: -500
0979: -500
0980: -500
0981: -500
0982: -500
0983: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
0984: -750
0985: +[B]500[/B]
0986: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
0987: +[B]250[/B] (BJ, 750 bet)
0988: +[B]500[/B]
0989: -500
0990: -500
0991: +[B]1000[/B]
0992: -500
0993: +[B]500[/B]
0994: -500
0995: +[B]500[/B]
0996: +[B]500[/B]
0997: +[B]500[/B]
0998: -500
0999: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1000: -500
1001: -750
1002: +[B]1000[/B]
1003: -500
1004: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1005: -1000
1006: -500
1007: -500
1008: -500
1009: -500
1010: -500
1011: +[B]500[/B]
1012: +[B]500[/B]
1013: +[B]500[/B]
1014: +[B]500[/B]
1015: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1016: -500
1017: -500
1018: +[B]1000[/B]
1019: +[B]500[/B]
1020: -500
1021: +[B]500[/B]
1022: +[B]500[/B]
1023: -500
1024: +[B]1000[/B]
1025: -500
1026: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1027: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1028: +[B]500[/B]
1029: -500
1030: +[B]500[/B]
1031: +[B]500[/B]
1032: -500
1033: +[B]500[/B]
1034: +[B]500[/B]
1035: +[B]1000[/B]
1036: -1000
1037: +[B]500[/B]
1038: -500
1039: -500
1040: -500
1041: +[B]1000[/B]
1042: +[B]500[/B]
1043: -500
1044: -500
1045: -500
1046: -500
1047: -500
1048: -1000
1049: -750
1050: -500
1051: -500
1052: -500
1053: +[B]1000[/B]
1054: -500
1055: +[B]1000[/B]
1056: -500
1057: -500
1058: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1059: +[B]500[/B]
1060: +[B]1000[/B]
1061: -500
1062: +[B]500[/B]
1063: -500
1064: -500
1065: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1066: -500
1067: +[B]500[/B]
1068: -500
1069: -500
1070: -1000
1071: -500
1072: -500
1073: -500
1074: -500
1075: +[B]500[/B]
1076: -500
1077: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1078: -750
1079: -500
1080: -500
1081: +[B]500[/B]
1082: +[B]500[/B]
1083: +[B]500[/B]
1084: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1085: -500
1086: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1087: -500
1088: -500
1089: -500
1090: +[B]500[/B]
1091: -500
1092: -500
1093: +[B]500[/B]
1094: +[B]1000[/B]
1095: +[B]500[/B]
1096: -500
1097: +0 (push, 1000 bet)
1098: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1099: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1100: -500
1101: +[B]500[/B]
1102: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1103: +[B]500[/B]
1104: +[B]500[/B]
1105: -500
1106: +[B]500[/B]
1107: -500
1108: -500
1109: -500
1110: -500
1111: +[B]500[/B]
1112: +[B]500[/B]
1113: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1114: -500
1115: -500
1116: +[B]1000[/B]
1117: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1118: +[B]500[/B]
1119: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1120: +[B]500[/B]
1121: -1000
1122: +[B]500[/B]
1123: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1124: +[B]500[/B]
1125: +[B]500[/B]
1126: +[B]500[/B]
1127: -500
1128: -500
1129: +[B]500[/B]
1130: -500
1131: -500
1132: -1000
1133: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1134: -500
1135: +[B]500[/B]
1136: -500
1137: +[B]500[/B]
1138: +[B]500[/B]
1139: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1140: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1141: +[B]500[/B]
1142: -500
1143: +[B]500[/B]
1144: -500
1145: +[B]500[/B]
1146: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1147: -500
1148: -500
1149: +[B]1000[/B]
1150: -500
1151: +[B]500[/B]
1152: -500
1153: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1154: -500
1155: -500
1156: +[B]1000[/B]
1157: -500
1158: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1159: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1160: -500
1161: +[B]500[/B]
1162: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1163: +[B]500[/B]
1164: +[B]1000[/B]
1165: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1166: +[B]500[/B]
1167: -500
1168: +[B]500[/B]
1169: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
1170: -100
1171: -100
1172: +[B]100[/B]
1173: -100
1174: +[B]100[/B]
1175: -100
1176: -100
1177: -300
1178: +[B]500[/B]
1179: +[B]200[/B]
1180: +[B]400[/B]
1181: +[B]100[/B]
1182: +[B]100[/B]
1183: -100
1184: +0 (push, 300 bet)
1185: +[B]200[/B]
1186: +[B]200[/B]
1187: +[B]100[/B]
1188: +[B]100[/B]
1189: -100
1190: +[B]450[/B] (BJ, 300 bet)
1191: +[B]50[/B]
1192: -5
1193: +[B]25[/B] (BJ, 75 bet)
1194: +[B]25[/B]
1195: -50
1196: +[B]50[/B] (BJ, 150 bet)
1197: -50
1198: -100
1199: -300
1200: +[B]500[/B]
1201: +[B]200[/B]
1202: +0 (push, 100 bet)
1203: +[B]100[/B]
1204: -100
1205: +[B]200[/B]
1206: +[B]100[/B]
1207: -100
1208: -100
1209: +[B]300[/B]
1210: +[B]150[/B] (BJ, 100 bet)
1211: -100
