Microgaming slots - are the odds adjustable?

**saladfingers** · 7th February 2007, 12:38 PM

Sorry in advance - I'm sure this has been discussed before but I couldn't find the thread...

Here's the (long) question:

Basically: I only play Microgaming slots, across a lot of MG casinos. My concern is that the odds vary wildly from place to place.

Every so often when I sign up at a new casino, I play various slots and hit the bonus rounds almost immediately. I made a huge profit from one, for instance, and when the bonuses kept coming, I started playing games I'd never played before, and hitting the bonus/freespins in those too. I played Glory of Rome and hit the bonus on my first spin, got the maximum from Cashanova, spins in Isis, MadHatters, Avalon, the max in Pharoah's Tomb etc etc...

But then there are other casinos where I can't hit a single bonus in anything... Specifically Grand Prive casinos. Bars and Stripes, for instance, which has always produced the bonus round within 30-40 spins for me elsewhere, ate all my money at one of their casinos. Then various other normally reliable games did the same at other GP casinos. And when I did hit a bonus - for instance in Age of Discovery, my first selection was the skull and crossbones, ending the bonus before it had started...

The only pattern I think I've spotted is this: signing up at a new casino, owned by a group of casinos where you've never played before can be lucrative. But signing up at a new casino owned by a group where you have played before can be the opposite.

Again, though, there are exceptions to this: I've done well out of all Palace Group casinos.

So I'm confused. But it really, really doesn't feel random to me: to hit every bonus in one MG casino, and do reliably well from the majority as a new player, and then hit nothing at all in any casino owned by Grand Prive, just doesn't feel like chance....

So can these places adjust their MG slot odds? Can they
a) weight things in favour of a brand new player to try to lure them in?
b) Or spot a player who has won elsewhere within the same group of casinos and weight the slots against them, to recoup their losses?

Any views much appreciated! (And sorry again if this has been debated before...)

**Simmo!** · 7th February 2007, 12:55 PM

I asked a Microgaming rep the very same question at ICE and his answer was a categoric "No - operators cannot change the payouts in any way, shape or form.". It's what I'd been told on a couple of occasions by operators I trust, but people will no doubt believe what they choose to believe

**Zoozie** · 7th February 2007, 02:13 PM

Yes, MG slots are the same everywhere - making it a very strong brand.
However the individual slots do have little difference in payout%.

"Thunderstruck" is the same no matter where you play it. Same paytable/same reels and same payout%. Any update/adjustments will come to all MG casinos (but there could be some time delay though).

It is kind of like McDonalds, just opposite: their hamburgers taste of the same crap no matter where you buy them.

I have said too many times now that it is a shame this does not apply to RTG casinos. It is up to each casino manager to configure the slots and they could be set to a ridiculous low payout% and you will never now what happened to you money before it is too late. And worse of all, whenever I have a bad session I will always suspect I got robbed (in terms of low payout%). While at MG I know it was a fair game.

Zoozie

**lojo** · 7th February 2007, 11:56 PM

I've had every imaginable scenario run through my head as I play and think about MG slots, but when its all said and done it boils down to dumb luck, good or bad. I've charted their slots and roulette in play mode and for real money and there is no statistical difference.

Regardless of what anybody can say or prove, luck runs in streaks and clumps - good luck and bad luck. With the RNG's and a fair program i would have a better chance of predicting my wins or losses by the weather or the color of shirt I'm wearing than by a new game or old casino. That's the cold hard conclusion from millions of spins on MG. And I have played every casino I could find that uses their software.

It just feels different sometimes. The RNG has no clue whether I have bet $37.50 or five cents, or played here before. The program only cares how much I bet because it has to pay me based on #of coins and lines, etc.

If they were rigged in any way, I guess I'd have to send back all my cashouts just so I could sleep nights (not)

I've noticed that I've never hit a jackpot when betting max coin size, coins and lines. Why? Because I've only done it a few hundred times compared to many thousands of low rolls. Hope that helps.

**Simmo!** · 8th February 2007, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by lojo

It just feels different sometimes.

Amen to that. But once again, it's variance (volatility) that's the key. Slots are volatile. Simple as.

**soflat** · 8th February 2007, 12:17 AM

Originally Posted by Zoozie

"Thunderstruck" is the same no matter where you play it. Same paytable/same reels and same payout%. Any update/adjustments will come to all MG casinos (but there could be some time delay though).

Have they actually ever changed the payout of a particular slot?

**Zoozie** · 8th February 2007, 08:16 AM

Originally Posted by soflat

Have they actually ever changed the payout of a particular slot?

I have no evidence this has been for a 5-reel slots. If they change a slot like "thunderstruck" players will see that the reels or paytable has changed.

But at one time Avalon re-downloaded for me at all casinos, but since I did not know the reels before, I can not check if anything was changed.

It takes many hours to find the reels for a 5-reel slot.Thunderstruck+clones are the only one I am really sure I have correct.

Zoozie

**Webzcas** · 8th February 2007, 04:13 PM

Just to confirm what Simmo! has mentioned above. Microgaming and only Microgaming can set the payout odds on the slots games at all of their licensees. The individual casino has no access or ability to do this.

This was certainly the case when I was working for Ladbrokes in Gibraltar for 5 years from 2000 - 2005, and is still the case now.

In addition all MGS Casinos are subject to independent audits each and every month by an outside auditor ( PWC )

**cheekymonkey** · 8th February 2007, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by Webzcas

This was certainly the case when I was working for Ladbrokes in Gibraltar for 5 years from 2000 - 2005, and is still the case now.

In addition all MGS Casinos are subject to independent audits each and every month by an outside auditor ( PWC )

One thing I have noticed though Webzcas. At one time you could not open more than 1 MG casino at a time on your PC, but now you can. Does that mean MG have lots of servers now or does each casino house it's own? Originally I thought all MG casinos routed through one server (sorry I'm not very technical actually - so I hope I make sense) at MG?

PS - Did you use to work with Bernadette? She used to be really generous with hospitality and stuff. I know she's left now, but she was a pleasure to speak to.

**Webzcas** · 8th February 2007, 04:27 PM

Each casino houses their own casino servers and they are therefore independent of one another. Certainly this is the case for Ladbrokes, 32Red etc.

That said when new games are rolled out, or updates occur, MGS guys based in SA do jump on all their clients gaming servers to perform said updates. As they are the only ones with full root/admin access to the gaming servers.

The licensee/casino is only responsible for the PTS ( Player Tracking Servers ) or now known as Casper Servers.

The Prima Poker Sites are different though. Whereby they are all based in Canada as far as I am aware. Ladbrokes being independent of the prima network or should I say the Microgaming Poker Network - Have their own servers for Ladbrokes Poker which are located in their Gibraltar offices in Europort.