Rushmore Casino Experiences

[Jade@rushmore]

Originally Posted by Nicole50

There is other way to know about your wagering. Check the loyalty points and If any 10 US wagered is one point then you have to calculate to know where your are regarding the wagering. For me I do it in playtech casino.By the loyalty points you get you can know how much you wagered.That'simple.

We have a very similar system where by one point is awarded for every $10 wagered. So there would be a way for our members to double check if they needed to.

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by Jade@rushmore

We have a very similar system where by one point is awarded for every $10 wagered. So there would be a way for our members to double check if they needed to.

This is not as reliable, as it seems (above) that King Solomon's denied a cash-in, and without the evidence of the playthrough counter the player had no means to make a case.

Why is it such a big problem for Rushmore to include this counter in the client? We have had answers such as "ask CS, they don't mind", and "use comps to estimate", but this simply dodges the question, why not get rid of the guesswork and potential for ambiguity and error (yes - it happens, CS SAY a player has met WR, but they can be wrong - many instances of this have been posted in complaints, although not for Rushmore).

Without a credible explanation as to why Rushmore find this counter such a "problem", we must assume there is some motive that outweighs giving players the clearest indication of their WR.
The counter has also been useful in the past to challenge an error. I took a coupon at iNetBet with an advertised WR of 20x, however when the counter popped up it had miscalculated it as 30x. I was able to alert CS to this error and get it corrected. Without the counter, this kind of thing would never be spotted by the player, but the casino would gain, and there would be a temptation to make coupon WR's unduly complicated.

I also used the comp point count method at another RTG casino, wagered beyond WR according to points earned, only to be shafted because I had "not met the terms". This was Crystal Palace, (and a free chip too, so I learned before they got a sniff of my own money). Without the counter, and their refusal to state which term was broken, I could not determine what stunt they had pulled. If the counter was in place, I would have known for certain that it was not WR, and I had fully met all the other terms. They could have deliberately misrepresented the rate of earning of comps, so that my calculations were out.

Given the reputation of RTG software, operators should be as open as they possibly can, even if they have a good reputation. It is a case of being SEEN to be good, not just having it on someone's word that they are.


Perhaps another RTG operator could comment on the ease (or not) of switching this counter on and off. It doesn't seem to be something that would challenge anyone who was competent to set up & run the back end of an online casino.

[Nicole50]

According to your post :

" I also used the comp point count method at another RTG casino, wagered beyond WR according to points earned, only to be shafted because I had "not met the terms". This was Crystal Palace, (and a free chip too, so I learned before they got a sniff of my own money). Without the counter, and their refusal to state which term was broken, I could not determine what stunt they had pulled. If the counter was in place, I would have known for certain that it was not WR, and I had fully met all the other terms. They could have deliberately misrepresented the rate of earning of comps, so that my calculations were out."

You are talking about the rogue Crystal Palace casino. This group of casino will never pay you even you meet the wagering requirement and even they have maximum bet of 1 USD per spin, there is no 20 cents or 40 cents.


The playtech casino have no counter also but Iam managing myself the wagering. Try to manage yourself but not in this kind of casinos as Crystal Palace .You can not find them in the list of accredited casinos in this forum. So why do you play there ?

[kakata]

...as for Rushmore, it doesnt work properly either.
When I begun my yesterday session I had only 1 point.
I deposited 56 and received 150% bonus =84 total wager suppose to be 20x( 56+84 ) which is 2800, correct?
I always use the "points counts metod"wherever there is no available "meter".
When I reached 280 points or $2.80, I knew I had met my WR.....wrong????
I called and was told that I still needed to wager $271.
Weird isnt it? I didnt have any intention to withdraw anyway.
Still after the phonecall I could hardly meet the wagering with a balance of 120 +.
BTW why does your Keno pays a lot less than standard RTG? ie: 5 out of 10 1x bet ( instead of 2x) ---- 6 out of 10 22x (instead of 25x)
8 out of 10 1000x (instead of 1200x)
Most of all noticeable 9 out of 10 pays 5000x when its 10.000x....I know cause I won it twice at 2 different RTG casinos

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by Nicole50

According to your post :

" I also used the comp point count method at another RTG casino, wagered beyond WR according to points earned, only to be shafted because I had "not met the terms". This was Crystal Palace, (and a free chip too, so I learned before they got a sniff of my own money). Without the counter, and their refusal to state which term was broken, I could not determine what stunt they had pulled. If the counter was in place, I would have known for certain that it was not WR, and I had fully met all the other terms. They could have deliberately misrepresented the rate of earning of comps, so that my calculations were out."