1212: -100
1213: +[B]1000[/B]
1214: -50
1215: +[B]100[/B]
1216: -100
1217: -100
1218: -150
1219: -250
1220: +[B]500[/B]
1221: -500
1222: -500
1223: +[B]500[/B]
1224: +0 (push, 750 bet)
1225: -500
1226: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1227: -500
1228: +[B]500[/B]
1229: -1000
1230: +[B]500[/B]
1231: -500
1232: -500
1233: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1234: -500
1235: +[B]500[/B]
1236: -500
1237: -500
1238: -500
1239: -500
1240: -500
1241: +[B]500[/B]
1242: +[B]500[/B]
1243: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1244: -500
1245: +[B]500[/B]
1246: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1247: +[B]500[/B]
1248: +[B]500[/B]
1249: +0 (push, 750 bet)
1250: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1251: +[B]500[/B]
1252: -500
1253: -500
1254: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1255: -500
1256: -500
1257: +[B]500[/B]
1258: +[B]500[/B]
1259: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1260: +[B]500[/B]
1261: +[B]500[/B]
1262: +[B]500[/B]
1263: -25
1264: +0 (push, 25 bet)
1265: -25
1266: +[B]100[/B]
1267: -25
1268: +[B]75[/B]
1269: +[B]50[/B]
1270: -50
1271: +[B]50[/B]
1272: -50
1273: +0 (push, 75 bet)
1274: +[B]50[/B]
1275: -25
1276: +[B]75[/B]
1277: -25
1278: -75
1279: +[B]250[/B]
1280: +0 (push, 50 bet)
1281: -50
1282: -150
1283: +[B]600[/B] (BJ, 400 bet)
1284: +[B]25[/B]
1285: -25
1286: -200
1287: -500
1288: -500
1289: -500
1290: -500
1291: -500
1292: -500
1293: -500
1294: +[B]500[/B]
1295: -500
1296: +[B]500[/B]
1297: +[B]500[/B]
1298: -500
1299: +[B]500[/B]
1300: +0 (push, 750 bet)
1301: -500
1302: -500
1303: -500
1304: +[B]500[/B]
1305: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1306: -500
1307: -750
1308: +[B]500[/B]
1309: -1000
1310: -500
1311: +[B]500[/B]
1312: -500
1313: +[B]500[/B]
1314: -500
1315: -500
1316: +[B]500[/B]
1317: -500
1318: +[B]500[/B]
1319: -500
1320: +[B]500[/B]
1321: +[B]500[/B]
1322: +[B]500[/B]
1323: +[B]500[/B]
1324: -500
1325: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1326: -500
1327: +[B]500[/B]
1328: +[B]500[/B]
1329: -500
1330: -1000
1331: -500
1332: -500
1333: +[B]500[/B]
1334: +[B]1000[/B]
1335: +[B]500[/B]
1336: -500
1337: -500
1338: +[B]500[/B]
1339: -500
1340: -500
1341: +[B]500[/B]
1342: -500
1343: -500
1344: +[B]500[/B]
1345: +[B]500[/B]
1346: -500
1347: -500
1348: -500
1349: -500
1350: -500
1351: +[B]500[/B]
1352: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1353: +[B]500[/B]
1354: -1000
1355: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1356: -500
1357: -1000
1358: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1359: +[B]500[/B]
1360: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1361: -500
1362: +[B]500[/B]
1363: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1364: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1365: -500
1366: +[B]1000[/B]
1367: -500
1368: +[B]500[/B]
1369: +[B]500[/B]
1370: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1371: +[B]500[/B]
1372: +[B]500[/B]
1373: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1374: -500
1375: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1376: +[B]500[/B]
1377: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 1250 bet)
1378: -500
1379: -500
1380: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1381: +[B]500[/B]
1382: +[B]500[/B]
1383: +[B]500[/B]
1384: -500
1385: -500
1386: +[B]500[/B]
1387: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1388: +[B]500[/B]
1389: +[B]500[/B]
1390: +[B]500[/B]
1391: -500
1392: +[B]500[/B]
1393: -750
1394: +[B]500[/B]
1395: -500
1396: -500
1397: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1398: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1399: -500
1400: +[B]500[/B]
1401: -500
1402: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1403: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1404: -750
1405: +[B]500[/B]
1406: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1407: -500
1408: +[B]500[/B]
1409: -500
1410: -500
1411: -1000
1412: +[B]500[/B]
1413: +[B]1000[/B]
1414: -500
1415: +[B]500[/B]
1416: -500
1417: +[B]500[/B]
1418: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1419: -750
1420: -500
1421: -1000
1422: +[B]1000[/B]
1423: -500
1424: +0 (push, 500 bet)
1425: -500
1426: +[B]500[/B]
1427: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1428: -500
1429: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1430: -500
1431: +[B]1000[/B]
1432: +[B]500[/B]
1433: -1000
1434: +[B]500[/B]
1435: -500
1436: +[B]750[/B] (BJ, 500 bet)
1437: -1000
1438: -500
1439: +[B]1000[/B]
1440: +[B]1000[/B]
1441: -500
1442: -500
1443: +[B]500[/B]
1444: +[B]500[/B]
1445: +[B]500[/B]
1446: +[B]500[/B]

 

[steinhaug]

Adding some more streak stats. If we look at consequtive wins or losses, and the rules are as follow.

A win streak are wins in a row, is broken by loss or push.
A lose streak are losses in a row, broken by win or push.

I have also ignored <4 sequences.

Winning streak:
6,4,4,4,5,6,5,7,[B]9[/B],6,4,4,8,4,6,5,7,5,4,4,5,4,4,4,4,4,5,5,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,5,4,4,4,5,4

Losing streak:
4,4,4,7,5,5,6,4,4,5,4,5,4,6,4,[COLOR="Red"][B]15[/B][/COLOR],4,6,4,4,4,4,6,5,4,4,4,9,6,10,7,4,4,5,9,4,5

By the way, the 15 in a row losing streak is from hand 476 above.

 

[Shocked]

Kimss,

I respect your greater experience with all things gambling, but do you really think on this occasion, the bloke bet 62.5 euros? ;o)

+ Blackjack BJ_WIN1 62.5 11-12-2008 01:38 4500 / 4562.5
Blackjack BJ BET1 -25 11-12-2008 01:38 4525 / 4500

I've checked a few pages and each time there is a win, the figure below it is a multiple. Paddy power have a similar system (I think it's PP) where they show the bet, then another line if it won.

KK,

The issue (for me) is whether this bloke got paid or not - I'm going to go and read the thread on the other forum, but how its been presented here is that he got extremely lucky and then Casino Club used a spurious 'bot play' argument to deny him his winnings. Perhaps someone can tell me if I am wrong, but bots are used to play lots of perfect games with small values so to get through wagering requirements. I can't imagine anyone buying a bot that played like this guy does..unless there is some flaw being taken advantage of in CC's software that has not been mentioned yet.

 

[Jukep]

According to the logs the player has started at 01:25 and stopped at 06:46, for a total playing time of 5:21.

There seem to be 1-2 minute breaks at 2:12, 03:36, 04:08, 05:48 and 06:10.

There are 1445 lines containing BET1, which apparently means that 1445 hands were played. Thats 4.5 hands per minute, which is slowish even for a slow software like Boss.

He has played from 1 to 8 hands per minute. His rate of play has not been constant at all, as can be seen from the deviation of hands played per minute. First column is the number of minutes that he has played a certain amount of hands, and the second column is the number of hands. So e.g. there are 39 minutes in the log when he's played 3 hands in a minute, 73 minutes when he's played 4 hands a minute etc.

      4 1
     22 2
     39 3
     73 4
     93 5
     73 6
     11 7
      1 8

He started with $4450 and ended with $10050. First 2 hours of playing his stack was pretty stable, only smallish swings up and down. After 3+ hours he got a nice upswing and reached $10k at 04:39. Then came a steep downswing, taking him down at $3k at 04:55. Again his luck turns and he's back at $10k at 05:10. Some ups and downs, and then almost broke at 05:35, only $905 left. Again back to $10k 06:01, almost broke at 06:31 ($1300), but again he manages to rise and ends up at $10k.