You are talking about the rogue Crystal Palace casino. This group of casino will never pay you even you meet the wagering requirement and even they have maximum bet of 1 USD per spin, there is no 20 cents or 40 cents.


The playtech casino have no counter also but Iam managing myself the wagering. Try to manage yourself but not in this kind of casinos as Crystal Palace .You can not find them in the list of accredited casinos in this forum. So why do you play there ?

I don't.
I got as far as registering, and then clicked through on their "safebet" seal to check their "certificate". All I found was a banner farm with a forum buried at the bottom of the page. It had a "review" - but it was far from glowing; someone forgot to "moderate" the safebet forum

I played the free chip since it was a no-risk way to check their credentials, and had they paid I would have continued to play, so they lost out.
I am now, after more than 2 years, getting promotional offers from Crystal Palace. New owners, but they have not demonstrated any willingness to shed their old ways.

Playtech casinos have no counter - I do not generally play at Playtech.
With MG, I much prefer to play where the bonus system is used. Although there is no counter as such, the amount shown as bonus gives a pretty good idea of how much progress has been made.
With Rushmore, there is no indication at all until the balance becomes "withdrawable". I do not trust the comp point system, as it can be prone to inconsistencies, such as different games having different rates of award. Worse still, RTG has no "playcheck", so unlike MG, it is not even possible to check and count the actual wagers.

We would be 100% at the mercy of Rushmore CS to get it right, and if they get it wrong, would management fess up or let the player suffer.
A previous post was about an innacurate reply from Rushmore CS, and Jade stated in effect that CS would not give such a reply, and asked for the name of the rep. This does not instill confidence, as often there is no actual "proof" of a reply, unless of course the player thinks they are bound to get screwed over and keeps records of everything. This would not be possible over the phone, nor if live chat didn't send the chat log to the player properly.

I feel that Rushmore are putting up considerable resistance to the idea of having this counter; why?

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by kakata

...as for Rushmore, it doesnt work properly either.
When I begun my yesterday session I had only 1 point.
I deposited 56 and received 150% bonus =84 total wager suppose to be 20x( 56+84 ) which is 2800, correct?
I always use the "points counts metod"wherever there is no available "meter".
When I reached 280 points or $2.80, I knew I had met my WR.....wrong????
I called and was told that I still needed to wager $271.
Weird isnt it? I didnt have any intention to withdraw anyway.
Still after the phonecall I could hardly meet the wagering with a balance of 120 +.
BTW why does your Keno pays a lot less than standard RTG? ie: 5 out of 10 1x bet ( instead of 2x) ---- 6 out of 10 22x (instead of 25x)
8 out of 10 1000x (instead of 1200x)
Most of all noticeable 9 out of 10 pays 5000x when its 10.000x....I know cause I won it twice at 2 different RTG casinos

Quite, this shouldn't happen. Someone has screwed up. Jade said it was 1 point for $10 wagered, so if you have 280 points you have to have wagered at least $2800. The WR at 20x on 56 for 84 bonus is indeed $2800, yet CS said you were short by $271. This is one hell of a margin of error in the comp point system, and seems to imply you have been awarded an extra 27 points along the way - most odd. Since you phoned, it is no good Jade asking for the record of this conversation, although you might remember the name of the rep.
This might mean that the back end systems do not work properly, a delay between wagering and it being logged. With the counter, I have seen it work instantly.


As for the Keno payouts, it seems to indicate that Rushmore have set their casino to the lower payout model, rather than the higher one. I wonder what their slots are set to?
There is still the question of the previously very high Random Jackpots. Jade said this was because players were being given alot of bonuses for playing these slots. OK - this would explain a rapid rise in their value, but it most certainly does NOT explain why they get so high. With more turnover, they should hit more often, this is basic maths of random events. There is a fixed chance per spin of the RJ being awarded, so if their are more spins per week, say, the RJ should hit more times per week on average. What it should NOT do is hit just the same number of times, but at much higher values - which seems to be how things are working out so far at Rushmore. I am wondering if RTG has another "switch" that we don't know about, whereby they can set a parameter that controls the chance of the RJ hitting per $ played, such that they either have them hitting often, or holding out for less frequent but bigger payouts.