He's changing his bet size often, from $5 to $1250. Here's the number of hands played with each bet size:

      6 -10
    516 -100
     54 -1,000.00
      1 -1,250.00
     11 -15
     26 -150
     72 -200
    156 -25
      6 -250
      2 -30
     18 -300
      2 -35
      1 -375
      4 -37.5
      2 -400
      1 -450
     21 -5
     54 -50
    444 -500
      1 -55
      2 -60
     25 -75
      1 -7.5
     16 -750
      2 -800
      1 -900

I believe an expected play log from a bot would be a long session with unchanging and small bet size, played fast and without breaks and with a constant hand rate.

When comparing his session to a supposed bot session, there seem to be few similarities.

His bet sizing has been like a rollercoaster, going up and down all the time. There are very few small bets, and lots of very big ones. I wonder why anyone would let a computer play with $100-1000 bet sizes. What would be the point?

He has not played very fast, and importantly, his hand rate per minute has not been steady at all.

His session has been pretty long, but there have been 5 1-2minute breaks. When taken out of context, a 5-6 hour session might look suspicious. However, if you look at the rollercoaster of his results, it's pretty easy to understand the urge to continue playing. First couple of hours are quite uneventfull, but the rest is pretty much constant swings. I personally would've been glued to the computer when swinging to $10k, down to $1k, then back up and down again, rinse and repeat...

I am surprised that this log has been used as evidence of bot play, as it really doesn't seem to support such a claim.

If this is all the evicence, then it looks like Casino Club has failed to fully and neutrally analyze the log, in it's eagerness to find damning evidence. It looks like their case rests purely on the length of the session, and all the contrary data has been ignored.

 

[steinhaug]

I've checked a few pages and each time there is a win, the figure below it is a multiple. Paddy power have a similar system (I think it's PP) where they show the bet, then another line if it won.

I corrected this, I read the logs wrong. You were right from your first post, the first line represent the bet. The next line will be the win if any, if no win the next line will be next bet. When I figured it out it was easy, and you can easily see the push and BJ on the list. My previous post has the corrected gameplay.

 

[The Dude]

Just to jump in here real quick-like before I hit the sack. I have the log file that covers 14 hours - not just six hours - of the same game play (virtually no breaks). You'll have to agree that is a phenomenal amount of time. 14 hours - no breaks. The guy's eyeballs would be falling out, he'd have thrombosis of the legs and a pee bucket beside his desk.

But thanks to kimss and a few others that have pointed out a number of odd things, this is the strangest bot play I've ever seen. I'll be getting back to this in the morning.

 

[steinhaug]

You'll have to agree that is a phenomenal amount of time. 14 hours - no breaks. The guy's eyeballs would be falling out, he'd have thrombosis of the legs and a pee bucket beside his desk.

Well, some people drink coffee, some people take amphetamins,

Anyways, if you have PHP installed CM you can use this script I put together to compile the data which I posted above.

Format should be from last to first:

Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:46 8050 / 7550
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:45 8550 / 8050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:45 9050 / 8550
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 2,000.00 11-12-2008 06:45 7050 / 9050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:45 8050 / 7050
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 2,000.00 11-12-2008 06:45 6050 / 8050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:45 7050 / 6050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:45 7550 / 7050
Blackjack BJ BET1 -1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:45 8550 / 7550
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 1,250.00 11-12-2008 06:44 7300 / 8550
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:44 7800 / 7300
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:44 8300 / 7800
Blackjack BJ_WIN1 1,000.00 11-12-2008 06:44 7300 / 8300
Blackjack BJ BET1 -500 11-12-2008 06:44 7800 / 7300

<?php

$wins = array();
$result = array();
$lines = file('bj.txt');
$lines = array_reverse($lines);
$count = count($lines);

$patterns = array();

for($i=0;$i < $count ;$i++){
  $current = $lines[$i];
  $current = str_replace('Blackjack BJ_WIN1','WIN',$current);
  $current = str_replace('Blackjack BJ BET1','BET',$current);
  $current = trim($current);
  $t = explode(' ',$current);
  if($t[0] == 'WIN') continue;

  $next = $lines[$i+1];
  $next = str_replace('Blackjack BJ_WIN1','WIN',$next);
  $next = str_replace('Blackjack BJ BET1','BET',$next);
  $next = trim($next);
  $n = explode(' ',$next);

  $current_val = $t[6] - $t[4];
  $next_val    = $n[6] - $n[4];

  $t[1] = str_replace(',','',$t[1]);
  $n[1] = str_replace(',','',$n[1]);

  if($n[0] == 'WIN'){
    if($t[1] > 0){
      die('<hr>' . $lines[$i] . "<hr>SHOULD BE LOSING LINE!");
    }
    $t[1] = $t[1] * -1;
    $r = $n[1] - $t[1];

    if($r == $t[1]){
      $result[] = '+' . '[B]' . $r . '[/B]';
      $wins[$t[1]]['win']++;
      if($patterns['lose']>3) { $patterns['losestreak'][] = $patterns['lose']; }
      $patterns['win']++;
      $patterns['lose'] = 0;
    } else if($r == 0){
      $result[] = '+' . $r . ' (push, ' . $t[1] . ' bet)';
      $wins[$t[1]]['push']++;
      if($patterns['lose']>3) { $patterns['losestreak'][] = $patterns['lose']; }
      if($patterns['win']>3) $patterns['winstreak'][] = $patterns['win'];
      $patterns['win'] = 0;
      $patterns['lose'] = 0;
    } else {
      $result[] = '+' . '[B]' . $r . '[/B]' . ' (BJ, ' . $t[1] . ' bet)';
      $wins[$t[1]]['win']++;
      $wins[$t[1]]['bj']++;
      if($patterns['lose']>3) { $patterns['losestreak'][] = $patterns['lose']; }
      $patterns['win']++;
      $patterns['lose'] = 0;
    }
    continue;
  } else {
    $result[] = $current_val;

    $t[1] = $t[1] * -1;
    $wins[$t[1]]['lose']++;
    if($patterns['win']>3) $patterns['winstreak'][] = $patterns['win'];
    $patterns['lose']++;
    $patterns['win'] = 0;
  }
}

echo '<hr>';
echo 'winstreak' . implode(',',$patterns['winstreak']) . '<br>';
echo 'losestreak' . implode(',',$patterns['losestreak']) . '<br>';
?>
<hr>
<table cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" border="0" width="" id="" class="" style="">
  <tbody>
    <tr>
      <td></td>
      <td valign="top"><?php
ksort($wins);
foreach($wins AS $a=>$b){
  echo '$' . prefix_zero($a,4) . ': ' . prefix_zero((int) $b['lose'],3) . ' : ' . prefix_zero((int) $b['push'],3) . ' : ' . prefix_zero((int) $b['win'],3) . ' (' . prefix_zero((int) $b['bj'],3) . ')<br>';
}
      ?></td>
      <td><?php
function prefix_zero($x, $l){
  while(strlen($x)<$l){ $x = '0' . $x; }
  return $x;
}

$line = 1;
foreach($result AS $a){
  if($a > 0){
    echo prefix_zero($line,4) . ': ' . $a . '<br>';
    //echo prefix_zero($line,4) . ': [B]' . $a . '[/B]<br>';
  } else {
    echo prefix_zero($line,4) . ': ' . $a . '<br>';
  }
$line++;
}
      ?></td>
    </tr>
  </tbody>
</table>

 

[Shocked]

Apologies Kimss, I should've read more thoroughly

The idea that playing for 6 hours with little breaks is very long, in my opinion, a joke - I'll gladly admit that I can play for MUCH more than that when the excitement is there and the adrenaline flowing...even previously rational people start thinking that there is some magical process going on when the luck is REALLY going for you (as in with this player).

What's rather worrying about this is that its not one of the casinos from the Virtual group..or even some newbie Go Wild type startup, its Casino Club - one of the biggest online casinos in europe! If the information given is true, then this severely questions their ethics and also the validity of their 'security checks' - from their forum, it looks like his results were supposedly checked at least twice and CC still maintained that he was using a bot?!? If they were at least saying that he's exploited a flaw in the software or some other cheat or fraud, then It would be slightly more convincing, but their argument is completely silly.

Aside from the fact that it looks bad for CC, they've shooting themselves again in the foot by not just letting this player play out all his winnings - from his play I'd guess that he's pretty compulsive with his gambling and CC have made sure that, if he does ever see his money, he won't be wasting it all on them.

Meh, glad there are more sensible casinos about.

---- wrote this before seeing CMs reply

 

[NextToYou]

I have the log file that covers 14 hours - not just six hours - of the same game play (virtually no breaks). You'll have to agree that is a phenomenal amount of time. 14 hours - no breaks. The guy's eyeballs would be falling out, he'd have thrombosis of the legs and a pee bucket beside his desk.

I don't find this strong enough evidence about anything.

I am personally definitely not a person having any kind of gambling problem/addiction and I just checked out of interest my personal play logs from my longest online poker sessions from last two years. The result is that I have several over 8 hour sessions tracked during last 2 years, meaning that I haven't had a break longer than ~3mins, because if you take a longer break, the software will kick you out from the table and it will be tracked as a new session if you go bsck. Longest session during last 2 years has been ~11 hours (and it has even been a winning session!).