[USA2112]

Originally Posted by vinylweatherman

There is still the question of the previously very high Random Jackpots. Jade said this was because players were being given alot of bonuses for playing these slots. OK - this would explain a rapid rise in their value, but it most certainly does NOT explain why they get so high. With more turnover, they should hit more often, this is basic maths of random events. There is a fixed chance per spin of the RJ being awarded, so if their are more spins per week, say, the RJ should hit more times per week on average. What it should NOT do is hit just the same number of times, but at much higher values - which seems to be how things are working out so far at Rushmore. I am wondering if RTG has another "switch" that we don't know about, whereby they can set a parameter that controls the chance of the RJ hitting per $ played, such that they either have them hitting often, or holding out for less frequent but bigger payouts.

For the random event to happen being it is a random jackpot the event could happen at 1000,000 spins one time compared to 100,000 spins or even 10 spins the next time, and so on.

Random jackpots aren't determaned by the amount of money played by the players, or if 500 people play one week or 10,000 people play the next week the size of the bets per player per line or how many lines played per spin and should not effect when the random jackpot will hit, if all the above player actions did effect the outcome, then the jackpots would not be random.

Also if so, how could it be explained that any single person could possibly ever hit a random jackpot two times over a short time which has happen the same as some players have hit back to back jackpots on a slot machine in the nearest landbase casino. Simple, they are Random jackpots.

The amount of money shown on random jackpots or progressive pots are determined by the amount of money put in the machine by the players, this is a fact, but the outcome of when the random jackpots will hit is not, so for some random jackpots to be higher at times then others or last longer before they hit seems normal.

[Audioz]

Originally Posted by USA2112

for some random jackpots to be higher at times then others or last longer before they hit seems normal.

For some it were okay, but there are all Random Jackpots always fall about $30,000 or even about $40,000 so that's really not normal, because normally the RJs fall on a balance of $10,000 - $20,000 but not much higher.

On Rushmore the RJs fall always when they're about $30,000 and very rarly when they were under $20,000 so this is very mysterious!

Btw. one jackpot is now about $43,600 (Tiger Treasures) so do you think this is normal, because i've never seen such high RJs on any RTG Casino, even on Bodog they will fall up to $20,000 and very rarly a little bit about it, but never so high!

[USA2112]

Originally Posted by Audioz

For some it were okay, but there are all Random Jackpots always fall about $30,000 or even about $40,000 so that's really not normal, because normally the RJs fall on a balance of $10,000 - $20,000 but not much higher.

On Rushmore the RJs fall always when they're about $30,000 and very rarly when they were under $20,000 so this is very mysterious!

Btw. one jackpot is now about $43,600 (Tiger Treasures) so do you think this is normal, because i've never seen such high RJs on any RTG Casino, even on Bodog they will fall up to $20,000 and very rarly a little bit about it, but never so high!

It may seem suspicious but you can't change that these are random jackpots, as mentioned above the amount of money shown is determined by amount of money played by the players and does not effect the outcome of the random jackpot hitting. I've seen comparable random jackpots in the past at other RTG's

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by USA2112

It may seem suspicious but you can't change that these are random jackpots, as mentioned above the amount of money shown is determined by amount of money played by the players and does not effect the outcome of the random jackpot hitting. I've seen comparable random jackpots in the past at other RTG's

Yes, but this is rare, it seems that it is all too common for the jackpots to get very high before hitting at Rushmore. If they were truly random, the RJ's at Rushmore would, over the long term, hit at the same average value as at other RTG casinos.

A simple comparison could be made between Club World, iNetBet, and Rushmore, logging the value at which the RJ's hit. With a long enough dataset, we would be able to see if there was any statistical significance in the hypothesis that Rushmore RJ's behave differently to others on the RTG platform. All three are considered reputable RTG casinos, so the comparison should be fair. The bigger the sample, the more significant any result would be.