Now, bear in mind that:

1. This has occured for me in online poker, which requires a hell of a lot more concentration and energy than playing online blackjack (which is very simple and dull game actually if you have even a bit experience).

2. Also, if the person in question has even a slightest kind of "addiction" or "rush" or whatever we want to call it towards the game, there won't be a feel of exhaustion before softwares are closed.

3. There are several confirmed cases people playing online poker for more than 18 hours straight and (without any extra incentive like bet or so) - why not 14 hours of online BJ then? It's not exactly a marathon.


In short: gambling 14 hours straight online with only short bathroom type of breaks or other 2-3 minute type of breaks (time that microwave pizza takes to heat or you take a fast dump) is not exactly any inhuman achievement, especially when talking about simple game like blackjack, which doesn't require too much constant effort.

Conclusion: 14 hour playing time can't be used as a judging evidence, there has to be much more.

 

[Rusty]

Even 14 hours with very short breaks is really not so amazing.

Hand on heart I have played 36 Hours straight before now with very few and only short breaks.
Have they ever heard of en suite bathrooms?
If this is their only evidence it stinks.

What might be more revealing is this Guys previous play patterns.

Apparently this was not his first play at the Casino.

At the moment I think the Casino are really out on a limb with this one unless we see some real evidence.

It should also not go unnoticed that several times he makes a very nice profit but continues to play until nearly bust.
He is actually just a few hands away from busting out sometimes and if he had, well then, there would be no bot play would there?

 

[Jufo]

It should also not go unnoticed that several times he makes a very nice profit but continues to play until nearly bust.
He is actually just a few hands away from busting out sometimes and if he had, well then, there would be no bot play would there?

That's right. He takes huge risks and almost loses it all - many times! The bots are used in completely opposite scenario: making very low-risk wagers to complete the wagering requirements. Did he even need to complete any wagering requirement?

 

[Pinababy69]

In short: gambling 14 hours straight online with only short bathroom type of breaks or other 2-3 minute type of breaks (time that microwave pizza takes to heat or you take a fast dump) is not exactly any inhuman achievement, especially when talking about simple game like blackjack, which doesn't require too much constant effort.

Conclusion: 14 hour playing time can't be used as a judging evidence, there has to be much more.

Even 14 hours with very short breaks is really not so amazing.

Hand on heart I have played 36 Hours straight before now with very few and only short breaks.

Absolutely 110% agree with both of you. I certainly wouldn't and don't make a habit out of it, and I find Blackjack boring as hell......but I'm sure there are times that I've sat and played for 14 hrs or more. Slots mind you, but same thing. Especially if you are on a roll and get that adrenaline rush going. I only play "on average" once, maybe twice a week. But if the reels are going my way, five or six hours is a normal gaming session. I don't find 14 totally absurd at all. And if this is what the casino is basing its decision on, then obviously they don't have too many true gamblers analyzing their data.

Add to that, as you guys mentioned, the fact that he more than once came close to busting out yet continued to play? What bot does that?

Note to mod or Bryan....could we get the thread title changed to more appropriately reflect the content?

 

[RobWin]

14 Hours is nothing...it's actually laughable as I have gone for the marathon of 72.5 hours before at the land based casino Harrah's, I arrived on a Friday morning early and sat down at one machine in the high limit area and played video poker continuously for approx. 72.5 hours before coming back to my senses and realizing that I had totally missed the days Saturday & Sunday and my only time away from the machine was for my brief two to three minute bathroom breaks...

My casino host even brought food to me while I was sitting and standing in front of this machine playing for this time period and she had even left twice to go home because her shift was over and then she returned to find me still there, lol...she was surprised the second day to still see me there but then the third day she was actually shocked !! Hell, I even drove 3 hours to get back home after this marathon run...

Those were some of my crazy days of gambling, I am now a hell of a lot more constrained and conservative !

 

[Rusty]

:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy

I am a lightweight!

 

[suzecat]

Wouldn't RNGs be considered a "bot" for the purposes of this thread? Seems to me that if a bot is in the casino's favor then that is ok...........but if in the player's favor then that is abuse? What kind of screwy azz logic is that?

 

[Przecinek]

This is crazy! I hope this topic gets more attention from some serious math guys that can compile it into stats... as there are to many "?" marks over this one.

I understand logic behind CC but this is getting way out of hand! This guy had made some big bucks, gambled with sums I would never be able to afford and I don't see any "bonus abusing" pattern in the log file posted. Shit I wouldn't be able to sleep for a week after placing $ 1000 bet (even $10 bets make my hands sweat over mouse). Either CasinoClub is holding back "real" evidence (maybe to prevent bot users from finding out how they track them down?) in which case they should be honest about it, or they are just using it as another excuse not to pay as we've seen that before (and we keep seeing like in the current "Microgaming blacklist" thread").

Edit : Like Rusty said "He is actually just a few hands away from busting out sometimes and if he had, well then, there would be no bot play would there?" ... This is prolly why this got me upset. That's why we need some more info from Casino Club asap

 

[Kodi]

14 hours - not just six hours - of the same game play (virtually no breaks). You'll have to agree that is a phenomenal amount of time. 14 hours - no breaks.

Do You think that its fair to void someone winnings because he make something wrong in the past? Why CC wait until someone hit some big winnings to show what they find? Why CC void winnings (6h session) that for sure ware made by human not bot?

 

[The Dude]

Am i missing something ?
I am having a bit of trouble working those logs out.. but it does indeed look like the player never won 2 hands in a row in over 2000 hands !

Now if that is true, then that is simply Ludicrous ... the odds of that happening ... are .... well ... Impossible !

WAYLANDER

This is what I'm finding odd - and this covers 14 solid hours of play. I believe some bots can be programmed to play loose. I'm looking at fourteen hours and no two winning hands in a row. How could this not be bot play if it's been programmed to lose every other hand?

I always assumed bots just flat bet X hands as quickly as posible...

Even the rudimentary software programs allow you to slow it down. Here is an excerpt from the instructions BLACKJACK BOT

SPEED SETTING

The bot plays at medium speed by default. You can choose the menu item option:speed to set speed to Fast or Slow. Note that the bot always plays in the Slow mode at 888 casino and the speed does not change by much at casino.net, Casino Club and Paradise Casino, as trying to play at faster speeds at these casinos can cause the bot to not work correctly.

They even include "bot" etiquette

BOT ETIQUETTE

Don't run the bot for 48-72 straight hours. This simply looks suspicious. Run it overnight for 8-14 hours and then give it an 8-10 hour rest. Try to make it look like a human player, for obvious reasons.

...Anywho, I would love to read some card experts observation on this gameresult and the result it produced compared to what one would normally expect from such play.

I think this would be quite interesting. I'll run it by a couple of people.

...In short: gambling 14 hours straight online with only short bathroom type of breaks or other 2-3 minute type of breaks (time that microwave pizza takes to heat or you take a fast dump) is not exactly any inhuman achievement, especially when talking about simple game like blackjack, which doesn't require too much constant effort.

Conclusion: 14 hour playing time can't be used as a judging evidence, there has to be much more.

I'm still going through the stats, and I haven't found a break longer than one minute - if that.

That's right. He takes huge risks and almost loses it all - many times! The bots are used in completely opposite scenario: making very low-risk wagers to complete the wagering requirements. Did he even need to complete any wagering requirement?

Like I mentioned earlier, I beleive bots can be programmed to be as human as possible.

Note to mod or Bryan....could we get the thread title changed to more appropriately reflect the content?

Done

I know a number of you feel that gambling for 14 hours straight without a break is doable - especially in a land based environment. Online? I don't buy it. Sorry, I just can't. If the guy was taking a break every couple of hours for a minute or two even to get up and stretch, it would show. There is a difference between sitting on your ass clicking a mouse every few seconds for fourteen hours - without stopping, and sitting at a black jack table in Vegas. Let's be real now.

I'm not convinced that this is not bot play, but I'll lift the player's ban so he can chime in if he wants to. I'd like to know how he was able to not win more than one hand in a row in fourteen hours.

 

[Jasminebed]

I've certainly played all night online. And since I smoke at my computer, it does not take me long to pee. I went to Atlantic City with a 70 year old woman who did not sleep for the three nights we were there, although she did take some time out from the baccarat tables to eat the comped food.

I'm no expert, but to deliberately lose every other hand does not seem like a winning strategy to me. And if you can "trick" the software by such behaviour, then the cards are not really random are they.

 

[Shocked]

This is what I'm finding odd - and this covers 14 solid hours of play. I believe some bots can be programmed to play loose. I'm looking at fourteen hours and no two winning hands in a row. How could this not be bot play if it's been programmed to lose every other hand?

I'll gladly admit that I did 10 hours of casino-ing just the other night and you can even talk to one of your reps to confirm it! When things are going well and the adrenaline's running, you can go for a looooong time!

The issue with the 'no two winning hands' thing has been addressed by myself and several others - it's the way that the logs are formatted.. i.e. the bet is shown, then if there is a win (or push), then it is shown on the next line up, if there is no win then no result is shown. Paddy Power do the same with their logs.

Like I mentioned earlier, I beleive bots can be programmed to be as human as possible.

I am sure you could program a bot to do lots of strange things and play like a ridiculously tilty player, but what would be the point?

No one would buy it..or if it was a 'feature' then no one would use it. The idea that someone would spend hours programming a feature that clearly no one would use is, frankly, silly!

I've read the other forum and I feel for this player - IMO with the evidence given, it's 99.99% certain that he's been treated terribly by CC, whether that be through their lack of competence or just straight roguish behaviour. Being that they are one of the biggest online casinos around, I'd assume it's the former and they just didn't do their job properly when they did their 'security checks', but, even if they see the error they've made, then it's still worrying.


------- In addition

Actually, it's PP Games, but here's an example from their logs and me playing 3 hand BJ:

Games Returns: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Return on Game Bet ID 72828612 Internet 4.50 74.14
Games stake: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Game Bet ID 72828612 Internet -3.00 69.64
Games Returns: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Return on Game Bet ID 72828547 Internet 4.00 72.64
Games stake: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Game Bet ID 72828547 Internet -3.00 68.64
Games Returns: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Return on Game Bet ID 72828500 Internet 2.50 71.64
Games stake: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Game Bet ID 72828500 Internet -3.00 69.14
Games stake: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Game Bet ID 72828467 Internet -3.00 72.14
Games Returns: Electracade Three Hand BlackJack: Return on Game Bet ID 72828415 Internet 3.00 75.14

It's the same formatting style as Casino Club, but because there is more explanation on each line, you can see that I won (or more precisely, didn't lose outright) three times in a row..

 

[Jufo]

This is what I'm finding odd - and this covers 14 solid hours of play. I believe some bots can be programmed to play loose. I'm looking at fourteen hours and no two winning hands in a row. How could this not be bot play if it's been programmed to lose every other hand?

I believe this was just a confusion caused by the way the hand history was formatted. See the second table in kimss's post #24 which shows the bets in correct order and there are many two and more wins in a row.

 

[Shocked]

I believe this was just a confusion caused by the way the hand history was formatted. See the second table in kimss's post #24 which shows the bets in correct order and there are many two and more wins in a row.

The (mis)reading of the logs has actually been corrected on post 13, 19, 22, 24 and 26. It's a shame that people are more interested in the idea that there is a flaw or strategy that has been used rather than reading the thread and asking why someone who (with all the evidence) has just 'got lucky' and is being denied 10,000 euros.

 

[Zodiac]

I'm still going through the stats, and I haven't found a break longer than one minute - if that.

It gives a break Bryan but CC have not found it and only placed a part of the protocol but the player found the break what he said always again.

Yesterday he got the complete protocol from CC and now you can see at this part that was indeed a break.

Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
10
11.12.2008 00:57
4150 / 4160
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-5
11.12.2008 00:57
4155 / 4150
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
10
11.12.2008 00:56
4145 / 4155
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-5
11.12.2008 00:56
4150 / 4145
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
250
11.12.2008 00:34
3900 / 4150
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-100
11.12.2008 00:34
4000 / 3900
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
400
11.12.2008 00:34
3600 / 4000
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-200
11.12.2008 00:34
3800 / 3600
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
200
11.12.2008 00:33
3600 / 3800
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-100
11.12.2008 00:33
3700 / 3600
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
200
11.12.2008 00:33
3500 / 3700
Blackjack
BJ BET1
-100
11.12.2008 00:33
3600 / 3500
Blackjack
BJ_WIN1
200
11.12.2008 00:33
3400 / 3600

and one must consider also a time difference from germany to Israel or Danmark, because CC said that some wins obtains after 24:00 pm but one hour time difference it was 23:00 pm

the completly protocoll you will find at roulette forum from page 20 to page 21

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

i see that his name is no longer red, so i can say to him that he maybe can post here again and do all by himself ?

 

[The Dude]

...i see that his name is no longer red, so i can say to him that he maybe can post here again and do all by himself ?

You're correct, he is no longer banned.

 

[Kodi]

1) Do You think that its fair to void someone winnings because he make something wrong in the past?
2) Why CC wait until someone hit some big winnings to show what they find?
3) Why CC void winnings (6h session) that for sure ware made by human not bot?

I think you missed my questions

 

[zenderady]

I can not belive casinmeister takes the side of cc.

The guy did not get a bonus! why would he use a bot????

 

[Jasminebed]

The guy did not get a bonus! why would he use a bot????

Yes indeed. As I understand it, the use of a bot will not negate house edge unless a bonus is taken.